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Is 180b isk per week from factional warfare normal? Is it balanced?

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Pipa Porto 1016	Posted - 2012.09.24 20:33:00 - [91] - Quote DarthNefarius wrote: Halia Janu wrote: Billions, if not trillions of isk gets removed from the overall economy every time a FW faction gets T5, long term this creates deflation, it is not a difficult concept. 75% of the ISK sink though is reduced at tier 5. I wish we could see the real numbers but with CCP Diagoras gone any stats you make up are derived purely out of your arse. I do think in the short term we may be seeing large amoubts ISK being deleted but since the implant market is not that elastic over the long term LESS ISK will be taken out due to unchanged demand of most faction LP store items & the 75% ISK reduction of the sink at Tier 5 Since you seem to have decided that reading's boring, I'll try again, The only possible way that's true is if a significant amount of LP is left unredeemed. The ISK is sunk as soon as you accept the LP store offer. The status of the market for items is entirely irrelevant to any discussion of Faucets. The Tier system doesn't alter the proportion of ISK to LP needed to extract LP, so all it does is change the amount of stuff that gets extracted for a given amount of ISK sunk. As it happens, because higher tiers increase the amount of stuff in the game by a larger amount for a given amount of ISK sunk, they're an even greater deflationary force than lower tiers. Are you claiming that people leave a significant amount of LP unredeemed every time they hit T5? Because that is the only way the ISK sink shrinks at higher Tiers. EvE: Everyone vs Everyone -RubyPorto
Large Collidable Object morons. 1983	Posted - 2012.09.24 20:34:00 - [92] - Quote Speaker for TheDead wrote: Your logic is flawed. Both give LP, but one is a sink, and one is a faucet? It's not - additional to concord LP, Incursions spawn massive amounts of isk out of nothing (=isk faucet), whereas even at Tier V, FW still removes isk from the economy. You know... morons.
Borisk Zeltsh Alcohlics Anonymous 0	Posted - 2012.09.24 20:37:00 - [93] - Quote I run fw plexs on one alt you can make between 6 to 10b week if you grind non stop the guy with that wallet link is eaither full crap or is running 18 acounts fw plexing is isk sink it doesnt put isk into game but u use isk with lp to get items from lp store fw missions gives isk but you put easly double that isk payout back into lp store fw isk income is nothing compard to o.o moon goo income but with fw at least the grunts get the isk and not some egotastic o.o alliance leader yes fw does need do be ballanced but not killed afta all the guys who fight for theyer faction deserve to make isk
Hakaru Ishiwara Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 330	Posted - 2012.09.24 21:13:00 - [94] - Quote DarthNefarius wrote: Pak Narhoo wrote: DarthNefarius wrote: with CCP Diagoras gone You keep writing that but where did you get that information, or is it based on pure speculation? https://twitter.com/CCP_Diagoras Last post 2 weeks ago. And the previous post was 26 June. Thats an entire summer &counting so far that CCP has been tighter fisted with stats then Romney with his past 10 years of tax returns! CCP has been stricter and stricter with their statistical reporting and data dumps since the Tyrannis debacle () 2.25 years ago. They really ratcheted down on cool data a year ago after the negative publicity and financial troubles associated with their Incarna expansion, loan repayment problem and subsequent layoffs. Pure speculation, but I'd wager that CCP doesn't want any* data coming out about their company or their IPs prior to their launch of DUST. Nothing can get in the way of their Free-to-Play and Gold-selling gravy train! (*) - where CCP economists and game designers overlooked the fact that players would reprocess POS modules to their [large] advantage. +++++++ I have never shed a tear for a fellow EVE player until now. Mark GÇ£SeleeneGÇ¥ Heard's Blog Honoring Sean "Vile Rat" Smith.
Pipa Porto 1016	Posted - 2012.09.24 21:20:00 - [95] - Quote Borisk Zeltsh wrote: I run fw plexs on one alt you can make between 6 to 10b week if you grind non stop the guy with that wallet link is eaither full crap or is running 18 acounts fw plexing is isk sink it doesnt put isk into game but u use isk with lp to get items from lp store fw missions gives isk but you put easly double that isk payout back into lp store fw isk income is nothing compard to o.o moon goo income but with fw at least the grunts get the isk and not some egotastic o.o alliance leader 6b a week is a Tech Moon. Wait... no it isn't, it's FOUR Tech moons. 1 Three day alt = 4 Tech moons isn't "nothing compard to o.o moon goo income" EvE: Everyone vs Everyone -RubyPorto
Xolve Amok. Goonswarm Federation 1113	Posted - 2012.09.24 21:28:00 - [96] - Quote Borisk Zeltsh wrote: I run fw plexs on one alt you can make between 6 to 10b week if you grind non stop the guy with that wallet link is eaither full crap or is running 18 acounts I make a similar amount with 12 accounts, the key is moving goods after cashing out in a tradehub other than Rens/Jita. In the past 60 days, I've cleared well over 350b, with a net loss of about 141m isk (500k slashers) due to either not paying attention at all, unfortunate spawn locations, or getting ganked. This is obviously not broken in the slightest, and should never be fixed. Inappropriate signature removed. Navigator.
Selinate 1008	Posted - 2012.09.24 21:39:00 - [97] - Quote SNIP ****, I don't know why I bother when I'm home sick with a cold. Was reading the wrong page.
Borisk Zeltsh Alcohlics Anonymous 0	Posted - 2012.09.24 22:00:00 - [98] - Quote Pipa Porto wrote: Borisk Zeltsh wrote: I run fw plexs on one alt you can make between 6 to 10b week if you grind non stop the guy with that wallet link is eaither full crap or is running 18 acounts fw plexing is isk sink it doesnt put isk into game but u use isk with lp to get items from lp store fw missions gives isk but you put easly double that isk payout back into lp store fw isk income is nothing compard to o.o moon goo income but with fw at least the grunts get the isk and not some egotastic o.o alliance leader 6b a week is a Tech Moon. Wait... no it isn't, it's FOUR Tech moons. 1 Three day alt = 4 Tech moons isn't "nothing compard to o.o moon goo income" What was the moon goo income before?
Pipa Porto 1016	Posted - 2012.09.24 22:07:00 - [99] - Quote Borisk Zeltsh wrote: Pipa Porto wrote: Borisk Zeltsh wrote: I run fw plexs on one alt you can make between 6 to 10b week if you grind non stop the guy with that wallet link is eaither full crap or is running 18 acounts fw plexing is isk sink it doesnt put isk into game but u use isk with lp to get items from lp store fw missions gives isk but you put easly double that isk payout back into lp store fw isk income is nothing compard to o.o moon goo income but with fw at least the grunts get the isk and not some egotastic o.o alliance leader 6b a week is a Tech Moon. Wait... no it isn't, it's FOUR Tech moons. 1 Three day alt = 4 Tech moons isn't "nothing compard to o.o moon goo income" What was the moon goo income before? The highest Tech got during the height of OTEC was about ~12b a month. Which would make each 3 day alt worth only Two Tech moons. EvE: Everyone vs Everyone -RubyPorto
Borisk Zeltsh Alcohlics Anonymous 0	Posted - 2012.09.24 22:14:00 - [100] - Quote Wts 3 day old fw farming alt will trade for two tech moons im not saying it doesnt need balancing it clearly does what i said was dont kill it so guys fighting for militia cant make isk from it
Natsett Amuinn GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 275	Posted - 2012.09.24 22:18:00 - [101] - Quote Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: Andski wrote: Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: According to the anti-high sec zealots, no number is ridiculous, as long as it is not high sec. So yeah, running around with a 3 day alt in a speed tanked Incurses, with zero weapons, orbiting low sec plexes for a payout, yeah, billions and billions of ISK / week is entirely reasonable. But for a high sec player to make 1 hundredth of that, oh no, that is unbalancing the game. You have not figured out yet the agenda of most of the CSM and some element of CCP employees. lol shut up this whole FW thing is dumb and CCP should be fixing it sooner rather than waiting till the next expansion to fix it, but that doesn't mean that your risk-free 120m/hour vanguard farming should come back It appears that CCP is too busy collaborating with you null sec zealots again to fix FW. I just read about the new high sec AI that will attack drones, and then the NUMEROUS posts by the dev Fox Four gloating about it. I have to hand it to you guys. You have a well honed machine there: an enormous propaganda team inundating the forums ceaselessly with lies to further your agenda, a CSM dominated by null sec, and then some unknown quantity of very sympathetic dev's. Except for the part where the new AI will focus less on drones. You should focus more on the truth and less on writing idiot ****.
Pipa Porto 1017	Posted - 2012.09.24 22:37:00 - [102] - Quote Borisk Zeltsh wrote: Wts 3 day old fw farming alt will trade for two tech moons im not saying it doesnt need balancing it clearly does what i said was dont kill it so guys fighting for militia cant make isk from it FW missioning has been steady at ~100m/hr for years. Removing FW plexing entirely won't stop you from making gobs of ISK. EvE: Everyone vs Everyone -RubyPorto
Takezo Wifebeater Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2012.09.24 22:55:00 - [103] - Quote When do faction tiers reach 5 anyway? They seem to be at lvl 1 most of them time (occasionally 2) from what I've seen.
Dinsdale Pirannha Pirannha Corp 303	Posted - 2012.09.24 23:00:00 - [104] - Quote Natsett Amuinn wrote: Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: Andski wrote: Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: According to the anti-high sec zealots, no number is ridiculous, as long as it is not high sec. So yeah, running around with a 3 day alt in a speed tanked Incurses, with zero weapons, orbiting low sec plexes for a payout, yeah, billions and billions of ISK / week is entirely reasonable. But for a high sec player to make 1 hundredth of that, oh no, that is unbalancing the game. You have not figured out yet the agenda of most of the CSM and some element of CCP employees. lol shut up this whole FW thing is dumb and CCP should be fixing it sooner rather than waiting till the next expansion to fix it, but that doesn't mean that your risk-free 120m/hour vanguard farming should come back It appears that CCP is too busy collaborating with you null sec zealots again to fix FW. I just read about the new high sec AI that will attack drones, and then the NUMEROUS posts by the dev Fox Four gloating about it. I have to hand it to you guys. You have a well honed machine there: an enormous propaganda team inundating the forums ceaselessly with lies to further your agenda, a CSM dominated by null sec, and then some unknown quantity of very sympathetic dev's. Except for the part where the new AI will focus less on drones. You should focus more on the truth and less on writing idiot ****. Sigh, you guys spin so many lies you can't even read facts anymore. Before : High Sec AI did not switch aggro once it was attached. Winter patch: High sec AI will switch aggro so drones will be attacked. Is this logic too hard for you, or are you stuck in liar mode?
Pipa Porto 1017	Posted - 2012.09.24 23:02:00 - [105] - Quote Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: Sigh, you guys spin so many lies you can't even read facts anymore. Before : High Sec AI did not switch aggro once it was attached. Winter patch: High sec AI will switch aggro so drones will be attacked. Is this logic too hard for you, or are you stuck in liar mode? How dare they improve your missions. EvE: Everyone vs Everyone -RubyPorto
Tyberius Franklin Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 301	Posted - 2012.09.24 23:08:00 - [106] - Quote Pipa Porto wrote: Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: Sigh, you guys spin so many lies you can't even read facts anymore. Before : High Sec AI did not switch aggro once it was attached. Winter patch: High sec AI will switch aggro so drones will be attacked. Is this logic too hard for you, or are you stuck in liar mode? How dare they improve your missions. For solo missioning (or anything really) this doesn't really change or improve anything. If you ran with others you probably got nerfed.
Soon Shin Caucasian Culture Club Transmission Lost 149	Posted - 2012.09.24 23:52:00 - [107] - Quote MotherMoon wrote: fw gives out about 300 million isk in 7 hours of work. That means a bil a week easy That means you're making about 42 million per hour using simple math. Sounds weaker than mission running to me. Oh FW is in lowsec its not some silly highsec stuff. As people hear how profitable something is, they will all jump on the bandwagon, flooding the market and causing a degradation of profits for everyone. Its a self correcting market my friends. Faction Warfare gives you straight up Loyalty Points, rather than isk like bounties do. Loyalty Points are highly susceptible to fluctuations and the LP store drags more isk out of the player's wallet than FW gives to the player. Therefore it is an Isk Sink System.
Andski GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 4863	Posted - 2012.09.25 02:11:00 - [108] - Quote Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: Sigh, you guys spin so many lies you can't even read facts anymore. Before : High Sec AI did not switch aggro once it was attached. Winter patch: High sec AI will switch aggro so drones will be attacked. Is this logic too hard for you, or are you stuck in liar mode? yeah if only there were people in nullsec who ratted in certain ships that generate sizeable amounts of isk by using 10+ drones who would be severely affected by this beyond that you're just going "abloo bloo blooooooooooooooooo my afk ratting domi is getting nerfed ((" please leave
Lord Zim 1524	Posted - 2012.09.25 03:47:00 - [109] - Quote Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: Sigh, you guys spin so many lies you can't even read facts anymore. Before : High Sec AI did not switch aggro once it was attached. Winter patch: High sec AI will switch aggro so drones will be attacked. Is this logic too hard for you, or are you stuck in liar mode? It's not a hisec-specific change. Hope this helps. Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilotn++ won't be jumping home.
TharOkha 0asis Group 62	Posted - 2012.09.25 05:27:00 - [110] - Quote Andski wrote: A blaster Naga can generate 90m-120m per hour in Guristas/Serpentis regions and a Vindicator can generate 120m-150m per hour, but those figures are basically with shield gank setups that die the moment anything sneezes at them (and yes, people shoot you in nullsec!) On the other hand, before the Escalation nerf to incursions, those income figures were achievable with T3/faction BS fleets and one guy I know had a Nightmare with a two slot tank and had no problem because they were ridiculously safe. Yet people want the Escalation changes reversed because it killed the incursion ~community~ or whatever. Yes with naga or vindi you can generate much more. But im talking about T3 with null+cloak+dscan spamming (nearly uncatchable in null = almost no risk, like in hisec). Im just pointing that null whiners that cry because they earn less than in hisec and even that they can be shot (you can be shot down in hisec too) is just their problem and incompetence. An if they live in alliance space (where null+cloak is not needed) this statement is doubly true. According incursion nerf. I dont have problem with that. I was incursion runner too (and made nice isks there) but i agree that rewards were astronomical (for hisec). But why oh why they nerfed lowsec incursion too?. There is big cry that lowsec is nearly empty. Incursion community was/is large enough to go to lowsec and do them (and i remember that we were on some of them, we even encoutered you (goons) and it was quite fun. But for what reason should we go to lowsec incs when hisec incs are still more attractive than lowsec? Nerfing hisec and lowsec in same time is not the way how to attract more ppl to low. GÇ£If reality can destroy the dream, why shouldn't the dream destroy reality?GÇ¥
Andski GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 4869	Posted - 2012.09.25 06:06:00 - [111] - Quote TharOkha wrote: According incursion nerf. I dont have problem with that. I was incursion runner too (and made nice isks there) but i agree that rewards were astronomical (for hisec). But why oh why they nerfed lowsec incursion too?. There is big cry that lowsec is nearly empty. Incursion community was/is large enough to go to lowsec and do them (and i remember that we were on some of them, we even encoutered you (goons) and it was quite fun. But for what reason should we go to lowsec incs when hisec incs are still more attractive than lowsec? Nerfing hisec and lowsec in same time is not the way how to attract more ppl to low. I agree that lowsec incursions should have remained as they were, maybe with minor adjustments but not balancing them around being run with shiny faction BS. They are inherently much more dangerous since the gates have scramming rats and somebody can light a cyno on you the moment your fleet pops the mothership. Honestly, I believe they should have been exclusive to lowsec since it was in serious need of something unique (and by that I don't mean broken FW sites that can be run in frigates) please leave
TharOkha 0asis Group 62	Posted - 2012.09.25 06:36:00 - [112] - Quote Andski wrote: I agree that lowsec incursions should have remained as they were, maybe with minor adjustments but not balancing them around being run with shiny faction BS. They are inherently much more dangerous since the gates have scramming rats and somebody can light a cyno on you the moment your fleet pops the mothership. Honestly, I believe they should have been exclusive to lowsec since it was in serious need of something unique (and by that I don't mean broken FW sites that can be run in frigates) i can agree with this post but hisec incs should remain (for training). According cyno after mothership kill, there should be 30-60 mins for cooldown, so even you pop mothership, cynojam will be still active. GÇ£If reality can destroy the dream, why shouldn't the dream destroy reality?GÇ¥
Josef Djugashvilis The Scope Gallente Federation 597	Posted - 2012.09.25 07:01:00 - [113] - Quote Pipa Porto wrote: Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: Sigh, you guys spin so many lies you can't even read facts anymore. Before : High Sec AI did not switch aggro once it was attached. Winter patch: High sec AI will switch aggro so drones will be attacked. Is this logic too hard for you, or are you stuck in liar mode? How dare they improve your missions. Change, not improve. You want fries with that?
Seleia O'Sinnor Drop of Honey 260	Posted - 2012.09.25 07:21:00 - [114] - Quote I hope everyone starts doing FW with this rediculous amount of income. New inventory: Getting better since version 1.2, but what about back and forward buttons?
Lord Zim 1524	Posted - 2012.09.25 07:24:00 - [115] - Quote Seleia O'Sinnor wrote: I hope everyone starts doing FW with this rediculous amount of income. Everybody really should. It doesn't take long to train an alt for it either. Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilotn++ won't be jumping home.
Lors Dornick Kallisti Industries Solar Assault Fleet 201	Posted - 2012.09.25 07:43:00 - [116] - Quote Seleia O'Sinnor wrote: I hope everyone starts doing FW with this rediculous amount of income. Hmm, cheap implants are nice
Chandaris Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel 85	Posted - 2012.09.25 14:26:00 - [117] - Quote CCP need to get off their asses and plug this exploit ASAP.
King Rothgar Black Watch Guard Gl0rious Bastards 305	Posted - 2012.09.25 14:41:00 - [118] - Quote FW is currently broken, far more broken than it was before the "fix." CCP has put forward some solid ideas to actually fix it though I think there is tons of room for improvement in them. Currently, FW is not an isk faucet since it does not generate significant amounts of isk (FW lvl4's do create a little, maybe 2M per mission). But its role as isk sink has been diminished due to greatly reduced LP store isk costs. Additionally, everything is so damn cheap at tier 5 that it makes any non-FW LP basically worthless. The only good bit of news here is the losing side of both fronts has greatly enhanced faction item values since FW LP can't buy them reasonably. The Troll is trolling.
Smodab Ongalot Shadows Of The Federation Drunk 'n' Disorderly 118	Posted - 2012.09.25 16:14:00 - [119] - Quote King Rothgar wrote: But its role as isk sink has been diminished due to greatly reduced LP store isk costs. I feel the need to correct this very common misconception. Tier level DOES NOT affect the isk/lp ratio sink. Since the tier based cost savings affect both LP and ISK cost, the ratio remains constant regardless of tier. The only thing that changes is the number of items that are created. Also, I'll confirm that you can easily make 5b/week on a single account part-time AFK plexing using a 900k SP toon.
Imports Plus State War Academy Caldari State 1	Posted - 2012.09.25 16:22:00 - [120] - Quote Smodab Ongalot wrote: Also, I'll confirm that you can easily make 5b/week on a single account part-time AFK plexing using a 900k SP toon. A super carrier every month nice! I have 3 characters training right now!!! Leave this alone CCP, thanks.

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