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CCP plan to improve 0.0 by turning 80% to "dross"

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Rashmika Clavain Gallente	Posted - 2011.04.04 11:16:00 - [91] Originally by: BIZZAROSTORMY A substantial subsection of the core playerbase IS going to leave the game. Awesome. Perhaps this will reduce the amount of annoying forum trolling with alts. oh wai...
Myra2007 Millstone Industries	Posted - 2011.04.04 11:19:00 - [92] Remeber nanonerf? At least two threadnaughts with a 150 pages each. About 3 people actually left. Now, look at your thread. Yeah... -- Originally by: Professor Slocombe I will only buy tickets if the prize is your stuff and you leave Eve. Forever. You irritating self obsessed cretin.
Grimpak Gallente The Whitehound Corporation Frontline Assembly Point	Posted - 2011.04.04 11:20:00 - [93] funny thing is, if most people turns to agents to fund them, they will also recieve some burn there because CCP wants to change agents too by giving them dynamic quality. not that it doesn't look bad on paper, but with this the most profitable agents will be astrosurvey ones since the more the agent is used the less quality it will have, and who the ** does astrosurvey agents? --- Quote:** The more I know about humans, the more I love animals. ain't that right.
Ordais	Posted - 2011.04.04 11:23:00 - [94] Edited by: Ordais on 04/04/2011 11:26:20 There are only a few things that will help, but it WILL NEVER HAPPEN: - a region doesnt have to support more ppl (like today), there need to be more regions because: - ppl need to be spread out again, they are all clustered together nowadays. its too easy to assamble 1000ppl to blob the heck out of everyone everywhere. Yes, exactly. The only protection against superblobs is "distance". It was back in the days, and it should be today. When we attacked the south from the north 2005/6 we had to organize logistic fleets to bring the equipment there, it took days. This supply lines got attacked and fun was to be had. Today, you just pack everything in jumpfrighters or roqs (whatever) and jump a fleet with T-bridges there in 30min. And CCP is wondering why everyone is blobbing? EvE always was about strategy and planning, but today you just get a bunch of capitals and go wherever you like in 15min, bleahh.
Grimpak Gallente The Whitehound Corporation Frontline Assembly Point	Posted - 2011.04.04 11:45:00 - [95] Originally by: Ordais Edited by: Ordais on 04/04/2011 11:26:20 There are only a few things that will help, but it WILL NEVER HAPPEN: - a region doesnt have to support more ppl (like today), there need to be more regions because: - ppl need to be spread out again, they are all clustered together nowadays. its too easy to assamble 1000ppl to blob the heck out of everyone everywhere. Yes, exactly. The only protection against superblobs is "distance". It was back in the days, and it should be today. When we attacked the south from the north 2005/6 we had to organize logistic fleets to bring the equipment there, it took days. This supply lines got attacked and fun was to be had. Today, you just pack everything in jumpfrighters or roqs (whatever) and jump a fleet with T-bridges there in 30min. And CCP is wondering why everyone is blobbing? EvE always was about strategy and planning, but today you just get a bunch of capitals and go wherever you like in 15min, bleahh. jumpbridges --- Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals. ain't that right.
Ingvar Angst Amarr Omni Industrial Coalition Talocan United	Posted - 2011.04.04 12:22:00 - [96] Degrading Moon goo. There you go. Every week a moon is farmed (or even portion of the week) the amount of resources goes down by 10%. Every week a moon is left fallow the resources return at the same pace. How's that for a change in dynamics?
TZeer BURN EDEN	Posted - 2011.04.04 12:28:00 - [97] "Buhu, I`m only making 50mil an hour instead of 60 mil an hour" LOLZ!!
Montgomery Crabapple	Posted - 2011.04.04 12:29:00 - [98] Totally agree with some of the posts here. The nature of 0.0 has been changed fundamentally with things like jump bridges, jump freighters and so on. 0.0 logistics used to be hard. I mean really hard (like slow-boating an Obelisk 40 jumps through 0.0 kind-of hard). Now it's easy. There's really no sense of anything "special" (I don't mean as in school) happening when you transition from 0.1 to 0.0. It's not like the undiscovered country any more. It seems to have turned into a concord free version of Empire.
fire elf Solar Storm Sev3rance	Posted - 2011.04.04 12:30:00 - [99] Originally by: Grimpak Originally by: Ordais Edited by: Ordais on 04/04/2011 11:26:20 There are only a few things that will help, but it WILL NEVER HAPPEN: - a region doesnt have to support more ppl (like today), there need to be more regions because: - ppl need to be spread out again, they are all clustered together nowadays. its too easy to assamble 1000ppl to blob the heck out of everyone everywhere. Yes, exactly. The only protection against superblobs is "distance". It was back in the days, and it should be today. When we attacked the south from the north 2005/6 we had to organize logistic fleets to bring the equipment there, it took days. This supply lines got attacked and fun was to be had. Today, you just pack everything in jumpfrighters or roqs (whatever) and jump a fleet with T-bridges there in 30min. And CCP is wondering why everyone is blobbing? EvE always was about strategy and planning, but today you just get a bunch of capitals and go wherever you like in 15min, bleahh. jumpbridges Keeping up Jumpbrigdes over greater distances COST ALOT, More Distance makes every reaction slower of each power block which SHOULD give more intresting fights and mabye there will be room for smaller alliances out in 0.0 ONCE again..
Brooks Puuntai Minmatar Solar Nexus. -Mostly Harmless-	Posted - 2011.04.04 12:42:00 - [100] The issue with removing JBs is it completely cripples those who live in the outer regions. Logistics through multiple nullsec regions just to get the area is horrid. 0.0 really needs a lot of things done to it to make it less blob/more viable and nerfing anomolies isn't one of them.

Borza Slavak Minmatar Universal Army	Posted - 2011.04.04 13:13:00 - [101] So the complaint is that players who go to 0.0 in order to treat it as a carebear paradise might leave? What's the loss there exactly? Surely they'll be happier churning out isk in highsec where they don't have to worry about scawy fwightening afk cloakers.
Simetraz	Posted - 2011.04.04 13:38:00 - [102] You are crying wolf The big changes will only effect the HIGH END SITES. This isn't going to bankrupt any alliance.
Grimpak Gallente The Whitehound Corporation Frontline Assembly Point	Posted - 2011.04.04 13:41:00 - [103] Originally by: fire elf Originally by: Grimpak Originally by: Ordais Edited by: Ordais on 04/04/2011 11:26:20 There are only a few things that will help, but it WILL NEVER HAPPEN: - a region doesnt have to support more ppl (like today), there need to be more regions because: - ppl need to be spread out again, they are all clustered together nowadays. its too easy to assamble 1000ppl to blob the heck out of everyone everywhere. Yes, exactly. The only protection against superblobs is "distance". It was back in the days, and it should be today. When we attacked the south from the north 2005/6 we had to organize logistic fleets to bring the equipment there, it took days. This supply lines got attacked and fun was to be had. Today, you just pack everything in jumpfrighters or roqs (whatever) and jump a fleet with T-bridges there in 30min. And CCP is wondering why everyone is blobbing? EvE always was about strategy and planning, but today you just get a bunch of capitals and go wherever you like in 15min, bleahh. jumpbridges Keeping up Jumpbrigdes over greater distances COST ALOT, More Distance makes every reaction slower of each power block which SHOULD give more intresting fights and mabye there will be room for smaller alliances out in 0.0 ONCE again.. you still have them. and I'm damn sure that either one of the blocks will go to the new space and take it instead the small alliances. --- Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals. ain't that right.
nano bobcat	Posted - 2011.04.04 13:41:00 - [104] Edited by: nano bobcat on 04/04/2011 13:43:52 yes, it will only bankrupt their poor pets :-D Originally by: Grimpak Originally by: fire elf instead the small alliances. small alliances sigh Those usually prefer hiding under the skirt of the bigger entities, so forget about them.
Furb Killer Gallente	Posted - 2011.04.04 13:46:00 - [105] Edited by: Furb Killer on 04/04/2011 13:46:48 Originally by: Simetraz You are crying wolf The big changes will only effect the HIGH END SITES. This isn't going to bankrupt any alliance. If high end site = every site that can (barely) beat lvl 4 missions in income, then yes. What is remaining are those sites that will generally yield a bit less than a lvl 3 mission (on a per hour base). Quote: "Buhu, I`m only making 50mil an hour instead of 60 mil an hour" LOLZ!! More like 20M max, but considering you are Burn Eden you are not affected anyway since your bots run in NPC 0.0.
Dr Fighter	Posted - 2011.04.04 13:49:00 - [106] Originally by: Holy One Quote: in the end who actually cares ^^ yup. its just a stupid mmo ffs. peeps need to get a reality check. it is just a game but its a hobby to many. Imagine the FA decided to make footabll more "interesting" by forcing them to use a rugy ball instead. At the end of the day people get used to the game and how it works, then suddenly a very small group (who happen to be in charge, like ccp here) change it and everyone who liked those specific elements stop playing and or scream for an appeal. just because people care how they spend their time, esp when they pay money for it. Then get simply ignored, its very unsupprising. then theres the trolls like you who care about nothing more than 30 seconds amusment saying stupid things about people that care about somthing. most eve players are all up for more players to play with as well as retaining the inital
Simetraz	Posted - 2011.04.04 13:56:00 - [107] What a shame, people have been complaining about all the super capitals out there. The of the matter is 90 % of them are personally owned. So if the the ISK per hour is reduced then the Super Capitals per hour will also be reduced. Granted not in the next 6 months but after that you should see a slow down in production as people have less expendable ISK. So people MIGHT switch to small ships. Large alliances MIGHT compress a little opening up more area. There will be less people spread all over the place. So reds MIGHT be able to come into a region without being spotted 20 jumps away. The simple fact is that 0.0 was not collapsing before they implemented the SOV changes and this is not a going back to a pre-state but a small nerf.
slightly sillydude	Posted - 2011.04.04 14:00:00 - [108] Honestly this might not be so bad. I mean, if the wealth of some 0.0 alliances is more concentrated it might not make it easier for small alliances to get out there, but it will make it easier for small alliances to bite the heels of the big ones. If there are only a handful of valuable systems a gang of 50 stealth bombers afkish cloaked in your system could be a real ****er. You wouldn't be able to fart let alone nonchalantly rat, especially coupled with the "force projection" nerfs, whatever they may be.
Nilhium	Posted - 2011.04.04 14:02:00 - [109] Edited by: Nilhium on 04/04/2011 14:05:29 Originally by: nano bobcat Edited by: nano bobcat on 03/04/2011 16:25:26 Originally by: Dark Striped Originally by: nano bobcat yes why? because it lags less, for instance. And its not only about the fleet sizes at all, like I wrote above. You put it that simple and you got a simple answer. Now you request reasons, so read the thread. Originally by: Dark Striped so 0.0 shoudl be less populated to compensate for blue balls and failing fc's, are you **ing joking? I just pointed out that CCPs original intention of more people in 0.0 went wrong possibly, for whatever reason doesnt really matter. Spoken like a whiny *** incapable of making friends or negotiating with his neighbors. " I can't figure out how to master the social aspects of the game, you must remove them!" I promise that once you graduate high school those social skills are going to become even more important. Best start honing them now.
Anitta Blake BSC LEGION Nabaal Syndicate	Posted - 2011.04.04 14:10:00 - [110] The main point being raised is that CCP main aim of the nerf is to make Coalitions less stable and in turn more conflicts / fights over Sov. I see no evidence to suggest this will happen. the problem we face with Coalitions/ power blocks goes far deeper then taken away Sanctums from 80% of space. Moon goo , Supercarrier, Titan blobs are all part of the power blocks 3 things that make then strong ccp need to do 3 things 1st before this nerf 1 2nd Moon goo nerf adding like 200 TECHNETIUM moons will mix stuff up a lot more 2 Supercarrier are over powered Vs dreads are now way under powered 3 for a alliance to clam sov in 100+ system just because it can it needs to be looked at. should cost them more for each system it holds by adding a SOV cost escalator this is the only way to make Alliances think more about what its needs rather than what it can hold.

nano bobcat	Posted - 2011.04.04 14:11:00 - [111] Edited by: nano bobcat on 04/04/2011 14:15:00 Originally by: Nilhium Spoken like a whiny *** incapable of making friends or negotiating with his neighbors. " I can't figure out how to master the social aspects of the game, you must remove them!" I promise that once you graduate high school those social skills are going to become even more important. Best start honing them now. My social competence is doubted by someone, who calls MMO nofaces as friends only because somebody agreed blue standing lmao**. bluelist != bff
Jaik7	Posted - 2011.04.04 14:24:00 - [112] in my opinion i'd love to see all the nullsec alliances blow up a couple thousand of their supercaps bickering over the best space. but i also know this will change almost nothing in the game of nullsec because the bigger blob will always win. alliances looking to expand into nullsec will always face the choice of rent or be blobbed.
Ordais	Posted - 2011.04.04 14:54:00 - [113] Edited by: Ordais on 04/04/2011 14:56:48 Originally by: Grimpak Originally by: fire elf Originally by: Grimpak Originally by: Ordais There are only a few things that will help, but it WILL NEVER HAPPEN: - a region doesnt have to support more ppl (like today), there need to be more regions because: - ppl need to be spread out again, they are all clustered together nowadays. its too easy to assamble 1000ppl to blob the heck out of everyone everywhere. Yes, exactly. The only protection against superblobs is "distance". It was back in the days, and it should be today. When we attacked the south from the north 2005/6 we had to organize logistic fleets to bring the equipment there, it took days. This supply lines got attacked and fun was to be had. Today, you just pack everything in jumpfrighters or roqs (whatever) and jump a fleet with T-bridges there in 30min. And CCP is wondering why everyone is blobbing? EvE always was about strategy and planning, but today you just get a bunch of capitals and go wherever you like in 15min, bleahh. jumpbridges Keeping up Jumpbrigdes over greater distances COST ALOT, More Distance makes every reaction slower of each power block which SHOULD give more intresting fights and mabye there will be room for smaller alliances out in 0.0 ONCE again.. you still have them. and I'm damn sure that either one of the blocks will go to the new space and take it instead the small alliances. And? Let them. There is a reason we didnt see frequent North vs. Sough 1000v1000 fights back in the days, because it was a pain to do. For small alliances to have a chance they NEED to have a possibility to go "under the radar" of certain enemies, and only "distance" can help here. BTW, jumpbridges where the biggest mistake ever in this game, and the only reason they implemented them was that they gave titan-owners (when they were "rare items") too much power, and they had to compensate for it for all that didnt have titans. This situation has changed fundamentally today, JBs are no longer needed, i would get rid of them alltogether, or limit them considerably. They go against EVERYTHING 0.0 needs. P.S. many would agree the best 0.0 experience was when only Dreads where in game, no other caps/supercaps. There is a reason for that, distance still mattered, AND there was a weapon against POS-structures.
Tamahra Gallente Caminus Trux Germani Ewoks	Posted - 2011.04.04 15:02:00 - [114] I live in providence, and im not happy with the changes. But apart from that one thing is for sure: 0.0 would become rather boring and static soon enough if every 0.0 system is the same, and has identical anomalies. There must be differences, aka the deeper the nullsec system, the better (in general). This is just a must, no matter if it benefits the big alliances or not. No one can argue this. But still, even the worst null sec system (the ones close to empire space) should have a higher isk per hour potential than running the best lvl 4 missions. That¦s the one and only key to making it right.
Rainus Max Fusion Enterprises Ltd Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2011.04.04 15:12:00 - [115] Originally by: Anitta Blake The main point being raised is that CCP main aim of the nerf is to make Coalitions less stable and in turn more conflicts / fights over Sov. I see no evidence to suggest this will happen. the problem we face with Coalitions/ power blocks goes far deeper then taken away Sanctums from 80% of space. Moon goo , Supercarrier, Titan blobs are all part of the power blocks 3 things that make then strong ccp need to do 3 things 1st before this nerf 1 2nd Moon goo nerf adding like 200 TECHNETIUM moons will mix stuff up a lot more 2 Supercarrier are over powered Vs dreads are now way under powered 3 for a alliance to clam sov in 100+ system just because it can it needs to be looked at. should cost them more for each system it holds by adding a SOV cost escalator this is the only way to make Alliances think more about what its needs rather than what it can hold. Point 1) - The problem is you have to have a bottleneck in a market otherwise everything ends up being sold for build cost and no-one makes money and the market basically implodes. I agree that the Tech only bottleneck is unfair on other alliances but would you rather go back to the old Prom/Dyspro situation where each moon was worth 4/5billion a week? Point 2) Heavily agree here, its seriously complicated by a few individuals who spend thousands of dollars on GTCs/plexes and then buys their entire alliance a replacement supercap fleet. Its really difficult to counter such a tactic and destroys game play. Point 3) Makes sense but then you are punishing the larger alliances, you need to have a more dynamic cap on how many systems an alliance can claim at a resonable cost verses their population. I will also point out that if you want alliances to fight, coalitions are a natural result. The NC iirc formed because of the common threat of BOB and then strenghtened by further attacks from Tri et al. There is nothing you can do to counter their formation other than preventing alliances setting each other blue or neutral and that simply just wont work!
Liouba Oksana Northbridge Services Group	Posted - 2011.04.04 15:19:00 - [116] What CCP ****es on its customers without even having the courtesy of calling it rain anymore? - Didnt see that one coming, honestly. :-D
knobber Jobbler Executive Intervention Controlled Chaos	Posted - 2011.04.04 16:27:00 - [117] Originally by: Simetraz Edited by: Simetraz on 04/04/2011 13:57:37 What a shame, people have been complaining about all the super capitals out there. The fact of the matter is 90 % of them are personally owned. Can you back that up? For smaller alliances this is probably the case, and probably for those that bot but I know of alliances who use moon mining etc to fund supercaps.
Anitta Blake BSC LEGION Nabaal Syndicate	Posted - 2011.04.04 17:11:00 - [118] Edited by: Anitta Blake on 04/04/2011 17:15:51 Originally by: Rainus Max Point 3) Makes sense but then you are punishing the larger alliances, you need to have a more dynamic cap on how many systems an alliance can claim at a resonable cost verses their population. I will also point out that if you want alliances to fight, coalitions are a natural result. The NC iirc formed because of the common threat of BOB and then strenghtened by further attacks from Tri et al. There is nothing you can do to counter their formation other than preventing alliances setting each other blue or neutral and that simply just wont work! if we look at the top alliances by member count the larger alliances are not the ones with the most systems Goonswarm the biggest has only 67 Systems by comparison to xXDEATHXx with 276 Systems dotlan.net alliance systems
ed jeni SKULLDOGS RED.OverLord	Posted - 2011.04.04 17:19:00 - [119] ok so i am supposed to run a hi-sec mission alt to fund my PVP lolz ? so 30% of 0.0 dwellers ragequit due to CCP putting the clock back to pre dominion and the remaining 70% sub a new hi-sec alt, i think i can now see the reasons behind the nerf. tbh CCP putting effort into changing the code base for this just beggars belief when so many issues remain ignored.
Rainus Max Fusion Enterprises Ltd Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2011.04.04 18:37:00 - [120] Originally by: Anitta Blake Edited by: Anitta Blake on 04/04/2011 17:15:51 Originally by: Rainus Max Point 3) Makes sense but then you are punishing the larger alliances, you need to have a more dynamic cap on how many systems an alliance can claim at a resonable cost verses their population. I will also point out that if you want alliances to fight, coalitions are a natural result. The NC iirc formed because of the common threat of BOB and then strenghtened by further attacks from Tri et al. There is nothing you can do to counter their formation other than preventing alliances setting each other blue or neutral and that simply just wont work! if we look at the top alliances by member count the larger alliances are not the ones with the most systems Goonswarm the biggest has only 67 Systems by comparison to xXDEATHXx with 276 Systems dotlan.net alliance systems Don't get me wrong alliances like xXDeathXx have their place in 0.0 but holding what a system for every 4 people is just insane. The idea behind a dynamic cap would be to make holding excessive amount of space very expensive. The only problem is that to make it work you need to expand 0.0 to deal with the player base increase.



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