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Snatch Pinion Jita Exiles Strategic Warfare Operations Command 5	Posted - 2012.11.20 06:09:00 - [31] - Quote Zwo Zateki wrote: Mexan Caderu wrote: maybe the agreement communities should change the agreed mom killing time from "Withdrawing" to "Mobilizing", to keep things interesting I'm sure ISN will approve rite? RITE? Then ISN will kill the mom as soon as it spawns. Even if there is no other highsec incursion. We have seen this before. ISN = Brick Squad of 2011 = griefers. Last time that happened, TVP did it and left incursions down for half a day. You are as terrible at lying as you are trolling. Your hatred and fear of ISN is irrational and downright silly. Enough so you feel as though you can just make stuff up, take all your problems then point and scream that it's the fault of "those poeple". Train some skills, encourage others to train skills, get better, fly better ships, then come at us in proper contest instead of wailing moaning and lying.
Luscius Uta Unleashed' Fury Forsaken Federation 24	Posted - 2012.11.20 07:15:00 - [32] - Quote Incursions belong to everyone, so neither TVP or any other Incursion community should have a monopolly to killing moms. Finishing an Incursion before it starts withdrawing isn't griefing, griefing is to not finish it at all and leave all the people who participated without LPs. And I've seen a lot of highsec Incursions not finishing. So, for as long as TVP is not being able (or not willing) to focus on more than one Incursion at a time I will call them griefers instead of ISN.
Snatch Pinion Jita Exiles Strategic Warfare Operations Command 5	Posted - 2012.11.20 07:37:00 - [33] - Quote Luscius Uta wrote: Incursions belong to everyone, so neither TVP or any other Incursion community should have a monopolly to killing moms. Finishing an Incursion before it starts withdrawing isn't griefing, griefing is to not finish it at all and leave all the people who participated without LPs. And I've seen a lot of highsec Incursions not finishing. So, for as long as TVP is not being able (or not willing) to focus on more than one Incursion at a time I will call them griefers instead of ISN. Precisely. The reason it all came about. Reading 'ISN is doing "OUR HQ Sites" ' and 'ISN just killed "OUR MOMs" ' is exactly why ISN started contesting them, collecting "THEIR TEARS".
Salpad Carebears with Attitude 119	Posted - 2012.11.20 08:50:00 - [34] - Quote Luscius Uta wrote: Incursions belong to everyone, so neither TVP or any other Incursion community should have a monopolly to killing moms. Finishing an Incursion before it starts withdrawing isn't griefing, griefing is to not finish it at all and leave all the people who participated without LPs. And I've seen a lot of highsec Incursions not finishing. So, for as long as TVP is not being able (or not willing) to focus on more than one Incursion at a time I will call them griefers instead of ISN. As far as I'm concerned, Incursions should be stopped as quickly as possible, because they disrupt most other PVE gameplay in the affected systems, such as mission running and mining. So, if the game mechanics are such that stopping an Incursion ASAP is not encouraged, then they are badly designed.
Mexan Caderu Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 6	Posted - 2012.11.20 13:07:00 - [35] - Quote Game mechanics surrounding incursions are another discussion My guess is CCP doesn't want to reduce potential conflict generators, and as such won't change the base incursion mechanics. On topic: ISN = incursion goons, think they own incursions. A few days ago I even saw them 'reserve' a site by marking it with a can, then abandoning their current ongoing site to contest when their 'reserved' site was being ran. Next day they decided it was time to kill their mom, and they formed up a fleet to get it down. Yea ISN, incursions don't belong to you, they belong to everyb...err...this seems familiar somehow....think I red something along these lines a while ago... Regards, Mexan Caderu
Yimodo Emphebion Emperium 2	Posted - 2012.11.20 14:04:00 - [36] - Quote I have heard everything in this topic over and over again, if it is in this topic or our own forum post that inform people about ISN, how we run fleets and what requerments we have in our fleets. For some reason everyone is bitching about ISN and how the communitie is being run. The only thing we want is to run incursions, make ISK and do this as effective as we can. Not everyone agrees with this but this is how we run incursions. Most of the other incursion communities made an agreement who can take the mom in what incursion, armor or shield (however half of the armor mom fleets is made out of shield fits because the armor communitie is much smaller). And most of these shield pilots come from alot of communities because they made the agreement about who is allowed to take the mom. (ISN isnt in this btw because we dont agree with the agreement they made) So basicly what is comes to is that ISN want to be independent communitie not hold by the agreements of the other communities. We kill incursions when we want to but never before an other good highsec incursion spawns, the last incursion we killed was in a system with 1 station in all the incursion systems, I dont believe that anyone in any of the other communities liked this so much that they wanted to stay here. And beside that, TVP was forming a fleet to end the incursion themselfs they where just slower with putting a fleet up. I just wanted to make these points clear, I'm kinda sick of people making ISN the bad guy in everything. What is more important to me is the pilots that fly with ISN like how we fly and enjoy flying with ISN. On a second note we are always willing to help people with ship fits or extra info about incursions and if people cant fly the fits that are requered to join our fleets we point them towards TVP untill they are able to fly a pirate BS with T2 guns and modules. Greetings, Yimo PS. I know I will get trolled alot because of this because people dont believe it ISN - Incursion Shiny Network -á-á -á Public channel: ISN Secondary
Mexan Caderu Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 6	Posted - 2012.11.20 15:12:00 - [37] - Quote Yimodo wrote: So basicly what is comes to is that ISN want to be independent communitie not hold by the agreements of the other communities. Can you be a independent community in another incursion spawn ? If you are so independent then be independent the whole way, not only on the bits that are convenient to you. Do that and all ISN complaints will dry out. Quote: We kill incursions when we want to but never before an other good highsec incursion spawns, the last incursion we killed was in a system with 1 station in all the incursion systems, I dont believe that anyone in any of the other communities liked this so much that they wanted to stay here. And beside that, TVP was forming a fleet to end the incursion themselfs they where just slower with putting a fleet up. I do believe they were trying to form a mom response fleet to ISN, and not a "kill the mom ahead of the agreed time" fleet. Your move. Regards, Mexan Caderu
Yimodo Emphebion Emperium 3	Posted - 2012.11.20 15:56:00 - [38] - Quote Quote: Can you be a independent community in another incursion spawn ? If you are so independent then be independent the whole way, not only on the bits that are convenient to you. Do that and all ISN complaints will dry out. Can't or won't go to another incursion if more than one is up? then you are not independent and claiming to be so is hypocritical of your part. Mostly there is only 1 good highsec incursion up the last couple of times and that aside we also like the contests, this is what makes incursions more fun to run. Sometimes you win one and sometimes you lose one, that is part of the game. (this is for both ISN and other communities, it's not like they are only fun if you win them) Quote: I do believe they were trying to form a mom response fleet to ISN, and not a "kill the mom ahead of the agreed time" fleet I believe it was the other way around, most of us where still in the Tournament match with our heads and talking stuff over and joking around about making a mom fleet. When we got the word about TVP joining fleet with TDF to kill the mom we started forming up (But this can be an endless discussion because you think you are right and I think I'm right) I mostly just want this crap to be over, we all want to fly incursions and let the pilots decide with who they fly, TVP, ISN, ICU, DIN, TDF or what other communities are out there. We all want the same thing, run incursions and make ISK, all in our own way. I also dont like that people start trolling or saying bad things about ISN in our own advertising forumpost. (You always have people that do or do not like some people, alliances, corps or communities. That is never going to change) ISN - Incursion Shiny Network -á-á -á Public channel: ISN Secondary
Mexan Caderu Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 6	Posted - 2012.11.20 16:04:00 - [39] - Quote Yimodo wrote: Quote: I do believe they were trying to form a mom response fleet to ISN, and not a "kill the mom ahead of the agreed time" fleet I believe it was the other way around, most of us where still in the Tournament match with our heads and talking stuff over and joking around about making a mom fleet. When we got the word about TVP joining fleet with TDF to kill the mom we started forming up (But this can be an endless discussion because you think you are right and I think I'm right) That's odd ... I was in TDF at the last mom popping time looking for a replacement logi and no mom fleet was announced. Also TVP was business as usual. I then noticed mom formup messages in ISN secondary ... Maybe you got information that the rest of us plebeians didn't get ?
Yimodo Emphebion Emperium 3	Posted - 2012.11.20 16:16:00 - [40] - Quote Quote: That's odd ... I was in TDF at the last mom popping time looking for a replacement logi and no mom fleet was announced. Also TVP was business as usual. Later I noticed mom formup messages in ISN secondary ... Maybe you got information about TVP/TDF management plans that the rest of us plebeians didn't get ? or did I miss TVP/TDF mom forming up O.o Like I said, I believe, and we can go back and forth with this over and over again, we both think we are right. That can happen I dont have a perfect memory but this is how I recall it. (I can be wrong of course) And you dont need to put yourself or anyone else down like that. Non of us are more then the other, we just all have our own way of doing stuff. Every incursion communitie has their own way and some pilots feel comfortable with one communitie and other with an other one. Its all personal preference. ISN - Incursion Shiny Network -á-á -á Public channel: ISN Secondary
Tonali Recursions 1	Posted - 2012.11.21 02:04:00 - [41] - Quote ^ Hopefully all ISN members understand what the above symbolizes and what can / will happen if one such ISN member chooses to ignore it. _kay
SkyMarshaller SkyMarshaller Corp 3	Posted - 2012.11.21 02:38:00 - [42] - Quote As someone new to incursions, I find this whole debate pathetic & pointless. As Yimodo said "...we all want to fly incursions and let the pilots decide with who they fly, TVP, ISN, ICU, DIN, TDF or what other communities are out there. We all want the same thing, run incursions and make ISK, all in our own way..." When I first researched this matter, I decided on flying with ISN because I lked the way they ran their side of things. That was my personal choice & I'm glad of it. Other people may have different opinions, but that is their right. I've only ventured outside the ISN fold once (Lv6) & got on well with the guys in that group. I will go back again, if & when ISN doesn't have a fleet going. I will never fly with any group who appear to do nothing more than grief/troll these forums, canning ISN at any & every opportunity. I am sure that there are many other people out there like me who read this stuff & think to themselves that if ISN is so disliked by these trolling/griefing communities then maybe they (ISN) are doing something right! I don't believe it is proper for anyone to sit here bad mouthing TVP v ISN (or vice versa). Each group will suit different people, so why not debate this sensibly & give people considering venturing into incursions (which after all this debate is all about) proper information with which to make a considered decision.
Snatch Pinion Jita Exiles Strategic Warfare Operations Command 6	Posted - 2012.11.21 07:26:00 - [43] - Quote Contest a site while they leave one on hold? ISK efficiency? Contesting? Welcome to game mechanics.
Mexan Caderu Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 6	Posted - 2012.11.21 09:55:00 - [44] - Quote SkyMarshaller wrote: Each group will suit different people, so why not debate this sensibly & give people considering venturing into incursions (which after all this debate is all about) proper information with which to make a considered decision. The gist: TVP = shield tank / low-medium fitting requirements, known for having HQ fleet running from downtime to downtime ISN = shield tank / high fitting requirements, known for terminating incursions that still had 1-3 days left to be farmed and contesting various sites for increasing their isk/h, fleet is active a few hrs/day TDF = armor tank / low-medium fitting requirements, known to be rather inactive, but fleets do eventually form for AS/VG sites Lv6 & Pheonix, DIn flotten &friends= high fitting requirements, known to frequent AS/VG sites, some will form up HQ fleet when there are enough active pilots. Fleet is active a few hrs/day for any 1 community, less overlap means there is usually something up during the 23h day. BTL = dead Legend: HQ= Headquarter site, 40 man fleet AS= Assault site, 20 man fleet VG= Vanguard site, 10 man fleet
Caellach Marellus Aideron Technologies 636	Posted - 2012.11.21 11:04:00 - [45] - Quote "Why can't they go somewhere else?" Why should they? No one has monopoly over incursions, and in the end the strong survive. They marked their current site with a can so they could identify it when they were done contesting another? That's just game mechanics and competitive gameplay. Almost didn't think I'd use these words in EVE, but welcome to competitive PvE. You have two choices if ISN fleets are constantly rolling you in sites, improve or accept it happens. Whining on a forum isn't going to change anything. Too much goddamn entitlement in this thread, it's a FFA, and not everyone has to play by your idea of the rules in the sandbox. Enjoy your gaming. http://northern-goblin.blogspot.com
Zwo Zateki Imperial Dreams Curatores Veritatis Alliance 28	Posted - 2012.11.21 15:12:00 - [46] - Quote Caellach Marellus wrote: "Why can't they go somewhere else?" Why should they? No one has monopoly over incursions, and in the end the strong survive. They marked their current site with a can so they could identify it when they were done contesting another? That's just game mechanics and competitive gameplay. Almost didn't think I'd use these words in EVE, but welcome to competitive PvE. You have two choices if ISN fleets are constantly rolling you in sites, improve or accept it happens. Whining on a forum isn't going to change anything. Too much goddamn entitlement in this thread, it's a FFA, and not everyone has to play by your idea of the rules in the sandbox. Yep, when ISN shiny fleet follows TVP into every single site, the latter just blob and kick ISN out of the system :P
goldiiee Tax and War Haven 68	Posted - 2012.11.21 16:02:00 - [47] - Quote Zwo Zateki wrote: Caellach Marellus wrote: "Why can't they go somewhere else?" Why should they? No one has monopoly over incursions, and in the end the strong survive. They marked their current site with a can so they could identify it when they were done contesting another? That's just game mechanics and competitive gameplay. Almost didn't think I'd use these words in EVE, but welcome to competitive PvE. You have two choices if ISN fleets are constantly rolling you in sites, improve or accept it happens. Whining on a forum isn't going to change anything. Too much goddamn entitlement in this thread, it's a FFA, and not everyone has to play by your idea of the rules in the sandbox. Yep, when ISN shiny fleet follows TVP into every single site, the latter just blob and kick ISN out of the system :P Great thought, but reality doesn't seem to not be your strong point. That worked out really well for them last time, right? They won the contest but did not get paid as they had over 60 people on grid to beat our 40. As of the time of this post Zwo ISN has never left a system due to contesting, and we have not seen this 'blob' that your speak of. Are you sure that's the 'story' you want to go with? I am still not sure why all the hostility and hatred you have for ISN, you flew with us for a couple months if i remember correctly and during that time you were one of our biggest supporters. Or was that just a lie as well? There is no "I" in "team." but there are 5 in "narcissistic personality disorder."
Lancastor Dex BLUE Regiment. 5	Posted - 2012.11.21 16:35:00 - [48] - Quote I love the innocent start of this thread and slow inevitable blood&guts end of it My post will follow pretty much same direction. Most was already said. TVP(and TDF) is basicaly enterance level incursion community and definitely a good place to start. ISN on the other hand has higher standards like T2 gunz and rigs and for most part faction battleships/logi + skill at lvl 5. Main concern of ISN is to make ISK as effectively and fast as possible. Winning a contest goes big way towards this goal, not ot mention it adds a FUN and competition factor to otherwise dull routine. So Zwo Zateki that is the real reason why we are following your fleets everywhere. (No its not because of your charm, sry...) If you do not like it - DEAL WITH IT! I see a lot of posts about how ISN kills moms prematurely. Its funny how all the posts are comming from 2 or 3 people. Did you get paid to do it or you are really that shortsighted and delusional? Amount of desinformation you spread around is rly commendable. Case in point was mom contest cca 2 weeks ago. ISN was slowly forming HQ running fleet, when i saw very amusing intel in TVP channel "ISN has formed 2 HQ fleets and plan to kill mom prematurely". With cca 30 ppl in fleet at that time it made us laugh. TVP response was even better. They made joint 70 man "response" fleet with TDF and hit the mom site. Being a willing contenders we went in with 45 ppl and won the contest. This is pretty much the scenario for every mom contest. Personaly i don't remeber when we warped into mom site before TVP/TDF fleets. And of course when they go in, a spirit of good contest dictates that ISN must respond. Original idea of Incursions was for them to be a bridge between PVE and PVP and when you look at it this way, contesting sites is just the thing. It is sort of Fleet vs Fleet combat. I dont want TVP to sound as a bad guys. They have my BIG thanx a respect for training incursion newbies and they are doing a good job. However less drama, shortsightidness and false propaganda wouldn't hurt. CU in next contest
Coffeinum Marcabian 5th Invasion Fleet 0	Posted - 2012.11.22 16:23:00 - [49] - Quote Lancastor Dex wrote: I love the innocent start of this thread and slow inevitable blood&guts end of it My post will follow pretty much same direction. Most was already said. TVP(and TDF) is basicaly enterance level incursion community and definitely a good place to start. ISN on the other hand has higher standards like T2 gunz and rigs and for most part faction battleships/logi + skill at lvl 5. Main concern of ISN is to make ISK as effectively and fast as possible. Winning a contest goes big way towards this goal, not ot mention it adds a FUN and competition factor to otherwise dull routine. So Zwo Zateki that is the real reason why we are following your fleets everywhere. (No its not because of your charm, sry...) If you do not like it - DEAL WITH IT! I see a lot of posts about how ISN kills moms prematurely. Its funny how all the posts are comming from 2 or 3 people. Did you get paid to do it or you are really that shortsighted and delusional? Amount of desinformation you spread around is rly commendable. Case in point was mom contest cca 2 weeks ago. ISN was slowly forming HQ running fleet, when i saw very amusing intel in TVP channel "ISN has formed 2 HQ fleets and plan to kill mom prematurely". With cca 30 ppl in fleet at that time it made us laugh. TVP response was even better. They made joint 70 man "response" fleet with TDF and hit the mom site. Being a willing contenders we went in with 45 ppl and won the contest. This is pretty much the scenario for every mom contest. Personaly i don't remeber when we warped into mom site before TVP/TDF fleets. And of course when they go in, a spirit of good contest dictates that ISN must respond. Original idea of Incursions was for them to be a bridge between PVE and PVP and when you look at it this way, contesting sites is just the thing. It is sort of Fleet vs Fleet combat. I dont want TVP to sound as a bad guys. They have my BIG thanx a respect for training incursion newbies and they are doing a good job. However less drama, shortsightidness and false propaganda wouldn't hurt. CU in next contest the thing is, do you have any idea why they started HQs in the first place dp ypu? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZk_qfvc9ac (change resolution till it works) A) you can't survive in an incursion system by yourself B) you can't win contests against equally fitted fleets C) go run NCNs
Nadia Gallen Advanced Engineering and Research Division 6	Posted - 2012.11.22 19:03:00 - [50] - Quote As they said, well played ^^ I do love that movie though... EVERYONE!!!! I might even put Leon on tonight, make popcorns... gonna be sweet!
Nituspar Z-ward 2	Posted - 2012.11.22 20:37:00 - [51] - Quote Quote: the thing is, do you have any idea why they started HQs in the first place, do you? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZk_qfvc9ac (change resolution till it works) Interesting, here i thought we started doing HQ's beacuse of the huge member-demand for them and us starting to have the numbers for it. I do however love how ISN losing two contests becomes a huge thing worth making a video about for another community, it just shows how far we've gotten over the last year Btw, if you're this confident in your fleets, why has DIN been doing their best to avoid us us in hq's? Charadrass actually chickened out and warped off from the first pocket of a TPPH we came into late to contest the last time our fleets met. Quote: A) you can't survive in an incursion system by yourself We've cleared incursions on our own plenty of times now, last one was actually done as a birthday gift to goldiiee. Lone incursions don't however bring contests which our members look forward to and are nice for both isk and breaking the monotony of farming sites. Quote: B) you can't win contests against equally fitted fleets This is a pretty funny statement as DIN's, as most other incursion communities' current fits are actually carbon-copied from the fits ISN researched to be better than what the majority used before ISN was around. As for contests we've won plenty, and lost some as well in the process. As long as the long-term numbers favour us by a large enough margin I don't see there being anything to worry about. This is the case when it comes to DIN as well, and why we don't exactly worry or acknowledge your community as any kind of a problem to us, similar to TVP. Quote: C) go run NCNs Boring sites, even though we did manage to get them down to 11-12 minutes.
Tonali Recursions 3	Posted - 2012.11.23 04:26:00 - [52] - Quote Quote: A) you can't survive in an incursion system by yourself Liberation of Reya complete From: CONCORD Sent: 2012.09.08 01:13 Maraudian Reya has been freed from the invading Sansha forces. Your efforts in this matter have not gone unnoticed and we are awarding you loyalty points. More details can be found in the Journal. In addition, we wish to honor the following pilots, whose individual contribution exceeded everyone else: 1 0bscurum Skord 110821 2 Yeyra 110821 3 Maraudian 110821 4 KarlSteiner 110821 5 drifter1357 110821 6 Chandra K'ailar 103665 7 Judge Ment 98416 8 4Manimal 92045 9 dark102042 Arzi 86866 CONCORD -- No one fully reads the thread they post in before hand?
Ahvram Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State 0	Posted - 2012.11.26 14:40:00 - [53] - Quote Maraudian wrote: Quote: Liberation of Reya complete From: CONCORD Sent: 2012.09.08 01:13 Maraudian Reya has been freed from the invading Sansha forces. Your efforts in this matter have not gone unnoticed and we are awarding you loyalty points. More details can be found in the Journal. In addition, we wish to honor the following pilots, whose individual contribution exceeded everyone else: 1 0bscurum Skord 110821 2 Yeyra 110821 3 Maraudian 110821 4 KarlSteiner 110821 5 drifter1357 110821 6 Chandra K'ailar 103665 7 Judge Ment 98416 8 4Manimal 92045 9 dark102042 Arzi 86866 CONCORD All ISN? :) So you guys ran one incursion for a day! When you start popping Concord list up with 400k+ LP per pilot and they are all ISN ill be impressed. O wait TVP and its sister communities do that nearly every incursion..... But ISN makes more money... Dont be fooled. They cant keep fleets going enough to compete with the legit upfront incursion communities. They want to keep themselves seperate from TVP because its easy to have someone else do the work for you then claim your the best. This is EVE if you cant be the best Grief the best and feel special about it.
Kodavor Jesus Saves 1 . 53	Posted - 2012.11.26 17:11:00 - [54] - Quote You , folk , amuse me . Please continue .
goldiiee Tax and War Haven 76	Posted - 2012.11.27 00:19:00 - [55] - Quote Ahvram wrote: Maraudian wrote: Quote: Liberation of Reya complete From: CONCORD Sent: 2012.09.08 01:13 Maraudian Reya has been freed from the invading Sansha forces. Your efforts in this matter have not gone unnoticed and we are awarding you loyalty points. More details can be found in the Journal. In addition, we wish to honor the following pilots, whose individual contribution exceeded everyone else: 1 0bscurum Skord 110821 2 Yeyra 110821 3 Maraudian 110821 4 KarlSteiner 110821 5 drifter1357 110821 6 Chandra K'ailar 103665 7 Judge Ment 98416 8 4Manimal 92045 9 dark102042 Arzi 86866 CONCORD All ISN? :) So you guys ran one incursion for a day! When you start popping Concord list up with 400k+ LP per pilot and they are all ISN ill be impressed. O wait TVP and its sister communities do that nearly every incursion..... But ISN makes more money... Dont be fooled. They cant keep fleets going enough to compete with the legit upfront incursion communities. They want to keep themselves seperate from TVP because its easy to have someone else do the work for you then claim your the best. This is EVE if you cant be the best Grief the best and feel special about it. Took some time to decide if this even deserved an answer, still not sure but I figure I should at least correct some mistakes. The incursion listed above was one we went to when it was in withdrawl. We arrived at 100% constellation control and ground down the control, spawned the kundalini, and popped the MOM in about 4 or 5 hours. It was my birthday so I remember it well. As I look back at emails from completed Incursions I find at least one ISN member on virtually every top ten mail. So do ISN members make more ISK than TVP members? As a matter of pure ISK as a component of time, then yes. As a matter of total ISK in the pocket, probably not. To explain in simpler terms if I spend 4 hours on in an ISN fleet I will make a minimum of 400 million ISK. If I spend 6 hours on I am usually awarded with 700 million ISK. As I personally like to play a little every day but only fleet up every other day I tend to add 1 to 2 billion to my wallet every week. As you pointed out TVP has members on this list every time, I am not aware of how many hours these people had to spend in game doing Warp,Activate,f1,f1,f1,f1,f1,Warp, repeat ad infinitum, to get on that list, but I can extrapolate from the amount of time it takes for TVP to complete a site, and do the math. Averaging it out and leaving the boring math stuff on a scratch pad I am getting 33 hours in optimal fleet without breaks. The same amount of lP converted to time in an ISN fleet is 14 hours in optimal fleet without breaks. So the next time you think contesting is griefing remember these numbers and think of the time we spend actually playing the game and not Warp,Activate,f1,f1,f1,f1,f1,GÇªGÇªGÇª. Reason and logic never wins over Stubborn and Convinced-á (But-áI still try..)
LYGIA Assisted Genocide Black Legion. 8	Posted - 2013.01.09 00:42:00 - [56] - Quote Good Information for Incursion ;)
Barrogh Habalu Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire 369	Posted - 2013.01.09 10:37:00 - [57] - Quote Tonali wrote: 1 0bscurum Skord 110821 2 Yeyra 110821 3 Maraudian 110821 4 KarlSteiner 110821 5 drifter1357 110821 6 Chandra K'ailar 103665 7 Judge Ment 98416 8 4Manimal 92045 9 dark102042 Arzi 86866 Before this recent drama started, those top numbers were around 400k LP each. Makes me wonder what happened recently, really. I used to run incursions with a small community a couple of months ago and every one lasted almost a week. Today it almost looks like by the time our lads reach new incursion, it is popped Someone really likes traveling and waiting for low/null sec incursions to expire.

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