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LV..4 a pain in the hull, but not for everyone

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Miss Xoco Minmatar Blacksteel Mining and Manufacturing Renaissance Federation	Posted - 2011.02.24 00:42:00 - [31] Edited by: Miss Xoco on 24/02/2011 01:27:36 Originally by: sir gapi So 1st. Wot u really want? a) a ship to make the maximum profit/salvage? b) a ship to blitz missions? c) a ship where u can have a cup of tea while playin for a) get a marauder for b) get machariel for c) get rattlesnake Me for myself got a rattler too. i always fly Omni-tanked, just switching the cruise missiles Resists are all around 75%, shield recharge passiv is 400/sec(could push it to 600hp/sec with fleet booster at 570 dps) at 620 dps with ogre II but keep in mind we are talkin about ships an fitting costs near 2 billion I pefer to drink a cup of tea.. i like tea. I want a Rattle, i decided already. May you help me with fit? Then i can even go afk a bit and switch to my other char for trading and what else. I already got a Rattle and 2 T2 Core Defence Field Purger rigs (not rigged yet, i can still sell in term its wrong rig). Just need 1 more, but im now out of ISK. :D So i will probably need a week or so to get the rest or i might just sell some ships. At beginning i wont do the LV. 4 allone, i will have a backup who will warp into me, as soon as i was able to test the tank. Breaking ships is the most messy stuff someone can have. YES the Tengu got SMALL SHIELD BOOST, i just spelled wrong. Thats from a mate, i do not own one and i usualy had armoor tanks! And thanks all for the T1 fits, i will probably test out such a fit aswell and maybe use for incursion.
Darth McDarth	Posted - 2011.02.24 02:13:00 - [32] Originally by: De BuG2 Those Mach fits are painful to look at. How do you fit a Mach then? Damage-specific hardeners and better rigs notwithstanding.
Miss Xoco Minmatar Blacksteel Mining and Manufacturing Renaissance Federation	Posted - 2011.02.24 02:59:00 - [33] Edited by: Miss Xoco on 24/02/2011 03:06:38 Sleepers need omni-tank since they arnt that stupid only to confront someone with 1-2 damage types. However, we are talking here about LV. 4 and specific cheap-trick with hardeners. Which is simnply a matter of knowledge. Actually i would have not lost my Typhoon if i knew about the EXP damage and just had a Omni-fit (which i usualy got on me), since i had everything pumped into Kinetic/Thermal, since i wasnt sure what damage they deal. "wrong hardeners" isnt generaly a bad fit, its just a mistaken to tank a EXP dealer with wrong hardeners. We all know, EVE is one huge rock-paper-scissor game, for every situation there is a good anti-fit. Knowledge is the key, as long as the limitation is only purely hardener based, the need of fitting skills is close to zero. Thats why you can run a LV. 4 even with "cheap" characters and cheap ships because the paper will always eat a rock, no matter how bad the paper quality is like. But even a 3 Billion ships can explode when there is a hole at a abused element and a warp scrambler (super mean). In any term, better to have a omni-fit than having a wrong element. A omni tank might be unable to complete hard missions but at least the ship might not explode in less than a min and can warp out on time.
vicror Critical Density	Posted - 2011.02.24 03:48:00 - [34] Edited by: vicror on 24/02/2011 03:50:04 Originally by: Miss Xoco 1. I do not accept statements from Alt-Characters who hide theyr true character and only want to provoke. I know you're not referring to my char. being an alt that needs to hide or provoke, right? I actually don't see anyone that would have any reason to provoke anything. It's you asking for help. did you read my statement? did you understand it? if so you got the answers to your post. Originally by: Miss Xoco 2. I never been a mission runner and i actually never used the expensive ships in real term. I was a collector and gatherer of many of those ships, i was doing marketing for nearly 2 years and i was moving around a lot of contracts. well now that seems like the reason you're having problems. I would suggest looking for cookie cutter(high rated) mission fits on battleclinic. like anything else in real life or in game. only lots of practice will get you the experience you'll need to run missions with the ease that others do. good luck
Miss Xoco Minmatar Blacksteel Mining and Manufacturing Renaissance Federation	Posted - 2011.02.24 09:30:00 - [35] Not you, but some people use 2 month old characters and starting to flame. I check every single character in EVE because i like to solve and work out stuff, im not only writtng for entertainment purpose.
Plentath	Posted - 2011.02.24 10:35:00 - [36] Originally by: Miss Xoco In any term, better to have a omni-fit than having a wrong element. A omni tank might be unable to complete hard missions but at least the ship might not explode in less than a min and can warp out on time. Yet you lost your ships because you did exactly this. Quote: Finally there seems to be 2 ways of doing it: 1. Overruler with Super omni tank, no need to check resist, just do it. 2. Every single weak T1 with 2 stacked resist hardeners on the 2 most abused spots, easy as that. Downside, always need to switch around hardeners, and take care not to make failure. No. Aren't you listening? Quote: And thanks all for the T1 fits, i will probably test out such a fit aswell and maybe use for incursion No one is this foolish. Quote: I would enjoy to see your "active drake fit", because no matter what i tried, even a 3 times RR repper BS with repair bonus was weaker than a passive tank, but i might be dumb, help me out. I don't even know. In summary, elaborate troll.
Tarasina	Posted - 2011.02.24 11:11:00 - [37] My maelstrom fit: [Maelstrom, mael lvl4 ACs] Gyrostabilizer II Gyrostabilizer II Gyrostabilizer II Tracking Enhancer II Tracking Enhancer II X-Large Shield Booster II Shield Boost Amplifier I Ballistic Deflection Field II Ballistic Deflection Field II Explosion Dampening Field II Explosion Dampening Field II 800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Fusion L 800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Fusion L 800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Fusion L 800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Fusion L 800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Fusion L 800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Fusion L 800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Fusion L 800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Fusion L Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Projectile Metastasis Adjuster I Warrior II x5 Valkyrie II x5 You can probably change rigs a bit. Metastasis...shouldn't need more tracking, falloff is better. I tried running an Angels mission with just 1 of each hardener (exp/kin) but my ship just melted. I'm guessing an Invulnerability field instead of a ballistic hardener might work better. Hits to 60km, not for much but most frigs die to ACs. At 40km I start targeting BSs and when they are within 10km they melt.
Miss Xoco Minmatar Blacksteel Mining and Manufacturing Renaissance Federation	Posted - 2011.02.24 11:22:00 - [38] We have some issues with the understanding what passive or active means. For me a active tank is by using hard boosters or real reppers. Passive means for me that there is no booster. However, it can aswell mean that you have ONLY resist hardeners without cap need. that would mean that every single item used for tank are not allowed to drain any cap. In that term i rather like to use 3 different term: Full active, semi-active and fully passive (no cap drain at all). The Semi-active is basically using the trick of exchanging cap-energy into the shield which is a indirect booster and usualy way more cap stable than a active booster (especially when you use 2 boosters/reppers at once). Surprisingly. even when a Kronos use 3 armor reppers at once and burning charges all the time, the tank is still weaker than from a shield-recharged Rattle. For me the passive tank is not a true passive tank because that tank i do consider "buffer tank" you may put in some resists or 1600 mm plates in order to increase that buffer even more but you do not actively heal anything else, unless you are draining your cap... once again, that is semi active, or already fully passive. Way to confusing but at least now everyone know what i mean. And again a tank is not a hardener and a hardener is not a tank. A tank is the mix of many different factors, way more than just hardeners, so a active hardener is not a active tank and a passive hardener is not a passive tank.
Plentath	Posted - 2011.02.24 11:36:00 - [39] Originally by: Miss Xoco We have some issues with the understanding what passive or active means. For me a active tank is by using hard boosters or real reppers. Of course you'll have issues understanding this if you arbitrarily define active / passive / buffer by whatever YOU want to see it as. Passive - the tank recharges itself (shields) and uses zero cap Passive (with active hardeners) - only the hardeners use cap. This is much stronger than the above in most setups, but can be neuted (not as good for wormholes) Active - uses a combination of shield or armour reppers along with their corresponding hardeners. Buffer - the amount of shield or armour is increased to take more total damage. Usually uses active hardeners to increase the EHP. As for the Kronos? It doesn't need a mighty tank. It obliterates the mission space too quickly to need one.
Miss Xoco Minmatar Blacksteel Mining and Manufacturing Renaissance Federation	Posted - 2011.02.24 11:48:00 - [40] Edited by: Miss Xoco on 24/02/2011 11:54:56 Regarding passive tank: The only way to make a tank not draining any cap is only to have shield regen increasing boosters such as the T2 core defence field purger rig and similiar modules. Any modules burning the cap in order to increase regen is forbidden, aswell any hardener which are draining cap. Such a tank is not a buffer but its very weak since many powerful modules only work by draining cap, and its totaly impossible to remote rep another one without sacrificing cap. However, almost any ship got a few of passive tank "left", all we do here is to increase the boost rate a little and put some non draining hardeners on it. So in that term my Drake, yes i got one too, is not passive, because i make use of "cap to shield power exchange", allowing for a much better tank but lesser cap stability. @Tarasina Falloff is always good for ACs, else you hit as far as your web goes, not much more. I used a Maelstrom with Artillery once and it failed. Im not sure if you have ACs or Artys. But its just hard to deal with ACs when the ship isnt having lot of falloff. And aswell hard to deal with Artillery if i cant keep the enemy at range, because as soon as they undercut a certain range, me is usualy busted. Nothing i can do against, the Maelstrom is a bad drone boat and Arty wont hit anymore.
My Postman	Posted - 2011.02.24 12:31:00 - [41] Active tanking means you use modules you have to activate (and they use cap). You go buffer/passive when neut/nos comes in your way. Here is a cookie cutter Domi fitting, that can run ALL missions. Low: 4 x Mission specific hardener II 2 x LAR Damage Control II Mid: 2 x Omnidirectional Tracking Link 100 MN Afterburner II 2 x Cap Recharger II High: 3 x 350mm Railgun II Small Tractor Beam I Salvager I Rigs: Large Sentry Damage Augmentor I 2 x CCC I Drones: 5 x Garde II Drones of your choice Note that i have WU 5 and AWU 4. Cap runs out after 15 min with one repper on (without guns, salvageer, tractor, afterburner, and you¦ll have to pulse the second repper when needed. Hope this helps.
Plentath	Posted - 2011.02.24 12:44:00 - [42] Originally by: Miss Xoco Edited by: Miss Xoco on 24/02/2011 11:54:56So in that term my Drake, yes i got one too, is not passive, because i make use of "cap to shield power exchange", allowing for a much better tank but lesser cap stability. For the sake of my curiosity - can you post this fit?
Wabs	Posted - 2011.02.24 14:27:00 - [43] seriously, you have a machariel with t2 CC rigs... use that! (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) Awesome ship! Dont use invuls in missions, use SPECIFIC hardners for that mission and swap out if the next missions has different rats. only time when invuls are needed is with drone missiosn i think. (check eve survival) Go for max 3 gyros and 3x tracking + damage control or something like that, maby 3x gyro 2x tracking, damage control + cap flux for even moar cap :) as tank, XL booster works without an injector, just dont perma run it! you have to keep your eys open but just start your booster every time your shield drops under 50% and turn it off again @ 95% leave the hardners on all the time ofc. thats how i used to tank stuff in the raven :) (years back when i did missions) cap stable tank is just saying you use to many mods for cap recharge
Mr LaForge	Posted - 2011.02.24 14:46:00 - [44] Edited by: Mr LaForge on 24/02/2011 14:48:50 The OP is too interested in omni tanking 1K DPS to care about most of the advice given here and is also not interested in doing his own research into what damage the rats give out. He's also stated in an indirect that he is not interested in actually using the skills he has or he would be flying a vargur, but thats too expensive.
Sullen Skoung	Posted - 2011.02.24 14:58:00 - [45] Edited by: Sullen Skoung on 24/02/2011 14:58:27 http://eve.battleclinic.com/loadout/50408-lvl-4-solo-AFK-Drake.html Regardless of the low rating its actually a good fit. The negatives on the fit seem to be because its a drake (how dumb is that.... rating a Drake fit low cause its a drake) and cause the name was wrong
Robbie Robot	Posted - 2011.02.24 15:54:00 - [46] I have the ingame browser book marked to a level 4 mission review to know what to tank. I then use a station container that is labelled 'Quick Fit' that has at least 2 of each hardener in it, so I can quickly swap out stuff. I have another station container that I dump all loot and salvage into, that is called "to sort" which gets emptied whenever I feel like getting richer (every 4-5 missions). Containers are key to station organization. I fly an abaddon, and I hate angels missions. Amarr ships are tough, and can crank out enough dps to do any level 4's, but some are slower because I cannot shoot the right stuff. I only have Amarr BS to 4, as well as large lasers to 4. I suggest figuring out what type of rat you are generally fighting from that agent, and pick an appropriate ship. Just look at the base resist. Most rats are vulnerable to the same damage they deal, so Gursista's deal mostly kinetic and take full damage from kinetic, making caldari ships ideal. <this end up>
Fulmar Muse	Posted - 2011.02.24 16:52:00 - [47] no, yes i completely agree... "tank" is a word that describes the sun, and the wind and the moon, in correlation with the astrological importance of capricorn. tis a word that's overused and often not used in it's true spiritual undertones. Keep on doin what you doin, do it gud.. huuh!
Miss Xoco Minmatar Blacksteel Mining and Manufacturing Renaissance Federation	Posted - 2011.02.25 01:08:00 - [48] Edited by: Miss Xoco on 25/02/2011 01:12:20 The Drake, out of my mind, is fitted like: 7x T2 H. Missile Launcher 1x Probe Launcher 1x T2 Inv. Field 1x T2 Photon Scattering Amplifier 1x T2 Heat Dissipation Amplifier 3x T2 Large Shield Expander 4x T2 Shield Power Relay 3x Med. Core Defence Field Purger Mixed T2 Drones (cant remember which one) Cap stable but not drain stable (the only drain stable ship is the one not using any cap at all, or constantly burning cap booster charges)
Fulmar Muse	Posted - 2011.02.25 01:47:00 - [49] agreed, that's the exact ship ull wanna be using, don't ever change it, even if people tell u to put damage mod on, just don't, cos ur billions of isk, will disappear and ull be left giggling @ yer 900,000isk balance, sat in an ibis bumping people @ jita ull wanna keep ur options open as to what you want to put in the lows, wen u start putting BCSs in yer lows, yer options begin to plummet 1 by 1, so id keep with that fit, if you want to keep your options open Keep on doin what you doin, do it gud.. huuh!
Sullen Skoung	Posted - 2011.02.25 03:55:00 - [50] Im atm running a HAM Drake with a 10 Ms microwarp drive for getting close. As long as I pulse the MWD and dont keep it on too horribly long, I can keep it stable. Im toying around with trying to fit a cap booster
Sanic Xaqueter	Posted - 2011.02.25 07:18:00 - [51] So someone tell me: tengu or Navy issue Raven for level 4 killing missions What can do it faster and easier?
Target Painter Minmatar	Posted - 2011.02.25 08:34:00 - [52] Originally by: Sanic Xaqueter So someone tell me: tengu or Navy issue Raven for level 4 killing missions What can do it faster and easier? CNR is faster, the Tengu is easier.
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2011.02.25 09:02:00 - [53] Originally by: Target Painter CNR is faster, the Tengu is easier. Agreed. The Tengu handles smaller ships with ease while its small size and high speed minimize incoming DPS The CNR has the DPS to take down battleships faster, but you really need to pay attention to triggers. -- [Aussie players: join ANZAC channel]
Red Raider Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.02.25 17:16:00 - [54] Originally by: Miss Xoco We have some issues with the understanding what passive or active means. For me a active tank is by using hard boosters or real reppers. Active Tank = Shield Booster/Armor Repper Passive Tank = Maxing out shield regen Buffer Tank = Bung load of HP's Active Hardeners = The ones you turn on. Passive Hardeners = The ones you don't. If you are shield tanked you should basically never use anything but active shield hardeners unless you have the cash to buy high end deadspace/officer passive hardeners and have your shield compensation skills maxed out. With armor its generally the opposite though as armor comp skills greatly enhance the value of EANM's and such. Once your skills are high enough omni tanking everything isn't an issue but it requires a hell of a lot of skills, crystal implants, and good hardwirings. The downside to this is that you sacrifice DPS to omni tank regardless of your skills. There has long been a belief that a cap stable tank is superior for PVE purposes but in reality your tank needs to last longer than your targets live and that's all. Anything more than that, that could have been put into DPS instead(sometimes its not an option), is wasted income. In your case I wouldn't take that approach. Tank the living crap out of your ship and start learning your limits. Use damage specific hardeners to increase your odds of survival. The repetitive nature of mission running will have you seeing missions again soon enough and with a little help from eve survival you should have no problem burning your way through lvl 4's. The real trick comes when you start closing that gap between just enough tank to live and shelling out DPS to get your income up. You will understand pucker factor when you start playing that game.
tankarmor	Posted - 2011.02.25 19:55:00 - [55] just share ideas about lvl 4, i'm a caldari raven pilot. 1. make sure you have active shield tank related skills to 4 2. you have t2 gallente drone 3. fit mission specific shield hardener 4. keep shield around 30~40% 5. read eve-survival otherwise you will mess around
Miss Xoco Minmatar Blacksteel Mining and Manufacturing Renaissance Federation	Posted - 2011.02.26 01:52:00 - [56] Edited by: Miss Xoco on 26/02/2011 01:54:15 Yes i will read it. Anyway, i got me the Rattlesnake and my fit is currently cap stable at 43% and looks like: Current Stats: 289 HP/s regen, omni resist between 70-76 (far above 80% when X types are overloaded), EHP about 140K, shield capacity ~25k Take into acount that not all my skills are maxed yet (Caldari BS only LV. 2 yet, Shield Operation only LV. 4, which i will now max up before i use the ship for missions, and probably replace the passive amplifiere with even better A-types. That means as long as the ship isnt ready to fly, i have to use some alternate T1 ship. High Slots: Not fitted yet Drone Bay: Not fitted yet Rigs: 3x T2 Core Defence Field Purger Med slots: Gisti X-type Heat Dissipation Field Pith X-type Photon Scattering Field Dread Guristas Kinetic Deflection Amplifier Dread Giuristas Explosion Dampening Amplifier 3x T2 Large Shield Expander (wish there would be X-large) Low slots: 1x DMC 5x T2 Shield Power relay Thats it for now. Now im gonna stop working on the Rattle for a while and try to build some stable T1 ship.
Chubrub	Posted - 2011.02.26 09:25:00 - [57] I really don't understand what the problem is with lvl 4 missions. I went from running 3's in a drake to using a faction fit cnr for lvl 4's. It's the only bs I've ever owned. I use the eve survival guides religiously and use specific hardeners and specific ammo. My cruise missile, Caldari bs and all missile support skills are lvl 3, I use t1 hammerheads with lvl 3 drone support, lvl 5 drone skill. I've done ae, wc and most other 'hard' level 4's and never had trouble. I warped out of wc room 2 at full shields before realising that I could ignore the elite frigs and kill everything else before I needed to worry about scram. My skills are bad and I kill slow but my tank skills are fine. Tl:dr = if you actually are using the mission reports you didn't need to make this thread. Listen to the advice others are giving you.
Mister Agreeable	Posted - 2011.02.26 09:53:00 - [58] Originally by: Chubrub Tl:dr = Listen to the advice others are giving you. Dude, it's a troll if I ever saw one. No one is that stupid and can read/write/use computer/walk upright.
vicror Critical Density	Posted - 2011.02.26 17:53:00 - [59] Originally by: Mister Agreeable Originally by: Chubrub Tl:dr = Listen to the advice others are giving you. Dude, it's a troll if I ever saw one. No one is that stupid and can read/write/use computer/walk upright. LOL, you haven't been playing eve long enough. I was also thinking troll. But, then I thought about all the idiots eve has and well you know.
Fimble	Posted - 2011.02.26 21:46:00 - [60] 10/10 Brilliant execution.

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