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Navy Faction ships after rebalancing

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Col Arran I don't pay taxes 33	Posted - 2012.11.19 04:20:00 - [1] - Quote So this is something I have yet to see anything about. With the new rebalancing and the "bringing up" of the lower tiered ships what is going to be done about the Navy Faction Variants? The best example I can think of right now is the Stabber and the Stabber Fleet issue. Currently the SFI excels over the normal stabber because it can fit decent armor tank with some damage mods and 4 slots for EWAR. Well once the rebalance comes out its really going to close up the gap between the 2 variations since the mid slots are going to be the same and the normal stabber is getting another low slot. This is really going to make me question the cost difference between the two ships and whether or not its justified. Point in short; Does CCP have any plans to also rebalance Navy Variants of ships?
Trinkets friend Sudden Buggery Swift Angels Alliance 546	Posted - 2012.11.19 05:16:00 - [2] - Quote Answer in short: yes. After they finish the T1 stuff. Taking submissions for "Trinkets friendly Advice Column" via evemail or private convo in-game. Anonymity sorta guaranteed.
Gabrielle Lamb Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic 55	Posted - 2012.11.19 05:22:00 - [3] - Quote I'm not as short as the other guy but. In short: When they buff T1 versions they make Navy versions obsolete for a little while. If they buffed Navy too then suddenly pirate and T2 versions would become obsolete as well until they got a buff.
Dinsdale Pirannha Pirannha Corp 405	Posted - 2012.11.19 05:23:00 - [4] - Quote You might as well mothball your faction cruisers for quiet some time. CCP plans on overhauling BC's, and BS's, before getting around to faction ships. I bought a number of fleet stabbers in anticipation of them increasing in value once the FW-created glut passed. That was a mistake. The prices of fleet ships will continue to plummet as in some cases the vanilla T1 variant will be superior.
Alara IonStorm 3522	Posted - 2012.11.19 05:58:00 - [5] - Quote Col Arran wrote: Currently the SFI excels over the normal stabber because it can fit decent armor tank with some damage mods and 4 slots for EWAR. Well once the rebalance comes out its really going to close up the gap between the 2 variations since the mid slots are going to be the same and the normal stabber is getting another low slot. You will be glad to know the new Stabber sucks urine dipped balls in comparison to the SFI in any fit including kiting. It isn't even close.
Shamus O'Reilly Gungnirs' Point I Know Right 5	Posted - 2012.11.19 07:35:00 - [6] - Quote Alara IonStorm wrote: Col Arran wrote: Currently the SFI excels over the normal stabber because it can fit decent armor tank with some damage mods and 4 slots for EWAR. Well once the rebalance comes out its really going to close up the gap between the 2 variations since the mid slots are going to be the same and the normal stabber is getting another low slot. You will be glad to know the new Stabber sucks urine dipped balls in comparison to the SFI in any fit including kiting. It isn't even close. this. the 6 lows a Stabber Fleet has compared to even the extra low of the new Stabber wins the day along with 5 guns. You'll have fun kiting in the new Stabber but that's all it seems useful for currently. With the SFI you can nano/shield tank it and kite effectively or armor that thing out, get an EHP of a lil less than a nanocane and BC speeds, still fit 180s across the highs, 2 webs/tracking disruptors/etc, a propmod, and a point. The SFI is still all out the better of the two
Christine Peeveepeeski The Imperial Fedaykin 160	Posted - 2012.11.19 08:36:00 - [7] - Quote Of all the t1 buffs and the detrimental effects it has on faction ships the SFI suffers the least. SFI can still sig tank like a boss, run a great tank AND still remain mobile. The SFI, at it's current price is a no brainer, certainly in faction warfare style engagements where the warp ins and fight points are so well defined. The new stabber will be able to kite, that's it.
Deerin Murientor Tribe Defiant Legacy 31	Posted - 2012.11.19 09:33:00 - [8] - Quote Osprey Navy Issue -> New Caracal outperforms it Caracal Navy Issue -> New Caracal is faster with 1 less launcher and fittings...so I'd say "barely" equal. Exeq Navy Issue -> New Thorax outperforms it completely Vexor Navy -> I'll go ahead and say it...New Vexor outperforms it. Scythe Fleet Issue -> Both Stabber and Rupture outperform it Stabber Fleet Issue -> Still boss. New Rupture is slow in comparison and new stabber doesn't even come close in power No idea for Amarr ships. Navy versions of Osprey, Exeq and Scythe were already not worth their money.....now they will be completely worthless. I assume it is the same case for auguror navy. So...not much will be changed for navy ships...our SFI's will blot out the sun. Caracal Navies will see reduction in numbers but still be used...others will be gathering dust. I've another question though. What is the problem with Omen Navy. It looks great on paper. What does it lack? Why don't I see them more often.
Garviel Tarrant Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel 209	Posted - 2012.11.19 09:49:00 - [9] - Quote SFI is still completely OP compared to the other faction cruisers. No worries.
John Ratcliffe Sausy Sausages 66	Posted - 2012.11.19 09:51:00 - [10] - Quote Gabrielle Lamb wrote: I'm not as short as the other guy but. In short: When they buff T1 versions they make Navy versions obsolete for a little while. If they buffed Navy too then suddenly pirate and T2 versions would become obsolete as well until they got a buff. Rubbish. The Navy versions will be as effective as they are now. If you want to use the T1 then crack on, but it's disingenuous to suggest that Navy is suddenly crap. The men waved their hats, the ladies their umbrellas. One felt they would have liked to touch the steel muscles of the most courageous champions since antiquity. Who will carry off the first prize, entering the pantheon where only supermen may go?
Val'Dore PlanetCorp InterStellar 216	Posted - 2012.11.19 11:17:00 - [11] - Quote Wait for the Navy ship crash and buy them up in anticipation of their eventual buff. Star Jump Drive
chris elliot EG CORP Talocan United 54	Posted - 2012.11.19 13:25:00 - [12] - Quote Val'Dore wrote: Wait for the Navy ship crash and buy them up in anticipation of their eventual buff. This guy knows whats up right here.
Lady Ayeipsia Red Federation RvB - RED Federation 420	Posted - 2012.11.19 13:37:00 - [13] - Quote Deerin wrote: Osprey Navy Issue -> New Caracal outperforms it Caracal Navy Issue -> New Caracal is faster with 1 less launcher and fittings...so I'd say "barely" equal. Exeq Navy Issue -> New Thorax outperforms it completely Vexor Navy -> I'll go ahead and say it...New Vexor outperforms it. Scythe Fleet Issue -> Both Stabber and Rupture outperform it Stabber Fleet Issue -> Still boss. New Rupture is slow in comparison and new stabber doesn't even come close in power No idea for Amarr ships. Navy versions of Osprey, Exeq and Scythe were already not worth their money.....now they will be completely worthless. I assume it is the same case for auguror navy. So...not much will be changed for navy ships...our SFI's will blot out the sun. Caracal Navies will see reduction in numbers but still be used...others will be gathering dust. I've another question though. What is the problem with Omen Navy. It looks great on paper. What does it lack? Why don't I see them more often. Actually, the navy auguror can have a phenomenal tank. It makes for a very nice bait ship. Most people assume it is lacking, engage, and realize it's a trap when they can't break the tank and the rest of your fleet arrives.
Jerick Ludhowe The Nyan Cat Pirates Nyanpire 208	Posted - 2012.11.19 15:43:00 - [14] - Quote John Ratcliffe wrote: Rubbish. The Navy versions will be as effective as they are now. If you want to use the T1 then crack on, but it's disingenuous to suggest that Navy is suddenly crap. Game is about relative performance bub, that's what "balance" is all about. If an inexpensive t1 cruiser becomes superior to a far more expensive and hard to obtain navy cruiser after the patch then something is quite undeniably wrong. The reality is that the SFI probably suffers the least from the relative change in performance between t1 and faction however as pointed out several times in this thread... Other cruisers are not fairing nearly as well.
Maeltstome Imperium Technologies Get Off My Lawn 122	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:18:00 - [15] - Quote Jerick Ludhowe wrote: John Ratcliffe wrote: Rubbish. The Navy versions will be as effective as they are now. If you want to use the T1 then crack on, but it's disingenuous to suggest that Navy is suddenly crap. Game is about relative performance bub, that's what "balance" is all about. If an inexpensive t1 cruiser becomes superior to a far more expensive and hard to obtain navy cruiser after the patch then something is quite undeniably wrong. The reality is that the SFI probably suffers the least from the relative change in performance between t1 and faction however as pointed out several times in this thread... Other cruisers are not fairing nearly as well. Hardly. People regularly pay 4/5 times more for an item with 5% more of something in it, or 5% less fitting etc. As long as a navy cruiser is 1% better in some way, it will still be flown.
Jerick Ludhowe The Nyan Cat Pirates Nyanpire 208	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:39:00 - [16] - Quote Maeltstome wrote: Hardly. People regularly pay 4/5 times more for an item with 5% more of something in it, or 5% less fitting etc. As long as a navy cruiser is 1% better in some way, it will still be flown. If you honestly think that anything other than a tiny proportion of the eve population will pay 4x to 5x more for a ship with a minimal 1% increase in effectiveness you're smoking some seriously good ****. The reality is that the issue being poked at by the op has already been admitted by ccp and will be addressed most probably late next year.
Goldensaver Vorbild Industries Inc. 98	Posted - 2012.11.19 18:20:00 - [17] - Quote Jerick Ludhowe wrote: Maeltstome wrote: Hardly. People regularly pay 4/5 times more for an item with 5% more of something in it, or 5% less fitting etc. As long as a navy cruiser is 1% better in some way, it will still be flown. If you honestly think that anything other than a tiny proportion of the eve population will pay 4x to 5x more for a ship with a minimal 1% increase in effectiveness you're smoking some seriously good ****. The reality is that the issue being poked at by the op has already been admitted by ccp and will be addressed most probably late next year. People pay about 3 or 4 times more for an implant that is only 1% better, and that just goes in a flimsy ship that gets popped by the first disco that you fly a shuttle through. I don't see why a ship only being 1% better should be seen too differently. Maybe 5% minimum, but still, it costs a lot for a small gain, and people pay the price anyways.
Perihelion Olenard Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 28	Posted - 2012.11.20 01:12:00 - [18] - Quote I think it will be quite a long time before you see changes to the navy issue ships. In a year-and-a-half CCP will release the new command ships, and after that you could see the navy issue ships improved slightly. They would probably tell you it's not a high priority. There is a lot of other stuff coming first.
Oblivion Maximus I.RAGE 5	Posted - 2012.11.20 01:46:00 - [19] - Quote chris elliot wrote: Val'Dore wrote: Wait for the Navy ship crash and buy them up in anticipation of their eventual buff. This guy knows whats up right here. SSSSSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!! Top Secrect - 007 style
Jerick Ludhowe The Nyan Cat Pirates Nyanpire 208	Posted - 2012.11.20 02:18:00 - [20] - Quote Perihelion Olenard wrote: I think it will be quite a long time before you see changes to the navy issue ships. In a year-and-a-half CCP will release the new command ships, and after that you could see the navy issue ships improved slightly. They would probably tell you it's not a high priority. There is a lot of other stuff coming first. Commands should be rebalanced by next summer... Not a year and a half BCs will probably be revamped before that.
Perihelion Olenard Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 28	Posted - 2012.11.20 02:56:00 - [21] - Quote Jerick Ludhowe wrote: Perihelion Olenard wrote: I think it will be quite a long time before you see changes to the navy issue ships. In a year-and-a-half CCP will release the new command ships, and after that you could see the navy issue ships improved slightly. They would probably tell you it's not a high priority. There is a lot of other stuff coming first. Commands should be rebalanced by next summer... Not a year and a half BCs will probably be revamped before that. Cruisers are now, battlecruisers are summer expansion, battleships are probably next winter expansion, then the summer after that may be command ships.
Rynnik Agony Unleashed Agony Empire 32	Posted - 2012.11.20 03:03:00 - [22] - Quote Perihelion Olenard wrote: Jerick Ludhowe wrote: Perihelion Olenard wrote: I think it will be quite a long time before you see changes to the navy issue ships. In a year-and-a-half CCP will release the new command ships, and after that you could see the navy issue ships improved slightly. They would probably tell you it's not a high priority. There is a lot of other stuff coming first. Commands should be rebalanced by next summer... Not a year and a half BCs will probably be revamped before that. Cruisers are now, battlecruisers are summer expansion, battleships are probably next winter expansion, then the summer after that may be command ships. Being as they did frigs, destroyers, cruisers, added 5 additional ships, and also rebalanced a bunch of modules in this upcoming patch, it is probably fairly safe to move your timeline up a bit.
Perihelion Olenard Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 28	Posted - 2012.11.20 03:04:00 - [23] - Quote Don't get me wrong, I'd like to see things fixed sooner. I'm all for it.
Jerick Ludhowe The Nyan Cat Pirates Nyanpire 210	Posted - 2012.11.20 20:11:00 - [24] - Quote Perihelion Olenard wrote: Jerick Ludhowe wrote: Perihelion Olenard wrote: I think it will be quite a long time before you see changes to the navy issue ships. In a year-and-a-half CCP will release the new command ships, and after that you could see the navy issue ships improved slightly. They would probably tell you it's not a high priority. There is a lot of other stuff coming first. Commands should be rebalanced by next summer... Not a year and a half BCs will probably be revamped before that. Cruisers are now, battlecruisers are summer expansion, battleships are probably next winter expansion, then the summer after that may be command ships. BCs will be early next year, re read blog
It'sNotMyFaultYourMother ThrewYouAway University of Caille Gallente Federation 5	Posted - 2012.11.20 20:33:00 - [25] - Quote Maeltstome wrote: Hardly. People regularly pay 4/5 times more for an item with 5% more of something in it, or 5% less fitting etc. As long as a navy cruiser is 1% better in some way, it will still be flown. Only in situations where it's benefitial to fly it. If the performance increase is that marginal and the price increase that steep people will simply put restrain themselves to flying Navy ships only when they're feeling confident that they will not loose them. For instance PVPing in their home smurf when they know in advance what ships and how many enemies they will be facing or PVEing.
Boomhaur 117	Posted - 2012.11.20 20:41:00 - [26] - Quote Rynnik wrote: Perihelion Olenard wrote: Jerick Ludhowe wrote: Perihelion Olenard wrote: I think it will be quite a long time before you see changes to the navy issue ships. In a year-and-a-half CCP will release the new command ships, and after that you could see the navy issue ships improved slightly. They would probably tell you it's not a high priority. There is a lot of other stuff coming first. Commands should be rebalanced by next summer... Not a year and a half BCs will probably be revamped before that. Cruisers are now, battlecruisers are summer expansion, battleships are probably next winter expansion, then the summer after that may be command ships. Being as they did frigs, destroyers, cruisers, added 5 additional ships, and also rebalanced a bunch of modules in this upcoming patch, it is probably fairly safe to move your timeline up a bit. You guys are way to optimistic they promised us walking in stations and all we got YEARS latter was a 1 room bachlor pad with a DOOR that doesn't work. Welcome to Eve. Everyone here is an Evil Sick Sadistic Bastard who is out to get you. Anyone who tells you otherwise is either trying to scam you or use you.
Jerick Ludhowe The Nyan Cat Pirates Nyanpire 210	Posted - 2012.11.20 21:17:00 - [27] - Quote Boomhaur wrote: You guys are way to optimistic they promised us walking in stations and all we got YEARS latter was a 1 room bachlor pad with a DOOR that doesn't work. Yea... because building a graphic engine from the ground up and introducing thousands upon thousands of art files is even remotely comparable to a balance pass... Oh wait it's not. I'm not trying to white knight here but using incarna **** up as some kind of justification for the point that BC, BS, T3s, and Commands will not get a balance pass in a reasonable time frame is an utter fail. Especially considering we've had had more than 40 ships balanced within the past 3-4 months...
Perihelion Olenard Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 28	Posted - 2012.11.20 21:47:00 - [28] - Quote Jerick Ludhowe wrote: BCs will be early next year, re read blog Yes, that would be the spring/summer expansion. They don't have any specific release date. How about you re-read the blog?
Tyberius Franklin Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 369	Posted - 2012.11.20 21:53:00 - [29] - Quote Perihelion Olenard wrote: Jerick Ludhowe wrote: BCs will be early next year, re read blog Yes, that would be the spring/summer expansion. They don't have any specific release date. How about you re-read the blog? I wouldn't count the summer expansion as "early" next year. Also we got some rebalancing done in patches in the late summer after inferno. nothing to say it cannot happen again.
Jerick Ludhowe The Nyan Cat Pirates Nyanpire 211	Posted - 2012.11.20 22:12:00 - [30] - Quote Perihelion Olenard wrote: Jerick Ludhowe wrote: BCs will be early next year, re read blog Yes, that would be the spring/summer expansion. They don't have any specific release date. How about you re-read the blog? "Well thatGÇÖs pretty much it for now, remember this is just a vision for the beginning of 2013 and as such, not final. We have more balancing changes to be planned and released, so keep your eyes peeled for updates." While obviously not containing any specific dates the "beginning of 2013" most certainly does coincide with my statement about early next year, as next year does happen to be 2013... The entire dev blog is simply summing up their "vision" of changes they would like to introduce "for the beginning of 2013". I'm pretty much 100% certain that we will see at the very least a bc balance pass well before next summer's xpack.

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