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Fortior
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Posted - 2005.04.08 12:52:00 -
[1]
Most people would agree that instas are a problem that needs fixing. I came up with a very easy solution (I apologize if someone else has already written about it) during the slow hours at work.
I propose that a timer is used when jumping, and that gates use a similar command as stations (instead of "dock", "jump". d'uh  ). That would make instas useless while not affecting normal jumps. Let me explain.
From the moment you choose "jump", a timer is initiated. Player A warps in at the regular 15 km, issues "jump" and the timer starts counting down X seconds before Player A is cleared for jumping. Player B jumps in 10 m from the gate and issues "jump" but has to wait X seconds before jumping. Player A's timer would be finished by the time he gets to the gate and can jump when in range. Player B's timer would still count down despite him being in range, and thus has to wait before it's finished before jumping.
Now, please, this is a small idea so turn down the flaming 
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.04.08 12:55:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: Fortior
Most people would agree that instas are a problem
Nope.
And post suggestions in the suggestion forum.
"As far as I can tell, It doesn't matter who you are, If you can believe there's something worth fighting for " - Garbage, "Parade" |
Joshua Foiritain
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Posted - 2005.04.08 12:57:00 -
[3]
So you want to to force people to wait at every gate?
Imo id rather see the eve universe changed so people dont have to travel as much before attempting to remove instas.
Encouraging regionalization for the market and allowing people to colonizce 0.0 will allow them to place things they need closer to where they live.
I'm not gonna waste an hour a day travelling to nearest hub to buy stuff without instas... 
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[Coreli Corporation Mainframe] |
cristari
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:00:00 -
[4]
Is it possible that we all stop talking about changing insta's
There is nothing wrong with them as they are, the only ppl complaining about them are gate camping pirates!!
GET A LIFE!!! |
Valentine Keen
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:00:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Joshua Foiritain
So you want to to force people to wait at every gate?
Imo id rather see the eve universe changed so people dont have to travel as much before attempting to remove instas.
Encouraging regionalization for the market and allowing people to colonizce 0.0 will allow them to place things they need closer to where they live.
I'm not gonna waste an hour a day travelling to nearest hub to buy stuff without instas...
This is the opinion I've recently reached as well - removal for travel IF there's infrastructure and design to encourage more local markets. Then we get a big universe, many more opportunities for business, trade even combat will smaller localised corps taking up the roles.
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Verone
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:01:00 -
[6]
here we go again
COME AND SOCIALISE WITH US NASTY SNIGG BASTARDS AT : WWW.SNIGG.CJB.NET |
Carinae
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:02:00 -
[7]
How about entering a 'Reliability' factor into insta jumps.
Smaller ships (Up to Frigate) insta warping hit the 'target' spot on
Med Ships (Cruisers / Destroyers) insta warping can land up to 2000m away
Large ships (Battle ships / Industrials) insta warping land up to 5000m away
This can be explained due to greater inertia and momentum !
As the larger ships will be needing their support ships, there will be a reason for the smaller ships not to jump, but wait and support their larger partners
Warrior of the Ushra'Khan
Death to slavery |
Fortior
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:08:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Maya Rkell
Originally by: Fortior
Most people would agree that instas are a problem
Nope.
And post suggestions in the suggestion forum.
Well, seeing how people keep asking the devs about it, I'd rate it as a problem.
Yes, I should've posted it there, but this gets more attention and thus feedback.
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cristari
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:14:00 -
[9]
Edited by: cristari on 08/04/2005 13:13:46
Can a GM or Forum Moderator put a block on all forum topics mentioning bm's, instajumps, instadocks, etc. . .
I am getting tierd of reading about them!!!!!
PLEASE!!!!!!
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Fortior
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:16:00 -
[10]
Hah, well, since Verone put it so eloquently, please drop this thread
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Shin Ra
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:16:00 -
[11]
Instas are fine, why do you have a problem with them?
-----------------------------------------
Heinky> Dont mix eve with rl it can be bad for your health |
Fortior
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:19:00 -
[12]
Honestly, *I* don't have a problem with them, people around seem to however. I have yet to experience a day without people in local complaining about it.
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cristari
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:20:00 -
[13]
Edited by: cristari on 08/04/2005 13:20:39
I have a solution!!
STOP READING LOCAL!!!
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Issac hunt
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:31:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Fortior
Originally by: Maya Rkell
Originally by: Fortior
Most people would agree that instas are a problem
Nope.
And post suggestions in the suggestion forum.
Well, seeing how people keep asking the devs about it, I'd rate it as a problem.
Yes, I should've posted it there, but this gets more attention and thus feedback.
Its a small bunch of whiners, who drag this subject up time and time again in a pathetic attempt to get things changed to allow them to get more kills/ganks. As you will see, most people are saying there is NOT a problem - it just the normal, everyday whinging from the same old crowd.
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Aikudos En'Fellamen
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:43:00 -
[15]
I would be sad to see instas go. They provide a measure of travelling, which allows you to go form A to B, faster than you usually would.
But I might be biased of course 
___________________________________________
Aikudos En'Fellamen |
Sergeant Spot
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:44:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Fortior
Most people would agree that instas are a problem that needs fixing.
Wrong
The only fixing that instas need is the removal of the 1 to 2km random factor that was recently added (although I can live with instas in their current form, it just means I need to redo all my Instas to be sure they are exactly gate centered rather than simply within 1km of the gate.)
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Viceroy
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:52:00 -
[17]
Instas are a problem, and they need fixing.
-
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lythos miralbar
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:53:00 -
[18]
Edited by: lythos miralbar on 08/04/2005 13:54:06
Nice thought, but no
There is nothing better than tooling up with smart bombs, and sitting on a gate blowing up frig after frig and podding thier pilots as they bm jump to a gate. Time and time again I had frigs get past me and eventualy I thought about it and decided to use thier instas against them. Works wonders every time.
Frigs with insta's = overconfient frig
Overconfident frig = dead frig
If you cannot even gather the reflex's to hit f1->f8 at the right time them perhaps you should go play monopoly online instead of eve, or just give up trying to blow people up
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Valentine Keen
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:54:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Sergeant Spot
Originally by: Fortior
Most people would agree that instas are a problem that needs fixing.
Wrong
The only fixing that instas need is the removal of the 1 to 2km random factor that was recently added (although I can live with instas in their current form, it just means I need to redo all my Instas to be sure they are exactly gate centered rather than simply within 1km of the gate.)
I'm fairly sure the Dev chat indicated the random sphere was 3km now, which probably makes it impossible for them to work every time.
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Riddari
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Posted - 2005.04.08 13:55:00 -
[20]
If 100 people scream themselves blue in the face that instas are a problem, do you think it reflects the opinion of all 60.000 accounts owners? (ok so that's maybe like 30.000 people)
Someone being vocal about something doesn't mean he's talking on behalf of the whole community or even, making sense.
¼©¼
a history |
Fester Addams
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Posted - 2005.04.08 14:35:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Fortior
Most people would agree that instas are a problem that needs fixing. I came up with a very easy solution (I apologize if someone else has already written about it) during the slow hours at work.
I propose that a timer is used when jumping, and that gates use a similar command as stations (instead of "dock", "jump". d'uh ). That would make instas useless while not affecting normal jumps. Let me explain.
From the moment you choose "jump", a timer is initiated. Player A warps in at the regular 15 km, issues "jump" and the timer starts counting down X seconds before Player A is cleared for jumping. Player B jumps in 10 m from the gate and issues "jump" but has to wait X seconds before jumping. Player A's timer would be finished by the time he gets to the gate and can jump when in range. Player B's timer would still count down despite him being in range, and thus has to wait before it's finished before jumping.
Now, please, this is a small idea so turn down the flaming
Firstly, Im not sure who you are talking about when you refer to "most people", the vast majority of players I have spoken to have no problem with instas and consider the issue done and done.
Admitedly I dont know most of the eve players but then I doubt you do ither.
Having removed that issue I will move onto your Idea.
In my humble opinion it can be compared with using a revolver to get water out of a glass, true a bullet or two will get the effect you are after but lets face it, it would cause alot more problems than just leaving it like it is.
This is plainly an atempt to make it easier for pirates to have time to target and shoot down a ship trying to get through the gate, thing is making it easier for the pirates is not neccesary, if you want to camp gates it is not only possible its actually not very hard... if you do it right.
Now if you and your friends havent figured out how to camp efficiently ... well I wont tell you how as that makes one less successfull camper out there.
hmm, a tad more ichor in that post than I intended, thus I would like to say I have nothing against campers or pirates, im just tired of them being so lazy :)
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Marcus Aurelius
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Posted - 2005.04.08 15:08:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Viceroy
Instas are a problem, and they need fixing.
Wrong.
Instas as a whole are not a problem. Some of their effects may be consider a problem.
Like Josh F said, remove the base of the sideeffects and you eliminate the problem without causing undesirable trickle-down issues.
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Gothmatar Ravenblade
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Posted - 2005.04.08 15:25:00 -
[23]
Here's another idea:
Give gates ownership. If you plan to travel through certain routes you can book instant-activations. Let them cost a bit and make them more expensive the lower the security is (or let the owner determine the price). Whoever owns the gate gets the ISKs (even if they are let's say alliance-owned). You have to pay ahead. If you don't book them then no matter what you are dropping 15km away.
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Sirkill
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Posted - 2005.04.08 17:01:00 -
[24]
Instas are a fairly minor problem, if you change them it would cuase a lot of upheavel but would be a very big inmprovment in the game.
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Saint Jack
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Posted - 2005.04.08 17:13:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Fortior
Most people would agree that instas are a problem that needs fixing. I came up with a very easy solution (I apologize if someone else has already written about it) during the slow hours at work.
I propose that a timer is used when jumping, and that gates use a similar command as stations (instead of "dock", "jump". d'uh ). That would make instas useless while not affecting normal jumps. Let me explain.
From the moment you choose "jump", a timer is initiated. Player A warps in at the regular 15 km, issues "jump" and the timer starts counting down X seconds before Player A is cleared for jumping. Player B jumps in 10 m from the gate and issues "jump" but has to wait X seconds before jumping. Player A's timer would be finished by the time he gets to the gate and can jump when in range. Player B's timer would still count down despite him being in range, and thus has to wait before it's finished before jumping.
Now, please, this is a small idea so turn down the flaming
"Begging the question': to assume true, that which has yet to be proven by debate.
1) Assuming that Most people agree with you.
2) That there is a problem with the game.
3) Introducing traffic jams is the a step in what you perceive as the right direction.
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Face Lifter
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Posted - 2005.04.08 17:31:00 -
[26]
Originally by: cristari
Is it possible that we all stop talking about changing insta's
There is nothing wrong with them as they are, the only ppl complaining about them are gate camping pirates!!
This is an aside: have you ever considered what is PvP in EVE? Where does it happen?
I'm pretty sure 90% of all EVE PvP happens at the gate. Do you disagree? Where else can it happen? belts? stations? maybe, but how often do you see that? not too often that's for sure.
So, does that mean 90% of all PvPers are stupid gate camping pirates just because that's where most of the fights occur?
Another aside: The key to having accountability in the game is to be able to force something upon others. When anonymous people start thinking they can get away doing pretty much anything with ease, you get anarchy, scams, pointless ganking, and general rude behavior. When people start fearing others, fearing stronger groups of people, then they will start having more respect, and think twice before they say or do bad things.
No guts no glory they say. When things are too easy, you can't feel proud of your accomplishments, you don't feel as much satisfaction. People will always yell "gank!" and other smack in local when the odds are against them. Then they'll wait it out in safe spot or insta jump out while flipping the middle finger. Where's the honor in that? Respect your enemy when they are stronger than you. The odds may change later and you'll switch roles.
With reduction of choke points in 0.0, more alternative ways in, gate camping shouldn't be as harsh as it is now. Life without insta jumps would be more bearable. Many stupid people will continue to die to ganks due to lack of insta jumps, and they will cry rivers on the forums. The smart people will learn to scout the gates before they approach them, learn to use scanners, learn to negotiate with stronger forces, learn to cooperate better, and overall get more satisfaction out of their accomplishments.
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Jakk Graiseach
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Posted - 2005.04.08 17:33:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Maya Rkell
Originally by: Fortior
Most people would agree that instas are a problem
Nope.
And post suggestions in the suggestion forum.
/seconded... 
--
** All accounts cancelled - have fun guys ** |
Banisher
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Posted - 2005.04.08 17:53:00 -
[28]
I agree, bookmarks are a problem, insta jumps and docks should be the norm, the 15m space is a waste of gaming time and there only for the campers gankers.
I say we should all have insta jumps and docks so we can play the game intead of ****ing time away on unwanted travel!.
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Face Lifter
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Posted - 2005.04.08 18:04:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Face Lifter on 08/04/2005 18:08:42
Originally by: Banisher
I agree, bookmarks are a problem, insta jumps and docks should be the norm, the 15m space is a waste of gaming time and there only for the campers gankers.
I say we should all have insta jumps and docks so we can play the game intead of ****ing time away on unwanted travel!.
I would find this acceptable if mobile warp disruptors were easily available for all, easily used, appropriately effective depending on their size and quality, and functioned in empire space.
There are different approaches to PvP problems. One is to remove insta jumps, another is to make them default but have improved mobile warp disruptors.
EDIT: for mobile warp disruptors to function in empire, it would probably be necessary to make them filter out friendlies and neutrals, so they only work against enemies. These "smart" mobile warp disruptors should be more expensive, but still very effective.
CONCORD could make sure people don't use "dumb" mobile warp disruptors, that stop everyone as opposed to just legal war enemies.
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cristari
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Posted - 2005.04.08 18:31:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Face Lifter
Originally by: cristari
Is it possible that we all stop talking about changing insta's
There is nothing wrong with them as they are, the only ppl complaining about them are gate camping pirates!!
This is an aside: have you ever considered what is PvP in EVE? Where does it happen?
I'm pretty sure 90% of all EVE PvP happens at the gate. Do you disagree? Where else can it happen? belts? stations? maybe, but how often do you see that? not too often that's for sure.
No I don't disagree, Yes!, Not to often because everybody seams to want to float around gates!!
Originally by: Face Lifter
So, does that mean 90% of all PvPers are stupid gate camping pirates just because that's where most of the fights occur?
If you want to call PvP'rs stupid that is you're perogative, I certinly never mentioned that!
What I did say was thet most of the ppl complaining about insta's are the gate camping pirates that don't get enough time to lock their targets, the insta's give the target a good chance of evaiding a kill and life goes on! However the gate campers grumble and moan about insta's and how they have to sit for hour's before finding that one person who dosn't have insta's before they can get their kill.
I too am a PvP person I know how to set up insta's and how to scout a system I have been on both sides of this argument and I still see no point to changing insta's they are very fair!!
Originally by: Face Lifter
Another aside: The key to having accountability in the game is to be able to force something upon others. When anonymous people start thinking they can get away doing pretty much anything with ease, you get anarchy, scams, pointless ganking, and general rude behavior. When people start fearing others, fearing stronger groups of people, then they will start having more respect, and think twice before they say or do bad things.
True and this is why calls for changes to insta's should stop. At present both parties have the ability to create bm's and insta's therefore if you are camping a gate expect you're prey to get away and take measures to stop it! If you are fighting campers, then you can scout and set you're own bm's and combat them!! EVERYTHING IS FAIR!!
Originally by: Face Lifter
No guts no glory they say. When things are too easy, you can't feel proud of your accomplishments, you don't feel as much satisfaction. People will always yell "gank!" and other smack in local when the odds are against them. Then they'll wait it out in safe spot or insta jump out while flipping the middle finger. Where's the honor in that? Respect your enemy when they are stronger than you. The odds may change later and you'll switch roles.
I have switched roles a few times!! The only ppl that benifit from the removal of insta's are the wanna be pirates in 0.0 who think they can shoot anything close to a gate and then get very frustraited when they sit in the same spot for hours on end watching lots of ships instajump past them! (Look on the threads for the ppl that complain about instas and you have found most of them!)
Originally by: Face Lifter
With reduction of choke points in 0.0, more alternative ways in, gate camping shouldn't be as harsh as it is now. Life without insta jumps would be more bearable. Many stupid people will continue to die to ganks due to lack of insta jumps, and they will cry rivers on the forums. The smart people will learn to scout the gates before they approach them, learn to use scanners, learn to negotiate with stronger forces, learn to cooperate better, and overall get more satisfaction out of their accomplishments.
I'm sorry dude but gate camping should not be allowed if you want to shoot someone go to war! Look for them! Take the time to find their safespots!! Just don't sit at gates, then complain when you cant shoot someone!! Everything else you have said seams to make sense.
NOW CAN WE STOP TALKING ABOUT CHANGING INSTAJUMPS PLEASE!!!!
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Banisher
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Posted - 2005.04.08 18:32:00 -
[31]
Do warp disruptors get you out of warp whilst warping or just prevent the warp sequence from initiating?
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Serilla
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Posted - 2005.04.08 18:34:00 -
[32]
i do not want to see instas nerfed......
instead bump up mobile warp disrupters..
Make them deployable in <.3 sec systems.
do not nerf our quick travel system please
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Face Lifter
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Posted - 2005.04.08 19:01:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Banisher
Do warp disruptors get you out of warp whilst warping or just prevent the warp sequence from initiating?
They do both, but aren't very reliable. I have limited experience with these and the effects I seen were sometimes odd.
Originally by: cristari
I'm sorry dude but gate camping should not be allowed if you want to shoot someone go to war! Look for them! Take the time to find their safespots!! Just don't sit at gates, then complain when you cant shoot someone!! Everything else you have said seams to make sense.
Ok, I can agree with most of your points. I really with that last one was a viable alternative, but unfortunately it is not. EVE does not have the tools to make it viable. It's too easy to avoid any conflict, people always want to avoid it when odds are against them.. so what's left? gate camps. I don't like it, but I do it as it's effective.
I really wish there were effective methods of breaking safe spots. I really wish there were effective methods of finding selected targets in EVE and forcing them to fight. I almost managed to do this after 2 hours of organizing and using locator agents, then finally during the fight the guy just warped off cause apparently het had 2+ warp core stabilizers. I'm jsut pointing out how easy it is to avoid combat.. gate camps is the only reliable solution
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Kayoss
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Posted - 2005.04.08 19:08:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Banisher
I agree, bookmarks are a problem, insta jumps and docks should be the norm, the 15m space is a waste of gaming time and there only for the campers gankers.
I say we should all have insta jumps and docks so we can play the game intead of ****ing time away on unwanted travel!.
I agree 100% with this statement.
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Duke Danger
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Posted - 2005.04.08 19:36:00 -
[35]
Just change the name from 'Instas' to 'Express Lane' and all the problems go away.... Trust me...
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Cummilla
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Posted - 2005.04.08 19:44:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Verone
here we go again
LOLLERSKATES! That emoticon pwns all!
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Emeline Cabernet
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Posted - 2005.04.08 19:47:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Fortior
Originally by: Maya Rkell
Originally by: Fortior
Most people would agree that instas are a problem
Nope.
And post suggestions in the suggestion forum.
Well, seeing how people keep asking the devs about it, I'd rate it as a problem.
Yes, I should've posted it there, but this gets more attention and thus feedback.
they are not asking, they are *****ing
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var'ulfur
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Posted - 2005.04.08 20:16:00 -
[38]
this has gone on since beta 4 i think. ccp will not drop them for doing it would mean recoding so many line os code to keep bookmarks but stop them from being use as instas.
guys come on out of evey 8 that get though 25 more dont cant get better odds anywhere
the horse is dead let it rest in peace
talk is cheap the cost of action is enormus
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worker
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Posted - 2005.04.08 20:39:00 -
[39]
Instas are not the problem they are a solution to a problem. that problem being gate gankers in 0.1 - 0.4 and before evryone screams carebear lamer newb etc.
You sit there ganking people at almost no risk you make your isk and have you "fun" if thats what you wish to call it, but us "carebears" make our isk in empire 0.5+ mining, manufacturing agent missions etc thats what we want to do.
If we need to go to 0.0 for what ever reason, mainly tons of cheap mega and zyd then why should we spend X number of seconds floating to a gate in our ships to be shot at by gank squads? we dont have to instas help us live a little longer and save a ton of time. if i have to spend a hour extra hauling megacyte from 0.0 because i have no megacyte thats a hour less i can spend mining base minerals which are needed in much vaster quanititys to make most stuff. so that you gankers can go out and lame it up at the gates.
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Dakath
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Posted - 2005.04.08 22:08:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Fortior
Most people would agree that instas are a problem that needs fixing. I came up with a very easy solution (I apologize if someone else has already written about it) during the slow hours at work.
I propose that a timer is used when jumping, and that gates use a similar command as stations (instead of "dock", "jump". d'uh ). That would make instas useless while not affecting normal jumps. Let me explain.
From the moment you choose "jump", a timer is initiated. Player A warps in at the regular 15 km, issues "jump" and the timer starts counting down X seconds before Player A is cleared for jumping. Player B jumps in 10 m from the gate and issues "jump" but has to wait X seconds before jumping. Player A's timer would be finished by the time he gets to the gate and can jump when in range. Player B's timer would still count down despite him being in range, and thus has to wait before it's finished before jumping.
Now, please, this is a small idea so turn down the flaming
I have a better idea. Make all weapons not fire within 100,000km of all stations and gates. That includes NPCS and especially pie-rats. No more ganking, no more need for insta-jumps. Of course lazy pie-rats would have to work for kills.
I would feel their pain and 
I chopped Bunny into little pieces.
\ ( )( X > ) ( .x ) / < _
Muahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!
Sic Transit Gloria Bunny! |
cristan
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Posted - 2005.04.10 07:55:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Face Lifter
Originally by: Banisher
Do warp disruptors get you out of warp whilst warping or just prevent the warp sequence from initiating?
They do both, but aren't very reliable. I have limited experience with these and the effects I seen were sometimes odd.
Originally by: cristari
I'm sorry dude but gate camping should not be allowed if you want to shoot someone go to war! Look for them! Take the time to find their safespots!! Just don't sit at gates, then complain when you cant shoot someone!! Everything else you have said seams to make sense.
Ok, I can agree with most of your points. I really with that last one was a viable alternative, but unfortunately it is not. EVE does not have the tools to make it viable. It's too easy to avoid any conflict, people always want to avoid it when odds are against them.. so what's left? gate camps. I don't like it, but I do it as it's effective.
I really wish there were effective methods of breaking safe spots. I really wish there were effective methods of finding selected targets in EVE and forcing them to fight. I almost managed to do this after 2 hours of organizing and using locator agents, then finally during the fight the guy just warped off cause apparently het had 2+ warp core stabilizers. I'm jsut pointing out how easy it is to avoid combat.. gate camps is the only reliable solution
So basically you want CCP to make a pirats job easy!!!
GOD WILL THESE PPL STOP MOANING!!!
I haven't moaned once about searching for safespots, using the probes is excelent I have come very close to finding safespots, It makes the game more pleasing to find a hard kill, and forcing them into hideing is better than having them shooting at you're other ships!!
I mean come on is there any reason why we are still talking about this!!
PLEASE CCP PUT A BLOCK ON THE WHOLE SUBJECT ON THE FORUMS!!!!
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cristari
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Posted - 2005.04.10 07:56:00 -
[42]
Edited by: cristari on 10/04/2005 07:56:37
Just incase you didn't know that was my alt!!
Who is now going into liquidation!!
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MOS DEF
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Posted - 2005.04.10 09:31:00 -
[43]
Do you even know how long it takes to get deep into 0.0 WITH instas. With your suggestion noone would ever travel up and down.
As if travelling wouldn't be too boring/time consuming as it is allready right now.
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Selena 001
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Posted - 2005.04.10 10:19:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Fortior
Most people would agree that instas are a problem that needs fixing. I came up with a very easy solution (I apologize if someone else has already written about it) during the slow hours at work.
I propose that a timer is used when jumping, and that gates use a similar command as stations (instead of "dock", "jump". d'uh ). That would make instas useless while not affecting normal jumps. Let me explain.
From the moment you choose "jump", a timer is initiated. Player A warps in at the regular 15 km, issues "jump" and the timer starts counting down X seconds before Player A is cleared for jumping. Player B jumps in 10 m from the gate and issues "jump" but has to wait X seconds before jumping. Player A's timer would be finished by the time he gets to the gate and can jump when in range. Player B's timer would still count down despite him being in range, and thus has to wait before it's finished before jumping.
Now, please, this is a small idea so turn down the flaming
Sounds like, "Eiter warp to a gate at 15KM, or get re-occuring Warp jumping Bug". Your also nerfing the ability to use a frigate with a MWD that warps to a gate at 15KM... and depending upon how long the timer it, maybe cruisers too. It ideas nice, but impractical.
P.S. Im against removing instas 
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*I only have 5 months left of 'knowing at all'... I had better put it to good use* |
Fortior
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Posted - 2005.04.10 11:51:00 -
[45]
Originally by: MOS DEF
Do you even know how long it takes to get deep into 0.0 WITH instas. With your suggestion noone would ever travel up and down.
As if travelling wouldn't be too boring/time consuming as it is allready right now.
Yeah, I know how long it takes. I've been down to Impass a couple of times and it's not the most entertaining event I can think of. The timer I proposed would only be something like 5 seconds, not 15 seconds or something like that. That way jumping won't be 'instant' and still not the mindnumbing warp-in at 15km. Loosing 5 secs per gate is something I could live with.
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Shamen
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Posted - 2005.04.10 11:54:00 -
[46]
The only idea people agree with (and its one i came up with is) have a gate orbit a certain point in space (orbit at 15km) so if you use insta's its very unlikely that you will be ontop of the gate...
_______________________
Vengeance Of The Fallen
Shamen - Captain & Forum warrior |
Deepeh
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Posted - 2005.04.10 12:46:00 -
[47]
Insta's are fine the way they are.
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YuuKnow
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Posted - 2005.04.10 13:29:00 -
[48]
instajumps aren't a problem. they actually make the game better because they shorten those long boring multijump trips.
the problem with 0.0 is that the gameplay out there is sooooooo lame. Local garantees that you will be spotted the instant you enter a system and people running to unreachable safespots that can't be reached is the absolute lamest part of this game hands down.
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Krulla
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Posted - 2005.04.10 13:48:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Fortior
Originally by: Maya Rkell
Originally by: Fortior
Most people would agree that instas are a problem
Nope.
And post suggestions in the suggestion forum.
Well, seeing how people keep asking the devs about it, I'd rate it as a problem.
Yes, I should've posted it there, but this gets more attention and thus feedback.
The only people who think they are a problem are people like Digitalcommunist and Viceroy who go "ZOMG I can't gank like back in 2003! Remove sentries plz! Remove instas plz! Remove cocord plz!"
Instas = Gewd.
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Quakindude
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Posted - 2005.04.10 15:44:00 -
[50]
Edited by: Quakindude on 10/04/2005 15:45:37
THe title says it all for the way some people think. Keep insta's but make them useless. Why would anyone keep something that doesn't work? 
As it is, in 0.0, people who wish to gank at the gates have to work for it. They setup on either side of the gate. They see someone warp into and insta-jump, the guys on the otherside have to work to catch that person. Linking sensors, jamming and disrupting are all on them. I see no reason to make 85% of the population in Eve work harder to please those that are whinning about having to work hard to gate gank.
The roles available in Eve are not ALL pirating or PvP'ing and indeed, those two roles make up very little of the overall percentage of players. While I am not a pirate and would never be, it is a role that is needed to enhance the gaming experience. PvP'ing is something I enjoy, but not all the time.
People who use insta's already work hard enough making them and tweaking them. It is just as viable a combat tactic as fleet operations with dedicated ECM ships. One more tool to keep in your toolbox. There are ways around Insta users just like insta users have ways around gate campers. It all works well together and removing Insta's would only frustrate the majority of players. If you need to gate gank, then you need to learn how to do it correctly and YOU gather the 10+ ships needed to run a gank effectively.
Insta's are fine the way they are.
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Juniper
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Posted - 2005.04.10 15:59:00 -
[51]
Keep instas, just make the warp-in bubble size related to a skill.
The higher the level of skill trained, the more accurate your warp engines reach the zenith of the bookmark.
-- Gotta sell my stuff...
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Zyrla Bladestorm
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Posted - 2005.04.10 17:05:00 -
[52]
Personally I use instas of course, as do most, Since without them everything is slower/riskier and thus less fun from that perspective, dont particularly want to see them leave.
I dont like them though, ever since beta when people started using them, they've been the atmosphere-killer to me (I may be wierd, but I like seeing ships flying through space)
.
-----
Apologys for any rambling that may have just occurred.
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Dark Silver
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Posted - 2005.04.10 17:07:00 -
[53]
Edited by: Dark Silver on 10/04/2005 17:09:23
Originally by: Banisher
I agree, bookmarks are a problem, insta jumps and docks should be the norm, the 15m space is a waste of gaming time and there only for the campers gankers.
I say we should all have insta jumps and docks so we can play the game intead of ****ing time away on unwanted travel!.
I second that, get rid of warp to distances all together, sureley by now you would have the technology to accurately warp a set distance and end up within docking/collection/jumping range of a station/cargo can/stargate without having to spend time travelling to it at a slower speed...
Originally by: Juniper
Keep instas, just make the warp-in bubble size related to a skill.
The higher the level of skill trained, the more accurate your warp engines reach the zenith of the bookmark.
This would also make an interesting improvement to the game, meaning that you could keep the warp in distance, but allow people to have shorter warp in distances due to skill (lv 5 being around 2k perhaps)
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Qayos
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Posted - 2005.04.10 17:20:00 -
[54]
I just wanted to point out really quickly to all those who think that instas are...
a dead horse.
fine.
not a problem.
perfect the way there are.
exactly how CCP want them.
(etc).
CCP seems to disagree with you. When asked about instas, this was the reply...
Originally by: Oveur
secondly, we're always considering what to do with instajumps and so far, we haven't seen a solution we're happy with
<snip>
Obviously it ranges from removing to replacing them with some kind of game mechanic
but yeah, the large disruptor and some tweaks to their size/cost/anchoring is coming up
on the possible solutions, we're looking for something closer to a game mechaning that replaces it to some extent, but whatever we would do, it's quite obvious that it's all a nerf
Now, it seems to me that they see them as something that needs to be nerfed, they are just deciding on exactly what to do with them. So they are most certainly far from being a dead horse, CCP is NOT happy with them how they are, and CCP disagrees that "Insta's are fine the way they are."
I also havn't seen a solution I'm 100% happy with as an idea. But I appreciate peoples thoughts and postings as to possible solutions. Perhaps we could just restrict the topic in posts that propose solutions to discussion of the proposed solution, and stop the dead horse and "instas are fine" spam.
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Fillmeup
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Posted - 2005.04.11 00:00:00 -
[55]
Wow, I wish I had a dead horse emoticon for this thread ....
There is nothing wrong with insta's, and the only possible benfit to the eve-online universe to removing them is that it makes it easier for gate gankers.
Now, I like gate gankers. They add that little bit of stress / fear that makes the whole game interesting.
If you want to see an Exodus, but not out of empire to 0.0 but an exodus from Eve to other online games this would be, imho, the quickest way to do it. I have precisely 1 1/2 hours day to play this game after work and considering downtime falls 9-10pm at night for me - if I had to travel without instas I (and many others) would most probably leave due to the game becoming as boring as all hell. And all of this just to make it a non-event for gank gankers to get easy kills??
At best, 10% of the eve-universe whinge about this and surprisingly the majority of them are gankers.
Leave it alone. It's done and dusted. If you can't catch people with ista's at gates you are doing something very wrong.
Thats Life, Thats EVE(TM)
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Justin Cody
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Posted - 2005.04.11 00:26:00 -
[56]
I've been involved in gate ganks, and I must say that instas are not a problem at all. Gate gankers are not a problem. In 00 you can deploy a mobile warp disruptor to remove the use of instas for the most part. in low security empire, the best solution to gate ganking is a covert ops ship and a small cruiser/frigate gank fleet. There is no real way to deal with instas in low sec empire, nor should there be. Its not THAT risky there. Just leave things as they are.
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Janara Kirk
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Posted - 2005.04.11 01:18:00 -
[57]
My vote is to keep the instas. I've had to work hard tweaking and setting them up, and even then they're not perfect. If I want to bring one little frigate out to 0.0, how am I supposed to stand up against apocs and Ravens? The people who know how to set up ganks properly have killed me, the ones who haven't, eat my dust.
Sometimes it just ends up being a hard chase...I think it adds to the game.. Take them away, and the only thing left in 0.0 will be ganker's and pirates.
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Orb Lati
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Posted - 2005.04.11 04:16:00 -
[58]
Edited by: Orb Lati on 11/04/2005 04:23:54
Perhaps the mistake was making them share-able.
If all BMs were locked to the character who made them and were not able to be shared then i feel alot of the contraversy for them would be gone.
If a player spends their own time making a 30+ jump route to speed their travel and help get past hot spots should they not reap the reward for that effort spent.
I think the issue was that they became so common due to shareablity among players.
Perhaps you might be best asking for CCP to first lock BMS to players then go thru there gate database and change all thier locations by shifting them in one of the x-y-z axis 100kms.
Of course with the new world order coming up that might be a good time to implement such a change.
However CCP would ned to put in a heft apology first to al those who have made thier own.
But in the interest of better game play i think most players would understand the sacrifice neccesary.
( i personally have made well over 1000 BMs and would be willing to sacrifies them all if they were made lockable to characters.)
"We Worship Strength, because it is through strength that all other values are made possible" |
Judas Kirk
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Posted - 2005.04.11 05:28:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Orb Lati
Edited by: Orb Lati on 11/04/2005 04:23:54
Perhaps the mistake was making them share-able.
If all BMs were locked to the character who made them and were not able to be shared then i feel alot of the contraversy for them would be gone.
I don't agree that they should be locked. Look, I'm a n00b, and I'm little, I can't take on the big guys, or rats in 0.0 space, however, what I can do is make sweet bms through hot territory. I've perfected it to a fine art. Why shouldn't I be able to sell my skills and my bms on the free market? It makes me a valuable asset to my corp, and others, and helps me participate in the game
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asmath
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Posted - 2005.04.11 08:34:00 -
[60]
Insta's are a necessary part of the game, as annoying as they maybe at times i can't imagine going 30 40 jumps without them. If you want to gank someone at a gate I'll guess you'll just have to be faster and smarter. Don't ask for handouts
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Orb Lati
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Posted - 2005.04.11 10:46:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Judas Kirk
I don't agree that they should be locked. Look, I'm a n00b, and I'm little, I can't take on the big guys, or rats in 0.0 space, however, what I can do is make sweet bms through hot territory. I've perfected it to a fine art. Why shouldn't I be able to sell my skills and my bms on the free market? It makes me a valuable asset to my corp, and others, and helps me participate in the game
but you can offer your services as a "pathfinder" in a gang. Gang warp allows you to "share" insta jumps with you gang mates as long as they are coordinated enough to travel as a group.
"We Worship Strength, because it is through strength that all other values are made possible" |
FireAnt
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Posted - 2005.04.11 11:24:00 -
[62]
i dont think anything needs to change as far as insta jumps. look how many pods kills there are though out eve per hour. you take them away and that will be 10 fold. also people sent money and time doing them, they shouldnt have ever been in game maybe, but since they are they need to say.
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Shar ch'Than
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Posted - 2005.04.11 12:03:00 -
[63]
bookmarks and insta jumps are a newbies only weapon against uber players with tech 2 ships and weapons that gank the gates... if you havent noticed most players that use tech2 just gank a gate and fight there... so much for an eve wide pvp, its just gate pvp atm...
either make the gate ganking a thing of the past or leave the instas alone...
if you'e noticed most people that complain about instas.. are pirates and gate gankers... and thats about it...
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