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Panchatantra
Bunnie Slayers
Redrum Fleet
0
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Posted - 2012.10.05 11:14:00 -
[1] - Quote
I am sorry to start a new thread but the ones I found were locked due to inactivity
What I propose is not a nerf on cloaking, but rather a nerf to AFK cloaking. No part of this game should be playable while gone from the keyboard for hours at a stretch- unless you are docked up.
An AFK cloaked cyno pilot in system can disrupt an entire days work for a 100 man corp, which is fine by me- but I want the other player to ACTUALLY be there.
This is what I am suggesting:
POS Module: Cloak Disrupt Pulse Array
Uses: Fuel X
Pulse: Every 5 min - timer visible in local CHANCE X on disrupting cloak (mitigated by cloaking skill)
Requirements: Soverignity X
Limitation: 1 per system, couple of hours fuel bay max.
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Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
319
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Posted - 2012.10.05 11:37:00 -
[2] - Quote
Panchatantra wrote:
What I propose is not a nerf on cloaking, but rather a nerf to AFK cloaking. No part of this game should be playable while gone from the keyboard for hours at a stretch- unless you are docked up.
Did you even check the reason for those locked threads, someone makes the same proposat you did, then it gets shot down. The OP does not come back with anything and it goes inactive.
As for your idea, how it this even balanced?? you have even specificly stated that you believe that it should be one-sided, in your favor....
"No part of this game should be playable while gone from the keyboard for hours at a stretch- unless you are docked up"
You are doing the same thing an AFK cloaker is, making his presence known in the system without being at the computer.
In addition to your proposal I suggest the additional balancing factor --->
With the 5 minute timer, every player who is docked up or in a POS shield gets pushed out into space.
Jint Hikaru - Miner / Salvager / Explorer / SpaceBum
In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. |
Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
319
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Posted - 2012.10.05 12:13:00 -
[3] - Quote
Now, if you are really trying to stop AFK cloaking, and not nerf all cloaks..... (because it sure seems like you simple want to nerf all cloaks), I propose the following.
Simply remove cloakers from local. And deny that cloaker local.
- Now cloaks are really cloaked.
- Now AFK Cloaking cannot cause any fear.
- Now active cloakers have to work for more intel or to find targets. (like decloak or use probes)
- Now system residents have to pay a little more attention to whats going on around them.
- Now (if done correctly) BOTs can be caught.
Jint Hikaru - Miner / Salvager / Explorer / SpaceBum
In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
443
|
Posted - 2012.10.05 12:31:00 -
[4] - Quote
yeah here we go, another afk cloaking thread.
afk cloakign is fine, suck it up. |
Mars Theran
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
333
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Posted - 2012.10.05 12:49:00 -
[5] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:yeah here we go, another afk cloaking thread.
afk cloakign is fine. Why? READ THE DAMN OTHER THREADS WHICH WERE CLOSED, why the f*ck did you think it requires a new one?
Actually, the idea has never been shot down; just flogged to death, like you've started doing in this thread. Who flogs it? AFK Cloakers would be my guess.
As an often pilot of CovOps ships, I see no reason why cloaks shouldn't be capable of being disrupted under certain mechanics. I don't agree that it should be instant, 100%, easy, or even potentially available anywhere, but it should be available in some fashion aside from the Spiraling Inty method, or the Mass Drone + Can Blob method.
Those are only effective on gates when aligning or warping in anyway. Aside from that, cloaking is invulnerable.
Maybe I was actually sleeping in front of my computer and dreamed I posted. Certainly, it's not there now. |
Mars Theran
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
333
|
Posted - 2012.10.05 12:50:00 -
[6] - Quote
Jint Hikaru wrote:Now, if you are really trying to stop AFK cloaking, and not nerf all cloaks..... (because it sure seems like you simple want to nerf all cloaks), I propose the following.
Simply remove cloakers from local. And deny that cloaker local.
- Now cloaks are really cloaked.
- Now AFK Cloaking cannot cause any fear.
- Now active cloakers have to work for more intel or to find targets. (like decloak or use probes)
- Now system residents have to pay a little more attention to whats going on around them.
- Now (if done correctly) BOTs can be caught.
Yes, because removing CovOps cyno pilots from local when they're waiting to hotdrop, (mentioned argument is somewhat valid), a blob on people is good game mechanics. 
Maybe I was actually sleeping in front of my computer and dreamed I posted. Certainly, it's not there now. |
Buzzy Warstl
The Strontium Asylum
174
|
Posted - 2012.10.05 13:40:00 -
[7] - Quote
I propose a ban to AFK docking. People can hang out in a system in perfect safety and you never know when they are going to undock and shoot something! |
Panchatantra
Bunnie Slayers
Redrum Fleet
0
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Posted - 2012.10.05 14:40:00 -
[8] - Quote
Well if he is at his computer and happens to get decloaked - he can just re-cloak. No prober in the world can get him that fast.
And with the timer visible in local he can just plan his pos scouting a bit.
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Panchatantra
Bunnie Slayers
Redrum Fleet
0
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Posted - 2012.10.05 14:41:00 -
[9] - Quote
Jint Hikaru wrote:
You are doing the same thing an AFK cloaker is, making his presence known in the system without being at the computer.
.
No I am not  |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc
Mordus Angels
598
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Posted - 2012.10.05 14:45:00 -
[10] - Quote
It is not that cloaks should not change, but this stalemate effect is countering the free intel being given out by local.
We have right now, a case of: "I know you are there, but I cannot find you"
(Absolute presence awareness countered by absolute location concealment)
You cannot change one side without the other, and still have balance.
Too much focus on how to remove AFK cloaking. You are addressing a symptom of a problem, not the problem itself.
If you want to remove AFK cloaking's game impact, remove cloaked ships from displaying in local.
When this is done, it becomes reasonable to consider means to hunt cloaked vessels. NOT before this happens.
So long as people in a system magically know cloaked pilots are present with them, cloaked vessels should not be vulnerable to being hunted effectively.
Cloaking will be earned when cloaking awareness is earned. Balance must be maintained.
Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata)
Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
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Inquisitor Kitchner
Galaxy Punks
Executive Outcomes
112
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Posted - 2012.10.05 14:57:00 -
[11] - Quote
Nikk Narrel wrote:
If you want to remove AFK cloaking's game impact, remove cloaked ships from displaying in local.
Congratulations.
You just removed the problem of "AFK cloaking" and replaced it with a problem whereby you log on straight away after down time, cloak up for 8 hours totally AFK and wait till everyone is ratting/mining without knowing you're there and then you hot drop someone.
If someone is AFK cloaking just go to another system and the problem is solved.
There's no way around the other problem and would make cloaking way too powerful. Plus you could fit cloaking devices to normal ships, let some scout scout their way in for a 15 man gang then have your 100 ships decloaking and the gate and totally own them, then cloak up again.
Sometimes thinking about ideas first before blurting them out is good fun. |
HY RWO
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2012.10.05 15:21:00 -
[12] - Quote
Only thing AFK cloaking does is......... nothing. If someone is in your local don't rat/mine solo. Make a thing where more than one person is in the same place and can support other players (maybe you can call it a fleet). |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc
Mordus Angels
598
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Posted - 2012.10.05 15:23:00 -
[13] - Quote
Inquisitor Kitchner wrote:Nikk Narrel wrote:
If you want to remove AFK cloaking's game impact, remove cloaked ships from displaying in local.
Congratulations. You just removed the problem of "AFK cloaking" and replaced it with a problem whereby you log on straight away after down time, cloak up for 8 hours totally AFK and wait till everyone is ratting/mining without knowing you're there and then you hot drop someone. If someone is AFK cloaking just go to another system and the problem is solved. There's no way around the other problem and would make cloaking way too powerful. Plus you could fit cloaking devices to normal ships, let some scout scout their way in for a 15 man gang then have your 100 ships decloaking and the gate and totally own them, then cloak up again. Sometimes thinking about ideas first before blurting them out is good fun.
Can't tell if trolling or not.
Clearly, assuming you are serious, you have not been thinking about game balance if you are going to just hand out even more information on ships that supposedly are the hardest ones to find.
Let's take this from the top, shall we?
AFK Cloaking: They are not at their keyboard. To date, most weapons fired and cyno fields have been performed by players who are most definitely at their keyboard.
AFK Cloaking: This is a ship, (if we agree it is a covops cloak using variety), that has been balanced for use with a cloak. Again, no weapons fire is possible during the operation of the cloak, and many models have penalties involving time before targeting can even be attempted.
Those points established, let's go on to consider pilots who are periodically present, and currently hoping to numb system residents to their presence by having it as a constant item.
First of all, why are you paralyzed?
There is no license or guarantee that null sec residents will be able to freely PvE without threat of hostile intervention.
FIT A TANK. FORM FLEETS. WORK AS A TEAM.
I can see ships needing to be fitted for defense possibly being less than maximum yield, but this is not high security space.
If your corporation or alliance is unable or unwilling to secure your borders, then the burden of dealing with hostiles, cloaked or otherwise, falls upon you.
Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata)
Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
Elisa Fir
Luminoctis
29
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Posted - 2012.10.05 15:24:00 -
[14] - Quote
Grow some courage.
Whining about someone in local, who may or may not be AFK, is just a sign that you're not suited to live in either low or null-sec.
If said cloaker is AFK, he is no threat to you
if he is not AFK, he's could be a threat, but apparently not a concern to the complainers.
Somehow, the nerf-AFK-Cloaking whiners feel unsafe in null sec, because there are other playes around.
Guess what.. EVE Online is a Multiplayer game and you are not supposed to be safe anywhere, not even in high-sec, let alone null sec. |
Panchatantra
Bunnie Slayers
Redrum Fleet
2
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Posted - 2012.10.05 15:42:00 -
[15] - Quote
Its not whining- its opinion with a clear suggestion.
the opinion being that it should not be possible to have such an impact on other peoples gameplay while being afk- and that for 23h a day.
And I am specifically talking about a very limited chance to decloak someone in your own SOV so you can do something about it. |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc
Mordus Angels
598
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Posted - 2012.10.05 15:55:00 -
[16] - Quote
Panchatantra wrote:Its not whining- its opinion with a clear suggestion.
the opinion being that it should not be possible to have such an impact on other peoples gameplay while being afk- and that for 23h a day.
And I am specifically talking about a very limited chance to decloak someone in your own SOV so you can do something about it.
How did they get into your sov in the first place?
Where is your gate defense? Do you have a cyno jammer active? What about a defense fleet?
Please tell me you are not fitting max yield exhumers without proper support.
The possible presence, worst case, of a cyno ship backed by a large capable fleet... I presume this is your concern.
Think about the teamwork and effort needed to pull that off.
Now, feel free to try and convince me that you should not need to match that level of commitment and teamwork, at least by the fraction needed to defend against it.
No hot drop to kill a 400million ISK ship is going to risk more than that, especially if you have ready the means to threaten that.
Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata)
Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
443
|
Posted - 2012.10.05 16:09:00 -
[17] - Quote
Panchatantra wrote:Its not whining- its opinion with a clear suggestion.
the opinion being that it should not be possible to have such an impact on other peoples gameplay while being afk- and that for 23h a day.
And I am specifically talking about a very limited chance to decloak someone in your own SOV so you can do something about it.
nothing new with this, everything has been discussed 895824 times already, go read older threads instead of posting in this one. |
Jin alPatar
Entertainment 7wenty
1
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Posted - 2012.10.05 18:02:00 -
[18] - Quote
If we look at this In Game instead of IRL, it makes sense to let people AFK cloak.
Any cloaky scout that is spending extended trips in enemy territory would assumedly need to take a sleep break every once in a while. But the ship wouldn't disappear or stop cloaking when they go to sleep, would it?
It actually makes more sense this way than having a ship disappear when someone logs off.
Why not propose making all logged off pilots still show up in local? THIS idea makes more sense than yours. |
HY RWO
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2012.10.05 19:48:00 -
[19] - Quote
Panchatantra wrote:I am sorry to start a new thread but the ones I found were locked due to inactivity
What I propose is not a nerf on cloaking, but rather a nerf to AFK cloaking. No part of this game should be playable while gone from the keyboard for hours at a stretch- unless you are docked up.
This is what I am suggesting:
POS Module: Cloak Disrupt Pulse Array
Uses: Fuel X
Pulse: Every 5 min - timer visible in local CHANCE X on disrupting cloak (mitigated by cloaking skill)
Requirements: Soverignity X
Limitation: 1 per system, couple of hours fuel bay max.
Wouldnt this nerf anyone that is not AFK cloaked? |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc
Mordus Angels
601
|
Posted - 2012.10.05 20:00:00 -
[20] - Quote
HY RWO wrote:Panchatantra wrote:I am sorry to start a new thread but the ones I found were locked due to inactivity
What I propose is not a nerf on cloaking, but rather a nerf to AFK cloaking. No part of this game should be playable while gone from the keyboard for hours at a stretch- unless you are docked up.
This is what I am suggesting:
POS Module: Cloak Disrupt Pulse Array
Uses: Fuel X
Pulse: Every 5 min - timer visible in local CHANCE X on disrupting cloak (mitigated by cloaking skill)
Requirements: Soverignity X
Limitation: 1 per system, couple of hours fuel bay max.
Wouldnt this nerf anyone that is not AFK cloaked?
Absolutely.
If you had someone covertly staked out at a station, for example, waiting and watching for an enemy / bounty target / big ISK target, then they would be likely concerned with this.
After 5 minutes covertly overseeing a gate for passage intel, you might suddenly appear in targeting range with no warning. Worse, you might be inspired to warp away before the time limit.
Players seeking to avoid cloaked vessels would know to travel at the time of the publicly displayed pulse, as scouts would be possibly too busy with their own trouble to properly relay intel.
Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata)
Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
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Mr Floydy
The Xenodus Initiative.
Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
30
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Posted - 2012.10.05 20:11:00 -
[21] - Quote
Think the OP's idea is actually worse than most ideas in threads about removing AFK cloaking.
If a single cloaky in your system is stopping you 100 man corp you really need the sort your life out. HTFU... etc.
+1 to removing local ;) It's why wormholes are awesome! |
Panchatantra
Bunnie Slayers
Redrum Fleet
2
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Posted - 2012.10.05 20:24:00 -
[22] - Quote
Nikk Narrel wrote:Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK..
I fully support this, seriously!
+100
tbh I support removing cloakies from local and local from cloakies too- it would add some depth to the whole business instead.
Now I hope the people encouraging me to bring my suggestion here can at least like the thread or they can go to heck  |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc
Mordus Angels
602
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Posted - 2012.10.05 20:47:00 -
[23] - Quote
Panchatantra wrote:tbh I support removing cloakies from local and local from cloakies too- it would add some depth to the whole business instead. Now I hope the people encouraging me to bring my suggestion here can at least like the thread or they can go to heck
That has been suggested before, and in my opinion would be a sensible approach.
Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata)
Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
Alundil
Seniors Clan
Get Off My Lawn
165
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Posted - 2012.10.05 20:50:00 -
[24] - Quote
Removing local (wtf not this again picard.jpg) would resolve this issue.
No one knows who is in system, not you, not the cloaker (who may or may not be there, AFK or otherwise) and they don't know you're there either. Win Win.
If you get hot dropped - then by definition it was not an AFK cloaker who did this to you. In fact, the AFK cloaker is very likely still AFK having missed the hot drop and your juicy kill mail because.......they were AFK. |
Alx Warlord
Security Task Force
174
|
Posted - 2012.10.05 20:51:00 -
[25] - Quote
Panchatantra wrote:
This is what I am suggesting:
POS Module: Cloak Disrupt Pulse Array
Uses: Fuel X
Pulse: Every 5 min - timer visible in local CHANCE X on disrupting cloak (mitigated by cloaking skill)
Requirements: Soverignity X
Limitation: 1 per system, couple of hours fuel bay max.
I really liked your IDEA although:
I think that a CLOAK SYSTEM JAMMER would be more extreme and would work better, There should be benefits for the SOV owners.
Also, can you please post this sugestion, of this new pos function, on this tread on my signature? I think you will have a good chance that someone from CCP to see it there...( As I'm constantly anoying the CSM with it  )
[Discussion] - New POS system ( Construction Block Built - Starbasecraft) <<< Please CCP read this! |
Arduemont
Lords 0f Justice
Fidelas Constans
292
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Posted - 2012.10.05 23:29:00 -
[26] - Quote
Interesting fact. In the years of Eve online, no one has ever died to an AFK cloaker. |
Doddy
Excidium.
Executive Outcomes
249
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Posted - 2012.10.05 23:44:00 -
[27] - Quote
Panchatantra wrote:
Well if he is at his computer and happens to get decloaked - he can just re-cloak. No prober in the world can get him that fast.
And with the timer visible in local he can just plan his pos scouting a bit.
Right, and if he is slowboating 200k to get on a sniper or blind flying to an off gate safe, or waiting in a plex for a target or even just trying to work is way through bubble spam he gets decloaked and dies for no real reason despite being at the keyboard and fully active. |
Goldensaver
Vorbild Industries Inc.
State Section 9
18
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Posted - 2012.10.06 00:12:00 -
[28] - Quote
Arduemont wrote:Interesting fact. In the years of Eve online, no one has ever died to an AFK cloaker.
That's just absurd, don't you know they are one of the most potent hunters in New Eden? In fact, I've gotten so many kills just from not being at my keyboard while cloaked, that it's unbelievable. |
Mr Floydy
The Xenodus Initiative.
Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
31
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Posted - 2012.10.06 07:44:00 -
[29] - Quote
Goldensaver wrote:Arduemont wrote:Interesting fact. In the years of Eve online, no one has ever died to an AFK cloaker. That's just absurd, don't you know they are one of the most potent hunters in New Eden? In fact, I've gotten so many kills just from not being at my keyboard while cloaked, that it's unbelievable.
I need to try this, I'll skill up an alt in a covops and go sit in the OP's home system cloaked and watch my killboard grow :D |
Alx Warlord
Security Task Force
174
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Posted - 2012.10.06 08:13:00 -
[30] - Quote
Mr Floydy wrote:Goldensaver wrote:Arduemont wrote:Interesting fact. In the years of Eve online, no one has ever died to an AFK cloaker. That's just absurd, don't you know they are one of the most potent hunters in New Eden? In fact, I've gotten so many kills just from not being at my keyboard while cloaked, that it's unbelievable. I need to try this, I'll skill up an alt in a covops and go sit in the OP's home system cloaked and watch my killboard grow :D
Guys... stop trolling... you guys can understand preaty well that this is about that "Cloaked Covert Cyno ship with a player that have enough patience to w8 a week for an oportunity" can't you? The feature and Ideas Discussion is for people that want to discuss game issues, so I sugest that you read THIS before you keep ruining people effort....
[Discussion] - New POS system ( Construction Block Built - Starbasecraft) <<< Please CCP read this! |
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