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Is Eve Leaning towards a population of gankers and pirates?

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Blade Murderhorn Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.09.24 11:23:00 - [31] Originally by: Demeterus This is not WoW, and i say that not to put you down, but to emphasize that there is no equivalent of low level players versus high level players as in that game. I agree that this is one of the things that make eve great, but in contrast to that it is not skill points that make the difference it is experience, also yea roaming gangs of frigates can be quite hardcore (I have participated in a few roams on an alt of mine, it is great fun) the problem comes when you are on your own.... but then this is what making corps is all about.... Cheers Blade ------------------------------------------- "The Master at being Podded...." Maby one day Revenge!
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2009.09.24 11:29:00 - [32] Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker Personally I get the feel that a larger part of EVE population have become more "carebearish" compared to EVE online in its younger days. So, no I dont think EVE have become more hardcore. If any: softer.. Wardeccing 5 mission runners that don't even pilot a BS like the OP and being "carebearish" aren't opposites. I will say they are the same thing. So yes, plenty of "carepirates" that want safe kills.
Trig Palin	Posted - 2009.09.24 11:30:00 - [33] Edited by: Trig Palin on 24/09/2009 11:35:01 I played WoW for a long time before I came to Eve. I have one particular, hilarious memory from one day when my server was down for a while after the standard downtime: I rolled a level 1 horde alt on some other server to kill the time and made my way to the human starting area. Apparently some guild from somewhere had had the same idea, because there were already 30 or so level 1 undead alts there. There was also a level 30 or so alliance paladin there who was effortlessly killing us off in waves; every few minutes he'd heal himself to full with one cast, none of us could hit him reliably due to the level difference, and he could kill us in one autoswing of whatever green weapon he had. The difference between WoW and Eve is that 30 newbies in rifters with one warp disruptor between them can take on all kinds of ****. You just need to get your head around the fact that non-consentual pvp is an intended part of Eve, even in empire, and it's not going anywhere. Basic tackling and combat skills are just as essential to your boring hulk character as support skills as learning, capacitor, tanking, fitting, and everything else. Once you find the occasion, or it forces itself upon you, you are pretty much guaranteed to have more fun than whatever carebearing you were doing before if you are prepared and you have the right mindset. You don't have to have 4 year old characters to kill 4 year old characters, and you you don't need t2 ships to kill t2 ships, because this isn't WoW.
Midge Mo'yb Antares Shipyards Vanguard.	Posted - 2009.09.24 11:34:00 - [34] Originally by: Statsministern The only reason i am playing this pile of junk game, is because i don't have anything better to do. Yes, it's sad. The game is definately leaning towards a more imature population. No question about that. The older mature players are allmost gone, they are obviously smarter than us, and have moved on to something better. Game quality has gone way down the **ter. Nerf after nerf. Making the game blob orianted. Sandbox my ass. You sandbox is filled with cat CCP! Also, to all trolls and internet haters. Seriously, stop wasting your time. There is nothing you can say or do to change my mind about this, nor alter the simple fact that i speak the truth. Go ** your selfs! :emotear: WHat more imature, the guys playing there internet spaceships or the guy crying because his pixels got blown up -----------------------------------------------
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2009.09.24 11:37:00 - [35] Originally by: Seth Quantix TBH, wardecs can be fun for you aswel, The balance with eve is that new players en masse are very effective against more experienced targets, so next time, just buy up some cheap t1 frigs and cruisers, fit them with buffer tanks/tackle etc 5 t1 frigs/cruisers can make quite a good little grup, losses are minimal and you get to learn a bit Quote: [the corp OP] was in had 5 members and we where war decced by a corp with 11 members And you can be sure the people wardeccing are synchronizing the time they play so they are on line at the same time. So you can stop spreading the tale of "large group of noobs killing the lone wolf wardeccer" a that is a myth in current EVE. That kind of player select a target weaker in experience and numbers.
Letrange Minmatar Chaosstorm Corporation Apoapsis Multiversal Consortium	Posted - 2009.09.24 11:39:00 - [36] Look, you setup a one man corp. Those aren't very war-dec survivable if you're a newbie. From what you say you've got no real reason to stick around the local area. Take a break, get in a fast frig and wander all over eve. Head to low sec for a while, fit out your frig with IStabs in the lows and it'll be fairly survivable (warps fast enough that unless you get unlucky by appearing right next to an interceptor you should get away from most gatecamps. Since you're solo the'll either chase you into low sec (which in their expensive ships will have the pirates frothing at the mouth). Make them chase you all over the place. If they are just in it for the ****s and giggles, they'll drop the war dec prety quick when they realize the'll have to work and go in dangerous places to go after you. Not to mention spend hundreds of thousands on locator agents. There are 3 ways to end a wardec: 1) Pound on them untill they go away (they chewed off more than they could handle) 2) out-isk them untill they go away (cheap ship vs expensive ships - a few kills and you can loose fleets and still come out ahead) 3) bore them to tears. High sec griefer corps are like loud dogs, if you don't get tree'ed in a station they are usually relatively in-effective. Other option: switch places with your alt. Put your alt in charge of the corp and drop to the noob corp for a few days and let them camp your alt. The whole trick is not to present them with the target they want to go after. Be inventive.
Demeterus Caldari	Posted - 2009.09.24 11:41:00 - [37] Edited by: Demeterus on 24/09/2009 11:44:50 Quote: I agree that this is one of the things that make eve great, but in contrast to that it is not skill points that make the difference it is experience, also yea roaming gangs of frigates can be quite hardcore (I have participated in a few roams on an alt of mine, it is great fun) the problem comes when you are on your own.... To be perfectly brutal and honest, the players that wardecc newb corps in empire are not exactly the cream of the crop in this game. They may have the sp's, but they are noobs. And I mean that in the true sense about their mentality and their experience. They're not going to be much of a problem if you fight back. Chances are that they, like their real life equivalents the schoolyard bully, will go find someone that doesn't fight back when you do. They may whine on the forums though. And yes, alone, a new player will always be at risk. But Eve isn't a game for the solo player, really. Yes, there are great players that solo - be it pirating or others - but the game is created to be social. So you need to integrate with other players to get ahead. Which is why you formed your corp in the first place. Just realize that your gang of miners or missioners can also be a gang of fighters, and that self-defence is a key part of the game experience. --- Wtf happened to my sig now?
Serge Bastana Gallente GWA Corp	Posted - 2009.09.24 11:49:00 - [38] Edited by: Serge Bastana on 24/09/2009 11:49:36 Edited by: Serge Bastana on 24/09/2009 11:49:16 I joined a corp only a few weeks after I started playing, I hadn't lost the 100% training bonus when I took their pvp basic course, which was followed by a roam into null sec, a gang of 30 frigates piloted by newbies. We got out to the boundary system between low and null sec and our two scouts reported a big old gate camp waiting on the other side just before they reported their ships and pods had been melted. Our FC, an experienced 0.0 pilot, laid it on the line, telling us that we would probably get popped if we jumped, so he gave us the choice to head back to empire or jump into the hell that was waiting on the other side of the gate. We decided to jump, we'd come on the roam hoping for a fight, and there was one waiting for us. I think the guys in the gate camp were pretty taken aback when 30 frigs came steaming through the gate, we saw several battleships making a quick exit. Then hell did break loose as our FC called primary on a Huginn. 30 of us melted the thing in pretty short order, something that surprised me. And when a Brutix went down just as fast I realised just how powerful a small frig fleet like that could be. We all got popped and sent home to our med clones, but for the first ever pvp experience, I was buzzing and somewhat enlightened to the possibilities. ------------------------------------------------ You either need a punch up the throat or a good shag. Nobody round here is offering the second one therefore your choices are limited!
Dodgy Past Amarr Freelance Tax Inspectors	Posted - 2009.09.24 12:34:00 - [39] Edited by: Dodgy Past on 24/09/2009 12:42:28 Originally by: Washell Olivaw So no, I don't think EVE is leaning more towards a pirate/ganking playstyle. As for being decced by "more experienced" players, they're not going to tell you they're pvp incompetents trying to get easy money. Don't believe their "Me big & strong" chest bashing until they've proven it in combat. You might even enjoy yourself in the process. If you fight back and link a killboard that shows all the expensive toys that were ganked by noobs it tends to stop any repeat problems. Nothing upsets these guys more than knowing that people might well see their failures enshrined on Battleclinic. Originally by: Venkul Mul And you can be sure the people wardeccing are synchronizing the time they play so they are on line at the same time. So you can stop spreading the tale of "large group of noobs killing the lone wolf wardeccer" a that is a myth in current EVE. That kind of player select a target weaker in experience and numbers. True if you let them come to you, but if you dock up when they can overpower and then go find them when they're carebearing or hassling others you can pick off stragglers. ( locator agents ftw ). Also they'll tend to be deccing other people so check their active wars and contact the other corps they're trying to grief. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Miraqu Caldari Marquie-X Corp Atropos.	Posted - 2009.09.24 12:44:00 - [40] Ganking hasn't really changed at all. Maybe suiciding is even a bit down because of the Concord buff. But, whenever I am in empire, I see lots and lots of cheap T1 indies hauling rather expensive stuff. A good portion of them even flying per autopilot. When later looking at the killboards, most of them were even completely untanked. A single cheap ship will usually suffice to pop that untanked industrial and the pilots should be ashamed about their own stupidity instead of whining. Though granted, that a properly tanked T2 Transport will pop eventually but it takes a lot more ships and better skilled pilots to do so. Not to mention that a properly flown and fitted blockade runner reduces the chance of getting ganked to a negligible margin. ---------------------------------------------------- Noobcorp deccing was always in eve and its still there. Not everybody who considers her/himself a PvPer is necessarily a good or even decent one. Quite the contrary in some cases. But nevertheless it is fun for them to make war on a newbie corp. On the other hand if these newbies would have used all available resources, checked out possible corps and and talked to them, they would have probably found a nice and friendly corp which doesn't get a wardec the very day they would join up. But: - everybody wants to be CEO - nobody wants to take orders - many are just lazy - some are even stupid - most are greedy - a few already know everything - quite a handful don't think about their actions beforehand So they make a corp, get 'decced and whine on the forums about how unfriendly eve is to new players, that everyone is a griefer/ganker/moron and.

Wild Rho Amarr Sniggerdly	Posted - 2009.09.24 12:55:00 - [41] An alternative is to find a WH system with a link to high sec and move in until the war is over. It'll take a bit of practice and cooperation but you can easily make a living in there and the odds for the war deccing corp finding you are pretty slim.
Serge Bastana Gallente GWA Corp	Posted - 2009.09.24 13:03:00 - [42] It's possibly a case of seeing more posts on the forums about gankings, but since the population of EvE has increased so have the number of people who can post on the forums. It's similar to the natural disasters around the world, there may not be more natural disasters, it's just that the worlds population has increased and some have chosen to live in areas where such things happen. so when they do occur more people are affected. ------------------------------------------------ You either need a punch up the throat or a good shag. Nobody round here is offering the second one therefore your choices are limited!
Flynn Fetladral Caldari BlackSite Prophecy	Posted - 2009.09.24 13:05:00 - [43] Originally by: baltec1 Originally by: Statsministern The only reason i am playing this pile of junk game, is because i don't have anything better to do. Yes, it's sad. The game is definately leaning towards a more imature population. No question about that. The older mature players are allmost gone, they are obviously smarter than us, and have moved on to something better. Game quality has gone way down the **ter. Nerf after nerf. Making the game blob orianted. Sandbox my ass. You sandbox is filled with cat CCP! Also, to all trolls and internet haters. Seriously, stop wasting your time. There is nothing you can say or do to change my mind about this, nor alter the simple fact that i speak the truth. Go ** your selfs! So quit if you dont like it. If you happen to go to WoW then you will be rasing the IQ of both games. loller :D
DrJ Zoidberg Heretic Army Heretic Nation	Posted - 2009.09.24 13:09:00 - [44] It's just the opposite, gankers and pirates are declining, forum whining carebears are rapidly increasing. It's not unlike real life media, violent crime has decreased 15% in the last 10 years, but media coverage of violent crime has increased 600%. The forums are hardly an accurate pole of the eve populous.
Jastra Gallente Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance	Posted - 2009.09.24 13:13:00 - [45] Originally by: Serge Bastana Edited by: Serge Bastana on 24/09/2009 11:49:36 Edited by: Serge Bastana on 24/09/2009 11:49:16 I joined a corp only a few weeks after I started playing, I hadn't lost the 100% training bonus when I took their pvp basic course, which was followed by a roam into null sec, a gang of 30 frigates piloted by newbies. We got out to the boundary system between low and null sec and our two scouts reported a big old gate camp waiting on the other side just before they reported their ships and pods had been melted. Our FC, an experienced 0.0 pilot, laid it on the line, telling us that we would probably get popped if we jumped, so he gave us the choice to head back to empire or jump into the hell that was waiting on the other side of the gate. We decided to jump, we'd come on the roam hoping for a fight, and there was one waiting for us. I think the guys in the gate camp were pretty taken aback when 30 frigs came steaming through the gate, we saw several battleships making a quick exit. Then hell did break loose as our FC called primary on a Huginn. 30 of us melted the thing in pretty short order, something that surprised me. And when a Brutix went down just as fast I realised just how powerful a small frig fleet like that could be. We all got popped and sent home to our med clones, but for the first ever pvp experience, I was buzzing and somewhat enlightened to the possibilities. small frig fleet combat with a good sized gang is awesome fun, and you need almost no skills to do it (in fact my new char got given all the skills and the ship you need during the tutorial) if you aim to take some space and keep it frigate gangs might not be your choice but for having a laugh with your mates, with the realistic probability of killing stuff a lot bigger than you and not caring if you get popped cos a t1 frigate costs nothing then you can have a lot of fun in this game that way If you dont believe me sign up for agony basic, played for 4 years and those few hours spent on agony basic were amongst the most memorable and fun. _ _ _
Seth Quantix Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2009.09.24 13:15:00 - [46] what you should do aswel, is have their nice tasty t2 ships chase your cheap frigate to rancer, its always camped, ul prolly escape, but they wont, the pirates there will start having orgasms about the whole thing and blow up as much as possible, its what i used to do when i was newbie/outclassed, its a cheap trick, but effective, all about knowing your surroundings, pirate camps have their uses, and the wardec will soon enough go away if you do that a few times. ----------------------------------------------- The NC final solution: Quote: rawr-vuk-lau: can we set BoB blue so we can kill Tri together?
Kara Mitsui The New Era Huzzah Federation	Posted - 2009.09.24 13:18:00 - [47] Everyone feels like the game is different now compared to when they started, and they will always feel that there's more of what they don't like and less of what they do. Same is true of pirates and miners alike. In reality, the proportions of people engaged in each type of activity hasn't really changed much at all, and won't unless they make some truly dramatic changes to the game. People have moaned about pirate since the first guy camped a gate in rancer. Pirates have whined about NPC corps since the privateers was just a glint in someone's eye. This is Eve, it's always been like this. Anyway, on topic - it seems to me that there are a lot of corps like this that end up folding due to wardecs, where they shouldn't but they just don't know how to fight. Most of the time these corps can't afford mercenaries, and they are keen to fight, but they are just inexperienced. There is probably a market for 'FC for hire'. These corps just need one person to lead them, not a whole mercenary corp. It would actually be ideal for people who don't get an opportunity to FC in their own corps because ther are so many experienced leaders. If I was still playing regularly I'd probably think about creating such a service, it would be a lot of fun leading a team of idiots against a bunch of arrogant a$$hole station campers...
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative.	Posted - 2009.09.24 13:18:00 - [48] To all those saying that hi-sec wardec artists are noobs, terrible PvPers, can't cut it in 0.0, cowards, etc... ...what does that say about the corps who lose to them?
Seth Quantix Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2009.09.24 13:25:00 - [49] oh and lookup the corp called eve university, some of the games best pvp'rs learned there, they love taking in new guys and girls, teaching them about combat mechanics and like, the teachers are all experienced, and they take you out in frig gangs etc, theres sommet to be said about 30 blood thirsty noobs in frigates, its fun and you will enjoy it plus you will learn about pvp and war decs, you will learn how to FC (Fleet Commander) dont run from it all, learn from it, make friends etc. ----------------------------------------------- The NC final solution: Quote: rawr-vuk-lau: can we set BoB blue so we can kill Tri together?
Kahega Amielden Minmatar Suddenly Ninjas	Posted - 2009.09.24 13:36:00 - [50] It's funny, OP. Suddenly Ninjas is pretty much permadecced these days (we've been in the current war for over a month. Somehow, despite the fact that many SN members are newer players, they manage not to emoragequit and complain on the forums. Find a less fail corp.

Blade Murderhorn Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.09.24 13:56:00 - [51] All excellent advise if I do say so my self, I have a couple of Alts in alliances and agree that a good fleet of rifters is just awesome! The problem I really had with the original war dec was that although there where 5 of us in the corp only 2 of us where real active players if you see what i mean :p If I had more players I would have got a gang together and gone for that command ship! it would have made a great killmail, either way some good info in this thread thanks! Cheers Blade ------------------------------------------- "The Master at being Podded...." Maby one day Revenge!
Ana Vyr	Posted - 2009.09.24 14:27:00 - [52] I think that PvP in nullsec has become so onerous in terms of the amount of hassles you have to deal with in alliances, that many PvP oriented players who can't get a decent foothold in 0.0 are resorting to this sort of thing. The solution, to me, is to make lowsec the small gang/solo PvP zone somehow. CCP needs to put some kind of irresistable incentive in lowsec to get the empire huggers out there. This empire war garbage is just sad.
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative.	Posted - 2009.09.24 14:33:00 - [53] Originally by: Ana Vyr I think that PvP in nullsec has become so onerous in terms of the amount of hassles you have to deal with in alliances, that many PvP oriented players who can't get a decent foothold in 0.0 are resorting to this sort of thing. The solution, to me, is to make lowsec the small gang/solo PvP zone somehow. CCP needs to put some kind of irresistable incentive in lowsec to get the empire huggers out there. This empire war garbage is just sad. CCP added 2500 systems of W-space for exactly this kind of thing. It's everything the "bored 0.0 PvPers" said they wanted; no sov, no hot drops, no local, lots of rats, lots of exploration, no blobs, no bubblecamped chokepoints. Over two thousand systems:- bigger than hi-sec and lo-sec combined. What more are they supposed to do?
Ana Vyr	Posted - 2009.09.24 14:38:00 - [54] That's a good point. I personally love wormhole space, but I rarely see anyone else there. You can make decent ISK in just a solo Drake out there in class 1, 2 and 3 w-space. I find it hard to believe that the scanning required is that much of a disinsentive to go out there. Sure beats grinding missions. Do you think that folks actually LIKE this "pick on helpless newbs in cages" thing that goes on in high sec? Sounds pretty boring to me.
Demeterus Caldari	Posted - 2009.09.24 14:44:00 - [55] Originally by: Malcanis To all those saying that hi-sec wardec artists are noobs, terrible PvPers, can't cut it in 0.0, cowards, etc... ...what does that say about the corps who lose to them? Doesn't say much at all if a bunch of new players in a newb corp lose to an outfit with multiple 5-10+ m sp players, but the other way around is however very, very telling. --- Wtf happened to my sig now?
Saartje Sarel	Posted - 2009.09.24 14:54:00 - [56] To the op: The reason for this is pretty simple really. 0.0 has entered a state of total stagnation in conjunction with two simple truths about the high sec palava: 1. Mining is no longer anywhere near as profitable as mission farming and 2. Mission farming gives you guns, some skills and makes you want to claw your eyes about after about 5 days. The natural progression from there, since everything else in eve requires months of skills training and/or a billion isk to get good at or actually profit from, is griefing. QED.
Captain Vampire	Posted - 2009.09.24 14:55:00 - [57] EvE has definitely changed over the years. It is far more "elitist" now than 2-3 years ago. I remember the times when a single Vagabond really scared me ****less. These days, anyone not flying HACs or T2s are considered newbs. I guess it is the nature of this kind of game play. EvE seems to water out the casual and semi hardcore, leaving PvP, in particular 0.0, but also in general, in the hands of the most dedicated and diehard players. And some of these, eventually realize they're not they're not better than their fellow elitist, and decided to bite off the new guys. I'm one of those. Heck, PvP was my main income for almost a year, I made billions of it. Now, finding and tackling a faction fitted BS in a 0.0 belt is just an old dream. I don't whine tho. It is all a part of the game. Adapt or die. And in EvE, the best players adapt and the worst quit. In the end, we're all going to be either hardcore or noobs.
Daemonspirit An Android Lust	Posted - 2009.09.24 15:01:00 - [58] To the OP - You have Pvp alts? In other corps? C'mon! Tell your other corps that you have some safe pvp for them! Anyone w/out rolls could have been dropped from their corp, and in yours in minutes after they arrive in your home/neighboring system. A command ship, two cruisers and a frig? - 6 Cruisers and they would have been crying in their wheaties. Wardec ends, everyone goes back to where they come from - end of story. OP sounds like a troll on the NPC taxing thingy/change. 4/10 - you let too much information out (I know about clones, pvp alts, other corps) - so i DOUBT "you" are a complete n00b. Originally by: baltec1 Originally by: Statsministern blather So quit if you dont like it. If you happen to go to WoW then you will be rasing the IQ of both games. DHAM! Good burn! ôEveryone has a right to be stupid; some people just abuse the privilege.ö
Professor Tarantula Hedion University	Posted - 2009.09.24 15:26:00 - [59] Edited by: Professor Tarantula on 24/09/2009 15:30:48 It's always been this way. I can remember a person agressively trying to bait me with a can when i was a noob doing a mission 4 years ago. I saw them enter stealth, and went to the can anyway to see what was in it, just to get them excited. It was a POS component of some type. The game could use a better security system, or a more effective bounty system. I had a L4 storyline completely ruined by a couple people when they stole the item i needed along with everything else, and i had to take the standing hit. And don't say i should have attacked them, they wanted me to, and were goading me on to agress so they could wreck me with god knows what was stealthed or ready to warp in. As it is right now, criminals have the advantage, and this has alot to do with it being the most popular career.
Dramaticus GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.09.24 15:38:00 - [60] with any luck, yes. Please don't use RL pictuers of players in Sig without permission. - WeatherMan



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