You are completely oblivious to how ECM is actually used in a fight aren't you?
You have already started the fight, a tackler rushes you and then suddenly Falcon before you realise it, perma jammed, scrammed...left for dead. You are pretty ******* stupid imo by thinking that a gang bringing ECM was more prepared, they are not more prepared just a lot less skill orientated and more catered towards the "killmails" mean everything playstyle that most of eve really needs to move away from.

You ever actually fought solo vs a gang with a Falcon? or even better in a duo vs a gang with a Falcon, there is so very very little you can do to avoid being jammed, one is do not engage while the other is move out of range of the Falcon. I have been perma jammed in a Talos from 100km, more than once.

You do the math and tell me what happens when a Falcon decloaks 50km away, it takes another 50km to MAYBE get out of jam range. It will take you 29 seconds doing 1.7km/s to get out of the possible jam range of the Falcon, presuming he is sitting still. It however only takes a ceptor 6 seconds to get within point range and 9 to get a scram. This means when the Falcon decloaks you need to either A) not be tackled by anything faster than you and B) no fast tackle coming/on you. Which btw 90% of the time is not possible, in order to tackle you must be tackled back, putting you at risk from the Falcon in pretty much every single engagement. This pretty much goes for anything that kites, anything that brawls is pretty much in a 100% guaranteed position of complete disadvantage if a falcon decloaks 50km away, to the point that you literally can not do ANYTHING to prevent the jamming, even the counter module ECCM only reduces the CHANCE of getting jammed, which counts for nothing if you have 6 jammers slapped on you.

Falcons are useless vs a big gang, however bring it against 1-2 targets and it can turn an already one sided 1/2 vs 10+ into a basic instawin, even more so if one of is already tackled.

Only time a Falcon has not become a problem for me solo is a stupidly fit one with tackle/multispecs, or lands @ zero, panics and fails to even jam/warp.

Nasty little Falcon deserves a spanking !

Ok - a few years ago i remember CCP talking about the reason why they changes the doomsday affect from area to target specific.

I agreed with a lot of their thinking, titan AOE doomsdays killed battles.

I am finding that Falcons are in my opinion coming close to being "battle killers"; its relative ease at how it can sit cloaked, and then uncloak to jam targets to me is what is painful; some of the lamest tactics are at play here. sabre on gate go to engage uncloak falcon and sit for 30 + seconds and not be able to defend yourself is quite honestly a game killer.

I like to PVP and I have been using smaller ships since they have give me chest beating than using 250m ships - if i lose my small ship to a falcon jamming is less painful than losing a 250m ship. However, what ever the cost of ship - the falcon is quite honestly a battle killer. i guess this is coming from a point of view of a solo pvp'er but in any sized gang being able to not defend yourself against a falcon or for that matter a BB, is what for me is killing PVP.

Can we get past how it happens and discuss how falcons and BB and kitsune destroys engagements

As an EWAR pilot, I would like NOT to be nerfed.

Falcon is no where near a battle killer. They're like flying paper kites. A falcon doesn't show up on a field of opponents and devastate them. It requires support. It also has a counter as previously mentioned, eccm or another falcon or drones or frigates or an Arazu or snipers etc etc etc. If you're frustrated because you aren't bringing ecm to the field but your opponent is then perhaps there's something to learn from that?

At best Falcon is a support ship in much the same fashion as a Guardian. If your opponent brings one, you need to bring two. If they bring two, you need three. Same is true for a Falcon when fleets and command are evenly matched.

If you're being out classed by your opponent either accept that you're not able to field a Falcon and choose your targets appropriately or field one. A Falcon neither costs much or has a high skill bar. Comparing the Falcon to Titans is....well.....asinine.

Other arguments against Falcon included permajam is no different from permatank except yes you can shoot your target but no you can't break their tank because logi is on the field. If there wasn't Falcon in the game the next argument would be against the Scorpion. No Scorpion, then against logi. No logi, then against something else that prevents >you< from being successful at a fight because you can't don't won't field it.

ECCM..
Problem solved

I was under the impression that the Falcon was with the Sabre that you faced? Or did I misread somewhere?

because of falcon!

Exactly i faced off against a sabre that i could see in my overview was more than happy to go at it and low and behold as soon as we engaged perma jammed from a falcon that uncloak 50km away....

OOOOHHHH YEEEAAAHHHH

FLY, YOU FOOLS!

Sounds like his problem isn't the lone falcon, but that falcon and the other ship.

Kind of like a guy in a falcon complaining that he got jumped by two guys and coudln't do anything.


What happens in the same situation if the OP had a friend with him in another assault ship?

Edit:
What would happen if the OP had 2 to 1 odds on those guys even?

Ok - a few years ago i remember CCP talking about the reason why they changes the doomsday affect from area to target specific.

I agreed with a lot of their thinking, titan AOE doomsdays killed battles.

I am finding that Falcons are in my opinion coming close to being "battle killers"; its relative ease at how it can sit cloaked, and then uncloak to jam targets to me is what is painful; some of the lamest tactics are at play here. sabre on gate go to engage uncloak falcon and sit for 30 + seconds and not be able to defend yourself is quite honestly a game killer.

I like to PVP and I have been using smaller ships since they have give me chest beating than using 250m ships - if i lose my small ship to a falcon jamming is less painful than losing a 250m ship. However, what ever the cost of ship - the falcon is quite honestly a battle killer. i guess this is coming from a point of view of a solo pvp'er but in any sized gang being able to not defend yourself against a falcon or for that matter a BB, is what for me is killing PVP.

I'm going to be polite - the problem is the falcon alone. Holistically there is not any way to combat being permanent jammed

Anyway a lot of good point on here it's time to kill this post

Combat options for being permanent jammed (In 1v1 situation)
In anything more then that simply bring your own falcon or use one of the options below.

1 - Warp Away falcons are slow and have low DPS
2 - Jam them first.
3 - Drones ECM, jamming is a hostile act if you get them out before he jams you the drones will jam him and you are free to
engage again.

Just top 3 options I could think of right now.

I think it is funny that two out of the three you list is using ECM to fight ECM.

There seems to be a group of people in this game who think that gangs should consist entirely of unsupported DPS ships with no gang links, cynos, probing alts or any other thing that a smart person might use to gain an advantage and that combat should consist of two of these gangs flying at each other for no reason other than because they want to fight.

Those guys should probably go join RvB or something.

They miss thier arena battlegrounds.

Combat options for being permanent jammed (In 1v1 situation)
In anything more then that simply bring your own falcon or use one of the options below.

1 - Warp Away falcons are slow and have low DPS
2 - Jam them first.
3 - Drones ECM, jamming is a hostile act if you get them out before he jams you the drones will jam him and you are free to
engage again.

Just top 3 options I could think of right now.

"Not being used" is not the same as "Not working".
People fit DPS mods over ECCM
People fit Tank mods over ECCM
People fit MWD/Point & Web over ECCM

then they cry that they have been ECM'ed
or they cry that needing ECCM is too situational to be worth it