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Kazang Gallente Wrecking Shots	Posted - 2009.05.06 18:13:00 - [1] The Pirate Bay has finally been blocked by my ISP this week and now I'm a very sad and angry panda. For anyone who doesn't know the owners of the site have been convicted of copyright infringement. ISPs around the world have been asked to block the site, most are compiling. The pirate bay trackers haven't been updated for 2 days and so I'm assuming its gone down, but can't check becasue I've been blocked. This is relatively old news but the trackers not being updated has made it a fresh issue. This is a huge, huge blow to the global internet community. Its a total injustice and an infringement on the basic rights of freedom of speech and information. The Pirate Bay are no more responsible for copyright infringement than the roads and car companies are responsible for trafficing drugs. The corruption of the judge and the law forces involved with this is blatant and heinous The governments and multi billion dollar media companies are controlling the flow of information. This one more step into them controlling us and turning the internet and our lives into a big brother controlled nightmare. The greed of the already super rich, manipulating laws and justice to their whim makes me sick. The corruption is more obvious than ever. If we let stuff like this happen it wont be long before laws like this are passed and we will be breaking the law by "bullying" and intimidating people on the internet and that includes EVE. Trying to ransom that hulk? Wardecing that carebear corp? Thats "Cyberbullying" and would come under the reign of that posturing and basic right infringing, abomination of a law. We shouldn't underestimate the effect of this, Mininova goes on trial in few days, and have begun to censor and filter content available through their site. This is the start of a downward spiral, if we let the media companies get away with this. This effects us in so many little ways, even our beloved Chribba would be a criminal under this new court ruling, for hosting EVE videos that use commercial songs or content soundtracks without permission. Does that make sense to you, does that seem just, does it seem fair? I don't think so. The problem is that regular folk have so little power to anything about stuff like this. Politicians don't care, they just want to line their own pockets, and media giants help them do that. I'm hoping that a group will organise a boycott but that may be wishfull thinking. Your thoughts?
Micheal Dietrich Caldari	Posted - 2009.05.06 18:23:00 - [2] /strolls in Hey guys, whats going on?
Vak'ran	Posted - 2009.05.06 18:29:00 - [3] Can't it be just down? I'm not getting the page either while I can freely visit any other such site (even based in my country). I'm not gonna assume it blocked by my ISP. Put down the tinfoil until sure. ----- Vak'Ran is your local official non-dedicated part-time advocate of reading comprehension and proliferation of intelligence on the EVE Online Forums.
TimMc Gallente Brutal Deliverance Blackguard Coalition	Posted - 2009.05.06 18:35:00 - [4] TPB isn't loading for me either. Public opinion is against the government and these multi-billion dollar companies, so one can hope they back off eventually. Current financial crisis has probably made the companies look around for lost income, of which they see internet piracy. What they fail to understand is that 90% of these people would have never bought the DVD anyway, and 5 years ago they were the people who recorded films off their TV and let their friends/children/neighbour borrow. Other 10% of people go and buy the DVD/CD anyway, because they liked the content and want to support it. Most people have a soul, these companies do not.
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2009.05.06 18:36:00 - [5] There have been problems with the registrations / Forgotten password mailouts, and the Captcha for registering. I'd assume they are just fixing this to be honest. ______________________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2009.05.06 18:49:00 - [6] It was down for a while for me too, now it works again. EVE issues\|Mining revamp\|Build stuff\|Make ISK
ceaon Gallente	Posted - 2009.05.06 18:58:00 - [7] Originally by: Kazang The Pirate Bay has finally been blocked by my ISP this week and now I'm a very sad and angry panda. TPB offers a service called http://ipredator.se/
RedSplat Heretic Army	Posted - 2009.05.06 19:03:00 - [8] Edited by: RedSplat on 06/05/2009 19:04:42 As long as there is a thirst for bootleg goods the unlawful trade in a copyrighted medium will continue. The only people that get burnt are figureheads. Ultimately its greedy record company's trying to keep a stranglehold on distribution in a medium where they can maximize profit with little competition. The internet, thus far, is almost entirely ungovernable. Also, TOR or bust. EDIT: I suggest OP avoids high profile golden donkeys like The Pirate Bay and Mininova that don't keep a secure hand on their data. Find a secure community. Originally by: CCP Mitnal I don't sleep. I am always here. Watching. Waiting. Originally by: CCP Mitnal it does get progressively longer.
Kazang Gallente Wrecking Shots	Posted - 2009.05.06 19:54:00 - [9] Originally by: RedSplat Edited by: RedSplat on 06/05/2009 19:04:42 As long as there is a thirst for bootleg goods the unlawful trade in a copyrighted medium will continue. The only people that get burnt are figureheads. Ultimately its greedy record company's trying to keep a stranglehold on distribution in a medium where they can maximize profit with little competition. The internet, thus far, is almost entirely ungovernable. Also, TOR or bust. EDIT: I suggest OP avoids high profile golden donkeys like The Pirate Bay and Mininova that don't keep a secure hand on their data. Find a secure community. I generally don't use the pirate bay except for stuff that is only available via big public trackers. I've already got round the block by using an open dns server instead of my ISPs default. The fact its the pirate bay in particular wont effect my download habits much, but it is the figure head, the golden donkey, is worrying becasue of that fact, not despite it. This could now go either way it could spur the public into action and get a change in copyright law. Or its tinfoil hat time and the could bring on the closure of all/most public bittorrent trackers. Figureheads falling are always a catalyst for change, its both interesting and worrying to think about which way it will go, becasue it will change things. Kazang
WhiteSavage Gallente Altruism. Avarice.	Posted - 2009.05.06 21:51:00 - [10] We are losing the internets

EliteSlave Minmatar Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2009.05.06 22:08:00 - [11] Guess you shouldnt partake in illegal activities, if you want software / music / movies... goto a Respected Distributor of said Product, IE: if you want Photoshop, goto www.adobe.com People like you cause these problems, downloading and distributing illegal copies of Software / music / movies only invites for tighter reins on the internet.
Xelios Minmatar Broski Enterprises Avarice.	Posted - 2009.05.06 22:13:00 - [12] intitle:index.of mp3 filetype:torrent Looks like Google is guilty of copyright infringement too
Taedrin Gallente Golden Mechanization Protectorate	Posted - 2009.05.06 22:17:00 - [13] Originally by: EliteSlave Guess you shouldnt partake in illegal activities, if you want software / music / movies... goto a Respected Distributor of said Product, IE: if you want Photoshop, goto www.adobe.com People like you cause these problems, downloading and distributing illegal copies of Software / music / movies only invites for tighter reins on the internet. OR, if you don't want to pay adobe hundreds of USD, you can go to www.gimp.org. I am personally of the opinion that if you want to rebel against profit mongering corporations, then instead of pirating their software, you should get open source alternatives. If you pirate their software, then that only makes them see you as a potential source of revenue via lawsuits (or by forcing you to buy their software once you can't pirate it anymore).
FOl2TY8 Tribal Liberation Force	Posted - 2009.05.06 23:27:00 - [14] Originally by: Taedrin I am personally of the opinion that if you want to rebel against profit mongering corporations, then instead of pirating their software, you should get open source alternatives. If you pirate their software, then that only makes them see you as a potential source of revenue via lawsuits (or by forcing you to buy their software once you can't pirate it anymore). This guy actually thinks things through. From now on I will forward all of my day to day dilemmas to you for review. ---------- This post brought to you by the worst PVP'er in Eve
Bullageddon Caldari	Posted - 2009.05.06 23:33:00 - [15] i you purchased media legally, you wouldn't have this problem. would you? === This Space For Lease or Sale.
northwesten Amarr Trinity Corporate Services	Posted - 2009.05.06 23:37:00 - [16] Originally by: WhiteSavage We are losing the internets In Honesty! we are! With some cable companys want to package access to internet! and this lobby groups want to end bit torrents. Problem is these company's slowly trying to tack control of the net!
Mr Reeth	Posted - 2009.05.06 23:44:00 - [17] Ahhh... nothing like the "they're rich so I have a RIGHT to steal from them" argument.
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong	Posted - 2009.05.06 23:50:00 - [18] Originally by: Mr Reeth Ahhh... nothing like the "they're rich so I have a RIGHT to steal from them" argument. points at my resently made post. If you ****ers paid for your games maybe we artists wouldn't be losing our jobs
TimMc Gallente Brutal Deliverance Blackguard Coalition	Posted - 2009.05.07 00:55:00 - [19] Originally by: Mr Reeth Ahhh... nothing like the "they're rich so I have a RIGHT to steal from them" argument. Worked for robin hood And btw TPB is working again for me.
Evthron Macyntire	Posted - 2009.05.07 01:05:00 - [20] Originally by: MotherMoon Originally by: Mr Reeth Ahhh... nothing like the "they're rich so I have a RIGHT to steal from them" argument. points at my resently made post. If you ****ers paid for your games maybe we artists wouldn't be losing our jobs Do you know what happens when the artists (painting art) lose government funding in Canada? The regular folk who pay for their grants tell them to get real jobs. If your not good enough to support yourself on whatever it is you do, then I guess you need to get a real job too. ------------------------------ Sigs like this.

Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2009.05.07 01:17:00 - [21] sigh People use the pirate bay for more than frickin Pirating. ______________________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008
Evthron Macyntire	Posted - 2009.05.07 01:19:00 - [22] Originally by: Blane Xero sigh People use the pirate bay for more than frickin Pirating. Well the name of the site certainly doesn't help their cause. But a few bad apples ruins the bunch right? ------------------------------ Sigs like this.
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2009.05.07 01:24:00 - [23] Originally by: Evthron Macyntire Originally by: Blane Xero sigh People use the pirate bay for more than frickin Pirating. Well the name of the site certainly doesn't help their cause. But a few bad apples ruins the bunch right? In all honesty, the meaning of a "Pirate Bay" goes further than "Get cheap knock off plundered booty here" But hey. Should we shut down World of Warcraft because it promotes violence in its name?. (Well, nine tenths of the eve online community would scream hell yea on principle, but still). If the name is enough grounds for something to be shut down / sue'd for illegal behaviour, then a hell of a lot of things are in trouble. (oh wait, this is only specific to pirate bay, amirite?) ______________________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008
Atomos Darksun Damage Incorporated.	Posted - 2009.05.07 01:53:00 - [24] Originally by: Evthron Macyntire Originally by: MotherMoon Originally by: Mr Reeth Ahhh... nothing like the "they're rich so I have a RIGHT to steal from them" argument. points at my resently made post. If you **ers paid for your games maybe we artists wouldn't be losing our jobs Do you know what happens when the artists (painting art) lose government funding in Canada? The regular folk who pay for their grants tell them to get real jobs. If your not good enough to support yourself on whatever it is you do, then I guess you need to get a real job too. Lol, I guess you want to go back to 8 bit graphics then... Originally by:** Amoxin My vent is talking to me in a devil voice... CONVERT TO LINKIFICATION! http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameb
Reiisha Evolution KenZoku	Posted - 2009.05.07 03:17:00 - [25] It's more of a cartel question. If so many people are "stealing" it, it's too expensive. Since the goods are infinately copyable, the true value goes down by a lot. There is no comparison to cars or other physical goods. Those are expensive for a reason - Shipment, materials, construction, development, and all the rest that comes with it. Cars can't be copied. They can't be conveniently downloaded over the internet. However, digital goods can. Their only cost is development, and almost negligably, shipment, especially when sold online. They can be copied infinately. They can be modified with almost unrestricted boundaries. The problem today is that a lot of companies are viewing digital goods as physical goods, and price them accordingly. However, they are not physical goods. They are made only once, ever. There is only 1 "original", if it can even be called that. It's value is lessened because if it's inherent properties, which i already mentioned, quite substantially, yet they are still trying to sell it to people as if they are physical, one time goods. There will always be people who steal them. However, the answer is not to spend millions upon millions of development on technologies that hurt the actual legit customers more than the thieves, and actually drive the price up even more - Thereby decreasing the size of their own market. The answer is to make it cheaper to the point where more profit is made and less people steal it. It's fine to take a stance against stealing.... Of course it's wrong. However, the answer is not to form a cartel and make the legit customers pay even more and make it more difficult for them to use the product they are selling. This is the thinking error a lot of "morally upstanding" people here have been making. They think it's okay for the concept of a free market to be thrown away at the advent of a new technology, and they're okay with paying a lot more for things that simply aren't worth that much. People need to realize that the world is changing. Certain concepts and ideas have to be reinvented, not forced to adapt to old and outdated ideas. Just because it's happening right now and under everyone's noses isn't a reason to ignore progress, or even inhibit it. This is the first time since the Roman empire fell that the world is going backwards in it's development. "If you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all"
Atomos Darksun Damage Incorporated.	Posted - 2009.05.07 03:44:00 - [26] Edited by: Atomos Darksun on 07/05/2009 03:44:17 Originally by: Reiisha stuff Originally by: Akita T Well, sure, let's say you spent half a year making a beautiful oil painting. Selling that at 10,000$ seems not just reasonable, but downright unfair to you, since, hey, half a year, and only one copy. If you made cheaper/faster/whatever replicas at 1,000$ or even 500$, now, again, that would probably be fine too. Ah, yes, but what if you made it a digital painting, which also took half a year to make, and looks almost identical to the oil painting, and were charging the same 10,000$ for each copy ? A copy which is made with absolutely no effort whatsoever ? Now, suddendly, I kind of lost sympathy for you, and I probably wouldn't even bother paying you but download it from somewhere. You know, your alternative being, say, charge 200$ for a high-quality physical print which would maybe cost you 100$ to make ? Or just charge 5$ for the data file ? Or better, give the data file for free and remind people they can make donations as small as 1$ if they want, and sell the high-quality print at 120$ a piece plus postage ? There's respect for intellectual property, and then there's blattant ripoff. Just because somebody SPENT some time doing something doesn't mean its value to you is the same value he assigns to it. And when that "thing" has no intrinsic physical value since the "copy" process takes virtually no money to make, charging the same amount of cash for two very different people is unfair to the person who holds the value of that piece of IP to be much lower. So, yeah, maybe one guy is a CEO and displays your "original, one of a kind" physical oil painting on the wall of his office for bragging rights, charging him more than 10k would be fair. But charging some cafe owner with loads of similar paintings much more than the cost of the materials and labor is not really all that fair. As for the digital version, if somebody uses it in, say, a movie or a commercial or whatnot and makes them loads of money, of course you should charge them a lot for their usage... but what about the poor sod that uses it as a screensaver or as a wallpaper for a couple of days, would charging him the same amount be fair ? Obviously, it wouldn't. ESPECIALLY since the cost of duplication is basically zero. And that's the main difference between "property" and "intellectual property", especially when the latter doesn't even have much of a physical form. If cost of duplication is negligible, then the pricetag for usage of the IP should be directly proportional to the uses one gives to that IP, anything else is unfair. And as the use varies wildly from person to person, having one single pricetag for all of it is inherently unfair. If you want some proof, look at the games Stardock makes. Barely any protection whatsoever, yet they make a load of cash on them IN SPITE of being "pirated" to hell and back. Or, probably, better said, they make so much money BECAUSED they are being "pirated". In another example, the makers of "The Man From Earth" going so far as to THANK "the pirates" for their contribution toward his bottom line. If you want even better proof, just look at the experiments Steam has been making, putting games up for sale at hugely discounted prices : by DECREASING price, they not only increased the number of sales, they increased TOTAL REVENUE... not just that, but the lower the price per unit became, the HIGHER the total revenue went. I can think of no better practical proof for the moral bankrupcy of the idea of single-price IP usage rights. It's not only hurting the consumer, it's ALSO hurting the IP owner. And the sad part is the IP owners, for the most part, don't even realize that. <3 Originally by: Amoxin My vent is talking to me in a devil voice... CONVERT TO LINKIFICATION! http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameb
Ruze Ahkor'Murkon Amarr No Applicable Corporation	Posted - 2009.05.07 04:08:00 - [27] Artists are ALWAYS the first to suffer in a society. We don't need them to survive, we don't need them to live on, and generally all they do is make our boring, droll lives just a little more tolerable. Doesn't mean the work they do is any less as far as effort is concerned, but when NEED comes into play and hard times come up to bat, it will ALWAYS be the artist who suffers first, over the bread maker or the field worker. This also holds true for luxury items and the like. Humans irrevocably realize that what we WANT does not equate to what we NEED, and we put inherent values to the two. And if a person can rationalize how stealing a loaf of bread to survive another week is okay, or how robbing a doctor at gunpoint for the medicine to save his wife and child is acceptable, you really think he's going to give a **** about that song you just made up? Art doesn't equal 'less reason' in many peoples minds, it equals 'less value'. Hell, artists rarely even respect each other, blatantly stealing styles and new methods from one another in order to satisfy their own urge for 'beauty.' I have not once heard some artist petition to have the chord b flat copyrighted, yet somewhere, somewhen, somebody first put it to use and turned it into art. Like it or not, we are ALL in this world for ourselves. The artist produces, by doesn't hesitate to ripoff good ideas and great strokes from those around him, yet somehow reaches to claim said things for himself. No man is different. Is my ability to stack boxes and put more things in a room than should normally fit anything less than art? But in the same breath, it's considered 'laymen' and useless. No man holds an artist in higher value than a man who is an artist himself. Posts by Ruze Ahkor'Murkon and Ruze
WhiteSavage Gallente Altruism. Avarice.	Posted - 2009.05.07 07:09:00 - [28] Originally by: Ruze Ahkor'Murkon Artists are ALWAYS the first to suffer in a society. We don't need them to survive, we don't need them to live on, and generally all they do is make our boring, droll lives just a little more tolerable. Doesn't mean the work they do is any less as far as effort is concerned, but when NEED comes into play and hard times come up to bat, it will ALWAYS be the artist who suffers first, over the bread maker or the field worker. This also holds true for luxury items and the like. Humans irrevocably realize that what we WANT does not equate to what we NEED, and we put inherent values to the two. And if a person can rationalize how stealing a loaf of bread to survive another week is okay, or how robbing a doctor at gunpoint for the medicine to save his wife and child is acceptable, you really think he's going to give a **** about that song you just made up? Art doesn't equal 'less reason' in many peoples minds, it equals 'less value'. Hell, artists rarely even respect each other, blatantly stealing styles and new methods from one another in order to satisfy their own urge for 'beauty.' I have not once heard some artist petition to have the chord b flat copyrighted, yet somewhere, somewhen, somebody first put it to use and turned it into art. Like it or not, we are ALL in this world for ourselves. The artist produces, by doesn't hesitate to ripoff good ideas and great strokes from those around him, yet somehow reaches to claim said things for himself. No man is different. Is my ability to stack boxes and put more things in a room than should normally fit anything less than art? But in the same breath, it's considered 'laymen' and useless. No man holds an artist in higher value than a man who is an artist himself. Artists make nothing off CD sales. Their personal income comes from entertainment deals, concerts, memorobelia etc. Please resize your sig to a maximum of 400 x 120 and a file size no greater than 24000 bytes - Mitnal
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative.	Posted - 2009.05.07 07:45:00 - [29] This will be Napster all over again. The record companies had an awesome chance back in 1999-2000; everyone was using Napster. They could have dealt with a single entity, skimmed off a few cents per transaction for a distribution model that was basically free (if your marginal cost is zero, then making 5 cents on 1000 sales is as good as making 5 dollars on 10 sales) and made bank. Instead they shot their own ****s off. Now the film companies are repeating this same hilariously terrible strategy.
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative.	Posted - 2009.05.07 07:46:00 - [30] Originally by: Ruze Ahkor'Murkon droll I don't think this word means what you think it means.



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