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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 18 post(s) |
Callic Veratar
Power of the Phoenix
277
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Posted - 2012.11.21 16:46:00 -
[31] - Quote
The only places I can think that would work for the new Subsystems icons would be under the Ship subsections and possibly as a method to further sub-divide the faction sections (ie all Republic Fleet Ammo). |
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
123
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Posted - 2012.11.21 16:50:00 -
[32] - Quote
John DaiSho wrote:Salpad wrote:A feature request: I'd like to be able to cancel my Buy Orders and Sell Orders from the Market window, instead of having to go the my Wallet and re-finding the order there. I can already modify the Orders I've created from the Market window, so why can't I also cancel them?
This has been posted several times in the "Soundwave, HALP!" little things thread, too. Its something that would be VERY handy. So pleeeeeaaaaaase do it :) o7 John
I've thought about posting it in the Little Things thread, on several occasions, but I've made a lot of other posts in that thread, and I'm not sure how much attention CCP pays to new threads. So I opted for here instead.
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Desmont McCallock
218
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Posted - 2012.11.21 16:51:00 -
[33] - Quote
I have 3 words for you.
"Was" "About" "Time" |
Sarrian Calda
The Lost Legion
6
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:01:00 -
[34] - Quote
Nice touch! How about a re-arrangement of the order of the way the items are listed in the market?
Currently, the items aren't seemed to be following any particular order when listed in the market tree.
I'm a missile user, so allow me to use missile launchers as example. 
To me, it seemed to be logical that the "light" stuffs should be at the top, since that would be what everyone begins the game with. Then as a player progresses through the game and learns the rope of "heavier" stuffs, then he/she will scroll further down to find the big guns.
However, the current order in Missile Launchers category is:
- Citadel Launchers
- Cruise Launchers
- Heavy Assault Launchers
- Heavy Launchers
- Light Missile Launchers
- Rapid Light Missile Launchers
- Rocket Launchers
- Torpedo Launchers
From top to bottom, it goes from Capital--sized weapon, to Battleship, to Cruiser-sized, to Frigates, and the last one back to Battleship. A bit odd, no? If we are to follow the progression path of skills or ship-size, it should be sorted like this:
- Rocket Launchers
- Light Missile Launchers
- Rapid Light Missile Launchers
- Heavy Launchers
- Heavy Assault Launchers
- Cruise Missile Launchers
- Torpedo Launchers
- Citadel Launchers
Or in reverse order, if you think the heavy stuffs should go on top. But as a sub-cap player, I honestly hope that I can filter things that I don't even plan to use out of the way, like the other suggestion earlier in this thread. Anyway, it's a separate topic. 
Next, the order of the items within the sub-categories.
Let's look at the Cruise Missile Launchers.
Right now, I see them listed as:
- Cruise Missile Launcher I
- 'Arbalest' Cruise Launcher I
- 'Limos' Cruise Launcher I
- 'Malkuth' Cruise Launcher I
- XT-9000 Cruise Launcher I
- Cruise Missile Launcher II
Again, I don't see what is the exact logic used here in the sorting system. Probably along the line of Tech 1 > Ascending Alphabetical order > Tech 2.
However, in practicality, the efficiency of the launchers mattered more than the name of the modules, since the naming convention doesn't follow alphabetical or numerical order to show its ascending power. As such, when I was still new to New Eden, I constantly had to force myself to memorize the names of the best Tech 1 item by manually going through each item to see its stats and compare, and that still continues whenever I venture into a group of modules that I rarely use.
In my opinion, if the items are sorted in terms of its efficiency, something that the Meta Level seems to represent, we can cut down the time a new (or forgetful pilot) spends on running through half the list only to find out that actually the first module after the base Tech 1 module is the best named T1 module. Some game/server performance saver there, perhaps? Less click too? Less market order requests to server if the pilot selected each item instead of clicking the information icon straight?
So, in terms of efficiency and functionality, the Cruise Launchers should be listed this way, in ascending order:
- Cruise Missile Launcher I
- 'Malkuth' Cruise Launcher I
- 'Limos' Cruise Launcher I
- XT-9000 Cruise Launcher I
- 'Arbalest' Cruise Launcher I
- Cruise Missile Launcher II
For some modules that I've previously compared, the Meta Level seems to correlate to the efficiency of the module as a whole. So in a sense, the higher Meta Level an item is, the more desirable it is. T2 requires more skill to operate than T1, but since their Meta Level is higher than the best named T1 module anyway, it fits into this sorting logic naturally.
This way, a player instinctively knows which tier of module he is looking for, without even knowing the name of the module beforehand. So, for a non-gun player like me, if one day I decide to go Hybrid, I can go into the market and pick the module above the T2 variant straight away without the need to verify whether is it the "best" named T1 module.
That said, I think the turrets could use some love to re-organize them into different sub-categories as well, since, for example, the Large Railguns have only 3 sizes: 350mm, 425mm and Dual 250mm. They are meant for different purposes as well, right? Larger calibers for long range, smaller calibers for shorter range. This would in practical sense have "categorized" themselves already, so why not put them into actual categories for easy sorting?
And, I think it should go from Short Range > Medium Range > Long Range to be aligned with the ascending sort order with the rest.
Thoughts |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
949
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:02:00 -
[35] - Quote
Grideris wrote:Separate categories for different sized plates/different resistances? Has Christmas come early?!
Hahahah Christmas. Funny guy.
Content Designer | Team Five 0
@regnerBA |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
949
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:03:00 -
[36] - Quote
Valkyrs wrote:Maybe consider putting ALL the items on the market, and for the ones that aren't allowed (essentially the ones you haven't added yet) put a little blurb "Item not available from market, click HERE to view in contracts" which then, obviously, opens the contract window with the given search.
Honestly if I find something that is not on the market I just add it. It takes me less effort to add it than it would to create any kind of link. I just need to hunt down all the things not there.
Content Designer | Team Five 0
@regnerBA |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
949
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:04:00 -
[37] - Quote
Xearal wrote:- Targetting annoying Market behaviour
- Target Locked
- CCP , FOXFOUR!
- Annoying Marketting behaviour is hit for over 9000 anti-papercut damage!
- Annoying Marketting behaviour has been destroyed.
Whooohoo !!!
Score another victory against the papercuts!
\o/ YAY! Death to little things!
Content Designer | Team Five 0
@regnerBA |
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Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
793
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:04:00 -
[38] - Quote
Sarrian Calda wrote:However, the current order in Missile Launchers category is: - Citadel Launchers
- Cruise Launchers
- Heavy Assault Launchers
- Heavy Launchers
- Light Missile Launchers
- Rapid Light Missile Launchers
- Rocket Launchers
- Torpedo Launchers
From top to bottom, it goes from Capital--sized weapon, to Battleship, to Cruiser-sized, to Frigates, and the last one back to Battleship. A bit odd, no? If we are to follow the progression path of skills or ship-size, it should be sorted like this: - Rocket Launchers
- Light Missile Launchers
- Rapid Light Missile Launchers
- Heavy Launchers
- Heavy Assault Launchers
- Cruise Missile Launchers
- Torpedo Launchers
- Citadel Launchers
Or in reverse order, if you think the heavy stuffs should go on top. But as a sub-cap player, I honestly hope that I can filter things that I don't even plan to use out of the way, like the other suggestion earlier in this thread. Anyway, it's a separate topic.
Alphabetic order, vs 'strength' Except rockets aren't lighter than Light missile launchers. They're a different type of weapon. Ditto with cruises and Torps.
FuzzWork Enterprises
http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/
Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.As well as mysql and CSV/XLS conversions of the Static Data Extract. |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
949
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:04:00 -
[39] - Quote
Crynsos Cealion wrote:Now it would be great if we actually could sell exploration loot like faction POS towers / modules and the various faction drones on the market as well.
All of those things are on the market as of Retribution...
See what I did there? I did awesome!
Content Designer | Team Five 0
@regnerBA |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
950
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:06:00 -
[40] - Quote
Fade Toblack wrote:@ CCP FoxFour - how about moving some of the low-value, drops-a-lot in missions stuff to the market? "Elite Drone AI" is my most obvious item. Selling some of this stuff on contract compared to the market is painful. I'd suggest getting somebody to run some data on stuff that's sold on contract either for low-values or in large quantities, and prioritising that list. Salpad wrote:I'd like to be able to cancel my Buy Orders and Sell Orders from the Market window, instead of having to go the my Wallet and re-finding the order there. Have you seen the "orders" tab on the Market Window?
This is a good idea. If my other plan fails I shall look into that. I am trying to find the best way to find things not listed on the market. Easier said than done apparently.
Content Designer | Team Five 0
@regnerBA |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
950
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:07:00 -
[41] - Quote
Arydanika wrote:Rejoice OCD sufferers & neurotics in New Eden! Rejoice!
Fantastic work on re-categorizing the market as well as the icon updates. I once saw Foxfour bravely take on four nerds raging about random game mechanics with only his wit and a single beer. Not even that display of greatness could have properly prepared me for textual delights found in this blog. On a side note; Arrow is clearly working very hard to get himself out of the design dog house. Looks like you'll be the clear by the time Retribution is released. Congrats yo.
A single beer. Riiiiiiiight. :P CCP Arrow does fantastic work!
Content Designer | Team Five 0
@regnerBA |
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Sarrian Calda
The Lost Legion
6
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:08:00 -
[42] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:Sarrian Calda wrote:However, the current order in Missile Launchers category is: - Citadel Launchers
- Cruise Launchers
- Heavy Assault Launchers
- Heavy Launchers
- Light Missile Launchers
- Rapid Light Missile Launchers
- Rocket Launchers
- Torpedo Launchers
From top to bottom, it goes from Capital--sized weapon, to Battleship, to Cruiser-sized, to Frigates, and the last one back to Battleship. A bit odd, no? If we are to follow the progression path of skills or ship-size, it should be sorted like this: - Rocket Launchers
- Light Missile Launchers
- Rapid Light Missile Launchers
- Heavy Launchers
- Heavy Assault Launchers
- Cruise Missile Launchers
- Torpedo Launchers
- Citadel Launchers
Or in reverse order, if you think the heavy stuffs should go on top. But as a sub-cap player, I honestly hope that I can filter things that I don't even plan to use out of the way, like the other suggestion earlier in this thread. Anyway, it's a separate topic. Alphabetic order, vs 'strength' Except rockets aren't lighter than Light missile launchers. They're a different type of weapon. Ditto with cruises and Torps.
Yeah I know, just giving an example there. Rocket would sound like a "simpler" weapon than Light guided missiles.
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CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
950
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:09:00 -
[43] - Quote
Irregessa wrote:Faction drones and POS towers/modules are on the market on Buckingham.
Still only Exotic Dancers, Female on the market, no mention of their Male counterparts.
Some of the skill categories could use this treatment as well, like Subsystem (for each race), Spaceship Command (categories for each race, another for t2 hulls, which the skills are all race independent), Science (categories for the Engineering/Physics skills, the research skills, the skills for Sleeper/Tolcan/etc tech), Industry (refining + refining proficiency skills, Mining, Manufacturing), Gunnery (Projectile, Hybrid, Energy, Support).
Thank you for the heads up! It has been a while since I looked at the skills area of the market and you are indeed correct it could use some love. Shall see what I can do.
Content Designer | Team Five 0
@regnerBA |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
950
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:10:00 -
[44] - Quote
Tek Handle wrote:
It doesn't make much sense to me to call it "Fleet Assistance Modules" instead of simply "Fleet Assistance", only because this category has modules in it, since all the other categories also contain only modules and are not named "Electronic Warfare Modules" for example. What do you think?
FINE! Make sense and all. :/ Shall look into it post Retribution. :)
Content Designer | Team Five 0
@regnerBA |
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Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises
Otherworld Empire
5553
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:11:00 -
[45] - Quote
With market cleanup one could have hoped for market bots too hehe Keep up the good work!
/c
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Utremi Fasolasi
The Jagged Edge
Rebel Alliance of New Eden
105
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:19:00 -
[46] - Quote
These changes are pretty foxy. |
Jesspa
BlackWing Cartel
16
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:31:00 -
[47] - Quote
I hardly ever browse the market by category like that anyway - I just use search. In fact, if there was an option for search results not to be categorised at all, but just presented in a flat list that I didn't have to subsequently expand to get to what I wanted even after searching, I'd go for that. |
Faulx
Brother Fox Corp
80
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:42:00 -
[48] - Quote
I find that I use the "Show Info" window's "Variations" tab a lot when pricing meta variants of items, If you could take some time to arrange each item's variant modules by their meta level inside the show info window it would save a lot of guess work...
For example the show info window for Nanofiber Internal Structures looks like this:
*Tech I
Beta Hull Mod Nanofiber Structure (meta 3)
Local Hull Conversion Nanofiber Structure I (meta 4)
Mark I Modified SS Nanofiber Structure (meta 1)
Nanofiber Internal Structure I (meta 0)
Type-D Altered SS Nanofiber Structure (meta 2)
*Tech II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II (meta 5)
*Storyline
Synthetic Hull Conversion Nanofiber Structure I (meta 6)
*Faction
Domination Nanofiber Structure (meta 8)
Republic Fleet Nanofiber Structure (meta 8)
...but it should look like this:
*Tech I
Nanofiber Internal Structure I (meta 0)
Mark I Modified SS Nanofiber Structure (meta 1)
Type-D Altered SS Nanofiber Structure (meta 2)
Beta Hull Mod Nanofiber Structure (meta 3)
Local Hull Conversion Nanofiber Structure I (meta 4)
*Tech II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II (meta 5)
*Storyline
Synthetic Hull Conversion Nanofiber Structure I (meta 6)
*Faction
Domination Nanofiber Structure (meta 8)
Republic Fleet Nanofiber Structure (meta 8)
Actually listing the meta number in the tab (like I have done) might also be good.
One other thing which would be amazing (esp for meta items) would be if you added a tab in the show info window which showed the (perfect) reprocessing breakdown (and the summed market value of the minerals/components, using the minerals' "global projected value" that you get when mousing over an item) for each item. That way you would know whether it would be better to simply reprocess the item or if it has innate value on its own. Otherwise, when selling lots of piddly things, transferring all that info into your own spreadsheet is too much overhead and things tend to either get reprocessed which don't deserve it or get sold to a market order belonging to someone who doesn't mind the overhead. |
Gizan
Hounds Of War
WHY so Seri0Us
70
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Posted - 2012.11.21 18:29:00 -
[49] - Quote
CCP ever gonna re-introduce FACTION POS MODULE/TOWER drops? |
Akrasjel Lanate
Imperial Guardians
Tribal Band
801
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Posted - 2012.11.21 18:41:00 -
[50] - Quote
Quote:Nothing ground breaking here, just a lot of cleanup and making better. |
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Jeremy Soikutsu
Homeworld Republic
Intrepid Crossing
25
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Posted - 2012.11.21 18:50:00 -
[51] - Quote
Irregessa wrote:Faction drones[...]are on the market on Buckingham.
Yay, now maybe we can sell some of these pieces of junk. |
Dasola
Rookie Empire Citizens
Rookie Empire
77
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Posted - 2012.11.21 19:43:00 -
[52] - Quote
while your at it can we have option to remove all things that are not profitable to manufacture from blueprint.. example i could feed me level...  Would clean up market quite a bit for us manufacturers...
or option to show as items where price spread is our selected % or higher
[Insert something funny or smart here] |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
747
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Posted - 2012.11.21 20:07:00 -
[53] - Quote
Faulx wrote:
Actually listing the meta number in the tab (like I have done) might also be good.
One other thing which would be amazing (esp for meta items) would be if you added a tab in the show info window which showed the (perfect) reprocessing breakdown (and the summed market value of the minerals/components, using the minerals' "global projected value" that you get when mousing over an item) for each item. That way you would know whether it would be better to simply reprocess the item or if it has innate value on its own. Otherwise, when selling lots of piddly things, transferring all that info into your own spreadsheet is too much overhead and things tend to either get reprocessed which don't deserve it or get sold to a market order belonging to someone who doesn't mind the overhead for less (sometimes way less) than they're worth.
1.) I like the idea of arranging items by meta level (rather than alphabetically). This way t2 items are always in the same position, meta 4 items are always in the same position, etc....
2.) I personally don't think you should add the reprocessing value of a module to the market.... I think a player should have to work to "optimize" their profits when buying and selling. |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
969
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Posted - 2012.11.21 20:09:00 -
[54] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:Faulx wrote:
Actually listing the meta number in the tab (like I have done) might also be good.
One other thing which would be amazing (esp for meta items) would be if you added a tab in the show info window which showed the (perfect) reprocessing breakdown (and the summed market value of the minerals/components, using the minerals' "global projected value" that you get when mousing over an item) for each item. That way you would know whether it would be better to simply reprocess the item or if it has innate value on its own. Otherwise, when selling lots of piddly things, transferring all that info into your own spreadsheet is too much overhead and things tend to either get reprocessed which don't deserve it or get sold to a market order belonging to someone who doesn't mind the overhead for less (sometimes way less) than they're worth.
1.) I like the idea of arranging items by meta level (rather than alphabetically). This way t2 items are always in the same position, meta 4 items are always in the same position, etc.... 2.) I personally don't think you should add the reprocessing value of a module to the market.... I think a player should have to work to "optimize" their profits when buying and selling.
One of the behind the scenes things I am doing is making sure everything has a proper meta level. There are certain items that don't and it just breaks things when you try to do that.
Content Designer | Team Five 0
@regnerBA |
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David Magnus
130
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Posted - 2012.11.21 21:37:00 -
[55] - Quote
Great, well thought-out changes.
Thanks!
http://soundcloud.com/davidkmagnus/fight-us-maybe
http://soundcloud.com/davidkmagnus/winterupdate
http://soundcloud.com/davidkmagnus/supercaps
http://soundcloud.com/davidkmagnus/pandemiclegion |
Rastlor
Dissident Aggressors
Mordus Angels
2
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Posted - 2012.11.21 22:43:00 -
[56] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:Fade Toblack wrote:@ CCP FoxFour - how about moving some of the low-value, drops-a-lot in missions stuff to the market? "Elite Drone AI" is my most obvious item. Selling some of this stuff on contract compared to the market is painful. I'd suggest getting somebody to run some data on stuff that's sold on contract either for low-values or in large quantities, and prioritising that list. Salpad wrote:I'd like to be able to cancel my Buy Orders and Sell Orders from the Market window, instead of having to go the my Wallet and re-finding the order there. Have you seen the "orders" tab on the Market Window? This is a good idea. If my other plan fails I shall look into that. I am trying to find the best way to find things not listed on the market. Easier said than done apparently.
Can you not do this at the database level on one of your internal builds? Seed everything on market in a station (think you do this on the test servers anyways) and then do a not exists query from your item db to find everything not on the market?
A clean market is a good market - good work btw |
Maverick Ice
The n00b Experience
0
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Posted - 2012.11.21 22:50:00 -
[57] - Quote
We need more of these types of changes...ones that make the game easier to use. +5000000 likes. |
Adellle Nadair
Abandoned Directives
6
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Posted - 2012.11.22 01:03:00 -
[58] - Quote
CCP FoxFour, Thank you Thank you Thank you! |
Mars Theran
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
412
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Posted - 2012.11.22 02:06:00 -
[59] - Quote
Nothing ground breaking maybe, but it's good.
zubzubzubzubzubzubzubzub |
Myrkala
Royal Robot Ponies
Happy Cartel
33
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Posted - 2012.11.22 03:33:00 -
[60] - Quote
Nice improvement.  |
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