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mightylord Minmatar Victory Not Vengeance Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2009.04.21 09:46:00 - [1] This should be in CAOD but no longer have a toon in a corp ATM. People here lie and tell the truth, so for alot of us it is difficult whom to believe. Not one shred of evidence has ever proved one person wrong or right. I have absolutely nothing to lose or gain from posting here. But something has prompted me to stand up and tell the masses what they are missing. That something was the idolization of Goons and thier actions. Have all of you who play this game lost thier sense of morality? Do you enjoy idolizing those whos primary existance from the begining was to destroy this game for the rest of us? You all know this to be true but you have lost sight of this and fell into the honey coming from the destruction of BOB aka Kenzoku. Sure without a doubt BoB was an entity that needed to be dealt with but we have simply replaced one evil with an inheritantly greater evil. Goons has used ALMOST every trick in the book to sway the masses to thier cause and now those who have been swayed have been lulled to the point of submission, with the exception of NC, XDeathX, IRC, ED, and a few others. These people refuse to be the puppets/pets of Goons. Now here are some of the juicy parts you need to know. 1. NC reset joke is not a joke. It was leaked by one of thier members prematurely. NC's plans are to withdraw on friendly terms from their assistance with goons and turn to attack Cobalt Edge because they are tired of having to give more and more to MH so pacify them. They figure while XD is busy with AAA and Atlas they will be ripe for the plucking. They are also concerned that XD is the largest land holder in the game currently and they want to rectify that. If Goons interferes or tries to threaten they will be set to red not just neut. Also thier other pets MM,KIA, Initiative have been sent as a small token to help goons back up thier pets as well. 2. XD has refused time and time again to assist goons with the problem of thier RA support nipping on the heels of AAA while being slammed by IRC/ED forces. They are unaware of NC's plans and continue to blindly support thier Russian brothers in the fight against AAA while ignoring IRC/ED. XD needs to know that soon he will be reset by NC and have to fight on 2 fronts unless he withdraws his support for RA. 3. IRC/ED have been fighting all comers with over 20 alliances showing up on thier killboards and they are still fighting with the heart of a lion. Last estimate they are killing enemy forces at a rate of 4:1 and continue to do so every day. Thier latest tally has been 100 ships a day for the last 16 days. They are not afraid to drop caps, they are not afraid to fight overwhelming odds, and seem to continually overcome every obstacle in thier path. They are a proverbial bull in the china shop right now and RA is losing thier ASS. 4. TCF is sitting on the fence waiting to see what offers they get from goons and Razor as to which way they will swing. There has been considerable unrest in thier camp as to the actions of IRON and MH an ocassional hassels from PL and CH. the talk is not good the majority are disatisfied about goons and thier broken promises much like the relationship of Goons and Atlas and others goons have promised but never delivered. 5. Kraftwerk,UL,SE are currently trying to support RA in attacking all thier enemies but each has thier own agenda according to thier members. UL is very concerned about losing thier space to Kraft and dealing with SE have not been going so well and their members are tired of fighting AAA and are short on ships and cash. SE members feel that thier being surrounded and the possibility of RA wanting the space they gave them back. They are racked by the fear of TCF in thier midst suddenly expanding and taking thier space in case they swing towards the goons after the NC reset. Kraft wants to be left alone after they are done lending thier ships to goons and their other pets and assert thier independance. More Later
Admiral FANTASY Amarr DarkStar 1 GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 09:57:00 - [2] Yes.
steveid Amarr Killed In Action The Firm.	Posted - 2009.04.21 09:57:00 - [3] the thing is I dont think any of this is news to anyone. Goons started out like that but eve is an insidious thing and they have a lot invested in the game now, I think they have as much a role to play as anyone in the future of the game. As for goons vs the NC i think that was always a marriage of convenience. It will last long enough to ensure BoB's destruction and its only natural (and better for both sides) that it ends. You dont want all of eve blue do you? The fact is goons dont really need anyone any more and will be looking to establish that with only their allies that stuck with them when it looked like they were going to get curbstomped.
Lizhia Birath Minmatar Rogue Industrial Group Shadows of Light	Posted - 2009.04.21 10:54:00 - [4] Edited by: Lizhia Birath on 21/04/2009 10:54:13 Is this thread about the NC attacking Xdeath or IRC, I dun understand :I
Jonas Cooke Minmatar Shadowed Command Fatal Ascension	Posted - 2009.04.21 11:02:00 - [5] Originally by: Lizhia Birath Edited by: Lizhia Birath on 21/04/2009 10:54:13 Is this thread about the NC attacking Xdeath or IRC, I dun understand :I All i got was Pro-IRC Anti-Goon.
Justin Cray Gallente GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 11:07:00 - [6] Originally by: Admiral FANTASY Yes. fpa strikes again
Himo Amasacia Minmatar Ultrapolite Socialites GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 11:08:00 - [7] "Understanding is a 3 edged Sword" - Ambassador Kosh
SpiderWebMayhem Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 11:10:00 - [8] Originally by: mightylord Goons has used ALMOST every trick in the book to sway the masses to thier cause and now those who have been swayed have been lulled to the point of submission, with the exception of NC, XDeathX, IRC, ED, and a few others. Here that PL? We have lulled you into submission. You may now serve me grapes and massage my feet. :smug:
Talitana Amarr GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 11:14:00 - [9] i think its a true story
Richyp Gallente GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 11:14:00 - [10] Originally by: SpiderWebMayhem Originally by: mightylord Goons has used ALMOST every trick in the book to sway the masses to thier cause and now those who have been swayed have been lulled to the point of submission, with the exception of NC, XDeathX, IRC, ED, and a few others. Here that PL? We have lulled you into submission. You may now serve me grapes and massage my feet. :smug: Did somebody say grape?

Cippalippus Primus Caldari The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2009.04.21 11:17:00 - [11] Originally by: mightylord Have all of you who play this game lost thier sense of morality? Do you enjoy idolizing those whos primary existance from the begining was to destroy this game for the rest of us? Let me paraphrase M.T. Cicero, with the first words of his famous speech against Catilina: Quousque tandem abutere, Goonius Examen, patientia nostra? Quam diu etiam furor iste tuus nos eludet? quem ad finem sese effrenata iactabit audacia? How long, O Goonswarm, will you abuse our patience? How long is that madness of yours still to mock us? When is there to be an end of that unbridled audacity of yours?
SpiderWebMayhem Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 11:25:00 - [12] Originally by: Richyp Originally by: SpiderWebMayhem Originally by: mightylord Goons has used ALMOST every trick in the book to sway the masses to thier cause and now those who have been swayed have been lulled to the point of submission, with the exception of NC, XDeathX, IRC, ED, and a few others. Here that PL? We have lulled you into submission. You may now serve me grapes and massage my feet. :smug: Did somebody say grape? Oh no what have I done! PL loves grapes!
Lumen Atra Gallente GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 11:29:00 - [13] Originally by: mightylord Sure without a doubt BoB was an entity that needed to be dealt with but we have simply replaced one evil with an inheritantly greater evil. Goons has used ALMOST every trick in the book to sway the masses to thier cause and now those who have been swayed have been lulled to the point of submission, with the exception of NC, XDeathX, IRC, ED, and a few others. These people refuse to be the puppets/pets of Goons. So, a greater evil is one that has not knowingly cheated, has attempted to spur development to making the game better, and has not fallen into thinking they are better than everybody else...this is a greater evil because...you don't like our attitude? Interesting. Tell us more about how evil is subjective based on whom you do or do not like instead of based on actions.
Totally Slick Amarr GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 11:31:00 - [14] I am totally slick, and I'm here to ask you a question. Is a man not entitled to the buttes of his donges? 'No!' says the man in Empire, 'It belongs to the mission runners.' 'No!' says the man in the Providence, 'It belongs to the Emperor.' 'No!' says the man in ISS, 'It belongs to everyone.' I rejected those answers; instead, I chose something different. I chose the impossible. I chose...z0r, a place where the artist would not fear the censor, where the scientist would not be bound by petty morality, where the great would not be constrained by the small! And with the donge of your butte, z0r can become your place, as well." -Andrew Cohen
Piggyblink Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 11:39:00 - [15] Edited by: Piggyblink on 21/04/2009 11:39:08 Hmm good post, but could someone please explain these acronyms: CAOD BOB NC IRC ED MH XD AAA MM KIA RA TCF IRON PL CH UL SE I didn't get those parts, thanks.
The Mittani Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 11:56:00 - [16] i completely agree with this fine poster and his EBM-themed corporation~
Zackalwe Gallente Thundercats RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2009.04.21 12:13:00 - [17] Edited by: Zackalwe on 21/04/2009 12:15:49 I dont normally post on CAOD, but this post has goaded me into a reply :( Im going to talk about your first point as I am in the NC and dont have the position to talk for other alliances. Quote: 1. NC reset joke is not a joke. It was leaked by one of thier members prematurely. NC's plans are to withdraw on friendly terms from their assistance with goons and turn to attack Cobalt Edge because they are tired of having to give more and more to MH so pacify them. They figure while XD is busy with AAA and Atlas they will be ripe for the plucking. They are also concerned that XD is the largest land holder in the game currently and they want to rectify that. If Goons interferes or tries to threaten they will be set to red not just neut. Also thier other pets MM,KIA, Initiative have been sent as a small token to help goons back up thier pets as well. This is an opinion from a humble grunt, not to be taken as official RZR policy: U mad? Seriously... You have one point that is half right there. Yes at some point in time I can see us retreating North and reseting Goons. Are we about to leave the South and start tearing it up in XDeathX space? If you think so you must be off your rocker seriously. We are down South to kill BOB. We are here to support our allies, Goonswarm, and ensure they secure Delve, Q and PB. If we do leave Querious at some point before that goal is reached it will only be for a week or so for a quick break. And tbh I dont think there is even much chance of that. Once we do leave the South, after our goal has been acomplished, there will be no need for continued standings with the Southern allies. It wont be war, just a reset on friendly terms and the chance of small gang pew in the future. If BOB was to return I would hope blue standings would be resumed and a return to the South would follow. Of course Im only a grunt and cant speak for that as policy... The rest of your post concerns other alliances, and while I think you are equally wrong I will let them respond. Another quick point: Its possible Goonswarm did start as you suggested, but they are part of the community now. Its my belief that it would be a loss to the community if they left Eve. I know a lot of people may not agree but a few things that Goons provide to Eve: They bring lots of drama. They bring a new perspective. They allow noobs to experience fleet combat unlike any other bloody alliance in the game. And I think they are fecking hilarious. As to them being a greater evil than BOB? No I dont think so. BOB wanted to control all of Eve. They destroyed alliances one by one through any means at their disposal. A 0.0 controlled by BOB with every alliance in 0.0 a pet, paying rent for their space? Or goons in Delve just being, well Goons? I know which one I would choose. One other quick point: This looks like an internal morale post intendid for IRC consumption only. It wont stand up to scrutiny on CAOD. You may not have wanted to post this here. Edited for quoting failure.
Neyem Praetorius Amarr Phalanx Security Service Psychotic Tendencies.	Posted - 2009.04.21 12:14:00 - [18] Originally by: mightylord Have all of you who play this game lost thier sense of morality? My theory is that concepts such as honor and fairness simple have no place in the mechanics or culture of this game. It sounds a little odd, but there's nothing wrong about being evil. After reading the rest of this post, I can't actually find anything else to reply to. You're saying that idolizing goons is bad, not that being allied with them is; and items 1-5 don't actually seem to be related to the rest of the post. So I'll say: Everybody knows that goons can be kind of mean, and we're aware they could turn on us for lulz once the AAA & co. situation stops being interesting. Frankly, anybody who isn't prepared to be backstabbed is probably taking crack kool-aid IV (this goes for everybody with an ally, not just goon pets). The SC helped us when MAX and Tri were taking regions in the north (my main being in NC and KIA during that period), and we've been allied since. The political situation is likely to change at some point in the future - it always does - but today we're working together against a common enemy. Plus, it gives me warm fuzzies when goons say 'special thanks to our allies for making this possible' after they do something awesome + evil. And there's always the possibility that we are entering a new era of peace and prosperity full of kind, gentle goons with galaxy-wide napfests. nods to self, very reassuring
Ace Frehley Minmatar Ore Mongers BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2009.04.21 12:19:00 - [19] Edited by: Ace Frehley on 21/04/2009 12:20:01 So if I get the razorposter correct, they "wanna" pew pew as long as it not threating their mining. Oh god where is this goin... signature is not EVE related, please change. ~WeatherMan
Ace Frehley Minmatar Ore Mongers BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2009.04.21 12:24:00 - [20] Even better, why dont you just have some pvp-arenas where you can all meet. so if you dont wanna pew pew just stay out of that "arena". Then you can create gangs to go out to do raids or quests to find epic mods etc etc. See where we goin signature is not EVE related, please change. ~WeatherMan

Yarik Mendel Amarr Privateers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2009.04.21 12:24:00 - [21] I have a confession to make. I too have the heart of a lion.
Zackalwe Gallente Thundercats RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2009.04.21 12:30:00 - [22] Originally by: Ace Frehley Even better, why dont you just have some pvp-arenas where you can all meet. so if you dont wanna pew pew just stay out of that "arena". Then you can create gangs to go out to do raids or quests to find epic mods etc etc. See where we goin Yes when BOB is gone everyone will live in peace and harmony and we will all hold hands and go on wendy walks What we MIGHT get is smaller regional conflicts instead of one massive war engulfing all of nullsec with every major fleet-fight a lagfest.
Gefunkt Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 12:52:00 - [23] You know who else held off 20 alliances for 9 months with a kill ratio of over 9000? Do you recall those Snowdens of yesteryear? They too were wounded tigers with a lyin heart. That's right, I'm talking about RISE.
128th ABC123 Caldari Eve Liberation Force Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2009.04.21 13:26:00 - [24] Originally by: Zackalwe Originally by: Ace Frehley Even better, why dont you just have some pvp-arenas where you can all meet. so if you dont wanna pew pew just stay out of that "arena". Then you can create gangs to go out to do raids or quests to find epic mods etc etc. See where we goin Yes when BOB is gone everyone will live in peace and harmony and we will all hold hands and go on wendy walks What we MIGHT get is smaller regional conflicts instead of one massive war engulfing all of nullsec with every major fleet-fight a lagfest. You did notice the 51K people online this weekend right??? If you honestly think anything in Eve will get any smaller or lag is an issue which will disappear... Alliances considered to be "irrelevant" or "small" field larger fleets than the leading alliancs of 3 years ago. New records on capship kills are being made regularly and one of the biggest capship battles never involved bob, but rather was between the drone region russians and atlas/rk/smash. Removing ex-bob/kenzoku/etc(which I dont think you guys will be doing btw) would change nothing about the direction the game is going.
Hanabi Kazan Gallente GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 13:32:00 - [25] Originally by: 128th ABC123 Removing ex-bob/kenzoku/etc(which I dont think you guys will be doing btw) would change nothing about the direction the game is going. name one entity in eve, besides the alliance formerly known as bob, that has dropped 500 caps on whoever the **** they feel like it. please, just one example.
Hanabi Kazan Gallente GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 13:36:00 - [26] Im sorry mightylord, but because we killed bob, you cant release your new poem: When the GBC came for the PL, I remained silent; I was not a PL member. Then they locked up the Good Russians, I remained silent; I was not a Good Russian. Then they came for the NC, I did not speak out; I was not a NC member. Then they came for the Goons, I did not speak out; I was not a Goon. When they came for me, there was no one left to speak out for me.
KeratinBoy Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 13:43:00 - [27] Originally by: mightylord Who will rid me of these troublesome Goons? All this was Hurfed before, all this will Blurf again. We are on the other side of the map, apart from SimmyB. I'm guessing you are losing, given the size of that big, whiny post. When Goons eventually die out in this game, I'm thinking you are going to point to this silliness with a smug expression, like you had much to do with it. Oh dear, oh dear...
Hanabi Kazan Gallente GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.04.21 13:44:00 - [28] in case you didnt get the last two posts I will spell it out for you (because if you didnt understand months ago, you must be really really *really* slow). the NC/PL/Goon/etc NAP only exists because otherwise kenny would bring the entire GKC down on one group at a time, annihilate them, and move on to the next group. their stated goal is to control all of 0.0. to do that, they need to kill NC, PL, Goons, etc.
Zackalwe Gallente Thundercats RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2009.04.21 13:47:00 - [29] Originally by: 128th ABC123 You did notice the 51K people online this weekend right??? If you honestly think anything in Eve will get any smaller or lag is an issue which will disappear... Alliances considered to be "irrelevant" or "small" field larger fleets than the leading alliancs of 3 years ago. New records on capship kills are being made regularly and one of the biggest capship battles never involved bob, but rather was between the drone region russians and atlas/rk/smash. Removing ex-bob/kenzoku/etc(which I dont think you guys will be doing btw) would change nothing about the direction the game is going. You kind of just proved my point. With more and more people heading to 0.0 it would be nice if the list of involved alliances in any given conflict went down. Imagine if this war is still going a year from now. 2500 in local? 3500? We have already passed 1500 on a number of occassions. The only way to go back to regional conflicts is if BOB is eliminated. The poem above me demonstrates exactly why this is the case.
Luciolla Amarr Eve Liberation Force Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2009.04.21 13:49:00 - [30] Originally by: Zackalwe One other quick point: This looks like an internal morale post intendid for IRC consumption only. It wont stand up to scrutiny on CAOD. You may not have wanted to post this here. This was originally posted by a Neutral, non IRC Link: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1054378 or here



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