Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
killerbitsch
|
Posted - 2009.05.30 12:37:00 -
[31]
|
Avalon Champion
Gallente Defence Evaluation Research Agency
|
Posted - 2009.05.30 12:38:00 -
[32]
Edited by: Avalon Champion on 30/05/2009 12:44:17
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Originally by: Avalon Champion What im trying to show is that if CCP want people to move around eve and populate more of eves systems and factions, then its about time they stopped focusing on Caldari and make other factions as attractive to the PvE community.
The thing is, if people do their homework, at least Minmatar and Amarr agents already ARE more attractive. Quite a bit more in fact. But people are ignorant about that because as I said above, people in general are lazy and other not very favorable things. And of course after they are told by their buddies with the same mindset that Caldari is good, they never bother to do their own research, run Caldari missions too and tell their own buddies about it, and so it spreads. And the people smart enough to run missions where the grass is greener are also smart enough to NOT try to encourage everyone to do the same, so the cattle herd doesn't get a whiff of that green grass and tramples it.
And that actually serves both sides, the cattle don't know what they are missing, and the more professional mission runners can continue to get richer undisturbed.
So serving Caldari a lot more agents while adding a few to the other factions seems to be prudent.
The only thing I can think of to really move the lazy mission runner blob somewhere else would be to move Jita and the Caldari starter systems there :P
Also if you count Ammatar as Amarr (which you damn well should imho) you need to do the same for Khanid.
I agree, with the point you made, and i did forget about the Khanid, SoE and Interbus so for completeness here we are :
total Agents for Khanid = 44 total Agents for SoE = 68 total agents for Interbus = 38
Khanid lvl 4 agents = 14 SoE lvl 4 agents = 7 Interbus lvl 4 agents = 5
with combat division filters as per original post
Khanid lvl 4 agents = 14 SoE lvl 4 agents = 0 Interbus lvl 4 agents = 2
Statistically, Caldari level 4's are jumping from 25 to 41 level 4 agents, thats a 64% increase, and makes them double the next nearest single faction, Minmatar 23, with an increase of 21%, Gallante are getting a 20% increase to 18 agents, and Ammar get nothing.
I personally dont think there is a need for more level 4 agents, but there is a need for a more even distribution of the existing lvl 4 agents around the universe, say no more than 1 level 4 agent within 2 jumps of another agent of simular level, which would also break up a lot of the mission hubs.
I also believe that these new agents could have been more evenly distrubuted around the factions, say 3 each for the main factions and the other 11 split between the minor factions, such as SoE and Interbus, Khanid, and the pirate factions.
Edit : minmatar agent increases corrected.
|
Lord Eremet
|
Posted - 2009.05.30 13:00:00 -
[33]
Agreeing with Ank for the first and, hopefully, last time.
|
ian666
Lamb Federation Navy C0VEN
|
Posted - 2009.05.30 20:30:00 -
[34]
yes remove it all
|
Typhado3
Ashen Lion Mining and Production Consortium Aeternus.
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 03:13:00 -
[35]
csm needs to go slap some sense into ccp -----------------------------------
ccp fix mining agent missions % pls
|
shuckstar
Hauling hogs
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 03:15:00 -
[36]
|
Dr BattleSmith
PAX Interstellar Services
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 03:48:00 -
[37]
+2
|
Altaree
Eve University Ivy League
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 03:48:00 -
[38]
I just noticed that CCP completely ignored this CSM thread about this topic: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1045176
sigh....
--Altaree Eve University |
Kate Libby
Solarflare Heavy Industries Doctrine.
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 04:55:00 -
[39]
makes indeed more sense to spread out people by adding more and better agents in other faction space rather then adding more caldari agents, simply because caldari space is more crowded and more people start of as caldari.
Especially talking about level 4 mission runners is some group where u should expect from those players (even if they mindless run missions in there whole eve career) to look around in high sec for more and better agents.
Even if u take the aproach that they are paying you money to give them what they want on a shiny plate ;p ---------------- www.Cybergate.nl Love and Kisses. |
Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue MeatSausage EXPRESS
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 05:09:00 -
[40]
This thread is just as stupid/idiotic as the orginal devblog.
The OP is actually *agreeing* with the dev decision to add L4 agents to the game in high sec. This doesn't solve anything or help anything.
Who cares about the distribution of more L4 agents between the races? The fact that more L4 agents are being added *AT ALL* is the problem.
We need to be removing reward for no risk from the game, not adding to it. I don't support the OP's idea at all. Simply changing the distribution of the new L4 agents isn't the answer. Not adding any new L4 agents is the correct solution.
Move ALL of the high quality L4 agents to lowsec, spread them out, and make sure that the L3 agents are also evenly spread out and dispersed. People who endure the risk of missioning in lowsec should be rewarded. Everyone else should have to suffer the consequences of remaining in high sec like a bunch of sissies and deal with the reduced income.
I've run plenty of missions, if for no other reason than to better understand my targets and to get bookmarks so that I could better kill mission runners (before they changed the probing mechanics). I don't get killed while doing so because I'm not an idiot carebear who's so lazy that they can't pay attention to the game. If you're getting killed while running missions then it's because you're too stupid to live, not because the game is too difficult or unfair.
Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam.
Death of Virtue is Recruiting
|
|
Rakshasa Taisab
Caldari Sane Industries Inc. Ethereal Dawn
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 05:45:00 -
[41]
As the poster above, I too think both the devblog and OP have the wrong approach to the problem.
We need dynamic agent quality, where it moves gradually over months based on how many missions the agent has been handing out compared to others. Thus the agent quality will drop to a point where mission runners will start considering moving to other systems, eventually reaching an equilibrium between agent quality and location quality.
|
Earthican
Minmatar DARKFELL EXCURSIONS Bunny Nation
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 06:39:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Avalon Champion
factionName agentcount ------------------------------ ----------- Caldari State 133 Minmatar Republic 114 Gallente Federation 113 Amarr Empire 89 Ammatar Mandate 48
Over all this shows that Amarr is in some serious need of love over all agent levels, although you could argue that ammatar mandate is a sub set of ammar, but thats a moot point.
89 + 48 = 137
Moot point indeed. P.S. Has anyone counted the number of Minmatar regions in empire space? |
Emma Royd
Caldari Maddled Gommerils
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 07:38:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Bellum Eternus
Move ALL of the high quality L4 agents to lowsec, spread them out, and make sure that the L3 agents are also evenly spread out and dispersed. People who endure the risk of missioning in lowsec should be rewarded. Everyone else should have to suffer the consequences of remaining in high sec like a bunch of sissies and deal with the reduced income.
Yawn, another "move any L4Q1+ agent to lowsec so me and my bunch of corpies can has some easy kills against PVE fit CNR's since that's all the sissy mission runners use" comment.
TBH with the chars I've got I could probably make as much money mining as I do running L4 but I prefer to mission.
Mission mechanics need a major overhaul.
Give players some variety in the missions they run, I look at eve-survival and haven't done a huge number of the missions listed as they are for other factions and Minmy / Gallente don't like me much Increase the AI of mission rats, but don't make it sleeper AI where they have your drones for lunch, or as 'difficult' as 0.0 (although living in 0.0 is easier than lowsec imo) and a properly set up system you can chain belt rats and earn more money than missions with less risk, you have intel channels, local and as soon as you see anyone you don't know in local you scurry off to the safety of your pos shields (you did allign when you got into the belt didn't you?) I've lived in lowsec, lived in 0.0 and lived in empire. I've retired to empire for a bit of downtime as I play eve to enjoy myself, to not have to worry about other players ganking me in lowsec, not to have to keep numerous chat channels open to see who's coming my way in 0.0.
So if you don't like the way eve is going, then you know where the door is, and CAN I HAS YOUR STUFF
It's not often I'm wrong, apart from the comments I make in the signature, and then I'm often wrong. On the other hand maybe I'm getting confused. ......My head hurts :( |
Ancy Denaries
Solaris Operations
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 08:47:00 -
[44]
Agreed! ----- Why doesn't anyone ever read the forums before posting? EVE is a game of adaptation and planning. Adapt or die. |
Ankhesentapemkah
Gallente Citation Registration Commission
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 10:51:00 -
[45]
As for those that want to move all L4 agents to lowsec period, go away. Those that think the current mission system is flawed and that lowsec/0.0 needs to be more lucrative, and the current mission system needs dynamic qualities which drop if more people run missions and so on, I agree, but there are two other proposal threads for that to discuss things such as that in.
Based on CCPs response to CSM1, this is just the first step and the mission system will be overhauled in the future.
Originally by: Altaree I just noticed that CCP completely ignored this CSM thread about this topic: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1045176
sigh....
That's because CSM2 voted this issue down and CCP never got it.
sigh...
CSM3 will hopefully do a lot better. ---
|
Cpt Tofutiger
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 11:24:00 -
[46]
i mostly agree with you
however you are completly neglecting lowsec and 0.0
as for bellum and people like him who are talking out of their intergalactic ass for most people doing lvl4's is a way to fund pvp what you want is to have oportunitys that have greater rewards in lowsec and 0.0 to give you more targets to probe out and kill not having less overall targets because they get borred of it all... because whiney little *****es like you demand that that for the comparativly small amount of players who engage in your elected profession the majority has to suffer
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 11:42:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Erik Finnegan Edited by: Erik Finnegan on 30/05/2009 08:25:41 edited for grammar :-}
The basis for PvE must be right. Empires should be kind of leveled.
Then again, I am wondering if it is the neutral undisputable static DB which makes pilots (and I mean the big massive majority of mission runners, who Leandro disrespectfully calls "cattle") move or stay in a certain area, let alone choose their race to begin with. Or would you not deem possible there are other, more subtle yet more powerful forces at work: like "my friends suggested that I do missions here".
While I agree with Ankhe's suggestion, should we not also think about a more dynamic approach to agents? - Why do agents have to stay in one station? Don't they have a private life?! - Why do agents have a fixed quality? Don't they participate in personnel progress programmes of their companies?! - Why do agents have a fixed quality when it comes to your standing? Don't you have favoured suppliers in your company?!
And one final thought: You want to spread out pilots? How about more mission rewards of the kind: "You did a great job. Here is the corporate card of a colleague of mine, who is in need of a talented pilot just like you!" Using personal standing towards that agent now in order to making him available to the pilot in question.
Really mate you're heading down a dangerous road. The plain fact is that the whole mission systems needs reworking from the ground up. The more "band aid" changes that are made, then the greater the pain will be when the whole festering mess has to be ripped off.
Given that, why slate CCP for applying a small, easy band-aid rather than a larger, more time consuming band-aid?
|
Random Womble
Emo Rangers Electric Monkey Overlords
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 11:42:00 -
[48]
agree that the way it is being done is screwey i would also like to point out from a minmatar perspective yes atleast they are getting agents unlike amarr but 2 of them are administration (none of the gallente/caldari are admin or similarly lower % combat mission agent types) and only 1 has a posistive quality (one of the administartions) the rest are at 0 (second admin), -7, -11 which seems a bit out of whack in comparison to me.
|
Gnulpie
Miner Tech
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 14:33:00 -
[49]
"This issue demands 23 new highsec L4 agents added... For each non-Caldari faction."
Sounds good - as a first step.
Bust just adding more agents is not good enough. It would be a first step, maybe.
What we really need is a dynamic agent quality system, get rid of the fixed quality system. But that would be a different issue. |
Tlar Sanqua
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 14:45:00 -
[50]
|
|
KinLuu
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 16:22:00 -
[51]
What about if agents give only a limited ammount of missions per player per day? Like for example 10 missions for a -20 and 5 missions for a +20 agent?
That way mission runners would HAVE to move around doing missions, thus spreading the ammount of mission runners to a wider areal.
|
Epegi Givo
Moral Equivalent Of War
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 16:48:00 -
[52]
Give amarr at least one decent highsec agent.
The best one for amarr navy is a Q -7 with 2 adjacent jumps, one of which is lowsec. ------------------------------------- My other alt is a Ferrari |
iP0D
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 17:06:00 -
[53]
CCP's decision here seems to have come completely irrelevant of the whole debate. It looks a lot more like a step in an ongoing evolution of agent services within empire space, this step being focused on alleviating stress in high sec (with the aim to create more mini hubs by encouraging people to spread out) in line with the distribution of population of that part of eve's population per race and playstyle.
It is dumb because of the timing and context of the emo debate. It is smart because it really is needed in light of an ongoing growth of the mission runner population. Plus for the first time CCP is actually taking the angle here of abusing people's own mindsets to achieve results, which is not a discouraging thing in my opinion.
It would have been nice if it had been paired with a similar initiative in providing a batch of agents in low sec at the same time. That would have saved a lot of emo.
|
Slave 2739FKZ
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 17:13:00 -
[54]
While CCP movement is dumb even to their standard... this thread does nothing to help fix the real problem with level 4 or missioning: it goes agaisnt the core of game because there isn't any real competition on them between players.
Remove the whole quality thing, make them give limited missions per day (easier to control the biggest ISK faucet also) and quality a fuction of usage. That to start with,m then add sleeper ai and totally revamp them, and epic missions allready damn it.
Then, only then, maybe it would be wise to add new agents .
|
Mara Kell
Steel Beasts Sev3rance
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 19:27:00 -
[55]
I totally agree with the OP. As agents are now its hard to resist to do missions for caladari because they simply have the best agents and the most of them.
As passionated Amarr player, id love to do missions for Khanid or Ammatar but they simply have no usefull agent at all. Look for Amarr Navy, Ammator Navy or Khanid Navy L4s with kill mission that are not right at or in low sec. There are none. And afaik its the same for the Minmatar faction.
So the problem is not with Caldari having to few agents, but the other factions (especially minor factions) having totally crap agents.
And CCPs attempt goes totally in the wrong direction.
|
Saphros
Lone Gunmen
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 21:11:00 -
[56]
Edited by: Saphros on 31/05/2009 21:11:18 Ankhesentapemkah allready got my vote on this.
|
fuze
Chosen Path Veritas Immortalis
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 22:30:00 -
[57]
For years mission agents and their distribution are in dire need of support. |
Deldrac
Ultrapolite Socialites GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2009.05.31 23:18:00 -
[58]
Edited by: Deldrac on 31/05/2009 23:18:53 Make quality dynamic already.
Each downtime, rank the agents at each level in order of the number missions run for them in the last 30 days.
Least used 2.5% get Q20 till next downtime, next 2.5% get Q19, all the way down to the most used at Q-20.
Problem solved.
|
I SoStoned
|
Posted - 2009.06.01 11:50:00 -
[59]
We need this topic stickied, it's too damn valid.
All factions should have identical agent ratios to prompt people to homogenize across the map.
|
Zargyl
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
|
Posted - 2009.06.01 13:46:00 -
[60]
Sounds nice. BTW the mentioned new Gallente Agent Avele Lelynier in Gererique (0.7) is listed ingame as a level 3 one (and not a level 4 one). Still a nice boost for Solitude
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |