probably the bcs, as they are locking faster, tracking better and are quicker at running once the locals formed up and the **** starts hitting the fan.

i am not saying that battleships are bad, and that you can't use them for anything besides pos bashing. but most of the time they won't perform much better than a bunch of battlecruisers and t2 cruisers. they have their uses, but they simply aren't worth it for the average player.

with the cruiser skills being x5 and x6 and being at least partially required for battleships, you can skill cruisers, advanced medium guns and 2 of the advanced cruisers to V in the same time it would take you to skill large t2 guns and battleships to V. and seing what range of ships you can fly with those skills and the skills you get access to makes the decision easy for many players.

So why won't anyone train Battleships?

Twenty plus new pilots, not a single one of them is willing to train battleships.

"I am gonna fly a Tengu"
"I would rather just fly frigates"
"I personally am just gonna do logistics"
"I want a freighter"
"Have Nighthawk, don't need a battleship"
"Sleipnir does everything"
"I don't fly battleships"
"I would train it but I need to get my elite certificates"
"I would rather fly a Hulk"
"I am not in your corp"
"I think a Sac would be better than a battleship, no?"
"All I need is my Drake"
"I fly the drake thats like a battleship"
"If Jeff is gonna fly a Drake so am I"
"Battleships are too slow"
"MWD + Slasher, nuff said"
"I have Caldari Battleship, why do I need another BS?"
"Only reason to train battleships is for carriers and I will never use one"
"It is suicide to fly a battleship outside of high-sec"
"I won't fly a battleship, cause I pay $15 a month, and you can't tell me what to train"
"In all seriousness... you can eat a bag of dicks"
"I won't train it, cause I don't want to train it"

What is the magic hammer argument for "Train a battleship so we can kill POS you dumb mother frackers?"
It would be so cool to have 20 people in Amarr battleships blasting POS to goo, but nobody will train.

I give up

"True... you may not use a battleship often, but when you need to use one you REALLY need to use one as few things will substitute a good battleship in a fleet."

I run in a CNR and am thinking of moving to a Navy Scorp (so i can use one of those extra mid slots for an AB :D ) and i love battleships, the one thing that niggles me about them is how slow they move which can be a real PITA for missions with gates a good distance away, and from what i can tell a large majority of people i know that don't like them for exactly that reason, they go for Tengu's instead because although it takes longer to train for and costs a lot more, a tengu can tear its way through level4 missions far quicker than most battleships, so i understand where they're coming from, despite the fact that i will always love my battleships :D

"True... you may not use a battleship often, but when you need to use one you REALLY need to use one as few things will substitute a good battleship in a fleet."

Has anyone said NeutDomi yet?

It would be so cool to have 20 people in Amarr battleships blasting POS to goo, but nobody will train.

Tell them 20 Mealstroms would instapop most of the other subcap ships they would have wanted to train?

How things have changed..

When I started years ago it seemed that all new pilots wanted to do was get into a battleship as quickly as possible, then whine when they got popped because their frigate guns didn't get the job done..

if you are going to bitchslap someone, and you have got a good logistics wing, BS is your choice.
It's like sitting in an 2000000 mm howitzer instapoping everything in sight.

noob with not much than 3 mil sp are in NM running incursions making billions dont see why your noobs cant do the same.

pathetic just how pathetic this game becoming.

The basic argument is that CERTAIN NEW PLAYERS put more stock in what EFT says is a bigger number than what actually flies, and are very very quick to dismiss the advice and experience of pilots who've been around long enough to know what's the better option. Reminding said people of this fact is the simplest thing to do. No need to be an ass, just gently remind them that, actually, you've been playing this game longer than they have, and you probably have a better idea of what's a good idea.

Specific counterpoints:

"I am gonna fly a Tengu"

Learn to actually PvP before you fly around a ship that costs a billion ISK to fiy properly. Alternatively, carebear.

"I would rather just fly frigates"

Admirable, actually. Train for battleships when you've maxed out frigate skills.

"I personally am just gonna do logistics"

Uh...wow? People actually want to fly logistics? Sounds like an ace pilot to me.

"I want a freighter"

Carebear.

"Have Nighthawk, don't need a battleship"

EFT more.

"Sleipnir does everything"

EFT more.

"I don't fly battleships"

Well what do you fly?

"I would train it but I need to get my elite certificates"

lol

"I would rather fly a Hulk"

Carebear.

"I am not in your corp"

I'm assuming this is an alliancemate? Talk to CEO?

"I think a Sac would be better than a battleship, no?"

EFT more.

"All I need is my Drake"

Is it a nanodrake? If it isn't, then EFT more.

"I fly the drake thats like a battleship"

EFT more.

"If Jeff is gonna fly a Drake so am I"

Jeff probably isn't the ranking FC in this conversation.

"Battleships are too slow"

Battleships aren't meant to be fast.

"MWD + Slasher, nuff said"

Kick from corp.

"I have Caldari Battleship, why do I need another BS?"

Torp ravens aren't terrible for POS bashes are they? I honestly don't know, the only caldari battleship I touch is the scorp.

"Only reason to train battleships is for carriers and I will never use one"

You've trained for them, might as well use them if the FC says to.

"It is suicide to fly a battleship outside of high-sec"

lol no

"I won't fly a battleship, cause I pay $15 a month, and you can't tell me what to train"

Kick from corp.

"In all seriousness... you can eat a bag of dicks"

Kick from corp.

"I won't train it, cause I don't want to train it"

Kick from corp.

I don't mean to tell you how to run your show, but to me this sounds largely like a discipline problem with your new pilots. The remainder just don't know any better, and a bit of time actually flying in space will learn them good. Or they'll refuse to join fleet ops because their ship is arse, and then you can call them on not pulling their weight.