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Sporked
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Posted - 2011.01.07 12:43:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Davich MacGregor
Originally by: Barakkus If I'm not mistaken, EVE used to be like that in the beginnings.
You are highly misinformed. If anything it was even safer in the beginning.
Well no, not really given that CONCORD didn't exist. That and 1400's could hit orbiting frigs with near perfect accuracy. If anything, it's safer now what with ships having twice the HP they did at release while weapon damage has been toned down meaning combined with session timers and CONCORD it's far easier to escape traps and such these days.
Remember the days of Ravens one-volleying cruisers and below with 900-damage-each-2-minute-flight-time torps? Carriers with 25k armour? Gankageddons? Nosdomis? Thorax fielding 10 heavy drones? Think back on all that and compare it to now and you'll realise EVE is rediculously safe to those who pay attention, maybe a little too much so. If CONCORD were to go, the people who don't die now would continue to not die (well maybe now and again, theres always someone better than you) and everyone else would learn by example.
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Veliria
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Posted - 2011.01.07 12:56:00 -
[32]
Edited by: Veliria on 07/01/2011 12:56:21 The problem with everything going 0.0 isn't those who'd survive and fight but the total destruction of the economy.
Say what you want about the industrialists, but they're the ones that make PvP affordable. Kill CONCORD, you kill off 99% of the industry, and PvP suddenly becomes so expensive that no one would be able to fight for very long. The production of 0.0 alliances is heavily supplied/augmented by minerals/modules/ships hauled from high-sec. Half of a 0.0 alliance would suddenly have to devote itself entirely to carebearing if they want to have any hope of having ships, modules and ammo for their members.
The starting systems would be camped to death, forcing new players to do X for Alliance Y or get podded Z times. PvP would rise, then fall and never get back on its feet, everyone would be too on edge to not be in a PvP ship, so any industry would be minimal, and without replaceable ships, PvP would eventually just stop. Casual players and carebears would just playing altogether as they can't do anything other than PvP for maybe 1-2 hours or just login to find themselves camped and bubbled in their station.
tldr; No industry, no affordable ships, no more PvP, no more EVE.
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Comrade Tsukae
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Posted - 2011.01.07 13:06:00 -
[33]
I think it would be cool and work great if the gameplay were structured differently. The way the game is now it would be awful.
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Murev Vorchilde
Caldari End Game.
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Posted - 2011.01.07 14:40:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Davich MacGregor
Originally by: Barakkus If I'm not mistaken, EVE used to be like that in the beginnings.
You are highly misinformed. If anything it was even safer in the beginning.
Bad memory or didn't play back then? - How Id Fix Secret world of pensioners |
oolk
Caldari Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2011.01.07 15:18:00 -
[35]
They did it once back in 05 iirc..too old to remember when really.
Yes,whole TQ was 0.0
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Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.01.07 15:37:00 -
[36]
Honestly it wouldnt be that bad as some say, and much would become better.
Sure some carebears will stop, but also many will move to the new 0.0. Large 0.0 alliances either need to protect their space (which then tbh needs to be easier than it is now, so no afk cloakers for example), and either have large industrial renter alliances in their space or adapt NRDS policies to get more people in to get minerals.
In other words 0.0 would go from: Hello i am noobie with industrial filled with stuff i want to sell to you -> insta popped, to: Hello i am noobie with industrial filled with stuff i want to sell to you -> \o/.
Now of course some people would die out, independent pirates will have it pretty much impossible with almost nowhere docking rights. Better yet our gankerbears (high sec wardeccers) will die out since they cant play without concord protection. No more ninja salvaging and you can always deal with people who play station games (either your station -> remove docking rights, or plan B, take station).
So the tl;dr is, people think it is problematic because carebears will all leave, but i seriously doubt they will, as long as you do give 0.0 residents the means to police their space better. Since simply said, contrary to now those carebears will be essential to the survival of your alliance, since you cant buy everything you want in jita (also requires that macros dont do all the carebearing).
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Hurtado JaSett
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Posted - 2011.01.07 17:01:00 -
[37]
I absolutely think this would work and work well. But as the OP stated up front, there would have to be some basic gameplay changes in order to give alliances a reason to want neutrals to operate in their space. That's a change that's long overdue.
I like the idea of alliances being able to profit from a market tax in stations under their control. Alliances would be able to create their own Jita by keeping taxes low and working hard to keep the routes into the system safe. This gives the alliance a vested interest in creating a stable environment for industrialists, traders, and mission runners because tax proceeds would become one of the alliance's one important sources of steady income. People talking about 24hr camps outside market hubs clearly didn't read what the OP wrote.
I'm surprised to hear so many people arguing that EVE needs incredibly high levels of built in safety and predictability in order to thrive. If there's a real need for safety and stability, then shouldn't it be player-run empires creating those conditions?
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Joss56
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2011.01.07 17:09:00 -
[38]
@ OP Simple, you'll find my accounts/char's in sale at e-bay the day after.
I don't realy care to know if i would be the only one or make part of the smalest part of players that would do it. I have no time to waste with scum, suckers, window lickers, deviants, ******eds. And i will never pay some GAME for that.
________________________________________________
"You do realise you live on a globe, right? And that there places outside the USA/UK?"
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Cydori
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Posted - 2011.01.07 19:29:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Joss56 Simple, you'll find my accounts/char's in sale at e-bay the day after.
I don't realy care to know if i would be the only one or make part of the smalest part of players that would do it. I have no time to waste with scum, suckers, window lickers, deviants, ******eds. And i will never pay some GAME for that.
EVE is supposed to be a sandbox game. Why are some people so opposed to players having more control of what happens in New Eden? If people want automated magical Elven kingdoms to keep them warm and safe, there's always WoW ------------------>>>>>> |
Syn Callibri
Minmatar 21st Eridani Lighthorse Broken Chains Alliance
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Posted - 2011.01.07 19:53:00 -
[40]
I think null or lo-sec space (DMZ) along the borders of all of the four empires would be pretty cool...and make sense.
[21EL] Commander Tac-Ops / [21EL] I.S.C. |
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Kalle Demos
Amarr Hysteria Nexus
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Posted - 2011.01.07 20:08:00 -
[41]
There wouldnt be any opportunity for small alliances (unless you enjoy being called a pet or renter), look at the sov map now of whats in 0.0 the only independent sov holding alliances are CVA and Ev0ke lol.
The same thing would happen in Empire, when you get powerblocks like NC who want the whole of 0.0 blue, drone alliances filled with nothing but botters and everyone else leeching moon goo, would there be any point in making everything 0.0?
Originally by: Kool StoryBro <---
Originally by: CCP Spitfire Spam post removed.
Random forum moments <0> |
Liz Laser
Metalworks Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2011.01.07 23:10:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Rin Vires There is one amazingly postive thing that would come from all of EVE turning 0.0
All macros/bots would die!
Just imagine, people actually having to play the game again to make ISK. It's crazy I know, but just think about it.
Have you ever visited null-sec?
Macros and bots abound.
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Ma'lice
Minmatar Brutor tribe
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Posted - 2011.01.07 23:14:00 -
[43]
Originally by: oolk They did it once back in 05 iirc..too old to remember when really.
Yes,whole TQ was 0.0
It wasn't TQ it was SiSi. And it was a stress test a couple days before RMR if I remember correctly. But yeah it was in '05
Originally by: Portios Smith
1 v 1 are like sex, be selective or catch a bug
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Joe Phoenix
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Posted - 2011.01.07 23:15:00 -
[44]
A truely free eve would kill griefing, so the idea isn't that bad.
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Lain Umi
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Posted - 2011.01.08 01:23:00 -
[45]
if all of eve was 0.0, then those who played more would run the game. simple as that. yes, it's another casual vs. hardcore argument. in other words, eve's population would halve instantly.
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Messoroz
The Scope
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Posted - 2011.01.08 01:33:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Headerman I imagine it would be fun for TEST to camp Jita 4-4 with 100 Sieged Nags...
I call your bluff and raise 200 sieged Moros with lasers fitted.
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Chuuuuy
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Posted - 2011.01.08 01:41:00 -
[47]
How about instead of taking away 0.0 space, make alliances have to pay for it with the money they make from taxes. I'm not sure how much it would cost, but for an example, 1 billion per month would establish sentry guns on gates and a basic CONCORD that would police the alliances space. This way, alliances could attract industrialists, miners, and traders. Then, alliances would be able to fight over various resources in space, for example, let's say there is a constellation that is very rich in asteroid belts that would provide lots of ores and stuff. It would be awesome. Players would be responsible for setting up their own governments. Politics and military would become a much bigger factor. You could even have alliances between alliances to fight wars against other alliances.
It would be exactly like the real world.
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Sporked
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Posted - 2011.01.08 01:45:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Ma'lice
Originally by: oolk They did it once back in 05 iirc..too old to remember when really.
Yes,whole TQ was 0.0
It wasn't TQ it was SiSi. And it was a stress test a couple days before RMR if I remember correctly. But yeah it was in '05
No, it was TQ too in the run up to the launch of Empyrean Age and to tie in with the events going on in the first novel CONCORD was taken offline for 24 hours by the Minmatar Elders fleet turning a large proportion of the DED station in Yulai into very small bits of debris.
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Messoroz
The Scope
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Posted - 2011.01.08 02:27:00 -
[49]
Edited by: Messoroz on 08/01/2011 02:27:12
Originally by: Chuuuuy How about instead of taking away 0.0 space, make alliances have to pay for it with the money they make from taxes. I'm not sure how much it would cost, but for an example, 1 billion per month would establish sentry guns on gates and a basic CONCORD that would police the alliances space. This way, alliances could attract industrialists, miners, and traders. Then, alliances would be able to fight over various resources in space, for example, let's say there is a constellation that is very rich in asteroid belts that would provide lots of ores and stuff. It would be awesome. Players would be responsible for setting up their own governments. Politics and military would become a much bigger factor. You could even have alliances between alliances to fight wars against other alliances.
It would be exactly like the real world.
You do realize that alliances already do this right? (besides sentry guns, nobody likes em, nobody wants em)
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Yoritomo Kitao
Amarr
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Posted - 2011.01.08 03:49:00 -
[50]
Remove Concord... tag criminals for everybody in high sec... create a new job : F.B.E. (Federal Bureau of Eradicaton) ?! :P
o/
Originally by: Par'Gellen
Originally by: RaTTuS eve is not real
LIES!
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Syphon Lodian
Gallente Fabled Enterprises
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Posted - 2011.01.08 04:05:00 -
[51]
There would be an exodus. That's about it. Development halted etc.
Pretty much, the only people left, would be the pilots on the forums that have ever used the term "carebear" in a derogatory manner. Have fun playing by yourselves, and be careful what you wish for, and all that, etc etc. -------------------------------------------------- |
Mutant Caldari
Caldari Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.08 05:35:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Joss56 @ OP Simple, you'll find my accounts/char's in sale at e-bay the day after.
I don't realy care to know if i would be the only one or make part of the smalest part of players that would do it. I have no time to waste with scum, suckers, window lickers, deviants, ******eds. And i will never pay some GAME for that.
I like how you attempted to call others ******s yet you still managed to **** the word up. Yeah I am a pirate. What are you gonna do about it? Killboard link is not allowed to be used in a signature.Applebabe
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Merovee
Amarr Gorthaur Legion
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Posted - 2011.01.08 06:49:00 -
[53]
'03 was fun, but there was less people playing, room to move, ships we're smaller. Really! do we want to go back? It's a lot better now in empire as more people play the game. Enough of the daydreams. Of Mordor
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Joss56
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2011.01.08 10:30:00 -
[54]
Edited by: Joss56 on 08/01/2011 10:35:05
Originally by: Cydori
Originally by: Joss56 Simple, you'll find my accounts/char's in sale at e-bay the day after.
I don't realy care to know if i would be the only one or make part of the smalest part of players that would do it. I have no time to waste with scum, suckers, window lickers, deviants, ******eds. And i will never pay some GAME for that.
EVE is supposed to be a sandbox game. Why are some people so opposed to players having more control of what happens in New Eden? If people want automated magical Elven kingdoms to keep them warm and safe, there's always WoW ------------------>>>>>>
You miss the point here.
In Eve you can pve right?
If you don't want that people pve then you don't put any in the game, that's what you are missing.
You are also missing the point that more you force people to do your masochist game of gank 5/1 blobs scams and all the stuff that gives you your sexual pleasure, will just make them go away.
Now let me make you think about something you just said, you want pvp right? Wy can't you find any with all those systems full of people in low sec? what are you afraid of that makes you cry about high sec people?
Thank you for showing how stupid a human being can be. ________________________________________________
"You do realise you live on a globe, right? And that there places outside the USA/UK?"
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Joss56
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2011.01.08 10:39:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Mutant Caldari I like how you attempted to call others ******s yet you still managed to **** the word up.
yesi'm not english native, can't have all the bigest defaults of life.
So? ________________________________________________
"You do realise you live on a globe, right? And that there places outside the USA/UK?"
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Babel
Utopian Research I.E.L. Hedonistic Imperative
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Posted - 2011.01.08 11:51:00 -
[56]
No-one wants this to happen again !!!
Or maybe they do ? :) . All generalisations are false - Discuss.
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Decus Daga
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Posted - 2011.01.09 02:21:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Furb Killer Honestly it wouldnt be that bad as some say, and much would become better.
Sure some carebears will stop, but also many will move to the new 0.0. Large 0.0 alliances either need to protect their space (which then tbh needs to be easier than it is now, so no afk cloakers for example), and either have large industrial renter alliances in their space or adapt NRDS policies to get more people in to get minerals.
In other words 0.0 would go from: Hello i am noobie with industrial filled with stuff i want to sell to you -> insta popped, to: Hello i am noobie with industrial filled with stuff i want to sell to you -> \o/.
Now of course some people would die out, independent pirates will have it pretty much impossible with almost nowhere docking rights. Better yet our gankerbears (high sec wardeccers) will die out since they cant play without concord protection. No more ninja salvaging and you can always deal with people who play station games (either your station -> remove docking rights, or plan B, take station).
So the tl;dr is, people think it is problematic because carebears will all leave, but i seriously doubt they will, as long as you do give 0.0 residents the means to police their space better. Since simply said, contrary to now those carebears will be essential to the survival of your alliance, since you cant buy everything you want in jita (also requires that macros dont do all the carebearing).
I think your correct, would love to see this happen, but alas, i doubt it will ever. (perhaps the ONLY reason to ever support a 2nd server would be for a full null server).
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Rin Vires
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Posted - 2011.01.09 03:27:00 -
[58]
Edited by: Rin Vires on 09/01/2011 03:27:16 Alright, I'll admit that my previous post was naive. I haven't been in null sec for around 3 years so it was kind of dumb for me to post about it. But I have a question, how in the hell are there so many bots out there? Why are people not ganking them? No one (besides botters) seems to like them so why put up with them?
If I were in ratting in a system and found a blue bot ratting there as well, I would pop the ****er. Sure the owner would get mad, but he shouldn't be botting in the first place. If the alliance members wouldn't allow the bots then they wouldn't work. Complacency of the memebers is as much to blame as the bot users for massive amounts of 0.0 bots.
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Corozan Aspinall
Party Time Inc.
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Posted - 2011.01.09 04:02:00 -
[59]
Dynamic sec status based on incursions. Point to point travel as an alterantive to gates - modified probes to create micro cynos allowing recon class ships or equivalent to leap frog larger vessels a la frontier.
Wine. Mmm. Chateau Saint-Germain. 2008. Good year!
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2011.01.09 07:16:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Rin Vires Alright, I'll admit that my previous post was naive. I haven't been in null sec for around 3 years so it was kind of dumb for me to post about it. But I have a question, how in the hell are there so many bots out there? Why are people not ganking them? No one (besides botters) seems to like them so why put up with them?
If I were in ratting in a system and found a blue bot ratting there as well, I would pop the ****er. Sure the owner would get mad, but he shouldn't be botting in the first place. If the alliance members wouldn't allow the bots then they wouldn't work. Complacency of the memebers is as much to blame as the bot users for massive amounts of 0.0 bots.
Factors: - SuperCapital-Online (see last QEN for numbers on Titans/SCs) - Nap-Fest (see NC) - Local as immediate intel tool - Braindead NPC (see agression mechanics and fixed content) - Braindead PvE content (see courier missions, see kill missions) - Blobfest-Online (see cyno/jumpbridge mechanics) - Jumpgate Bottleneck - Hotdrop-Online - HP-Online (see timers and HP on sov modules) support Public Idea Tracker | 24hr PLEX |
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