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Mas Cream Monetary Allocation Certified Securities Inc.	Posted - 2011.02.10 21:29:00 - [91] MACSI recommends less audits, more LOLCAT links. Buy Shares in Eve Online's First FAKE SCAM!
RAW23	Posted - 2011.02.10 21:34:00 - [92] Originally by: Cheque Please PS: I was denied funding by the MD Audit Fund I don't remember which way I voted on your audit (although, if memory serves, I only voted against one in total) but looking again at your first offering thread it is not entirely surprising that you were not considered to be a serious potential recipient of charitably donated funds . I think promising an audit in your OP, then doing an about face once the bond filled (pending audit), and then changing your mind again once all your potential investors withdrew might possibly have had something to do with it. Fake edit Looking at my mail, I voted for funding your audit btw.
Hrabandur2 Amarr	Posted - 2011.02.10 21:39:00 - [93] Thx for the business opportunity. I confirm that i recieved the anticipated interest and principal. You have however ended this a touch soon. As you say you might want to pay more interest i would like that I also liked your convos! Always ready to chat spending some time with your investors is nice. The stop loss thing should become a standart for MD, but i think that wont happen cause nobody else seemed to like that part. I however see the need for a simple structure for unsecured bonds i the future with a performance check included that shouldn't be to hard to implement. So i want to thank you again for the great time chatting with you and i hope you invest the money good. Nice played and fly safe
RAW23	Posted - 2011.02.10 21:50:00 - [94] Edited by: RAW23 on 10/02/2011 21:51:23 Originally by: Block Ukx Originally by: Lethal Entrepreneur ... A proposed fix to this would be to for auditors to actually give a discounted audit on a characterÆs first offering. Oh yeah, that should have fixed everything! An audit would have stopped you from stealing the ISK. Those are very powerful auditors. Funny to hear a scammer recommending audits, when we all know audits can't prevent people for stealing your ISK. I don't think many people who argue for audits argue that they stop scams (although they can stop Ponzi schemes from growing and, thus, stop scammers from stealing MORE isk). The claim is, rather, that they give investors more information to base their risk assessments on. Btw, how is your audit coming along? Have you selected an auditor yet?
soncir	Posted - 2011.02.10 21:57:00 - [95] Well I lost a little isk on my first MD investment. I'll go back to the other sources for future. I am amazed you'd burn the char for a few billion though.
Two Shots Caldari GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2011.02.10 22:07:00 - [96] Originally by: soncir Edited by: soncir on 10/02/2011 22:01:15 Well I lost a little isk on my first MD investment. I'll go back to the other sources for future. I am amazed you'd burn the char for a few billion though. Alt edit fail: Reservent. Why are you amazed by that? The character cost him 1 billion to buy and made him 6.2 billion. That's over a 500% return on his investment. Two Shots Goonwaffe
Lethal Entrepreneur	Posted - 2011.02.10 22:10:00 - [97] Edited by: Lethal Entrepreneur on 10/02/2011 22:10:40 Originally by: Two Shots Originally by: soncir Edited by: soncir on 10/02/2011 22:01:15 Well I lost a little isk on my first MD investment. I'll go back to the other sources for future. I am amazed you'd burn the char for a few billion though. Alt edit fail: Reservent. Why are you amazed by that? The character cost him 1 billion to buy and made him 6.2 billion. That's over a 500% return on his investment. I scammed the 1bn on my first toon as well, Actually even when i posted this thread I had a price check going for the price of this character to be sold out. Nobody bothered checking last posts or anything.
Block Ukx Forge Laboratories	Posted - 2011.02.10 23:28:00 - [98] Originally by: RAW23 I don't think many people who argue for audits argue that they stop scams (although they can stop Ponzi schemes from growing and, thus, stop scammers from stealing MORE isk). The claim is, rather, that they give investors more information to base their risk assessments on. Btw, how is your audit coming along? Have you selected an auditor yet? It might help with regard to the business assessment, but it does nothing for scam assessment. An audit is a useful tool for a scammer to gain more ISK. You still thinking of a poor scammer, but most scammers build scams over previous scams, so they have resources to make an audit look legit. Do you still believe audits cannot be forged? Regarding BSAC, we created a new account and are moving the CSF assets over to the new account, which is a bit time consuming. With the exception of contracts (no contract API), this separate account will allow for a full transparency in the CSF business; becoming the first business to do so. Regarding the auditor, I have not found anyone trustworthy to do the audit yet. BSAC Stock Exchange - EVE's only real-time stock exchange
Block Ukx Forge Laboratories	Posted - 2011.02.10 23:30:00 - [99] Originally by: Lethal Entrepreneur I scammed the 1bn on my first toon as well, Actually even when i posted this thread I had a price check going for the price of this character to be sold out. Nobody bothered checking last posts or anything. I guess your next step is to abuse the audit mentality and steal more funds with an even bigger IPO. BSAC Stock Exchange - EVE's only real-time stock exchange
Lethal Entrepreneur	Posted - 2011.02.10 23:36:00 - [100] Originally by: Block Ukx Originally by: Lethal Entrepreneur I scammed the 1bn on my first toon as well, Actually even when i posted this thread I had a price check going for the price of this character to be sold out. Nobody bothered checking last posts or anything. I guess your next step is to abuse the audit mentality and steal more funds with an even bigger IPO. I can neither confirm nor deny any future plans. Also if anyone with an idea how to work any market tool had my full api, I would have never raised a dime.
Cheque Please Hot Like Mexico	Posted - 2011.02.11 00:04:00 - [101] Originally by: RAW23 Originally by: Cheque Please PS: I was denied funding by the MD Audit Fund I don't remember which way I voted on your audit (although, if memory serves, I only voted against one in total) but looking again at your first offering thread it is not entirely surprising that you were not considered to be a serious potential recipient of charitably donated funds . I think promising an audit in your OP, then doing an about face once the bond filled (pending audit), and then changing your mind again once all your potential investors withdrew might possibly have had something to do with it. Fake edit Looking at my mail, I voted for funding your audit btw. Haha, no worries. I don't blame anyone; my first bond was probably a little too crazy. I wouldn't have invested in me either. On topic: Lethal, I'm curious as to what your end game is. Most scammers just cut and run and maybe try to do it again with a new character, but you're still here advocating audits and tighter security. --- RL Meeting w/ Chribba
Breaker77 Gallente Reclamation Industries	Posted - 2011.02.11 00:16:00 - [102] Originally by: Cheque Please On topic: Lethal, I'm curious as to what your end game is. Most scammers just cut and run and maybe try to do it again with a new character, but you're still here advocating audits and tighter security. Bad Bobby did the same thing. He even gave the MD Audit Fund a chance to find a new investment so he didn't rob it. He even stated that, but I can't be asked to dig through the piles of posts looking for it. So in summary is LE = BB alt?
Liberty Eternal	Posted - 2011.02.11 00:25:00 - [103] Originally by: Breaker77 So in summary is LE = BB alt? lol, for a second there I was about to tear you a new one I would say no, as the other LE is clearly quite an intelligent human being, while Bad Bobby was an incompetent idiot.
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2011.02.11 00:29:00 - [104] Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha on 11/02/2011 00:30:52 Originally by: Breaker77 Originally by: Cheque Please On topic: Lethal, I'm curious as to what your end game is. Most scammers just cut and run and maybe try to do it again with a new character, but you're still here advocating audits and tighter security. Bad Bobby did the same thing. He even gave the MD Audit Fund a chance to find a new investment so he didn't rob it. He even stated that, but I can't be asked to dig through the piles of posts looking for it. So in summary is LE = BB alt? Fun thing, I was thinking exactly the same. It's the most dangerous scammer. The regular ones are "too heavy" and easily caught, the "random trigger inside" scammer sometimes does not even know he is a scammer, he just entertrains the idea (even in this scam, the OP says he might pay back, another BB alike ambiguity between scam, not scam, give back but always be under the ligths. It's also a sign of a little personality disorder. Quote: I would say no, as the other LE is clearly quite an intelligent human being, while Bad Bobby was an incompetent idiot You have only seen a certain facet of BB, the one he wanted you to see. Best scammers are also magnificent roleplayers. - Auditing & consulting When looking for investors, please read http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h + http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
Cheque Please Hot Like Mexico	Posted - 2011.02.11 00:31:00 - [105] Originally by: Liberty Eternal Originally by: Breaker77 So in summary is LE = BB alt? lol, for a second there I was about to tear you a new one I would say no, as the other LE is clearly quite an intelligent human being, while Bad Bobby was an incompetent idiot. That's odd, because they're both really just Ji Sama alts (including Breaker) --- RL Meeting w/ Chribba
Lethal Entrepreneur	Posted - 2011.02.11 00:37:00 - [106] My end-game? I like a challenge.
Lethal Entrepreneur	Posted - 2011.02.11 00:48:00 - [107] Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha on 11/02/2011 00:30:52 Originally by: Breaker77 Originally by: Cheque Please On topic: Lethal, I'm curious as to what your end game is. Most scammers just cut and run and maybe try to do it again with a new character, but you're still here advocating audits and tighter security. Bad Bobby did the same thing. He even gave the MD Audit Fund a chance to find a new investment so he didn't rob it. He even stated that, but I can't be asked to dig through the piles of posts looking for it. So in summary is LE = BB alt? Fun thing, I was thinking exactly the same. It's the most dangerous scammer. The regular ones are "too heavy" and easily caught, the "random trigger inside" scammer sometimes does not even know he is a scammer, he just entertrains the idea (even in this scam, the OP says he might pay back, another BB alike ambiguity between scam, not scam, give back but always be under the ligths. It's also a sign of a little personality disorder. Explains why I always attract the weirdos.
Marhaba	Posted - 2011.02.11 03:22:00 - [108] I knew this was a scam when Lethal convo'd me out of the blue, even though I've had no previous contact with the person. I'm not linking the whole chat log, just the one relevant line from me: [ 2011.02.08 01:47:44 ] Marhaba > Sounds like a scam to me
ArtemisSDS	Posted - 2011.02.11 04:48:00 - [109] This guy convoed me as well. I kind of knew that it was a scam at that point. 6bil+ in less than a week? not bad
Lost Hamster Hamster Holding Corp	Posted - 2011.02.11 09:57:00 - [110] Hehe, He convoed me as well. However I had to turn him down, no posting history, first bound, no audit, extreme expansion. To many red flag to give him any money. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Shields are like pants, they're supposed to come off. Armor is like the condom once its gone ur ****ed
RAW23	Posted - 2011.02.11 12:07:00 - [111] Originally by: Block Ukx Originally by: RAW23 I don't think many people who argue for audits argue that they stop scams (although they can stop Ponzi schemes from growing and, thus, stop scammers from stealing MORE isk). The claim is, rather, that they give investors more information to base their risk assessments on. It might help with regard to the business assessment, but it does nothing for scam assessment. An audit is a useful tool for a scammer to gain more ISK. You still thinking of a poor scammer, but most scammers build scams over previous scams, so they have resources to make an audit look legit. Do you still believe audits cannot be forged? Yes, I am primarily thinking about audits for first time offerings in my comments in this thread. They have a great role to play in making life harder for scammers by ensuring that an offeror doesn't have known scammers on his account and wasn't given life through suspicious isk transfers; that they are actually trading as they claim; that they have the skills and nav that is claimed. Without the ability to check all these things there is no way to distinguish between someone who does trade, have skills and some nav, plus a clean account, on the one hand, and someone who has never traded, has no trade skills and has alts on the same account that run contract scams. As long as the second person can cut and paste a similar offering post to the first person there will be pretty much no way to tell the difference between them without an audit. With regards to audits on bigger businesses could you give any examples where 'the audit mentality' to which you refer has led people to invest in a scam that would otherwise have been avoided? I've only been around for 16 months but I don't think I've seen any such situations in my time here. I just don't buy the theoretical claim that an audit is a useful tool to gain more isk for a scammer as it breaks down to the claim that the investors are safer if big businesses are not audited than if they are. Assuming the pot of investor cash remains equal in both cases I really can't see anything, either theoretical or evidential, to back up the suggestion that investing in an audited offering is riskier than investing in an unaudited offering. The only way I can see to claim that audits are detrimental in the way you suggest would be to add in the supposition that having audits increases the amount of isk in the investment market and that the extra isk goes entirely, or at least disproportionately, to audited large investment vehicles which, in turn, turn out to be scams sufficiently often to overtake the losses from scams in non-audited large businesses. But, again, whilst that works as a theoretical hypothesis the evidence just doesn't seem to support it, unless there have been some large audited scams of which I am not aware. On the question of forgery, I am sure this is possible to some extent, depending on the manner in which an audit is done. One Stop, for instance, was independently audited on an ongoing basis, rather than on the basis of a single snap shot and would,thus, have found forgery to be very difficult, whilst the same cannot be said of an audit of the whole operation of a business like BSAC if done on a snap shot basis. But, in any case, even if a full audit is impossible, an anti-Ponzi audit could not, I think, be forged. You either have, or have access to, X amount of assets or you do not. The only way to get around one of these would be to raise a completely private and secret loan to cover the shortfall for the duration of the audit.
Corcyrus Endymion Caldari Excessum Corporation Excessum Gaming	Posted - 2011.02.11 17:05:00 - [112] Originally by: Lethal Entrepreneur My end-game? I like a challenge. A challenge? How is parting idiots with their isk a challenge? If you had LE/VV/RAW by the nose, that I would consider at least slightly challenging. This whole IPO was as obvious a scam as any other. Let alone the mere pittance you got away with.
Lethal Entrepreneur	Posted - 2011.02.11 17:11:00 - [113] Edited by: Lethal Entrepreneur on 11/02/2011 17:12:16 Originally by: Corcyrus Endymion Originally by: Lethal Entrepreneur My end-game? I like a challenge. A challenge? How is parting idiots with their isk a challenge? If you had LE/VV/RAW by the nose, that I would consider at least slightly challenging. This whole IPO was as obvious a scam as any other. Let alone the mere pittance you got away with. Haha, reread what I said and what I was responding to. You can't move to better things without having some sort of startup ISK. 6.2b is chump change in the scheme of things, but it was a necessary take for the moment. Also it was a bond, principle pay back after fixed duration, all that jazz.
Corcyrus Endymion Caldari Excessum Corporation Excessum Gaming	Posted - 2011.02.11 17:18:00 - [114] Originally by: Lethal Entrepreneur Edited by: Lethal Entrepreneur on 11/02/2011 17:12:16 Originally by: Corcyrus Endymion Originally by: Lethal Entrepreneur My end-game? I like a challenge. A challenge? How is parting idiots with their isk a challenge? If you had LE/VV/RAW by the nose, that I would consider at least slightly challenging. This whole IPO was as obvious a scam as any other. Let alone the mere pittance you got away with. Haha, reread what I said and what I was responding to. You can't move to better things without having some sort of startup ISK. 6.2b is chump change in the scheme of things, but it was a necessary take for the moment. Also it was a bond, principle pay back after fixed duration, all that jazz. My bad. I was too engrossed in righteous fury and furious anger at the sheer greed of people throwing away isk/time because thinking is :effort:. It's a sport I guess.
Lethal Entrepreneur	Posted - 2011.02.11 17:27:00 - [115] Originally by: Corcyrus Endymion Originally by: Lethal Entrepreneur Edited by: Lethal Entrepreneur on 11/02/2011 17:12:16 Originally by: Corcyrus Endymion Originally by: Lethal Entrepreneur My end-game? I like a challenge. A challenge? How is parting idiots with their isk a challenge? If you had LE/VV/RAW by the nose, that I would consider at least slightly challenging. This whole IPO was as obvious a scam as any other. Let alone the mere pittance you got away with. Haha, reread what I said and what I was responding to. You can't move to better things without having some sort of startup ISK. 6.2b is chump change in the scheme of things, but it was a necessary take for the moment. Also it was a bond, principle pay back after fixed duration, all that jazz. My bad. I was too engrossed in righteous fury and furious anger at the sheer greed of people throwing away isk/time because thinking is :effort:. It's a sport I guess. A sport seems to be a rather admissible definition. In the end though its not about the ISK, the ISK is secondary to my motives.
Caldariftw123	Posted - 2011.02.11 17:41:00 - [116] you're going to give the isk back on payment date, aren't you? You get your bond, forum troll fun AND another laugh at the end by doing this. Seems to be the in thing lately .. honest IPOs with collateral, scams-that-don't-scam-but-profit, etc. .. where's my old MD gone? :S
Lethal Entrepreneur	Posted - 2011.02.11 17:47:00 - [117] Originally by: Caldariftw123 you're going to give the isk back on payment date, aren't you? You get your bond, forum troll fun AND another laugh at the end by doing this. Seems to be the in thing lately .. honest IPOs with collateral, scams-that-don't-scam-but-profit, etc. .. where's my old MD gone? :S It would provide a good laugh no doubt... not sure if any of my investors would reinvest though.
Two Shots Caldari GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2011.02.11 18:01:00 - [118] Originally by: Lethal Entrepreneur Originally by: Caldariftw123 you're going to give the isk back on payment date, aren't you? You get your bond, forum troll fun AND another laugh at the end by doing this. Seems to be the in thing lately .. honest IPOs with collateral, scams-that-don't-scam-but-profit, etc. .. where's my old MD gone? :S It would provide a good laugh no doubt... not sure if any of my investors would reinvest though. Never underestimate the stupidity or irritability of random pubbies. Two Shots Goonwaffe
Lethal Entrepreneur	Posted - 2011.02.12 17:44:00 - [119] Well I bid you all an exciting future! Sadly this character is being transferred to a new owner for the amount of 2bn. If you need to contact me you may do so on Electus Ereptor. Until next time.
Lederstrumpf	Posted - 2011.02.15 00:54:00 - [120] Originally by: Arcy Dorei Originally by: Lethal Entrepreneur Originally by: Lederstrumpf Originally by: Kalrand I'm kind of surprised that a new-to-MD character trader was able to walk in here and raise 5 billion isk. He did raise the expansion by private convo'ing people from MD prior to setting up his expansion post in here, telling them current investors kinda agreed to the expansion plan... Let me correct you and Arcy there Let me clarify .. there's no need to 'correct' me +1

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