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Vashna
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Posted - 2005.04.23 14:47:00 -
[1]
What about a no clone? Clone make the game a little non sense... you are simply immortal... in to an rpg immortality is a total flaw I think...
With no clone there is much more tactical considerations... more feel of fear... more reality... you cannot simply say: if things go bad I always have a clone... :(
At least you can let player choose... hard core playing or normal playing... with bonuses for the hardcore characters...
It is my opinion...
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Helmut 314
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Posted - 2005.04.23 14:51:00 -
[2]
There is this game out there called Diablo II that offers that playmode. Maybe you should investigate that ?
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Trying is the first step of failure
- Homer J Simpson |
Skogen Gump
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Posted - 2005.04.23 14:51:00 -
[3]
Someone wake me up when EVE becomes a Role Play Game :)
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Vashna
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Posted - 2005.04.23 14:54:00 -
[4]
Well I want this feature in eve... immortality is too easy... wanted criminal that buy a clone and get killed by friends for dividing money of the bounty is easy...
"The clone save my ass" is a **** thing
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James Draekn
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Posted - 2005.04.23 16:24:00 -
[5]
Just hope you don't run into people who like to pod people for fun. This will hurt the newer player far more then the experienced ones.
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Shira d'Radonis
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Posted - 2005.04.23 18:14:00 -
[6]
Well, if people want to have a special option to play the hard/impossible no clone way, that's one thing... but surely you can't expect EVE to even be playable if there were no clones at all and dying meant your character was eliminated...
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ôàquod ad ius naturale attinet, omnes homines aequales suntö
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Troye
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Posted - 2005.04.23 18:21:00 -
[7]
There is already a massive "fear" of being ganked and poded cos you lose so much. if anything they need to decrease the damage inflicted on a char when you die, then maybe people would be more temped to stay and fight as opposed to warping/logging off whenever things get ugly.
(\_/)
(O.o)
(> <)This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world domination. |
Vashna
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Posted - 2005.04.23 19:41:00 -
[8]
Well at least they can put that a clone price is about 50 mil of isk... or something like it... in two words... there is clones but you cannot buy them like mc donalds burgers!!
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Sicori Malaki
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Posted - 2005.04.24 03:23:00 -
[9]
stu pid
take other MMORPG games, like WoW, you are immortal there, and you wont even loose your stuff. only the 5 minutes it takes to find your corpse. other MMOG have "immortal" players not loosing anything as well.
there is already enough "risk" in eve, if you get in combat and die you loose your ship, your modules your cargo, everything. isn't that enough risk without making you risk loosing say, 2 years of training time?
if you ask me, EvE is the only "real" mmog that offers real "risk" when doing day to day stuff.
like I said, stu pid and ill thought out idea that would only serve your needs.
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Only in the Tales that humans tell, do the hunters kill the wolf in the end.
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Lagar
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Posted - 2005.04.24 08:30:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Lagar on 24/04/2005 08:31:14
Vashna: your idea is absoloutly no sence.. no one will be in 0.0 and considering the risk of permanently losing the char, would cause the game to quickly become playerless.. and the game would be full of alts and all T2 ships would be for the longest survivals.. this would quickly make a corp superior and any person who's lost have a long time to catch up..
peeps are Afraid enough of 0.0 space, no clones would mean the deathblow of EVE as a game
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Hayzo
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Posted - 2005.04.24 08:44:00 -
[11]
ok, so if you have no clone, you die after about 3 months, loose all your SP, and re-enter the game in an Ibis. my friend, your a genius.
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"Sanity Is Not Statistical" |
Vashna
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Posted - 2005.04.24 11:23:00 -
[12]
1. I do not offended any one sicori malaki... so here the stu pid is you..
2.I say clone must have a more high price... just for not let immortality be so simple to acquire..
3. I know much players that like this type of gaming simply because it take real hard risks... like in diablo 2 hardcore gaming: only the one that play in hardcore can be considered real professional players... all others are amateurs...
4. we are here to discuss about topics... if you simply say you dumb, you idiot, you insante, without posting some alternative or ideas... pls do not reply to this topic
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Fester Addams
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Posted - 2005.04.24 11:27:00 -
[13]
Clones are needed, as this game cant rely on permadeath you have to have a way to wake the dead.
Personally I think it would be interesting if you needed standing with a station in order to use their clone facilities.
Simply force people who play on the bad side to have to go a long way to get their clone uppdated.
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Vashna
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Posted - 2005.04.24 11:43:00 -
[14]
this can be an idea fester for take us in a middle way between clone and no clone
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Fester Addams
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Posted - 2005.04.24 12:05:00 -
[15]
This is in reality a tad off topic but...
In reality I have a tough time understanding why all stations allow all players to dock.
Say I have a -5 standing with Amarr navy, why on earth should they allow me to dock in their station?
Likewise having a low security standing should affect the stations behavior, lats say I have -10 security status, this would represent I am one of the universes most sought after criminals, why on earth would then concord assembly allow such a criminal to not only dock, but trade in the station, repair his ship, refit it with weapons and then launch back into space.
Yes I know, the station guns will fire on the ship as it tries to dock or undock... well I have seen -10 people dock in concord stations so its doable.
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Vashna
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Posted - 2005.04.24 12:12:00 -
[16]
Well this is another very bad point... -10 player that trade in concord starbases LOL
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Hayzo
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Posted - 2005.04.24 16:21:00 -
[17]
 Quote:
if you simply say you dumb, you idiot, you insante,
well you are, and youve spelt insane wrong.
Quote:
without posting some alternative or ideas... pls do not reply to this topic
Alt idea:
how about, not.
Quote:
At least you can let player choose... hard core playing or normal playing... with bonuses for the hardcore characters...
look at it this way; EVE already has a very, very steep learning curve. if you put this in, new players are essentially screwed.
also, true hardcore gamers are quite rare, EVE is the kinda game you can pick up and play, once you've learned the basics. i think theres normally around 10,000 playes online, you will be lucky if 1,000 of them are hardcore gamers.
EVE is a time consuming game, it can take months to train for a ship. doing this will waste the time of many, and ppl are not gonna keep paying ú10 (...or 10 euros... or whatever) just to keep wasting their time.
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"Sanity Is Not Statistical" |
Vashna
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Posted - 2005.04.25 01:23:00 -
[18]
OMFG!! A retarded guy...
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Troye
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Posted - 2005.04.25 01:42:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Troye on 25/04/2005 01:42:42
Originally by: Vashna
OMFG!! A retarded guy...
Lol @ Vashna, how is he retarded? I dont think you realise how badly having no clone would effect Eve, every1 wud leave for a start.
So i spend 2 years training up my char into the best PvP, miner, manufacterer around then in the blink of an eye i cud lose it all cos of some dumbass who decides to pod me...
Yeah GREAT idea! you shud get a job as a CCP dev
(\_/)
(O.o)
(> <)This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world domination. |
Blind Man
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Posted - 2005.04.25 02:51:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Helmut 314
There is this game out there called Diablo II that offers that playmode. Maybe you should investigate that ?
lol I still play that while servers are down on eve 
(\_/)
(O.o)
(> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world domination. |
Vashna
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Posted - 2005.04.25 11:13:00 -
[21]
Well you lose all this Troye if you make PvP or go in low security systems... if you do: miner, trader, scientist, manufacter, hauler... you don't risk so much...
if you want to kill other ppl... show to other your tactical abilities... make the "great one" againe the other, then there must be some risks... TOO EASY MAKE "THE GREAT ONE" IN EVE IF YOU ARE IMMORTAL(or if the clone is too easy to acqure and maintain updated)...just for this I say he is a retarded. TOO EASY
CCP can find a solution that bring us between TOO EASY and TOO HARD... but I know that some "GREAT PLAYERS" have fear to be killed and lose their so EASY immortality.
Over all that... EVE is a great game anyway...
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Andrew Redburn
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Posted - 2005.04.25 12:40:00 -
[22]
mate, I don't know about you, but if I get killed, I usually loose at leat 30-100M plus for the ship (BS being the cheapest, HAC the most expensive) plus have to buy a new clone for 12M. Now add all implants I currently got.
My last death costed me an Assault Frigate worth 100M, my clone and 2* +3 imps and 4 attribute imps. Now calculate that it takes me at least 10hours playing time to regain what I lost in the best case, this IS some loss.
In WoW you loose max 10Mins of time for running to your dead body plus 1-4g for repairs. That's it. And the risk being killed in EVE is quite superior if you are in 0.0 and doing PvP.
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dimiz
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Posted - 2005.04.25 16:56:00 -
[23]
This has to be one of the dum best ideas ever on the forums.
Problem currently in eve is that ppl are too afraid to leave empire space because of the major risks - lose ship, maybe named modules and implants is no fun.
This whole discussion is absurd, it's never going to happen unless CCP really wants an "exodus". Let it drop.
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Tummass
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Posted - 2005.04.25 17:04:00 -
[24]
OK you say you dont want clone option... ok do up your clone skill just once... leave it at basic. go get 3-4 mill skill points and go out and get killed. see if you like idea of no clone when skill points that took you 2 months to learn you now have to relearn and you cant even use your Battle ship for the time being.....
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Hayzo
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Posted - 2005.04.25 18:46:00 -
[25]
Quote:
OMFG!! A retarded guy...
forgive me, but ibelive youre the "retard guy."
you simply do not relize how much of a step in the wrong direction this would be.
you would decrease EVEs playerbase dramatically by doing this.
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"Sanity Is Not Statistical" |
OMC Conscript
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Posted - 2005.04.26 22:30:00 -
[26]
Are you alright??
We want more pvp not less. You should be very careful when you say crap like that out loud, CCP may actually implment it ...lol
If your plan is to destroy the game completly, thats a great plan Best idea i've heard on wrecking the game to date,(though i haven't seen the up coming patch notes.. ..lol).
If you want to see death more permanate might i sugest a lawn chair and a bug zapper.
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Tisiph0ne
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Posted - 2005.04.26 23:06:00 -
[27]
The idea: that conflict should make you lose something.
Well it is flawed, because conflict was meant to be a secondary result of having attempted to gain something, especially as a group.
In this game all you have is a ship and a bank account. You don't have territory or really anything to risk.
You can't stop or destroy a rival because there is nothing to destroy but his endless supply of ships. At the most efficient end of this model, everyone will pursue combat through alts and superior numbers and cowardly tactics. We carebear griefers call this the CS mentality.. the ball is in CCPs court to come up with higher game objectives than griefing people as individuals rather than as groups.
All this insta-achievement is the real grief.
Gimme stuff to build in space CCP! For the love of Jove! It's been like.. let's see 1998.. carry the 2.. 3 years already! Geez.
Who the hell cares about turret balancing! Gimme deployable towers and refining arrays in space!
Don't make our pod deaths in vain. Let us help others die for an actual cause.
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Hayzo
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Posted - 2005.04.27 09:14:00 -
[28]
martyrs => yes
perma-death => no
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"Sanity Is Not Statistical" |
Waut
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Posted - 2005.04.27 10:06:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Waut on 27/04/2005 10:11:26
Edited by: Waut on 27/04/2005 10:09:08
Edited by: Waut on 27/04/2005 10:07:33
Originally by: Helmut 314
There is this game out there called Diablo II that offers that playmode. Maybe you should investigate that ?
yes but in diablo 2 you could reach a high level in a matter of DAYS.
In Eve, we are speaking of loosing MONTHS of experience.
Who on earth will start all over again when suddenly a year of playing is down the drain?
It could only work if it was on a different server (so you can choose) and where you learn everything a hell of a lot faster than in normal Eve
Dumbest. Idea. Ever
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Frost Killer
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Posted - 2005.04.27 14:06:00 -
[30]
Yup no way.
Example for some expensive setups of dying
A nice rare faction ship with faction loot, hmmm tahts at least 4-12bil isk. Now say it takes a week or so to even get a bil isk (and this is totally inflated for most people). 4-12 weeks or 3months to get back to where he was if he can even get that faction ship (if its a rare pirate faction one).
Then you got implants, say by some stupid chance your loaded with +5's Thats antoehr 4bil isk, and some other rare hardwired mods. Then ontop of that the best clone is about the cheapest at around 17mil isk.
Ok so say 4months to a year to get back ontop from the loss of that. Now say you have 30mil SP, and loose that in a blink of an eye. Right there thats 2 years of gettin him up to that point!
As said in Diablo you can max out in a month or 2 of gaming. EVE is totally different, at least a while back it would take years to max out SP. Only way this could happen is if you had some sort of LVL grinding crap brought into the game, and increased learning abilities.
So no clones = bad m'kay. Increased clone cost I could see, or maybe buying multi clones for a discount if increased clone costs comes in but getting rid of clones is not the way to go.
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Ummm ya.... |
Jawas
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Posted - 2005.04.27 17:59:00 -
[31]
Apart from the loss of SP, most of that can be accounted for by the corp you are with. If they decide to send you out to guard a sector, they should take responsibility if you lose your ship and items that can be replaced by financial means.
As for SP, that's something different. Obviously the best clones are not enough to hold a maxed out player but could there be a reason for that? It makes a podder a bit more wary about who they take on, no matter how good you are, there's always someone better. If you are going to lose half your skill points in a few seconds, would you stick around?
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Xotic
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Posted - 2006.05.24 09:11:00 -
[32]
You all seem to be forgetting a very important thing. the second level clone and higher are optionally. If you want fear, if you want death. Then don't uprade your clone.
But don't come crying when you get podded by a guy, who used the option to upgrade his clone.
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Drizit
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Posted - 2006.05.24 10:07:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Xotic
You all seem to be forgetting a very important thing. the second level clone and higher are optionally. If you want fear, if you want death. Then don't uprade your clone.
But don't come crying when you get podded by a guy, who used the option to upgrade his clone.
I read all the way to here with the intention of saying the exact same thing.
If you want to play hardcore and not have a clone, it's fine by me but don't impose this rule on everyone else.
CCP already knows that no clone = no players end of story. End of Eve I certainly wouldn't pay CCP so I could remain in a noob ship forever.
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Reggie Stoneloader
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Posted - 2006.05.25 08:55:00 -
[34]
Yeah, it's pretty much a terrible idea. SP is the ladder we climb, isk is the grind. Losing isk is a setback. That's your risk, your reward, your thrill. Losing SP is a blow against your identity and functionality. It hurts your investment in the game and shakes your interest. Gaining SP is a long trip, and nobody wants to backtrack on that road.
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Iron Wraith
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Posted - 2006.05.25 09:28:00 -
[35]
aww, beaten to it by 2 other people
but yeah, juuust incase its missed, diablo hardcore mode = newbie clone.
1: undock
2: eject
3: self destruct pod
4: dont buy a new clone
TADA!!! you are playing the game in hardcore mode. so there you have it. you can already do what you want to do. and yes it can be thrilling and very very scary. i've heard stories of pvpers going out on an alliance opp then realising half way through that they forgot to buy a new clone after their last death. luckily they managed to warp their pod out and get home to by a new clone after they were shot down in battle.
so, smile, you have your wish
as for more isk for a clone. no thank you. its bad enough not having the 8mill isk for my clone at the moment, if i needed 50 mill for my clone i'd be safe in empire running missions again and not on the front line with my alliance throwing my ships at the hordes of evil. all i hope is when i do go down i'm in my BS not my ceptor so i can afford a new clone from the insurance payout  .
and as for the RP aspect of cloning. planet dwellers A cant afford clones and B dont walk abount in a pod guaranteeing a perfect mind transfer. thats why we are immortal. their lifes pale in comparison to ours. we are like gods to them, even the youngest of us would be able to buy their home, school, hostpital and funeral parlour and ensure a swift run through life at the hands of a sadistic killer. the richest of us could buy out entire planets and if they so wished sell the occupants into slavery. of course there would be plenty of other pilots willing to stop such an act of evil, but minmatar and amarr never did see eye to eye over that topic
and the pod actually destroys you, when it detects its destruction it injects you with a powerfull drug that nukes your brain but allows it to take a perfect snap shot of your mind. so when your in a new clone pay a thought for your last one. it could still be alive in a partially destroyed pod but completly brain dead....
Because sometimes you just have to go back to your roots:
[2005.02.20 01:08:03] (combat) Your Civilian Light Electron Blaster perfectly strikes Serpentis Smuggler, wrecking for 20.3 damage. |
Cyberus
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Posted - 2006.05.25 12:07:00 -
[36]
NO way!!!!!!!!!!!. i did play eve since the begining and beleave me ppl did cry to CCp to get clones in game. Why?? Simple... I play now for 3 years and dont realy want in 1 day lose all my skillpoints. If it happence i just simply will stop play this game, because i'm not realy interesting then spend other 3 years to get this 37 mil sp back. This idea is crazy and i not support those. Just think about what happence if your pod will be killed. Ask this qwestion to you self -> Do you wanna be a 1 day old noob like you was before when you started play this game? Dont think so!!!!
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