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xxxak Caldari No Limit Productions Mostly Harmless	Posted - 2009.10.27 17:54:00 - [1] Here is an idea to make AFs more unique and useful: Give them a role bonus that prevents 2pt scrams from shutting off their MWDs. That way, they have some unique flavor compared to ceptors, but they are not over powered because the fitting requirements of a MWD and the cap use of a MWD means that they are not OP like the ultra-speed afterburner thought the Devs had. Maybe HACs should get thus role bonus too? Eh.. let's just talk about AFs.
George Mccloud Gallente Domination. THE KLINGONS	Posted - 2009.10.27 18:03:00 - [2] The proposed AF boost to AB speed isn't enough already?
Cartheron Crust Red Federation	Posted - 2009.10.27 18:08:00 - [3] Or they could just give them the missing bonus that their respective t1 hull has.
Cpt Branko The Scope	Posted - 2009.10.27 18:13:00 - [4] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 27/10/2009 18:14:19 Edited by: Cpt Branko on 27/10/2009 18:13:41 Originally by: xxxak Here is an idea to make AFs more unique and useful: Give them a role bonus that prevents 2pt scrams from shutting off their MWDs. That way, they have some unique flavor compared to ceptors, but they are not over powered because the fitting requirements of a MWD and the cap use of a MWD means that they are not OP like the ultra-speed afterburner thought the Devs had. Maybe HACs should get thus role bonus too? Eh.. let's just talk about AFs. I actually like that much much better then the AB idea I really like that. Not OP because of web and neut, and MWD cap use / sig bloom, but helps them a ton get to their sweetspot. Becomes nice heavy tackle but not invulnerable. Still need racial 4th bonus (like, more damage). But very much yes. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Avan Sercedos The Tuskers	Posted - 2009.10.27 18:15:00 - [5] Originally by: George Mccloud The proposed AF boost to AB speed isn't enough already? Because that totally hasn't been scrapped
baltec1 Antares Shipyards Phalanx Alliance	Posted - 2009.10.27 18:15:00 - [6] Or they could fix rockets so the vengence doesnt get more firepower with projectiles and give the retribution a second mid thus fixing amarr AF.
xxxak Caldari No Limit Productions Mostly Harmless	Posted - 2009.10.27 18:22:00 - [7] Originally by: George Mccloud The proposed AF boost to AB speed isn't enough already? The proposed AF boost to AB speed is dead. This is my alternative proposal.
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2009.10.27 18:32:00 - [8] Edited by: Sidus Isaacs on 27/10/2009 18:32:25 Originally by: George Mccloud The proposed AF boost to AB speed isn't enough already? Thats been removed for some time now ;) Edit: thats what I get for replying long after I open thread :P -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Cpt Branko The Scope	Posted - 2009.10.27 18:32:00 - [9] Originally by: baltec1 Or they could fix rockets so the vengence doesnt get more firepower with projectiles and give the retribution a second mid thus fixing amarr AF. Yeah, roflkets really really need a fix. Currently they're the stupidest weapon system in the game. I'd also say Retri needs a second mid but Amarr pilots vehemently disagree and say it's fine with one, so I just give up on that. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
baltec1 Antares Shipyards Phalanx Alliance	Posted - 2009.10.27 18:43:00 - [10] Originally by: Cpt Branko I'd also say Retri needs a second mid but Amarr pilots vehemently disagree and say it's fine with one, so I just give up on that. We dont need it but we wouldnt mind having it

Cpt Branko The Scope	Posted - 2009.10.27 18:46:00 - [11] Originally by: baltec1 Originally by: Cpt Branko I'd also say Retri needs a second mid but Amarr pilots vehemently disagree and say it's fine with one, so I just give up on that. We dont need it but we wouldnt mind having it But whenever I suggest the Retribution needs a second mid, I get the "but Amarr are gang ships/get a tackler/you can't do everything in a single ship/etc" so I just concluded that Amarr pilots are deathly afraid of medslots, like they're the workings of the devil and sully their gank/tank purity. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Vasira Baerest Blue Republic	Posted - 2009.10.27 19:00:00 - [12] Originally by: Cpt Branko Originally by: baltec1 Originally by: Cpt Branko I'd also say Retri needs a second mid but Amarr pilots vehemently disagree and say it's fine with one, so I just give up on that. We dont need it but we wouldnt mind having it But whenever I suggest the Retribution needs a second mid, I get the "but Amarr are gang ships/get a tackler/you can't do everything in a single ship/etc" so I just concluded that Amarr pilots are deathly afraid of medslots, like they're the workings of the devil and sully their gank/tank purity. Nah, just not willing to give up a high or low slow to pick up that additional mid.
Infected69 Amarr Infinite Covenant	Posted - 2009.10.27 19:03:00 - [13] Edited by: Infected69 on 27/10/2009 19:03:04 Originally by: baltec1 Originally by: Cpt Branko I'd also say Retri needs a second mid but Amarr pilots vehemently disagree and say it's fine with one, so I just give up on that. We dont need it but we wouldnt mind having it What? who is we? 1 mid slot is ******ed. fix it.
xxxak Caldari No Limit Productions Mostly Harmless	Posted - 2009.10.27 19:05:00 - [14] Jesus F C Can we get back on topic here. You guys have the worst ADD. Lawl.
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2009.10.27 19:21:00 - [15] 2pt immunity would make them nanos like the days of old, imo not that good idea. Id rhater see damage and resistance bonuses for them, i.e. not the same bonus accross the board, but each need to be looked at individually. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Cpt Branko The Scope	Posted - 2009.10.27 19:35:00 - [16] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 27/10/2009 19:39:23 Originally by: Vasira Baerest Nah, just not willing to give up a high or low slow to pick up that additional mid. Midslot >> utility high. If you use the utility high for a nos, you could just consider using a cap booster. Originally by: Sidus Isaacs 2pt immunity would make them nanos like the days of old, imo not that good idea. Nah, because the sig bloom makes them not too hard to track outside of webrange, and preety OK inside it until they shut MWD off and are up close (which they should generally survive anyway, approach only takes so long with a MWD-ing frig). But then they're at risk from drones and multiple webs. I like it. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
baltec1 Antares Shipyards Phalanx Alliance	Posted - 2009.10.27 19:45:00 - [17] Edited by: baltec1 on 27/10/2009 19:45:12 Originally by: Cpt Branko Midslot >> utility high. If you use the utility high for a nos, you could just consider using a cap booster. Then we still wouldnt get the point on it and would just end up with more cap for a short while No what we need is the following: [Retribution, I have a dream] Small Armor Repairer II Armor Thermic Hardener II Adaptive Nano Plating II Capacitor Power Relay II Heat Sink II 1MN Afterburner II Warp Disruptor II Dual Light Pulse Laser II, Amarr Navy Multifrequency S Dual Light Pulse Laser II, Amarr Navy Multifrequency S Dual Light Pulse Laser II, Amarr Navy Multifrequency S Dual Light Pulse Laser II, Amarr Navy Multifrequency S Small Nosferatu II Energy Collision Accelerator I Energy Collision Accelerator I
Dengen Krastinov Navy of Xoc Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2009.10.27 20:05:00 - [18] Originally by: Cartheron Crust Or they could just give them the missing bonus that their respective t1 hull has. ^^ This, I'm not sure why people propose more complicated 'fixes' when this would completely solve the issues for most ships.
Deva Blackfire 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2009.10.27 20:43:00 - [19] Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 27/10/2009 20:43:42 One of the biggest AB bonused AFs flaws was "immunity to scrambler". Doing 1,2-1,5km/s and being immune to scrams is wrong. And now you propose that ship should do 1,5-2,5+ km/s and be immune to scrams? Dream on.
N00byn00blar	Posted - 2009.10.27 20:52:00 - [20] Originally by: Deva Blackfire Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 27/10/2009 20:43:42 One of the biggest AB bonused AFs flaws was "immunity to scrambler". Doing 1,2-1,5km/s and being immune to scrams is wrong. And now you propose that ship should do 1,5-2,5+ km/s and be immune to scrams? Dream on. Err an extra slot on my retribution would be nice. I don't care about scram immunity, actually being able to use one would be nice!

xxxak Caldari No Limit Productions Mostly Harmless	Posted - 2009.10.27 20:59:00 - [21] Originally by: Deva Blackfire Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 27/10/2009 20:43:42 One of the biggest AB bonused AFs flaws was "immunity to scrambler". Doing 1,2-1,5km/s and being immune to scrams is wrong. And now you propose that ship should do 1,5-2,5+ km/s and be immune to scrams? Dream on. The difference is that 1) its hard to perma-run a MWD 2) you have the sig of a cruiser with a MWD on 3) a MWD forces you to make significant fitting compromises The above are signfiicant trade offs. The AB boost had none of those trade offs. We played EVE for about 5 years without 2pt scrams killing MWD, and it wasnt a terrible game then. I think a MWD AF won't break EVE.
Adacia Calla Minmatar 1st Steps Academy Tread Alliance	Posted - 2009.10.27 21:06:00 - [22] Good thing I just bought 4x Coreli C-Type 1MN MWD for 5mil a piece. Better than T2 in every way.
Ravenesa The Bastards The Bastards.	Posted - 2009.10.27 21:08:00 - [23] I'm part of the Amarr crowd that kinda likes the Ret the way it is because I fly it in small gangs. Does it suck as a solo AF for PvP? Yes. Does it suck as a missioning boat? Hell no! Does it suck as a ratting ship? Again Hell No! It is a DPS boat, plain and simple. Nothing fancy, just per DPS. Do rockets need to be fixed? Hell Yes! Back on topic... If ceptors aren't immune to the MWD/Scram trick then no way should AF's have that immunity. How about a 50% reduction in heat damage from overloading mods? It allows them to overheat sooner and boost their DPS as well as their initial speed, but doesn't give them a permaboost. The pilot still has to manage what he is doing and for how long.
xxxak Caldari No Limit Productions Mostly Harmless	Posted - 2009.10.27 21:15:00 - [24] Originally by: Ravenesa I'm part of the Amarr crowd that kinda likes the Ret the way it is because I fly it in small gangs. Does it suck as a solo AF for PvP? Yes. Does it suck as a missioning boat? Hell no! Does it suck as a ratting ship? Again Hell No! It is a DPS boat, plain and simple. Nothing fancy, just per DPS. Do rockets need to be fixed? Hell Yes! Back on topic... If ceptors aren't immune to the MWD/Scram trick then no way should AF's have that immunity. How about a 50% reduction in heat damage from overloading mods? It allows them to overheat sooner and boost their DPS as well as their initial speed, but doesn't give them a permaboost. The pilot still has to manage what he is doing and for how long. Interesting point about ceptors, but I disagree: Ceptors have the advantage of being VERY fast, so fast that they can stay out of web/neut range easily. AFs are not nearly as fast. Thus, my new feature adds flavor to the game. As it is now, there is almost NO reason to buy and fly an AF. They cost 5 times as much as a T1 cruiser, for roughly equal performance. They are good for nothing more than styles points. With my suggestion, some people WOULD choose an AF over a ceptor. Thats GOOD for EVE, not bad. If you want a boost for ceptors, start a new thread :p
Don Pellegrino	Posted - 2009.10.27 21:30:00 - [25] Quote: As it is now, there is almost NO reason to buy and fly an AF. They cost 5 times as much as a T1 cruiser, for roughly equal performance. They are good for nothing more than styles points. I disagree, they are awesome solo pvp ships. They survive lowsec gatecamps, are faster and more agile than T1 cruisers and they can kill T1 cruisers or at least disengage most of the time. ... but I have to agree that they need a boost to make worth flying in a broader range of situations. I like your scram immunity idea, but it is a bit overpowered. Giving them their T1 version bonus doesn't seem to be enough, but it is certainly a very good start.
Lili Lu	Posted - 2009.10.27 21:31:00 - [26] Originally by: Cartheron Crust Or they could just give them the missing bonus that their respective t1 hull has. Really this would be the place to start. Maybe after such a correction to AF a one size fits all buff such as proposed by the OP could be considered.
Ravenesa The Bastards The Bastards.	Posted - 2009.10.27 22:02:00 - [27] Originally by: xxxak Originally by: Ravenesa I'm part of the Amarr crowd that kinda likes the Ret the way it is because I fly it in small gangs. Does it suck as a solo AF for PvP? Yes. Does it suck as a missioning boat? Hell no! Does it suck as a ratting ship? Again Hell No! It is a DPS boat, plain and simple. Nothing fancy, just per DPS. Do rockets need to be fixed? Hell Yes! Back on topic... If ceptors aren't immune to the MWD/Scram trick then no way should AF's have that immunity. How about a 50% reduction in heat damage from overloading mods? It allows them to overheat sooner and boost their DPS as well as their initial speed, but doesn't give them a permaboost. The pilot still has to manage what he is doing and for how long. Interesting point about ceptors, but I disagree: Ceptors have the advantage of being VERY fast, so fast that they can stay out of web/neut range easily. AFs are not nearly as fast. Thus, my new feature adds flavor to the game. As it is now, there is almost NO reason to buy and fly an AF. They cost 5 times as much as a T1 cruiser, for roughly equal performance. They are good for nothing more than styles points. With my suggestion, some people WOULD choose an AF over a ceptor. Thats GOOD for EVE, not bad. If you want a boost for ceptors, start a new thread :p Ceptors are fine, I was just using that as a counter point. I actually do like the overloading idea the more that I think about it. It gives AB AF's a speed over 1k and a bit and boosts DPS/Tanking/Tackling/etc. AF's have a longer lock range then ceptors so an overloaded point would hit out to 28k, extended web range, etc.
Grimpak Gallente Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group	Posted - 2009.10.27 23:23:00 - [28] Originally by: Cpt Branko Edited by: Cpt Branko on 27/10/2009 19:39:23 Originally by: Vasira Baerest Nah, just not willing to give up a high or low slow to pick up that additional mid. Midslot >> utility high. If you use the utility high for a nos, you could just consider using a cap booster. Originally by: Sidus Isaacs 2pt immunity would make them nanos like the days of old, imo not that good idea. Nah, because the sig bloom makes them not too hard to track outside of webrange, and preety OK inside it until they shut MWD off and are up close (which they should generally survive anyway, approach only takes so long with a MWD-ing frig). But then they're at risk from drones and multiple webs. I like it. 4/2/5 retri is nice, but I want a 5/1/5 retri with 5 turrets --- Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals. ain't that right.
xVx Scarecrow Minmatar	Posted - 2009.10.27 23:40:00 - [29] i thinks its a ok idea but it wouldnt it make ceptors usless for general tackel?. why have a ceptor tackel when an af would be tougher and faster when it gets in web/scram range? only the super fast ceptor would be usfull to get there to hold the target till the af gets there to tackel it better. ceptor would prob die in the process loosing to anti/support
Stuart Price Caldari The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2009.10.28 00:58:00 - [30] Edited by: Stuart Price on 28/10/2009 00:58:49 They all need their fourth bonus, tied to AF skill: Harpy: +5% shield resistances per level Hawk: +10% explosion velocity per level (+change the damage bonus to match the Kestrel) Enyo: +10% falloff per level (oops, forgot it already had a tracking bonus) Ishkur: +10% drone optimal/tracking OR maybe speed (both MWD and orbit) per level (I'm loathe to give them the usual HP/damage bonus) Retribution: +5% RoF per level Vengeance: +10% flight time per level (Vengeance has a bloody odd bonus combination to start with) Wolf and Jag I've never flown, but some form of agility/sig/speed based bonus maybe? Also: Fix rockets. A LOT of frigates would become very, very viable indeed with rockets fixed. With a fourth bonus in place, I'm not sure AF's would NEED a role bonus. Putting the 'irate' into 'Pirate'

Adacia Calla Minmatar 1st Steps Academy Tread Alliance	Posted - 2009.10.28 01:58:00 - [31] Originally by: Stuart Price Edited by: Stuart Price on 28/10/2009 00:58:49 They all need their fourth bonus, tied to AF skill: Harpy: +5% shield resistances per level Hawk: +10% explosion velocity per level (+change the damage bonus to match the Kestrel) Enyo: +10% falloff per level (oops, forgot it already had a tracking bonus) Ishkur: +10% drone optimal/tracking OR maybe speed (both MWD and orbit) per level (I'm loathe to give them the usual HP/damage bonus) Retribution: +5% RoF per level Vengeance: +10% flight time per level (Vengeance has a bloody odd bonus combination to start with) Wolf and Jag I've never flown, but some form of agility/sig/speed based bonus maybe? Also: Fix rockets. A LOT of frigates would become very, very viable indeed with rockets fixed. With a fourth bonus in place, I'm not sure AF's would NEED a role bonus. I'll take either +10% Falloff or +7.5% Tracking per level for my Jag.
Cpt Branko The Scope	Posted - 2009.10.28 02:05:00 - [32] Originally by: Deva Blackfire Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 27/10/2009 20:43:42 One of the biggest AB bonused AFs flaws was "immunity to scrambler". Doing 1,2-1,5km/s and being immune to scrams is wrong. And now you propose that ship should do 1,5-2,5+ km/s and be immune to scrams? Dream on. Yeah, except you get 500% more sig, which effectively nullifies the speed boost from a MWD, tracking wise, at cost of 25% of your cap and not being able to permarun it to begin with. Compared with a boosted AB which takes bugger all cap, makes you approximately 5 times harder to track and is easier to fit plus permarunnable, well... the MWD bonus is certainly less OP. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Christina Bamar Agony Unleashed Agony Empire	Posted - 2009.10.28 05:10:00 - [33] Am I the only one who never MWDs once I get into range? After a web or two you're easier to hit with your MWD on than off, why would you want to keep it on? CEO, Agony Unleashed
baltec1 Antares Shipyards Phalanx Alliance	Posted - 2009.10.28 10:43:00 - [34] Originally by: Stuart Price Edited by: Stuart Price on 28/10/2009 00:58:49 They all need their fourth bonus, tied to AF skill: Harpy: +5% shield resistances per level Hawk: +10% explosion velocity per level (+change the damage bonus to match the Kestrel) Enyo: +10% falloff per level (oops, forgot it already had a tracking bonus) Ishkur: +10% drone optimal/tracking OR maybe speed (both MWD and orbit) per level (I'm loathe to give them the usual HP/damage bonus) Retribution: +1 mid slot Vengeance: rockets get fixed. Wolf and Jag I've never flown, but some form of agility/sig/speed based bonus maybe? Also: Fix rockets. A LOT of frigates would become very, very viable indeed with rockets fixed. With a fourth bonus in place, I'm not sure AF's would NEED a role bonus. Fixed amarr for you.
Marcus Alkhaar Exotic Dancers Club	Posted - 2009.10.28 11:09:00 - [35] Assault frigates could do with a -7.5% cap use on small armor repair/small shield booster per level. It won't nerf the passive tanked assault frigates as a single small rep usually have to rep ~18 cycles to compete with a passive tanked assault frigate which is fully cap stable.
Lugalzagezi666	Posted - 2009.10.28 11:47:00 - [36] While you talking about 4th bonus for afs... first some afs /heh/ need to be fixed, because they are total trash compared to the ishkur and jag /or give them individual 4th bonus that will make them comparable to jag and ishkur/. And retri - it needs +1 mid. Every combat ship /except some ewar and logis/ needs to fit a point. For "it brings dps to af gangs" crowd - you are ******s. I cant stand these ppl in fleets, totally ignoring primaries, shooting random inties, that are not doing anything, but when fleet have to gtfo and enemy tacklers are chasing us, their "antitackler" retributions /ab fitted ofc - you always have to be capstable/ are leaving heavier ships behind. ...but it looks so good being top damage dealer on km, right?
baltec1 Antares Shipyards Phalanx Alliance	Posted - 2009.10.28 12:28:00 - [37] Originally by: Lugalzagezi666 While you talking about 4th bonus for afs... first some afs /heh/ need to be fixed, because they are total trash compared to the ishkur and jag /or give them individual 4th bonus that will make them comparable to jag and ishkur/. And retri - it needs +1 mid. Every combat ship /except some ewar and logis/ needs to fit a point. For "it brings dps to af gangs" crowd - you are ******s. I cant stand these ppl in fleets, totally ignoring primaries, shooting random inties, that are not doing anything, but when fleet have to gtfo and enemy tacklers are chasing us, their "antitackler" retributions /ab fitted ofc - you always have to be capstable/ are leaving heavier ships behind. ...but it looks so good being top damage dealer on km, right? Sounds like you have bad pilots in a good ship tbh.
Lugalzagezi666	Posted - 2009.10.28 12:37:00 - [38] More like bad pilots in bad ship. Ishkur can easily bring dps AND point to the gang. And maybe some ewar too. Retri is just worthless atm, only some ppl do not understand it.
Cpt Branko The Scope	Posted - 2009.10.28 12:40:00 - [39] Originally by: Christina Bamar Am I the only one who never MWDs once I get into range? I don't do it either. Ofc the MWD makes you easier to hit when webbed. Hell, on some heavier ships with a plate or something, even not being webbed when MWD-ing makes you easier to hit (and particularly in orbit, where topspeed is less then max straightline). But MWD gets you on top of targets when fitted to a frig hull in seconds, and once you're up close, your base velocity makes you hard to hit. If you couldn't be scrambled, it just means you typically could not prevent AFs from getting to hugging range and would have to deal with them there. It's not a bad idea as such, and not really OP since MWD does not give you a massive boost to damage mitigation. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
baltec1 Antares Shipyards Phalanx Alliance	Posted - 2009.10.28 12:45:00 - [40] Originally by: Lugalzagezi666 More like bad pilots in bad ship. Ishkur can easily bring dps AND point to the gang. And maybe some ewar too. Retri is just worthless atm, only some ppl do not understand it. Its easy to tell you have never flown retris.

Smabs	Posted - 2009.10.28 12:48:00 - [41] The main problem with an AF is simply the cost. They really, really need to have the material price cut down so that you could buy one for around 12 mil or so. A few little boosts to some of the less used ones would be awesome, too. And I think everyone agrees that rockets need fixing.
Lugalzagezi666	Posted - 2009.10.28 12:56:00 - [42] Yes baltec, tell me that 180 dps of retri is much more usefull than 160 of ishkur or harpy /rails!/. Yes, my fault, i know that 20 dps more is always better than bringing a point...
Mish'Kala Minmatar Eye of Osiris	Posted - 2009.10.28 13:28:00 - [43] Sorry, I must have missed it. Can someone link the Dev post that says the AB bonus has been scrapped please.
baltec1 Antares Shipyards Phalanx Alliance	Posted - 2009.10.28 16:27:00 - [44] Originally by: Lugalzagezi666 Yes baltec, tell me that 180 dps of retri is much more usefull than 160 of ishkur or harpy /rails!/. Yes, my fault, i know that 20 dps more is always better than bringing a point... The ishkur needs its drones to do that damage it also does not have the gun range or tracking nore can it tank as well a retribution not to mention most ishkurs are fitted with a MWD so their sig is massive and with my range advantage I will land at least two perfect hits before its guns even flare up.
Col Angus	Posted - 2009.10.28 20:49:00 - [45] I quite like the idea of shielded MWD's on all "Assault" ships. LetÆs face it, a competently piloted t1 cruiser will destroy any AF (please note competence is required), and itÆs well established that BCÆs commonly outclass HACÆs. This would give the t2 ôAssaultö class ship a nice niche, while not making them over powered. They would still have huge sig rads, 1pt & 2pts would still stop them from warping, and neuts/nos/webs still work on them. They would now have a roll that could not be duplicated by a t1 ships for a fraction of their price. There should be something special about all t2 ship classes. The only thing special about the Assault class of ship currently, is that its isk sink to usefulness ratio sucks worse than all other ship classes. And for those of you that would complain that they can escape too easilyàguess what, if they are running away, they are likely no longer a threat to you either.
Cpt Branko The Scope	Posted - 2009.10.28 22:32:00 - [46] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 28/10/2009 22:33:07 Originally by: Col Angus I quite like the idea of shielded MWD's on all "Assault" ships. LetÆs face it, a competently piloted t1 cruiser will destroy any AF (please note competence is required), and itÆs well established that BCÆs commonly outclass HACÆs. This would give the t2 ôAssaultö class ship a nice niche, while not making them over powered. They would still have huge sig rads, 1pt & 2pts would still stop them from warping, and neuts/nos/webs still work on them. They would now have a roll that could not be duplicated by a t1 ships for a fraction of their price. There should be something special about all t2 ship classes. The only thing special about the Assault class of ship currently, is that its isk sink to usefulness ratio sucks worse than all other ship classes. And for those of you that would complain that they can escape too easilyàguess what, if they are running away, they are likely no longer a threat to you either. Well, escape too easily... there's the whole place between 10.8km and 13km which you have to get out of. Not so easy, and you might just run out of EHP doing it. Definitely wouldn't be unkillable, particularly with the way the MWD increases your sig so that tracking is not a problem. That said, it preety much would obsolete scram-only fits (unless they have neutralizers or something) for tackle. I can't say I would cry about it, since webs would still largely work, but would have to consider it a bit more before coming to a conclusion. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint


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