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Seriphyn Inhonores Gallente Electus Matari	Posted - 2009.08.20 17:00:00 - [1] I shared with another friend of mine my desire for the Ishukone corporation to win the right over the Intaki system, as a 'last resort' if there would be no salvage of the situation. It's very uncanny how this desire came true. I have a lot of respect for Otro Garuishi and Ishukone, for their opposition to Heth and barbarism. Then again, I do talk with a lot of bias, as my primary school on Caldari Prime was Ishukone-run. I pray Reppola treats Intaki Prime with a sense of humanitarianism, something Heth lacks. Of course, ideally, it would be better if this wasn't happening at all. What right does Heth have to 'bid' away sovereign Gallente territory? I also urge Ishukone-aligned capsuleers to assist in making sure as little blood is spilled as possible. Seriphyn Inhonores Luminaire District Parliament candidate for Greater Monipuolinen ward Sociocrat Party
Ouro Akala	Posted - 2009.08.20 17:20:00 - [2] Mr Inhonores, war determines not who is right, but who is left. In this case, the Intaki system is left in the hands of the Caldari, regardless of any "rights". One might argue the same situation was with Caldari Prime and the Federation until recently. While of course this is a sad state of affairs for many, it is the reality of things, and guns loaded with harsh words, no matter how righteous, don't win territory. It is indeed, pragmatically speaking, the best thing to happen to Intaki Prime under the current circumstances. However, this is also a great risk to Ishukone. From what I can tell they are currently perceived as the only "good" Caldari corporation within the Federation. Should they botch this one up, all this hardly earned trust will go to hell on a one way trip at warp speed. We, as a people, have always been divided between the two empires. The Mordu's Legion is an example of this, as is the current situation. I pray that our people will not suffer through these trying times.
Stitcher Caldari ForgeTech Industries	Posted - 2009.08.20 18:27:00 - [3] I find it intriguing that Ishukone's only purchase in this auction was Intaki. That fact certainly implies some motive beyond development and profit, doesn't it? Though doubtless the development of Intaki and the resultant profits would be a welcome benefit... Funny how Ishukone can command my loyalty even now. One of my first thoughts on hearing the news was the concern that some FDU resurgence might reclaim Intaki and render a doubtless expensive Ishukone investment null and void... which in turn sparked the fleeting notion that perhaps I had better re-enlist with the Protectorate and defend my parent corporation's investments. It was very fleeting, though. I'd prefer the investment not have been made at all. Still, better to protect an unwise investment and nurture it into a more secure one, than let it wither and die undefended I suppose. - Verin "Stitcher" Hakatain.
Sumerio Rayej Intaki Liberation Front	Posted - 2009.08.21 04:31:00 - [4] Edited by: Sumerio Rayej on 21/08/2009 04:31:57 I have to agree with Mr. Inhonores on this one. I am not personally happy with Tibus Heth's decree, either, but Intaki could have done much worse than to have the Ishukone corporation come to our system. The Intaki Liberation Front has many friends at Ishukone and will work to secure the best situation possible for our people, until such time as true independence becomes reality for Intaki.
Dex Nederland Caldari Lai Dai Infinity Systems	Posted - 2009.08.21 05:12:00 - [5] Originally by: Stitcher It was very fleeting, though. I'd prefer the investment not have been made at all. Still, better to protect an unwise investment and nurture it into a more secure one, than let it wither and die undefended I suppose. Could you be more apologetic about Caldari success in a war that the Federation agreed to? The State's government* is distributing territory it has responsibility over to its component members for administration, management, and development. This is how we do things. The Okkelen constellation is a perfect example of this, where Lai Dai and SuVee took on the responsibility of administering, managing, and developing the constellation. Since the State has acquired responsibility for a large swath of the State-Federation frontier, it only makes sense that the State divide the responsibility between its member corporations as it does in all of its territories. *Despite the sensationalism of the Scope's reporting and attributing this all to Tibus Heth, it is highly likely that the CEP was very involved in this. The goal of the development bidding is in part to pay for some of the resources spent securing the homeworld. CEO, Lai Dai Infinity Systems
Simon Coal Gallente The Grass Spiders	Posted - 2009.08.21 07:26:00 - [6] Originally by: Dex Nederland The State's government* is distributing territory it has responsibility over to its component members for administration, management, and development. This is how we do things. Yay. Not that this is just territory. It's people, infrastructure, culture. Now the Caldari get to be the foreign empire telling a native culture how they can practice their identity. I wonder if you'll let us walk away if we decide we don't want to be a part of your government.
Stitcher Caldari ForgeTech Industries	Posted - 2009.08.21 09:24:00 - [7] Originally by: Simon Coal Now the Caldari get to be the foreign empire telling a native culture how they can practice their identity. I wonder if you'll let us walk away if we decide we don't want to be a part of your government. We shall have to wait and see, shan't we? Nederland-haan, you're correct of course, I am somewhat... apologetic. it's a byproduct of being a conscientious objector to the occupation of Federation space for much the same reasons as pilot Coal just alluded to. My opinion will remain that this should not have come to pass. But there's no use in complaining about what has been - now is the time to focus on making the best of the situation. If we're going to be there, we may as well do right by these people.... - Verin "Stitcher" Hakatain.
Pytria Le'Danness Placid Reborn	Posted - 2009.08.21 10:56:00 - [8] I am apalled how ignorant some capsuleers are about the situation and how they are now making excuses for their actions during the war. It's good news that Intaki is now under control of a Caldari corporation? Do you really think this is an improvement over the situation before the war? You know, when the people on our homeworld were in charge of their own destiny? I'm annoyed at all the capsuleers who don#t care at all about the people on the planets. But I am even more dismayed at corporations like the Intaki Liberation Front who actively supported the Caldari invaders while claiming neutrality - you just need to look at the employment history of people like Yuri Intaki to confirm this. And now the Caldari have invaded our homeworld - did anyone really think they'd give our people freedom and the right to decide their own fate? Our homeworld is now being sold to the highest bidder and you can bet that the winner will try to make profit out of that. Sadly it's the populace on the planet who will be suffering, the capsuleers who did nothing to prevent that get away scot free or even with a chuckle at their achievements. Intaki that were in control of their own decisions are now degraded to prisoners of war who have to pray that a foreign power keen on wiping out all that is Federation treats them fairly and refrains from taking away all they own. The Intaki lived in peace, but now they have been liberated ... liberated from their worldly possessions. I am sure they are quite thankful for this. Don't celebrate the fact that it is a relatively moderate corporation that is taking control of our homeworld. Grief for the fact that you handed it to them in the first place. Corporation RP channel: "PlacidReborn"
Mazca Lopez Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2009.08.21 12:33:00 - [9] I should like to hear Vremaja Idama's position in this matter?
Jake Dreadmore Caldari JotunHeim Hird Mostly Harmless	Posted - 2009.08.21 13:18:00 - [10] Originally by: Pytria Le'Danness Don't celebrate the fact that it is a relatively moderate corporation that is taking control of our homeworld. Grief for the fact that you handed it to them in the first place. As far as I recall you proclaiming it to be "inevitable" as you covered your retreat out of Placid not even a year ago. Pherhaps your words are poorly choosen?
Pytria Le'Danness Placid Reborn	Posted - 2009.08.21 13:27:00 - [11] Originally by: Jake Dreadmore Pherhaps your words are poorly choosen? Aparently. What I wanted to convey there was that if we had stayed in the war, Placid Reborn would have ceased to exist. The war cost us more pilots than joined, and several pilots (myself included) were exhausted by the constant battle.
Tomahawk Bliss Minmatar Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2009.08.21 17:47:00 - [12] you ran away from the fight because you were "tired" and you felt your corporation wouldn't survive due to poor recruitment numbers because the fighting was hard? and still you think you have any reputation to cast aspersions on ILF? ludicrous.
Aria Jenneth Caldari Ghost Festival	Posted - 2009.08.21 17:47:00 - [13] The fact that Ishukone bid only on the Intaki system seems to bode well for the Intaki future. If the megacorporation sees an essential resource to be tapped there, I can't imagine there's one there that exists nowhere else in Placid, unless it's the Intaki people themselves. Knowing Ishukone's historical policies and political outlook, it may be that it sees a reversal of the tide coming, or at least the potential for one, and desires to protect the system from exploitation by corporations of the Patriot or, gods forbid, Practical factions. Such exploitation, after all, could lead to further hate and bloodshed after this war passes, and the State has historically enjoyed good relations with many of the Intaki bloodline (those of Mordu's Legion, for instance). Yes, the more I think about it the more this looks like a sheltering move. Hm. Well, it's good to see at least one megacorporation thinking about the future in the broadest sense.
Gottii Minmatar Re-Awakened Technologies Inc Electus Matari	Posted - 2009.08.21 18:03:00 - [14] Edited by: Gottii on 21/08/2009 18:03:35 Apparently the Amarr arent the only ones who see nothing wrong with buying and selling entire cultures and races...
Svetlana Scarlet Caldari Caldari Independent Navy Reserve	Posted - 2009.08.21 18:35:00 - [15] Originally by: Gottii Apparently the Amarr arent the only ones who see nothing wrong with buying and selling entire cultures and races... No one is talking about "buying and selling" people, and no doubt most private property owners on these worlds will be allowed to retain the rights. What will change is that no longer will these systems be run by buffoons trying to curry favor with capricious masses, but by corporations responsible to their shareholders for running things efficiently and for a profit. There's no doubt that this will be a difficult transition, but none of these systems has exactly prospered under Gallente rule -- and the Intaki have suffered more than most. With Ishukone taking over the administration of Intaki Prime, I hope that the opportunities provided to my family as Ishukone citizens will be extended to the people there -- stable employment, the opportunity to invest in their future, and a new employer that is invested in their success. -- CAPT Svetlana Scarlet CAIN Chief of Diplomatic Staff
Sky Grunthor Minmatar The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc. Balance of Judgment	Posted - 2009.08.21 18:49:00 - [16] Originally by: Svetlana Scarlet Originally by: Gottii Apparently the Amarr arent the only ones who see nothing wrong with buying and selling entire cultures and races... No one is talking about "buying and selling" people, and no doubt most private property owners on these worlds will be allowed to retain the rights. What will change is that no longer will these systems be run by buffoons trying to curry favor with capricious masses, but by corporations responsible to their shareholders for running things efficiently and for a profit. There's no doubt that this will be a difficult transition, but none of these systems has exactly prospered under Gallente rule -- and the Intaki have suffered more than most. With Ishukone taking over the administration of Intaki Prime, I hope that the opportunities provided to my family as Ishukone citizens will be extended to the people there -- stable employment, the opportunity to invest in their future, and a new employer that is invested in their success. You must be reading a different news source than I am... Although, I must confess that Ishikone may respect private property, I doubt any of the other Mega-Corps will have the same respect as Ishikone does. However what Heth is doing IS the auctioning off of entire planets including private property to the mega corps. It is up to the mega corp whether that private property is honored or not. I daresay it is up to the mega corps whether the population is enslaved and sold off or not as well. Caldari corporation are well known for enslaving Minmatar and others for sale to the pirate nations and Amarr empire even though they do not usually hold slaves themselves. As to the claim of them doing terribly under Gallente authority... Before the war the federation was in the middle of a socio-economic golden age in comparison to Caldari. If not for the war, they would most likely still be in such a state. Now they fear for their property and possibly their own life and freedom at the hands of an arbitrary foreign power. That is such a better state to be in, really it is. ------------------------------------------------- Search: Sky Grunthor
Mort Eveson Gallente Intaki Liberation Front	Posted - 2009.08.21 19:08:00 - [17] Originally by: Pytria Le'Danness Again with the Yuri thing, she is her own woman, she follows her own path. I agree that this isn't good but it is certainly less bad than it could be. I have great respect for Placid Reborn, although I haven't seen as many of your pilots in Intaki recently. Ironically it was your pro-Fed policies compared with the ILFs neutral policies that persuaded me to join the ILF (where I am very happy). Intriguingly your comments echo someone else's I've heard (I'm sure he'll make himself known): " As for discussions about which megacorp is worse than another, I will not go there. It would be too much like two slaves discussing who has the kinder master for me to stomach." As always I watch to see what happens and respond in kind. Ishukone's track record things could be far worse. Until I find out how they are acting on the ground I cannot in good conscience commit to a course of action. Mort "" Visit us on http://www.ilfcorp.com/
Herzog Wolfhammer Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2009.08.21 20:24:00 - [18] There may be a self-interested motive in Ishukone driven by an Intaki independence. Corporation that can have sovereign status in a system, breaking free from the Caldari state and in between 2 empires. Where there is profit motive behind and ideal, then it becomes a front. This will get interesting and I don't think Heth will be happy when this is over.
Ouro Akala	Posted - 2009.08.21 21:15:00 - [19] Actually the auctionning off of systems is a very Caldari thing to do, regardless of negative or positive connotations. The whole State, after all, is a gigantic BUSINESS. Thus war is also business. Terrtories become assets. As the Provist Directorate is not a business venture, when it acquired territories, it treated them as assets, and because it cannot develop them by itself, it sold them, again, like any other assets they would have that were valuable, and yet unusable. To be honest, should the situation had been in reverse, that is, the Federation would have claimed all Caldari systems, I'm sure that hive of s****and bickering that is our Senate would think up some equally "creative" solution to manage the situation of the conquered people.
Halunoto Vankaalen	Posted - 2009.08.21 22:15:00 - [20] Edited by: Halunoto Vankaalen on 21/08/2009 22:19:47 Originally by: Seriphyn Inhonores What right does Heth have to 'bid' away sovereign Gallente territory? The right was attained with the capture of the system. Feel free to try resistance Inhonores. Originally by: Sky Grunthor You must be reading a different news source than I am... It appears so. Originally by: Sky Grunthor I daresay it is up to the mega corps whether the population is enslaved and sold off or not as well. Caldari corporation are well known for enslaving Minmatar and others for sale to the pirate nations and Amarr empire even though they do not usually hold slaves themselves. Really. Good luck trying to prove that, such baseless claims only incite lunacy and violence, concepts that are somewhat abhorrent when conducted in the name of enforced ignorance and racial hatred. Direct your disapproval towards the limp wristed Senate for complying with invasion, not the Caldari for making the most of an opportunity. Originally by: Sky Grunthor As to the claim of them doing terribly under Gallente authority... Before the war the federation was in the middle of a socio-economic golden age in comparison to Caldari. If not for the war, they would most likely still be in such a state. Now they fear for their property and possibly their own life and freedom at the hands of an arbitrary foreign power. Initial reports from our early landings elsewhere indicate otherwise pilot. Originally by: Sky Grunthor That is such a better state to be in, really it is. Their previous caretaker has all but abandoned them to whatever fate they might reap. You can explain that to them, as you struggle to describe the evils of a society where talent and ability are recognised and duly rewarded. Or why the gross underdevelopment and stagnation of their home regions might be allowed to continue for the sake of bureaucratic comfort.
Sky Grunthor Minmatar The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc. Balance of Judgment	Posted - 2009.08.21 22:38:00 - [21] Edited by: Sky Grunthor on 21/08/2009 22:42:53 ignore this. ------------------------------------------------- Search: Sky Grunthor
Kyoko Sakoda Caldari Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2009.08.22 01:33:00 - [22] The only value I see so far is political. ___ Latest video: War Has Come (720p)
Seriphyn Inhonores Gallente Electus Matari	Posted - 2009.08.23 12:02:00 - [23] It has occured to me. If Ishukone is currently 'financially struggling', how will they hope to maintain a sustained offensive against the Federation Army stationed on Intaki? They won't achieve total victory in a short matter of minutes like on Caldari Prime, that's for sure. A long-drawn out battle of occupation is at hand maybe? Seriphyn Inhonores Luminaire District Parliament candidate for Greater Monipuolinen ward Sociocrat Party
Hester Shaw	Posted - 2009.08.23 15:32:00 - [24] Originally by: Seriphyn Inhonores It has occured to me. If Ishukone is currently 'financially struggling', how will they hope to maintain a sustained offensive against the Federation Army stationed on Intaki? They won't achieve total victory in a short matter of minutes like on Caldari Prime, that's for sure. A long-drawn out battle of occupation is at hand maybe? Two words: Orbital bombardment.
Aria Jenneth Caldari Ghost Festival	Posted - 2009.08.23 16:10:00 - [25] Originally by: Hester Shaw Originally by: Seriphyn Inhonores It has occured to me. If Ishukone is currently 'financially struggling', how will they hope to maintain a sustained offensive against the Federation Army stationed on Intaki? They won't achieve total victory in a short matter of minutes like on Caldari Prime, that's for sure. A long-drawn out battle of occupation is at hand maybe? Two words: Orbital bombardment. Maybe. All in all, a drawn-out war would be much more expensive than a decisive strike, as Ishukone is undoubtedly aware. Consequently, orbital bombardment does seem a likely option. However, please do not forget that Ishukone, "financially struggling" or not, is a Caldari State megacorporation with the resources of entire planets at its command. It has its own standing military and shipyards, and the Ishukone Watch is far from a joke. Considering Ishukone's reputation, the degree to which that reputation is at stake, and the deadly disadvantage the Federal forces find themselves at, the words "negotiated surrender" come to mind. The alternative is likely a sustained orbital assault to soften Federal targets, followed by ground-based invasion to mop up the resulting mess-- all with overwhelming force. The point would be to get the pain, financial and otherwise, over with quickly.
Stitcher Caldari ForgeTech Industries	Posted - 2009.08.23 16:23:00 - [26] This all, of course, assumes that Ishukone are interested in forcible occupation of the planet. I've not yet seen any evidence to suggest that as being the case. If Ishukone wanted a world to occupy, there were far cheaper, safer and easier alternatives to Intaki, and Ishukone didn't bid on a single one of them. the people on Intaki Prime have nothing to fear, I'm utterly convinced of it. - Verin "Stitcher" Hakatain.
Tomahawk Bliss Minmatar Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2009.08.23 16:27:00 - [27] Orbital Bombardment of Intaki would be a death sentence to the Caldari's chance at profit from occupancy. Right now you have Intaki fighting for the Caldari, but watch what happens if even one of the 500 Idama gets blown up and their reborn memories lost. YouÆll see the deeply spiritual Intaki rise up like a hurricane. The question for Ishukone is only if they will blunder and kill something important or if they will ride the tide of anti-Federation sentiment and establish long lasting profitable enterprises. I personally think the Intaki will benefit greatly from Ishukone. A megacorp putting its resources into infrastructure and progress in the Intaki system will look mighty good when compared to a Federation that more or less ignored the whole region.
Natalcya Katla Naqam Exalted.	Posted - 2009.08.23 16:49:00 - [28] So much useless arguing over a simple lump of dirt. Won't somebody get rid of that planet already?
Seriphyn Inhonores Gallente Electus Matari	Posted - 2009.08.23 16:53:00 - [29] Originally by: Natalcya Katla So much useless arguing over a simple lump of dirt. Won't somebody get rid of that planet already? Typical capsuleer response. You probably don't even realize there are crews on the ships that you fly? It's probably one big hologame to you as well. Millions of people live on Intaki. And hell, you're Intaki yourself, your ethnicity traces back there.
Aria Jenneth Caldari Ghost Festival	Posted - 2009.08.23 16:55:00 - [30] Originally by: Seriphyn Inhonores Originally by: Natalcya Katla So much useless arguing over a simple lump of dirt. Won't somebody get rid of that planet already? Typical capsuleer response. You probably don't even realize there are crews on the ships that you fly? It's probably one big hologame to you as well. Millions of people live on Intaki. And hell, you're Intaki yourself, your ethnicity traces back there. Um. Mr. Inhonores, Ms. Katla is far from a typical capsuleer. And I can assure you, she's quite aware of her ethnic background.

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