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Suggestions to improve both pirates and carebears Eve experience.

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Sorja	Posted - 2004.12.27 18:09:00 - [1] Edited by: Sorja on 27/12/2004 18:12:34 Reading many threads where PvPers and non PvPers alike complain about how piracy is dead in Eve, or how griefing is rampant, here are some suggestions to discuss. Allow consensual wars without fee. No warfare in 0.6 and up. Every kill against someone who is not at war with you should get you a 0.1 sec + the sec system it occurs in (e.g. a hit of 0.6 for a 0.5 system agression). A kill against a negative status player should NOT give you any sec status hit nor bonus. A player regains 0.1 sec status every week when he did not get any sec hit. Remove sentries from 0.4 and below. Remove Concord from 0.6 and below. Set the log off timer to 10 minutes for anyone involved in PvP combat. Yes, it sucks when you loose connection, but it's part of the game. Players with security status below -1.0 should be KOS anywhere by players, no matter the sec status of the system. Limit insurance to 50% maximum. There are more points who need attention, but let's first see if anyone in interested in the discussion in the first place. Please, if you disagree, try to come up with a better proposal. Or say the actual system is fine and needs no tweaking.
Sorja	Posted - 2004.12.27 18:09:00 - [2] Edited by: Sorja on 27/12/2004 18:12:34 Reading many threads where PvPers and non PvPers alike complain about how piracy is dead in Eve, or how griefing is rampant, here are some suggestions to discuss. Allow consensual wars without fee. No warfare in 0.6 and up. Every kill against someone who is not at war with you should get you a 0.1 sec + the sec system it occurs in (e.g. a hit of 0.6 for a 0.5 system agression). A kill against a negative status player should NOT give you any sec status hit nor bonus. A player regains 0.1 sec status every week when he did not get any sec hit. Remove sentries from 0.4 and below. Remove Concord from 0.6 and below. Set the log off timer to 10 minutes for anyone involved in PvP combat. Yes, it sucks when you loose connection, but it's part of the game. Players with security status below -1.0 should be KOS anywhere by players, no matter the sec status of the system. Limit insurance to 50% maximum. There are more points who need attention, but let's first see if anyone in interested in the discussion in the first place. Please, if you disagree, try to come up with a better proposal. Or say the actual system is fine and needs no tweaking.
Joshua Foiritain	Posted - 2004.12.27 18:14:00 - [3] No wars in empire, that sounds like fun... --------------------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Joshua Foiritain	Posted - 2004.12.27 18:14:00 - [4] No wars in empire, that sounds like fun... --------------------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Neon Genesis	Posted - 2004.12.27 18:15:00 - [5] Originally by: Sorja A player regains 0.1 sec status every week when he did not get any sec hit. Set the log off timer to 10 minutes for anyone Limit insurance to 50% maximum. These points I agree with. 1. the regaining would be slow but still there which saves people weeks of solid dull npcing to get it up. 2. Logoff timer b4 u disapear is stupid, 10 minutes would be gr8, as it gives u time to kill the offline ship b4 it dissapears. This is only gonna get worse when hp's are increased. 3. This would mean that U could actually dmg people economically and not everyone would throw their bs away haphazardly cos it will only cost u 30M to buy anuther and reinsure it. The rest are fairly off the wall and I dont think they would add anything to the game. IMO ofc __ There, i just contributed nothing to your thread
Neon Genesis	Posted - 2004.12.27 18:15:00 - [6] Originally by: Sorja A player regains 0.1 sec status every week when he did not get any sec hit. Set the log off timer to 10 minutes for anyone Limit insurance to 50% maximum. These points I agree with. 1. the regaining would be slow but still there which saves people weeks of solid dull npcing to get it up. 2. Logoff timer b4 u disapear is stupid, 10 minutes would be gr8, as it gives u time to kill the offline ship b4 it dissapears. This is only gonna get worse when hp's are increased. 3. This would mean that U could actually dmg people economically and not everyone would throw their bs away haphazardly cos it will only cost u 30M to buy anuther and reinsure it. The rest are fairly off the wall and I dont think they would add anything to the game. IMO ofc __ There, i just contributed nothing to your thread
Dao 2	Posted - 2004.12.27 18:23:00 - [7] aye not bad ideas except for i dont liek the top one ;p maybe something like that but to much >< and take all forms of good ore (if they havent taken away that good stuff in complexes) out of .6 +, but add some maybe better things in lower >< like maye some jaspet in .5 and hemo and hedge in .4 and .3 and gneiss in .1s. the real good stuff to stay in .0 ;p
Dao 2	Posted - 2004.12.27 18:23:00 - [8] aye not bad ideas except for i dont liek the top one ;p maybe something like that but to much >< and take all forms of good ore (if they havent taken away that good stuff in complexes) out of .6 +, but add some maybe better things in lower >< like maye some jaspet in .5 and hemo and hedge in .4 and .3 and gneiss in .1s. the real good stuff to stay in .0 ;p
Lord Anubis	Posted - 2004.12.27 18:46:00 - [9] gneiss used to be ina .7 system at one point You cant beat Death But you can make the bastard work hard for it wtb Jerek Zuomi's Insignia
Lord Anubis	Posted - 2004.12.27 18:46:00 - [10] gneiss used to be ina .7 system at one point You cant beat Death But you can make the bastard work hard for it wtb Jerek Zuomi's Insignia

ErrorS	Posted - 2004.12.27 19:01:00 - [11] Edited by: ErrorS on 27/12/2004 19:01:39 I agree with ship insurance (see interceptors. Still one of the more popular ships even with crappy insurance). No war in 0.6 or up? thats rediculous.. no war in 1.0 would be awesome in my opinion though. there should be fees for fighting in empire space with sec status above 0.3. Maybe have a few different kinds of war.. 0.0 war obviously, no action needed. up to 0.3 without a fee and 0.4-0.9 with a fee. removing sentries from 0.4 and below is rediculous. That makes 0.4 sector areas 0.0 areas with crappy ore. It's pointless... 10min logoff timer is alright I guess, as long as it's only during a PvP battle.. and I like security status growing back. ________ I'm strict Caldari "The grass is always greener on the other side" - Maybe they're not as uber as you think? -ErrorS
ErrorS	Posted - 2004.12.27 19:01:00 - [12] Edited by: ErrorS on 27/12/2004 19:01:39 I agree with ship insurance (see interceptors. Still one of the more popular ships even with crappy insurance). No war in 0.6 or up? thats rediculous.. no war in 1.0 would be awesome in my opinion though. there should be fees for fighting in empire space with sec status above 0.3. Maybe have a few different kinds of war.. 0.0 war obviously, no action needed. up to 0.3 without a fee and 0.4-0.9 with a fee. removing sentries from 0.4 and below is rediculous. That makes 0.4 sector areas 0.0 areas with crappy ore. It's pointless... 10min logoff timer is alright I guess, as long as it's only during a PvP battle.. and I like security status growing back. ________ I'm strict Caldari "The grass is always greener on the other side" - Maybe they're not as uber as you think? -ErrorS
Prototype 00	Posted - 2004.12.27 19:09:00 - [13] The insurance is fine as it is, and wont be changed, unfortunatly only pirate/PvP'er opinions are generally heared on the forums and so are taken as general consensus Teir 1 BS's should not be impossible to gain and keep hold of by noobs, let them NPC and die in peace, they venture into low sec thinking they are invincible will show them different. Just remember you eliteist sods 100+ mil is an insane amount to the larger population of eve and stoping new(ish) players keeping theyre shiny BS's is not going to happen just because you want to hurt your enemys more besides, do you know any insurance company which DOESENT offer 100% coverage? P 00 Arrggghhh the PieRats are a'comin
Prototype 00	Posted - 2004.12.27 19:09:00 - [14] The insurance is fine as it is, and wont be changed, unfortunatly only pirate/PvP'er opinions are generally heared on the forums and so are taken as general consensus Teir 1 BS's should not be impossible to gain and keep hold of by noobs, let them NPC and die in peace, they venture into low sec thinking they are invincible will show them different. Just remember you eliteist sods 100+ mil is an insane amount to the larger population of eve and stoping new(ish) players keeping theyre shiny BS's is not going to happen just because you want to hurt your enemys more besides, do you know any insurance company which DOESENT offer 100% coverage? P 00 Arrggghhh the PieRats are a'comin
Dianabolic	Posted - 2004.12.27 19:44:00 - [15] Any pilot that initiates aggression against someone who then blows them up should have their insurance cut by 50%.
Dianabolic	Posted - 2004.12.27 19:44:00 - [16] Any pilot that initiates aggression against someone who then blows them up should have their insurance cut by 50%.
Bhaal	Posted - 2004.12.27 20:23:00 - [17] Quote: Limit insurance to 50% maximum That's crap... ------------------------------------------------ "for piece sakes!"
Bhaal	Posted - 2004.12.27 20:23:00 - [18] Quote: Limit insurance to 50% maximum That's crap... ------------------------------------------------ "for piece sakes!"
pshepherd	Posted - 2004.12.27 20:41:00 - [19] yer, i have to agree. Thats a really crap idea
pshepherd	Posted - 2004.12.27 20:41:00 - [20] yer, i have to agree. Thats a really crap idea

Johnson McCrae	Posted - 2004.12.27 21:06:00 - [21] Here's a better solution. Make everybody be in a NPC corp. All NPC corp taxes of sales/bouties are based on how low your sec rating is. 10.0 would be 100% tax. This would include direct player trades. 0 sec rating would be 50% tax. All griefers will have a visible name of 'Dung Head' so people can recognize them easily. All Pirates will be labled 'Will work for Isk' All Carebears will be labled 'N00B Master' It ain't over till the fat lady falls on ya! [ 2004.10.09 02:50:23 ] (combat) Your 425mm Compressed Coil Gun I perfectly strikes Guardian Sentry, wrecking for 747.3 damage.
Johnson McCrae	Posted - 2004.12.27 21:06:00 - [22] Here's a better solution. Make everybody be in a NPC corp. All NPC corp taxes of sales/bouties are based on how low your sec rating is. 10.0 would be 100% tax. This would include direct player trades. 0 sec rating would be 50% tax. All griefers will have a visible name of 'Dung Head' so people can recognize them easily. All Pirates will be labled 'Will work for Isk' All Carebears will be labled 'N00B Master' It ain't over till the fat lady falls on ya! [ 2004.10.09 02:50:23 ] (combat) Your 425mm Compressed Coil Gun I perfectly strikes Guardian Sentry, wrecking for 747.3 damage.
Huskk	Posted - 2004.12.27 21:15:00 - [23] Edited by: Huskk on 27/12/2004 21:17:50 Originally by: Sorja Edited by: Sorja on 27/12/2004 18:12:34 Allow consensual wars without fee.. Agree Originally by: Sorja No warfare in 0.6 and up. That kinda goes against idea one Originally by: Sorja Every kill against someone who is not at war with you should get you a 0.1 sec + the sec system it occurs in (e.g. a hit of 0.6 for a 0.5 system agression). This combined with other ideas futher down leaves next to no margin for mistakes, theres NEEDS to be a margin people are not perfect and will screw up from time toi time and lock the wrong person (I've done it) Originally by: Sorja A kill against a negative status player should NOT give you any sec status hit nor bonus. On the fence here, its so easy to lose sec I'd say no sec loss if the target is at -1.0 or less. Originally by: Sorja A player regains 0.1 sec status every week when he did not get any sec hit. Agree Originally by: Sorja Remove sentries from 0.4 and below. Oh dear god no. Every ganker has been asking for this since the begining of time 0.4 - 0.1 is the middle ground this would remove it utterly and would result in gankfests not piracy. Originally by: Sorja Remove Concord from 0.6 and below. Just not needed Originally by: Sorja Set the log off timer to 10 minutes for anyone involved in PvP combat. Yes, it sucks when you loose connection, but it's part of the game. With the new hp changes I agree Originally by: Sorja Players with security status below -1.0 should be KOS anywhere by players, no matter the sec status of the system. below -2.0 or -3.0 maybe but as I said earlier its to easy to lose sec. And if you have this then remove restriction on players with low sec flying ship in hi sec space.. let them at least defend themselves. Originally by: Sorja Limit insurance to 50% maximum. I prefer Frig 75% Cruiser 50% BS 25% this would help piracy alot as it will be cheaper to payup than die. Also kill the 15 minite flag in 0.4 or at least reduce it. Add a way to extract peoples cargo and mods without killing the ship (reduce it to structure or something) this alone will boost true piracy through the roof --------------------------------------------- [ 2004.12.06 14:06:31 ] (combat) Gallente Control Tower [THIN] LIGHTLY hits you, doing 768.7 damage.
Huskk	Posted - 2004.12.27 21:15:00 - [24] Edited by: Huskk on 27/12/2004 21:17:50 Originally by: Sorja Edited by: Sorja on 27/12/2004 18:12:34 Allow consensual wars without fee.. Agree Originally by: Sorja No warfare in 0.6 and up. That kinda goes against idea one Originally by: Sorja Every kill against someone who is not at war with you should get you a 0.1 sec + the sec system it occurs in (e.g. a hit of 0.6 for a 0.5 system agression). This combined with other ideas futher down leaves next to no margin for mistakes, theres NEEDS to be a margin people are not perfect and will screw up from time toi time and lock the wrong person (I've done it) Originally by: Sorja A kill against a negative status player should NOT give you any sec status hit nor bonus. On the fence here, its so easy to lose sec I'd say no sec loss if the target is at -1.0 or less. Originally by: Sorja A player regains 0.1 sec status every week when he did not get any sec hit. Agree Originally by: Sorja Remove sentries from 0.4 and below. Oh dear god no. Every ganker has been asking for this since the begining of time 0.4 - 0.1 is the middle ground this would remove it utterly and would result in gankfests not piracy. Originally by: Sorja Remove Concord from 0.6 and below. Just not needed Originally by: Sorja Set the log off timer to 10 minutes for anyone involved in PvP combat. Yes, it sucks when you loose connection, but it's part of the game. With the new hp changes I agree Originally by: Sorja Players with security status below -1.0 should be KOS anywhere by players, no matter the sec status of the system. below -2.0 or -3.0 maybe but as I said earlier its to easy to lose sec. And if you have this then remove restriction on players with low sec flying ship in hi sec space.. let them at least defend themselves. Originally by: Sorja Limit insurance to 50% maximum. I prefer Frig 75% Cruiser 50% BS 25% this would help piracy alot as it will be cheaper to payup than die. Also kill the 15 minite flag in 0.4 or at least reduce it. Add a way to extract peoples cargo and mods without killing the ship (reduce it to structure or something) this alone will boost true piracy through the roof --------------------------------------------- [ 2004.12.06 14:06:31 ] (combat) Gallente Control Tower [THIN] LIGHTLY hits you, doing 768.7 damage.
RollinDutchMasters	Posted - 2004.12.27 22:05:00 - [25] Edited by: RollinDutchMasters on 27/12/2004 22:08:11 Originally by: Sorja Allow consensual wars without fee. A player regains 0.1 sec status every week when he did not get any sec hit. Set the log off timer to 10 minutes for anyone involved in PvP combat. Yes, it sucks when you loose connection, but it's part of the game. Players with security status below -2.0 should be KOS anywhere by players, no matter the sec status of the system. Limit insurance to 50% maximum. These are the relatively good ideas. Originally by: Sorja No warfare in 0.6 and up. Every kill against someone who is not at war with you should get you a 0.1 sec + the sec system it occurs in (e.g. a hit of 0.6 for a 0.5 system agression). A kill against a negative status player should NOT give you any sec status hit nor bonus. Remove sentries from 0.4 and below. Remove Concord from 0.6 and below. These are not. Taking concord wars out of .6+ basically gives a giant safe harbor for corps to base attacks out of. EVE does not need a PvP free zone. That would be stupid. Making .5 into CONCORD-less land is pointless, there are enough low-sec empire systems now. Taking gate guns from .4-.1 makes it into de-facto 0.0, which will reduce the ability of people to live and operate in said areas. They will be valueless because the ore isnt good enough for a 0.0 style area. I would suggust instead: Nerf Insurance (Basing on ships lost might be better then a straight nerf) Passive Sec Increase FIX FLAGGING FIX LOGOFFS Outlaw at -2 Sec Change the NPC-Gank table to: -2 to -3: No 1.0 -3 to -4: No .9 -4 to -5: No .8 -5 to -6: No .7 -6 to -7: No .6 -7 and under: No .5 Consentual war Originally by: Sochin CCP has provided you with the tools you need to avoid crime. You're just too lazy/stupid to use them.
RollinDutchMasters	Posted - 2004.12.27 22:05:00 - [26] Edited by: RollinDutchMasters on 27/12/2004 22:08:11 Originally by: Sorja Allow consensual wars without fee. A player regains 0.1 sec status every week when he did not get any sec hit. Set the log off timer to 10 minutes for anyone involved in PvP combat. Yes, it sucks when you loose connection, but it's part of the game. Players with security status below -2.0 should be KOS anywhere by players, no matter the sec status of the system. Limit insurance to 50% maximum. These are the relatively good ideas. Originally by: Sorja No warfare in 0.6 and up. Every kill against someone who is not at war with you should get you a 0.1 sec + the sec system it occurs in (e.g. a hit of 0.6 for a 0.5 system agression). A kill against a negative status player should NOT give you any sec status hit nor bonus. Remove sentries from 0.4 and below. Remove Concord from 0.6 and below. These are not. Taking concord wars out of .6+ basically gives a giant safe harbor for corps to base attacks out of. EVE does not need a PvP free zone. That would be stupid. Making .5 into CONCORD-less land is pointless, there are enough low-sec empire systems now. Taking gate guns from .4-.1 makes it into de-facto 0.0, which will reduce the ability of people to live and operate in said areas. They will be valueless because the ore isnt good enough for a 0.0 style area. I would suggust instead: Nerf Insurance (Basing on ships lost might be better then a straight nerf) Passive Sec Increase FIX FLAGGING FIX LOGOFFS Outlaw at -2 Sec Change the NPC-Gank table to: -2 to -3: No 1.0 -3 to -4: No .9 -4 to -5: No .8 -5 to -6: No .7 -6 to -7: No .6 -7 and under: No .5 Consentual war Originally by: Sochin CCP has provided you with the tools you need to avoid crime. You're just too lazy/stupid to use them.
Sorja	Posted - 2004.12.28 00:54:00 - [27] I agree with many objections to my first proposals. About no warfare in 0.6 and up, I made the mistake to join corps too soon (low combat skills, high learnings) and left them because of the 'all over the place' wars. IMHO, some zones need to be safe, because ganking newbies are detrimental to the game (as well as bada$$ murderers playing alts, which is perfectly lame). Let's say 0.8 and up should be safe. About the sentries in 0.4 and below, it's possible to tank sentries or shoot from afar. Since CCP's implementation is not perfect, I thought it would be better to get ridd of them all together. What I had in mind was to throw pirates a bone, but it proves a poor idea. Same for Concord in 0.6 and lower. Forget it. About the error margin, I refined my point. Is this better ? Allow consensual wars without fee. No warfare in 0.8 and up. Every kill against someone who is not at war with you should get you a 0.2 security status hit if you have a negative sec or 0.1 if you are positive. A kill against a negative status player should NOT give you any sec status hit nor bonus. A player regains 0.1 sec status every week when he did not get any sec hit. Set the log off timer to 10 minutes for anyone involved in PvP combat. Players with security status below -1.0 should be KOS anywhere by players, no matter the sec status of the system (which leaves at least 5 'free kills' after which pirates face their choices). Limit insurance to 50% (piracy IS needed and players have to admit that piracy is far better than random player killing, so this would benefit to everybody).
Sorja	Posted - 2004.12.28 00:54:00 - [28] I agree with many objections to my first proposals. About no warfare in 0.6 and up, I made the mistake to join corps too soon (low combat skills, high learnings) and left them because of the 'all over the place' wars. IMHO, some zones need to be safe, because ganking newbies are detrimental to the game (as well as bada$$ murderers playing alts, which is perfectly lame). Let's say 0.8 and up should be safe. About the sentries in 0.4 and below, it's possible to tank sentries or shoot from afar. Since CCP's implementation is not perfect, I thought it would be better to get ridd of them all together. What I had in mind was to throw pirates a bone, but it proves a poor idea. Same for Concord in 0.6 and lower. Forget it. About the error margin, I refined my point. Is this better ? Allow consensual wars without fee. No warfare in 0.8 and up. Every kill against someone who is not at war with you should get you a 0.2 security status hit if you have a negative sec or 0.1 if you are positive. A kill against a negative status player should NOT give you any sec status hit nor bonus. A player regains 0.1 sec status every week when he did not get any sec hit. Set the log off timer to 10 minutes for anyone involved in PvP combat. Players with security status below -1.0 should be KOS anywhere by players, no matter the sec status of the system (which leaves at least 5 'free kills' after which pirates face their choices). Limit insurance to 50% (piracy IS needed and players have to admit that piracy is far better than random player killing, so this would benefit to everybody).
Chucky	Posted - 2004.12.28 01:16:00 - [29] I got a sugestion that might make this game more fun........QUIT WHINING AND PLAY!!! ... you will see more and more marketing which in turn will bring you more players to torture.
Chucky	Posted - 2004.12.28 01:16:00 - [30] I got a sugestion that might make this game more fun........QUIT WHINING AND PLAY!!! ... you will see more and more marketing which in turn will bring you more players to torture.



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