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NightmareX D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2009.05.20 20:36:00 - [61] Edited by: NightmareX on 20/05/2009 20:46:40 Originally by: Murina Originally by: NightmareX Originally by: Murina Originally by: NightmareX The usual lies, denials and trolls... Do you have anything on topic and from YOUR experiances flying blaster battleships on TQ to add?...... When it's about Blasters, Darknesss & Leilani Solaris is the man to talk to. So they will just say the same as me. Easy as that. Leilani Solaris has many many more kills using lasers and rails than blasters. http://triumvirate-alliance.com/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=1271&view=ships_weapons How many times do you need to be told to check your material before you post? It's not the point on how many kills they have with each weapons. It's how good they are with the ships and weapons, like Leilani Solaris have showed in his latest movie that is called Crimewave. There he use a Blaster Mega and a Blaster Kronos. In that movie like in the movie to Darknesss, he shows that Large Blasters are really good as long your doing it right. It's been proved alot of times when someone release a movie with Blaster BS'es in that they are doing very good in the Blaster BS'es. And then, why should i listen to some whiners when the movies shows that Blasters works really good?. If the Blasters works good for the players who are making the movies, then for sure, the Blasters will work as good for me then as they are doing for the movie maker when i'm using the right tactics / setups etc etc. There is NO EXCUSES that Blasters are crap when peoples shows ALOT of times that Blasters can work really really good. Do i need to say more?. Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise
Rivqua Caldari Omega Wing R.E.P.O.	Posted - 2009.05.20 20:36:00 - [62] Originally by: Murina Whitch natural resists would you use?, shield natural resists?, armour natural resists?, hull natural resists?, T2 ship hull, armour or shield natural resists?, T1 ship hull, armour or shield natural resists?, which races T1 or T2 armour, hull or shield natural resists?.....and on and on... I would start by balancing against natrual armour resists (ie, without the +10% racial resist bonus). That's the baseline in this discussion atleast, because we are (were) discussing amarr and gaylente. Everything else is up to the player, and how he fits his ship / chooses to fly his ship. Another question, are we discussing "blaster tracking" or general "I want blasters to always be the correct choice for any fight that involves pvp" ? If we are talking increasing blaster tracking, what is the max point? Where is enough enough? Currently blasters do alot of things better then lasers. They don't do stationary gatecamping better. They do brawling alot better though. They do warp on top of enemy and shoot alot of better. They clear small ships alot faster. But that's ofcourse my opinion, I ask, tell us all, where is your "this is where we are, and this is where we want to be". Maybe if there was such a statement, backed up by technical data, those against the idea, could maybe come up with other ideas to buff/nerf about blasters, and you would get your tracking boost. About someone mentioning earlier pulses got a tracking boost: Don't forget, they are still the worst tracking close range battleship gun in the game. _________________ - Rivqua - --- R.E.P.O. ---
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.05.20 20:54:00 - [63] Originally by: Rivqua Another question, are we discussing "blaster tracking" or general "I want blasters to always be the correct choice for any fight that involves pvp" ? At the moment lasers are the correct choice for any fight that involves pvp so a improvement for blasters could only lessen the gap. Originally by: Rivqua Currently blasters do alot of things better then lasers. They don't do stationary gatecamping better. They do brawling alot better though. They do warp on top of enemy and shoot alot of better. They clear small ships alot faster. 1. Pls enlighted us to what "brawling" is?, or did you just make it up to fill out your "lots of things better". 2. Anybody can "warp on top of enemy and shoot", and if its a gang blasters lose any DPS advantage they may have before the first ship goes pop if they burn away, so unless its a gank opn a solo ship blasters are at a disadvantage. Blaster ships also have weaker tanks than the laser ships. 3. The tracking of laser ships at their available ranges allows them to hit small ships a lot more easily than blasters do. Originally by: Rivqua About someone mentioning earlier pulses got a tracking boost: Don't forget, they are still the worst tracking close range battleship gun in the game. Maybe you need to learn about how range effects transversal and tracking, lasers may have lower base tracking than blasters but the range of pulse and the way range effects transversal means that they hit small ships very easily. PS: I also do not see the point of boosting the tracking on blasters as no turret system has a problem hitting a simular sized ship even at close range. They do need to do more dmg at 10-20km though.
NightmareX D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2009.05.20 21:04:00 - [64] Edited by: NightmareX on 20/05/2009 21:04:37 I'm only gonna reply to one of your points over here Murina. And it's this one under: Originally by: Murina At the moment lasers are the correct choice for any fight that involves pvp so a improvement for blasters could only lessen the gap. LOL, talk about FOTM dream world. That's the most stupid FOTM bear reply EVER. Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise
Bellum Eternus Gallente Death of Virtue MeatSausage EXPRESS	Posted - 2009.05.20 22:01:00 - [65] The back and forth replies in this thread up till now are either funny or pathetic, depending on how you look at it. So far there has been almost zero discussion about anything of any actual value. Just a bunch of insults and 'you're wrong' being tossed about, or arguing whether or not blasters even deserve a review in the first place. Here are the key issues: Blasters don't do enough peak DPS when compared to other weapons systems given their current limitations of short range, poor tracking inside that range, and high cap use compared to capless weapons. The argument 'skill something else' isn't valid. I have max skills in all four weapon types. That simply isn't an issue. I want each weapon system to be good at their niche role, and right now blasters don't accomplish this. One interesting side issue is how weapons scale between ship sizes. Small blasters are pretty good in my opinion, being balanced and working well when used properly. They have enough track, sig res and damage etc. to work against their proper targets with a good fit. Blasters don't scale so well when applied to larger ships such as BCs and BS. Smaller ships have enough speed and agility to easily fly into blaster range and maintain enough tracking at close ranges to hit their targets. Larger ships using blasters (BS specifically) aren't as flexible speed/agility wise and as a result lose a large degree of effectiveness when compared to smaller ships with blasters. Another issue is tanks and how they are radically different between ship classes. This is another major reason why blasters are more effective for smaller ship classes than with larger ships. Large ships have massive tanks with massive amounts of EHP and this results in minimizing the small DPS advantage large blasters have over lasers (and no DPS advantage over torps) when compared to smaller ships with fewer/no rigs and very lightweight tanks. Since smaller ships have lighter weight tanks, it's possible to use a high DPS setup and get in and make a kill and get out before your own (non existant) tank runs out. This isn't the case with larger (BS, BC) sized ships. It isn't possible to set up a gank ship that is focused solely on DPS and overcome a tanked setup before you're dead yourself. At the moment blaster ships are facing opposing ships with more EHP and 95-110% of their damage output, with fewer range limitations than they have. It's simply not competitive. Just use lasers you say? I have large pulse/beam spec to 4. I have torp spec 4. I have large AC spec 4. I'd like blasters to actually do what they're supposed to: overwhelming DPS at short range. Right now they do almost the same DPS as everything else, at 1/5 the range. Do I want more range? No. More tracking? Maybe a little. Large blasters (not medium or small) need more DPS. I'd say 25-30% more would be a good start. Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam. Death of Virtue is Recruiting
NightmareX D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2009.05.20 22:11:00 - [66] Edited by: NightmareX on 20/05/2009 22:14:36 Originally by: Bellum Eternus Large blasters (not medium or small) need more DPS. I'd say 25-30% more would be a good start. Holy crap. Do you even know what your talking about here?. Jesus christ man. Do you even know how ridicoulusly overpowered Large Blasters is going to be if that happens?. You wont get your uber insta pwn machine back again, JUST FORGET IT. The HP buffs we got on the ships some years ago is meant to let ships last longer in EVE. Is the HP buffs really needed if you want a 25-30% DPS increase on Blasters?. If there is something that will be boosted if that's ever needed, it will be the Bonuses on ther Mega that will be changed / boosted then. And not the Blasters. Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise
Liang Nuren No Salvation Gentlemen's Club	Posted - 2009.05.20 22:30:00 - [67] Originally by: NightmareX Originally by: Bellum Eternus Large blasters (not medium or small) need more DPS. I'd say 25-30% more would be a good start. Holy crap. Do you even know what your talking about here?. It's so stupid that it hurts. 30% more raw damage might push the Mega's status as top damage dealer out to 8km, tbqfh. As it stands now, as shown in my post at the top of page 2, the Abaddon is a superior damage dealer from less than 6km until it runs out of range at 55km. -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org

CCP Mitnal C C P	Posted - 2009.05.20 22:54:00 - [68] Cleaned. Please stay on topic. Having personal conflicts within threads ensures that tbere is never a consensus on how to fix an issue. Mitnal Community Representative CCP Hf, EVE Online Contact us

NightmareX D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2009.05.20 22:56:00 - [69] Edited by: NightmareX on 20/05/2009 22:56:22 Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: NightmareX Originally by: Bellum Eternus Large blasters (not medium or small) need more DPS. I'd say 25-30% more would be a good start. Holy crap. Do you even know what your talking about here?. It's so stupid that it hurts. 30% more raw damage might push the Mega's status as top damage dealer out to 8km, tbqfh. As it stands now, as shown in my post at the top of page 2, the Abaddon is a superior damage dealer from less than 6km until it runs out of range at 55km. -Liang Your forgetting to take the omni tank resists into the picture here again or?. Because if you do, the Blaster Mega for example will pretty much be on top already. Here is an example: http://triumvirate-alliance.com/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=3342412 And here: http://triumvirate-alliance.com/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=3329335 And here to: http://triumvirate-alliance.com/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=3315623 I can link many more though, but i don't see the point in that tbh. Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise
Liang Nuren No Salvation Gentlemen's Club	Posted - 2009.05.20 23:04:00 - [70] Originally by: NightmareX Your forgetting to take the omni tank resists into the picture here again or?. Because if you do, the Blaster Mega for example will pretty much be on top already. Here is some examples: Here, here and here. I can link many more though, but i don't see the point in that tbh. Actually, I'm not at all forgetting to take resistances into account here. As has been shown repeatedly, EM damage is either the best damage type to deal or second best, especially with the recent resurgence in shield buffer tanking. I have already shown that in today's PVP environment, it's a very fantastic damage type to deal. It's shown here: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1076161&page=2#33 -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org

NightmareX D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2009.05.20 23:15:00 - [71] Edited by: NightmareX on 20/05/2009 23:18:45 Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: NightmareX Your forgetting to take the omni tank resists into the picture here again or?. Because if you do, the Blaster Mega for example will pretty much be on top already. Here is some examples: Here, here and here. I can link many more though, but i don't see the point in that tbh. Actually, I'm not at all forgetting to take resistances into account here. As has been shown repeatedly, EM damage is either the best damage type to deal or second best, especially with the recent resurgence in shield buffer tanking. I have already shown that in today's PVP environment, it's a very fantastic damage type to deal. It's shown here: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1076161&page=2#33 -Liang Yes, Lasers is a little better when your shooting shield tanked ships. I have said this earlier to. But if your shooting omni armor tanked ships, then Blasters have an advantage over Lasers. Anyways, 15 days and 21 hours left until i have Large Blaster Spec skill on level 5. Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise
Bellum Eternus Gallente Death of Virtue MeatSausage EXPRESS	Posted - 2009.05.20 23:17:00 - [72] Originally by: NightmareX Edited by: NightmareX on 20/05/2009 22:25:25 Originally by: Bellum Eternus Large blasters (not medium or small) need more DPS. I'd say 25-30% more would be a good start. Holy crap. Do you even know what your talking about here?. It's so stupid that it hurts. Jesus christ man. Do you even know how ridicoulusly overpowered Large Blasters is going to be if that happens?. You wont get your uber insta pwn machine back again, JUST FORGET IT. The HP buffs we got on the ships some years ago is meant to let ships last longer in EVE. And not to let a Tempest for example to blow up in 2 secs against 2 Blaster Megas. Is the HP buffs really needed if you want a 25-30% DPS increase on Blasters?. If there is something that will be boosted if that's ever needed, it will be the Bonuses on ther Mega that will be changed / boosted then. And not the Blasters. I was exaggerating the point (25-30% more DPS) to A) make a point, and B) to watch all the people truely not interested in fixing blasters (you) get trolled. I don't think that 25% is really reasonable. I think maybe 10-15% will work. If you buff the Mega's ship bonus then you affect other things like sniper performance in fleet etc., so that won't work. It's (very) funny that you bring up HP buffs. It's changes precisely like HP buffs and T2 ammo damage reduction and the addition of tanking rigs that have really diminished the performance of blasters. It's not that the HP buffs need to be rolled back, or rigs nerfed to reduce tanking across the board. All that needs to be done is add some more DPS to blasters and leave everything else static. Right now I think that everything is fairly well balanced between Projectiles/Lasers/Missiles with respect to short range large BS weapons. ACs need a bit more tracking, same as blasters, but that's just due to the web nerf. I'd actually be happy with a web increase to 70% and be done with it. 60% was too much of a nerf. Lasers suffer from crippling cap use, ACs and missiles are lowish on the DPS scale but use zero cap, and blasters use quite a bit of cap, particularly when you're running 7-8 guns on a BS it can be an issue when you get more than one large neut on you. But alas, you're pretty much set in your opinion. I'm not trying to change that. Just trying to bring attention to a shortcoming with blasters so that the devs will address it. Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam. Death of Virtue is Recruiting
Bellum Eternus Gallente Death of Virtue MeatSausage EXPRESS	Posted - 2009.05.20 23:23:00 - [73] Originally by: NightmareX Yes, Lasers is a little better when your shooting shield tanked ships. I have said this earlier to. But if your shooting omni armor tanked ships, then Blasters have an advantage over Lasers. Completely wrong. Lasers have the advantage shooting either type. My EM resists are usually the lowest of all my resists on just about every T2 armor tanked ship I fly, and if it's not the lowest, then it's within a few percentage points of my other middle resists. Further more, it doesn't matter what the highest/lowest resist is when you're losing 50-90% of your DPS due to range issues when using blasters, while you're still dealing 100% of your DPS using lasers. I can produce graph after graph of lasers doing more actual damage to a target with EM resists being the highest than blasters. Lasers do a LOT of dps, they have GREAT range, and EM resists simply aren't what they used to be. My omni tanked triple armor hardener Dominix tank has EM as it's lowest resist. Your arguments are weak and don't hold up to any scrutiny. Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam. Death of Virtue is Recruiting
NightmareX D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2009.05.20 23:24:00 - [74] Edited by: NightmareX on 20/05/2009 23:26:59 Bellum Eternus. I have one thing that i agree with you on. Instead of messing with the tracking on the Blasters and Autocannons, then i rather see the webs boosted up to 70% max. Because increasing the DPS any more or tracking is not a good idea to do today. But we are talking about something that might happen in 1-2 years with the speed CCP have to fix things. So maybe in that time, things might have changed alot in PVP to that time, and maybe a boost to tracking or DPS will be needed that then. You never know. But as things are today. Increasing the DPS or tracking on Blasters or Autocannons will rather mess up more things than it will fix tbqh. Anyways, fix Artilleries before you even think about messing with Blasters. Autocannons need to be looked at to before Blasters. Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise
5pinDizzy	Posted - 2009.05.21 00:25:00 - [75] Edited by: 5pinDizzy on 21/05/2009 00:28:25 Can anyone think of a change that's come about within the last couple of years that hurt lasers? My memory is struggling. My memory is sketchy without going through it all. List of Laser Buffs Revelations - All base em resists lowered by 10% - Amarr buff Quantum Rise - Missiles heavily nerfed. - Caldari nerf Quantum Rise - Medium drones nerfed. - Gallente take the worst nerf Quantum Rise - All ships slowed down. - Minmatar and Gallente take the worst nerf, Minmatar for their speed tanking and Gallente for the time taken to get within their very short range. Quantum Rise - Webs take heavy nerf - Gallente nerf mainly as that 10km range is where even their biggest ships like to operate in when fitting blasters. Negating what tracking advantage they have considerably. Minmatar Artillery and Autocannons were always crap as long as I can remember. Take that and the fact that all types of ewar has gradually been made more and more useless over time and Amarr combat focused laser boats keep climbing the tree.
Bellum Eternus Gallente Death of Virtue MeatSausage EXPRESS	Posted - 2009.05.21 00:31:00 - [76] Originally by: NightmareX You know that my close range RR Tempest is ROFL'ing at your Abaddon or Geddon everytime i fight one of those ships?. You want to know why?. Yes it's because i can tank a gank fitted Abaddon / Armageddon with only one LAR II on my Tempest because the EM and Thermal resists is so high. My current setup on my RR Tempest have 80% EM and 67.6% Thermal resists, while it have 62.6% Kinetic and 55.1% Explosive resists. If you have EM as the lowest resist on your passive tanked omni RR BS, your doing something really really wrong. Re-read what I posted: active tri-hardened tank. Not passive. And yes, special case (Minmatar) tanks will have an advantage vs. lasers. Frankly, I end up killing Abaddons in Tempests more so because I can use 2x heavy neuts on them and don't need any cap for my ACs, allowing me to devote the rest of my cap to my tank. It takes a while to burn through all that EHP, but I get there eventually. And this is a blaster thread. We're getting off track here. I agree 100% that Artillery needs to be changed/buffed big time, but again, that's another thread/issue. Just because I'm pro-blaster doesn't mean that I'm anti-projectile. Allow me to re-iterate: I want every weapon system in the game to perform well in it's niche, and that includes artillery etc. TBH I'd like to see arty alpha increased by 100%, ROF decreased by the 50% or w/e to keep DPS the same, and the clipe sized increased by 300% or so. Sounds perfectly fair to me. All arty should have OMGWTF alpha, and it doesn't. I think that a 70% web would help just enough to 'fix' large AC/blaster tracking issues, particularly with the agility changes just added to TQ. It'll still never be like it was, but 60% is just too little of a speed reduction for a single web. I see this as a better more 'smooth' solution than jacking with specific tracking. Another thing with projectiles and ACs in particular: I'd like to see the ability to switch damage types and still see the same total DPS, rather than having the range/DPS vary wildly with damage type, similar to how missiles are. Right now the 'you can choose damage type' is a bit of a farce when it comes to projectiles. I think it would be acceptable to simply have 2x damage choices per range/damage catagory of ammo: have an EMP style ammo: em/kin/exp damage, and then a thermal style with heavy therm/exp. and then provide each ammo style with the 4-5 range variants required. This is in addition to fixing T2 ammo, which right now is just horrid. If you want projectiles fixed so bad then start a thread for that and I'll lend my support. Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam. Death of Virtue is Recruiting
Deva Blackfire D00M.	Posted - 2009.05.21 00:33:00 - [77] Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 21/05/2009 00:34:34 Dont forget exploration - its also laser buff (no ammo use!). Also invention: more scorch for laser users and cheaper guns! Im sure that "coalition of coalitions" is also laser buff - as we know they are mainly gang weapons and gangs of 1500 people are best place for lasers. Ofc nano nerf is also laser buff - everything is easier to hit. Blackops boost is also laser boost - THE REDEEMER! is laser boat!. To sum up: are you stupid or just playing one? EDIT: bellum: what is the "tracking issue" you are talking about? BS unable to wtfpwn frig? Or maybe having problems instapwning cruisers? Coz BS vs BS they hit quite well and isnt BS role killing other BSs?
Bellum Eternus Gallente Death of Virtue MeatSausage EXPRESS	Posted - 2009.05.21 00:49:00 - [78] Originally by: Deva Blackfire Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 21/05/2009 00:34:34 Dont forget exploration - its also laser buff (no ammo use!). Also invention: more scorch for laser users and cheaper guns! Im sure that "coalition of coalitions" is also laser buff - as we know they are mainly gang weapons and gangs of 1500 people are best place for lasers. Ofc nano nerf is also laser buff - everything is easier to hit. Blackops boost is also laser boost - THE REDEEMER! is laser boat!. To sum up: are you stupid or just playing one? EDIT: bellum: what is the "tracking issue" you are talking about? BS unable to wtfpwn frig? Or maybe having problems instapwning cruisers? Coz BS vs BS they hit quite well and isnt BS role killing other BSs? Anyone who has flown blaster BS a LOT knows that the only way to really do effective damage is to be just under optimal range (say, 4km for Neutron IIs and max skills with faction antimatter) and have both the shooter and the target sit dead still. Any transversal at all will wreck your DPS, and this is BS vs. BS. It only gets worse when you're shooting at a smaller target. It's not like an Abaddon or Geddon where a BS can be going 3-400m/sec transverse at 15km and you're still hitting it for 100% effective DPS, or zapping cruisers at 2km/sec at 35km away. Ask yourself this: is it reasonable to expect an Abaddon to be able to hit a Cruiser flying at 1500-2km/sec at 30-40km for 80-90% effective DPS using T2 ammo? If the answer is yes, then shouldn't it also be reasonable for a Mega (which has a tracking bonus, no less) to hit a Cruiser flying at the same speed at 12-18km and do the same relative DPS with similar ammo? Everything in Eve is a tradeoff. Lasers have big benefits and great capability, so to ACs. Blasters right now are sucky because lasers can do their job at their range at 90-100% efficiency plus continue to perform at what are for blasters extreme ranges. Heck, a while back I instapopped a Harpy or Hawk (can't remember exactly which) with my Abaddon at 45km+. When it happened I thought the guy warped off when I lost lock. I couldn't believe it. lasers are awesome. I want blasters to be awesome in their own area of operation as well: extreme close range. Right now they're not. Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam. Death of Virtue is Recruiting
5pinDizzy	Posted - 2009.05.21 00:50:00 - [79] Originally by: Deva Blackfire Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 21/05/2009 00:34:34 Dont forget exploration - its also laser buff (no ammo use!). Also invention: more scorch for laser users and cheaper guns! Im sure that "coalition of coalitions" is also laser buff - as we know they are mainly gang weapons and gangs of 1500 people are best place for lasers. Ofc nano nerf is also laser buff - everything is easier to hit. Blackops boost is also laser boost - THE REDEEMER! is laser boat!. To sum up: are you stupid or just playing one? Sorry what do you want me to reply to? You didn't make a point. You spouted a load of nonsense and said. "That's you that is, that's what you sound like."
NightmareX D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2009.05.21 01:00:00 - [80] Edited by: NightmareX on 21/05/2009 01:03:02 Originally by: Bellum Eternus lasers are awesome. I want blasters to be awesome in their own area of operation as well: extreme close range. Right now they're not. Lasers atm are a bit to much awesome tbh. The only logical solution atm is just to nerf the tracking a bit for Scorch / Lasers, so they can be more balanced to the other 3 weapon systems. If CCP takes away the tracking boost to Lasers as they gave the Lasers some years ago, then i think everything will be pretty nice tbh. When you can hit a Cruiser flying at 1500-2km/sec at 30-40km for 80-90% effective DPS using T2 ammo on Large Lasers, then i will say nerf the tracking on the Large Lasers now. Or just revert the tracking boost to Large Lasers that they got some years ago. Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise

Gavin Darklighter THE FINAL STAND	Posted - 2009.05.21 01:30:00 - [81] Edited by: Gavin Darklighter on 21/05/2009 01:36:11 Blasters don't need a 30% damage increase, that is just insane. Forget the Megathron, I would LOVE a 1400 DPS Rokh or a 2k DPS shield-Hype, but it would just be stupid overpowered. Blasters DO need a massive tracking boost, something like 50%. ACs need a tracking boost as well, say, 30%. And all the T2 short-range ammo should be changed. Lasers don't need a nerf. They got the nerf with the web changes, same as every other turret got nerfed. What we need is for the short-ranged guns to be more effective at point blank than lasers are, and right now they aren't. signature picture exceeds the size limit.~WeatherMan
NightmareX D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2009.05.21 01:34:00 - [82] Edited by: NightmareX on 21/05/2009 01:35:43 Originally by: Gavin Darklighter Blasters DO need a massive tracking boost, something like 50%. ACs need a tracking boost as well, say, 30%. And all the T2 short-range ammo should be changed. Was the web nerf needed if you want a 50% tracking boost on Blasters and 30% on Autocannons?. Can i ask you why CCP nerfed the webbers?. Yes i know the answer, but do you know it?. Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise
Gavin Darklighter THE FINAL STAND	Posted - 2009.05.21 01:39:00 - [83] Edited by: Gavin Darklighter on 21/05/2009 01:45:51 Originally by: NightmareX Edited by: NightmareX on 21/05/2009 01:35:43 Originally by: Gavin Darklighter Blasters DO need a massive tracking boost, something like 50%. ACs need a tracking boost as well, say, 30%. And all the T2 short-range ammo should be changed. Was the web nerf needed if you want a 50% tracking boost on Blasters and 30% on Autocannons?. Can i ask you why CCP nerfed the webbers?. Yes i know the answer, but do you know it?. Yes it is. The web nerf was too heavy handed, and now even same-class ships can evade fire too easily. After such a tracking boost, cruisers and frigates will still be able to evade effectively for the most part but it will make it harder to evade BS guns in a BS. For everything else, there is tracking disruptors. It would take a 400% tracking boost to blasters to make them track a webbed target as well as they did before QR. And the webs got nerfed because speed got nerfed, but battleships don't go 1/4 the speed they used to. signature picture exceeds the size limit.~WeatherMan
NightmareX D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2009.05.21 02:25:00 - [84] Edited by: NightmareX on 21/05/2009 02:26:21 Originally by: Gavin Darklighter Edited by: Gavin Darklighter on 21/05/2009 01:45:51 Originally by: NightmareX Edited by: NightmareX on 21/05/2009 01:35:43 Originally by: Gavin Darklighter Blasters DO need a massive tracking boost, something like 50%. ACs need a tracking boost as well, say, 30%. And all the T2 short-range ammo should be changed. Was the web nerf needed if you want a 50% tracking boost on Blasters and 30% on Autocannons?. Can i ask you why CCP nerfed the webbers?. Yes i know the answer, but do you know it?. Yes it is. The web nerf was too heavy handed, and now even same-class ships can evade fire too easily. After such a tracking boost, cruisers and frigates will still be able to evade effectively for the most part but it will make it harder to evade BS guns in a BS. For everything else, there is tracking disruptors. It would take a 400% tracking boost to blasters to make them track a webbed target as well as they did before QR. And the webs got nerfed because speed got nerfed, but battleships don't go 1/4 the speed they used to. I like the webs as they are now, but it wouldn't hurt to take them to 70%. I'm all in for that. But saying 50% tracking boost to Blasters and 30% to Autocannons is asking to get the frigs and cruisers unpopular against BS'es again. Or it will make the frigs and cruisers useless against BS'es then. Like they was earlier. There is 2 reasons why the webs got nerfed. 1. To let the Frigs and Cruisers or Battlecruisers have a chance against Battleships, instead of getting instapwned by BS'es because they can't out track the BS'es at all. 2. The webs got nerfed because the speed was also nerfed. And yes, the speed nerf was needed tbh. Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise
Bellum Eternus Gallente Death of Virtue MeatSausage EXPRESS	Posted - 2009.05.21 06:24:00 - [85] Originally by: Gavin Darklighter Edited by: Gavin Darklighter on 21/05/2009 01:36:11 Blasters don't need a 30% damage increase, that is just insane. Forget the Megathron, I would LOVE a 1400 DPS Rokh or a 2k DPS shield-Hype, but it would just be stupid overpowered. Blasters DO need a massive tracking boost, something like 50%. ACs need a tracking boost as well, say, 30%. And all the T2 short-range ammo should be changed. Lasers don't need a nerf. They got the nerf with the web changes, same as every other turret got nerfed. What we need is for the short-ranged guns to be more effective at point blank than lasers are, and right now they aren't. Hehe. BTW, I'm throwing a vid together of some scrap fraps footage I've had sitting around. My side of our little fight will be in it. Fast forwarded of course. ^-^ And yeah, I was being dramatic with the 30%, but I still think that blasters could do with a bit more peak DPS, particularly the large and medium sized guns. I don't want lasers nerfed relative to the other weapons, and lasers do just a little bit too much DPS compared to blasters, particularly given their range. Blasters should reign supreme at their optimal range, and they don't. Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam. Death of Virtue is Recruiting
Gabriel Karade Gallente Celtic Anarchy Force Of Evil	Posted - 2009.05.21 08:47:00 - [86] Five words: Tracking formula, point blank range... -------------- Video - 'War-Machine'
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2009.05.21 09:00:00 - [87] Boost Artillery, Boost autocannons, Boost Blasters, but leave lasers the f'ck alone. They were without a doubt the worst weapon type for a long time, in 9/10 situations you were better off with Artties/Auto's on an Apoc than actual lasers, and now they are actually useful with [i]useful T2 ammo[/u] (well, Scorch and Conflag anyway) which is what alot of people moan about with other weapons (Crap T2 ammo). Why would you rather nerf everything to be crap than buff whats already crap to be good?. 20% tracking bonus to Blasters, 25% more damage modifier, 10% slower rate of fire. 15% more tracking to Autocannons, 10% more damage modifier, 10% faster rof. Make autocannons the "Rounds per minute" king and make blasters the "damage per hit" king of the two. Tweak some numbers here and there, oh and somewhere in amongst it all make artillery not suck too. Disclaimer, numbers are random as *** off the top of my head crap. Just contibuting my 0.02isk ___________________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008 ^Third Times a Charm^
Tuncan Minmatar Mortis Angelus The Church.	Posted - 2009.05.21 09:36:00 - [88] Edited by: Tuncan on 21/05/2009 09:37:17 CCP should sharpen the borders, strenghten the abilities of weapons. Large blasters can have a better tracking at their optimal, i can dodge a mega in a phoon when webbed with 1 ab running (3x trimarks 2x 1600's) at 500m. Say that increase in %20 tracking HOWEVER, their optimals and range should be lower than normal. T2 null ammo can reach 13km optimal i guess, it should be under 8km. Thats it, if a large blaster user catches your BS( not bc or cruiser ) you are dead. Large lasers on the other hand, should have a significant tracking nerf. If you are shooting long range, you should suffer from tracking. Thats it. If i am closer to your BS you are dead, if i am away i am dead. But the TRUE fix to this game is to nerf CAP boosters. They are significantly overpowered and they are removing the penalty of lasers.
Daan Sai Polytrope	Posted - 2009.05.21 09:39:00 - [89] My suggestions: 1) buff blaster tracking. Yes. they are close range only weapons, exactly why they need more tracking. Many, me incl, think that after the speed/web changes they are still not right. Dramatic increase to tracking is needed, plus agility for blaster boats or they are just useless at their role. 2) buff projectile Alpha Strike. Ever since the big hp buff projectiles have been devalued, esp arties. Don't increase ROF, or you just make them into flexible rails. But double the damage modifiers and you get serious alpha again. --------------------------------- Internet Submarines is Serious Business ---------------------------------
Bonny Lee Caldari The Guardian Agency Guardian Federation	Posted - 2009.05.21 09:48:00 - [90] Edited by: Bonny Lee on 21/05/2009 09:48:44 I have looked into the weapon-systems to compare a little bit better. So i understand why for example blaster need a tracking boost. Tracking of the short range Large weapons is (eft): Hybrid: 0.05 0.046 0.0433 Projectil: 0.054 0.048 0.0432 The first thing i find a bit strange is that every projectil is better in trackin then the comparable blastersize-weapon, but the biggest. Why is 800er tracking worse then Neutron Blasters? (Funny thing Med-sized it is 425: 0.1056 vs heavy neutron: 0.1 small-sized it is 200: 0.315 vs light neutron: 0.3165) So you can¦t say that blaster tracking is worse cause sometimes AC (wtf?) have worse tracking. There is no line someone could see in that. The badest tracking ingame (Short range) is Laserstuff but on the other side they can shoot easily 2x the range so the tracking doesnt matter that much. => I can¦t understand why people do want to buff Blastertracking above AC-Tracking. Thats not right and that shouldnt be done. AC have to fight in Falloff they would need by far the best tracking. Today even this isnt the case cause the Largest-AC is not in line. I dont know what it was like before (with 90% webbers) but nobody is complaining about 800er tracking but all the people complain about blaster? So Why? They have better tracking atm.



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