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Overpowered T3s are Overpowered

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Robert Caldera	Posted - 2010.12.08 09:26:00 - [31] Edited by: Robert Caldera on 08/12/2010 09:28:09 the interdiction nullifier is one of the worst things CCP added to this game over the last years. I use such a legion for hauling things through 0.0 but I think this should not be that easy. Fitted for max agility - 4 WCS, T2 agility rigs + some nanos, it aligns within 3 seconds or something like that + covert cloak; noone will be ever able to catch that one unless some dumb accident happens.
Jayme Meladi	Posted - 2010.12.08 09:32:00 - [32] Originally by: Robert Caldera Edited by: Robert Caldera on 08/12/2010 09:28:09 the interdiction nullifier is one of the worst things CCP added to this game over the last years. I use such a legion for hauling things through 0.0 but I think this should not be that easy. Fitted for max agility - 4 WCS, T2 agility rigs + some nanos, it aligns within 3 seconds or something like that + covert cloak; noone will be ever able to catch that one unless some dumb accident happens. If you put that much effort and money into not being caught then you shouldn't really be able to be caught. You act as if it's "easy" but its still well over half a billion isk you dropped on a ship to HAUL things...The game needs a counter to bubbles frankly, makes 0.0 accessibility somewhat more difficult than it should be on it's own given the nature of bottlenecks.
Robert Caldera	Posted - 2010.12.08 09:38:00 - [33] No, I still think that should not be possible. ISK never balance things out.
Target Painter	Posted - 2010.12.08 09:41:00 - [34] Edited by: Target Painter on 08/12/2010 09:41:33 Fit two sebos on a frig with high sensor strength. Put two remote sebos on that same frig. Preferably the guy flying that frig lives somewhere in the UK, or at least Europe. Back him up with suitable tackle to prevent anyone from warping off or gatecrashing. Enjoy killing about half of the cloakies that try to run your instalocking gatecamp. Including "overpowered" T3s.
Jayme Meladi	Posted - 2010.12.08 09:49:00 - [35] Originally by: Robert Caldera No, I still think that should not be possible. ISK never balance things out. Going to have to agree to disagree here. While isk isnt really a balance factor to pretty much imply there shouldn't be a counter to bubbles is insane.
Robert Caldera	Posted - 2010.12.08 09:55:00 - [36] Originally by: Target Painter Edited by: Target Painter on 08/12/2010 09:41:33 Fit two sebos on a frig with high sensor strength. Put two remote sebos on that same frig. Preferably the guy flying that frig lives somewhere in the UK, or at least Europe. Back him up with suitable tackle to prevent anyone from warping off or gatecrashing. Enjoy killing about half of the cloakies that try to run your instalocking gatecamp. Including "overpowered" T3s. there is no such thing as "instalock" on cloaker ships, they re-cloak usually, before you are even allowed to begin locking.
Lost Greybeard	Posted - 2010.12.08 10:58:00 - [37] Originally by: Culmen Edited by: Culmen on 08/12/2010 04:57:13 Originally by: rain9441 Originally by: Lord Jita The problem is that there is no counter to it. We need t3 interdictors or something that can stop them. You need to be able to prevent the prevention from preventing the original action. This is why denying the denial is a bad game play concept. Damage is done. Countering the counter's counter is even worse off than what you got now. Seconded. Also since ECM is countered by ECCM. We need a counter to ECCM, so give us ECCCM But then we need a counter for that so ECCCCM then ECCCCCM, then ECCCCCCM then ECCCCCCCM then ECCCCCCCCM then ECCCCCCCCCM then ECCCCCCCCCCM .... .... and so on ECCCM would just be ECM. More scanner suppression counters scanner strength, it's a question of optimizing your output against their defenses. Sliding scale versus sliding scale, with one party being able to invest more resources in winning at the expense of other things they'd normally be able to fit (like more points, webs, etc). Do infini-point ships work on the interdiction nullified ships? That could be an alternative if it's not already the case. --- If you outlaw tautologies, only outlaws will have tautologies. ~Anonymous
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates The Star Fraction	Posted - 2010.12.08 11:19:00 - [38] interdiction nullifed T3s will get caught in exactly the same gatecamps that other covert cloakers will. If you manage a decloak, then it'll be within a few seconds, and that's not enough time for the T3 to warp. Unless you mean drag bubbles, but ... well, frankly even they are avoidable, especially if you fly a cloaker. There are other reasons that T3s are powerful - such as their ability to fit a ludicrous tank and DPS, comparatively - but ... the interdiction nullifier isn't it.
Grimpak Gallente The Whitehound Corporation Vorpal's Edge	Posted - 2010.12.08 12:09:00 - [39] Originally by: James Lyrus There are other reasons that T3s are powerful - such as their ability to fit a ludicrous tank and DPS, comparatively - but ... the interdiction nullifier isn't it. specially when the IN sub doesn't give any slots and the base agility and speed aren't that hot. sure it has an agility bonus, but it kinda needs that bonus to unnerf the agility penalty it has. tengu is special tho, being a caldari ship it has high base agility already. --- Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals. ain't that right.
Robert Caldera	Posted - 2010.12.08 12:50:00 - [40] Originally by: James Lyrus interdiction nullifed T3s will get caught in exactly the same gatecamps that other covert cloakers will. If you manage a decloak, then it'll be within a few seconds, and that's not enough time for the T3 to warp. You are a noob, sir. A proper fitted T3 covert will align and warp cloaked within about 3 seconds. In a real enviromnent, considering lags (even regular slight latency), you wont be able to decloak, lock and put a point on that covert before it warps away.
jerichot Cutish Brunts	Posted - 2010.12.08 13:05:00 - [41] Originally by: masternerdguy 1. I own a tengu. I can use them. I think that the 50% damage reduction isn't good enough, they are basically the new cloaky hauler. Since you fly T3, I dont understand why do you want a nerf ? generally people dont want to nerf the ships they fly , right ? Not happy that you little gate gank team cant catch them, so you come to b*tch on the forums and ask for a nerf ?
Diesel47	Posted - 2010.12.08 13:16:00 - [42] Bubble camps are for noobs trying to pvp anyways... So who cares?
Grimpak Gallente The Whitehound Corporation Vorpal's Edge	Posted - 2010.12.08 13:26:00 - [43] Originally by: Robert Caldera A proper fitted T3 covert will align and warp cloaked within about 3 seconds. In a real enviromnent, considering lags (even regular slight latency), you wont be able to decloak, lock and put a point on that covert before it warps away. he is right tho, since many people tend to fit cargo expanders in blockade runners, or not agility-fitting IN subbed T3's because they think their bubble immunity and cloak will trump eeeeeveryone. so it's pretty much a "trust stupid" thing. --- Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals. ain't that right.
Brian Ballsack	Posted - 2010.12.08 14:02:00 - [44] Originally by: Sverige Pahis Erm guys OP is a ****ed troll and world reknowned ** poster, look at his terrible posting history and stop biting I cba to check peoples history before replying plus even if he is a troll how does it affect me ? Only very sad people are actually bothered that they were led on by a troll, to most people living in the real world, this means nothing.
Templar Dane Amarrian Retribution	Posted - 2010.12.08 15:19:00 - [45] Wahhhh, covert interdiction nullifier can't be caught by our bubble camps. Well, unless the poor sod jumps in and is right next to a corpse/ship/can/wreck/cloud/probe/etc/etc/etc/etc Hey, I know, lets remove the entire bookmark feature AND cloaks AND WT0. Then things can be EASIER than they used to be. Then, when nobody ever leaves highsec we'll all get on the forums and ***** about how there's nobody to shoot at.
Muad 'dib Caldari The Imperial Fedaykin	Posted - 2010.12.08 15:24:00 - [46] how about a 500m-a-piece anti-nullifier bubble? Anyone would think 0.0 ONLY had t3 haulers trading, with all the whine splashed on the forums.
Scorpionidae	Posted - 2010.12.08 17:47:00 - [47] You know I think they cool it T3 cos its ment to be better the T2 and T1... Just a thought. Scorpionidae
Robert Caldera	Posted - 2010.12.08 17:58:00 - [48] one, who enters 0.0 should have to deal with bubbles. Even supers do.
Seriously Bored Minmatar	Posted - 2010.12.08 18:37:00 - [49] Originally by: Robert Caldera one, who enters 0.0 should have to deal with bubbles. Even supers do. They do deal with it. By fitting Interdiction Nullifiers. They deal with it very successfully. ùùùùù Originally by: CCP Big Dumb Object When I nerf something, it takes 2-3 months for your dreams to be crushed.
Kyle Sucks Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2010.12.08 18:41:00 - [50] consider the fact that the interdiction nullifier is useless on its own anyway, and must come packaged with a covert cloak sub to be worth shat.
Tarasina	Posted - 2010.12.08 18:49:00 - [51] Buuhuu, 1 ship evaded your bubble. Harden up, carebear!
Target Painter	Posted - 2010.12.08 20:32:00 - [52] Originally by: Robert Caldera there is no such thing as "instalock" on cloaker ships, they re-cloak usually, before you are even allowed to begin locking. lol Fly through EC- a few times and get back to me on that.
Bluejacket CT Percussive Diplomacy	Posted - 2010.12.08 22:37:00 - [53] Cloaky T3s are usually pretty garbage to be honest. Sure they go through your **ty gatecamp, but who cares, they do ** for dps and generally should just self-destruct themselves and save everyone the trouble. ~
Ulstan	Posted - 2010.12.08 22:45:00 - [54] I think this is a rather silly post. The point of T3's is to specialize them. If you just want tanky/ganky you get more bang for your buck from battlecruisers. The tengu being a cloaky hauler is silly, as the blockade runners do a far better job. So a T3 can be specialized to ignore bubbles and use the covops cloak...this is a problem how? That sounds like a very specialized role, which sounds entirely appropriate to the strategic cruiser class.
Shawna Gray Gallente	Posted - 2010.12.08 23:47:00 - [55] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Professor Tarantula Everyone is so used to being spoon-fed PvP by gatecamps. This, really, is the heart of the problem. I'm not sure how much sense choke points really make in a space game. -Liang Without chockepoints pvp becomes optional.
Ulstan	Posted - 2010.12.08 23:51:00 - [56] PvP is already optional.
Headerman Minmatar Metanoia. Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2010.12.08 23:53:00 - [57] Originally by: Lord Jita The problem is that there is no counter to it. We need t3 interdictors or something that can stop them. of course there is a counter: they are hella expensive
Nian Banks Minmatar Berserkers of Aesir	Posted - 2010.12.09 00:00:00 - [58] We don't need more counters to counter the counter.... What we need is a game that works like rock paper scissors, or the traditional concept of the Chinese Elements. Rock may counter Scissors but Paper Counters the Rock. In that way it make sense.
Vikarion Caldari Blackened Steel	Posted - 2010.12.09 00:38:00 - [59] There is a counter to the interdiction nullifier sub-system: it's called a focused disruption script. You are not guaranteed a kill because you put a bubble up, nor should you be. In Eve, the people who take care to safeguard their assets and use intelligent strategies and expensive tools are supposed to be difficult to counter. In addition, ISK is supposed to matter, and you are supposed to be able to escape PvP if you take the necessary steps. Non-consensual PvP means that you can be shot against your will, but it also implies the fact that they have to catch you to shoot you, unless you think Eve is supposed to be all the other players lining up for you to shoot. Gatecamps are not supposed to be, nor were they ever supposed to be, fool-proof defenses against infiltration or travel. If they were, CCP wouldn't have spent so much time creating things like covops ships and the Black Ops jumpdrive and covert cynos. Therefore, the interdiction nullifier subsystem is performing as intended. - - -
Robert Caldera	Posted - 2010.12.09 11:28:00 - [60] Edited by: Robert Caldera on 09/12/2010 11:29:32 Originally by: Target Painter lol Fly through EC- a few times and get back to me on that. only noobs camp regional gates. But I've lived near pure blind for a while and know your noobish NC pets camps there. You're lol, sir Originally by: Headerman of course there is a counter: they are hella expensive the price balances nothing.

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