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baltec1
Antares Shipyards Vanguard.
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Posted - 2009.09.25 22:50:00 -
[31]
Edited by: baltec1 on 25/09/2009 22:50:21
Originally by: Blane Xero
Originally by: baltec1
Originally by: Resire Honore Just an information, even in '"' as you propably see.
Anyone else just think of Jenny Spitfire when trying to read this?
Jenny spitfire Could spell a whole lot better. It was more of a grammar issue there
One of them at least used the wrong words
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2009.09.25 22:51:00 -
[32]
Assuming for a second this is NOT a troll (and my "common sense" is tingling on that one... nobody can be THAT idiotic and reach such a position of power in EVE, or can it?), the player formerly known as "X" got exactly what he deserved for being an utter tool. Oh, and "Y" should have kept all the stuff as punishment for "X" being a moron that gives so many rights to random newbies.
But since this is almost certainly a troll, I'm going to say : "3/10 : Almost believable, but not controversial enough"
_
Info about our corp | Beginer's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper |
Jin Nib
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Posted - 2009.09.25 22:51:00 -
[33]
I thought the IEEE was supposed to handle things like this... Joe is getting old and this looks to be good material. Slackers :P. -Jin Nib Trading on behalf of Opera Noir since: 2009.03.02 03:53:00
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Cpt Branko
The Scope
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Posted - 2009.09.25 22:55:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Cpt Branko on 25/09/2009 22:55:39
Originally by: Janusz Rvn Some of my friends were playing in EVE, a lootà Over 3 years of playing and paying. ThatÆs was an honest and trustfully characterà LetÆs name his ôXö. Them in his corporation (where hi was a one of oldest and important players), join noob, lets name his ôYö. As a helpful person ôXö help younger mate as hi canà infoÆs, skills, even borrowing of own stuff. Some time later, corp bosses discovered that ôYö uses boots to play on one of his altà so by the corp rules alt was expelled for a corp. sad storyà but this is only a beginning. After thatÆs incident, ôYö felt himself very resentful û ônobody can tell my how I should play!ö. Normal player in situation like this leaving corp, and find more accurate companionà But ôYö has an other idea of ôrulesö. He took a loot of BPO for corp hangars, put offline couple POSÆes (2 in middle of production mother ships), stole POS parts, BPO and anything what hi can. Most of BPO was owned by ôXö (All of them worth over 25B ISK), so ôXö use his skill (using known e-mail) to check who hi is, and send to him information, some like this: ôYou not anonymous in net. You name is ôXö and you live at ôX û homeö, so please give my BPO backö. ôYö returned all (or almost all û cause hi canÆt return minerals and parts for 2 Nyxs) to ôXö. All problems solvedà Not reallyà Here is CCPà After couple daysà All ôXö account was bannedà Reason ôBraking EULA rulesöà ThatÆs was all available informationÆs. So ôXö write an e-mail to CCP: ôWhatÆs happened?öà And receive answer: ôOne of player (supposable ôYö) told us you treat him in RL so hi must give you all his BPOö.
So ôXö lost 4 characters (all of them with over a 50 mil SP) because ôone of playeràö. CCP donÆt even try do explain situation or inform one of conflict sides about incident. They KNOW whatÆs heapend, maybe ôYö was a CEO of CCP or maybe his uncle is a cleaner on second floor on main CCP building? Who knows? Only one thing is solid, ôYö told a truth and only truth.
IÆm old player too, my main char has over 70m sp, and I play and pay over 3 years. As I suppose, based on CCP GMÆs rules my account will be banned to, after thatÆs post, but IÆm not sorry. If in this community thieves and layerÆs doing by the ôrulesöà I should seek accurate companion.
Assuming this is not trolling: (a) You gave a newbie roles to do all that? Why? Also, when you want to boot someone you first remove the roles and then boot him. (b) You do not, ever, in any cirrumstances, utter something which resembles a RL threat. It's the banstick for that. (c) When someone is using bots on a alt, you can petition him for that, and he'll get the ban himself.
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Fitz VonHeise
Eye Bee Em
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Posted - 2009.09.26 01:24:00 -
[35]
I think peopl are missing the Op's point.
What did CCP do to make sure that X actually DID send said email and threaten to do harm to Y in real life?
If they just took Y's word for it then that is plan wrong. And if it was an email sent from some random name (which most people have) what is to say that Y didn't make up a yahoo name and send to himself a threating email to frame X and get him banned?
You do see how this could be missused? How did CCP prove that X sent it?
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Fitz VonHeise
Eye Bee Em
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Posted - 2009.09.26 01:37:00 -
[36]
As far fetched as this may sound.
Maybe Y thought up this plan of getting X banned AND getting his stuff back as theft in Eve is legal and CCP might have given all those BPO's back after the ban. CCP might think, "Y must be innocent because he did give all those BPO's back after he got the threatening email."
The point is that in RL you are presumed innocent until proven guilty.
Maybe X really did do it. But unless CCP really did have iron clad proof, if I were X, I would push this all the way to the CEO of CCP and tell them give me back my characters.
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Zartanic
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Posted - 2009.09.26 01:50:00 -
[37]
Edited by: Zartanic on 26/09/2009 01:56:02
Originally by: Fitz VonHeise As far fetched as this may sound.
Maybe Y thought up this plan of getting X banned AND getting his stuff back as theft in Eve is legal and CCP might have given all those BPO's back after the ban. CCP might think, "Y must be innocent because he did give all those BPO's back after he got the threatening email."
The point is that in RL you are presumed innocent until proven guilty.
Maybe X really did do it. But unless CCP really did have iron clad proof, if I were X, I would push this all the way to the CEO of CCP and tell them give me back my characters.
This is nothing to do with corp theft or giving back BPO's or anything of that nature. That's all totally irrelevant. Its to do with X making a RL threat which is apparent from what was said in the Ops post. They admitted it. That's a bannable offence no matter what the reason even if Y planned it that way.
Its a very easy decision for CCP to make as the circumstances are irrelevant. The only relevant part of the Ops post is...'so ôXö use his skill (using known e-mail) to check who hi is, and send to him information, some like this: ôYou not anonymous in net. You name is ôXö and you live at ôX û homeö, so please give my BPO backö.'
But I call troll too as no one gives that sort of access to a new character, 4/10. All good trolls give a hint as in 'good-fellow' in the subject line.
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Obsidian Hawk
RONA Corporation
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Posted - 2009.09.26 01:59:00 -
[38]
i stopped reading after i saw all the bad formatting. use justified please. --------------------------
WTB a sig, or moderation of my sig by all the hot CCP girls. |
Yakia TovilToba
Halliburton Inc.
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Posted - 2009.09.26 03:00:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Janusz Rvn Them in his corporation (where hi was a one of oldest and important players), join noob, lets name his ôYö.
....
But ôYö has an other idea of ôrulesö. He took a loot of BPO for corp hangars, put offline couple POSÆes (2 in middle of production mother ships), stole POS parts, BPO and anything what hi can. Most of BPO was owned by ôXö (All of them worth over 25B ISK)
This is the part where X and the corp did a mistake. Giving a "noob" that joined the corp recently the chance to steal and offline all that stuff. Don't give so much power to new people in your corp, or anyone that you don't know very good. It was a matter of time till someone would rob you. Take your ban as a lesson, don't trust anyone and read the EULA+ToS, that helps you to stay within the rules if you really like to ruine someones gameplay.
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Zodiaq
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.09.27 03:20:00 -
[40]
You guys don't get it - this is big misunderstanding and You see this all wrong, proly in worst possible way... sadly GMs see this same way... when my friend wrote 'You not anonymous in net. You name is “Y” and you live at “Y – home' he didn't mean 'your name is Y and you live here so as we know where u live we can get you' but he meant 'your name is Y you live HERE and start acting as grown person, what u did affected other peoples work, don't act as child happy to get other ppl suffer, bu as coworker who's actions affect other people'. This is all big misunderstanding! Think of it a moment - if he wanted to threaten person Y he would have done it REALLY anonymously as he is IT specialist, and he knows all information on Internet can be traced specially if sent in game or via communicators... but that wasn't his intention! He just wanted Y to start acting like grown man, as this game encourages such people to play it and have fun (average age of players is higher than games like WoW or such). I hope that CCP can see what my friend really meant and fix all this - permanent ban for misunderstanding is very extreme action. Many months of hard team work to be lost.
PTF - Zodiaq
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Neci Maren
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Posted - 2009.09.27 03:25:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Zodiaq You guys don't get it - this is big misunderstanding and You see this all wrong, proly in worst possible way... sadly GMs see this same way... when my friend wrote 'You not anonymous in net. You name is ôYö and you live at ôY û home' he didn't mean 'your name is Y and you live here so as we know where u live we can get you' but he meant 'your name is Y you live HERE and start acting as grown person, what u did affected other peoples work, don't act as child happy to get other ppl suffer, bu as coworker who's actions affect other people'. This is all big misunderstanding! Think of it a moment - if he wanted to threaten person Y he would have done it REALLY anonymously as he is IT specialist, and he knows all information on Internet can be traced specially if sent in game or via communicators... but that wasn't his intention! He just wanted Y to start acting like grown man, as this game encourages such people to play it and have fun (average age of players is higher than games like WoW or such). I hope that CCP can see what my friend really meant and fix all this - permanent ban for misunderstanding is very extreme action. Many months of hard team work to be lost.
PTF - Zodiaq
You don't bring Real Life into a game. He went and got this person's name with the intent of having him act mature in this situation. That is unacceptable. It is a threat.
It isn't a misunderstanding, it is a violation of the EULA. Your friend's ban will stick and stay stuck because he violated the rules of this game.
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Serge Bastana
Gallente GWA Corp
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Posted - 2009.09.27 03:40:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Serge Bastana on 27/09/2009 03:41:07 No sorry mate, I say *******s, knowing someone's real name is one thing, I discovered another player's name on a website that had his eve character listed, that was publicly displayed, but what I didn't do is then go and find out his home address and start telling him that I had this information.
Doesn't really matter if the claim is that it was a message to grow up, there is an implied threat there when you go to the effort of uncovering that information. That's where it all goes wrong.
The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Now walk it.
------------------------------------------------ You either need a punch up the throat or a good shag.
Nobody round here is offering the second one therefore your choices are limited! |
Fortunate Star
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Posted - 2009.09.27 03:50:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Fitz VonHeise As far fetched as this may sound. The point is that in RL you are presumed innocent until proven guilty.
Maybe X really did do it. But unless CCP really did have iron clad proof, if I were X, I would push this all the way to the CEO of CCP and tell them give me back my characters.
You dont own "your" characters or anything in game. CCP does. CCP never have to give anyone anything in game.
They could decide arbitrarily to nuke your character for no reason whatsoever and there is nothing you could ever do about it. |
WhiteSavage
Gallente Ever Flow
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Posted - 2009.09.27 04:05:00 -
[44]
Did he threaten the thief or just say hey this is where u live? And either way how did the thief prove anything>? unless the conversation was ingame.
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Zodiaq
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.09.27 06:35:00 -
[45]
Originally by: WhiteSavage Did he threaten the thief or just say hey this is where u live? And either way how did the thief prove anything>? unless the conversation was ingame.
He just said where Y lives, there was not other intentions than what I've already written. No threats, no insulting, and my friend meant no harm - conversation was personal and no other ppl were informed about address. CCP is overreacting - as I said what was my friend's intentions, CCP permanently baned his accounts, destroying many months of OUR team work. I know they can do that to anyone, but would anyone be happy when they do such thing to him? Many people in our alliance know person X well, we have met personally in real life on our few gatherings and I honestly can say he is calm person (playing eve mainly as industrialist), not type of thug, and CCP made him a big harm... we are loosing our friend here all because of misunderstanding!
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Joe Skellington
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.09.27 08:17:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Zodiaq
Originally by: WhiteSavage Did he threaten the thief or just say hey this is where u live? And either way how did the thief prove anything>? unless the conversation was ingame.
He just said where Y lives, there was not other intentions than what I've already written. No threats, no insulting, and my friend meant no harm - conversation was personal and no other ppl were informed about address. CCP is overreacting - as I said what was my friend's intentions, CCP permanently baned his accounts, destroying many months of OUR team work. I know they can do that to anyone, but would anyone be happy when they do such thing to him? Many people in our alliance know person X well, we have met personally in real life on our few gatherings and I honestly can say he is calm person (playing eve mainly as industrialist), not type of thug, and CCP made him a big harm... we are loosing our friend here all because of misunderstanding!
Have your friend petition someone with higher authority, I'm sure they will work it out.
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Nika Dekaia
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Posted - 2009.09.27 08:23:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Zodiaq He just said where Y lives, there was not other intentions than what I've already written. No threats, no insulting, and my friend meant no harm - conversation was personal and no other ppl were informed about address. CCP is overreacting - as I said what was my friend's intentions, CCP permanently baned his accounts, destroying many months of OUR team work. I know they can do that to anyone, but would anyone be happy when they do such thing to him? Many people in our alliance know person X well, we have met personally in real life on our few gatherings and I honestly can say he is calm person (playing eve mainly as industrialist), not type of thug, and CCP made him a big harm... we are loosing our friend here all because of misunderstanding!
There is NO MISUNDERSTANDING what so ever.
It was your fault when giving him the rights in the first place. You then faild to remove those rights before telling him he would be kicked.
You then got his RL information. Doing so and using the information to make him give back the items is very much blackmailing. Whether the thread was explicit spoken out or not is irrelevant. The potential of RL threads alone is enough.
And if the proof (your friends email) was checked and verified by the GM is obsolete NOW since you gave proof yourself.
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Joe
Umbra Legion Shadow Empire.
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Posted - 2009.09.27 08:30:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Mavvaz How do you expect anyone to read this?
Eve is a multicultural game, and whatever country the Op's from, I think he was able to get the story across. Exactly how many languages are you fluent in mate?
To the OP: your friend screwed up, thereÆs no reason to feel like a victim or think that the same is going to happen to you, unless your breaking the same basic rules of game play.
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Sani Oska
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Posted - 2009.09.27 08:45:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Zodiaq
Originally by: WhiteSavage Did he threaten the thief or just say hey this is where u live? And either way how did the thief prove anything>? unless the conversation was ingame.
He just said where Y lives, there was not other intentions than what I've already written. No threats, no insulting, and my friend meant no harm - conversation was personal and no other ppl were informed about address. CCP is overreacting - as I said what was my friend's intentions, CCP permanently baned his accounts, destroying many months of OUR team work. I know they can do that to anyone, but would anyone be happy when they do such thing to him? Many people in our alliance know person X well, we have met personally in real life on our few gatherings and I honestly can say he is calm person (playing eve mainly as industrialist), not type of thug, and CCP made him a big harm... we are loosing our friend here all because of misunderstanding!
If X is not a thug then why did he need to look up real life information on Y? What purpose did this exercise serve? Start acting like a man or what? Why do you think Y gave back stuff when X told him he knows his real life info?
Quite obvious it is blackmail. There is no place for that in this game. Tell all of your friends and corpmates to read EULA very carefully so that more months of your teamwork will not go down the drain if they suddenly decide to start blackmailing each other.
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Malthros Zenobia
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Posted - 2009.09.27 10:05:00 -
[50]
The text is horrible but if I'm reading right, a newbie joins your corp, you apparently give them a ton of access. They use said access to take items and disrupt operations then they leave with all their loot. Your friend then sends them a message basically saying "I know who you are and where you live, give it back", which most people will see as a threat against their well being, and the person's banned for making RL threats?
Your corp needs to control its roles better. I am amazed that a corp with those assets, and that apparently does supercap production, would give that level of access to a new player.
Originally by: kieron The Carrier was never intended to be a solo OMGWTF mission-farming PWNmobile.
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Malthros Zenobia
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Posted - 2009.09.27 10:13:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Blane Xero
Originally by: baltec1
Originally by: Resire Honore Just an information, even in '"' as you propably see.
Anyone else just think of Jenny Spitfire when trying to read this?
Jenny spitfire Could spell a whole lot better. It was more of a grammar issue there
Jenny also did it on purpose to get attention, just like the Vaga BPO thing a few years ago.
Originally by: kieron The Carrier was never intended to be a solo OMGWTF mission-farming PWNmobile.
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Merovee
Amarr Gorthaur Legion
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Posted - 2009.09.27 10:26:00 -
[52]
good fella = gets whacked by ccp = Of Mordor
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Doddy
The Executives IT Alliance
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Posted - 2009.09.27 10:36:00 -
[53]
Why did you kick the alt and not the main? thats just plain stupid. Why did a noob have access to nyx parts anyway? And yeah RL threats = bannage pure and simple.
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Doddy
The Executives IT Alliance
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Posted - 2009.09.27 10:41:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Fitz VonHeise I think peopl are missing the Op's point.
What did CCP do to make sure that X actually DID send said email and threaten to do harm to Y in real life?
If they just took Y's word for it then that is plan wrong. And if it was an email sent from some random name (which most people have) what is to say that Y didn't make up a yahoo name and send to himself a threating email to frame X and get him banned?
You do see how this could be missused? How did CCP prove that X sent it?
I would imagine its the same email address as the eve account is tied to tbh, fairly straight forward.
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Esk Esme
Caldari Perkone
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Posted - 2009.09.27 10:58:00 -
[55]
threatning in R.L over a game wich is only pixels is just stupid deserved to be band
on side note i hope he went to his house and got his own head kicked it coz worse thing some1 could do in R.L is knock my door with attatude theyd find a lump hammer straight in they head
so all in all a ban was getting off lightly
my spelling sux so sue me
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Landrassa
Friendly Neighbourhood Extortion Company
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Posted - 2009.09.27 11:08:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Sani Oska Edited by: Sani Oska on 25/09/2009 22:19:30 Your friend X had 4 characters with 50 mil skill points each and he did not know that finding real life information on players and using that to coerce them to give you things in game (even if Y is just returning those BPOs) is against the EULA???
Heck, if the threats are serious enough, that might be grounds for actual criminal prosecution. Threatening people in real life is something police officers and judges tend to frown upon, and the fact that it is over something as silly as a bunch of pixels doesn't exactly help X's case either. --------------------------------------------------- Recruitment thread |
Gsptlsnz
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Posted - 2009.09.27 11:36:00 -
[57]
Edited by: Gsptlsnz on 27/09/2009 11:36:58 "We know where you live" is such a common threat it's a cliche in books, films, TV. It's used for its easy deniability - it's not easy for the victim to report it to the police.
But anybody who uses that approach understands the true nature of the communucation.
It just doesn't matter how bad "Y's" in-game behavior was. It doesn't matter how much RL time the stuff that was stolen represents. It doesn't matter how carefully "X" composed his threat.
CCP had no real choice in how they could react.
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Babel
Boom and Bust Economics Ltd. N0thing To See Here
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Posted - 2009.09.27 11:42:00 -
[58]
If I received a message telling me 'You are not anonymous, Your name is *YYYY*, You live at *ADDRESS* - please return what you stole' of course I wouldn't interpret that as a potential threat at all .... of course not ... how silly to think such ... inconceivable ...
'Your name is Y you live HERE and start acting as grown person, what u did affected other peoples work, don't act as child happy to get other ppl suffer, but as coworker who's actions affect other people' I would of course interpret the message this way .... any other interpretation is completely out of the question. :) . "Out of the good of evil born, Came Uriel's voice of cherub scorn" |
Another Forum'Alt
Gallente Center for Advanced Studies
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Posted - 2009.09.27 11:48:00 -
[59]
Corp theft is legit. you let this guy have access to all your BPOs? Please tell me your corp name so I can join
Making IRL threats is against the EULA, try reading it some time. It WILL get you permabanhammered as it should. (see: Ginger Magician) BECAUSE OF FALCON. Guide to forum posting |
Splinter McIron
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Posted - 2009.09.27 11:49:00 -
[60]
There are consequences to being a bad person. Being hunted down and beaten to near death/death for actions in a game might just be one of them. It is really a good idea to think before you act, just how motivated is the person you are stealing from to defend their goods? You stole something from them in a game, they will steal something from you in RL. Seems fair to me, seeing as you left them no other options.
Without seeing the actual e-mail that was sent, word for word, I cannot say whether CCP took the right action or not, however, I can tell you that X did not take the right action. E-mails can be tracked, showing up on his doorstep or calling him to ask for them back is un-proveable, and far more effective.
-Splinter
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