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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:08:00 -
[61]
So... wannabe scammer turns into industrialist and then capitalist, is unable to keep it from gobbling up all his ingame time, that burns him out, he wastes a load of ISK on silly things and stops generally giving a fudge, posts about how he masterplanned it all or somesuch (when he could have paid most or all of it back instead of wasting it on crap).
Not so much a story of a hugely successful scammer, but rather the story of a burnout/washout that happened to start out by trying to be a big-time scammer.
Final verdict : meh. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts _
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Babyface Eighteen
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:10:00 -
[62]
Cosmo who?
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Block Ukx
Forge Laboratories
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:10:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Originally by: Block Ukx
YouÆve been proven wrong, and yet wonÆt admit it. Not only that, you have the guts to continue your defamation campaign. IÆm not surprise
What did I tell you via mail about the forum?
Don't you see that the next natural target of ANY troll + flaming as the "Last Big Unaudited Thing" is exactly you?
Yes you did. I wonÆt post again in this thread. I just couldnÆt help it!
BSAC Stock Exchange - EVE's only real-time stock exchange |
Kalrand
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:10:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Block Ukx
That's ok. I'll continue to prevent you and Karland to run the next "Super Secured Audit Enabled" scam.
Karland doesn't post on this forum.
Vote KALRAND for CSM! |
Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:12:00 -
[65]
Quote:
While one time audits are useless when faced with someone smart enough to exploit them.
Performance audits work well. One time audits - as said many times even in recently - act as entry barrier for the large number of low level scammer. Sadly high level scammers can circumvent or just bypass them (using their "rep" to avoid them). This is a further proof of that, and also a further proof that when the audits state that "the investee shows the potential to honor the bond" they are true to the bone.
Potential <> act, since Aristotile times. - Auditing & consulting
When looking for investors, please read http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h + http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
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Misty McGinnity
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:13:00 -
[66]
lol so much hate, please continue.
p.s. block can i my plex early? im going away next week for a holiday :3
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Liang Nuren
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:17:00 -
[67]
Cosmoray, IIRC you were the dude that blew up thousands of battleships with "insurance scamming". Did you really do this?
-Liang -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
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Roguehalo
Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:18:00 -
[68]
When people realise that anybody who 'needs' capital is by defintion incompetent then they'll stop providing it and stop getting scammed.
By all means borrow 2-3b when you are getting started but if anybody needs more financing after that then they're doing something wrong.
Cosmoray wasn't a scammer at the start..........It's his incompetence and inability that just didn't give him any other option. Major fail really.
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Caldariftw123
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:18:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Liang Nuren Cosmoray, IIRC you were the dude that blew up thousands of battleships with "insurance scamming". Did you really do this?
-Liang
Get out, this thread is now about audits/bsac
but yeah according to his story he did do that, I think it said 13000 battleships in the end.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:20:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Liang Nuren Cosmoray, IIRC you were the dude that blew up thousands of battleships with "insurance scamming". Did you really do this?
"Insurance Exchange Rate (IER) [...]In 4Q 2009 the IER profit on each of the above listed ships was over 10M ISK per ship. Using the 32B ISK raised above and using ALTS and characters purchased with previously raised funds I ran a huge IER operation at Paara (2 jumps from Jita). I was able to make 13,000 BSÆs (profit per ship went down after as people jumped on this) in about 6 weeks, and turned the 32B ISK into 132B ISK. Have to say a word to red Frog Freight who moved over 100B ISK in minerals per week from Jita to my base. This would be the last time I would spend any time playing industrial tycoon. I got so bored with the production I stopped early when I could have made much more.
Bored with the Money
Entering 2010 I was suddenly sitting on a pile of ISK which I didnÆt really care about, so I started to give some away. The money went to friends, ship purchases (lots of shiny equipment), and simply giving it away in Jita. I even gambled about 15B ISK away on EOH poker with crazy betting
In total I went through the entire 100B in 4 weeks."
From his OP linky. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts _
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cosmoray
Cosmoray Holdings Corp
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:21:00 -
[71]
Originally by: SencneS Edited by: SencneS on 04/03/2011 01:06:47 While one time audits are useless when faced with someone smart enough to exploit them. I wonder how he could have faired with an ongoing constant financial reporting on his API.
Its one thing to create an environment in which can clearly trick a one time audit, it's another to maintain the illusion without anything unusual coming up. The longer it runs the possibility of being tripped by up a financial reporting would be.
Interesting read none the less, it's saved for reference material and is has some new unique insight into what to look for to determine a scam at least.
I would have been dead in the water with continuously tracked API data.
The obvious way to beat individual audits was and is asset transfers via station trades between two accounts.
Secondly you always need to rotate who you use to audit you.
Account A set up, gets audits passes with auditor X Account B launches business with account A assets, and audited by auditor Y Account A launches bigger business with account B assets, audited by auditor X or new one.
Obviously takes a bit of time for API to clear between audits. This can be done easily by buying lots of little junk for low lvl PVP (ammo etc.).
Assets can be boosted with good quality BPC's that software can't see difference (used to be at least).
Final and possibly most important thing is the interview with the auditor to discuss business plan and scope.
Spend time chatting with auditor that it is said publically that it is the "other" character being audited, and that in event of SCAM the characters will be released. The auditors always see this as failsafe, because they are above reproach.
This way the unknown ALT is never audited by the same auditor so the information isn't made public so other auditors won't find out.
The other thing on your side is that auditors are quite often doing the audit to prepare a name for themselves. They are building their own rep by performing a quality audit on you. They want you to be successful. There are always questionable items that come up on the audit, as long as you have a reasonable explanation the auditor WANTS to believe you. This process is in their benefit also.
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Frenden Dax
Dax Acquisitions
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:22:00 -
[72]
This is disappointing, as well as entirely unexpected.
Cosmo, you were one of the few remaining people on MD that I still had respect for.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:26:00 -
[73]
You know what all of this actually reminds me of ? The much-too-frequent stories of big lottery winners who screw up their own lives because they have no clue how to handle themselves now that they have potentially a lot of money, and end up doing a lot of stupid stuff because of it, basically not just wasting it all but also getting deep into debt because of it, so that at the end, winning the lottery was one of the worst things that happened to them. Ok, it was not a lottery win for cosmoray and debt in EVE is unenforceable, but it was pretty close to that, and the end result was similar, but only his investors paid the price.
It's actually a sad story. I don't dislike cosmoray because of it, not even an ounce of hate, really (well, not having had invested a single ISK with him ever is probably one of the prerequisites for that, heh)... in fact, I actually pity him, more than anything else. You just had to burn out, didn't you ? Now one more entertainment source is gone. Oh well... _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts _
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Selene D'Celeste
Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:27:00 -
[74]
This whole story seems a bit ..... haphazard, fabricated, something? Any chance that the story you posted is fabricated and there is another reason you don't have any ISK left? ______________________________
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Roguehalo
Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:28:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Frenden Dax This is disappointing, as well as entirely unexpected.
Cosmo, you were one of the few remaining people on MD that I still had respect for.
On what basis?
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Selene D'Celeste
Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:28:00 -
[76]
Originally by: SencneS Well I'll be... Look mommy another one!! He is already on "The Thieves of EVE" list anyway so it's not like anything changed.
Another day another ISK sucked away by those smarter then the people who watch over them.
Do you actually know why he's on that list, or are you just trying to be clever? ______________________________
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Frenden Dax
Dax Acquisitions
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:33:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Roguehalo
Originally by: Frenden Dax This is disappointing, as well as entirely unexpected.
Cosmo, you were one of the few remaining people on MD that I still had respect for.
On what basis?
Industrial prowess, and consistently running a business while regularly paying dividends. Of course, the latter item is now revealed to be false.
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Roguehalo
Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:33:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Selene D'Celeste This whole story seems a bit ..... haphazard, fabricated, something? Any chance that the story you posted is fabricated and there is another reason you don't have any ISK left?
Some people just fall so in love with Kings
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:36:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Frenden Dax Cosmo, you were one of the few remaining people on MD that I still had respect for.
Hmmm, I wonder... How many people are left in the "ran or still running high-ticket public fund deals and not scammed yet" group ? ... about four or so ?
_
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts _
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YouGotRipped
Ewigkeit
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:37:00 -
[80]
Originally by: SencneS Well I'll be... Look mommy another one!! He is already on "The Thieves of EVE" list anyway so it's not like anything changed.
Another day another ISK sucked away by those smarter then the people who watch over them.
"Charmed magic casements opening on the foam of perilous seas in faery lands forlorn..."
Black Sun Empire |
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Roguehalo
Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:37:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Frenden Dax
Originally by: Roguehalo
Originally by: Frenden Dax This is disappointing, as well as entirely unexpected.
Cosmo, you were one of the few remaining people on MD that I still had respect for.
On what basis?
Industrial prowess, and consistently running a business while regularly paying dividends. Of course, the latter item is now revealed to be false.
What industrial prowess was that? You need to realise that people with genuine industrial prowess DON'T NEED TO BORROW ISK since making isk in Eve is ridiculously easy.
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Frenden Dax
Dax Acquisitions
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:43:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Frenden Dax Cosmo, you were one of the few remaining people on MD that I still had respect for.
Hmmm, I wonder... How many people are left in the "ran or still running high-ticket public fund deals and not scammed yet" group ? ... about four or so ?
A rapidly diminishing number, indeed.
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:44:00 -
[83]
Quote:
There are always questionable items that come up on the audit, as long as you have a reasonable explanation the auditor WANTS to believe you. This process is in their benefit also.
This is why I always stated that auditors should be paid by investors like in RL.
Also, you did not use BPCs but put real BPOs in trade window and BPCs cannot be copied in a POS - and they were showing as such.
Therefore in my case, the audited character had:
- real BPOs - real POS - real ISK. - real other assets.
So it's not true you just slapped some BPCs and had the OK tag with no effort like you seem to want to dismissively show.
Quote:
This whole story seems a bit ..... haphazard, fabricated, something? Any chance that the story you posted is fabricated and there is another reason you don't have any ISK left?
There is more that he did not say...
I.e. this lack of possessions had a VERY odd coincidence with that very timely event involving somewhat related guy caught in RMT or cheating and that was subject to full confiscation by CCP.
Imagine if it's all the same person. At this point nothing may be excluded and the effects would be exactly those: a pretend scammer who in realty got caught with his hands in the cheat honey.
- Auditing & consulting
When looking for investors, please read http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h + http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
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YouGotRipped
Ewigkeit
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:48:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Frenden Dax Cosmo, you were one of the few remaining people on MD that I still had respect for.
Hmmm, I wonder... How many people are left in the "ran or still running high-ticket public fund deals and not scammed yet" group ? ... about four or so ?
Why, Sally, I didn't know you cared...
Black Sun Empire |
Selene D'Celeste
Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:49:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Frenden Dax
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Frenden Dax Cosmo, you were one of the few remaining people on MD that I still had respect for.
Hmmm, I wonder... How many people are left in the "ran or still running high-ticket public fund deals and not scammed yet" group ? ... about four or so ?
A rapidly diminishing number, indeed.
We should start a thread making a list, though it would be a damn short thread. ______________________________
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cosmoray
Cosmoray Holdings Corp
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:50:00 -
[86]
VV the audit you performed showed REAL BPO's and assets. This was done via asset transfer from Cosmoray to Irgazin.
At the time you even asked why there was questionable transactions between Cosmoray and Irgazin, because there was a bunch of ISK transfers. It was played off easily. Read the chatlog bro!!
My first audit that was done on the original Cosmo Construction, was done with BPC's.
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Misty McGinnity
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Posted - 2011.03.04 01:51:00 -
[87]
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha Wall of babblefish
You gave a green light to a scammer & even put an alt in a holding corp with him. Please stop posting, i highly doubt anyone will trust you to audit them after this.
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Fulbert
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.03.04 02:01:00 -
[88]
Posting in an epic thread! - It's raining memes! - Audits are being questionned. Serious buisness. - Block Uxx versus Kalrand! Flamewar has begun!
Philosophical concerns : isn't EVE online a giant Ponzi scheme with Jovian lolcats on the top? Has "Market Discussions" anything to do with "Markets"... or "Discussions" (calling each other "idiots" or "meat popsicles" isn't really a discussion, sir...). ____________________________________ Fulbert Industrialist - Casual Trader EVE Online, the best browser MMO of them all |
Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2011.03.04 02:03:00 -
[89]
Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha on 04/03/2011 02:04:59
Quote:
At the time you even asked why there was questionable transactions between Cosmoray and Irgazin, because there was a bunch of ISK transfers. It was played off easily. Read the chatlog bro!!
Yes but as you well say, beyond asking I could not have the proof. You also appeared to be friendly to each other, which would explain transactions going back and forth.
Quote:
You gave a green light to a scammer
You oddly missed this:
Quote:
Basically, the Investee looks like with the ability to successfully honor the bond, with some effort. Notice how an audit can only evaluate the ability or potential of an Investee to succesfully honor a bond, not his possibly different real plans.
Quote:
i highly doubt anyone will trust you to audit them after this.
This is quite low on my care-meter. I did all my audits except the last two for 1/10 of the equivalent money of the time I spend doing them.
It was and is a work made to try help the MD community with the little I can do.
If none will want them made any more, hey, it's time saved for me.
- Auditing & consulting
When looking for investors, please read http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h + http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
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LeonessDarkpaw
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Posted - 2011.03.04 02:04:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Kalrand
You're an idiot who didn't read what he posted.
Thankfully no one cares what you think.
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