| Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Rowan
   |
Posted - 2003.06.28 14:44:00 -
[1]
Times in the document are MST. This was logged Friday, June 27th.
http://servers.durp.org/pann.doc
Edited by: Rowan on 28/06/2003 14:44:59
Thread locked - please see comment at the end of the thread for more details - Mayumi
|
Zora
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 14:55:00 -
[2]
hmm... thanks, very interesting read :)
|
Jash Illian
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:05:00 -
[3]
Dare I ask WTF WAS THAT?!?
That is the most...bah, I won't go into it. If I did, it'd be ugly. I will say CCP needed to review their staff...
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Shinana
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:12:00 -
[4]
Pann has always been very outspoken compared to other community managers (EA, Blizzard, those guys usually respond very minimally and vaguely). To be honest, I like her forthrightness, even if I don't always agree with what she says (that doesn't mean I disagree with her here. I neither confirm nor deny, senator.).
|
Axelay
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:19:00 -
[5]
Definately..
That explains why the dozens of suggestions I have sent to Pannish have gone by without notice. I think I will mail them to Campion, he seems to have a bit more of an objective outlook on how the game dynamics need to be changed.
Rather than the emotional standpoing of 'm0o is bad!! ban them all!'
And how unprofessional is it to publicly accuse an entire group of exploiting when there is absolutely no evidence to support it?
Crazy..
I thought she was more mature than to sink to such depths of emotional un-objectivity.
_____
m0o
|
Vacuole
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:24:00 -
[6]
Is there some irrefutable evidence that that was really Pann?
All I saw was some chat long thing..
|
Daemun Khanid
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:25:00 -
[7]
First off, I don't believe that should have been posted without the consent of all parties involved. Second, as far as what Pann said I agree. Certain persons are known to have used and still use exploits regardless of the excuses and denials the spew forth. Some people seem to have a real problem understanding the definition of exploit. I say stop playing nice and treat them the way anyone found to be cheating or using exploits should be treated. Ban them and move on.
Edited by: Daemun Khanid on 28/06/2003 15:28:42
VADM. Daemun of Khanid |
CortexX
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:26:00 -
[8]
To some degree I agree with Pan
There has to be far too much focus and time wasted dealing with MOO and all the petitions and aggro they cause . Id rather see this time spent adding content to the game for the benefit of everyone else .
As members of the playerbase MoO have a responsibilty to their fellow players to act with some sensibility and behave in a realisticly acceptable manner . Unfortunately they dont see this point of view .
There are ways to play the pirate character without indescriminate killing of everyone they find . Now they find that everyone logs and docks when they are around , they have made the game boring as hell for themselves and are now complaining about it.
If Pan and the rest of his staff really feel like this ( a larger percentage of the playerbase certainly do )then i suggest they make an example of M0o and ban them and dissolve their corp .
This should be followed with some guidelines for pirating for the other pirates to follow . This is a compromise i have seen in other online games .
The systematic killing of noobs is very detrimental to the game , if the game gets a bad reputation for this it will very quickly show in the numbers . Most people start playing a game online after checking out its reviews and reading its forums . No matter how you look at it or what your opinion is , this is a solid fact that can`t be ignored !
Its about time for CCP to show some sack and act for the good of the game .
CortexX
(freelancers guild member)
|
Flaloch
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:27:00 -
[9]
If that was Pann....
1) Fix the game
2) Go Pann !!!!
"The people expected it of me and I had got to do it; I could feel their two thousand wills pressing me forward, irresistibly. "
- Orwell |
Luka Liki
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:29:00 -
[10]
Axelay, you seem well knowledged about exploits. Maybe you should try not be so 'straight-to-the-cheese' next time.
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=12959
|
Jash Illian
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:34:00 -
[11]
<< (EA, Blizzard, those guys usually respond very minimally and vaguely). >>
I'd take EA or Blizzard when it comes to whether or not comments from official sources are colored by personal feelings.
Bah...screw it, I'm gonna go into it. That is by far the most unprofessional display I've seen out of CCP to date. If an employee of any other business that involves customer service went so far to display their personal opinion of someone so publically, I'd be demanding to speak with their manager. Oops...CCP doesn't have a Customer Service Manager to my knowledge.
This will quickly get turned into "Pann said that m0o was exploiters!" which is obviously wrong since she apparently lacks any evidence to support her beliefs. As a Community Manager, way to frellin go </sarcasm>. Those little personal opinions will be used for the coming weeks to as gospel that m0o is exploiting. The fact that it's only a personal belief lacking evidence (or would you care to explain having evidence yet allowing them to stay?) will be lost.
As an official representative of CCP who is going to be quoted even if she belches...Well I fire people that pull stunts like that in front of my customers.
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Damon Vile
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:42:00 -
[12]
That log isn't the whole story..as always
Someone asked pann what she thought of the whole thing. She asked moo if it was ok to post her personal opinion of the "moo problem" Both moo ppl ( strav and jort ) said go for it.
There are far to many games out there where you never hear from the devs at all. CCP may not always say what you want to hear but atleast they talk to you like you're a person.
|
Sankari Kinoi
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:48:00 -
[13]
Oh please, are we all that fragile that we can't read a little comment from a Game Company Rep?
It was unprofessional?
It was Pann's personal opinion. Big deal.
Yep, CCP should fix the lag loophole which m0o love to use. But that's no excuse to actually use it.
CCP should published a "Fair-Play" policy. It's nice to try and create a no-rules world, but it's far to obvious it'll never work whilst people try and look for an advantage over others.
|
Vacuole
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:48:00 -
[14]
Ya, I kind of suspected that the "chat log" was either trimmed for content (to someone's own specification), or fabricated entirely.
I'm not suprised that the whole story wasn't presented there.
|
Jash Illian
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:49:00 -
[15]
<< CCP may not always say what you want to hear but atleast they talk to you like you're a person. >>
Maybe that's why they keep looking like amateurs.
There is no such thing as "Off the record" for a developer, any more than there is for a politician. Anything they say will be taken as gospel. The Gospel According to Pann is that m0o are a bunch of exploiters. So:
1) Where's the proof?
2) Why are they still here?
If those questions can't be answered, then she never should have said a single word in public.
Vacuole and Damon Vile:
Maybe I read better than most but I think
"[08:04:PM] <Pann> I would never say this publicly, but if you're here, j0rt, and you have no problem with me saying this in front of other people, I will say it.
[08:04:PM] <j0rt^> say what you want"
most people should have caught that.
Sankari Kinoi:
Yes it's unprofessional. It's not about being too fragile to handle the truth. It's about stirring up more crap with your personal opinons that are going to be taken as an official stance despite all logic. "Pann said m0o are exploiters!" but yet they're still playing the game.
Daemun Khanid:
I read the log line for line. Most companies I know, mine included, fire people for stating their personal opinion about any client or customer in public. It doesn't matter whether or not people agree with that opinion.
Edited by: Jash Illian on 28/06/2003 15:58:22
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Daemun Khanid
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:50:00 -
[16]
Anyone who has something negative to say about Pann's comments really should read the entire log more thoroughly and follow what was being said. I don't think Pan was out of line in anyway what-so-ever.
VADM. Daemun of Khanid |
Anaconda
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:55:00 -
[17]
This is over today. I am leaving EvE. I have never seen another MMORPG handling customer problems in these amateur ways.
CCP has put the rules of the game and some people are using THAT rules to kill other people. Damn it why don't you just raise security rating of systems instead of banning customers without reasons. After seeing this actions noone will want to be pirate anymore.
The game is over boring, and if you destroy pvp element too, it will be a just mining simulator and you will lose customers in time.
I have always defended you since beta 5 and i always told people to be patient and give time to CCP. But this is too far, i wish you good luck and i hope you won't get bankrupted.
|
Torval Sontu
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 15:57:00 -
[18]
Yes again people are being selective on what others say.
Pann gave a personal opinion that didn't reflect CCP's views so why are people upset?
Apparently more people agree with Pann's views in IRC than on the boards so :).
Regardless people should know how Stavr0s thinks and views this game not to mention his fellow corp members. They have made it obvious from the get go and I do agree with some views even if they go about them wrong.
I guess people like defending silly acts much like a teenager being a smartass to a cop thinking they can't do anything to them since they are underage.
In the end though this attempt at trolling I have to give a 6/10 since I expected this after last night.
Anyhoo at the end of the day...
|
Slam
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 16:00:00 -
[19]
all I read is:
*m0o thumping chest*
*Pann thumping chest*
Morb talking reason
*m0o thumping chest*
*Pann thumping chest*
Morb and Athan talking reason
etc. etc.
|
Rowan
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 16:04:00 -
[20]
Vacuole, if you want to see the log with all the joins, away messages, and disconnects back in, i'll send it to you. I took those out and double-spaced it so it was easier to read. As far as whether or not that was the real Pann, ask j0rt or stavr0s, they'll tell you she was there.
And Torval, if you're accusing me of trolling, grow up. All I was doing was posting something I thought the general population that isn't on #eve-online would be interested in.
Edited by: Rowan on 28/06/2003 16:10:39
Edited by: Rowan on 28/06/2003 16:11:38
|
Cymoril
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 16:09:00 -
[21]
I think the part about M0o that is the funniest, is how whenever they are accused of exploiting, their response almost always includes, "But the game let's us do it, so how is that an exploit? We are just doing what the game lets us do."
Is it possible to be more stupid? Think for a minute, by definition, an exploit is something that the game allows you to do, but you shouldn't be doing it. If the game didn't allow for something, how the hell COULD you exploit it?
Now they are whining that they have nothing to do. Well, go play something else then. CCP owes you nothing. If you are bored with this game, it is your own fault.
CCP's biggest error isn't in their programming. It is in their lack of commiting to what is an exploit and what isn't. Every time you log in, players should be expected to read the news window that pops up. Exploits should be clearly defined here (until they get fixed). If a player does something that is listed as being an exploit, they get banned. This way, there would be no argueing, no ambiguity, no crying. All CCP would have to do at that point is say, "We clearly listed this activity as an exploit, and you continued to do it anyway." Problem solved. |
Buttercup
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 16:12:00 -
[22]
"This is over today. I am leaving EvE. I have never seen another MMORPG handling customer problems in these amateur ways."
ok, lets get this right. Pann recived PERMISSION from the client before stating a personal opinion, amateur? no, thats your reaction.
ppl get upset cuz this is panns opinion? as far as i kow, Pann is NOT a dev, but brings the issues and comments that we have TO them, NOT fix them herself. less then a week ago, 99% were all yelling for Pann to do/say something, if there was anyway to do it, this was the most pro. way to do it. Everyone has opinions, Pann does not effect the game with personal opinions, DEV's *MIGHT*, this is also not a dev.
moo said there was no 1 there size to fight em? hahaha, stop the cargo droping and the station hugging, and i'm sure there are plenty of corps willing to take a shot :)
pillow fights and brownies |
Yangja Isuko
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 16:13:00 -
[23]
stop whining people. both sides.
YOU!
YOU!
shut UP.
|
Luka Liki
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 16:18:00 -
[24]
*Hands Yangja Isuko some fresh cheese*
|
Setec
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 16:23:00 -
[25]
<Setec> woah just read that log of pann talking about m0o, that's nuts
<Quantum> Pretty crazy huh?
<Setec> i wonder if the server has the nickname pann reserved for her or if somebody could imposter
* Setec is now known as Pann
<Elixir> hİhİ
<dk2> Setec: wheres it at?
* Pann is now known as Setec
<[Talon]Revolution> got link?
<Setec> answers that!!
Aha!
It wasn't necessarily actually Pann. The channel does not have that nickname reserved for the real Pann or anything. Sounds to me like it's an imposter.
___________________________________________
Space Invaders website: http://www.si-corp.net |
Jash Illian
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 16:27:00 -
[26]
<< Aha!
It wasn't necessarily actually Pann. The channel does not have that nickname reserved for the real Pann or anything. Sounds to me like it's an imposter. >>
Okay, Setec. I'll call off the dogs as that's actually a good point, unlike the ones coming from the "Nerds in Love with Any Female on the Net".
Personally, I find it completely credible that the real Pann would post something like that in an IRC channel based on past observance of her. But we can wait till Pann comes here and comments. Which I seriously doubt she will.
Edited by: Jash Illian on 28/06/2003 16:27:56
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Adam DeBlade
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 16:32:00 -
[27]
Axelay? no proof? thats like standing with a smoking gun and say "i didnt do it" unfortunatley there is ALOT of proof of what many members have done in m0o |
Jash Illian
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 16:39:00 -
[28]
<< Axelay? no proof? thats like standing with a smoking gun and say "i didnt do it" unfortunatley there is ALOT of proof of what many members have done in m0o >>
Then why aren't they banned? And don't give me that "CCP is just trying to be nice" or "They're using them to find bugs" crap. Neither are worth allowing exploiters to remain in the game.
So where is the proof (and not your opinion of what is an exploit either, since you have no authority to declare exploits)?
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Spider Jeru
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 16:46:00 -
[29]
Oops. I hate when I accidentally leave dozens of containers laying around the belts like this
http://firefrost.free.fr/eve/raid_on_m00/Image9.jpg
|
MaiLina KaTar
|
Posted - 2003.06.28 16:48:00 -
[30]
Well those 2 screens posted in the chat are proof enough to me.
If that was really Pann chatting then I don¦t see any problem with it. You asked her for her personal opinion, she told you her opinion and now you whine about it? Really... THAT¦S lame.
You play lame, so don¦t wonder when people tell you just that. And don¦t act like you¦re all righteous or something, you¦re not.
If you so hate the mechanics of the game and are so upset about them, and if you "own anything" and are "so bored" then why the hell don¦t you just leave? Answer is simple: You love all the attention and for once in your life you¦re in the middle of something and people talk about you... something that obviously wasn¦t done in any other game.
In other games people who do these kinds of things simply get banned, actually you should be happy with CCP or their representatives. They are nice enough to even let guys like you be around.
Mai's Idealog |
| |
|
| Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |