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Signal11th
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Posted - 2011.08.19 08:46:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza
Originally by: Signal11th
err yes. fly a tank ship around wait for him to turn up kill or be killed, if he lights the cyno counter drop them with your super caps/carriers/sub cap ..ohh sorry your atlas you don't have any. God mate you such a nub it's ridiculous, you spout the usual rubbish that you hear from all the whiners without actually trying anything or thinking you such a leet player just thinking about things is enough.
Try doing sometimes it actually works!
This is hilarious, keep it up. Have you realized the hole in this plan yet?
Well yes Atlas don't have any supercaps. I'm going to stop feeding your troll.
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Empy Ralt
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Posted - 2011.08.19 08:47:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Thornat Ok so one more question.
How does a single lone wolf cloaker pop anything?
A cloaked T3 can kill a substantial number of things, especially if they are already rat-damaged. As can a stealth bomber really. The trick is they'll only attack if they can win and there's nothing you can do about it.
The answer is to play an alt or even better log out of Eve and go play some tanks :)
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Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr Divine Power. Atlas.
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Posted - 2011.08.19 08:49:00 -
[33]
Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 19/08/2011 08:49:26
Originally by: Signal11th
Well yes Atlas don't have any supercaps. I'm going to stop feeding your troll.
Do you seriously need a hint as to what the flaw in having a large standing fleet waiting for an AFK cloaker to show up is? This is so sad. This is what happens when people feel informed from skimming evenews24 |
Tokyo Rose
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Posted - 2011.08.19 08:51:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza
Originally by: Tokyo Rose
I bet my way was more challenging than setting a bot loose in nullsec farming rats.
You mean those bots that warp to a safe and go into AFK cloak mode?
I'm sorry for your loss of profit.
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Miss Rabblt
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Posted - 2011.08.19 08:52:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Signal11th It's called being proactive instead of docking up and whining in forums. Surely an alliance the size of Atlas can organize the baiting and killing of a lone cloaker even if he has a cyno.
you do realise that "afk cloaker" isn't NPC here? You really sure you understand it?
Just one question: how can you be sure that afk cloaker will aggro your bait ship? And when will it happen? Or you want to have your "bait command" 24/7 in this system? If i were play game "afk cloaker" and i found suspicious activity and "defensless" ship flying around hour by hour i would go afk for loooong time because this is obvious trap for me.
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Signal11th
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Posted - 2011.08.19 08:55:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 19/08/2011 08:49:26
Originally by: Signal11th
Well yes Atlas don't have any supercaps. I'm going to stop feeding your troll.
Do you seriously need a hint as to what the flaw in having a large standing fleet waiting for an AFK cloaker to show up is? This is so sad. This is what happens when people feel informed from skimming evenews24
Not really, surely you have 5 or 10 people in your system that can drop ratting and suit up so to speak, ok you run the risk of getting hotdropped but in what 2 years in various places it happened once and people lost 4 ships whoppee.
Just laziness, you much vaunted 0.0 people always bang on about pvp this pvp that but only on your terms and when your more than likely going to win. So what if you get hot dropped at least you tried.
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Mors Magne
Astral Adventure
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Posted - 2011.08.19 08:56:00 -
[37]
I ninja rat in 0.0 with a T3 ship and a covert ops cloak. I often cloak and log off.
Therefore, I am an "AFK cloaker".
But what is all the fuss about?
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Tokyo Rose
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Posted - 2011.08.19 08:59:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Miss Rabblt
Originally by: Signal11th It's called being proactive instead of docking up and whining in forums. Surely an alliance the size of Atlas can organize the baiting and killing of a lone cloaker even if he has a cyno.
you do realise that "afk cloaker" isn't NPC here? You really sure you understand it?
Just one question: how can you be sure that afk cloaker will aggro your bait ship? And when will it happen? Or you want to have your "bait command" 24/7 in this system? If i were play game "afk cloaker" and i found suspicious activity and "defensless" ship flying around hour by hour i would go afk for loooong time because this is obvious trap for me.
I used to set a few of my alts in active nullsec station systems just to collect all the tears from the countless local and private convos asking wth was I up to and what was my problem disrupting their operations.
It was a great passtime as I farmed fw missions.
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Signal11th
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:00:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Miss Rabblt
Originally by: Signal11th It's called being proactive instead of docking up and whining in forums. Surely an alliance the size of Atlas can organize the baiting and killing of a lone cloaker even if he has a cyno.
you do realise that "afk cloaker" isn't NPC here? You really sure you understand it?
Just one question: how can you be sure that afk cloaker will aggro your bait ship? And when will it happen? Or you want to have your "bait command" 24/7 in this system? If i were play game "afk cloaker" and i found suspicious activity and "defensless" ship flying around hour by hour i would go afk for loooong time because this is obvious trap for me.
My rabbit you must have thought all of 30 seconds to come up with that reply. Yes you don't like the fact you have an cloaky in your system you don't rat, you try to bait him or you move to another system to rat. Everyone has choices just because people don't like their safe isk supply disturbed is no reason to start asking for nerfs to ships that actually fill their role very well.
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AFK Cloaker
Amarr Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:01:00 -
[40]
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Miss Rabblt
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:06:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Signal11th
Originally by: Miss Rabblt
Originally by: Signal11th It's called being proactive instead of docking up and whining in forums. Surely an alliance the size of Atlas can organize the baiting and killing of a lone cloaker even if he has a cyno.
you do realise that "afk cloaker" isn't NPC here? You really sure you understand it?
Just one question: how can you be sure that afk cloaker will aggro your bait ship? And when will it happen? Or you want to have your "bait command" 24/7 in this system? If i were play game "afk cloaker" and i found suspicious activity and "defensless" ship flying around hour by hour i would go afk for loooong time because this is obvious trap for me.
My rabbit you must have thought all of 30 seconds to come up with that reply. ....
i don't need 30 seconds to get your idea about hunting afk cloaker. I have heard about ideas liek this many times. However my questions aren't answered. Have you something to say here?
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Sjugar
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:11:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Sjugar on 19/08/2011 09:11:58 The main problem I have with AFK cloakers is that they're playing the game while not behind their computer. Just like a bot, basically the same thing, you let a machine play the game for you.
On the other hand, I don't really see what you can do without hurting the legit non-AFK cloakers who can sit in systems for hours, days on end just to get that one kill and strike fear in their victims hearts.
Meh, just make a cloak something that stops your cap-regen and takes a tiny tiny bit of cap to cycle. Or make it have a meltdown at intervals which the player can stop to keep up a cloak, just something to make sure that people are behind their computer.
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Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr Divine Power. Atlas.
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:12:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Signal11th
Not really, surely you have 5 or 10 people in your system that can drop ratting and suit up so to speak, ok you run the risk of getting hotdropped but in what 2 years in various places it happened once and people lost 4 ships whoppee.
Okay let's play this scenario out because this isn't sinking in. We got an AFK cloaker in system and we have a strong fleet full of guys ready and waiting at a POS and hell even a titan ready to bridge into this system; billions of isk have been sunk into this project to kill a 40mil cyno-fit AFK Cloaker.
So I'm sitting here in my tanked abaddon or whatever with a cyno of my own fit, as per your suggestion, warping from belt to belt, waiting along with dozens of guys to get this guy out of our system and defend our space against all comers, right?
So we're waiting, and waiting, and waiting because, oh yeah this guy is AFK; asleep, or at work, or whatever while dozens of players and tons of hardware are being used for hours on end idling waiting for him to uncloak. After 4-5 or more hours, the fleet disbands having wasted everyone's time, time that could have been spent going on CTAs, or roaming, etc. Maybe we'll have better luck tomorrow and form another fleet hoping he's actually at his computer to even notice the bait ship. But probably not.
I mean Signal, we've all had the idea of the dedicated "bait" ship to catch AFK cloakers at one point or another. I've been on several attempts at it But when you threw out the idea of "keep a super fleet on standby AFK cloaker" as a viable counterstrategy and proof that cloak is somehow balanced or whatever, I knew you were talking theorycraft there bud. |
Jemima Puddlefuck
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:15:00 -
[44]
How exactly is someone who is not at the keyboard 'playing the game'> ~~~
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Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr Divine Power. Atlas.
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:15:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Sjugar
On the other hand, I don't really see what you can do without hurting the legit non-AFK cloakers who can sit in systems for hours, days on end just to get that one kill and strike fear in their victims hearts.
Eh, just disable auto-repeat on the cloaking module and make its cycle timer last 300 seconds. |
baltec1
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:15:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Sjugar Edited by: Sjugar on 19/08/2011 09:11:58 The main problem I have with AFK cloakers is that they're playing the game while not behind their computer. Just like a bot, basically the same thing, you let a machine play the game for you.
On the other hand, I don't really see what you can do without hurting the legit non-AFK cloakers who can sit in systems for hours, days on end just to get that one kill and strike fear in their victims hearts.
Meh, just make a cloak something that stops your cap-regen and takes a tiny tiny bit of cap to cycle. Or make it have a meltdown at intervals which the player can stop to keep up a cloak, just something to make sure that people are behind their computer.
Remove local and both of your issues are solved.
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Tokyo Rose
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:16:00 -
[47]
Edited by: Tokyo Rose on 19/08/2011 09:18:43
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza
Originally by: Signal11th
Not really, surely you have 5 or 10 people in your system that can drop ratting and suit up so to speak, ok you run the risk of getting hotdropped but in what 2 years in various places it happened once and people lost 4 ships whoppee.
Okay let's play this scenario out because this isn't sinking in. We got an AFK cloaker in system and we have a strong fleet full of guys ready and waiting at a POS and hell even a titan ready to bridge into this system; billions of isk have been sunk into this project to kill a 40mil cyno-fit AFK Cloaker.
So I'm sitting here in my tanked abaddon or whatever with a cyno of my own fit, as per your suggestion, warping from belt to belt, waiting along with dozens of guys to get this guy out of our system and defend our space against all comers, right?
So we're waiting, and waiting, and waiting because, oh yeah this guy is AFK; asleep, or at work, or whatever while dozens of players and tons of hardware are being used for hours on end idling waiting for him to uncloak. After 4-5 or more hours, the fleet disbands having wasted everyone's time, time that could have been spent going on CTAs, or roaming, etc. Maybe we'll have better luck tomorrow and form another fleet hoping he's actually at his computer to even notice the bait ship. But probably not.
I mean Signal, we've all had the idea of the dedicated "bait" ship to catch AFK cloakers at one point or another. I've been on several attempts at it But when you threw out the idea of "keep a super fleet on standby AFK cloaker" as a viable counterstrategy and proof that cloak is somehow balanced or whatever, I knew you were talking theorycraft there bud.
Alternately you could just pve with cheap insured ships and not give a rats arse about the afk cloaker if he turns out to be hostile with a fleet waiting to cyno in on your ratting raven or mining covetor.
The only thing afk disrupt is botters.
If they disrupt anyone else then you just psyched yourself out over a phantom threat.
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Thornat
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:16:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Empy Ralt
Originally by: Thornat Ok so one more question.
How does a single lone wolf cloaker pop anything?
A cloaked T3 can kill a substantial number of things, especially if they are already rat-damaged. As can a stealth bomber really. The trick is they'll only attack if they can win and there's nothing you can do about it.
The answer is to play an alt or even better log out of Eve and go play some tanks :)
I would love some examples of ships that a cloaked ship, even a T3 ship can take on. I mean I just don't see it. I have brawled with a lot of cloakers and by far, more than any other ship (even T1 frigates) they are the easiest ships to pop in the game. If you can't take on a lone stealth bomber than strictly speaking you aren't ready for PvP, low sec and definitly not null sec. I mean Eve has a progression in place, you can't be out their with weak fittings and in a class of ship incapable of taking on something as trivial as a paper thin cloaker.
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Sjugar
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:18:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza So we're waiting, and waiting, and waiting because, oh yeah this guy is AFK; asleep, or at work, or whatever while dozens of players and tons of hardware are being used for hours on end idling waiting for him to uncloak. After 4-5 or more hours, the fleet disbands having wasted everyone's time, time that could have been spent going on CTAs, or roaming, etc.......
Maybe you should have done just that. Leave the cloaker be and go out roaming and rofl at your carebears who are a waste for any pvp-alliance anyhow.
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Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr Divine Power. Atlas.
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:18:00 -
[50]
Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 19/08/2011 09:18:50
Originally by: Tokyo Rose Alternately you could just pve with cheap insured ships and not give a rats arse about the afk cloaker if he turns out to be hostile with a fleet waiting to cyno in on your ratting raven or mining covetor.
Okay, "let the enemy destroy your ship", another reasonable idea from the fertile mind of Tokyo Rose. |
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Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr Divine Power. Atlas.
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:21:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Sjugar
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza So we're waiting, and waiting, and waiting because, oh yeah this guy is AFK; asleep, or at work, or whatever while dozens of players and tons of hardware are being used for hours on end idling waiting for him to uncloak. After 4-5 or more hours, the fleet disbands having wasted everyone's time, time that could have been spent going on CTAs, or roaming, etc.......
Maybe you should have done just that. Leave the cloaker be and go out roaming and rofl at your carebears who are a waste for any pvp-alliance anyhow.
Hmm yes, maybe the "standing anti-AFK cloaker fleet" was an ill-considered idea after all, I agree. |
Thornat
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:21:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 19/08/2011 09:18:50
Originally by: Tokyo Rose Alternately you could just pve with cheap insured ships and not give a rats arse about the afk cloaker if he turns out to be hostile with a fleet waiting to cyno in on your ratting raven or mining covetor.
Okay, "let the enemy destroy your ship", another reasonable idea from the fertile mind of Tokyo Rose.
I really don't understand what your after to be honest. I'm going through your post trying to figuire out what part of evading, trapping and dealing with cloakers you have trouble with. I mean if you think a cloaker is in a system, move to the next system.
I honestly just don't get where the problem is.
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Tokyo Rose
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:21:00 -
[53]
Edited by: Tokyo Rose on 19/08/2011 09:27:28
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 19/08/2011 09:18:50
Originally by: Tokyo Rose Alternately you could just pve with cheap insured ships and not give a rats arse about the afk cloaker if he turns out to be hostile with a fleet waiting to cyno in on your ratting raven or mining covetor.
Okay, "let the enemy destroy your ship", another reasonable idea from the fertile mind of Tokyo Rose.
What? Why would any nullsec rats destroy your ratting raven? It has more than sufficient tank and gank to pwn even an officer spawn.
As far as mining and having the rats pwn u wtf are you doing in a belt when exploration has much much much greater rewards for mining with nearly zero threat from rats.
Edit: you changed rats to enemy ships you sly dog. Still thats the whole point of doing pve in a cheap insurable ship.
If the afk cloaker actually turns out to be a real threat then they will grow bold on kills that cost you nothing.
Thats when you set the trap. But then again this is atlas we are talking about and thats probably well beyond their abilities.
Someone needs to direct an atlas rep to this thread so they can either remove this genius from the alliance or stop him from posting.
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Signal11th
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:27:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza
Originally by: Sjugar
On the other hand, I don't really see what you can do without hurting the legit non-AFK cloakers who can sit in systems for hours, days on end just to get that one kill and strike fear in their victims hearts.
Eh, just disable auto-repeat on the cloaking module and make its cycle timer last 300 seconds.
Agree with you on this one! but I would like a visable alert to say the cloak is off. the amount of times I've been uncloaked without realising it is unreal.
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Miss Rabblt
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:29:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Thornat I would love some examples of ships that a cloaked ship, even a T3 ship can take on.
just some examples from last month.
0.0 Rogue drones. People farm anomalies like drone Horde and Drone Patrol. There is 2 types of Drone Hordes: small one and big one. Big one has 4 bunkers inside which are triggers for spawn when attacked. Whole spawn only tankable by carrier. Many frig-tacklers here. Just little idea: you warp there, wait for victim starts to aggro bunkers. Then you point him and help rats to kill him. You even can trigger more spawns and if you are fast and small you can get out in time. We have one guy who lost his raven warped into fully triggered drone horde. It was someone's mistake or sabotage. No one knows.
Drone Patrol: when you aggro initial rat you get 4 spawns near with total amount of 3-6 scram/web frigates. With little help of "afk cloaker" you can loose your ship there fast. I mean: neutralizing or 100-300 additional DPS is enough.
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Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr Divine Power. Atlas.
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:31:00 -
[56]
Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 19/08/2011 09:33:26
Originally by: Thornat
I really don't understand what your after to be honest. I'm going through your post trying to figuire out what part of evading, trapping and dealing with cloakers you have trouble with. I mean if you think a cloaker is in a system, move to the next system.
So far the options offered are "surrender the space and move somewhere else", or "let the enemy destroy my ship and just try to mitigate the cost as much as possible". Why is so offensive to some to point out that the cloak is effectively an invulnerability button under the current EVE game mechanics? I mean, I've made most of my profits using cloaked haulers myself; but I still feel the mechanic is unbalanced. |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr Divine Power. Atlas.
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:35:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Signal11th
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza
Originally by: Sjugar
On the other hand, I don't really see what you can do without hurting the legit non-AFK cloakers who can sit in systems for hours, days on end just to get that one kill and strike fear in their victims hearts.
Eh, just disable auto-repeat on the cloaking module and make its cycle timer last 300 seconds.
Agree with you on this one! but I would like a visable alert to say the cloak is off. the amount of times I've been uncloaked without realising it is unreal.
That seems fair; I've done that a lot myself when warping to WHs. |
Tokyo Rose
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:37:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza
Originally by: Thornat
I really don't understand what your after to be honest. I'm going through your post trying to figuire out what part of evading, trapping and dealing with cloakers you have trouble with. I mean if you think a cloaker is in a system, move to the next system.
or "let the enemy destroy my ship and just try to mitigate the cost as much as possible". Why is so offensive to some to point out that the cloak is effectively an invulnerability button under the current EVE game mechanics?
Its not mitigating the cost of your ship that is the goal.
Its letting the hostile grow accustomed to killing ships that make him vulnerable to a trap.
Is losing your cheap insured pve ship such a huge deal that you can't see the bigger picture.
I mean really, does the killboard mean that much to you?
Also every ship in the game that can cloak loses its invulnerability as soon as it tries to act.
So please for the love of god and your alliance reputation just stop posting now.
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Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr Divine Power. Atlas.
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:41:00 -
[59]
Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 19/08/2011 09:43:07 Continue elaborating your really bad idea. It's like the "standing anti-AFK cloaker fleet", but includes the losses of several ships as a prereq. I am intrigued, do continue. |
Tokyo Rose
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Posted - 2011.08.19 09:43:00 -
[60]
Edited by: Tokyo Rose on 19/08/2011 09:49:05
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza Continue elaborating your really bad idea.
Continue not getting it.
We have all night.
edit because he edited.
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 19/08/2011 09:43:07 Continue elaborating your really bad idea. It's like the "standing anti-AFK cloaker fleet", but includes the losses of several ships as a prereq. I am intrigued, do continue.
Ok lets spell it out for you in simple easy to understand terms.
If your afk cloaker turns out to be an actual hostile threat you bait him with easy kills that do nothing to your bottom line past a few losses no one cars about on the corp killboard.
Once he is feeling safe you pull the trigger on the trap.
How is this so hard to understand?
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