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Skill Queue and "older" players.

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Gariuys Evil Strangers Inc.	Posted - 2009.03.20 15:36:00 - [31] Originally by: Sheriff Jones Once again, people read what they want to read I didn't say it's useless 100%, just that after you've maxed your skills to over 1d, it would be NICE to get a 2 skill queue. Weekends etc. Stop tryig to make me look like i'm against the skillqueue as it is! You're talking about very specific situations though, like vacations etc, where you don't have a skill long enough to cover the time when you'll be away, but 2 skills queued would cover that time. Would be nice, but I tend to plan ahead so that I'll have a oh I don't know, rank 5+ lvl5 ready for when I wont see a computer for more then 2 days. ;-) Question is really what's the intended functionality, prevention of loss of training time when you only got small kills to train, or the ability to leave the game for longer periods and keep training. I'm gueessing it's the first, so little chance of getting a 2 skill queue regardless of time left to train.
Taius Pax	Posted - 2009.03.20 15:42:00 - [32] Originally by: Sebea No. There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with the current que. It's too short. There's no reason to have any limit on it at all. Since you have to pay for the training time (as it should be, ghost training never should have existed in the first place) there's absolutely no reason I should have log in to click a button to make the next skill go. I should be able to play when I want and not have to schedule other more important activities around a game. Given that the training is tied to real time whether you're in game or not, there's really no excuse for not having an infinite queue.
Taius Pax	Posted - 2009.03.20 15:43:00 - [33] BTW, don't get me wrong, I like the fact that there's a queue now. At least I don't have to juggle 3-4 skills that have a few hours left so I can be around to click a button to make the next one go or wake up in the middle of the night when something I set two weeks ago is finishing.
Gariuys Evil Strangers Inc.	Posted - 2009.03.20 15:44:00 - [34] Originally by: Taius Pax Originally by: Sebea No. There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with the current que. It's too short. There's no reason to have any limit on it at all. Since you have to pay for the training time (as it should be, ghost training never should have existed in the first place) there's absolutely no reason I should have log in to click a button to make the next skill go. I should be able to play when I want and not have to schedule other more important activities around a game. Given that the training is tied to real time whether you're in game or not, there's really no excuse for not having an infinite queue. Yes there is, it's called, games are supposed to be played, not used as a 10 buck a month investment to sell of a.... hmmm yeah good idea...
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:10:00 - [35] Originally by: Matroshka Originally by: Sheriff Jones ...it's useless 100%... ...i'm against the skillqueue as it is! I like your idea, but I don't think it'll happen. Oh you...you...you Matroshka Misquoter! Ok, the sensual of the forums is that it's not really needed. Thought i'd throw it out there anyhoo. Mostly it'd be useful for more busy real life(look it up, weird place, also wiki sun before you go out and find it) or vacation times. My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
Laur Khal	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:13:00 - [36] Originally by: Taius Pax Originally by: ry ry it's an interesting idea actually. i suspect the 24 hour thing is just to keep people logging in regularly. They claim this is the reason for the limit. However, I find this to be utter bull**. How is setting a long training queue, say 30 days long, and walking away from the computer different from setting a 30-40 day skill and walking away from the computer? it's not, and you're right. there is no reason not to make the queue arbitrary length. as one who sometimes takes 6 week long business trips and/or holidays, i would GREATLY appreciate being able to set a 3 month queue of skills instead of having to desperately hunt down an internet cafe with my laptop in a strange country. not good. Quote:** Given that ghost training was removed and there's no way to recover skill points lost to real world time not spent training I find CCP's argument utterly hollow. ghost training = skill training after unsubscribing? yeah that was a really crappy change, it means the next time i unsubscribe due to real life, i probably won't come back due to months of lost training.
Marrrk Vanquish Inc	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:13:00 - [37] Edited by: Marrrk on 20/03/2009 16:13:21 Its far from useless, when I have less than 24 hours left on a skill I get to add a new skill to the queue and not have to worry about when I am going to fit that remaining 14 hours it. It benefits older players just as much as younger players.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:14:00 - [38] Originally by: Marrrk Edited by: Marrrk on 20/03/2009 16:13:21 Its far from useless, when I have less than 24 hours left on a skill I get to add a new skill to the queue and not have to worry about when I am going to fit that remaining 14 hours it. It benefits older players just as much as younger players. slams head on desk My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
Laur Khal	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:18:00 - [39] Edited by: Laur Khal on 20/03/2009 16:20:33 Originally by: Gariuys Originally by: Taius Pax It's too short. There's no reason to have any limit on it at all. Since you have to pay for the training time (as it should be, ghost training never should have existed in the first place) there's absolutely no reason I should have log in to click a button to make the next skill go. I should be able to play when I want and not have to schedule other more important activities around a game. Given that the training is tied to real time whether you're in game or not, there's really no excuse for not having an infinite queue. Yes there is, it's called, games are supposed to be played, not used as a 10 buck a month investment to sell of a.... hmmm yeah good idea... how is it any different than training Drone Interfacing V and not playing for 25+ days? It's my sub, i'll play when i want thanks. Makes no difference to CCP if/when i actually play as long as i continue my sub. if someone needs to set a new skill to train but doesn't have time to play then they currently will login for 60 secs to set the skill then they're off again. -> queue should be of arbitrary length. incidentally, i am a very casual player due to RL workload & committments, and i only resubscribed to EVE because of the introduction of the skill queue.
Taius Pax	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:18:00 - [40] Originally by: Marrrk Edited by: Marrrk on 20/03/2009 16:13:21 Its far from useless, when I have less than 24 hours left on a skill I get to add a new skill to the queue and not have to worry about when I am going to fit that remaining 14 hours it. It benefits older players just as much as younger players. It's not useless. It just only solves one of the problems it could have. (Having to log in at a specific time to set a skill instead of the current 24hr window - yes this is an improvement!) But it doesn't address issues with people who need to be away from the game for a long period of time for some reason.
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:20:00 - [41] Originally by: Laur Khal i probably won't come back due to months of lost training. You realise that you don't actually lose anything, right? By your logic I 'lost' years of skill training by not joining EVE at release. So did everyone else who joined after release. - DesuSigs
Laur Khal	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:23:00 - [42] Edited by: Laur Khal on 20/03/2009 16:27:11 Edited by: Laur Khal on 20/03/2009 16:25:17 Edited by: Laur Khal on 20/03/2009 16:24:31 Originally by: Crumplecorn Originally by: Laur Khal i probably won't come back due to months of lost training. You realise that you don't actually lose anything, right? By your logic I 'lost' years of skill training by not joining EVE at release. So did everyone else who joined after release. it's a bit different... when you unsub from EVE it may be due to an extended period of RL work/committments but you have full intentions of resubbing in the future when the RL stuff settles down. if you now stop training 3 days after unsubbing then it really kills a lot of the desire to come back... if i get another 3 month OS assignment then i'm probably done with EVE cause what's the point of paying for 3+ months if you know you'll be unable to play at all? at least when skills continued training after unsubbing i could set the longest skill possible and eliminate or substantially mitigate the training loss. for a casual like me, "losing" 3 months of training time is a killer. so for me, no training after unsubbing is close to a death sentence for my EVE days.
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:27:00 - [43] Originally by: Laur Khal it's a bit different... when you unsub from EVE it may be due to an extended period of RL work/committments but you have full intentions of resubbing in the future when the RL stuff settles down. If they are going to account for that, they should give you the ISK you would have made in that time too. CCP want you to need to log in to change skills, just as you need to log in to make ISK or do anything else. Feature, not a bug. - DesuSigs
Laur Khal	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:28:00 - [44] Edited by: Laur Khal on 20/03/2009 16:30:50 Edited by: Laur Khal on 20/03/2009 16:29:31 Originally by: Crumplecorn CCP want you to need to log in to change skills, just as you need to log in to make ISK or do anything else. Feature, not a bug. that much is clear, and that's why i've cancelled. great "feature"... not. i don't have time for a game that "needs" me to do anything.
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:30:00 - [45] Edited by: Crumplecorn on 20/03/2009 16:37:24 Edited by: Crumplecorn on 20/03/2009 16:33:52 Originally by: Laur Khal that much is clear, and that's why i've cancelled. great "feature"... not. The list of features in EVE which are good but nonetheless make people quit is long and extensive. Also, if skills are the be all and end all of EVE for you, then this (rickroll) is for you. Quote: i don't have time for a game that "needs" me to do anything. Recorded for posterity. - DesuSigs
Xenoxide Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:33:00 - [46] Originally by: Laur Khal i don't have time for a game that "needs" me to do anything. You want to play a game without actually playing the game? Reward without effort?
Laur Khal	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:39:00 - [47] Edited by: Laur Khal on 20/03/2009 16:40:09 Originally by: Xenoxide You want to play a game without actually playing the game? Reward without effort? how is skill training while logged off/unsubscribed "playing"? what about buy/sell order that people sell to/buy from while you're logged out? more "reward without effort", huh? /cluestick
Taius Pax	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:43:00 - [48] Originally by: Xenoxide Originally by: Laur Khal i don't have time for a game that "needs" me to do anything. You want to play a game without actually playing the game? Reward without effort? The reward/effort part of Eve is ISK. Fight more, kill more, pirate more, mine more, get more ISK. The only in-game effort in skill training is buying learning skills and implants and this is more about knowing the fact that this benefits you. Having to schedule life around 60 second periods to click a button in a game is silly.
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:43:00 - [49] Originally by: Laur Khal how is skill training while logged off/unsubscribed "playing"? Skill training is part of the game, the fact that it is very hands off doesn't change this. If you don't agree, why so emo over skills? Originally by: Laur Khal what about buy/sell order that people sell to/buy from while you're logged out? more "reward without effort", huh? Your skills train while logged out too, what's your point? - DesuSigs
Archiaron Gallente Midnight Enterprises	Posted - 2009.03.20 16:57:00 - [50] I've had no real issues with the skill Que at all. when I need to travel somewhere and won't be around a computer for a while I throw in a Spaceships command skill to V and don't really bother more about it after. The idea with a 24h time limit is probably for just more then forcing you to log on and play sometimes. If I could Que how much I wanted my idea would be to start a few alts, buy the skill books I wanted for them and just Que them for the next 7 or 8 months and come back when they're ready. But honestly, this game has existed since 2003-2004 and even though everyone complained about needing a Que, we managed without it for 7 years. And I had no problems earlier with training as well. The only thing this Que has done is reduce the times that I have to start a skill training I didn't really want but had the optimal duration for when I needed to travel. 24h or 48h makes little difference, the only thing that happens is that someone else's training plan isn't working with the Que system and comes to the forums to offer extended time on it. Side note: I agree that the Que becomes less useful fast when you've played longer. But then again, the older players has the benefits of always having skills that will require more then 2 or 3 days to finish. Something newer players may not have due to low multipliers.
Niccolado Starwalker Shadow Templars	Posted - 2009.03.20 17:17:00 - [51] Originally by: Sheriff Jones Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 20/03/2009 13:10:43 The thing about skillqueue is that it's a VERY nice tool. You can basically train(choo)train(hihi) a skill to level 5. At some point though, you get all your skills(rather quickly) to a level where they all take over a day. I'm assuming this comes rather fast with some people. So, a suggestion to queue "change"; Keep so that you can set any amount of skills in queue on the 24h period but also add that you can set 2 skills after each other even if they go over that time. So, 24 hour period = limitless. Other then that, maximum 2 skill queue. The skillqueue is great, but it quickly becomes a "useless" feature. Thoughts? No. This is one of the reason I did not want a skill queue in the first place. If you give the playerbase a finger, they want the whole bloody hand! I think CCP have been too nice already! Queuing with one additional skill as you propose will not be good for the game! Originally by: Dianabolic Your tears are absolutely divine, like a fine fine wine, rolling down your cheeks until they flow down the river of LOL
Jarna Amarr Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2009.03.20 17:25:00 - [52] Originally by: Taius Pax Originally by: ry ry it's an interesting idea actually. i suspect the 24 hour thing is just to keep people logging in regularly. They claim this is the reason for the limit. However, I find this to be utter bull**. How is setting a long training queue, say 30 days long, and walking away from the computer different from setting a 30-40 day skill and walking away from the computer? Given that ghost training was removed and there's no way to recover skill points lost to real world time not spent training I find CCP's argument utterly hollow. So, someone else who isn't blinded by the Siren song of CCP. CCP's argument that the queue allows people to log in more is utter bull. I find myself playing the game more when I have 5 or 6 quick skills training than when I have 3 day long skills. I've had several people concur with me on this. This doesn't fix the issue, because the login issue lies with people not logging in during 3day + skills. In-fact, it may exacerbate it because now, people can login once every 24 hours to setup skills instead of every couple hours. So many of you are **en brainwashed and can't even see it; it's pathetic.
Ronha Ottrit Minmatar	Posted - 2009.03.20 17:26:00 - [53] Originally by: Laur Khal Edited by: Laur Khal on 20/03/2009 16:30:50 Edited by: Laur Khal on 20/03/2009 16:29:31 Originally by: Crumplecorn CCP want you to need to log in to change skills, just as you need to log in to make ISK or do anything else. Feature, not a bug. that much is clear, and that's why i've cancelled. great "feature"... not. i don't have time for a game that "needs" me to do anything. This is pretty universal to all MMO's, if your unsubbed or not playing, raid gear isn't going to magically appear in your inventory on EQ2 or WoW. If your going on a long trip, set a long skill, maybe get a friend to log you on and queue the next long one for you.. you have friends right? Hard to guess with this defeatist attitude.
Tkar vonBiggendorf Gallente Snake Eyes Inc	Posted - 2009.03.20 17:31:00 - [54] Sheesh. Give a mouse a cookie.... So you can't queue up two level 5's back to back from the start. But, at least you don't have to log in at 3am to switch skills, or pause that first level 5 with 12 hours left and finish it off 2-3 hours at a time over the next week. You get to queue the next skill at a time of day of your choosing, if not the day of your choosing. Big win for us, any way you look at it. I promise nothingÖ. --CCP Prism X
Ronha Ottrit Minmatar	Posted - 2009.03.20 17:36:00 - [55] Originally by: Sheriff Jones Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 20/03/2009 13:10:43 The thing about skillqueue is that it's a VERY nice tool. You can basically train(choo)train(hihi) a skill to level 5. At some point though, you get all your skills(rather quickly) to a level where they all take over a day. I'm assuming this comes rather fast with some people. So, a suggestion to queue "change"; Keep so that you can set any amount of skills in queue on the 24h period but also add that you can set 2 skills after each other even if they go over that time. So, 24 hour period = limitless. Other then that, maximum 2 skill queue. The skillqueue is great, but it quickly becomes a "useless" feature. Thoughts? I'd say the amount of people who have every skill in the game past level 1, or even all the ones they need for a chosen vocation, are the minority. I believe I remember reading the largest portion of the population is in the 30-40mil SP range, and speaking for the majority myself, can attest that i've got PLENTY of small skills I need done. Sorry Sheriff, your the minority and as for right now the change is not needed, besides 24 hour window is plenty. If you can't log in for those last 24 hours then plan ahead.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2009.03.20 17:41:00 - [56] Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker No. This is one of the reason I did not want a skill queue in the first place. If you give the playerbase a finger, they want the whole bloody hand! I think CCP have been too nice already! Queuing with one additional skill as you propose will not be good for the game! Baaah! I like the finger! ....no wait..damn...oh well, roll with it.... IT's covered in chocolate and...no wait...damnit...hold on. goes off to fix his analogies The finger that CCP gave us is yummy to suck on... To hell with it...and i love the finger, i'm not asking for a whole hand, i'm asking for a possible add-on, like a ring, or a clipped nail. BEcause hwile i enjoy all the goodness of the chocolate covered finger i'm recieving, i still feel like that there could be more to it. I'm not demanding, or complaining, or whining...i'm just..well...sometimes you like a bit more then a finger. Now i'm gonna take a shwoer as this post made me feel dirtier then usual. Which is saying alot. My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
Winterblink Body Count Inc. Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2009.03.20 17:41:00 - [57] Originally by: Sheriff Jones Originally by: Marrrk Edited by: Marrrk on 20/03/2009 16:13:21 Its far from useless, when I have less than 24 hours left on a skill I get to add a new skill to the queue and not have to worry about when I am going to fit that remaining 14 hours it. It benefits older players just as much as younger players. slams head on desk Whoa whoa WHOA!!! moves pie Ok, continue warp drive active \| nature vraie
Cors It's A Trap	Posted - 2009.03.20 17:49:00 - [58] Just make a skill cue Skill. lvl 1 24hrs.. lvl 2 48hrs lvl 3 72hrs lvl 4 96hrs lvl 5 120hr. Make it a rank 10 Skill. SIG: FULL WINDOWS CLIENT 1.9gig
Niccolado Starwalker Shadow Templars	Posted - 2009.03.20 17:54:00 - [59] Originally by: Sheriff Jones Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker No. This is one of the reason I did not want a skill queue in the first place. If you give the playerbase a finger, they want the whole bloody hand! I think CCP have been too nice already! Queuing with one additional skill as you propose will not be good for the game! Baaah! I like the finger! ....no wait..damn...oh well, roll with it.... IT's covered in chocolate and...no wait...damnit...hold on. goes off to fix his analogies The finger that CCP gave us is yummy to suck on... To hell with it...and i love the finger, i'm not asking for a whole hand, i'm asking for a possible add-on, like a ring, or a clipped nail. BEcause hwile i enjoy all the goodness of the chocolate covered finger i'm recieving, i still feel like that there could be more to it. I'm not demanding, or complaining, or whining...i'm just..well...sometimes you like a bit more then a finger. Now i'm gonna take a shwoer as this post made me feel dirtier then usual. Which is saying alot. Well, look on it from the bright side. Your ideas might not be the best, but your stories are! Originally by: Dianabolic Your tears are absolutely divine, like a fine fine wine, rolling down your cheeks until they flow down the river of LOL
Zex Maxwell Caldari	Posted - 2009.03.20 17:58:00 - [60] Edited by: Zex Maxwell on 20/03/2009 18:01:19 Originally by: Sheriff Jones At some point though, you get all your skills(rather quickly) to a level where they all take over a day. I'm assuming this comes rather fast with some people. Yeah, it did come a lot faster when it hits to day long skills. its actually came to the point where i forgot to add a skill, and my char was doing nothing till I notes it. Originally by: Marrrk Its far from useless, when I have less than 24 hours left on a skill I get to add a new skill to the queue and not have to worry about when I am going to fit that remaining 14 hours it. It benefits older players just as much as younger players. Start doing lv 5 skills, and tell me that comment still applies to you. ---

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