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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.12.18 22:58:00 -
[421]
We need to get over this idea that "they are taking my money" with regards to taxes. We all live in the same system, if we like it or not. We are all linked in a symbiotic relationship in this world, what all of us do affect all others, however slight it its. But it all adds up.
Therefore, if all of us care for all of us, we will all be better off. This is what the governments role is supposed to be. Its a representation of the people, acting in the peoples interest. Government should never have a goal of making profit, it should spend all it "makes" back into the people with infrastructure, science, laws and other programs that benefit us all.
What other reason is there to have a government?
We don't have that today tho. That much is obvious. There is a pretty strong disconnect between the people in the world, and the world governments. Today we got some kind of sick twisted abomination thats only a mockery of what its supposed to be. People are oppressed, people die in poverty, people are cast in jail for no reason, people die needlessly in meaningless wars. This is obviously a problem as we have seen these last years. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
Vogue
Skynet Nexus
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Posted - 2010.12.18 23:12:00 -
[422]
Edited by: Vogue on 18/12/2010 23:12:45 I shall repost what I said a year ago:-
Margaret Thatcher said once 'there is no such thing as soceity'. Which bites but it is true. I am 34 and when i was a kid my mates parents used to leave their front doors open. We used to run around and go into our mates houses and if we showed some courtesy we were welcome. Nowadays most neighbours just dont talk to each other.
The BBC did a social experiment once. They got someone to pretend to collapse in a village and in a city. In the village the locals responded immediatley and offered to help the 'collapsed' person. But in the city the faux collapsed person was ignored. The moral is as most of us live in large urban sprawls we find it hard to associate in a genuine way with such a large number of people. Sociologists say that an urban area of up to 20,000 people is the most we can handle in feeling truely a part of.
And to that end to really create heartfelt societies we should have a 'campus' style of living. Have communities that have small local shops (France supports shops in rural towns and villages). Schools, hospitals. And similar type amenities that can be walked to, or by bus or a short drive away. Legislate to have the soulless shopping on the outskirts of cities shut down.
Yes services could become more expensive. But people really need to start thinking in terms of 'social capital'. Money is important as its an enabler to a better lifestyle. But its a narcissistic lifestyle if its the new opium for the masses - unadulterated consumerism.
I am liberal about many things. But i beleive in such things as national service. The boom of financial prosperity has given people a false sense of entitlement. There should be an ethos that 'citizenship' should be earned and not given.
Me for president!
..................................................
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Slightly Sensational
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Posted - 2010.12.19 03:26:00 -
[423]
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs We need to get over this idea that "they are taking my money" with regards to taxes. We all live in the same system, if we like it or not. We are all linked in a symbiotic relationship in this world, what all of us do affect all others, however slight it its. But it all adds up.
Therefore, if all of us care for all of us, we will all be better off.
That's cute. For one it isn't necessarily true, lets say you have a rich genius and poor idiots or an even split, which scenario is better for progress? Then there's also the part about freedom, and how much humanity has progressed since we discovered how nice freedom is. Fact is, taxation is theft, and "they are taking my money" is true in most nations.
If you want to live in this super symbiosis happy love socialist society then that should be your choice, you could do it by forming a group of people who split their money and pool it together. But forcing it on others, more importantly doing so simply because they had the misfortune of being born in your nation? Yeah, that's not very nice.
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Wendat Huron
Stellar Solutions
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Posted - 2010.12.19 03:40:00 -
[424]
Originally by: Slightly Sensational
If you want to live in this super symbiosis happy love socialist society then that should be your choice, you could do it by forming a group of people who split their money and pool it together...
You mean gypsies? Yes that's working out well for them. You cannot be a minority to yourself living inside a majority with a differing set of rules, the majority will enforce its will on you.
Delenda est achura. |
So Sensational
GREY COUNCIL Nulli Secunda
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Posted - 2010.12.19 03:54:00 -
[425]
Originally by: Wendat Huron
Originally by: Slightly Sensational
If you want to live in this super symbiosis happy love socialist society then that should be your choice, you could do it by forming a group of people who split their money and pool it together...
You mean gypsies? Yes that's working out well for them. You cannot be a minority to yourself living inside a majority with a differing set of rules, the majority will enforce its will on you.
As long as the rules do not conflict with the rules of the majority that's not true.
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Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.12.19 14:34:00 -
[426]
Originally by: Slightly Sensational
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs We need to get over this idea that "they are taking my money" with regards to taxes. We all live in the same system, if we like it or not. We are all linked in a symbiotic relationship in this world, what all of us do affect all others, however slight it its. But it all adds up.
Therefore, if all of us care for all of us, we will all be better off.
lets say you have a rich genius and poor idiots or an even split, which scenario is better for progress?
Please rephrase, I am not sure what you are getting at. Because we have what we have right now, and its a fair mix.
"If you want to live in this super symbiosis happy love socialist society then that should be your choice, "
You know what? I do. I actually do want to live in a world with peace, a world where education, science, exploration, art, music are our main goals. A world that actually takes care of all of us, not just the rich. A world that is human centric, not profit centric. A world where we would use technology to the betterment of all mankind, not the destruction of small countries with brown people in them.
Try and ridicule it all you want. But in the worlds of Spider Jerusalem: I hate it here.
Ever heard of democracy? Yeah, we don't have that. Perhaps in the future we will, but right now you are being forced to work more then 50% of your non sleeping time to get money to pay for basic live necessities. And you work for "the man". 1% of the rich people is the ones who you work for. That is our system we have now. Either you work for them, or you go out in the bush and live alone. So it is being force upon you more now than then you would realize.
There are of course a few exceptions with some 1 man companies, but they still more or less work for other big companies. At any rate that is the exception, not the norm.
All in all, we are actually a social spices, we can not survive on our own and expect to progress. We need to work together to achieve anything. It why we evolved the cerebral cortex after all, so we have the ability to change ourself and to adapt more rapidly then regular biological evolution. Its tiem we started using it and built a world that is better, not continue in the same crap we have now. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
Nok Cartesian
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Posted - 2010.12.19 15:12:00 -
[427]
Originally by: Slightly Sensational
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs We need to get over this idea that "they are taking my money" with regards to taxes. We all live in the same system, if we like it or not. We are all linked in a symbiotic relationship in this world, what all of us do affect all others, however slight it its. But it all adds up.
Therefore, if all of us care for all of us, we will all be better off.
That's cute. For one it isn't necessarily true, lets say you have a rich genius and poor idiots or an even split, which scenario is better for progress? Then there's also the part about freedom, and how much humanity has progressed since we discovered how nice freedom is. Fact is, taxation is theft, and "they are taking my money" is true in most nations.
If you want to live in this super symbiosis happy love socialist society then that should be your choice, you could do it by forming a group of people who split their money and pool it together. But forcing it on others, more importantly doing so simply because they had the misfortune of being born in your nation? Yeah, that's not very nice.
If you are actually one of those who is paying more than your fair share for services, you are completely capable of leaving the country. Those people that are professionals or business owners earning a high income have little problem moving to another country. They are welcome pretty much anywhere in the world. The only people that truly are forced to pay taxes are the "poor idiots" (as you say) because they are incapable of getting an education or experience in a field that would allow them the mobility the "rich genius" has.
Basically, going by your logic of classifying people as a "rich genius" or a "poor idiot" there's two options here: You're either a "rich genius" and you choose to pay taxes (by virtue of choosing to continue to live in a country that collects taxes) or else you are a "poor idiot" and you don't have a choice. So, what is it? Do you have a choice or don't you?
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So Sensational
GREY COUNCIL Nulli Secunda
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Posted - 2010.12.19 19:01:00 -
[428]
Edited by: So Sensational on 19/12/2010 19:01:39
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs Please rephrase, I am not sure what you are getting at. Because we have what we have right now, and its a fair mix.
You: If everyone is better off, equally cared for, we will all benefit from it. Me: Not true, if you have a rich genius and poor idiots the likelihood that we will all benefit (Through innovation for example) from that situation is higher than in yours.
You can also exchange the wealth portion in this example for anything else that is unfair in this world, education, health and so on.
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs You know what? I do. I actually do want to live in a world with peace, a world where education, science, exploration, art, music are our main goals. A world that actually takes care of all of us, not just the rich. A world that is human centric, not profit centric. A world where we would use technology to the betterment of all mankind, not the destruction of small countries with brown people in them.
And that's alright with me. Do you know what I want? Not to be forced to participate in whatever you believe is the ideal world, nor in the process of getting there.
Originally by: Nok Cartesian
If you are actually one of those who is paying more than your fair share for services, you are completely capable of leaving the country.
The only people that truly are forced to pay taxes are the "poor idiots" (as you say) because they are incapable of getting an education or experience in a field that would allow them the mobility the "rich genius" has.
While the first sentence is true in some places, it's not necessarily true everywhere. More importantly, neither party (Rich or poor) should be forced to move, or pay taxes for stuff that they don't benefit from.
Originally by: Nok Cartesian Basically, going by your logic of classifying people as a "rich genius" or a "poor idiot" there's two options here: You're either a "rich genius" and you choose to pay taxes (by virtue of choosing to continue to live in a country that collects taxes) or else you are a "poor idiot" and you don't have a choice. So, what is it? Do you have a choice or don't you?
I don't classify people that way, it was an example to prove that his statement is false.
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ChaeDoc II
Gallente Sigillum Militum Xpisti R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2010.12.19 19:51:00 -
[429]
Confirming thread still on-topic.
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Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.12.19 20:53:00 -
[430]
I would urge you to look into how the monetary system actually works. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
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Adunh Slavy
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Posted - 2010.12.19 21:52:00 -
[431]
Originally by: ChaeDoc II Confirming thread still on-topic.
IBNBLFP
In before not being locked for politics.
The Real Space Initiative - V7
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Nyu Shin
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Posted - 2010.12.19 22:18:00 -
[432]
Rove Suspected In Swedish-U.S. Political Prosecution of WikiLeaks
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Reiisha
Evolution IT Alliance
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Posted - 2010.12.19 23:54:00 -
[433]
Originally by: Nyu Shin Rove Suspected In Swedish-U.S. Political Prosecution of WikiLeaks
I like the last paragraph of that article. Sort of says it all.
"If you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all"
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Herzog Wolfhammer
Gallente Sigma Special Tactics Group Fleet Coordination Coalition
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Posted - 2010.12.20 07:46:00 -
[434]
One side effect of Wikilieaks
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Zhula Guixgrixks
Increasing Success by Lowering Expectations
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Posted - 2010.12.20 12:30:00 -
[435]
Originally by: Herzog Wolfhammer One side effect of Wikilieaks
Good one. How true: "Your reaction speaks volumes".
Truth about todays omni present hypocrisy scares so many. And because they got accustomed to it, they will fight back by all means. Not their empty chatter, but their reactions will expose the truth.
"You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged. And many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system, that they will fight to protect it."
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Nyu Shin
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Posted - 2010.12.20 15:53:00 -
[436]
Having almost joined the US State Department, I can attest that the cables released by WikiLeaks were written by career diplomats who almost always follow the State DepartmentĘs current party line... They tell Washington exactly what it wants to hear. For a diplomat, telling Washington itĘs wrong is a sure-fire way to get transferred to the US Embassy Ulan Bator, Mongolia, or Monrovia, Liberia.
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Jackie Flackette
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Posted - 2010.12.21 16:55:00 -
[437]
Here is another interesting take on the whole wikileaks thing.
What's funny about this is that I now have some crazy local neocons (fake conservatives who love wars and police state) thinking I am an Assange fan and an enemy of the state - they actually threatened me. I told them I an never armed.
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Louis deGuerre
Gallente Malevolence. Imperial 0rder
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Posted - 2010.12.21 19:57:00 -
[438]
Edited by: Louis deGuerre on 21/12/2010 19:57:51
Originally by: Jackie Flackette Here is another interesting take on the whole wikileaks thing.
The quietly removing freedom and neutrality from the internet has been going on for quite some time now, but of course your e-mail is being read for a long time now. It bad all over, the Netherlands has one of the highest ratios of wiretapping/citizen in the world. Most worrisome tough are Britain's anti-**** plans
P.S. Hope it works out with those creepy neocons
----- Amicus Morte is recruiting. Dive into the world of 0.0 !
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Boonaki
Caldari Focused Annihilation Detrimental Imperative
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Posted - 2010.12.21 22:50:00 -
[439]
Tor, learn about it, use it, best protection against the world wide bull**** going on.
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Nyu Shin
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Posted - 2010.12.22 02:06:00 -
[440]
Guardian details sex charges against Julian Assange
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Louis deGuerre
Gallente Malevolence. Imperial 0rder
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Posted - 2010.12.22 11:25:00 -
[441]
Winner in the irony category :
WikiLeaks' Assange complains he's victim of leaks ----- Amicus Morte is recruiting. Dive into the world of 0.0 !
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Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.12.22 12:50:00 -
[442]
Originally by: Louis deGuerre Winner in the irony category :
WikiLeaks' Assange complains he's victim of leaks
What irony?
He is complaing about the reason behind it, not the leak in and of itself. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
Louis deGuerre
Gallente Malevolence. Imperial 0rder
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Posted - 2010.12.22 13:11:00 -
[443]
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs
Originally by: Louis deGuerre Winner in the irony category :
WikiLeaks' Assange complains he's victim of leaks
What irony?
He is complaing about the reason behind it, not the leak in and of itself.
It was a joke mate. Serious thread is too serious. ----- Malevolence. is recruiting. Dive into the world of 0.0 !
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Pan Crastus
Anti-Metagaming League
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Posted - 2010.12.22 13:24:00 -
[444]
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs
He is complaing about the reason behind it, not the leak in and of itself.
Damn those leaky condoms!
How to PVP: 1. buy ISK with GTCs, 2. fit cloak, learn aggro mechanics, 3. buy second account for metagaming
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Zhula Guixgrixks
Increasing Success by Lowering Expectations
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Posted - 2010.12.22 13:33:00 -
[445]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Damn those leaky condoms!
"Make leaks not war."
approved by space pope
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Nyu Shin
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Posted - 2010.12.22 16:20:00 -
[446]
Bank Of America Accused Of Breaking Into Woman's Home, Taking Husband's Ashes BoA , time to go.
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tartan pixie
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2010.12.22 17:00:00 -
[447]
Originally by: Vogue Edited by: Vogue on 18/12/2010 23:12:45 I shall repost what I said a year ago:-
Margaret Thatcher said once 'there is no such thing as soceity'. Which bites but it is true. I am 34 and when i was a kid my mates parents used to leave their front doors open. We used to run around and go into our mates houses and if we showed some courtesy we were welcome. Nowadays most neighbours just dont talk to each other.
The BBC did a social experiment once. They got someone to pretend to collapse in a village and in a city. In the village the locals responded immediatley and offered to help the 'collapsed' person. But in the city the faux collapsed person was ignored. The moral is as most of us live in large urban sprawls we find it hard to associate in a genuine way with such a large number of people. Sociologists say that an urban area of up to 20,000 people is the most we can handle in feeling truely a part of.
And to that end to really create heartfelt societies we should have a 'campus' style of living. Have communities that have small local shops (France supports shops in rural towns and villages). Schools, hospitals. And similar type amenities that can be walked to, or by bus or a short drive away. Legislate to have the soulless shopping on the outskirts of cities shut down.
Yes services could become more expensive. But people really need to start thinking in terms of 'social capital'. Money is important as its an enabler to a better lifestyle. But its a narcissistic lifestyle if its the new opium for the masses - unadulterated consumerism.
I am liberal about many things. But i beleive in such things as national service. The boom of financial prosperity has given people a false sense of entitlement. There should be an ethos that 'citizenship' should be earned and not given.
Me for president!
Stop reading the daily mail!
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Pan Crastus
Anti-Metagaming League
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Posted - 2010.12.22 17:10:00 -
[448]
Originally by: Nyu Shin Bank Of America Accused Of Breaking Into Woman's Home, Taking Husband's Ashes BoA , time to go.
oh noes, they stole Mr. Ash (his name). SCNR. ;-)
How to PVP: 1. buy ISK with GTCs, 2. fit cloak, learn aggro mechanics, 3. buy second account for metagaming
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Malaclypse Muscaria
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Posted - 2010.12.22 17:16:00 -
[449]
This just happened yesterday: the Spanish parliament rejected a newly proposed law that would've allowed a government appointed commission to shut down websites used for illegal downloading and piracy.
What does this have to do with Wikileaks? Well, Wikileaks has precisely been detailing over the last weeks how the US, using their economic and political power, has been trying to bully the Spanish government and politicians of different parties to pass this sort of law, since Spain has been dubbed by US authorities and entertainment industry as a "pirate paradise" (ranking second in the world for most piracy), given the laxity current law has towards downloading over here.
These leaks have added fuel to the fire on this debate, exposing the US pressures and maneuvering behind this new proposed law, and in the end it was shot down by the Spanish parliament.
Also, a week ago the Spanish government was sued for blocking investigations on the death of a Spanish reporter by US soldiers: as revealed by other Wikileaks, our government did this to try to win the favour of American interests, while at the same time it was publicly lying to the family of the dead reporter saying they where trying to do all they could to bring justice on his death.
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Nyu Shin
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Posted - 2010.12.22 19:50:00 -
[450]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Originally by: Nyu Shin Bank Of America Accused Of Breaking Into Woman's Home, Taking Husband's Ashes BoA , time to go.
oh noes, they stole Mr. Ash (his name). SCNR. ;-)
Damn, a bright fellow :-)
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