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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Benri Konpaku
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Posted - 2010.04.17 14:37:00 -
[61]
Originally by: CCP Manifest As you know, adding features players want might increase lag. Fixing "what's broke" and reducing lag means taking time off from adding features that players want. They are all the source of endless internal debate (passionate yelling debate let me tell you) and we do our best to balance them all.
If that's the case then I'm pretty sure everyone here would rather you put new content on hold and focused on fixing existing content and eliminating lag.
Heck make it a whole expansion if you want, call it Stakra. __________
"Welcome, to city 17. It's safer here." |
Amida Ta
German Mining and Manufacture Corp.
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Posted - 2010.04.17 14:44:00 -
[62]
Edited by: Amida Ta on 17/04/2010 14:45:44
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: Amida Ta I'd be VERY surprised if currently more than 10% of CCP staff is actively involved in Eve development (and I'm talking about last year, likely more).
Seeing as how they cross-develop a lot of things between their various products, you're surprised by default (unless you're implying that 80+% of the company is on permanent vacation).
I doubt that. A) They are using Scrum and a core rule of Scrum is: no cross-development. Every developer in a scrum team has to be 100% in that team and for that purpose. B) There is not really a lot they COULD cross-develop. Engine for a space sim used for a gothic mmo or a console fps? Hardly. And just because an artist thinks he may be able to reuse a model from dust for eve does not make that cross-development. _________________________ EveAI.Live - The EVE-Online API/class library for .Net, C# and VB.Net |
Vossejongk
Caldari Bendebeukers Green Rhino
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Posted - 2010.04.17 14:52:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Whattis
Originally by: Pottsey http://www.eveonline.com/tyrannis/default.asp mostly fluff no almost no new content.
Please tell us there is more than just that. That's not an expansion that's a mini content patch barely. What on earth have the Devs been working on all this time? Where is all he new gameplay content?
Is it me are the expansions content wise getting smaller and smaller? What happened to the good old days of Red Moon Rising style expansions?
CCP Stop releasing new content, fix lag first BAW CCP Where's my content BAW
BAW
RABBLE RABBLE But then again I cant really approve of any of this because this is my signature |
Hentes Zsemle
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Posted - 2010.04.17 15:00:00 -
[64]
CCP is lucky that there is no realy alternative for a spaceship nerd... yet... The decline in player numbers shows very well how satisfied we are. The last two expansions included stuff which was worth to check out, renew the subscription, even if for 2 months, but this one... where is the content in tyrannis?
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Tippia
Reikoku IT Alliance
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Posted - 2010.04.17 15:00:00 -
[65]
Edited by: Tippia on 17/04/2010 15:01:33
Originally by: Amida Ta I doubt that. A) They are using Scrum and a core rule of Scrum is: no cross-development. Every developer in a scrum team has to be 100% in that team and for that purpose.
Different cross-development. I'm talking about the features that will exist in multiple games (like the whole Incarna engine).
Quote: B) There is not really a lot they COULD cross-develop. Engine for a space sim used for a gothic mmo or a console fps? Hardly.
…except that they're using the same engine in both EVE Incarna and WoD, and that they're reusing (or, more accurately, tying together) the backbone data structure in EVE and Dust, and that graphical assets (not just models) take quite some time to develop, so reusing them for multiple games means that they're doing exactly what you're saying they're not doing: developing for both games at once.
In fact, instead of just doubting things for no reason, how about you take some time to look into what they're doing, how they're doing it, and why? ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki |
Im Blue
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Posted - 2010.04.17 15:02:00 -
[66]
Edited by: Im Blue on 17/04/2010 15:03:05
Originally by: Benri Konpaku
Originally by: CCP Manifest As you know, adding features players want might increase lag. Fixing "what's broke" and reducing lag means taking time off from adding features that players want. They are all the source of endless internal debate (passionate yelling debate let me tell you) and we do our best to balance them all.
If that's the case then I'm pretty sure everyone here would rather you put new content on hold and focused on fixing existing content and eliminating lag.
Heck make it a whole expansion if you want, call it Stakra.
agreed, please stop adding stuff until you fix what we do have. delay this expansion til teh end of teh year, 1. you might have it finished and including all you said would be in it. 2. teh in between time can spent fixing all the bugs
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Ban Doga
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Posted - 2010.04.17 15:08:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Im Blue Edited by: Im Blue on 17/04/2010 15:03:05
Originally by: Benri Konpaku
Originally by: CCP Manifest As you know, adding features players want might increase lag. Fixing "what's broke" and reducing lag means taking time off from adding features that players want. They are all the source of endless internal debate (passionate yelling debate let me tell you) and we do our best to balance them all.
If that's the case then I'm pretty sure everyone here would rather you put new content on hold and focused on fixing existing content and eliminating lag.
Heck make it a whole expansion if you want, call it Stakra.
agreed, please stop adding stuff until you fix what we do have. delay this expansion til teh end of teh year, 1. you might have it finished and including all you said would be in it. 2. teh in between time can spent fixing all the bugs
Adding new stuff is usually easier than fixing stuff that's broken. And it's usually easier to be used on a feature page.
I'd like to know if CCP is still following that 50:50 policy, keeping bug fixing and new content at about the same speed.
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Amberlamps
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Posted - 2010.04.17 15:12:00 -
[68]
Originally by: CCP Manifest
Your list is basically our 4 commandments, so I'm glad you put them in once place. fix whats broke add features that the players want reduce lag and above all communicate with the player base in the way that made EVE what it was
2/10, Trolling the userbase like that is so old.
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Merouk Baas
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.04.17 15:29:00 -
[69]
No, the Tyrannis feature page is not a major disappointment. It has some information, it has screenshots showing the in-game views of planetary stuff (which, heh, compared to the nice planetary vista splash screens used for advertising Tyrannis, are quite meh), and it gives an idea of what the expansion will contain.
I think you're confusing the feature page that they have out now with the page that they'll have up during the downtime when the patch Tyrannis in. That one should have a lot more information it. What they've posted now is appropriate for this time (one month until release).
I also think you're trying to say that Tyrannis will be disappointing. Which, ok. But your post doesn't say that, your post says that the web page is disappointing. The web page isn't; it's a well-designed and good-looking web page.
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Doc Fury
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Posted - 2010.04.17 15:31:00 -
[70]
Edited by: Doc Fury on 17/04/2010 15:34:18
Originally by: CCP Manifest ... PR whitewash..
Your list is basically our 4 commandments, so I'm glad you put them in once place. fix whats broke add features that the players want reduce lag and above all communicate with the player base ...
Ummm, when or where exactly were the players asking for PI?
Are you saying it was also players who asked for Alienware flashy support?
While I'd like to believe CCP abides by these so called commandments, I simply cannot since I have eyes, a long memory, and the fact that there are bugs in the game that have been here for years and ones that get fixed only to be re-introduced every other patch. Does the zoom being reset every time we undock or jump through a gate regression bug ring a bell? Cmon' how frakking hard is it to make sure you guys don't re-introduce the same stupid bugs over and over? Oh yeah, I forgot, CCP expects their subscribers to do the QA/QC heavy lifting, that's why.
The UI is still fundamentally a complete joke, there are lots of delete and cancel options in the various menus (that have been there for years) that still don't require user confirmation. This is basic UI development 101 stuff. I don't know how many times I've reported this very basic and specific deficiency over the last 4+ years (and others), with ZERO communication from CCP. The simple stuff that is so easily fixed always seems to be ignored.
So... How's that inifiniband upgrade working out?
CCP: promises made > promises kept.
The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'no.' |
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Merouk Baas
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.04.17 15:47:00 -
[71]
CCP, here's an idea that I've stolen from a friend of mine: let us vote on what we consider important. When people say "you haven't fixed the UI in 7 years!!!" neither you nor we know how big an issue the UI really is. Run a poll; you'll get an idea, and we might shut up once we realize that only 5 people out of 300,000 voted for UI fixes.
The CSM is supposed to run these kinds of polls, but they don't have the tools to do it (your forums don't support polls, duh!). So maybe you can modify the CSM voting mechanism a little and adapt it to let us vote on issues. It would be easier than implementing poll support for the forums.
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Deva Blackfire
Shut Up And Play WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2010.04.17 15:59:00 -
[72]
I cant remember which game had this but some MMO i played earlier had polls when you were loging in (or out... duh). Questions asked were about the future of the game. I doubt it would be hard to actually make a poll after you log in on character selection screen. And you could get a LOT of feedback this way...
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Empress Shai
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Posted - 2010.04.17 16:31:00 -
[73]
Edited by: Empress Shai on 17/04/2010 16:32:43 ]Edited for clarity[
It is still kind of interesting how ppl are complaining, when the severity of what we have seen achieved is still quite vast. I know the bugs, the jump to nowhere (desyncing), the lag in 0.0 and such are plaguing, but they are working to add more depth of content.
This is a first step in a line of site they have. First ships and stations, then wormholes to add depth. Then planet harvesting, then combat on those planets. After which we can walk on those stations and such.
I know no one wants to hear it, but I still think it's amazing. Yes allot of people are content with the way the game is, but allot of us are looking forward to what is to come.
AFTERALL, the point we started playing EVE is because it was immersive (well atleast me). I am glad they haven't dumbed it down like other MMOs, and have made it be something that seems vast when you first step in. None of the future "feature/upgrades/etc" are why I play it now, but they might be one day.
I know this much, I am excited about it, and I am hopeful. OK I will go back under my rock now.
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Pr1ncess Alia
Caldari Perkone
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Posted - 2010.04.17 17:06:00 -
[74]
i understand it's just not realistic to suggest they stop all development to work on bugs and performance issues. you cant go down to the art department and tell a bunch of artists to get cracking on some database issue
however, the company has resources and it would be better served reallocating their resources towards database/server/whatever issues until real combat in low sec is possible, until fleet fights in 0.0 are possible, etc...
I'm not sure the people in charge realize that this game (great game) requires a LOT of work by a LOT of people before all ships are in place for a fleet fight.
Caps or bs or whatever. people joke that these things cost next to nothing but they do not for the majority of players... and to have so much time and so much investment and man hours... so much coordination flushed down the drain when the moment all of this work has built up to ends up being either
-some choppy crap where you activate your mods on a target then watch the fight go by as your mods never turn off
-a lag for some fight for others when only half the players get to actually participate in the fight
-the all to common, wtf black screen you don't even get to watch the game flush your work and time down the drain. you don't know if your alive, you don't know if your dead and it takes upwards of an hour or more before you find out
these things are just unacceptable. you can experience this once or twice and say 'oh well, crap happens' but after that, it's simply not worth what you have invested in the game to risk it TRYING TO PLAY the game. and you end up doing something else.
some of these people get so upset they don't come back at all
CCP: we all know "you're working on it". I tell this to my boss all the time. But if I eventually do not produce tangible results I will have my head under the axe.
I hope the new stuff is great, but do you even know if it will WORK? I would have trouble believing you if you say it will, because the same game and basically same mechanics you have been working with for the past 7 years does not work, and you don't know why, and bottom line your customers are losing faith. And a new expansion just isn't what we want right now, not when the game already is broken.
Sort out your priorities and do whatever it is you need to do to fix the problem.
"A game that is significantly nonlinear is sometimes described as being open-ended or a sandbox, and is characterized by there being no "right way" of playing the game." |
Esharan
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.04.17 17:08:00 -
[75]
Simply put.... yes very dissapointed.
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Dodgy Past
Amarr Debitum Naturae BricK sQuAD.
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Posted - 2010.04.17 17:14:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Empress Shai It is still kind of interesting how ppl are complaining, when the severity of what we have seen achieved is still quite vast. I know the bugs, the jump to nowhere (desyncing), the lag in 0.0 and such are plaguing, but they are working to add more depth of content.
Nothing like logging on 2 evenings in a row and being completely unable to play because you're too close to major fleet fights.
The fact that so much that has been promised before is being completely ignored while a big feature set that has very little interest for most is being introduced is why people are particularly incensed. Especially when there is no reason to believe that we won't be rushed into a new expansion with the game still horribly broken from the last one. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- you seem determined to turn it into ******* Hollyoaks for neckbeards. |
Zeomebuch Nova
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Posted - 2010.04.17 17:21:00 -
[77]
Originally by: CCP Manifest Phew, TLDR Manifest! Gawsh.
What can improve that communication is, well, us. And me. And, I suppose, you. But please do not think these forums fall on deaf ears. It's not the case. They are invaluable for us since we can't sit in every chat, visit every corp website, tap every vent convo and read everyone of the awesome blog posts you guys write.
Capische?
My basic reply is... "yes, you are right". I guess I could have made this a lot shorter... oops.
Assault Frigate wants to have a conversation with you Sir.
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malfoy
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Posted - 2010.04.17 17:32:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Tippia Edited by: Tippia on 17/04/2010 15:01:33
Originally by: Amida Ta I doubt that. A) They are using Scrum and a core rule of Scrum is: no cross-development. Every developer in a scrum team has to be 100% in that team and for that purpose.
Different cross-development. I'm talking about the features that will exist in multiple games (like the whole Incarna engine).
Quote: B) There is not really a lot they COULD cross-develop. Engine for a space sim used for a gothic mmo or a console fps? Hardly.
àexcept that they're using the same engine in both EVE Incarna and WoD, and that they're reusing (or, more accurately, tying together) the backbone data structure in EVE and Dust, and that graphical assets (not just models) take quite some time to develop, so reusing them for multiple games means that they're doing exactly what you're saying they're not doing: developing for both games at once.
In fact, instead of just doubting things for no reason, how about you take some time to look into what they're doing, how they're doing it, and why?
i hope eventually they will tie in. deusex meets tribes, meets eve.
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Hixxy
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2010.04.17 17:47:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Khemul Zula
Originally by: ed jeni
and shanghai and Atlanta have been doing what for the last 3 1/2 years ? working on EVE mostly, thats what.
They have?
LOL
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Serpents smile
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Posted - 2010.04.17 17:52:00 -
[80]
Originally by: Pottsey So Serpents smile I take it that means you're happy with the size of the expansion? You also appear to think no one should ever complain.
Wait, what? I see what you didn't do there.
Answering your question, I can't since we don't have the full list of what will be in next expansion. I've been over to Sisi a few times and what is there is far from finished. How it will look like once it hit Tranquility, only CCP knows.
The current site feels like a placeholder. Until we get hold of the actual patch list, I try to give CCP the benefit of the doubt.
About complaining, meh, well, maybe I got too much into reading this part of the forums where complaints, tinfoil hattery run rampant every 2-3 posts. I hate it when some make it look like CCP is sitting on their behind drinking bree 23/7. They have, I strongly believe, a very dedicated team working on all kinds of things they don't tell us enough about. And, yes they f-up from time to time but that is where we come in and correct them as best as we can. I just think that a lot off the 'whaaa this', 'whaaa that', could have more impact if it was worded more constructively and had a bit more thought/ research behind it/ time to think about the post before actually being posted. Lord knows only how many posts I killed just seconds before posting them here, which is probably a very good thing that happened.
Anyway, I have to run for dinner. Hope i didn't offend you.
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Deva Blackfire
Shut Up And Play WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2010.04.17 18:14:00 -
[81]
Well shame that stuff usually gets removed not added in the last minute (unless i missed something).
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Zeba
Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company
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Posted - 2010.04.17 19:29:00 -
[82]
I would rather ccp went from two new content expansions each year to one MAJOR new content expansion with as much bug fixes as possible and one MAJOR bug fix and current content refining expansion. This gives the devs far more time to work on getting their ideas completely fleshed out and fully tested BEFORE it goes live. I mean sprints are great for getting stuff done quickly but why sprint and possibly miss stuff on the way due to going so fast when you could walk and not miss a thing? Hell as an easy example its time for the next expansion already and we STILL have the game killing lag that Dominion introduced with no solution in sight. Also refined current content can easily count as new content if it gets people to use it that normaly don't due to others telling them its crap and don't bother.
Originally by: CCP Zymurgist Get off the forums and go kill someone!
Originally by: Amarr Supremacist Yeah, it(Jaguar) almost has cruiser level tank and gank!
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Gunnanmon
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2010.04.17 19:39:00 -
[83]
Please don't criticise anything related to Eve.
Thank you. Signature locked for discussing moderation. Navigator
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Im Blue
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Posted - 2010.04.17 19:40:00 -
[84]
Originally by: CCP Manifest Phew, TLDR Manifest! Gawsh.
What can improve that communication is, well, us. And me. And, I suppose, you. But please do not think these forums fall on deaf ears. It's not the case. They are invaluable for us since we can't sit in every chat, visit every corp website, tap every vent convo and read everyone of the awesome blog posts you guys write.
Capische?
My basic reply is... "yes, you are right". I guess I could have made this a lot shorter... oops.
thought you might like this little bit of convo we had ina chat channel thsi evening, wasnt staged, just by teh end reminded me of thsi post of yours.
[19:20:58] yyy > what's the fuzz :-) [19:21:45] xxx > just talking about how sxxt planetry interaction is [19:22:16] yyy > aha, i guessed right then :-) [19:22:35] zzz > basically only good thing about it is yay new scorp model. [19:22:51] xxx > and thats meh [19:23:01] zzz > i think its better than the current one. [19:23:15] xxx > oh and there making some alien ware keybaords light up.. wooot [19:23:59] xxx > it might be, but they ahve so much more to do that just oh here look at a new ship model [19:24:19] xxx > fix the ui, fix the industral panel [19:24:27] xxx > fix the fxxxing role rent facty [19:24:39] zzz > fix the shxxty new mail [19:24:43] xxx > yeh [19:24:53] zzz > ohh wait no. something else we get [19:24:56] zzz > fix lag to pre dom lvls [19:24:59] xxx > higher res corp logos...... [19:25:04] xxx > yay [19:25:11] xxx > like who gives a fxxk [19:25:19] xxx > fix teh space part of teh space game [19:25:49] xxx > space ships fighting that dont fight propely ina space ship game, is a little bit fxxked up [19:26:17] zzz > still..... at least we arent playing wow [19:26:28] xxx > lmao [19:27:19] zzz > lol [19:27:21] zzz > ok yea [19:27:29] xxx > ccp may be shxxty in the game aspect [19:27:53] zzz > im waiting for a but [19:27:56] xxx > but at least they dont get payment glitches that charge thousands of dollars in subsriction fees in a matter of ten seconds [19:28:10] zzz > like blizzard had a little bit ago [19:28:22] xxx > is taht teh only thing that ccp is good at? [19:28:46] zzz > mmmmm....... i think so
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malfoy
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Posted - 2010.04.17 19:44:00 -
[85]
they are all betaing the new wow expantion. thats my theory anyway.
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Zeba
Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company
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Posted - 2010.04.17 19:45:00 -
[86]
Originally by: Im Blue wasnt staged
Of course.
Originally by: CCP Zymurgist Get off the forums and go kill someone!
Originally by: Amarr Supremacist Yeah, it(Jaguar) almost has cruiser level tank and gank!
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Im Blue
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Posted - 2010.04.17 19:49:00 -
[87]
Originally by: Zeba
Originally by: Im Blue wasnt staged
Of course.
no it wasnt, just i remebered that last bit of the gm's post. i cut the start of the channel discussion out as tbh i didnt want to relive this afternoons football results, 1 point clear is ok with 3 games to go, well i hope
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Verone
Gallente Veto Corp
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Posted - 2010.04.17 19:50:00 -
[88]
Originally by: Pottsey You also appear to think no one should ever complain.
I think the point that he's making is the fact that you barely ever do anything but complain.
The vast majority of the threads and post you make on these forums are whines, or snipes at CCP.
Honestly, if you're so disappointed with the game that you have to get a stick wedged in your ass over a features page on the website, maybe you should reconsider where you're investing your $14.95 a month.
>>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW <<< |
Zeba
Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company
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Posted - 2010.04.17 19:53:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Im Blue
Originally by: Zeba
Originally by: Im Blue wasnt staged
Of course.
no it wasnt, just i remebered that last bit of the gm's post. i cut the start of the channel discussion out as tbh i didnt want to relive this afternoons football results, 1 point clear is ok with 3 games to go, well i hope
Of course.
Originally by: CCP Zymurgist Get off the forums and go kill someone!
Originally by: Amarr Supremacist Yeah, it(Jaguar) almost has cruiser level tank and gank!
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Terianna Eri
Amarr Senex Legio Get Off My Lawn
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Posted - 2010.04.17 20:09:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Benri Konpaku
Originally by: CCP Manifest As you know, adding features players want might increase lag. Fixing "what's broke" and reducing lag means taking time off from adding features that players want. They are all the source of endless internal debate (passionate yelling debate let me tell you) and we do our best to balance them all.
If that's the case then I'm pretty sure everyone here would rather you put new content on hold and focused on fixing existing content and eliminating lag.
Heck make it a whole expansion if you want, call it Stakra.
We did that once - it was called Quantum Rise - people complained that there was no new content. And really, the people who are developing new content probably aren't the same people fixing bugs and working on lag. Thinking of new things to do and how to implement it so that it works well in-game is a different task from optimizing code and finding conflicts and such. ________________
Originally by: CCP Incognito PS the "time to P*nis" is the shortest time recorded in human history. :)
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