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Mutnin
Amarr Mutineers
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Posted - 2011.06.09 19:25:00 -
[61]
Edited by: Mutnin on 09/06/2011 19:37:18
Originally by: Quality Poaster SEEEEE
Oh I see you know how an LP store works, good for you. Again, what does that have to do with pvp or my previous posting?
You just sound mad, but I'll bite..
It allows us to make ISK while staying on the front lines. Prior to FW missions getting a buff most FW players had to return to high sec to do their ISK grinds or go out to null sec.
Not to mention it now allows FW pilots to afford to compete against the various neutral/pie groups that live or roam the areas. Show me any other place in EVE that people consistently throw them selves at one another for little to no reason other than PVP. RvB which is mostly T1 frigs and Cruisers of course is about the only other place. Null sec the wars always come and go, giving the players time to ISK grind in between, meanwhile in FW the battle never stops.
FW essentially needed the ISK source, because it was likely one of the biggest ISK sinks in the game and a lot of players used to quit, simply because they couldn't afford the losses. TBH if not for FW missions I likely would of quit this game some time ago.
You are either just a troll (name gives big hint) or you are mad cause your sanctum farming got nerfed or just bitters because someone else makes more than you.
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X Gallentius
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.06.09 19:33:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Patient 2428190 stuff
You don't have to chase mission runners if you don't want to.
And, as pointed out previously, the rewards for FW missions are "incredible" because not enough people have the balls to do them.
How do plexes relate to FW missions? People weren't doing plexes even before mission penalties were nerfed.
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Quality Poaster SEEEEE
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Posted - 2011.06.09 19:45:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Mutnin
You just sound mad, but I'll bite..
You must be projecting there, i'm not in any way affiliated with FW. I just pointed out the great irony that what's killing it is the inability of participants to agree on it's reform (ccp has said as much) which has everything to do with the mission system.
Originally by: Mutnin
It allows us to make ISK while staying on the front lines. Prior to FW missions getting a buff most FW players had to return to high sec to do their ISK grinds or go out to null sec.
Then you chose to do that. Are you going to tell me that lowsec has no other opportunites for you to make isk?
Originally by: Mutnin
FW essentially needed the ISK source, because it was likely one of the biggest ISK sinks in the game and a lot of players used to quit, simply because they couldn't afford the losses. TBH if not for FW missions I likely would of quit this game some time ago.
I'm going to ask you the samething i've asked Gallentius and Cromwell: what does that have to do with the pvp?
Originally by: Mutnin
You are either just a troll (name gives big hint) or you are mad cause your sanctum farming got nerfed or just bitters because someone else makes more than you.
And in either case i've made my point. Anyone can see you're doggedly defending a system that benefits you only minimally, meanwhile you turn a blind eye to the problems it causes and rage that "fw is broken," time and again.
Sorry if it makes you mad, but the truth hurts.
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X Gallentius
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.06.09 19:57:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Quality Poaster SEEEEE
Originally by: Mutnin
It allows us to make ISK while staying on the front lines. Prior to FW missions getting a buff most FW players had to return to high sec to do their ISK grinds or go out to null sec.
Then you chose to do that. Are you going to tell me that lowsec has no other opportunites for you to make isk?
You are the solution to your own whining.
Just quit whining and joint the gravy train. As more of you whiners join up and do FW missions, the payouts (based on LP and not isk) will decrease to other standard payouts for PvE activities, and then you won't be able to whine anymore.
Problem solved.
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Deen Wispa
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.06.09 20:50:00 -
[65]
Quality Poaster is obviously a troll. By his own admission, he is not even affiliated with FW so he only speaks from an outsider's perspective. Join and see what it's like. If not, then you're welcome to stick to nullsec too.
Everything that X Gal and Mutnin posted is true as I joined a few days ago. It takes balls to run missions in lowsec while being hunted by WTs or pirates. Even if it didn't take balls, the isk is needed so that people can fund their PvP habits.
I like the "us vs them" rival mentality that is FW. It feels like a true rivalry. The only other place you get this is Nullsec but I'm not interested in dealing with the politics and blobs.
It's a sandbox. Play the way you want to play it.
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Mutnin
Amarr Mutineers
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Posted - 2011.06.09 20:54:00 -
[66]
Edited by: Mutnin on 09/06/2011 20:56:52
Originally by: Quality Poaster SEEEEE
I'm going to ask you the samething i've asked Gallentius and Cromwell: what does that have to do with the pvp?
Last time I checked, ships cost ISK, so ISK is needed for PVP. If you are not involved in FW, what makes you think you know what is wrong with it? TBH, at least on the Gal/Cal side of things the fight is pretty healthy and thanks to having a income people can fly stuff a bit better than T1 cruisers. (sometimes that's good & bad.. would love to see less Drams for an example but that's not just an FW issue)
Out of the things wrong with FW, missions are likely at bottom of list.
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Von Kroll
Caldari Kroll's Legion
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Posted - 2011.06.09 22:11:00 -
[67]
Originally by: X Gallentius
Here's your real issue. Some carebear is making more isk farming missions while actively piloting his stealth bomber and dramiel than you and your alts are by afk mining/running L4 missions/doing industry/POS reactions in high sec.
This... You guys are on the outside looking in and you think you know. To be honest, other than overwhelming the market with LP stuff, I could care less if there are carebears farming FW missions. For those of us that want to pew, we're all looking for a way to pay for the ships we lose on a daily basis. The missions serve that purpose. And, if you're patient, there's plenty of ways to catch those mission runners--just takes more patience than most gank-bears have.
P.S... post with your mains.
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Quality Poaster SEEEEE
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Posted - 2011.06.09 22:38:00 -
[68]
The tone of this thread just got mad, why is everyone mad?
And seriously, post with your forum alts, cowards.
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Har Harrison
Amarrian Retribution
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Posted - 2011.06.09 23:09:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Deen Wispa Quality Poaster is obviously a troll. By his own admission, he is not even affiliated with FW so he only speaks from an outsider's perspective. Join and see what it's like. If not, then you're welcome to stick to nullsec too.
Everything that X Gal and Mutnin posted is true as I joined a few days ago. It takes balls to run missions in lowsec while being hunted by WTs or pirates. Even if it didn't take balls, the isk is needed so that people can fund their PvP habits.
I like the "us vs them" rival mentality that is FW. It feels like a true rivalry. The only other place you get this is Nullsec but I'm not interested in dealing with the politics and blobs.
It's a sandbox. Play the way you want to play it.
Someone who has been in FW for a few days thinks it takes balls to fly a cloaky ship into a mission, spam d-scan and warp out if a WT enters the mission... And since they collect multiple missions, they bounce to another system and do that one and maybe come back, or maybe they don't... And doing this makes them enough ISK that if they do lose a ship every now and then, they have a heap of spares ready to go in their carebear hangar...
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Deen Wispa
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.06.09 23:57:00 -
[70]
Edited by: Deen Wispa on 10/06/2011 00:04:33 Edited by: Deen Wispa on 10/06/2011 00:01:22 Edited by: Deen Wispa on 10/06/2011 00:00:48 Edited by: Deen Wispa on 10/06/2011
Originally by: Har Harrison
Originally by: Deen Wispa Quality Poaster is obviously a troll. By his own admission, he is not even affiliated with FW so he only speaks from an outsider's perspective. Join and see what it's like. If not, then you're welcome to stick to nullsec too.
Everything that X Gal and Mutnin posted is true as I joined a few days ago. It takes balls to run missions in lowsec while being hunted by WTs or pirates. Even if it didn't take balls, the isk is needed so that people can fund their PvP habits.
I like the "us vs them" rival mentality that is FW. It feels like a true rivalry. The only other place you get this is Nullsec but I'm not interested in dealing with the politics and blobs.
It's a sandbox. Play the way you want to play it.
Someone who has been in FW for a few days thinks it takes balls to fly a cloaky ship into a mission, spam d-scan and warp out if a WT enters the mission... And since they collect multiple missions, they bounce to another system and do that one and maybe come back, or maybe they don't... And doing this makes them enough ISK that if they do lose a ship every now and then, they have a heap of spares ready to go in their carebear hangar...
Never said it takes balls to fly in a cloaky ship. Flying a bomber against Guristas who hit out from 100KM and ECM w/o another ship drawing aggro is suicide. Flying in a regular T1 in lowsec is alot tougher w/o alts scouting ahead.
But please continue misinterpreting and applying your Amarr FW missions to Gallente FW missions if it makes you feel better about your internet spaceships skillz :) -----------------
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Har Harrison
Amarrian Retribution
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Posted - 2011.06.10 02:26:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Deen Wispa Edited by: Deen Wispa on 10/06/2011 00:04:33 Edited by: Deen Wispa on 10/06/2011 00:01:22 Edited by: Deen Wispa on 10/06/2011 00:00:48 Edited by: Deen Wispa on 10/06/2011
Originally by: Har Harrison
Originally by: Deen Wispa Quality Poaster is obviously a troll. By his own admission, he is not even affiliated with FW so he only speaks from an outsider's perspective. Join and see what it's like. If not, then you're welcome to stick to nullsec too.
Everything that X Gal and Mutnin posted is true as I joined a few days ago. It takes balls to run missions in lowsec while being hunted by WTs or pirates. Even if it didn't take balls, the isk is needed so that people can fund their PvP habits.
I like the "us vs them" rival mentality that is FW. It feels like a true rivalry. The only other place you get this is Nullsec but I'm not interested in dealing with the politics and blobs.
It's a sandbox. Play the way you want to play it.
Someone who has been in FW for a few days thinks it takes balls to fly a cloaky ship into a mission, spam d-scan and warp out if a WT enters the mission... And since they collect multiple missions, they bounce to another system and do that one and maybe come back, or maybe they don't... And doing this makes them enough ISK that if they do lose a ship every now and then, they have a heap of spares ready to go in their carebear hangar...
Never said it takes balls to fly in a cloaky ship. Flying a bomber against Guristas who hit out from 100KM and ECM w/o another ship drawing aggro is suicide. Flying in a regular T1 in lowsec is alot tougher w/o alts scouting ahead.
But please continue misinterpreting and applying your Amarr FW missions to Gallente FW missions if it makes you feel better about your internet spaceships skillz :)
I actually don't really run missions - I just chase the minnies who do in my local systems. So don't project YOUR ideas. And all you have really proven in your post is one of the main claims of issues with FW missions - they are unbalanced since some races can solo them and some require a speed tank...
And what are these scouts flying in if not t1 frigs??? Can only assume it would therefore have to be a cloaky since you won't scout in a BC or BS...
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Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
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Posted - 2011.06.11 04:59:00 -
[72]
Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 11/06/2011 05:03:05
The plex spawning system is broken in the same way it was with Incursions. Incursions has been fixed while FW code remains broken.
Anatomy of plex PvP:
* One of a few playable target systems is chosen (constellation/sov borders matter) * Both militia login at downtime and start opening plex. * PvP ensues as both sides switch plexes and reship to draw out and counter each other, many fights are assured no matter who has more numbers. * All plex in the target system are closed. * Both teams spread out and close surrounding plex to have them respawn, some fighting, mostly resetting the system for more plex fights. (bio break) * Some plex respawn in the target system and another round starts. * These plex are then closed. * No more plex spawn in any of the systems which will effect the target. * FW closes for another 20 hours until tomorrows reset.
To answer "They need to give it meaning"
The system already contains meaning, the original game-design is good. When plex PvP works there is an advantage in owning a system. You need NPCs in larger plex to fight when grossly outnumbered, having plex on your side opens up your options.
They just need to look at the fix in Incursions and "corify" it to the same FW code.
Lost Incognito has more details on how the constellation and sov borders play into the limited number of working target systems.
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Cromwell Savage
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.06.11 18:28:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Quality Poaster SEEEEE
Originally by: Cromwell Savage
In that FW missions actually contribute to more targets for PvP? Yep.
Oh I see what you did thar. Targets, sure. Targets that fight back, no. But I guess if you equate popping a few bombers with a fleet battle, you'd be satisfied. I'm a little suprised to hear this from QCS members, but you are gallente.
Originally by: Cromwell Savage
Not saying I have never missioned, it's just not my thing. While I will agree that FW missions are not "perfect", nothing rarely is and I'm not one to begrudge someone from utilizing them to make ISK. As I've said, even the dedicated "FW carebear" adds to tagrgets of opportunity and with some effort and a little luck, can be caught with enough regularity to make it worth while. While not "ground breaking", I won't have to purchase any covert ops cloaks for a long, long time....and that's just loley stalth bombers. We've had corpies bag faction fit, cloaky T3's used exclusively for FW missions...so the opportunities are out there.
Again, i'm really confused. Are you in it for fights or the shot at roping a dope who's farming plexes? You know you can do that for MUCH better rewards in a wormhole, right? The carebears are growing fat off your pvp system, you're gaining only the occasional table scrap kill from it.
Originally by: Cromwell Savage
I'm in FW for the wardec. However, I'll plex and I'll mission when it suits me. At the same time, it matters not to me if others are in FW for goals or opportunities other than PvP. FW is what you make it. The actual "broken" mechanics have been mentioned already and I do not feel missions are anywhere near the top of the list...
So list off what's broken for me then. I'll garuntee you most of it is related to the mission system.
Targets are targets. Sure, I'd prefer "consentual" targets, but in leiu of that, I kill what's available. But as been proven many times over, sometimes it can be hard to get fights out of "consentual" targets...
I can care less if the carebears grow fat. Let them. More faction mods/ships on the market makes them more affordable for the rest of us. Again, I'll go kill what is available to kill.
What's broken? First and foremost the faction standing bug when repping friendly outlaws (-5 and below). The other "main" issue, a reason for occupancy. Not much there regarding carebears and mission running.
As I've said before, let them mission. It doesn't detract from the PvP. At least a dedicated carebear running FW missions (who wouldn't be in lo-sec or FW as it is and therefore a target if he weren't running said FW missions) is a possible target for ganking. Consentual or not is irrelevant...flashy orange will get shot at . |
Maiev Satellizer
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Posted - 2011.06.11 23:50:00 -
[74]
Just came in to say hello to the owange flashy minnies o/
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Bluejacket CT
Percussive Diplomacy The Phoenix. Consortium
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Posted - 2011.06.12 00:28:00 -
[75]
CHATGRIS BROKE FW
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Beta Miner
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Posted - 2011.06.13 05:34:00 -
[76]
Edited by: Beta Miner on 13/06/2011 05:35:05
Originally by: Constantinus Maximus
To answer "They need to give it meaning" ...
They just need to look at the fix in Incursions and "corify" it to the same FW code.
This, +10.
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Unfamed II
Caldari NPC Corporation Paisti Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.06.13 23:13:00 -
[77]
FW is filled with the worst carebears in EVE pretending to be in it for the PVP. Anyone telling something different is simply a liar. Removing missions would be a good start to make FW a bit better, and I could get rid of 6 alt accounts. -b |
Mister Kwong
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Posted - 2011.06.14 00:21:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Unfamed II NULLSEC is filled with the worst carebears in EVE pretending to be in it for the PVP.
fixed that for you :)
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Altered Ego
Meatshield Bastards The Bastards.
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Posted - 2011.06.14 02:41:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Unfamed II FW is filled with the worst carebears in EVE pretending to be in it for the PVP. Anyone telling something different is simply a liar. Removing missions would be a good start to make FW a bit better, and I could get rid of 6 alt accounts.
Unfamed, you are exactly wrong. I don't run missions at all, any more, and certainly don't run FW missions. Even though a lot of people have brought up some valid points about mission failings, such as payout/difficulty imbalances I still think that FW are a good idea that just needs to a few fixes.
The key to making FW worth while is to add features to making it as appealing to as many people as possible, or to better explain things, add features the appeal to each of the eve professions that players tend follow. And they should be more lucrative than non FW activities à after all, they are doing business in a warzone.
Mission runners -should- have better paying missions that should be equally challenging/rewarding for each faction.
Traders/haulers/industrialists: bonusÆ for doing business in a warzone, perhaps lower taxÆs or exclusive access to facilities in FW only stations
Miners: bigger/better roids for them to mine.
Incursions: have all these activities pave the way for an incursion by the opposing faction fleet.
Plexing: I think plexing should either get that bug fix love that people have been calling for for ... is it years, now? Either that or replace it with something more analogous to fighting for sov in nullsec.
Dust: definitely work these guys into the equation somehow.
Pvp: So, the moral of the story is asking to nerf or remove thinks like missions is nothing better than throwing the baby out with the bath water. Extra incentives means more antelope at the watering hole, so to speak, which translates into more targets for those looking for gratuitous player on player action. =)
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Borun Tal
Minmatar Just Abide
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Posted - 2011.06.14 04:17:00 -
[80]
Originally by: King Rothgar That pretty much. In FW you fight over absolutely nothing, it's all for ****s and giggles.
You say that like it's a bad thing. :) (Joining Caldari side in 3 jumps)
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Lyrrashae
Minmatar Crushed Ambitions
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Posted - 2011.06.14 07:03:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Quality Poaster SEEEEE
Originally by: Mutnin
FW essentially needed the ISK source, because it was likely one of the biggest ISK sinks in the game and a lot of players used to quit, simply because they couldn't afford the losses. TBH if not for FW missions I likely would of quit this game some time ago.
I'm going to ask you the samething i've asked Gallentius and Cromwell: what does that have to do with the pvp?
Ladies, Gentlemen, and potato-crisp bags...behold!
I present to you, the stupidest person in EVE.
Grade 2-level reading comprehension/retention much, troll?
You have, however, engendered 3 pages of responses from smarter people who should know better than to bite in the first place, though, so I suppose that's worth at least a 4/10, maybe 4.5/10 at the maximum...
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Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
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Posted - 2011.06.14 09:13:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Altered Ego Unfamed, you are exactly wrong...
He is really not. The vast majority are there only to farm LP and usually with representation in all four militias .. if that was not the case we would be able to run 5x20man gangs 23/7 easily which is hardly the case.
Fix it! (my old, so very old thread)
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X Gallentius
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.06.14 16:32:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Mistress Milana considering joining but here it's broken. How?
So, to answer your original question, FW is broken because you'll be able to pvp 23/7 while also being able to make unbelievable amount of isk to replace your lost ships.
If you ask me, I'd pass on that proposition...
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Deen Wispa
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.06.14 23:39:00 -
[84]
Edited by: Deen Wispa on 14/06/2011 23:39:04
Originally by: X Gallentius
Originally by: Mistress Milana considering joining but here it's broken. How?
So, to answer your original question, FW is broken because you'll be able to pvp 23/7 while also being able to make unbelievable amount of isk to replace your lost ships.
If you ask me, I'd pass on that proposition...
Thing is though, it's slightly misleading because it's not really isk but the LP. I didn't know we couldn't make money on bounties :( . I have started running missions and the LP is awesome. But I'm wondering from the traders here, how easily are you able to redeem the LP items such as ships and then sell it on the market?
I personally don't care to fly Fed Navy comets and would rather sell them. Haven't had much of a chance to test this out and would rather hear from the successful traders here.
I am so far content with FW and what it brings for me. -----------------
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Dirk Smacker
Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse
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Posted - 2011.06.15 00:17:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Bluejacket CT CHATGRIS BROKE FW
We all sat back and let it happen.
Shame on us.
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moneykeeper
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Posted - 2011.06.15 18:52:00 -
[86]
Don't blame the mission runners. There is nothing else to do in fw now, other than run missions. The whole character of fw has changed, for the worse if you ask me.
About 2 years ago faction war was awesome. You could log in, x up get in a fleet and go fight a wt fleet. Back then there was pretty much always a t1 frig and cruiser fleet up. For the most part you didn't need to be in a specified ship. You didn't need to have a specified number of sp. All were welcome.The fleets were full of people who just wanted to have fun.
I joined back up a few months ago expecting it to be pretty much the same. Damn, faction war sucks now. It honestly felt like being in a noob corp. Except the militia chat was full of tools who look down on the new players. There were a couple of new players trying not to make fools of themselves, but nobody ever responded to them in militia chat. You militia guys suck.
Not only that, there are never any fleets up now. Maybe there are some private, elite, invite only fleets for numptys who take fw srsly. But the days of xing up and having fun are gone.
So what do you think people are going to do, roam around low sec solo getting ganked by pirates? Nope, they are going to get a stealth bomber and run fw missions. That is the only reason to be in militia now. From what I can see all the fun drained away long ago.
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Princess Nexxala
Gallente Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.06.15 19:38:00 -
[87]
Edited by: Princess Nexxala on 15/06/2011 19:45:00 I is one of those numptys...but may I ask why do you think other people are in FW to hold your hand and deliver you fun? You are not in my corp so why should I care? Make your own fun you lazy bum, that's what Eve is all about. If you want your PvP served to you then **** off and go play wow.
Originally by: moneykeeper
Not only that, there are never any fleets up now. Maybe there are some private, elite, invite only fleets for numptys who take fw srsly. But the days of xing up and having fun are gone.
No, roam solo ganking pirates...its much more rewarding
Originally by: moneykeeper
So what do you think people are going to do, roam around low sec solo getting ganked by pirates?
Chatgris is an evil pirate who makes his corpmates go gcc. He turned me into a pirate and started making me fly these ghey nano ships
Originally by: Bluejacket CT CHATGRIS BROKE FW
IMO FW is still the best source of small gang PvP available in this game. Free war dec is free. Blobs still happen but even those can be quite fun to fight if your not a complete muppet. If they fix the issues its just gravy adding to an already excellent part of Eve.
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moneykeeper
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Posted - 2011.06.15 19:48:00 -
[88]
Originally by: Princess Nexxala I is one of those numptys...but may I ask why do you think other people are in FW to hold your hand and deliver you fun? You are not in my corp so why should I care, hell even if you were I wouldn't care. Make your own fun you lazy bum, that's what Eve is all about. If you want your PvP served to you then **** off and go play wow.
Suits me. You don't sound like someone I would like to fly with. You sound like total idiot, tbh.
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Princess Nexxala
Gallente Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.06.15 19:53:00 -
[89]
I am an enormous idiot actually
Originally by: moneykeeper
Originally by: Princess Nexxala I is one of those numptys...but may I ask why do you think other people are in FW to hold your hand and deliver you fun? You are not in my corp so why should I care, hell even if you were I wouldn't care. Make your own fun you lazy bum, that's what Eve is all about. If you want your PvP served to you then **** off and go play wow.
Suits me. You don't sound like someone I would like to fly with. You sound like total idiot, tbh.
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moneykeeper
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Posted - 2011.06.15 20:12:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Princess Nexxala I am an enormous idiot actually
Originally by: moneykeeper
Originally by: Princess Nexxala I is one of those numptys...but may I ask why do you think other people are in FW to hold your hand and deliver you fun? You are not in my corp so why should I care, hell even if you were I wouldn't care. Make your own fun you lazy bum, that's what Eve is all about. If you want your PvP served to you then **** off and go play wow.
Suits me. You don't sound like someone I would like to fly with. You sound like total idiot, tbh.
Maybe. Do you poach pilots from milita, stick spies in the opposition militia hoping to get an easy gank, gate camp high sec gates for hours on end and speak down to people new to faction war? Then you are probably not as fabulous as you seem to think.
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