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BIG and the Triple Titan Lottery

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Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll	Posted - 2009.10.21 10:07:00 - [61] Originally by: MeNoLikee Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha I want the 20 IQ I lost by reading the OP's posts back. You crap on this board all the time. When you give me back my time? post with your main you chicken ****.
MeNoLikee	Posted - 2009.10.21 15:33:00 - [62] Originally by: Ji Sama post with your main you chicken ****. Your an alt and posted this? Why you taking soo personal? I read many posts by you loser game players. VV spend all day posting and playing. You too. You got no life?
Solisk Gallente HyperFang Aquisitions And Logistics New Eden Retail Federation	Posted - 2009.10.21 17:07:00 - [63] Originally by: MeNoLikee Originally by: Ji Sama post with your main you chicken ****. Your an alt and posted this? Why you taking soo personal? I read many posts by you loser game players. VV spend all day posting and playing. You too. You got no life? Anyone else amused by the irony of this?
Dumb Jerk	Posted - 2009.10.21 17:13:00 - [64] Edited by: Dumb Jerk on 21/10/2009 17:14:18 Vherok: you can't have it back. Not yours. Sorry. Ji Sama and MeNoLikee: take your slap fight somewhere else. I was hoping this thread would have some modi****of decorum, but I guess I was hoping for too much. Ji Sama: still don't see 100 tickets purchased. When are you going to get around to getting that straightened out? or at least editing your post on the main BIG thread so that no one gets the wrong impression that you're trying to inflate the numbers. edit: the needlessly censored word is m-o-d-i-c-u-m
Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll	Posted - 2009.10.21 17:27:00 - [65] Damn your not only a dumb jerk, your also stupid. Its out of my court, i transfered the isk, and mailed TS about the mistake, its out of my hands, fact remains i wired 1B for 100 tickets with the reason titan to TS.
Dumb Jerk	Posted - 2009.10.21 17:55:00 - [66] Originally by: Ji Sama Damn your not only a dumb jerk, your also stupid. Its out of my court, i transfered the isk, and mailed TS about the mistake, its out of my hands, fact remains i wired 1B for 100 tickets with the reason titan to TS. Why should I or anyone else believe you? You got caught in a lie. Pony up the dough or admit it already. Also, you've begun to degenerate into pedestrian insults and off topic posts. Can't you do any better?
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Dark-Rising IT Alliance	Posted - 2009.10.21 17:57:00 - [67] Quote: Anyone else amused by the irony of this? I am saddened to say that I work for 9-10 hours a day, so the alt really got nothing right. The fact I have been healing after surgery for 1.5 months (as stated many times) might have been missed by Mr. Exclamation Mark. - Auditing and consulting Before asking for investors, please read http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h and http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
Kalrand Charles Ponzi School of Business GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.10.21 18:28:00 - [68] Originally by: Dumb Jerk Originally by: Ji Sama Damn your not only a dumb jerk, your also stupid. Its out of my court, i transfered the isk, and mailed TS about the mistake, its out of my hands, fact remains i wired 1B for 100 tickets with the reason titan to TS. Why should I or anyone else believe you? You got caught in a lie. Pony up the dough or admit it already. Also, you've begun to degenerate into pedestrian insults and off topic posts. Can't you do any better? this could be settled by having Torn comment on the issue. Otherwise both of you have plausible arguments and need to stop bickering.
Drab Cane Carbenadium Industries	Posted - 2009.10.21 18:54:00 - [69] DJ, hopefully you now have your answer. The majority of replies were of the opinion that as long as the lottery holds to its contract, it is not a scam. You've also heard from TS, stating that the lottery terms were not his decision and that the terms will stand as is. As for the dispute with Ji Sama, I don't understand. Whether Ji has or has not purchased tickets in the lottery has little to do with your original post. I can understand your disappointment - you were no doubt trying to pressure TS into modifying the lottery terms, perhaps even getting your money back. Is there any chance you can sell your tickets to someone else, to recoup your ISK? ----------------------------------------------- - Who Dares, Wins
Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll	Posted - 2009.10.21 18:55:00 - [70] Originally by: Kalrand Originally by: Dumb Jerk Originally by: Ji Sama Damn your not only a dumb jerk, your also stupid. Its out of my court, i transfered the isk, and mailed TS about the mistake, its out of my hands, fact remains i wired 1B for 100 tickets with the reason titan to TS. Why should I or anyone else believe you? You got caught in a lie. Pony up the dough or admit it already. Also, you've begun to degenerate into pedestrian insults and off topic posts. Can't you do any better? this could be settled by having Torn comment on the issue. Otherwise both of you have plausible arguments and need to stop bickering. No, i know what i did, and i have an api log to prove it. He on the other hand is making things up as he goes along.

Dumb Jerk	Posted - 2009.10.21 21:10:00 - [71] Originally by: Drab Cane DJ, hopefully... [reasonable, sane sounding stuff] Thanks for being so calm and reasonable. I have to disagree on one point. Torn has never actually addressed my two questions: what will BIG do if the lottery doesn't sell out in 6 months or 12 months? Despite his comments, these two, simple questions have never been directly addressed. If you read all the stuff I've posted, it's pretty much all I've ever wanted. My aggravation stems less from the loss (cause hey, its a lottery), than from the attitude expressed by Torn and others: that somehow it is remotely reasonable to have a lottery with no deadline for a drawing and to have no real solution 3 months into this. It seems ridiculous to say that somehow it is a titan producer who is responsible for the delay. Is BIG physically incapable of pulling down the post and refunding the money? Has Torn signed some RL contract with a RL player? Does he collect the ISK and give it immediately to the titan producer? (that would be pretty dumb, since there would be no guarantee that the producer actually turns over the titans at the conclusion). It simply makes no sense. Coupled with his statements that say i'm going to do whatever I want, whenever I want, and I'm not going to do anything about the problem, I think it should be obvious why someone would be a little peaked over the whole thing. I suspect that some of the opinions being rendered have more to do with the poster's relationship with BIG than it does about the actual situation. My questions about scams are valid, despite BIG's previous reputation; after all, EBank, DBank, and many other corps have built solid reputations over long periods of time and then turned out to be riddled with theives and schemers. As for the Ji Sama thing, I believe Ji to be an alt of a BIG member or sympathizer who is attempting to prop up the lottery sales by lying about buying a billion ISK worth of tickets. It isn't the buying; its the lying.
Drab Cane Carbenadium Industries	Posted - 2009.10.21 23:59:00 - [72] DJ, just to summarize for you, the titans will not be awarded until all tickets are sold. Even if it takes five years to do so, all tickets must be sold before the titans will be awarded. Those are the terms of the lottery, and apparently TornSoul will not be deviating from those terms. And yeah, in my opinion it seems unfair that the lottery will hold onto the money and the titans indefinitely. But anyone who bought the tickets (hopefully) read those terms and accepted them. You wanted a different answer, but unfortunately that seems to be it. ----------------------------------------------- - Who Dares, Wins
Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll	Posted - 2009.10.22 00:03:00 - [73] Lying about a billion isk wtf? Really, you're an ignorant.
Solisk Gallente HyperFang Aquisitions And Logistics New Eden Retail Federation	Posted - 2009.10.22 00:19:00 - [74] Dumb Jerk: I highly doubt Ji would lie about a billion isk. Also, if you knew anything about him, you'd realize that he has his fingers in just about all of the "major" investments. Usually for a billion or more. Not only that, but he could have easily just NOT bought the 100 tickets and gave a perfectly acceptable excuse why he didn't. Nothing is in stone until isk is sent, regardless of what someone says.
Drab Cane Carbenadium Industries	Posted - 2009.10.22 00:21:00 - [75] DJ, I just found the thread you started under Crime and Punishment. You may not be aware of this, but openly accusing the lottery of being a scam will not encourage more people to buy tickets. Just saying . . . ----------------------------------------------- - Who Dares, Wins
Solisk Gallente HyperFang Aquisitions And Logistics New Eden Retail Federation	Posted - 2009.10.22 00:34:00 - [76] Originally by: Drab Cane DJ, I just found the thread you started under Crime and Punishment. You may not be aware of this, but openly accusing the lottery of being a scam will not encourage more people to buy tickets. Just saying . . . His thread in C&P was in extreme bad taste. It shows just how little class he actually has. I just hope for TornSoul's sake, as well as the ticket holders, that he didn't completely screw his chances of selling the rest of the tickets.
Dumb Jerk	Posted - 2009.10.22 17:47:00 - [77] So. Now its MY fault the tickets won't sell? That's pretty funny. If you had done ALL of your homework, you would have visited the Titan ticket list. There you would see that since I began posting to the BIG thread, this thread, and the day I created the C&P thread, ticket sales have gone UP. Probably because of my incessant nattering (which you all seem to love, so I'm going to give you all I have and more). But let's be frank, shall we? No matter how you do the math, the lottery won't sell out for years at this rate. Drab--I appreciate your reasonable, calm tone and contributions. I hope you won't take it poorly when I say, I don't want an answer from you. I want the answer to my two questions from Torn. Period. All he has to do is answer the two questions. Not you. Not Ji. Not random people. Torn. Again, it's that simple. Ji--glad to see the hundred tickets bought. Now allow me to point something out: the rules are clear, if you don't send the ISK in the proper way, BIG considers it a donation. You didn't send it the right way by your own admission. So, why did you get special treatment? The rules are clear, right? The terms of the contract are clearly stated, the rules are clearly stated, etc., right? But YOU somehow managed to get an exception to the rules. So they are not, in fact, rules at all. The terms can clearly be adjusted at Torn's whim. So, Torn, why don't you adjust the terms for me? Give me my money for the tickets I bought. That could also make me go away. Wouldn't that be nice? Finally, for those of you who persist in saying that this character or that character can be trusted: Prove It. We all live in a world of alts. Unless you've been logging into their accounts, you have no real idea who they are, what other characters they have, or what they are up to. For all I know, all of you are alts of the same person. So quit pretending like trust is for real in this game. Only an idiot would believe it.
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Dark-Rising IT Alliance	Posted - 2009.10.22 17:59:00 - [78] We are all Riethe alts. - Auditing and consulting Before asking for investors, please read http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h and http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll	Posted - 2009.10.22 18:07:00 - [79] "A person is thought to be great souled if he claims much and deserves much... He that claims less than he deserves is small souled... The truly great souled man must be a good man...Greatness of soul seems... a crowning ornament of all the virtues... Great honors accorded by persons of worth will afford pleasure in moderate degree: he will feel he is receiving only what belongs to him, or even less, for no honor can be adequate to the merits of perfect virtue, yet all the same he will deign to accept their honors, because they have no greater tribute to offer him. Honor will be rendered by common people and on trivial grounds he will utterly despise, for this is not what he merits... He therefore to whom even honor is a small thing will be indifferent to other things as well. Hence great souled men are thought to be haughty...The great souled man is justified in despising other people - his estimates are correct; but most proud men have no good ground for their pride... He is fond of conferring benefits, but ashamed to receive them, because the former is a mark of superiority and the latter inferiority. He returns a service done to him with interest, since this will put the original benefactor into his debt in turn, and make him the party benefited. The great souled are said to have a good memory for any benefit they have conferred, but a bad memory for those which they have received...It is also characteristic of the great souled men never to ask help from others, or only with reluctance, but to render aid willingly; and to be haughty towards men of position and fortune, but courteous towards those of moderate station... And to adopt a high manner with the former is not ill-bred, but it is vulgar to lord it over humble people... He shows timidity; and care more for truth than for what people will think;... He is outspoken and frank, except when speaking with ironical self-deprecation, as he does to common people. He will be incapable of living of the will of another, UNLESS A FREIND*, since to do so is slavish... He does not bear a grudge, for it is not the mark of greatness of soul to recall things against people, especially the wrongs they have done you, but rather overlook them. He is... not giving to speaking evil himself, even of his enemies, except when he deliberately intends to give offence... Such then being the great souled man, corresponding character on the side of deficiency is the small souled man, and on that excess the vain man."
Minmatari One	Posted - 2009.10.23 15:54:00 - [80] Originally by: Ji Sama Blah blah blah, heavily edited quote with lots of ellipses If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, then baffle them with bullsh*t.

Claire Voyant	Posted - 2009.10.23 16:01:00 - [81] Originally by: Minmatari One Originally by: Ji Sama Blah blah blah, heavily edited quote with lots of ellipses If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, then baffle them with bullsh*t. That's Aristotle, man, show some respect. The Dude's been dead for 2,330 years, but he still speaks to us today. Um, nevermind, I can't figure out what he's talking about.
Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll	Posted - 2009.10.23 16:02:00 - [82] Originally by: Minmatari One Originally by: Ji Sama Blah blah blah, heavily edited quote with lots of ellipses If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, then baffle them with bullsht. Its Aristotle! You just called his work bull***... Good Job... I agree 100% with the quote i made, and i try to live up to it.
Minmatari One	Posted - 2009.10.23 17:19:00 - [83] Aristotle is awesome. And entirely irrelevant. That is to say, you can't make any really valid argument, so you're going all straw man on OP. Thus, bullsht in this post. If you were trying to make an argument of some sort and you would like to lean on Aristotle, you need to read On Sophistical Refutations* first. Then you might want to consider that Aristotle thought that slavery was both natural and right (Politics and Nicomachean Ethics). Would you say that such a person displays the noble virtues of soul you quote? What irony that you don't recognize that someone could, on the surface, appear to be noble, but, inside, be willing to debase and enslave others for personal gain. See, there's the connection with the argument in this thread. You, a Torn alt (CCP StevieG outed you in the BIG thread btw), appear to be doing something for noble reasons, but, in reality, you are willing to take advantage of others for personal profit and gain. I'm glad I found this thread. It's not often I get to use my philosophy degree. I almost wish I had bought a ticket so I could get all angry about it.
Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll	Posted - 2009.10.23 17:22:00 - [84] Edited by: Ji Sama on 23/10/2009 17:24:19 You failed to read a single quote... Come back when you understand it. It might be a strawman, but its relevant none the less. TS also mentioned some in another post in another thread. Why do people climb mount everest? Because its there. EDIT: Its funny im a TS alt, since i have many vitnesses that can attest to myself talking with TS irl at fanfest, and gankaton etc. And yes i am pretty sure there are pics to prove it aswell :D If any CCP personal has outed me, it is surely a joke!
Aurorae Andromedae	Posted - 2009.10.23 17:51:00 - [85] Originally by: Ji Sama Edited by: Ji Sama on 23/10/2009 17:45:16 Edited by: Ji Sama on 23/10/2009 17:24:19 You failed to read a single quote... Come back when you understand it. It might be a strawman, but its relevant none the less. TS also mentioned some in another post in another thread. Why do people climb mount everest? Because its there. EDIT: Its funny im a TS alt, since i have many vitnesses that can attest to myself talking with TS irl at fanfest, and gankaton etc. And yes i am pretty sure there are pics to prove it aswell :D If any CCP personal has outed me, it is surely a joke! EDIT: It would appear to not be a joke, any idiot with half a brain can see im not TS. Apparently CCP is in short supply of competent moderators. Why do you care so much about this? This thread is a public confirmation for Ji Sama beign TS alt, or TS being Ji Sama's alt. It's quite obvious now.
Minmatari One	Posted - 2009.10.23 17:59:00 - [86] Originally by: Ji Sama You failed to read a single quote... Come back when you understand it. It might be a strawman, but its relevant none the less. LOL. Apparently YOU don't understand the DEFINITION of a straw man argument. BTW I read it twice in college, wrote my junior thesis on Aristotelian logic, wrote my senior english thesis on Aristotelian rhetoric and modern political language, and wrote my senior philosophy thesis on dialectics. Get a grip on yourself. You speak whereof you do not know. Not even close.
Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll	Posted - 2009.10.23 18:00:00 - [87] i care about my reputation. now post with your main. EVE Search
Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll	Posted - 2009.10.23 18:06:00 - [88] Originally by: Minmatari One Originally by: Ji Sama You failed to read a single quote... Come back when you understand it. It might be a strawman, but its relevant none the less. LOL. Apparently YOU don't understand the DEFINITION of a straw man argument. BTW I read it twice in college, wrote my junior thesis on Aristotelian logic, wrote my senior english thesis on Aristotelian rhetoric and modern political language, and wrote my senior philosophy thesis on dialectics. Get a grip on yourself. You speak whereof you do not know. Not even close. I know what a strawman argument is, i also know what a strawman is in general. You didnt major in anything. And if you understood the qoute you wouldnt be making yourself to look like a ******. Its more than relevant.
Aurorae Andromedae	Posted - 2009.10.23 20:43:00 - [89] Edited by: Aurorae Andromedae on 23/10/2009 20:43:52 Originally by: Ji Sama i care about my reputation. now post with your main. EVE Search Your reputation? Your reputation in MD goes down with every post that you post in this thread defending the poor business that TS have done in BIG Titan lottery. Come on, they got the maximum coverage on EVE. ISD news, then after couple days... Nothing. After week, still nothing. No confirmation about holding titans. Couple messages about that TS is working on 'solution'... Seriously, how idiotic you think we are? Give up, you can't milk it anymore. ~~
TornSoul BIG Libertas Fidelitas	Posted - 2009.10.23 21:14:00 - [90] Originally by: Dumb Jerk Ji--glad to see the hundred tickets bought. Now allow me to point something out: the rules are clear, if you don't send the ISK in the proper way, BIG considers it a donation. You didn't send it the right way by your own admission. So, why did you get special treatment? The rules are clear, right? The terms of the contract are clearly stated, the rules are clearly stated, etc., right? But YOU somehow managed to get an exception to the rules. So they are not, in fact, rules at all. The terms can clearly be adjusted at Torn's whim. So, Torn, why don't you adjust the terms for me? Give me my money for the tickets I bought. That could also make me go away. Wouldn't that be nice? If people by mistake send ISK to me (TornSoul) I return it. Simple as that. I don't try and determine where the ISK was supposed to go in the first place - That's got nothing to do with it... If people however somehow mess up a payment to BIG Games, then they're out of luck. As that account is tied into a bazzilion background jobs (via the EVE API) and multiple DB's. Trying to "undo" a payment to that char is a heck of a lot of work (depending on circumstances several DB's would have to be updated manually etc) This is the reason why i state that any errors in sending ISK to BIG Games, the ISK is first a) treated as a (normal) BIG Lottery purchase, and secondly b) Any amount above the BIG Lottery max is treated as a donation (to the BIG Lottery). Those are my "standard terms of business" (with regards to any payments made to BIG Games) You can like them or not, that won't change things the least. BIG Lottery



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