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WhatÆs the max/average DPS a cruiser can do?

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Pottsey	Posted - 2005.03.30 08:32:00 - [1] I just joined a corp only PvP tournament with a few rules. Rules -No Poding -No smart bombs due to being to easy to pod. -Biggest ship cruiser and no T2 cruisers. T2 frigates, mining barge and Industrials permitted. -No torpedoes which I thought was strange. Turns out the person in charge thinks they do splash damage and can easy pod someone. Torpedoes permitted if someone proves to him they donÆt splash and pod. -T2 modules permitted. -Tournament split into 2 one for low skill pilots and 1 for high skill pilots. My problem is I sort of skipped Cruisers in my pilot career and donÆt have a clue about the type of DPS other Cruiser's will deal to me or can tank. Could someone please give me a guide line of Cruiser average and max DPS excluding and including torpedoes? _________________________________________________ Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source.
Bad'Boy	Posted - 2005.03.30 08:33:00 - [2] well...thorax can do damage close to Deimos..but cant tank as good.. B.A.D.B.O.Y.: Biomechanical Android Designed for Battle and Online Yelling "Bad Boys,Bad Boys, what you gonna do, what you gonna do when WE come for yoU"
Elve Sorrow	Posted - 2005.03.30 08:42:00 - [3] To be honest, most tech2 frigs will own a Cruiser. Especially in a 1v1, id be going for an Assault frig. Torpedoes dont do splash damage, this was removed. Im unsure how you wanna stash a Siege Launcher on a cruiser tho? /Elve New Video out! Watch me!
Pottsey	Posted - 2005.03.30 08:46:00 - [4] Edited by: Pottsey on 30/03/2005 08:47:21 Thorax happens to be the ship I am using. So for no ones taken the shields down which is why I was wondering whatÆs the max DPS a Cruiser can do. Either I have an invincible ship V other cruisers or I got luckily in the first round of battles. I tend to lean towards lucky. But the next round will be a lot harder. So can Cruisers do 60 to 100DPS? ôTo be honest, most tech2 frigs will own a Cruiser. Especially in a 1v1, id be going for an Assault frig.ö My first match was against a Wolf Assault frig it couldnÆt get my shields below 90%. Tough little ship though with 92% base EM resistance but I thought its DPS was low. _________________________________________________ Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source.
Sangxianc	Posted - 2005.03.30 08:46:00 - [5] A Thorax is probably your best bet for DPS. Stick 3 or 4 damage mods and Ion Blaster IIs on it if you can use them. Then put Heavy Drones in the dronebay. - Any man's death diminishes me, as I am involved in mankinde; And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; It tolls for thee.
Seramis	Posted - 2005.03.30 08:46:00 - [6] If cruisers are the largest ship allowed then you can forget torpedos. Siege Launcher needs such a lot Power that you can't fit it to a cruiser (maybe u can but then u can forget all other equipment :-) ).
Bad'Boy	Posted - 2005.03.30 08:47:00 - [7] Originally by: Pottsey Thorax happens to be the ship I am using. So for no ones taken the shields down which is why I was wondering whatÆs the max DPS a Cruiser can do. Either I have an invincible ship V other cruisers or I got luckily in the first round of battles. I tend to lean towards lucky. But the next round will be a lot harder. So can Cruisers do 60 to 100DPS? thorax=around 320DPS(with 8 ogres drones) and maxed skills? B.A.D.B.O.Y.: Biomechanical Android Designed for Battle and Online Yelling "Bad Boys,Bad Boys, what you gonna do, what you gonna do when WE come for yoU"
Bad'Boy	Posted - 2005.03.30 08:48:00 - [8] btw, dont try to passive shield tank it B.A.D.B.O.Y.: Biomechanical Android Designed for Battle and Online Yelling "Bad Boys,Bad Boys, what you gonna do, what you gonna do when WE come for yoU"
Pottsey	Posted - 2005.03.30 08:49:00 - [9] Edited by: Pottsey on 30/03/2005 08:51:21 Thanks Bad'Boy thats usefull to know. ôbtw, dont try to passive shield tank itö To late :) The missiles ships seem to find it impossible to break. But I was worryed about a Blaster setup. _________________________________________________ Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source.
Dash Ripcock	Posted - 2005.03.30 08:59:00 - [10] Fit a Thorax with 5 Electron IIs and a bay full of Heavy Drones, and you're looking at massive DOT for a cruiser. I like the following: High 5 * Electron IIs Medium 1 * 10Mn MWD 1 * Scram (7.5Km) 1 * Web (85% plus) Low 1 * M Armour Rep II 3 * Hardeners (Kin/Therm/Exp) 1 * Cap Relay Drones 4 * Praetors (EM) 4 * Bezerkers (Exp) The damage-over-time is enormous, and you still have a decent armour-tank to boot. I know you like passive shield-tanking, but with a Thorax you might have to pass on this one! Battle Angels Inc - The Movie

Pottsey	Posted - 2005.03.30 09:08:00 - [11] ôI know you like passive shield-tanking, but with a Thorax you might have to pass on this one!ö I donÆt have much choice all my skills are built for passive tanking I cannot even use a Med Armour Rep II. Anyway my passive tank gets more then double the Hp/s back over that setup and I have a shield harder plus I can keep it going for ever. But you post gave me a brilliant guideline for what I will be going up against which is what I was looking for in this thread. Thanks for the help. _________________________________________________ Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source.
Raem Civrie	Posted - 2005.03.30 09:11:00 - [12] Don't use a med armor rep II on a thorax, go for a medium 'accomodation' vestment rep. Should cost around 4 million. Combine with blasters and MWD, and you should have a fair blasterboat. However, the thorax excels not at tanking but damage and versatility. With 8 heavy drones against frigates and heavy ion blasters versus cruisers, you should have a fair shot against other contestants.
Pottsey	Posted - 2005.03.30 09:15:00 - [13] What about EW defence? I was debating lowering my defence on my passive tank a little for some anti EW. I guess the Blaster setup you suggested forgets about target range reducing modules and just gets in close. _________________________________________________ Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source.
Bad'Boy	Posted - 2005.03.30 09:22:00 - [14] Edited by: Bad''Boy on 30/03/2005 09:23:39 Edited by: Bad''Boy on 30/03/2005 09:23:07 Originally by: Pottsey What about EW defence? I was debating lowering my defence on my passive tank a little for some anti EW. I guess the Blaster setup you suggested forgets about target range reducing modules and just gets in close. 8 ogres would pwn any BB in no time btw try this instead: high: 5Light neutron MED:MWD, 20km dist. web LOW:med armor rep II, 1600mm plate, 2xwarp stabs and PDU and 8 heavy drones cheap and good setup B.A.D.B.O.Y.: Biomechanical Android Designed for Battle and Online Yelling "Bad Boys,Bad Boys, what you gonna do, what you gonna do when WE come for yoU"
Pottsey	Posted - 2005.03.30 09:27:00 - [15] I forgot to say no warping out. So no need for warp scramblers or stabs. But thatÆs very tempting. If my tank badly fails this next match I will start training my skills for that ready for next event based on your setup but perhaps with an extra hardener. If 8 ogre truly can own a BB then I will skip on anti EW. With amour tanking is using 1 xxx% module to all amour resistance worth while? _________________________________________________ Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source.
Cinnander	Posted - 2005.03.30 09:52:00 - [16] Edited by: Cinnander on 30/03/2005 09:56:00 Edited by: Cinnander on 30/03/2005 09:54:56 If you can get 50k+ away from the guy Thorax with 5 x 250mm Railgun, (need 4 RCUs to use) lets you rain death down on people from like 60k away. Even better if you can use RCU IIs you can get 2 damage mods and a tracking enhancer in there too. Put a sensor booster and a couple damps into your mids and providing you can keep your range (abotu 25km even with antimatter) you can own them Also use 8 Wasps in your drone bay Alternately aim to tank like a muther, and let the drones do the work (emp+explosive 3:5 ratio, heavies) so put some nosses and a neut in your highs, you can zap them out of the sky and let the drones finish them off. Just plough into them, hit the zappers, release the drones (if you're on TS, shout "FLY MY PRETTIES, FLY!") and turn on the tank. Of course you'll need a couple cap mods in low (or any available highs), and perhaps a web to make it easier on your drones, and to make sure they dont escape. Once their cap dies, their hardeners go offline, they die fast. Oh and if you're against a BB, if you manage to zap his cap, he can't EM you, and if he does, the drones will aggro on him anyway.
Frank Horrigan	Posted - 2005.03.30 09:52:00 - [17] 1. whats the prize? 2. can i sign up? Originally by: Oveur Originally by: Bhaal What has turned out better than expected? Everything. Remember, we're from Iceland. (\_/) (O.o) (> <) This i
Shirei	Posted - 2005.03.30 10:09:00 - [18] Originally by: Bad'Boy high: 5Light neutron MED:MWD, 20km dist. web LOW:med armor rep II, 1600mm plate, 2xwarp stabs and PDU and 8 heavy drones cheap and good setup The only problem with this set-up is that it would run into major trouble against long range ceptors (e.g. Crow or Crusader orbiting at 15-20k) because heavy drones have major problems hitting unwebbed ceptors and you won't get in gun range. If you want to be able to counter those as well, you could try fitting medium pulse lasers instead of the frig neutrons. The thorax only has a damage bonus for cruiser hybrids anyway, so you're not even giving up any ship bonus. They do a little bit less damage than neutrons though, but have far superior range, so if you're up against another Thorax, you'd do best to try and keep him at range.
Dash Ripcock	Posted - 2005.03.30 10:34:00 - [19] Edited by: Dash Ripcock on 30/03/2005 10:38:15 Originally by: Raem Civrie Don't use a med armor rep II on a thorax, go for a medium 'accomodation' vestment rep. Should cost around 4 million. I'm not quite sure if I understand the reasoning behind this, bar the lack of skills to use a T2 Medium Repairer. From a completely statistical point of view, here's the run-down: M 'Accomodation' Vestmant Rep: 288 armour/160 cap = 1.8 armour points per cap M 'Accomodation' Vestmant Rep: 288 armour/12 seconds = 24 armour points per second M Armour Repairer II: 320 armour/160 cap = 2 armour points per cap M Armour Repairer II: 320 armour/12 seconds = 26.667 (3 d.p.) armour points per second The setup I stated above fits fine - I use it myself - and besides the rather minimal training needed to use a M Rep II (Repair Systems IV, Mechanic IV - both worthwhile skills in a Thorax), it's both more cap efficient, and repairs your armour faster. On top of that, they are readily available for 500K, whereas a named T1 item will set you back 4M - and that's if you can find it. Sounds rather expensive to me... Battle Angels Inc - The Movie
meowcat	Posted - 2005.03.30 10:53:00 - [20] Edited by: meowcat on 30/03/2005 10:53:49 my rax does about 240 dps with 5x Heavy electron II's and a couple of damage mods (excluding drone damage) i have Cruiser 5 and medium blaster spec 4 ~~~~)\~~~~~\o/~~~~ yeah but no but yeah but no but

Gunstar Zero	Posted - 2005.03.30 10:59:00 - [21] re DPS: I can squeeze ~ 150 DPS from my harpy. Torps haven't done splash damage in quite some time. The Thorax & it's oversized dronebay is going to be a pretty safe bet for this tourny.
Nanus Parkite	Posted - 2005.03.30 10:59:00 - [22] Accomodation repairers are significantly easier to fit than tech II equivalents.
Akaviri	Posted - 2005.03.30 11:04:00 - [23] Edited by: Akaviri on 30/03/2005 11:22:53 Edited by: Akaviri on 30/03/2005 11:15:07 Edited by: Akaviri on 30/03/2005 11:13:30 Originally by: Pottsey Could someone please give me a guide line of Cruiser average and max DPS excluding and including torpedoes? Here's what a Caracal can do: Heavy Missles do 150 dmg per hit. With Heavy Missles lvl 5 this is 1501.25=187.5 dmg. A Caracal with 5 Arbalest Heavy Launchers and 2 Ballistic Control I's and missle launcher operation V will have a rate of fire of 10.53 seconds. So the max dps a Caracal can do without resorting to super expensive bcu's (or fitting turrets) is 187.5 5 / 10.53 = 89 dmg/sec. Add about 15 dmg/sec for 2 medium drones and you get 104 dmg/sec It's harder for me to figure out the max skills figures for turrets, so this is just what I can do. My gunnery skills aren't anything special (1.1mil sp in gunnery and I can't use tech II guns) so the following are just typical setups. My Vexor can do 130 dmg/sec with 4x Medium Modal Electron Blasters (no damage mods) plus 108 dmg/sec from 15 medium drones for a total of 238 dmg/sec. My Thorax can do 199.74 dmg/sec with 5x Medium Modal Electron blasters and one Magnetic Stabilizer II. 8x Heavy Drones do an additional 154.86 dmg/sec. So a typical Thorax can do 354.6 dmg/sec. When fighting a Blackbird or another ship that might jam you, be sure to launch your drones before you even get locked. That way, if you get jammed they immediately attack his ship. Drones sometimes do stupid things like just sitting there if you launch them after you get jammed. Edit: I forgot the Caracal has a drone bay. Edited again: 4 medium drones don't fit in a 200m3 dronebay Edited yet again: I forgot about the damage bonus to missles from Ballistic Conrols. Caracal should do a little over 100 dmg/sec not including drones. ````````````` _ \|\_ ````````````` \` oo\ ````````_____/ =__Y= `````` /` `````` ) `_``` / ` , ``` \/\_.(\_/) ((____\| `` )_--\ \_-`(x.x) `------'`------` `--` (> <) Kitty pwns Bunny!
Demangel	Posted - 2005.03.30 11:19:00 - [24] Edited by: Demangel on 30/03/2005 11:21:07 If EW is going to be part of the picture, this is going to be ugly me thinks. If this is 1v1 I dunno, really it's going to come down to who fit what that round and pray you fit the papers, and he fit the rocks. But Thorax is a Damn overal fine ship for cruiser duels. Hell even with rails you can do some very very very nasty things. It's been a while for me and EW, but you can even try going for a limited EW setup of your own, two muiltispectrals should jamm anything cruiser sized IIRC. Leaving 1 slot for MWD, or mod of choice. Really tho as someone flying thorax's for a long time, the brute force method is great with this ship so long as you can hold the tank, keep the cap, and not get jammed (and even then your drones can do the talking) you should be ok. Tho I swore off shield tanking a LONG time ago. Too cap draining for a rax really. If you can't use medium armor reps there IS an alternative. Use two small ones, for the same cap but less fitting you can repair the same or more armor if named, if Tech II it's pretty nice. One setup that can be ok if your going tank heavy: High 5 Named small nuetrons (Or tech II if you can use em I guess). Mid 1 MWD 1 web (mod of choice, I sometimes go for a sensor dampner or cap recharger in the last mid, sometimes an AB, I don't think you need a scrambler right? so fit this to your pleasure, and maybe even an ace in the hole?). Low: 2X Best small rep you can fit (Tech II is best, but named will do). With tech II's you can repair hella fast for the same cap drain as 1 medium with less skills than a Tech II medium and far less fitting. 1 1500MM plate 2 Energized hardners (racial or adaptive, racial if you have a clue what your up against obviously) or damage mods or even CPR's (since your armor tanked the +20% from both these suckers is nice, and won't bother your shields). Or you can go extreme damage 5 heavy blasters (whatever fits, can fit an ion or three with care). 1 MWD 1 web 1 Cap boosting oriented module (either faster charge or an injector, you won't be doing much looting so the injector might be good here? god it's been a while LOL). either 1 medium rep, 2 small, and the rest either damage mods or racial/adaptive hardners (all energized.). That will cook most cruisers in no time flat assuming you catch em. You could also do something unexpected and go for a mid/long range oriented setup. Most folks will likely suspect you to use a blaster setup, and might fit things to make doing that near impossible. I know I would try heheh. So maybe go for like 2-3 250MM's or more, and fill the rest with dual 150's or 200s and try to get all your guns to hit the same optimal at around 20KM or so. an OLD setup I USED to use was 2x 250MM's and 3 dual 150MM's the 150's were good cuz they could hit a close range cruiser pretty well if need be, but could easily have an optimal of 20KM. With such a setup your not going to be using all AM ammo. More like Iridium and I think uranium? Iridium in the shorter range ones, uranium in the 250's IIRC. Next you gotta count on you mids for something other than MWD and webbing. An AB is a good bet here or a MWD if you got max cruiser skill. Low slots are a mixed bag, but tanking would be important OR fit 3 8 point multispectrals, as many guns as you can cram on, (remember as always you don't need to tackle in duels! you can use those mids for EW if you like! or even passive shield tanking galore!). The lows with cap stuff to help with EW and gun drain. Anyway much of the latter part of this post was old theory that used to do pretty ok in some corp duels I fought and wasn't "allowed" to blasterax myself. Galaxion > If you drove a car shaped like a thorax women would call you Demangel > Dude... I would call.. Demangel > wait that sounded g@y I bet. Galaxion > Just a bit.
Arthur Guinness	Posted - 2005.03.30 11:42:00 - [25] what retard mentioned torps when talking about cruiser duels? you still playing Gemini?
Chode Rizoum	Posted - 2005.03.30 11:51:00 - [26] NOS vexor.. will beat any cruiser Centuria > whoot? Centuria > you stalking me? :) -- Nafri > then I a bird pooed on my head AND ON MY MEAL -- http://www.subroc.net/teddybears/
lythos miralbar	Posted - 2005.03.30 11:51:00 - [27] errrm.. just a sugestion.. There is no mention of EW being banned, so why not get a blackbird, stick 4 multi specs on it ( plus webber and maybe mwd ) and you can jam anything you will come up against..?? stick some heavy launchers in the highs and a nos, and you can vary your dammage to your target.. just a thought
Demangel	Posted - 2005.03.30 11:59:00 - [28] Originally by: lythos miralbar errrm.. just a sugestion.. There is no mention of EW being banned, so why not get a blackbird, stick 4 multi specs on it ( plus webber and maybe mwd ) and you can jam anything you will come up against..?? stick some heavy launchers in the highs and a nos, and you can vary your dammage to your target.. just a thought Amen if EW isn't banned I have a suspicion that it's going to be a BB pilot that wins this thing. Drone boat being a close second maybe (nos Vexor can be a pain in the tuckus "HAHAH I got you now vexor boy! I'm at blaster range and... Uhm... Crap? I can't shoot or... Uhm... CRAP... CRAP... CRAP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Kill mail reads: you where killed by drones, have a nice day and thank you for playing EVE). Don't laugh, not long after Vexor got it's buffage and i didn't know about it, I lost my sexy thorax to one, I had no idea all those drones where on me or where they where coming from... Bah... It sucked... (hangs head in shame). Galaxion > If you drove a car shaped like a thorax women would call you Demangel > Dude... I would call.. Demangel > wait that sounded g@y I bet. Galaxion > Just a bit.
Dash Ripcock	Posted - 2005.03.30 12:07:00 - [29] Originally by: Nanus Parkite Accomodation repairers are significantly easier to fit than tech II equivalents. Granted, but if you have the room to fit one, and are trained in using them, there should be nothing stopping you from using them! As mentioned, a Vexor with a nosferatu/tank setup will perform very well, as will a Blackbird - the only problem with the latter being drones. Blackbirds aren't tough, and don't kick out a whole lot of damage either - if someone else is piloting a drone ship like a Thorax or Vexor, and can tank your damage - you're in trouble. Battle Angels Inc - The Movie
Reite	Posted - 2005.03.30 12:32:00 - [30] Originally by: Elve Sorrow To be honest, most tech2 frigs will own a Cruiser. Especially in a 1v1, id be going for an Assault frig. Torpedoes dont do splash damage, this was removed. Im unsure how you wanna stash a Siege Launcher on a cruiser tho? I dont agree, a good cruiser pilot will kill a good assault frig pilot.



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