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Proportion of new EVE players vs Old

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Kimsemus BURN EDEN Northern Coalition. 8	Posted - 2012.11.19 15:29:00 - [1] - Quote I was discussing this with some mates on TS while playing last night, and we got into an interesting topic about player proportions. I've been playing since 2003, and I used to notice a disproportionate number of older players, vs relatively fewer new players. In the past year, or maybe couple years, I've noticed greatly increased numbers of new characters/players, and fewer older players. I just wanted to get your guys perspective on player populations and changing demographics of characters/players. I feel personally that lots of new people is a good thing, it means a healthy game, but I've noticed that a lot of my fellow old timers are going into semi-retirement, moved on, or maybe I notice fewer outside of hardcore null PVP alliances because of higher populations...or maybe I'm just being an idiot and way off base. What are your thoughts?
Anslo BHEI Galactic Construction The Unforgiven Alliance 583	Posted - 2012.11.19 15:33:00 - [2] - Quote I think any game needs new blood to continue flowing. People can only play a game for so long before they move on. I wouldn't be surprised if this new vocal minority screaming about preserving Eve's "sanctity" are a minority of bitter vets reacting to this new influx. It's like in the real world. The young embrace change, the old consider it anathema. -\_For the Proveldtariat_/-
Alice Saki 19708	Posted - 2012.11.19 15:34:00 - [3] - Quote Bring back the old, Alot of my Friends have quit http://i.imgur.com/vXey1.png
Dr No Game Android Empire 0	Posted - 2012.11.19 15:36:00 - [4] - Quote You're welcome for the newbie tears :P
Galaxy Pig Caldari Provisions Caldari State 149	Posted - 2012.11.19 15:36:00 - [5] - Quote I welcome whippersnappers as long as they check their WoW attitude at the door ;) and a lot of them do seem to pick up the idea of EVE pretty quick.
Kenneth O'Hara Bareback Pornstars Fade 2 Black 4948	Posted - 2012.11.19 15:38:00 - [6] - Quote There's no such thing as a "new" player. It's a myth. They are all alts. Unless they really are a new player, then it's not a myth. Best thread ever!!! Stick around. I'm full of bad ideas. ~Isaac Clarke
Kimsemus BURN EDEN Northern Coalition. 10	Posted - 2012.11.19 15:39:00 - [7] - Quote I feel that a lot of new players are put off because they feel like that they will never be able to catch up to older chars from a SP perspective. I've always tried to tell them that once you hit around 12-15m SP, if you focused training to a few ships/fits the rest of the SP rarely matter, anything above that brings flexibility and variety. Sometimes I sit and talk about the T2 BPO lottery, mining in cruisers, corps having to pool isk for 1 battleship, the introduction of mining barges, nano nerf, etc, and people listen to me like I'm some kind of sorcerer making stories up.
Alice Saki 19710	Posted - 2012.11.19 15:42:00 - [8] - Quote Kimsemus wrote: I feel that a lot of new players are put off because they feel like that they will never be able to catch up to older chars from a SP perspective. I've always tried to tell them that once you hit around 12-15m SP, if you focused training to a few ships/fits the rest of the SP rarely matter, anything above that brings flexibility and variety. Sometimes I sit and talk about the T2 BPO lottery, mining in cruisers, corps having to pool isk for 1 battleship, the introduction of mining barges, nano nerf, etc, and people listen to me like I'm some kind of sorcerer making stories up. I'm always complaining about my SP and I've been playing a year xD Srsly It sucks :P http://i.imgur.com/vXey1.png
Kenneth O'Hara Bareback Pornstars Fade 2 Black 4950	Posted - 2012.11.19 15:47:00 - [9] - Quote Kimsemus wrote: I feel that a lot of new players are put off because they feel like that they will never be able to catch up to older chars from a SP perspective. I've always tried to tell them that once you hit around 12-15m SP, if you focused training to a few ships/fits the rest of the SP rarely matter, anything above that brings flexibility and variety. Sometimes I sit and talk about the T2 BPO lottery, mining in cruisers, corps having to pool isk for 1 battleship, the introduction of mining barges, nano nerf, etc, and people listen to me like I'm some kind of sorcerer making stories up. Oh yeah, I had new players listen to me the same way in WoW before I repented of my ways and started playing EVE. I kept most of the experience in running guilds and group management. Apparently those are usefull skills regardless of the game. I also realize that you can't start at the top of a mountain and expect to conquer it. You have to work your way up, fighting off the competition along the way to truly conquer. Best thread ever!!! Stick around. I'm full of bad ideas. ~Isaac Clarke
Colonel Xaven Decadence. RAZOR Alliance 195	Posted - 2012.11.19 15:47:00 - [10] - Quote Kimsemus wrote: Sometimes I sit and talk about the T2 BPO lottery, mining in cruisers, corps having to pool isk for 1 battleship, the introduction of mining barges, nano nerf, etc, and people listen to me like I'm some kind of sorcerer making stories up. I started in 2007 and I, too, feel like an old man, sitting on the campfire and telling the kids my stories about old times. Feels weird. But, EvE is not a casual game and the new players who actually stay in the game for longer are a real benefit to the game. Here we can assume they are open for shifting their mind and adapt, go new ways, think before acting etc. Those who do not survive the first time, wouldn't be of any benefit at all. www.facebook.com/RazorAlliance
Norm Tempesta The Konvergent League Sev3rance 10	Posted - 2012.11.19 15:51:00 - [11] - Quote Alice Saki wrote: Kimsemus wrote: I feel that a lot of new players are put off because they feel like that they will never be able to catch up to older chars from a SP perspective. I've always tried to tell them that once you hit around 12-15m SP, if you focused training to a few ships/fits the rest of the SP rarely matter, anything above that brings flexibility and variety. Sometimes I sit and talk about the T2 BPO lottery, mining in cruisers, corps having to pool isk for 1 battleship, the introduction of mining barges, nano nerf, etc, and people listen to me like I'm some kind of sorcerer making stories up. I'm always complaining about my SP and I've been playing a year xD Srsly It sucks :P Haha, don't worry, it never changes. It will keep sucking .
Kenneth O'Hara Bareback Pornstars Fade 2 Black 4953	Posted - 2012.11.19 15:57:00 - [12] - Quote Kimsemus wrote: I feel that a lot of new players are put off because they feel like that they will never be able to catch up to older chars from a SP perspective. I've always tried to tell them that once you hit around 12-15m SP, if you focused training to a few ships/fits the rest of the SP rarely matter, anything above that brings flexibility and variety. Sometimes I sit and talk about the T2 BPO lottery, mining in cruisers, corps having to pool isk for 1 battleship, the introduction of mining barges, nano nerf, etc, and people listen to me like I'm some kind of sorcerer making stories up. pulls up a chair next to the camp fire, starts eating a can of pork and beans So how was it back in the day? What all has changed? Best thread ever!!! Stick around. I'm full of bad ideas. ~Isaac Clarke
Ptraci 3 R Corporation The Irukandji 715	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:02:00 - [13] - Quote Kenneth O'Hara wrote: pulls up a chair next to the camp fire, starts eating a can of pork and beans So how was it back in the day? What all has changed? Problem is he's so old, he probably doesn't even remember anymore. We old farts tend to repeat ourselves a lot. And we also tend to repeat ourselves.
Dave stark Black Nova Corp. R O G U E 661	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:04:00 - [14] - Quote did some one mention training skills? Reading my posts is like panning for gold; most it will be useless, but occasionally you'll find a nugget of gold.
Kimsemus BURN EDEN Northern Coalition. 11	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:07:00 - [15] - Quote I think one think that has persevered in the community as a whole, and something that I am happy about, is that EVE enjoys a much higher level of maturity than most other MMOs, partially because the complicated nature of the game scares off the stupid, but also because older players that mentor younger players instil a certain set of values and etiquette. Of course there are exceptions to every rule, but over all I'm happy to see the "old ways" being carried on by many new players. The fact that after nine years we still drop a "gf" in local after most fights as a universal sign that one side has conceded, or acknowledges a good opponent, is testament to this.
Demolishar United Aggression 440	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:07:00 - [16] - Quote All the old players made swarms of alts. They don't seem to realise it's self-destructive as they are destroying the "ecosystem" of EVE by marginalising the new players.
Mr Pragmatic 76	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:09:00 - [17] - Quote Its hard for new players to enjoy the game b/c soloing is boring. Unlike most MMOs you can go around and never talk to a soul if you don't need too. Maybe this world is another planet's hell. -Aldous Huxley
Kara Vix Perkone Caldari State 92	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:10:00 - [18] - Quote I think an MMO is like a nations economy, it needs growth and an influx of new people to sustain itself, if it relies too heavily upon the older players then its headed for a bust. Emergent gameplay, which is all the rave these days, is fine, but as another game designer pointed out, its bad in the long run to let the griefers control the environment (paraphrase). Eve will figure this out and balance its universe accordingly and then I think it will enjoy more growth. I have some old friends from when I began in June 03 on my notice list but haven't seen them log on for years, but thats ok, I have more newer friends on that list now.
Dave stark Black Nova Corp. R O G U E 662	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:16:00 - [19] - Quote Mr Pragmatic wrote: Its hard for new players to enjoy the game b/c soloing is boring. Unlike most MMOs you can go around and never talk to a soul if you don't need too. which defeats the whole purpose of an mmo. Reading my posts is like panning for gold; most it will be useless, but occasionally you'll find a nugget of gold.

Chribba Otherworld Enterprises Otherworld Empire 5525	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:17:00 - [20] - Quote Probably because there's about 100k pilots being born each month... GÿàGÿàGÿà Secure 3rd party service GÿàGÿàGÿà Visit my in-game channel 'Holy Veldspar' Follow me on Twitter @Chribba

Kimsemus BURN EDEN Northern Coalition. 12	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:21:00 - [21] - Quote Chribba wrote: Probably because there's about 100k pilots being born each month... Chribba you've been around a long time too, whats your perception of how the community has changed?
Kenneth O'Hara Bareback Pornstars Fade 2 Black 4956	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:24:00 - [22] - Quote Kimsemus wrote: Chribba wrote: Probably because there's about 100k pilots being born each month... Chribba you've been around a long time too, whats your perception of how the community has changed? Also, another thing we have to consider or question is if these "new" players being created are actually new players or just alts from multiboxed accounts. Best thread ever!!! Stick around. I'm full of bad ideas. ~Isaac Clarke
Hemmo Paskiainen Armenian Noodle Dip 371	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:28:00 - [23] - Quote well, normaly i dont forum too much too serieus but letme tell you something that might be reconizable for you. I have played for almost 5 yrs non stop 2-5 hours of eve aday. This was in the time that not much game imporvemnts were done. To not troll ccp or be rude mad or whatever i keep it to my personal opinions now. I felt for quet a while neglected. Like horrible "i dont want your anyway", neglected. But i was addiced to this wonderfull fun game. I mean love it. Done most things someone could do in eve. From one side i want to play this game but overtime i traded all my positive associations with this game for bad associations. Negative ones. So basicly everytime i loaded on eve, subcontionious it got a negative charge in my brain (are you still following me? srry my english could be poor sometimes, but meh who cares rly if you understand me? exept the troll to troll trolls.. lols). These negative associations were enhanced by poor communications and qlueless & pointless new changes (like cloths are more important than unbalanced ships right? & the supercap whoopsy). These associations are realy hard to change on a mind level, its some psyco stuff (dont rly want to bore you too much with it). If you would analyse player statsics and the outflow of old players there is not only new implenmentations and communication important, also the direct play environment and what people associate with that. I will be giving a direct example that prolly get trolled but its how it works on a psycic level. Tech is unbalanced, many people still associate tech with ccp failur (favouritism ect). A direct concequence of this failure is Test & hbc in the south. Southrn players associate all the trolling of test and they just being there due ccp failure. Basicly they load the negative associations from the direct play environment. On a psycic level the game turned into crap because of repeatable failure. It isnt that bad if it gets reconnized and such but if neglected than the synargy (htf do i write with without using a translator :p) is again neglection and in the brain you take it more serious and more real (authentic) and thus addic more subcontious value to that. But this is on a negative way. Its bad, it makes you dont even want to undock and you ask yourselve..... why boot i this game up and dont want to undock anymore? Like you want to play the game but once you reconize it, something triggers in the brain that makes you load the negativity and thus bye bye your will to play. Since eve targets a clever high intellegence target group that is smart and have good memories its rly a bad situation. Like rly bad. Its like apple losing its apple stores. Add the social aspect, butterfly aspect and the communication possiblilities (teamspeak, vent ect) and you can compare it to a flue. Everytime something bad get implementend it go's around again and it enhanced the association on a positive or negative way. So the circle is round. In short too many negative associations with the game environment makes old people leave. In addiction to the negative association factors i can rly recommend ccp to fix certain stuff really quick. Like tech, supers, broken, goons (you were warned with tech change ccp, sack the devteam who's idea it was), sov system ect that directly influence the older vert generations area's, like 0.0. Basicly im personaly predicting that it will continue untill these stuffs are fixed or eve drops below its activity break even point where its outflow is bigger than its imput and isnt fixable anymore. So meh, in short,.... i should get payed for doing ccp's work of finding this stuff out CCP FIX BLACK OPS FFS [url]http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/9679/whatihavedoneineve.jpg[/url]
Kara Vix Perkone Caldari State 93	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:30:00 - [24] - Quote With all due respect Hemmo, if you want people to read your thoughts you need be more concise. Reading a wall of text is just too arduous.
Mathrin Synthetic Solution Synthetic Systems 1	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:31:00 - [25] - Quote I've been playing for around 4 years and am the oldest of my current friends and corp. some of my members I have recruited as day old players. It's good to see them as solid members of the group now. New members are a good thing as long as we train them right.
Max Doobie Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State 12	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:32:00 - [26] - Quote To me a lot of vets are irritating. They see themselves as important in a game so they use their "status to talk down to new players in an effort to make themselves feel more relevant. It's extremely lame to me. It's similar to how old people IRL talk rap about the younger generation to boost themselves because they failed at life, meanwhile they have the new Iphone 5 being delivered in the mail...the times must not be all that bad, eh? Then you have vets who use their experience to help others and overall make the game a better place. The Bitter Vets better thank these types because without them noobs would be leaving in even larger droves. You guys say EVE is player sustained, right? So then you should take responsibility for the retention rates and it starts with the attitudes some of you have towards us. I'm not asking for my hand to be held. Simple and basic respect, for one, towards us when we ask a simple question that to YOU may seem silly goes a long way. Or how about giving a logical and reasonable rebuttal to our concerns if you feel they are unwarranted instead of bashing and name calling? This is an MMO. Who the hell wants to PAY to play with a bunch of self-righteous douchebags??? It's the MAIN reason I left WoW; the community got unbearable. It was as if there was a competition between vets for who could be the biggest a**hole to noobs and each other. Meanwhile I was the level 80/85 helping noobs with quests running them through dungeons, helping them out with gold, teaching them the game, connecting them to guilds that would be a good fit for them based on their long term aspirations. It was fun too, it wasn't a burden at all. Bottom line, vets in ALL MMOs need to take responsibility for the state of the community because they're the ones who influence it the most.
Hemmo Paskiainen Armenian Noodle Dip 371	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:34:00 - [27] - Quote Kara Vix wrote: With all due respect Hemmo, if you want people to read your thoughts you need be more concise. Reading a wall of text is just too arduous. i know, dont care, its full with horrible grammar failre aswell... meh who cares lols CCP FIX BLACK OPS FFS [url]http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/9679/whatihavedoneineve.jpg[/url]
Spurty V0LTA Verge of Collapse 574	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:35:00 - [28] - Quote Kimsemus wrote: Sometimes I sit and talk about the T2 BPO lottery, mining in cruisers, corps having to pool isk for 1 battleship, the introduction of mining barges, nano nerf, etc, and people listen to me like I'm some kind of sorcerer making stories up. Amen Big != Better either. Give me 30 pilots that know there ship and role in the fight over 1,000 animated window lickers in rifters any day. --- "Also, your boobs" - CCP Eterne (Still writing great prose!)
Kara Vix Perkone Caldari State 96	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:36:00 - [29] - Quote Hemmo Paskiainen wrote: Kara Vix wrote: With all due respect Hemmo, if you want people to read your thoughts you need be more concise. Reading a wall of text is just too arduous. i know, dont care, its full with horrible grammar failre aswell... meh who cares lols Oh I dont judge grammar and such, not everyone was taught english in school. Was suggesting you use fewer words to state your opinion then more will read it. Was constructive criticism
Hemmo Paskiainen Armenian Noodle Dip 371	Posted - 2012.11.19 16:36:00 - [30] - Quote Kara Vix wrote: Hemmo Paskiainen wrote: Kara Vix wrote: With all due respect Hemmo, if you want people to read your thoughts you need be more concise. Reading a wall of text is just too arduous. i know, dont care, its full with horrible grammar failre aswell... meh who cares lols Oh I dont judge grammar and such, not everyone was taught english in school. Was suggesting you use fewer words to state your opinion then more will read it. Was constructive criticism in that case i log in for you and send you 500 mil CCP FIX BLACK OPS FFS [url]http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/9679/whatihavedoneineve.jpg[/url]

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