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John Blackthorn	Posted - 2005.03.30 20:19:00 - [1] This is not a rant but rather a concern. The latest patch has removed both of the current scorpian bounus of 5% more shields and 5% missle velocity bonuses. Replaced with a % increase for ecm and % increaes in ecm optimal range. ---------------- I guess this is what ccp had ment this ship to be in the first place but this change really changes how the scorp can be used in the future. Personally I liked to npc with my scorp. With these changes I loose shields and the ability to range the npc's at a further distance. I normaly range the npc's and by the time they get to me (npc battleships) I can still take them out. The new bonuses of ecm will do nothing to help with npc hunting. Removing old bonuses actually make it more difficult for me tank and range. ----------------- If the ecm bonus is to stay then I suggest: A slight shield cap increase. Baisicly somewhere between where it is now and what the raven's base shield cap is. and adding one low slot or one high slot (still keep the setup 4 missel launchers, 4 turrets). Of course I wouldn't mind another missle slot either :) but that may be to much. -BT
John Blackthorn Foundation Gemini Federation	Posted - 2005.03.30 20:19:00 - [2] This is not a rant but rather a concern. The latest patch has removed both of the current scorpian bounus of 5% more shields and 5% missle velocity bonuses. Replaced with a % increase for ecm and % increaes in ecm optimal range. ---------------- I guess this is what ccp had ment this ship to be in the first place but this change really changes how the scorp can be used in the future. Personally I liked to npc with my scorp. With these changes I loose shields and the ability to range the npc's at a further distance. I normaly range the npc's and by the time they get to me (npc battleships) I can still take them out. The new bonuses of ecm will do nothing to help with npc hunting. Removing old bonuses actually make it more difficult for me tank and range. ----------------- If the ecm bonus is to stay then I suggest: A slight shield cap increase. Baisicly somewhere between where it is now and what the raven's base shield cap is. and adding one low slot or one high slot (still keep the setup 4 missel launchers, 4 turrets). Of course I wouldn't mind another missle slot either :) but that may be to much. -BT
xOm3gAx	Posted - 2005.03.30 20:43:00 - [3] sell the scorp get a raven imo the scorp should be either; a) a gunboat like the old days with rail bonus's b) a 100% ew boat like it is currently meant to be and as long as the raven doesnt become a gunboat ill be happy =P though i do think it would be nice to have the scorp as an ew/gunboat kinda mix the bonus's up a little bit ----------------- Decloaks and starts blasting your sig Applesauce Biotch ~~~My Banner got nerfed~~~ But I still love the mods anyway Succumb to your nightmares Darkness shall embrace you
xOm3gAx Caldari	Posted - 2005.03.30 20:43:00 - [4] sell the scorp get a raven imo the scorp should be either; a) a gunboat like the old days with rail bonus's b) a 100% ew boat like it is currently meant to be and as long as the raven doesnt become a gunboat ill be happy =P though i do think it would be nice to have the scorp as an ew/gunboat kinda mix the bonus's up a little bit ---------------------------------------- http://www.oldnumber7.com/forumpic.gif Please ensure your signature is 24,000 bytes or less - Udat
Soulis	Posted - 2005.03.30 20:45:00 - [5] i remember reading about being able to use ew on the npc's. surely when this comes into effect you will be pleased
Soulis Shinra Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2005.03.30 20:45:00 - [6] i remember reading about being able to use ew on the npc's. surely when this comes into effect you will be pleased Shinra - The Good Guys
Weston McArthur	Posted - 2005.03.30 21:57:00 - [7] Originally by: Soulis i remember reading about being able to use ew on the npc's. surely when this comes into effect you will be pleased Even if EW starts working on NPCs, it will do nothing for the swarms you find in higher-end bship spawns, or lvl3/4 missions. Not that I really care either way. Between Caldari and Amarr bships I'm sure I'll find something useful, even after everything is nerfed into proportion.
Weston McArthur The Trident Dominion Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2005.03.30 21:57:00 - [8] Originally by: Soulis i remember reading about being able to use ew on the npc's. surely when this comes into effect you will be pleased Even if EW starts working on NPCs, it will do nothing for the swarms you find in higher-end bship spawns, or lvl3/4 missions. Not that I really care either way. Between Caldari and Amarr bships I'm sure I'll find something useful, even after everything is nerfed into proportion.
YukFooo	Posted - 2005.03.31 23:25:00 - [9] Yay, more slots for the Scorp? A tier 1 bs? It ONLY has 37 mid slots ffs
YukFooo	Posted - 2005.03.31 23:25:00 - [10] Yay, more slots for the Scorp? A tier 1 bs? It ONLY has 37 mid slots ffs
xOm3gAx	Posted - 2005.04.01 00:36:00 - [11] back in earlier castor days you could use ew on NPC's ----------------- Decloaks and starts blasting your sig Applesauce Biotch ~~~My Banner got nerfed~~~ But I still love the mods anyway Succumb to your nightmares Darkness shall embrace you
xOm3gAx Caldari	Posted - 2005.04.01 00:36:00 - [12] back in earlier castor days you could use ew on NPC's ---------------------------------------- http://www.oldnumber7.com/forumpic.gif Please ensure your signature is 24,000 bytes or less - Udat
Harakiri	Posted - 2005.04.01 07:20:00 - [13] /Nitpick mode ON Whats an Scorpian? Read after me > S C O R P I O N ... !! .. ok , one more time S C O R P I O N /Nitpick mode OFF Just venting some steam
Harakiri Amarr	Posted - 2005.04.01 07:20:00 - [14] /Nitpick mode ON Whats an Scorpian? Read after me > S C O R P I O N ... !! .. ok , one more time S C O R P I O N /Nitpick mode OFF Just venting some steam
Sinister Spy	Posted - 2005.04.01 15:02:00 - [15] Originally by: YukFooo Yay, more slots for the Scorp? A tier 1 bs? It ONLY has 37 mid slots ffs Scorpion has 8 mid slots. It lacks on firepower, so it's strength is supposed to be EW. But the way EW is going, many people might be selling their scorps when the patch hits
Sinister Spy	Posted - 2005.04.01 15:02:00 - [16] Originally by: YukFooo Yay, more slots for the Scorp? A tier 1 bs? It ONLY has 37 mid slots ffs Scorpion has 8 mid slots. It lacks on firepower, so it's strength is supposed to be EW. But the way EW is going, many people might be selling their scorps when the patch hits
Piscis	Posted - 2005.04.01 15:21:00 - [17] Originally by: Harakiri /Nitpick mode ON Whats an Scorpian? Read after me > S C O R P I O N ... !! .. ok , one more time S C O R P I O N /Nitpick mode OFF Just venting some steam /nitpick mode ON "Whats an Scorpian?"?? Does Scorpion start with a vowel? no. Is it an abreviation? no. then it should be "Whats a Scorpian?" then surely... /nitpick mode OFF
Piscis Gallente	Posted - 2005.04.01 15:21:00 - [18] Originally by: Harakiri /Nitpick mode ON Whats an Scorpian? Read after me > S C O R P I O N ... !! .. ok , one more time S C O R P I O N /Nitpick mode OFF Just venting some steam /nitpick mode ON "Whats an Scorpian?"?? Does Scorpion start with a vowel? no. Is it an abreviation? no. then it should be "Whats a Scorpian?" then surely... /nitpick mode OFF [URL=http://imageshack.us][/URL]
Harakiri	Posted - 2005.04.01 16:11:00 - [19] Originally by: Piscis Originally by: Harakiri /Nitpick mode ON Whats an Scorpian? Read after me > S C O R P I O N ... !! .. ok , one more time S C O R P I O N /Nitpick mode OFF Just venting some steam /nitpick mode ON "Whats an Scorpian?"?? Does Scorpion start with a vowel? no. Is it an abreviation? no. then it should be "Whats a Scorpian?" then surely... /nitpick mode OFF Sorry , english isnt my native language so i cannot live up to your standards of english , however even I take offence in so many people renaming a ship ...
Harakiri Amarr	Posted - 2005.04.01 16:11:00 - [20] Originally by: Piscis Originally by: Harakiri /Nitpick mode ON Whats an Scorpian? Read after me > S C O R P I O N ... !! .. ok , one more time S C O R P I O N /Nitpick mode OFF Just venting some steam /nitpick mode ON "Whats an Scorpian?"?? Does Scorpion start with a vowel? no. Is it an abreviation? no. then it should be "Whats a Scorpian?" then surely... /nitpick mode OFF Sorry , english isnt my native language so i cannot live up to your standards of english , however even I take offence in so many people renaming a ship ...
Magunus	Posted - 2005.04.01 19:53:00 - [21] Originally by: Soulis i remember reading about being able to use ew on the npc's. surely when this comes into effect you will be pleased It's supposed to be in this patch... Last bullet in the first paragraph: NPCÆs can now be target jammed (ECM) like other players Don't know how that's going to work against hoards of rats, but I guess if you just use ECM on the rats most likely to do significant damage, it'd work out ok. --- In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. -- Douglas Adams, 'The Restaurant at the End of the Universe'
Magunus The Forsakened Few	Posted - 2005.04.01 19:53:00 - [22] Originally by: Soulis i remember reading about being able to use ew on the npc's. surely when this comes into effect you will be pleased It's supposed to be in this patch... Last bullet in the first paragraph: NPCÆs can now be target jammed (ECM) like other players Don't know how that's going to work against hoards of rats, but I guess if you just use ECM on the rats most likely to do significant damage, it'd work out ok. --- In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. -- Douglas Adams, 'The Restaurant at the End of the Universe'
Cummilla	Posted - 2005.04.01 22:49:00 - [23] I think it's very safe to say that there will be an extremely strong surge is "pre-owned" Scorps come patch time lol
Cummilla	Posted - 2005.04.01 22:49:00 - [24] I think it's very safe to say that there will be an extremely strong surge is "pre-owned" Scorps come patch time lol
Darkwolf	Posted - 2005.04.02 00:28:00 - [25] The Scorpion hasn't gotten weaker at all. Rather, now that ECM works on NPCs, you don't NEED that 20% extra shields, since you can hold off the damage with jammers. I've been trying it out. ECM working on NPCs is something I've been waiting for, for nearly two years now. Bravo for CCP!
Darkwolf Caldari	Posted - 2005.04.02 00:28:00 - [26] The Scorpion hasn't gotten weaker at all. Rather, now that ECM works on NPCs, you don't NEED that 20% extra shields, since you can hold off the damage with jammers. I've been trying it out. ECM working on NPCs is something I've been waiting for, for nearly two years now. Bravo for CCP!
John Blackthorn	Posted - 2005.04.02 01:59:00 - [27] You will not abe able to ecm enough npc's before they outdamage the scorp in npc fights... for that matter pvp it will be even weeker. I think when I checked ealier today by shield was like 5500 with no extenders.
John Blackthorn Foundation Gemini Federation	Posted - 2005.04.02 01:59:00 - [28] You will not abe able to ecm enough npc's before they outdamage the scorp in npc fights... for that matter pvp it will be even weeker. I think when I checked ealier today by shield was like 5500 with no extenders.
Darkwolf	Posted - 2005.04.02 02:14:00 - [29] Edited by: Darkwolf on 02/04/2005 02:37:53 Originally by: John Blackthorn You will not abe able to ecm enough npc's before they outdamage the scorp in npc fights... for that matter pvp it will be even weeker. I think when I checked ealier today by shield was like 5500 with no extenders. Uh huh. Then tell me how I managed to kill a 1x500k BS + 4x110k cruiser spawn on Sisi just then, in an armour tanked Dominix... Using just drones... And without shields getting below half (and only because I messed up)? (trying to find a twin bs spawn in my Scorp right now, actually). edit: Downed a 750k bs + 4x100k cruiser spawn, shields never dipped below 95%, didn't use drones, didn't use shield booster, in a scorp.
Darkwolf Caldari	Posted - 2005.04.02 02:14:00 - [30] Edited by: Darkwolf on 02/04/2005 02:37:53 Originally by: John Blackthorn You will not abe able to ecm enough npc's before they outdamage the scorp in npc fights... for that matter pvp it will be even weeker. I think when I checked ealier today by shield was like 5500 with no extenders. Uh huh. Then tell me how I managed to kill a 1x500k BS + 4x110k cruiser spawn on Sisi just then, in an armour tanked Dominix... Using just drones... And without shields getting below half (and only because I messed up)? (trying to find a twin bs spawn in my Scorp right now, actually). edit: Downed a 750k bs + 4x100k cruiser spawn, shields never dipped below 95%, didn't use drones, didn't use shield booster, in a scorp.
Naal Morno	Posted - 2005.04.02 06:39:00 - [31] 1. Shield bonus means exactly NOTHING. It is just a little more buffer before you go down if you can't sustain tank. 2. If you're tanking, your damage vs regen is what determines if you're winning or about to die. This DID NOT change. 3. Now you can jam NPC. USE FREAKING Jammers+ECCM Burst and I bet you can disable lots of NPCs this way, both away and en masse up close... There is totally nothing to complain. Scorpion is the only ship getting meaningful bonus from all ships this patch after all... And if you don't like it, buy raven. After this one gets nerf, train other race like most old players did anyway... Your Heavy Neutron Blaster II perfectly strikes Serpentis Chief Sentinel, wrecking for 660.4 damage.
Naal Morno ECP Rogues Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2005.04.02 06:39:00 - [32] 1. Shield bonus means exactly NOTHING. It is just a little more buffer before you go down if you can't sustain tank. 2. If you're tanking, your damage vs regen is what determines if you're winning or about to die. This DID NOT change. 3. Now you can jam NPC. USE FREAKING Jammers+ECCM Burst and I bet you can disable lots of NPCs this way, both away and en masse up close... There is totally nothing to complain. Scorpion is the only ship getting meaningful bonus from all ships this patch after all... And if you don't like it, buy raven. After this one gets nerf, train other race like most old players did anyway... _________________________________________ The cloaky orchestrator
Pottsey	Posted - 2005.04.02 15:48:00 - [33] "1. Shield bonus means exactly NOTHING. It is just a little more buffer before you go down if you can't sustain tank." ThatÆs not true the scorp was one of the best passive shield tankÆs against NPC as the higher the shield cap the more shield hitpoints you get back a second. Even if you donÆt passive tank but active you still lose out on Hp/s regen. The scorp could with a passive tank get over 125 to 135 shield hp/s. ThatÆs 625 to 675hp over 5 seconds. ThatÆs more then an Extra Large T2 shield booster with 0 cap drain. Now you dont get anywhere near that amount. ô2. If you're tanking, your damage vs regen is what determines if you're winning or about to die. This DID NOT change.ö As above losing 25% shields lowers you hp regen a lot even if you active tank. _________________________________________________ Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source.
Pottsey Gallente	Posted - 2005.04.02 15:48:00 - [34] "1. Shield bonus means exactly NOTHING. It is just a little more buffer before you go down if you can't sustain tank." ThatÆs not true the scorp was one of the best passive shield tankÆs against NPC as the higher the shield cap the more shield hitpoints you get back a second. Even if you donÆt passive tank but active you still lose out on Hp/s regen. The scorp could with a passive tank get over 125 to 135 shield hp/s. ThatÆs 625 to 675hp over 5 seconds. ThatÆs more then an Extra Large T2 shield booster with 0 cap drain. Now you dont get anywhere near that amount. ô2. If you're tanking, your damage vs regen is what determines if you're winning or about to die. This DID NOT change.ö As above losing 25% shields lowers you hp regen a lot even if you active tank. Passive shield tanking guide, click here.
Sky Hunter	Posted - 2005.04.02 21:54:00 - [35] Congrats on ruining one of best ships. Now without 10% missle and 5% shield Scorp can be trashed by all who dont use it in fleets. No way you gonna kill anything with 750m/s torp or 1600m/s CM. If those who say that +5% shield is nothing, i advice to train Caldari BS to lvl 5. How about +25% shields? Dont forget shield managment skill with also +5%? How about total of 50%? And how about now we get a more paper Scorpion that more weaker without bonuses and now cant even fly solo! Hell if such ship meet any BS that is out of jam range or got counter-jamming modules. Scorp dead. /me congratulates again on ruining one of my favourite ships in game. -=-
Sky Hunter Rage and Terror	Posted - 2005.04.02 21:54:00 - [36] Congrats on ruining one of best ships. Now without 10% missle and 5% shield Scorp can be trashed by all who dont use it in fleets. No way you gonna kill anything with 750m/s torp or 1600m/s CM. If those who say that +5% shield is nothing, i advice to train Caldari BS to lvl 5. How about +25% shields? Dont forget shield managment skill with also +5%? How about total of 50%? And how about now we get a more paper Scorpion that more weaker without bonuses and now cant even fly solo! Hell if such ship meet any BS that is out of jam range or got counter-jamming modules. Scorp dead. /me congratulates again on ruining one of my favourite ships in game. -=-
Pottsey	Posted - 2005.04.02 22:13:00 - [37] ôHow about +25% shields? Dont forget shield managment skill with also +5%? How about total of 50%?ö DonÆt forget another 10% from Escort Tactics when in groups and the cheap 600k implants with + to shield cap and shield recharge. You could forget about tanking and relay on shear hitpoints with T2 large shield extenders added on top of all that. _________________________________________________ Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source.
Pottsey Gallente	Posted - 2005.04.02 22:13:00 - [38] ôHow about +25% shields? Dont forget shield managment skill with also +5%? How about total of 50%?ö DonÆt forget another 10% from Escort Tactics when in groups and the cheap 600k implants with + to shield cap and shield recharge. You could forget about tanking and relay on shear hitpoints with T2 large shield extenders added on top of all that. Passive shield tanking guide, click here.
Sky Hunter	Posted - 2005.04.03 09:00:00 - [39] well im not so into shield tank much :) But still, changing scorp bonuses means "fleet only" title for it. Very disappointed. I liked Scorp as a Tier I BS for solo pvp/small scale NPC ops -=-
Sky Hunter Rage and Terror	Posted - 2005.04.03 09:00:00 - [40] well im not so into shield tank much :) But still, changing scorp bonuses means "fleet only" title for it. Very disappointed. I liked Scorp as a Tier I BS for solo pvp/small scale NPC ops -=-
Darkwolf Caldari	Posted - 2005.04.03 22:05:00 - [41] Edited by: Darkwolf on 03/04/2005 22:08:20 Originally by: Sky Hunter well im not so into shield tank much :) But still, changing scorp bonuses means "fleet only" title for it. Very disappointed. I liked Scorp as a Tier I BS for solo pvp/small scale NPC ops Explain how you figure that? Four jammers on one target = target is jammed about 96% of the time. Five jammers on one target = target is jammed something like 98% of the time. That's with racial jammers. With multispecs, it's more like 81% with 4 jammers. Sounds pretty good for solo pvp. And for NPC operations, you can now jam NPCs. Make of this what you will. Frankly, I'm amazed at the vast hordes of people who are crawling out of the woodwork, complaining about a) the ew changes, b) the removal of two pretty crappy bonuses, and having them replaced with two pretty good bonuses. In general, without actually trying the changes on Sisi at all. Try it for yourself.
Elissa	Posted - 2006.07.23 08:26:00 - [42] Whens the last time you fought 1 NPC? In my missions, I'm usually dealing with 1-4 BS, 8-15 Cruisers and numerous frigates at once. Please tell me how ECM is going to help you in this situation.

Mephysto	Posted - 2006.07.23 11:11:00 - [43] Thread Necromancy is Bad!


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