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[Proposal] Hybird Fix

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captain foivos	Posted - 2011.01.06 07:30:00 - [31] Railguns are good at sniping. Like me. Originally by: CCP Zulu You're assuming I read threads before I turdpost in them :)
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2011.01.06 09:57:00 - [32] Edited by: Gypsio III on 06/01/2011 10:00:07 Originally by: Rip Minner The 20% tracking inc to base hybird weapons will get inc with ship bounses/hardwireing/tracking mods but the 10% Sig Res dec will not. Aaargh. Yes, it will. Signature resolution is simply another modifier to tracking - just like tracking mods/ship bonuses/hardwirings. There is no difference between a turret of sig res 400 m and tracking 0.004 and one of sig res 100 m and tracking 0.001.
Joss56 Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2011.01.06 12:53:00 - [33] Originally by: Crazy KSK ... the adrestia is right now then blasters have been successfully fixed Adestria and Vindicator are the only gallente ships with real gallente bonus and where hybrids work fine (in paper) Now some people talk about drones, well drones everybody can use them so this is not an argument. If all gallente ships had +10% (or 5%) hp and dmg per level, then drone argument could be reasonable, but it's not. Hybrids get me ... ________________________________________________ "You do realise you live on a globe, right? And that there places outside the USA/UK?"
Madasa Boxofrogs	Posted - 2011.01.06 15:07:00 - [34] Originally by: captain foivos Railguns are good at sniping. Like me. Railguns are also terrible at posting ~~(killmails)~~ , like you.
Rented	Posted - 2011.01.06 23:10:00 - [35] Originally by: Rip Minner Edited by: Rip Minner on 06/01/2011 06:11:56 Originally by: Gypsio III As you can see, this means a 10% reduction (9/10) to signature resolution has >>EXACTLY<< the same affect as an inverse increase (10/9, or 11.1111111111%) in tracking. So you can see, there is absolutely no difference whatsoever between decreasing signature resolutions and inversely increasing tracking... making modifying both of them pointless, misleading, and generally fail. And yes, it works the same with all mods bonuses and anything and everything else. Can you now plz show me how 10% reduction to Signature Resolution works with Ship bounses/Hardwirering/Tracking Mods. Becouse if you need me to I can show you how a Real 33% inc to tracking will work with this things. Im not really sure what part of me proving them to be exactly the same you failed to understand. As in.. EXACTLY... in every way... you know.... as in having the same effect... in every way.... do you really not grasp the concept of EXACTLY THE SAME? (you know COMPLETELY THE SAME THING) Do you understand math at all? I showed you how a change to one is EXACTLY the same as an inverse change to the other, ANY CHANGE, that kind of includes all bonuses, hardwiring, and tracking mods. Lets go back to the simplified tracking/sig part of the hit equation... *(TransvSig_Res)/(RangeTrackingSig_Rad) Now I really didnt think it needed to be simplified any further, but lets remove all the variables we're not even talking about simply to see the relation between signature resolution and tracking. (Sig_Res)/(Tracking) Looks suspiciously like they have an inverse relationship doesn't it? Now lets pretend your bonuses, hardwirings, and tracking mods happen to increase your tracking by... 50%, nice. (Sig_Res)/(Tracking1.5)* Now what happens if Sig_Res is reduced by 50% too. This is also commonly known as dividing by 2, so we put a 2 on the bottom of the equation. *(Sig_Res)/(Tracking1.52)* Whoa..... did you see that?!?! That division by 2 multiplies with any tracking modifiers (in this case the +50% tracking). In case you missed it... (Sig_Res)/(Tracking1.52)** WOW, they multiply.... THAT MEANS CHANGES TO SIG RES AND TRACKIGN STACK PERFECTLY IN EVERY WAY........ WOW.
captain foivos	Posted - 2011.01.06 23:15:00 - [36] Originally by: Madasa Boxofrogs Railguns are also terrible at posting ~~(killmails)~~ , like you. u mad bro? Originally by: CCP StevieSG It's your female forum mod Stevie-G. I'm here to tell you kids from around the block. Rapping's not allowed in here. Welcome to my lock.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2011.01.07 05:34:00 - [37] Edited by: Rip Minner on 07/01/2011 05:37:37 Originally by: Rented Originally by: Rip Minner Edited by: Rip Minner on 06/01/2011 06:11:56 Originally by: Gypsio III As you can see, this means a 10% reduction (9/10) to signature resolution has >>EXACTLY<< the same affect as an inverse increase (10/9, or 11.1111111111%) in tracking. So you can see, there is absolutely no difference whatsoever between decreasing signature resolutions and inversely increasing tracking... making modifying both of them pointless, misleading, and generally fail. And yes, it works the same with all mods bonuses and anything and everything else. Can you now plz show me how 10% reduction to Signature Resolution works with Ship bounses/Hardwirering/Tracking Mods. Becouse if you need me to I can show you how a Real 33% inc to tracking will work with this things. Im not really sure what part of me proving them to be exactly the same you failed to understand. As in.. EXACTLY... in every way... you know.... as in having the same effect... in every way.... do you really not grasp the concept of EXACTLY THE SAME? (you know COMPLETELY THE SAME THING) Do you understand math at all? I showed you how a change to one is EXACTLY the same as an inverse change to the other, ANY CHANGE, that kind of includes all bonuses, hardwiring, and tracking mods. Lets go back to the simplified tracking/sig part of the hit equation... *(TransvSig_Res)/(RangeTrackingSig_Rad) Now I really didnt think it needed to be simplified any further, but lets remove all the variables we're not even talking about simply to see the relation between signature resolution and tracking. (Sig_Res)/(Tracking) Looks suspiciously like they have an inverse relationship doesn't it? Now lets pretend your bonuses, hardwirings, and tracking mods happen to increase your tracking by... 50%, nice. (Sig_Res)/(Tracking1.5)* Now what happens if Sig_Res is reduced by 50% too. This is also commonly known as dividing by 2, so we put a 2 on the bottom of the equation. *(Sig_Res)/(Tracking1.52)Whoa..... did you see that?!?! That division by 2 multiplies with any tracking modifiers (in this case the +50% tracking). In case you missed it... (Sig_Res)/(Tracking1.52)* WOW, they multiply.... THAT MEANS CHANGES TO SIG RES AND TRACKIGN STACK PERFECTLY IN EVERY WAY........ WOW. Thats all good bro but there is not a mod in game that changes Sig Res its a fixed stat. It's nice that moveing it around like that works like tracking in the to hit formal. But it do's not get improved in any way by Ship bounces/hardwiring/tracking mods. Here it is again for you. It is: Hit chance = ((1/2)^(((Transv/(Range*nullTRACKING))*(Sig_Res/Sig_Rad))^2) +((max(0,Range-Optimal))/Falloff)^2)) I bolded the part of the Hit chance formaly that is truely affected by Ship bounces/hardwiring/tracking mods. I never said that Sig_Res reduction was not a Hit chance inc it is. But it's not affected by Ship bounces/hardwiring/tracking mods. It's just not. Just as it is a fixed number now it would be a fixed number after a 10% reduction bro. Hope that you can understand that. I know no other way to get that point out there for you. Edit: I also Bolded the part were you went wrong as there is nothing in game that is going to lower your gun's Sig_Res for you. Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rented	Posted - 2011.01.07 23:56:00 - [38] I just showed exactly how it is, in fact, effected by tracking mods, and how inverted changes to tracking and signature resolution have *identical* impacts on hit chance... making your proposal to change both pointless besides showing how you don't actually know how turrets work and have no grasp of the math involved. You seem to be extremely bad at math, apparently even when others do it for you.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2011.01.08 04:38:00 - [39] Edited by: Rip Minner on 08/01/2011 04:42:26 Edited by: Rip Minner on 08/01/2011 04:41:08 Originally by: Rented Edited by: Rented on 08/01/2011 00:18:47 I just showed exactly how it is, in fact, effected by tracking mods, and how inverted changes to tracking and signature resolution have *identical* impacts on hit chance... making your proposal to change both pointless. I bolded the part of the hit chance equation that is ACTUALLY effected by tracking mods (aka- stacks with): Hit chance = ((1/2)^*(((Transv/(RangeTracking))(Sig_Res/Sig_Rad))^2) +((max(0,Range-Optimal))/Falloff)^2)) You'll notice that the bolded part of the equation consists entirely of variables being multiplied together, some of which are inverted(division), and that it includes tracking and signature resolution. Obviously if everything is being multiplied together, any changes to them are multiplied together as well, this means those changes stack. Your problem Rented is that you dont get were the variables* for the formal come from. The math before the math that is missing you up bro. If you realy this good with math how can you not fig this out with out me having to put up the formal that is used to get the Tracking variable up here for you. And if you have not fig it out by now there is no math formal used to get then Sig_Res number becouse it's a fixed number on the gunnery weapon with no ingame multipliers. I am also starting to think mybe you failed Algebra. Sig_Res formal is What ever is on the gunnery weapon in question Tracking formal is Base Tracking of the weapon multiplied by Ship bounses/Tracking mods/Hardwiring and skills. I dont have that formal in front of me right this sec and dont remeaber it in full off the top of my head. But if I have to I will go find it for you Rented. Becouse it has nothing to do with Sig_Res. How ever I will give you a nice 10/10 for a very good troll Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Shea Amara	Posted - 2011.01.08 08:04:00 - [40] Something needs to be done and this looks as good as anything alse I have seen.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2011.01.08 13:37:00 - [41] This is painful. Rip, why do you want to change sig resolution instead of tracking? You must think that doing this will produce a different in-game effect? Tell me what happens in the following situation. How much damage (as a percentage of the EFT maximum) is done? Transversal is zero. A turret of signature resolution 400 m fires at a target of signature radius 40 m sitting at its optimal range.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2011.01.08 16:54:00 - [42] Edited by: Rip Minner on 08/01/2011 16:58:41 Originally by: Gypsio III This is painful. Rip, why do you want to change sig resolution instead of tracking? You must think that doing this will produce a different in-game effect? Tell me what happens in the following situation. How much damage (as a percentage of the EFT maximum) is done? Transversal is zero. A turret of signature resolution 400 m fires at a target of signature radius 40 m sitting at its optimal range. Snap I did not think of it like that. I was wanting to use the Sig_Res as a way to inc tracking for Caldire ships with out making the guns overly fast on Galante ships with tracking bounces. Though mybe it's still a good change on Rails they need a damg inc as well and a tracking inc. for Caldire gunboats. Mybe a 10% damg inc on rails and Lead adds a 20% tracking inc? Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Omara Otawan	Posted - 2011.01.08 18:00:00 - [43] Originally by: Rip Minner The problem is the two diffent race's ships make them near impossable to balance realy. Ether need to remove Hybirds and hand Gallent Projectiles and Caldire Lazers or Give Hybirds to Gallent and make a 4th gunnery system for Caldire. Once you realize caldari gunships are mainly rail focused while gallente are mainly blaster focused it really isnt that difficult.
FlameGlow Rebellion Alliance	Posted - 2011.01.08 18:37:00 - [44] Originally by: Omara Otawan Originally by: Rip Minner The problem is the two diffent race's ships make them near impossable to balance realy. Ether need to remove Hybirds and hand Gallent Projectiles and Caldire Lazers or Give Hybirds to Gallent and make a 4th gunnery system for Caldire. Once you realize caldari gunships are mainly rail focused while gallente are mainly blaster focused it really isnt that difficult. By rail focused you mean can't fit them due to PG and got no tracking and usually no damage bonus greatly complementing a weapon system with great range, low damage and poor tracking? And by blaster focused you mean slow, armor-tanked ships, ideal for use with shortest-range weapons?
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2011.01.08 19:48:00 - [45] Originally by: FlameGlow Originally by: Omara Otawan Originally by: Rip Minner The problem is the two diffent race's ships make them near impossable to balance realy. Ether need to remove Hybirds and hand Gallent Projectiles and Caldire Lazers or Give Hybirds to Gallent and make a 4th gunnery system for Caldire. Once you realize caldari gunships are mainly rail focused while gallente are mainly blaster focused it really isnt that difficult. By rail focused you mean can't fit them due to PG and got no tracking and usually no damage bonus greatly complementing a weapon system with great range, low damage and poor tracking? And by blaster focused you mean slow, armor-tanked ships, ideal for use with shortest-range weapons? Ya I loled at this too Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2011.01.08 19:57:00 - [46] As long as Caldari railboats have the range to use faction ammo, they'll have far better tracking than their Gallente counterparts (and any other turret using T2 long-range ammo). Remember, range bonuses are damage bonuses. I suspect that fiddling with rail range will offer a more targeted boost to the Caldari railboats than just a straight damage boost. Looking at Rokh and Eagle PG will also help. Of course, some more damage may also be needed, but I'd start with looking at the range myself. I haven't run any numbers on this.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2011.01.08 20:03:00 - [47] Edited by: Rip Minner on 08/01/2011 20:07:37 Originally by: Gypsio III As long as Caldari railboats have the range to use faction ammo, they'll have far better tracking than their Gallente counterparts (and any other turret using T2 long-range ammo). Remember, range bonuses are damage bonuses. I suspect that fiddling with rail range will offer a more targeted boost to the Caldari railboats than just a straight damage boost. Looking at Rokh and Eagle PG will also help. Of course, some more damage may also be needed, but I'd start with looking at the range myself. I haven't run any numbers on this. Ya becouse we all know that Caldire boats are so fast and agile that you can keep range right? I also take it you have not used beams on a Apoc or Artilary on a Mel? The better sniping dps is going to Lazer's and the better Alph to Artilary's Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2011.01.08 21:08:00 - [48] Originally by: Rip Minner Originally by: Gypsio III As long as Caldari railboats have the range to use faction ammo, they'll have far better tracking than their Gallente counterparts (and any other turret using T2 long-range ammo). Remember, range bonuses are damage bonuses. I suspect that fiddling with rail range will offer a more targeted boost to the Caldari railboats than just a straight damage boost. Looking at Rokh and Eagle PG will also help. Of course, some more damage may also be needed, but I'd start with looking at the range myself. I haven't run any numbers on this. Ya becouse we all know that Caldire boats are so fast and agile that you can keep range right? I also take it you have not used beams on a Apoc or Artilary on a Mel? The better sniping dps is going to Lazer's and the better Alph to Artilary's Are hybirds useable ya any weapon system is useable with a big blob. And everyone can use Fraction ammo. You what? Come on man, think before you post. We're talking about rails, hence sniping. Ship speed is of little consequence for snipers, especially on the BS scale. And Caldari ships have good agility. Alpha is artillery's theme, it's no bloody surprise that it's more than rails. And of course Beams have more damage, they have less range. And no, not everyone can use faction ammo, because they don't have the range. Look, if you're to propose the boost that rails need, you need to have a basic understanding of the weapons. After seeing your utter confusion about tracking I have zero confidence in your ability to do so now. Stop whinging and try to propose a coherent idea for boosting rails backed up by specific fits and comparisons. More tracking on rails isn't really necessary, particularly not in the half-baked sig resolution fashion that you came up with originally. The fundamental problem is damage at range, which can be addressed via increased raw damage or increased range.
Rented	Posted - 2011.01.08 21:10:00 - [49] Edited by: Rented on 08/01/2011 21:13:46 Lets actually put your original proposal into the hit equation. Which is 10% reduced signature resolution, and 20% increased tracking. Hit chance = ((1/2)^(((Transv/(RangeTracking1.2))((Sig_Res0.9)/Sig_Rad))^2) +((max(0,Range-Optimal))/Falloff)^2)) This is an exact representation of what you've proposed for hybrids, as tracking is improved by 20%, and signature resolution is reduced by 10% (which is your idea). However this also equals... ((1/2)^((((Transv*0.9)/(RangeTracking1.2))(Sig_Res/Sig_Rad))^2) +((max(0,Range-Optimal))/Falloff)^2)) Which also equals... ((1/2)^(((Transv/(RangeTracking*1.2*1.1111111111))(Sig_Res/Sig_Rad))^2) +((max(0,Range-Optimal))/Falloff)^2)) Which also equals... ((1/2)^(((Transv/(RangeTracking*1.3333333333))(Sig_Res/Sig_Rad))^2) +((max(0,Range-Optimal))/Falloff)^2)) Which is the same as just a 33.33333333% increase to tracking... so why did you propose changing signature resolution? What you fail to understand is that the first equation I've shown here accurately represents your proposed changes and has exactly the same value as the last, aside from an infinitely repeating decimal I didn't take the time to type out, demonstrating changing both tracking and signature resolution is pointless. You also seem to fail to understand a change to base tracking can be applied either before or after any other modifiers to the same effect. Originally by: Rip Minner I am also starting to think mybe you failed Algebra. I took and passed both college calculus and advanced linear algebra, pretty good grades too... have you finished highschool? I find your elementary grade grasp of math disturbing. Apparently valid mathimatical proofs just aren't good enough for you.
Omara Otawan	Posted - 2011.01.08 23:39:00 - [50] Originally by: Rip Minner Mybe it's the fact you get better usage out of the gun BC Ferox with Artilery that makes them Rail focused? Yea, now that you mention it the Ferox does have this bonus to projectile optimal range... Originally by: Rip Minner Or mybe it's the fact you get usage out of AC's on the Myradon? That makes them blaster focused? The myrm does not have any turret bonuses, so it can fit whatever it wants. If you are looking for blaster focused platforms, I suggest you take a close look at Deimos or Astarte... 2/10 for trolling attempt though.
Ildryn do you -Mostly Harmless-	Posted - 2011.01.09 02:32:00 - [51] I am all for fixing hybrids. But i have not a clue what a hybird is. Can it fly?
Ogogov Gallente Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.01.09 03:26:00 - [52] Originally by: Ildryn I am all for fixing hybrids. But i have not a clue what a hybird is. Can it fly? only for a short amount of time if you drop it in orbit over a planet from your cargo hold.
MeBiatch	Posted - 2011.01.09 03:50:00 - [53] Originally by: Rented Edited by: Rented on 09/01/2011 02:45:51 I posted yet another mathimatical proof of the direct relation between tracking and signature resolution... but after considering your apparent inability to read numbers and/or do math at all, I've given up and deleted it. interesting enough... sig res of guns has no ewar that negatively affects them... but tracking comps affect the direct tracking of guns... so in a way haveing a reduced sig res for guns will help hybrids against tracking disrupters... though i heard that if they balanced out the optimal range and falloff on blasters so that both would be 50% of max range this would help them out a whole lot... which would negate having to give blasters a tracking boost... though i still think a reduced sig res is a neat way to increase chance to hit...
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2011.01.09 08:36:00 - [54] Edited by: Rip Minner on 09/01/2011 08:46:12 Originally by: Gypsio III Originally by: Rip Minner Originally by: Gypsio III As long as Caldari railboats have the range to use faction ammo, they'll have far better tracking than their Gallente counterparts (and any other turret using T2 long-range ammo). Remember, range bonuses are damage bonuses. I suspect that fiddling with rail range will offer a more targeted boost to the Caldari railboats than just a straight damage boost. Looking at Rokh and Eagle PG will also help. Of course, some more damage may also be needed, but I'd start with looking at the range myself. I haven't run any numbers on this. Ya becouse we all know that Caldire boats are so fast and agile that you can keep range right? I also take it you have not used beams on a Apoc or Artilary on a Mel? The better sniping dps is going to Lazer's and the better Alph to Artilary's Are hybirds useable ya any weapon system is useable with a big blob. And everyone can use Fraction ammo. You what? Come on man, think before you post. We're talking about rails, hence sniping. Ship speed is of little consequence for snipers, especially on the BS scale. And Caldari ships have good agility. Alpha is artillery's theme, it's no bloody surprise that it's more than rails. And of course Beams have more damage, they have less range. And no, not everyone can use faction ammo, because they don't have the range. Look, if you're to propose the boost that rails need, you need to have a basic understanding of the weapons. After seeing your utter confusion about tracking I have zero confidence in your ability to do so now. Stop whinging and try to propose a coherent idea for boosting rails backed up by specific fits and comparisons. More tracking on rails isn't really necessary, particularly not in the half-baked sig resolution fashion that you came up with originally. The fundamental problem is damage at range, which can be addressed via increased raw damage or increased range. Last time I checked the Apoc can reach out just as far with more dps then the Rohk. And the Apoc is more agile. As far as boosting raw dps then you end up with a Kin/Therm Beam with worse tracking and reload times. Why dont you go and get a basic understanding of the BS sniping platforms? If you did you would already know that you need 15 Rohk's to match the dps of 10 Apoc snipers. How ever if you inc there tracking they would make a good Middle ground Gunnery platform for fighting in mid range reather then inc the dps for a kin/therm beam ripoff. Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2011.01.09 09:28:00 - [55] Originally by: Rented Edited by: Rented on 09/01/2011 02:45:51 I posted yet another mathimatical proof of the direct relation between tracking and signature resolution... but after considering my apparent inability to read numbers and/or do math at all, I've given up and deleted it. Becouse I still can't show a direct relation between ingame tracking inc/dec mechanics and signature resolution. I'm having a reather hard time on the concept of a Constant or fixed number in equations. There fixed the for ya Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2011.01.09 09:59:00 - [56] Originally by: MeBiatch Originally by: Rented Edited by: Rented on 09/01/2011 02:45:51 I posted yet another mathimatical proof of the direct relation between tracking and signature resolution... but after considering your apparent inability to read numbers and/or do math at all, I've given up and deleted it. interesting enough... sig res of guns has no ewar that negatively affects them... but tracking comps affect the direct tracking of guns... so in a way haveing a reduced sig res for guns will help hybrids against tracking disrupters... though i heard that if they balanced out the optimal range and falloff on blasters so that both would be 50% of max range this would help them out a whole lot... which would negate having to give blasters a tracking boost... though i still think a reduced sig res is a neat way to increase chance to hit... At least someone gets the Two differnt sides of Tracking/Sig_Res. Just as the hit chances inc of a low Sig_Res would be unaffected by ewar they would also be unaffected by Skills/tracking mods/hardwiring/ship bounces. Rented you could learn a thing or two from this guy Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2011.01.09 10:23:00 - [57] Edited by: Rip Minner on 09/01/2011 10:25:31 Originally by: Omara Otawan Originally by: Rip Minner Mybe it's the fact you get better usage out of the gun BC Ferox with Artilery that makes them Rail focused? Yea, now that you mention it the Ferox does have this bonus to projectile optimal range... Originally by: Rip Minner Or mybe it's the fact you get usage out of AC's on the Myradon? That makes them blaster focused? The myrm does not have any turret bonuses, so it can fit whatever it wants. If you are looking for blaster focused platforms, I suggest you take a close look at Deimos or Astarte... 2/10 for trolling attempt though. Yea, now that you mention the Ferox does have this bonus to Hybirds opt range on Med hybirds but Med Projectiles get out to the same range hit harder track faster capless with better ammo options and lower fitings cost. Funny that. I too give you a 2/10 sir Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rented	Posted - 2011.01.10 00:47:00 - [58] Edited by: Rented on 10/01/2011 00:50:33 Originally by: Rip Minner Originally by: MeBiatch Originally by: Rented Edited by: Rented on 09/01/2011 02:45:51 I posted yet another mathimatical proof of the direct relation between tracking and signature resolution... but after considering your apparent inability to read numbers and/or do math at all, I've given up and deleted it. interesting enough... sig res of guns has no ewar that negatively affects them... but tracking comps affect the direct tracking of guns... so in a way haveing a reduced sig res for guns will help hybrids against tracking disrupters... though i heard that if they balanced out the optimal range and falloff on blasters so that both would be 50% of max range this would help them out a whole lot... which would negate having to give blasters a tracking boost... though i still think a reduced sig res is a neat way to increase chance to hit... At least someone gets the Two differnt sides of Tracking/Sig_Res. Just as the hit chances inc of a low Sig_Res would be unaffected by ewar they would also be unaffected by Skills/tracking mods/hardwiring/ship bounces. Rented you could learn a thing or two from this guy Someone else being just as bad at math as you doesn't make your math any less wrong. Originally by: Rip Minner I am also starting to think mybe you failed Algebra. Interestingly enough I took and passed both college calculus and advanced linear algebra, pretty good grades too... have you finished highschool? I find your very poor grasp variable mathimatics somewhat amusing, I suppose I'll humor your grade school level of ignorance yet again. Hit chance = ((1/2)^(((Transv/(RangeTracking))(Sig_Res/Sig_Rad))^2) +((max(0,Range-Optimal))/Falloff)^2)) trackingModifications = all tracking effects stacked with stacking penalty, etc. Tracking = baseTrackingtrackingModificationsyourTrackingChange Sig_Res = signatureResolutionyourSigResChange Hit chance = ((1/2)^(((Transv/(RangebaseTrackingtrackingModificationsyourTrackingChange))((signatureResolutionyourSigResChange)/Sig_Rad))^2) +((max(0,Range-Optimal))/Falloff)^2)) Hit chance = ((1/2)^((((TransvyourSigResChange)/(RangebaseTrackingtrackingModificationsyourTrackingChange))(signatureResolution/Sig_Rad))^2) +((max(0,Range-Optimal))/Falloff)^2)) Hit chance = ((1/2)^(((Transv/(RangebaseTrackingtrackingModificationsyourTrackingChange(1/yourSigResChange)))(signatureResolution/Sig_Rad))^2) +((max(0,Range-Optimal))/Falloff)^2)) Funny how yourSigResChange can be inverted and moved right over and multiplied with yourTrackingChange like that, it almost as if it'd be pointless to make both changes, even despite the fact that trackingModifications are being applied. I really don't get how you can fail to grasp that Sig_Res and Tracking are being inversely multiplied together and that obviously any changes that have been made to them get inversely multiplied together as well (also known as stacking). And finally... rearranging the hit chance equation into hopefully idiot-proof form. Hit chance = ((1/2)^((Sig_Res/Tracking)(Transv/(Sig_RadRange)))^2) +((max(0,Range-Optimal))/Falloff)^2)) Would Sig_Res being divided by Tracking happen to count as a direct relation to you? Don't think it's a valid form of the equation? I highly encourage you to attempt to prove it wrong, put in whatever values you wish and compare to the original, I would be nothing short of amazed. Feel free to show the math too, it'll be good for some laughs.
Omara Otawan	Posted - 2011.01.10 01:04:00 - [59] Edited by: Omara Otawan on 10/01/2011 01:07:04 Originally by: Rip Minner Yea, now that you mention the Ferox does have this bonus to Hybirds opt range on Med hybirds but Med Projectiles get out to the same range hit harder track faster capless with better ammo options and lower fitings cost. I'm intrigued how you get better range from artillery on the ferox than from rails. I'm also intrigued on how they track better, or have lower fitting costs, or do better damage@range... Originally by: Rip Minner I cant belive your pointing to the deimos as a working blaster cruiser. At least we still have the Astarte.... The problem people have with the Deimos is not that it doesnt work, but rather that it is a 120mill cruiser that gets instantly primaried.
Rented	Posted - 2011.01.10 01:52:00 - [60] Originally by: Omara Otawan Edited by: Omara Otawan on 10/01/2011 01:07:04 Originally by: Rip Minner Yea, now that you mention the Ferox does have this bonus to Hybirds opt range on Med hybirds but Med Projectiles get out to the same range hit harder track faster capless with better ammo options and lower fitings cost. I'm intrigued how you get better range from artillery on the ferox than from rails. I'm also intrigued on how they track better, or have lower fitting costs, or do better damage@range... Originally by: Rip Minner I cant belive your pointing to the deimos as a working blaster cruiser. At least we still have the Astarte.... The problem people have with the Deimos is not that it doesnt work, but rather that it is a 120mill cruiser that gets instantly primaried. Im pretty sure rational thought doesn't really come into much consideration, but it's fun to see what random crap comes next. Personally im hoping he endorses laser hyperions.

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