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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 10 post(s) |
Vrenth
Gallente Lightning Industries
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Posted - 2009.07.28 16:28:00 -
[1]
These capital ship fuel bays are nothing but a nerf if you decrease our cargo bay size. You realize that a carrier/mothership's utility is greatly decreased if they can't anchor/unanchor structures because they are too large to fit in their now laughable cargo. No capital ship should have a base cargo less than the carrier's current cargo on SiSi, it's an issue of taking away luxuries that have nothing to do with combat and have no need to be nerfed.
If you are going to decrease our cargo this much, I suggest making those fuel bays much, much larger to compensate.. or doubling the size of ship corporate hangers and allowing structures to anchor/unanchor from hangers. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for the fuel bay addition, it is a long needed change.. but it should be an addition, not a substitution. Capital ships size is already pathetic enough, don't kill our cargo holds as well.
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
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Posted - 2009.07.28 16:37:00 -
[2]
Actually... the harder is to move caps around the better.
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Vrenth
Gallente Lightning Industries
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Posted - 2009.07.28 16:43:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Vrenth on 28/07/2009 16:44:19
Originally by: Deva Blackfire Actually... the harder is to move caps around the better.
The current system will make it no harder to move them around... it will make it easier.
It will make it HARDER to do everything else they used to do related to cargo. They may as well take the word Carry out of Carrier. It can't even carry ships that well... so don't make that argument . The carrier/mothership should have 10,000/25,000m3 fuel bays used to refuel other ships in the fleet. That is what carriers do IRL.
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Rusty Cargoguy
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.07.28 20:08:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Rusty Cargoguy on 28/07/2009 20:08:25
Originally by: Vrenth That is what carriers do IRL.
real life spaceships? not just internet spaceships now? awesomes!
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Xarxii
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Posted - 2009.07.28 20:48:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Rusty Cargoguy Edited by: Rusty Cargoguy on 28/07/2009 20:08:25
Originally by: Vrenth That is what carriers do IRL.
real life spaceships? not just internet spaceships now? awesomes!
This may come as a surprise to you, but CCP didn't invent the carrier.
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Aramith
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Posted - 2009.07.28 20:54:00 -
[6]
ccp may not have invented the carrier, but last i knew of navy logistics practices, the carrier does not refuel the rest of the fleet.
That is the job of the fleet oilers (tanker ships that more closely resemble the industrial ships of eve)
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Xarxii
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Posted - 2009.07.28 20:57:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Aramith ccp may not have invented the carrier, but last i knew of navy logistics practices, the carrier does not refuel the rest of the fleet.
That is the job of the fleet oilers (tanker ships that more closely resemble the industrial ships of eve)
Partly true, but if you want to get technical, most of the naval ships in modern days are nuclear powered, and require no specific "fuel".
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Aramith
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Posted - 2009.07.28 21:20:00 -
[8]
the carrier and the subs are nuclear powered but everything else runs off of diesel fuels of some grade or another.
those all need to be refueled, as well as all the aircraft that the carrier handles thus it does get refueled so it can keeps its planes in the air.
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Bobbeh
Minmatar Navy of Xoc Wildly Inappropriate.
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Posted - 2009.07.29 08:37:00 -
[9]
It will weed out the use of caps for non combat oriented things.
Carriers are haulers, they are support escort for dreads, Repair machines, and local system refit and rearm stations.
The real and only nerf is for dreads who will no longer beable to use cans and therefor greatly reducing its stront cycle count from 6-7 cycles plus iso's plus ammo to 2-3 cycles plus not as much iso's and alot more ammo. As a dread pilot this is a scary scary thought, and i hope is dealt with by ccp.
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Cors
It's A Trap
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Posted - 2009.07.29 08:42:00 -
[10]
I've seen a few of these threads. And the one thing that almost every one of them misses is that carriers are NOT meant to be haulers. They are meant to move ships from your Outpost into combat, NOT to move them from empire to 0.0.
They're NOT meant to be used to move fuel for pos's, or ammo for ships. They are meant to be a small scale base in space, OR as a combat ship. NOT as a cargo hauler.
Neither are dreads meant to be cargo haulers. The dread has a SINGLE purpose.
To jump to the fight, and put maximum damage on target. Either another capital ship, or on a POS/station. It's NOT meant for hauling.
If you want to haul things, buy a jump freighter. They ARE meant to haul. Carriers and Dreads are for combat. NOT logistics.
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JamesTalon
Caldari The Knights Templar
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Posted - 2009.07.29 08:55:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Cors If you want to haul things, buy a jump freighter. They ARE meant to haul. Carriers and Dreads are for combat. NOT logistics.
To be honest, normally when I'm moving stuff with my carrier, my entire cargohold and a chunk of the corp hangar contains fuel, but losing the cargohold capacity and basically being forced to only store fuel in most of what was taken from it just rubs me the wrong way...
"Till shade is gone, till water is gone, into the Shadow with teeth bared, screaming defiance with the last breath, to spit in Sightblinder’s eye on the Last Day." - Robert Jordan |
Vrenth
Gallente Lightning Industries
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Posted - 2009.07.29 16:15:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Cors
Carriers and Dreads are for combat. NOT logistics.
Gee, and here I was thinking that carriers were a dedicated logistics capital ship.... you know, hence the tactical logistics reconfiguration (triage) and all those bonuses to remote repairing. You'de almost think they were a combat support ship.. maybe they should continue to fill the roll of logistic by continuing to carry fuel for the dreadnoughts and themselves (hint hint, siege moduals isn't the only thing that uses strontium). Why do dreadnoughts have a larger fuel bay than carriers, it should be the same
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Doomed Predator
The Graduates Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2009.07.29 18:23:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Vrenth Edited by: Vrenth on 28/07/2009 16:44:19
Originally by: Deva Blackfire Actually... the harder is to move caps around the better.
The current system will make it no harder to move them around... it will make it easier.
It will make it HARDER to do everything else they used to do related to cargo. They may as well take the word Carry out of Carrier. It can't even carry ships that well... so don't make that argument . The carrier/mothership should have 10,000/25,000m3 fuel bays used to refuel other ships in the fleet. That is what carriers do IRL.
They would have taken the word carry out of carrier if they removed fighters. Get a Rorqual or a jump freighter if you want to move your stuff. The 'Fendahlian Collective' strikes again |
ice sect
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Posted - 2009.07.29 18:46:00 -
[14]
will someone post the current sisi stats relating to cargoholds/fuel bays please?
- dreads - titans - carriers - motherships - whatever other ships theyre trying to damage the use of
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Lewyrus
Jugis Modo Utopia Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2009.07.29 18:52:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Lewyrus on 29/07/2009 18:54:15
Originally by: ice sect will someone post the current sisi stats relating to cargoholds/fuel bays please?
Fuel bays for isotopes, strontium and liquid ozone: Black Ops: 1000 m3 Carrier: 3000 m3 Dread: 7000 m3 Mothership: 5000 m3 Rorqual and Jump Freighter: 10k m3 Titan: 60k m3
Ammo bays: Revelation: 250 m3 Moros: 1750 m3 Phoenix: 2000 m3 Naglfar: 2250 m3 Titans have double these amount (for respective race).
Cargoholds: Carriers: 820-875 m3 Dreads: 1810-2560 m3 Motherships: 1337-1415 m3 Titans: 11k-16k m3 Rorqual and Jump Freighter are unchanged.
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Vrenth
Gallente Lightning Industries
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Posted - 2009.07.29 19:08:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Vrenth on 29/07/2009 19:08:33
Originally by: Doomed Predator
They would have taken the word carry out of carrier if they removed fighters. Get a Rorqual or a jump freighter if you want to move your stuff.
I'm not talking about moving my stuff. I'm talking about picking things up that are more 1000m3 that carriers have often been used for. Such as anchoring cans and pos structures. This is a side affect from giving us fuel bays and taking away our cargo that was overlooked. I don't want to have to carry an industrial everywhere I go. 3000m3 cargo is not huge, it didn't allow us to replace freighters, but it is nessesary.
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Sertan Deras
Gallente Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.07.30 04:58:00 -
[17]
Capital ships can no longer carry capital mods in their cargo holds. This is brilliant forethought on CCP's part. No other ship in the game (that I am aware of) is prohibited from carrying it's own mods in it's cargo hold.
The Carrier fuel bay size is a total joke, it should be the same size as the Dreads. Carrier's didn't suddenly start using half the fuel, or half the stront, of a Dread. Even if you want to use the "Carriers don't go through as much stront", it shouldn't be half the size.
Out of random curiosity, can the Carrier fuel bay hold liquid ozone? If so, then that is another reason it should be much larger.
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Etien Aldragoran
DarkStar 1 GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.07.30 05:40:00 -
[18]
Do the designers even play this game?
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Fuujin
GoonFleet
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Posted - 2009.07.30 06:03:00 -
[19]
With these changes to utterly nerf the carrier, a DREAD can now carry and deploy a small tower, while a carrier can't even deploy a medium gun.
So are carriers just supposed to be basilisks with a better tank? |
Vrenth
Gallente Lightning Industries
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Posted - 2009.07.30 07:54:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Fuujin
With these changes to utterly nerf the carrier, a DREAD can now carry and deploy a small tower, while a carrier can't even deploy a medium gun.
So are carriers just supposed to be basilisks with a better tank?
Apparently. I don't want my carrier to be the jack of all trades that they used to be, they nerfed their hauling ability already, now apparently they need to nerf their ability to do ANYTHING pos related. Before they could, with cargo extenders, carry and set up light pos setups, now you would need rigs to even get close to the cargo required...
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Tairon Usaro
The X-Trading Company RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2009.07.30 08:12:00 -
[21]
The whole concept of dedicated bays is
CRAP Unneed, unwanted and it wont fix the broken blackops concept ________________________________________________ Some days i loose, some days the others win ... |
Oarta
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Posted - 2009.07.30 22:21:00 -
[22]
I like the change, though the size of the fuel bays may need a little adjustment. It allows for roles to be more defined for the ships in regards to what they need to carry. Dreads for siege, Carriers for ship transport and Rorquals/Jump Freighters for the back-end logistics.
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Vrenth
Gallente Lightning Industries
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Posted - 2009.07.31 01:48:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Oarta I like the change, though the size of the fuel bays may need a little adjustment. It allows for roles to be more defined for the ships in regards to what they need to carry. Dreads for siege, Carriers for ship transport and Rorquals/Jump Freighters for the back-end logistics.
If you jump a jump freighter full of fuel into a fleet battle, I'd laugh. Jump freighters have no role, besides having a jump drive and being able to go into empire. A rorqual can get upwards of 150k cargo with all things considered, with very good jump range. This will cost you far less than a jump freighter, and has a use.
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kittypaws
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Posted - 2009.07.31 07:01:00 -
[24]
lol CCP always seems to be able to make things more stupid!
Plese dont do this.. it's hard enuf to change your carrier fitting already!
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Oarta
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Posted - 2009.07.31 11:23:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Vrenth
Originally by: Oarta I like the change, though the size of the fuel bays may need a little adjustment. It allows for roles to be more defined for the ships in regards to what they need to carry. Dreads for siege, Carriers for ship transport and Rorquals/Jump Freighters for the back-end logistics.
If you jump a jump freighter full of fuel into a fleet battle, I'd laugh. Jump freighters have no role, besides having a jump drive and being able to go into empire. A rorqual can get upwards of 150k cargo with all things considered, with very good jump range. This will cost you far less than a jump freighter, and has a use.
When I stated back-end, I also was including the movement and transport of POS equipment. JF do the major movements to staging, Rorquals do the deployments to hostile.
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Tappits
Priory Of The Lemon Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2009.07.31 13:13:00 -
[26]
Sounds like a good idea to me.
P.S WTS 2 carriers and a dread, pm me..... ---------------------------------------------- Pro BOB????? I fail At forums |
Tammarr
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Posted - 2009.07.31 16:18:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Tammarr on 31/07/2009 16:18:45 Skeptic to reducing cargobays and making pathetic fuel bays. My redeemer sits at 3k cargospace, to bridge people. If its cargohold isnt changed, I can now hold 4k of fuels for people? But I have to lift it from cargo->fuelbay possibly totaly making things go to poo, the bridge isnt open long enough to start fiddling around with adding fuel to fuelbay. More and more of a twitchgame and I aint getting younger. Dreads able to siege 3 cycles or be able to jump? Gratz... I'am sure the brilliant tought here is: Duh, like, then they'll have to resupply more often, duh, making it more like rl, duuuuh get it, theyll bring haulers to refuel da dreads duuuh. No, No, No. Its already a tremendous worktask to get a sizeable capfleet to get going in the right direction. Change sov first, then we can talk about changes that make the trenchwarfare even more bitter and uninteresting.
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Seishi Maru
The Black Dawn Gang
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Posted - 2009.07.31 16:36:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Xarxii
Originally by: Aramith ccp may not have invented the carrier, but last i knew of navy logistics practices, the carrier does not refuel the rest of the fleet.
That is the job of the fleet oilers (tanker ships that more closely resemble the industrial ships of eve)
Partly true, but if you want to get technical, most of the naval ships in modern days are nuclear powered, and require no specific "fuel".
US and france carriers, UK, France, RUssia, US,India, China submarines (being ONLY US and freance fully nuclear sub fleet) and a single class of Russian Battlecruisers.
All the rest of naval vessesl in world are gas turbines or diesel engines.
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Alexander Knott
Ars ex Discordia GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.07.31 16:40:00 -
[29]
Why are we talking about what aircraft carriers in real life do in a forum about internet spaceships?
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ChronoSphere
Sturmgrenadier Inc Executive Outcomes
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Posted - 2009.07.31 16:58:00 -
[30]
I think this is kinda fail tbh, no one has had any problems really with how carriers work. They're multi-use versatile ships, and have been from day 1 - they can do pvp, they can do logistics, they can do cargo movement, they're just not the "best" ship for each role (Except logistics). They're a jack-of-all trades, master of none type deal.
This effectively nerfs carriers so that their only usage is gonna be moving rigged ships or repping towers, with occasional drone support. -------------- ~Admiral, Executive Officer Sturmgrenadier, Inc. Join Sturmgrenadier today! |
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