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Carmen Priano
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Posted - 2005.03.23 22:50:00 -
[31]
Edited by: Carmen Priano on 23/03/2005 22:51:15
I'm sure, Selim, there'll be all manners of Gallente celebration when drone carriers and advanced-tech drones come into the game. 'Til then, well -- c'est la vie. I'm sure Ammarians and Matari will deal, as well.
(and thanks, Pottsey!)
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Zanthiuse
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Posted - 2005.03.23 23:11:00 -
[32]
i'm willing to bet that even with the grid bonus they will only be able to fit 2 or so cruise launchers, so it won't matter. Gallante will have 2 cruise and guns, caldari 2 cruise and light missles. Of course i havn't actually done the math...
____________________________
Waiting to cut out the deadwood.
Waiting to clean up the city.
Waiting to follow the worms. |
Selim
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Posted - 2005.03.23 23:19:00 -
[33]
Just because the caldari usually use more missiles than the rest doesn't mean that their bomber should have more, too.
To put this in perspective, lets say you have two cheapo car companies. One generally makes cheap sedans, the other one makes cheap SUVs. Now, one day they both decide to put forth a design for a luxury sedan. Why would the sedan maker put forth a superior car? Just because they usually make sedans doesn't mean the other company will not make one as good.
Caldari shouldnt have more missile launchers than the others. Why would amarr for example, not put mostly missiles on their MISSILE SHIP?
The argument that the other races all have their specialty - nonsense. These are tech 2 frigates and they're all supposed to be rougly balanced. It would make sense if these ships weren't entirely made for the launchers, but they are, and its total nonsense that the caldari one should obviously be superior at its intended role...
Besides, what on earth would the amarr and minmatar 'focus' in?
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Ithildin
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Posted - 2005.03.23 23:21:00 -
[34]
Oh great, look at that. They'll be good for a few until the Cruise Missiles start working as they should. Seriously, I'd expect some more missile slots on a bomber than a mere two, even from a Gallente ship.
Atleast they've got the resistance bonus that Assault ships should have (that is a bonus that isn't tied to ship skill)
--
If TC causes you discomfort that you feel is unwarranted or may be outside TC's current contract - contact me, please. |
Damocles Ician
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Posted - 2005.03.23 23:25:00 -
[35]
I notice that there's no reduction of CPU for covert ops cloaking devices.
On another note, will the reduction in grid for cruise launchers be 1000*(5*19.65%) or ((((1000-19.65%)-19.65%)-19.65%)-19.65%)-19.65%)
I'm really happy about the cloaked speed increase - that's nice :)
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Famine Aligher'ri
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Posted - 2005.03.23 23:25:00 -
[36]
 Originally by: Zanthiuse
i'm willing to bet that even with the grid bonus they will only be able to fit 2 or so cruise launchers, so it won't matter. Gallante will have 2 cruise and guns, caldari 2 cruise and light missles. Of course i havn't actually done the math...
Far as I know, Cloaking Devices are High Slots only? So "a Gun".
If they use jammers ect it might just be "2 Cruiser Missiles, A cloaking Device and Small NoS" for cap.
Famine Aligher'ri, of The Aligher'ri
-The Frig- |
Herugrim
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Posted - 2005.03.23 23:25:00 -
[37]
Of course they're just place holder stats on the bombers, but I hope they don't end up as just low-risk gank ships, lobbing cruise missiles from long distance. I'm imagining more of a WW2 style bomber that has to evade enemy fire before reaching its target, dropping its devastating payload, and getting out.
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Selim
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Posted - 2005.03.23 23:28:00 -
[38]
Edited by: Selim on 24/03/2005 00:05:10
Originally by: Damocles Ician
I notice that there's no reduction of CPU for covert ops cloaking devices.
On another note, will the reduction in grid for cruise launchers be 1000*(5*19.65%) or ((((1000-19.65%)-19.65%)-19.65%)-19.65%)-19.65%)
I'm really happy about the cloaked speed increase - that's nice :)
Cruise Launchers will use 17.5 grid, 13 on the caldari one.
It does suck that there is no CPU decrease for covert ops cloaks. Regular cloaks suck because they cant lock quick enough.
One other thing... even the caldari one does poo damage. I'd rather use a taranis, which is quicker, probably cheaper, more survivable and does more damage.
I expect to see that the Manticore will be the only one worth using due to what basically amounts to 50% more missile damage, and a much higher lock range. The other ones are crap because they only have 2 launchers, a useless bonus (gun bonus stupid on missile ship!). Not to ignore the fact that they need to fit 2 guns, thats alot of extra powergrid to be using. And the caldari one has a second powergrid reduction bonus which makes fitting 3 cruise launchers only minimally more difficult than fitting 2 on any others. If you actually had to fit 2 micro aux to fit 3 cruise launchers it would be understandable.
Its really a joke how they say that an extra small gun is equal to an extra large missile launcher... you'd need 3 tech 2 ballistic controls, which aren't out yet, to roughly equal the damage of the manticore, meanwhile it will have one lowslot and one midslot open that you do not (it needs one low for a micro aux).
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Zanthiuse
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Posted - 2005.03.23 23:50:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Selim
Edited by: Selim on 23/03/2005 23:29:07
Originally by: Damocles Ician
I notice that there's no reduction of CPU for covert ops cloaking devices.
On another note, will the reduction in grid for cruise launchers be 1000*(5*19.65%) or ((((1000-19.65%)-19.65%)-19.65%)-19.65%)-19.65%)
I'm really happy about the cloaked speed increase - that's nice :)
Cruise Launchers will use 17.5 grid, 13 on the caldari one.
It does suck that there is no CPU decrease for covert ops cloaks. Regular cloaks suck because they cant lock quick enough.
they are anti battleship, so maybe they shouldn't lock super fast? I don't think they should be shooting down frigs.
Also, i'd assume they don't use covert ops cloaks.
____________________________
Waiting to cut out the deadwood.
Waiting to clean up the city.
Waiting to follow the worms. |
meowcat
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Posted - 2005.03.24 00:01:00 -
[40]
Edited by: meowcat on 24/03/2005 00:03:12
re-releasing frigates that fire cruise missiles BEFORE doing missile agility is a really really bad idea IMHO.
they will be vulnerable to new EW with their crummy lock times (no covert ops cloak)
~~~~)\~~~~~\o/~~~~
yeah but no but yeah but no but |
Selim
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Posted - 2005.03.24 00:08:00 -
[41]
I was thinking, if cruise missiles were totally crap at killing frigs, then the 3 non caldari ones would be alot better due to their turrets, because they could fight frigates alot easier than the caldari one.
Then again, these things are fragile enough that a navitas could take one down if the cruise missiles didn't work on it...
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Grimpak
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Posted - 2005.03.24 00:24:00 -
[42]
...think even an impairor would be able to take them out....
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Quote:
Fragm's Oversized Ego Cannon barely scratches the forums, inflicting omgnoonecares damage
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Roy Focker
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Posted - 2005.03.24 00:49:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Zanthiuse
Originally by: Selim
Edited by: Selim on 23/03/2005 23:29:07
Originally by: Damocles Ician
I notice that there's no reduction of CPU for covert ops cloaking devices.
On another note, will the reduction in grid for cruise launchers be 1000*(5*19.65%) or ((((1000-19.65%)-19.65%)-19.65%)-19.65%)-19.65%)
I'm really happy about the cloaked speed increase - that's nice :)
Cruise Launchers will use 17.5 grid, 13 on the caldari one.
It does suck that there is no CPU decrease for covert ops cloaks. Regular cloaks suck because they cant lock quick enough.
they are anti battleship, so maybe they shouldn't lock super fast? I don't think they should be shooting down frigs.
Also, i'd assume they don't use covert ops cloaks.
You hit the nail right on the head. Bombers, should have longer lock times. Those longer lock times would ofcourse leave them vulnerable to attack.
I see this as a step towards have specific rolls instead of everyone fighting in battleships.
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I am not paying $15 a month to play a immature a-hole. |
Tairos Hakonnus
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Posted - 2005.03.24 01:14:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Jim Raynor
Minmatar Frigate Skill Bonus: 19.65% reduction in Cruise
Launcher powergrid needs and 5% bonus to Cruise Missile
kinetic damage per level
Minmatar frig skill is required to fly the Manticore?
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http://spla.sh/bp/bp_files/main.htm |
MOOstradamus
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Posted - 2005.03.24 01:28:00 -
[45]
/me begs / wishes for/ hopes / dreams / prays that one of his Research Agents will discover a Stealth Bomber BPO
MOOrovingian "Following & supporting EVE (since Jan 2001) is like wiping your arse with sandpaper."
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Sorja
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Posted - 2005.03.24 01:52:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Tairos Hakonnus
Originally by: Jim Raynor
Minmatar Frigate Skill Bonus: 19.65% reduction in Cruise
Launcher powergrid needs and 5% bonus to Cruise Missile
kinetic damage per level
Minmatar frig skill is required to fly the Manticore?
Either it's a bug (bad copy paste) or a hoax 
If those ships can't use a covert ops cloaking devices, how can they be faster cloaked than uncloaked?
There's a 75% speed penalty on the advanced cloaking tech II, isn't it?
Anyways, very interesting concept!
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ErrorS
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Posted - 2005.03.24 02:25:00 -
[47]
These seem alright, I'm a bit disapointed though.
I wanted bomb launchers. Lots of grid, but a skill bonus for the ship so they could use them.
Bombs are 50m3, launchers hold 100m3 and have a RoF of 60 seconds.
They do 1000damage a hit, have a top speed of 200m/s and a flight time of 30 seconds.
Cloaked Manticore comes in cloaked at near full speed, gets within 2000meters of a battleship, uncloaks and unloads a full payload of bombs. It would either die, or have to warp out. The battleship would be nearly crippled.
They should be slow, well tanked but easy to hit, they should have almost no penalty for moving speed while cloaked.
200m3 cargo so they can hold 4 extra bombs. But after 1 or 2 alpha strikes, they gotta dock or pick up more ammo.
Hell, even make them use torpedos with a 50% damage increase and -50% speed penalty with a special launcher that only holds a few.
Ultimate gank ship, but useless against frigates and cruisers.
________
I'm strict Caldari
"The grass is always greener on the other side" - Maybe they're not as uber as you think?
-ErrorS |
Armenilla
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Posted - 2005.03.24 03:10:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Tairos Hakonnus
Originally by: Jim Raynor
Minmatar Frigate Skill Bonus: 19.65% reduction in Cruise
Launcher powergrid needs and 5% bonus to Cruise Missile
kinetic damage per level
Minmatar frig skill is required to fly the Manticore?
This is most likely a placeholder value. Most ships, before they are released, tend to have completely wrong racial ship skills. The value in the database has probably not been initialized yet, but it has to be something, and minmatar happens to be the default. |
Glarion Garnier
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Posted - 2005.03.24 03:16:00 -
[49]
The nice part of these new ships is that now having the Electronics Upgrades skill to lvl 5 is quite handy. Will boost Covert OP frigate sales as a by product.
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VossKarr
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Posted - 2005.03.24 03:44:00 -
[50]
/emote checks the market for Arby cruise launchers and then makes a note to himself: "quick, get a couple of launchers before the selles got the wind of this!" 
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Tar Magen
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Posted - 2005.03.24 03:55:00 -
[51]
Edited by: Tar Magen on 24/03/2005 03:55:33
Originally by: Pottsey
Edited by: Pottsey on 23/03/2005 22:52:10
Only got time for 1 ship and as I like Gallente best here is the Nemesis
http://www.dissonance-corp.com/files/2005.03.23.22.40.52.jpg
As for the comments on everyone should have the same missile slots, as these are missiles ships, I donÆt agree. When we get drone ships I expect Gallente to have the most drone space and most bonuses same for missiles ships, Caldari should have the best missile ships or pure missiles ships. It makes sense to me that Gallente are not missile uses so I expect them to sneak in a few blasters. Balanced ships does not mean everyone has to be the same. One thing that does seem odd is these are the combat covert op ships yet they have less hull and shields then the scout covert op ships.
What is the "Ion Propulsion Strength" that appears in the bottom right corner of the screenshot?
Aut viam inveniam aut faciam. |
jbob2000
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Posted - 2005.03.24 04:03:00 -
[52]
just guessing here, but it might be the t2 components kicking in
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CANADIAN |
Cracken
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Posted - 2005.03.24 04:13:00 -
[53]
Edited by: *****en on 24/03/2005 04:20:54
Edited by: *****en on 24/03/2005 04:14:29
that appeared with the new ew changes. No clue what it means though.
also omg el crap resists on the nemisis it isn't going too survive long enough too get close with those resists. Either it needs 2 more lows or the resists bumped up a bit.
Also 2 cruise launchers uses up almost all the ummodified grid. hmmz 45 base grid would solve that problem though.
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Harry Voyager
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Posted - 2005.03.24 04:34:00 -
[54]
The Ion Propulsion strength is there because either Webs or Warp Scramblers are now Racial items. Might be both; I haven't really been keeping up on them.
Harry Voyager
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Letifer Deus
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Posted - 2005.03.24 05:26:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Zanthiuse
i'm willing to bet that even with the grid bonus they will only be able to fit 2 or so cruise launchers, so it won't matter. Gallante will have 2 cruise and guns, caldari 2 cruise and light missles. Of course i havn't actually done the math...
Manticore with lvl 3 covert ops and 2 micro aux can fit a T2 MWD and 3 cruise launchers. 
I am the OG PIIIIIMP |
Gierling
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Posted - 2005.03.24 05:33:00 -
[56]
Im sorry no, I don't want cruise missile launching stealth frigates to have uber resists as well.
Bastards we are lest Bastards we become. |
Famine Aligher'ri
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Posted - 2005.03.24 06:06:00 -
[57]
Yeah you do don't lie.
Famine Aligher'ri, of The Aligher'ri
-The Frig- |
Pottsey
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Posted - 2005.03.24 09:16:00 -
[58]
ôTo put this in perspective, lets say you have two cheapo car companies. One generally makes cheap sedans, the other one makes cheap SUVs. Now, one day they both decide to put forth a design for a luxury sedan. Why would the sedan maker put forth a superior car? Just because they usually make sedans doesn't mean the other company will not make one as good.ö
ThatÆs easy the Sedan builder has been making them longer so know more tricks of the trade and can fit more for the same cost due to what they learnt in the past. Look at real life cars two companies building the same type of car often have very different styles. BWM favour using back wheel drive while say Ford or Mitsubishi favour using front wheel drive.
Same for Eve Caldari favour missiles so fit more missiles and have the engineerÆs that know how. Gallant favour Blasters so they add the option of using blasters and bump up the powergrid as thatÆs there thing.
The person who specialises in something is almost always going build the better product and each company has its style which they always apply. The Gallant Bomber is built by the formost builders of blasters so it makes sense it has the tell tile signs of a blaster ship, extra powergrid, blaster turrets e.c.t
Look at real life bomber planes. Bomber A might be able to drop bombs only while Bomber B from another company has none bomb weapons added onto it.
_________________________________________________
Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source. |
NoNameNewbie
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Posted - 2005.03.24 10:25:00 -
[59]
wow ...
1 more useless Shipclass ...
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Damocles Ician
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Posted - 2005.03.24 10:40:00 -
[60]
stats might not be finalised yet
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