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I Want To Learn To Fly a Falcon

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Admiral Byng	Posted - 2009.10.30 05:28:00 - [1] I am a terrible tackler. I prefer doing things from a ways away. Can someone point me to a good guide showing how to employ a falcon in small gangs and large fleets. I think I am heading the right direction for fit. But range to operate at and tactics would be nice. Rook and Blackbird advice would be great also.
Bloody Rabbit	Posted - 2009.10.30 08:07:00 - [2] Best way to learn is to grab 50 blackbirds and fit them with t1 mods and join FW or Privateers. After you lose some ships ask yourself what did you learn, what worked, what didn't work and you will be all set. If you are going to fly the Falcon or Rook, have recon at 5 and most if not all your Ewar skills at 4-5.
Admiral Byng	Posted - 2009.10.30 14:04:00 - [3] Any chance someone could tell me about their mistakes so I can do this with 25 Blackbirds?
Grouchy Smurf Minmatar	Posted - 2009.10.30 14:26:00 - [4] No matter how many sex-books you read, you will never be good. Give it a try (the blackbird part, that is).
Lady Spank Amarr Sekret Kool Klubb	Posted - 2009.10.30 14:29:00 - [5] Recognize how lucky you are to have a bird singing for you! You could try playing a tape that has both the calls of predator birds and birds in distress, or put up plastic owls or hawks. Birds are not dumb however and you will have to change these regularly. The quality of my replies is directly related to the QQuality of the opÆs comments
Lady Spank Amarr Sekret Kool Klubb	Posted - 2009.10.30 15:03:00 - [6] Actual post. Falcons are pretty lame tbh but if you must learn to fly one, be aware of a few things. They don't tank too well, esp with all the overkill ecm mods people fit them with. You will be hated You will not be respected as a good pvp pilot ECM makes the fight boring for you, even if you win. Can you tell I don't like ecm? If you have an idea of fit down, its really up to you to get some practice in... an insured blackbird with meta 3 (cheap) mods will cost you peanuts after insurance so have a go... they work well in small gangs but be prepared to be primary if they can get a lock on you. Also neuts will screw you over instantly. The quality of my replies is directly related to the QQuality of the opÆs comments
Marko Riva Adamant Inc.	Posted - 2009.10.30 15:42:00 - [7] Edited by: Marko Riva on 30/10/2009 15:42:45 Nonsense, ECM is a valid tactic intended to turn the side of a battle. if you want good fightsÖ then ECM can be an issue but if you're interested in teamwork, specialisation and tactics then ECM is just one of the options available to you. The whole "waaah not fair, you didn't let me bash your head in, you SUCK and CHEAT!!!" stance is just laughable. If one side put in the effort to form up a proper team with tactics and more than just DEEPEEESSSS then kudos to them. Here's some tips; 1) try to avoid using multispectrals, 4 different racials will jam 1 target better than 4 multispecs. If you REALLY have no idea what you'll be facing and it'll be a ton of them then it may be an option but normally I'd rather be (close to) SURE I'd jam a specific target than to "spray and pray". 2) join the fight late, wait to warp in or uncloak till the fight has started. Most of the time the enemy will have tunnel vision and won't realise you're there. This can/will buy you some time instead of being primary right away. Also always be aligned out, you have enough range (even after the changes) to instawarp away when you smell trouble 3) the whole "I'll JUST get another jam off on this guy before I'll cloak or run, those inties are still far off and that BS isn't firing on me just yet, I have time" gets you killed. You have no tank and you're no use dead, once they notice you they'll primary your arse before you can say "notintheface!". Don't be afraid to chicken out by warping away (possibly to a different BM on the gate/station) and rejoin the fight later on 4) most FC's have no clue on support things in a fleet, they understand dps/pvp ships but a lot of them have no personal experience with ECM ships (or scouts/coverts for that matter), because of that they'll consider ECM (and coverts) as an afterthought and will just order you to "jam stuff, or something". So unless specifically asked to jam a certain target use this as a general "to jam" guide; - other ECM ships - logistics ships - hardest hitter Try to avoid jamming recons unless you really have to, they have high sensor strength making them difficult to jam. Jamming droneboats doesn't help too much, while you shut down their tackling/neuts/guns the drones are still at work. Other ships will, most of the time, be a better target for you 5) when in small gangs and going against a very limited number of targets jam strength is better than tank, when in a big fleet fit a 1600 plate and DCU even if it lowers your jamming 6) fit your ECM ships cheaply, you're going to lose them :) Don't bother with fancy weaponry, sister launchers or other expensive crap on your falcon. Only use your (meager) dps options in small (recon) engagements, if you start trying to dps in big fights you'll forget to jam and lose overview of the fight 7) enjoy the hate, bathe in the knowledge that the guy you just jammed, depriving him of a target or kill, will be yelling at his screen hoping for some miracle. After you're done simply cloak up and smile ----------- ADM-I
Lady Spank Amarr Sekret Kool Klubb	Posted - 2009.10.30 16:33:00 - [8] Originally by: Marko Riva Edited by: Marko Riva on 30/10/2009 15:42:45 Nonsense, ECM is a valid tactic intended to turn the side of a battle. if you want good fightsÖ then ECM can be an issue but if you're interested in teamwork, specialisation and tactics then ECM is just one of the options available to you. The whole "waaah not fair, you didn't let me bash your head in, you SUCK and CHEAT!!!" stance is just laughable. If one side put in the effort to form up a proper team with tactics and more than just DEEPEEESSSS then kudos to them. I'm thinking more of times when you get outnumbered... have a potentially interesting challenging fight and THEN their Falcon comes in. And really, while I don't like ECM in its current form I'm not whining, I'm just saying be prepared to be hated by people The quality of my replies is directly related to the QQuality of the opÆs comments
Gunns AbeLazin	Posted - 2009.10.30 17:03:00 - [9] The above post is very good. I personally love ECM; I always feel I can affect the fight best when jamming their best DPS ship AND some other random guy at the same time. I've only gotten to fly Blackbirds up to this point, though, but Falcon is on the way! I'd agree, if you feel like you need some ECM practice, try the Blackbird. Be ready to run away.
Admiral Byng	Posted - 2009.10.30 19:22:00 - [10] Marko, Your post was just want I wanted. What about range. The Blackbird fit I am looking at is about 50+50. Should I be out at 50 or further out? I can target well over 100k.

Marko Riva Adamant Inc.	Posted - 2009.10.30 20:02:00 - [11] Edited by: Marko Riva on 30/10/2009 20:07:09 You can't target over 100km with a BB unless fitting a sensor booster, and it really depends on the situation if you need one tbh. Personally I'm not a fan of wasting an ECM slot on an SB, also because (ideally) you'll join the fight later anyway so there's no initial rush to ECM the crap out of everyone out of fear of being instapopped or counter jammed. The best combo of rigs for a BB (if you want to take it that far) is a targeting range rig, ECM range and strength one. Due to the stacking penalties it gets you VERY close to the max attainable jam strength anyway. So I'd fit those 3 rigs, 2 sig distortion amps in low and in the mids T2 or best named jammers. If the fight would be a bit less controlled (due to bigger size or the enemies being faster or simply better) I'd trade one amp for a plate. But losing too much jamming strength makes it more of a hitn'miss type of thing which I personally dislike. You either do your job or you don't. ECMing from falloff depends on the situation, if you're dealing with a lot of amarr pulse BS's then gaining some extra range extends your life expectancy by uhm... over 9000. Against other short range BS it doesn't really matter and the only thing you'll have to worry about is drones and light ships (or warp ins). So I'd sit at about 70km+ negating most short range BS's and drones. The rigs really help you with this. ----------- ADM-I
Bloody Rabbit	Posted - 2009.10.30 23:18:00 - [12] Originally by: Admiral Byng Marko, Your post was just want I wanted. What about range. The Blackbird fit I am looking at is about 50+50. Should I be out at 50 or further out? I can target well over 100k. For the blackbird warp in last and hold off at 75km from your fleet. Just think of yourself as the get out of jail card that a fleet has. Marko is right on that most of the FC will not care about you and order you to do things that will get you killed so the best thing to do is throw away 50 blackbirds (t1 fitted, not meta as it costs too much) to learn before climbing into a Falcon or Rook. You will lose your ships but that is ok as hopefully you will help your fleet save their ships.
Dunk Dinkle Caldari Caldari State 1st Protectorate	Posted - 2009.10.31 17:14:00 - [13] A few things about taking on the ECM role: 1) You will be primaried. 2) You will lose your ships, repeatedly. 3) Your enemies will curse your name. 4) You are invaluable to your fleet's success. I fly ECM in faction warfare, mainly in a Blackbird. Occasionally in a Scorpion if we are running a battleship fleet. I fly Falcons on rare occasions when I'm feeling randy. Learn to fly Blackbirds until it is straightforward before you try a Falcon. Losing a 100+ mil ship is no fun. In perfect conditions, you should be orbiting a gate at optimals (50km+) waiting for the enemy. The DPS will be at their optimals, usually much closer in. If the FC calls for a specific jam target, jam that. Otherwise, jam any enemy ECM first, any enemy logistics second, and then it's their high DPS stuff. Try to leave one jammer ready in case you get tackled. You maybe asked to protect other ships as your fleet goes through a camp. Meaning you'll jump into a camp with your fleet holding cloak. Your fleet will attempt to warp. You job is to not warp, but stay briefly to break the locks of anyone that is tackling one of your fleet's ships. So if the Raven in your fleet is tackling, you need to break the tacklers locks, so he can get free. If you are lucky, you both get away. About half the time, the ship you protect gets away, but you get tackled or primaried and don't. But you did save a 100 mill ship with your 5-10 mill ship. Here's my usual Blackbird fitting, balanced for effectiveness and the fact that it's unlikely to survive any prolonged engagement. [Blackbird, I was primary] Compulsive Signal Distortion Amplifier I 800mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Compulsive Multispectral ECM I CZ-4 Concussive Spatial Destabilizer ECM 'Hypnos' Ion Field ECM I 'Umbra' I White Noise ECM Enfeebling Phase Inversion ECM I 1MN MicroWarpdrive I 'Malkuth' Heavy Missile Launcher I, Thunderbolt Heavy Missile 'Malkuth' Heavy Missile Launcher I, Thunderbolt Heavy Missile 'Malkuth' Heavy Missile Launcher I, Thunderbolt Heavy Missile Salvager I Medium Particle Dispersion Projector I Medium Particle Dispersion Augmentor I
Biscuit0 GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.11.03 06:06:00 - [14] Weapons of any kind on ECM ships are bad because they tempt you to use them. Put a neut or remote armor rep in your highs. Blackbirds have the better range than a Falcon so you can stay farther out, put 2x sig distortion amps in the lows and rig for target range and maybe agility. Focus more on keeping yourself safe and the use of bookmarks to slip around the battlefield. If at all possible make sure you have a few bookmarks setup on all gates/stations at ECM optimal + 25km or so. Align out immediately after you drop out of warp and start jamming other ECM / logistics / DPS. When you see someone within 50km closing in on you warp out and head to another bookmark.
Syekuda State Protectorate	Posted - 2009.11.03 16:39:00 - [15] Originally by: Biscuit0 Weapons of any kind on ECM ships are bad because they tempt you to use them. Put a neut or remote armor rep in your highs. Blackbirds have the better range than a Falcon so you can stay farther out, put 2x sig distortion amps in the lows and rig for target range and maybe agility. Focus more on keeping yourself safe and the use of bookmarks to slip around the battlefield. If at all possible make sure you have a few bookmarks setup on all gates/stations at ECM optimal + 25km or so. Align out immediately after you drop out of warp and start jamming other ECM / logistics / DPS. When you see someone within 50km closing in on you warp out and head to another bookmark. Dont mean to pun but your contradicting yourself. you say you can stay further out than a falcon (you try to stay away at 50km or so anyway) and then you say replace those missile launchers for neuts and/or RR. Those 2 high modules requires to be very close. Since I get better chance of going away when your at 50km, I rather use missiles instead of being very close to someone and doing RR or neuting him. Cause if I'm too close to someone else, I get higher chance of getting tackled or dying even faster.
Sir Fourhead Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2009.11.03 17:09:00 - [16] Originally by: Syekuda Originally by: Biscuit0 Weapons of any kind on ECM ships are bad because they tempt you to use them. Put a neut or remote armor rep in your highs. Blackbirds have the better range than a Falcon so you can stay farther out, put 2x sig distortion amps in the lows and rig for target range and maybe agility. Focus more on keeping yourself safe and the use of bookmarks to slip around the battlefield. If at all possible make sure you have a few bookmarks setup on all gates/stations at ECM optimal + 25km or so. Align out immediately after you drop out of warp and start jamming other ECM / logistics / DPS. When you see someone within 50km closing in on you warp out and head to another bookmark. Dont mean to pun but your contradicting yourself. you say you can stay further out than a falcon (you try to stay away at 50km or so anyway) and then you say replace those missile launchers for neuts and/or RR. Those 2 high modules requires to be very close. Since I get better chance of going away when your at 50km, I rather use missiles instead of being very close to someone and doing RR or neuting him. Cause if I'm too close to someone else, I get higher chance of getting tackled or dying even faster. He is not suggesting that you try to fit a blackbird for close range business. He's saying that you should not fit dps because that adds another activity for you to manage, and you are likely to get distracted from your main role (jamming) Neuts are useful if you somehow get tackled by a frigate, and all your 20 second jam cycles fail or are active on other targets for some reason. With a mix of medium and small neuts, you can shut down a frigate's tackle long enough to align and warp out to a different BM
Syekuda State Protectorate	Posted - 2009.11.03 17:35:00 - [17] Originally by: Sir Fourhead He is not suggesting that you try to fit a blackbird for close range business. He's saying that you should not fit dps because that adds another activity for you to manage, and you are likely to get distracted from your main role (jamming) Neuts are useful if you somehow get tackled by a frigate, and all your 20 second jam cycles fail or are active on other targets for some reason. With a mix of medium and small neuts, you can shut down a frigate's tackle long enough to align and warp out to a different BM Telling the role of his statement really helps. I thought at first he wanted to use the neuts all the time in battle which didn't made sense at all. Yours does and thats what I would do it anyway.
Precisionist	Posted - 2009.11.03 19:58:00 - [18] Originally by: Syekuda Originally by: Sir Fourhead He is not suggesting that you try to fit a blackbird for close range business. He's saying that you should not fit dps because that adds another activity for you to manage, and you are likely to get distracted from your main role (jamming) Neuts are useful if you somehow get tackled by a frigate, and all your 20 second jam cycles fail or are active on other targets for some reason. With a mix of medium and small neuts, you can shut down a frigate's tackle long enough to align and warp out to a different BM Telling the role of his statement really helps. I thought at first he wanted to use the neuts all the time in battle which didn't made sense at all. Yours does and thats what I would do it anyway. Rofles most people got it, if you ever been in a falcon before.
Draeklore Unknown-Entity Maru Ka'ge	Posted - 2009.11.03 20:35:00 - [19] I would have to agree with whomever said to fly 50 blackbirds first. Maybe by then you'll have enough SP and actual skill to fly a falcon.
The Tzar T-Wrecks Cult of War	Posted - 2009.11.04 12:53:00 - [20] I like to fly mine with 2 large shield extenders and 2 extender rigs. 12K shield on a falcon is awesome! Make sure you are one of the last to uncloak into the engagement, after all primaries have been called, engage at about 40km and keep aligned at all times. Whilst the jams no longer work if you're cloaked up, if the fight is messy (lots of enemies) you can still be effective by putting one of each racial on the corresponding enemy BS (sub largest ship) and annoy the hell out of them by breaking their lock, cloaking up, rinse and repeat. Since the falcon nerf, the ship is even more fun to fly imo.

Torpir Lee Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2009.11.04 13:23:00 - [21] I like this guide for new players trying to learn the basics of ECM: Broski Enterprises - ECM 101
Syekuda State Protectorate	Posted - 2009.11.04 13:43:00 - [22] uhh wow, this guide. I love it. I love the explanation. lol. so funny too. It comes with pictures too.
Starnap Somali Coastguard Authority	Posted - 2009.11.04 13:46:00 - [23] Originally by: Marko Riva Edited by: Marko Riva on 30/10/2009 15:42:45 1) try to avoid using multispectrals, 4 different racials will jam 1 target better than 4 multispecs. If you REALLY have no idea what you'll be facing and it'll be a ton of them then it may be an option but normally I'd rather be (close to) SURE I'd jam a specific target than to "spray and pray". I'm not so sure about this. If you don't know what you're going to face, 4 multispecs give a better chance of jamming a single target than 1-of-each racial. On the other hand, if there are loads of targets then chances are you'll find a good use for each of the racials and then that is much better.
Parati Ad'Bellum	Posted - 2009.11.06 13:50:00 - [24] Does falloff work the same on ECM as it does on guns?
Noran Ferah Red Sky Morning	Posted - 2009.11.09 16:33:00 - [25] Multispec is failure; fit them and be laughed at when your deathmails are posted. ECM is your tank. Never orbit anything. Orbit in a Falcon = death. Align to a celestial (not a gate) cloaked at your OPTIMAL from your target or intended target location (gate) at your lowest possible speed. When you engage, you wait until the target has agressed your mates so they cant jump back through the gate or re-dock, then set 75% speed to celestial, decloak and jam. The real secrets to falcon flying, not the common sense crap I just listed, you must earn...
Mister Turner	Posted - 2009.11.09 19:06:00 - [26] Originally by: Dunk Dinkle [Blackbird, I was primary] Compulsive Signal Distortion Amplifier I 800mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Compulsive Multispectral ECM I CZ-4 Concussive Spatial Destabilizer ECM 'Hypnos' Ion Field ECM I 'Umbra' I White Noise ECM Enfeebling Phase Inversion ECM I 1MN MicroWarpdrive I 'Malkuth' Heavy Missile Launcher I, Thunderbolt Heavy Missile 'Malkuth' Heavy Missile Launcher I, Thunderbolt Heavy Missile 'Malkuth' Heavy Missile Launcher I, Thunderbolt Heavy Missile Salvager I Medium Particle Dispersion Projector I Medium Particle Dispersion Augmentor I Good job fitting a frigate mwd on a cruiser hull. Get rid of the multi and the plate, use a single LSE for buffer. Put a DC2 or another SDA as your low.
Bombuhr	Posted - 2009.11.19 15:11:00 - [27] To the Original poster: I like you am new to ecm (i'm pretty new to everything in eve lol) however i've done a few skirmishes here and there, and the biggest problem for you is getting used to be the primary target. You will loose alot of ships, doesn't matter if you are in a falcon or blackbird, you'll loose them. Your job is to find the most dangerous ship in the enemy fleet and disable that for as long as possible, That's the number 1 rule. Another thing to know is that unless you got Recon Ships to lvl4 there's no point in sitting in a falcon. The covertops cloaking device will utterly destroy your cpu and the ecm bonus to the ship is based on the recon ships skill, so you need to get it to lvl5. and remember this, you will notice that ships will resists your jams quite often. it's pretty hard beeing the ecm pilot, but it's also quite helpful to your fleet. by all means go for it, but do remember it's alot of personal experience combined with alot of skill points training. As soon as you've had plenty of practice you'll learn what to target, ecm is all about beeing fast.
Jones Bones Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2009.11.19 15:40:00 - [28] If you are in a falcon and you are the primary you are doing it wrong. Do not decloak/warp in until the battle has started. Then jam to your heart's content from 70-100km away (use ECM range rigs and get your skills up). If you are using it under negative sec status throw 2-3 LSEs on it for a more than necessary buffer. Make sure you are aligned to a close celestial. If a tackler burns for you or their long range guys are killing you, warp out. Warp to a celestial on the other side of the gate and warp back in. Rinse and repeat till all of them or all of your friends are dead. =================== Go Bucks!
Den Ortur	Posted - 2009.11.19 16:45:00 - [29] Originally by: Lady Spank Recognize how lucky you are to have a bird singing for you! You could try playing a tape that has both the calls of predator birds and birds in distress, or put up plastic owls or hawks. Birds are not dumb however and you will have to change these regularly. \o/
Noran Ferah Red Sky Morning	Posted - 2009.11.20 20:00:00 - [30] LSE's? On a Falcon? Are you people for real? ECM IS YOUR TANK. If you can't grasp this go fly a Blackbird until you get it. Noobs.



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