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Schalac Caldari Apocalypse Reign	Posted - 2009.04.11 09:22:00 - [1] Jebus Chimney CCP, 1 second jam time on suicide gankers??? As soon as i got my first volley off I was jammed to hell and back. How are we supposed to suicide people if you cheat the game with 1 second jam times when someone goes criminal in highsec? I mean I know that CONCORD reaction times were reduced, but this is more than reduced it's instant now. How is that fair to us people that find a nice juicy target just auto piloting his way through high sec? It's freaking WoW with space ships. WOW WITH SPACESHIPS, no wonder Iceland has a queen for a king. SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN
Sjobba	Posted - 2009.04.11 09:34:00 - [2] Nice. Suicide ganker tears. This definitely goes into the collection. Originally by: Schalac [...]no wonder Iceland has a queen for a king. I wasn't aware we had a king... nor a queen
Schalac Caldari Apocalypse Reign	Posted - 2009.04.11 09:37:00 - [3] Originally by: Sjobba Nice. Suicide ganker tears. This definitely goes into the collection. Originally by: Schalac [...]no wonder Iceland has a queen for a king. I wasn't aware we had a king... nor a queen Post with your main, queen. SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN
Banana Torres The Green Banana Corporation	Posted - 2009.04.11 10:26:00 - [4] Originally by: Schalac It's freaking WoW with space ships. WOW WITH SPACESHIPS How so? It it was WoW you would either be able to agress with no response, agress but have to deal with angry, but beatable, NPCs or not be able to agress at all. Originally by: Schalac no wonder Iceland has a queen for a king. I don't think Kerry Katona counts as royalty.
Colonel Xaven Decadence. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2009.04.11 10:32:00 - [5] Originally by: Schalac Jebus Chimney CCP, 1 second jam time on suicide gankers??? As soon as i got my first volley off I was jammed to hell and back. How are we supposed to suicide people if you cheat the game with 1 second jam times when someone goes criminal in highsec? I mean I know that CONCORD reaction times were reduced, but this is more than reduced it's instant now. How is that fair to us people that find a nice juicy target just auto piloting his way through high sec? It's freaking WoW with space ships. WOW WITH SPACESHIPS, no wonder Iceland has a queen for a king. You should do the tutorial at least once. Empire was never designed for ganking. If you have some SP, you can move your rifter to lowsec. Proud member of RZR - Decadence.
Sjobba	Posted - 2009.04.11 10:33:00 - [6] Originally by: Schalac Originally by: Sjobba Nice. Suicide ganker tears. This definitely goes into the collection. Originally by: Schalac [...]no wonder Iceland has a queen for a king. I wasn't aware we had a king... nor a queen Post with your main, queen. Nice. I even got him to give me the "I totally fail, and I know it" response And no, seeing as my main is currently in carebear-mode I have no intention of drawing the attention of forum-trolling wannabe mercs. (Not neccissarily you, by the way. But there are a lot of them around.) Feel free to war-dec me tho. I'm online every now and then to check Jita prizes
Schalac Caldari Apocalypse Reign	Posted - 2009.04.11 10:35:00 - [7] Originally by: Colonel Xaven Originally by: Schalac Jebus Chimney CCP, 1 second jam time on suicide gankers??? As soon as i got my first volley off I was jammed to hell and back. How are we supposed to suicide people if you cheat the game with 1 second jam times when someone goes criminal in highsec? I mean I know that CONCORD reaction times were reduced, but this is more than reduced it's instant now. How is that fair to us people that find a nice juicy target just auto piloting his way through high sec? It's freaking WoW with space ships. WOW WITH SPACESHIPS, no wonder Iceland has a queen for a king. You should do the tutorial at least once. Empire was never designed for ganking. If you have some SP, you can move your rifter to lowsec. Rifter?? lowsec??? Sorry I'm not a goon, I fly real ships, and yes all Empire ever was is ganking because no one ever consents to PvP in empire. SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN
Sibs Dalarian	Posted - 2009.04.11 10:38:00 - [8] Post with your main, queen. Did you by any chance grab that superior argumentative logic from the WoW forums? But i agree I am sure the queen "main" would have a totally different unbiased point of view simply because of an avatar change! The response times on Concord are excellent and I am glad to see that the Bears that Care are a little safer every day from the harm of random shootings.
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N. Dara Cothrom	Posted - 2009.04.11 10:40:00 - [9] Originally by: Colonel Xaven Originally by: Schalac Jebus Chimney CCP, 1 second jam time on suicide gankers??? As soon as i got my first volley off I was jammed to hell and back. How are we supposed to suicide people if you cheat the game with 1 second jam times when someone goes criminal in highsec? I mean I know that CONCORD reaction times were reduced, but this is more than reduced it's instant now. How is that fair to us people that find a nice juicy target just auto piloting his way through high sec? It's freaking WoW with space ships. WOW WITH SPACESHIPS, no wonder Iceland has a queen for a king. You should do the tutorial at least once. Empire was never designed for ganking. If you have some SP, you can move your rifter to lowsec. Said the alliance with NPC corp freighter alts in abundance
Schalac Caldari Apocalypse Reign	Posted - 2009.04.11 10:46:00 - [10] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Colonel Xaven Originally by: Schalac Jebus Chimney CCP, 1 second jam time on suicide gankers??? As soon as i got my first volley off I was jammed to hell and back. How are we supposed to suicide people if you cheat the game with 1 second jam times when someone goes criminal in highsec? I mean I know that CONCORD reaction times were reduced, but this is more than reduced it's instant now. How is that fair to us people that find a nice juicy target just auto piloting his way through high sec? It's freaking WoW with space ships. WOW WITH SPACESHIPS, no wonder Iceland has a queen for a king. You should do the tutorial at least once. Empire was never designed for ganking. If you have some SP, you can move your rifter to lowsec. Said the alliance with NPC corp freighter alts in abundance Oh, that looks like... yes it is. Military experts all calling this a burn. RAZOR alliance lol. Why don't you Mach 3 your ass out of my thread Colonel. SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN
Colonel Xaven Decadence. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2009.04.11 10:46:00 - [11] Originally by: Schalac Rifter?? lowsec??? Sorry I'm not a goon, I fly real ships, and yes all Empire ever was is ganking because no one ever consents to PvP in empire. I am sure there is a guide for war declarations. If not, join the ingame help channel. Originally by: Malcanis Said the alliance with NPC corp freighter alts in abundance I wish I could say something about your alliance, but I don't know it. Offtopic anyways. Proud member of RZR - Decadence.
Ruze Ahkor'Murkon Amarr No Applicable Corporation	Posted - 2009.04.11 10:50:00 - [12] The real solution, is a more in-depth criminal system. This would completely change how crime happens, though, and would have drawbacks and advantages. - CONCORD should no longer be invulnerable, and should again be tankable/destroyable. - Evading CONCORD or other faction police should no longer be an 'exploit' (was stupid to begin with). - Committing a crime and getting caught by CONCORD or faction police gives a real punishment, including short term imprisonment for that character (not avoidable by recycling the char, unlogging, or changing toons). - Property destroyed during a suicide gank is requisitioned the moment police arrive, including any wrecks and cans. - Characters receive PERMANENT criminal records, which are relative to the region/empire where the offense was committed, and increases the chance the police will respond faster and more harshly, slowly and over time. - Characters who commit a crime receive a warrant, and can be pursued by CONCORD, faction police, or select 'law enforcement' players in regions where that warrant is valid. Separate of the bounty system, which is independent. Warrants are only removed when the players crime is served (via imprisonment, destruction, etc). On the other end: - Insurance contracts cannot be collected by someone accused/convicted of a crime. - In the case where an individual unlawfully attacks another player, taking their rightful possessions (secure cans/wrecks) and causing them damage, the criminal player (if caught) can be charged for the dividend of repairs/replacements. I'd then add more ways to do crime, legitimate through game mechanics. Ways to deliberately make false contracts (where you use an in-game skill in order to create said contract with false information); ways to jam, disable and hijack ship modules straight from the ship, without destroying it (and alerting police); etc. Make it a real profession. Combine a real profession with the means to escape the police, but severe punishment if you're caught? Good criminals get better ... bad and mediocre criminals would suck. Originally by: 5pinDizzy Troll Score-o-Meter --------Failure----------\|\|\|-----------Succes------- 10-9-8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1--0--1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10
Schalac Caldari Apocalypse Reign	Posted - 2009.04.11 10:51:00 - [13] Originally by: Colonel Xaven Originally by: Schalac Rifter?? lowsec??? Sorry I'm not a goon, I fly real ships, and yes all Empire ever was is ganking because no one ever consents to PvP in empire. I am sure there is a guide for war declarations. If not, join the ingame help channel. Originally by: Malcanis Said the alliance with NPC corp freighter alts in abundance I wish I could say something about your alliance, but I don't know it. Offtopic anyways. Didn't I just tell you to GIT? Anyway. What am I going to do with a war declaration? Ok lets see here I find a hauler with some juicy stuff in his cargo hold. I then mark his corp and alliance and propose a vote to war dec them. I then log in all of my alts to vote on said war dec and then wait 24 hours for the resolution to pass. All the while that guy I was marking is going to wait for me to get all of this done and stay there for me so I can legally shoot him??? Now GIT. SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN
Colonel Xaven Decadence. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2009.04.11 10:59:00 - [14] Originally by: Schalac Didn't I just tell you to GIT? No need to weep bitter tears. You asked here, don't fear answers. Quote: Anyway. What am I going to do with a war declaration? Ok lets see here I find a hauler with some juicy stuff in his cargo hold. I then mark his corp and alliance and propose a vote to war dec them. I then log in all of my alts to vote on said war dec and then wait 24 hours for the resolution to pass. All the while that guy I was marking is going to wait for me to get all of this done and stay there for me so I can legally shoot him??? You can have it very much easier in lowsec or 0.0. Try it. If you need help with that, join the ingame help channel. Proud member of RZR - Decadence.
Asuka Smith Gallente StarHunt	Posted - 2009.04.11 11:06:00 - [15] The ability to engage a player in non-consensual PVP and a single server shard are the defining traits of EVE. The OP is on to something, and while I myself have never and will never suicide gank, the fact that it was an option was a big part of my experience. I am disheartened at this development, and if the DEVs are reading I hope you read this and remember what killed UO before you start implementing more changes that reduce risk and danger in ANY part of EVE.
Tippia Raddick Explorations BlackWater.	Posted - 2009.04.11 11:11:00 - [16] Originally by: Colonel Xaven You should do the tutorial at least once. Empire was never designed for ganking. When I did the tutorial, it quite clearly stated that empire space (including high-sec) wasn't safe; that you should be on your toes at all time; and that ganks could happen anywhere… So I'd say it was quite clearly designed for ganking. ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in =v=… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki
Lord Fitz Project Amargosa	Posted - 2009.04.11 11:12:00 - [17] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Colonel Xaven Originally by: Schalac Jebus Chimney CCP, 1 second jam time on suicide gankers??? As soon as i got my first volley off I was jammed to hell and back. How are we supposed to suicide people if you cheat the game with 1 second jam times when someone goes criminal in highsec? I mean I know that CONCORD reaction times were reduced, but this is more than reduced it's instant now. How is that fair to us people that find a nice juicy target just auto piloting his way through high sec? It's freaking WoW with space ships. WOW WITH SPACESHIPS, no wonder Iceland has a queen for a king. You should do the tutorial at least once. Empire was never designed for ganking. If you have some SP, you can move your rifter to lowsec. Said the alliance with NPC corp freighter alts in abundance Have you seen any 0.0 alliance for which this isn't the case ? If so, please let me know, I have people itching for stupid targets.
Schalac Caldari Apocalypse Reign	Posted - 2009.04.11 11:14:00 - [18] Originally by: Colonel Xaven You can have it very much easier in lowsec or 0.0. Try it. If you need help with that, join the ingame help channel. Oh yes, how did I miss all of those heavily traveled trade routes in lowsec and 0.0 where people auto pilot T1 industrials all day long? I should of gone there instead... SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN
TimMc Gallente Brutal Deliverance	Posted - 2009.04.11 11:16:00 - [19] Originally by: Ruze Ahkor'Murkon The real solution, is a more in-depth criminal system. This would completely change how crime happens, though, and would have drawbacks and advantages. - CONCORD should no longer be invulnerable, and should again be tankable/destroyable. - Evading CONCORD or other faction police should no longer be an 'exploit' (was stupid to begin with). - Committing a crime and getting caught by CONCORD or faction police gives a real punishment, including short term imprisonment for that character (not avoidable by recycling the char, unlogging, or changing toons). - Property destroyed during a suicide gank is requisitioned the moment police arrive, including any wrecks and cans. - Characters receive PERMANENT criminal records, which are relative to the region/empire where the offense was committed, and increases the chance the police will respond faster and more harshly, slowly and over time. - Characters who commit a crime receive a warrant, and can be pursued by CONCORD, faction police, or select 'law enforcement' players in regions where that warrant is valid. Separate of the bounty system, which is independent. Warrants are only removed when the players crime is served (via imprisonment, destruction, etc). On the other end: - Insurance contracts cannot be collected by someone accused/convicted of a crime. - In the case where an individual unlawfully attacks another player, taking their rightful possessions (secure cans/wrecks) and causing them damage, the criminal player (if caught) can be charged for the dividend of repairs/replacements. I'd then add more ways to do crime, legitimate through game mechanics. Ways to deliberately make false contracts (where you use an in-game skill in order to create said contract with false information); ways to jam, disable and hijack ship modules straight from the ship, without destroying it (and alerting police); etc. Make it a real profession. Combine a real profession with the means to escape the police, but severe punishment if you're caught? Good criminals get better ... bad and mediocre criminals would suck. CCP hire this man.
Shidhe Minmatar The Babylon5 Consortuim	Posted - 2009.04.11 11:17:00 - [20] I am somewhat sympathetic to the OP. NPC corps are a rather abused system - they were never intended to provide safe operations for major alliances. However suicide ganking should not be viable against smaller targets - there should be a long term cost to make only really valuable targets worth while. Killing new character's hard won industrial in high sec at the cost of a tech 1 frig to an established character cannot be allowed. The point made in another post about an expanded criminal system is good - though the details need work. But the idea of avoiding Concord being an exploit really should go. Gradations in high-sec really should mean something. In 1.0 systems there probably is a policeman on each corner. In 0.5 systems the law is stretched, and suicide ganking should be something to worry about when you take that freighter of Dyspro through. And lots of routes from A to B in high sec do pass through 0.5 or 0.6 on the way...
Colonel Xaven Decadence. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2009.04.11 11:23:00 - [21] Originally by: Schalac Oh yes, how did I miss all of those heavily traveled trade routes in lowsec and 0.0 where people auto pilot T1 industrials all day long? I should of gone there instead... Oh, you look for very very easy afk instant-iwin kills - the real PvP way. Why don't you just say that? I am afraid this game is not that easy yet. But why don't you just start a campaign about it (you know, countless alts starting threads complaining about it)? Maybe CCP can do you a favor. And maybe CCP can design an AFK option too, i.e. a button which says "if you wanna go afk and still gank afk ships with no consequence in empire, press here". Who knows, some day... Proud member of RZR - Decadence.
Schalac Caldari Apocalypse Reign	Posted - 2009.04.11 11:25:00 - [22] I'm not ***ing about being blown up, I'm not *ing about concord showing up faster and I'm not *ing about sec loss. What really irks me is that I now have to not only click a damned menu everytime I want to suicide someone, because the do not show this again box was removed from that message, but have to deal you infinpoint jammers that lock you out instantly. If you can't alpha a target then you can't kill it is what CCP said to us and then went and nerfed all of the weapons that were actually able to alpha stuff. It's complete bull** honestly. SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN
Schalac Caldari Apocalypse Reign	Posted - 2009.04.11 11:27:00 - [23] Originally by: Colonel Xaven Originally by: Schalac Oh yes, how did I miss all of those heavily traveled trade routes in lowsec and 0.0 where people auto pilot T1 industrials all day long? I should of gone there instead... Oh, you look for very very easy afk instant-iwin kills - the real PvP way. Why don't you just say that? I am afraid this game is not that easy yet. But why don't you just start a campaign about it (you know, countless alts starting threads complaining about it)? Maybe CCP can do you a favor. And maybe CCP can design an AFK option too, i.e. a button which says "if you wanna go afk and still gank afk ships with no consequence in empire, press here". Who knows, some day... It's called piracy you ******. Look it up on your "google". SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN
Colonel Xaven Decadence. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2009.04.11 11:30:00 - [24] Originally by: Schalac It's called piracy you ****. Look it up on your "google". You mean me in person? Now you become bitter. That's sad. Proud member of RZR - Decadence.**
Ms Delerium	Posted - 2009.04.11 11:36:00 - [25] LMAO you been caught. You just want easy kills. You are worse than carebears. MS DELERIUM HAS SPOKEN
Sakurako Kimino OffBeat Creations	Posted - 2009.04.11 11:37:00 - [26] Originally by: Ruze Ahkor'Murkon The real solution, is a more in-depth criminal system. This would completely change how crime happens, though, and would have drawbacks and advantages. - CONCORD should no longer be invulnerable, and should again be tankable/destroyable. - Evading CONCORD or other faction police should no longer be an 'exploit' (was stupid to begin with). - Committing a crime and getting caught by CONCORD or faction police gives a real punishment, including short term imprisonment for that character (not avoidable by recycling the char, unlogging, or changing toons). - Property destroyed during a suicide gank is requisitioned the moment police arrive, including any wrecks and cans. - Characters receive PERMANENT criminal records, which are relative to the region/empire where the offense was committed, and increases the chance the police will respond faster and more harshly, slowly and over time. - Characters who commit a crime receive a warrant, and can be pursued by CONCORD, faction police, or select 'law enforcement' players in regions where that warrant is valid. Separate of the bounty system, which is independent. Warrants are only removed when the players crime is served (via imprisonment, destruction, etc). On the other end: - Insurance contracts cannot be collected by someone accused/convicted of a crime. - In the case where an individual unlawfully attacks another player, taking their rightful possessions (secure cans/wrecks) and causing them damage, the criminal player (if caught) can be charged for the dividend of repairs/replacements. I'd then add more ways to do crime, legitimate through game mechanics. Ways to deliberately make false contracts (where you use an in-game skill in order to create said contract with false information); ways to jam, disable and hijack ship modules straight from the ship, without destroying it (and alerting police); etc. Make it a real profession. Combine a real profession with the means to escape the police, but severe punishment if you're caught? Good criminals get better ... bad and mediocre criminals would suck. Just no. as to high sec gankers i find them to be cowards you want to kill people in hi sec war dec them so the can fight back, i'm also one who is not agenst them being in the game but if your going to camp a hi sec gate where concord is then be ready for the insta locks.
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2009.04.11 11:38:00 - [27] Originally by: Ruze Ahkor'Murkon The real solution, is a more in-depth criminal system. This would completely change how crime happens, though, and would have drawbacks and advantages. - CONCORD should no longer be invulnerable, and should again be tankable/destroyable. - Evading CONCORD or other faction police should no longer be an 'exploit' (was stupid to begin with). - Committing a crime and getting caught by CONCORD or faction police gives a real punishment, including short term imprisonment for that character (not avoidable by recycling the char, unlogging, or changing toons). - Property destroyed during a suicide gank is requisitioned the moment police arrive, including any wrecks and cans. - Characters receive PERMANENT criminal records, which are relative to the region/empire where the offense was committed, and increases the chance the police will respond faster and more harshly, slowly and over time. - Characters who commit a crime receive a warrant, and can be pursued by CONCORD, faction police, or select 'law enforcement' players in regions where that warrant is valid. Separate of the bounty system, which is independent. Warrants are only removed when the players crime is served (via imprisonment, destruction, etc). On the other end: - Insurance contracts cannot be collected by someone accused/convicted of a crime. - In the case where an individual unlawfully attacks another player, taking their rightful possessions (secure cans/wrecks) and causing them damage, the criminal player (if caught) can be charged for the dividend of repairs/replacements. I'd then add more ways to do crime, legitimate through game mechanics. Ways to deliberately make false contracts (where you use an in-game skill in order to create said contract with false information); ways to jam, disable and hijack ship modules straight from the ship, without destroying it (and alerting police); etc. Make it a real profession. Combine a real profession with the means to escape the police, but severe punishment if you're caught? Good criminals get better ... bad and mediocre criminals would suck. Would be interesting if the penalties were strong enough (no 10 minutes go to jail for killing a freighter) and not too easy to circumvent using an alt (i.e if penalty is 1 hour of that character game time, leaving him in jail and playing with a alt make the penalty almost meaningless). Maybe a way to reflect that could be freezing training for the account for a period, but then people will start protesting that it is only a way to force people to subscribe for a longer time. Isk fines? weak. The idea is interesting but very hard to realize. Too easy to make the consequence meaningless if you are Real Life or Game Life rick.
Schalac Caldari Apocalypse Reign	Posted - 2009.04.11 11:42:00 - [28] Originally by: Ms Delerium LMAO you been caught. You just want easy kills. You are worse than carebears. MS DELERIUM HAS SPOKEN Hmm, that's interesting. How about this. If you can tell me who HAS SPOKEN, before SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN I'll let you off easy. If not I'll form a posse and come gank the ever living hell out of you with way too much over kill to make sure we kill you in an alpha strike. SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN
Shidhe Minmatar The Babylon5 Consortuim	Posted - 2009.04.11 12:00:00 - [29] Advice to OP - don't get side-tracked by attacks. You want a sensible discussion on this subject (and I do too), and a thread consisting of 95% attack and counterattack is just going to get ignored (which is often what the people posting want). So address only the posts that actually say something, and save up for a considered response. Good luck!
Colonel Xaven Decadence. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2009.04.11 12:02:00 - [30] Originally by: Schalac Originally by: Ms Delerium LMAO you been caught. You just want easy kills. You are worse than carebears. MS DELERIUM HAS SPOKEN Hmm, that's interesting. How about this. If you can tell me who HAS SPOKEN, before SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN I'll let you off easy. If not I'll form a posse and come gank the ever living hell out of you with way too much over kill to make sure we kill you in an alpha strike. You make a fool of yourself. Seriously, dude. Proud member of RZR - Decadence.

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