You seem to be homogonizing ice mining, and ore mining.

And you seem to think there is a difference. It takes 30 minutes to fill a Mackinaw with ore and my fingers need to be in contact with the keyboard 5 or 6 times for less than 5 seconds.

Hold it! I would love to have something TO do when I mine, but the way it stands, I just sit here, and watch lasers spin. As far as solutions go, I really have no clue. A mini game is out of the question, but really what else is there?

Yes if you have one account and are sitting in high-sec then there is very little to do.

Now add alts into the mix and or try that in low-sec or null and the results completely change.

IF you want excitement find a null-sec corp and mine there.

Actually that is even worse since you have to be paying enough attention to see if someone shows up in local and can't fully AFK, but the act itself is still just as boring.

Then I guess mining isn't for you.

running 20 accounts of miners seems to increase the intensity of mining, you should give it a shot

running 20 accounts of miners seems to increase the intensity of mining, you should give it a shot

........
To each there own but that is nuts.

Hold it! I would love to have something TO do when I mine, but the way it stands, I just sit here, and watch lasers spin. As far as solutions go, I really have no clue. A mini game is out of the question, but really what else is there?

You have to remember the agenda of all the people "against afk mining". Its not to stop afk mining, its to remove it from the game entirely, and replace it with some other way of getting minerals. But they cannot come right out and say that. But they have noticed that mining is a semi-afk activity, and if the players were forced to not be semi-afk they would mostly stop doing it. The resulting disruption to the game would force CCP to add new, non-mining mineral sources.

Unfortunately for these folks, CCP seems to be moving the other way. The mining profession has been augmented with both a reduction in mineral sources from other activities and with better mining ships.

The result is miners continue to mine while chatting, reading, watching TV and so on, and CCP will say "working as intended".

Unfortunately for these folks, CCP seems to be moving the other way. The mining profession has been augmented with both a reduction in mineral sources from other activities and with better mining ships.

The result is miners continue to mine while chatting, reading, watching TV and so on, and CCP will say "working as intended".

When I dabbled in it, when done as a fleet operation stuff pops pretty fast (if not ice), you're swapping targets/repositioning a fair bit. It's relatively engaging - certainly compared to the other "non-combat" activities (trading and so forth).

Don't get me wrong, it's certainly no adrenaline rush, but who am I to judge what other people find rewarding/relaxing?

the depressing thing is if you mine normal ores strategically (outside of low/null) you can infact mine 90% of a belt without ever having to move a ship provided you have strong (for high sec) mining boosts. But the state of most belts definately makes the retargeting and refiring of lasers a very constant thing

Your sitting there, watching lasers turn as you mine a roid. Oh the occasional rat will come, but you get to see your drones circle & kill it within 10 seconds. Some action right? Super exiting isn't it? It's god dam torture, and unless it was more interactive/ required player input (for the mining itself), people will continue to go afk while mining.

I would in fact think CCP is pretty happy with the AFK mining. Also, much less miner ganking, always plus.

Now, freighters ...

ya given that they went the opposite direction with mining a few ago. Buffing ehp instead of buffing gankers
now 450,000 accounts.
Being a miner I see a connection lol

Your sitting there, watching lasers turn as you mine a roid. Oh the occasional rat will come, but you get to see your drones circle & kill it within 10 seconds. Some action right? Super exiting isn't it? It's god dam torture, and unless it was more interactive/ required player input (for the mining itself), people will continue to go afk while mining.

I have a great idea to make mining more interactive. Module cannot auto repeat =1

Hold it! I would love to have something TO do when I mine, but the way it stands, I just sit here, and watch lasers spin. As far as solutions go, I really have no clue. A mini game is out of the question, but really what else is there?

Two posts with little knowledge.

Making turrets not auto-repeat would:

- break the game design that makes turrets auto-repeat.

- exclusively and only boost botting BY A LOT. Because making something stupidly tedious and boring even more tedious and boring augments botting and that's it and it always been like that.

A mini game is out of the question, but really what else is there?

Hold it! I would love to have something TO do when I mine, but the way it stands, I just sit here, and watch lasers spin. As far as solutions go, I really have no clue. A mini game is out of the question, but really what else is there?

I have a great idea to make mining more interactive. Module cannot auto repeat =1

welcome to high sec mining, were asteroids contain less ore than your lasers harvest in one cycle.

guess you got your wish this christmas.

I guess you've never been to an ice field.

sure i have.
however ice is worth less than not logging in since the barge changes.

Yet thousands of miners do it all over highsec because: undock, warp to ice, press butan, come back in 30 minutes. Mining turrets not auto-repeating probably wouldn't affect ore miners all that much, but it would bring the interaction to the game that many miners so desperately desire.

And you seem to think there is a difference. It takes 30 minutes to fill a Mackinaw with ore

It wouldn't break the game design at all. It would also not exclusively boost botting. What it would do is encourage miners to actually play the game & make it less boring.

Stick to your nullsec knowledge, because you don't have any of it regarding hi sec nor mining.

Your sitting there, watching lasers turn as you mine a roid. Oh the occasional rat will come, but you get to see your drones circle & kill it within 10 seconds. Some action right? Super exiting isn't it? It's god dam torture, and unless it was more interactive/ required player input (for the mining itself), people will continue to go afk while mining.

In New Order systems, afk miners get interactive game play. In fact, all miners get interactive game play. I know we Agents are not the most popular fellows in Eve but at least you can't (safely) not be around while ice mining when we (and the Knights of the New Order) are present. Its not boring in Kamio and Halaima these days.

This is how afk mining could be affected. The need to be present combined with someone giving you something to do. Eve at its finest.

www.minerbumping.com

Highsec is worth fighting for.

In New Order systems, afk miners get interactive game play. In fact, all miners get interactive game play. I know we Agents are not the most popular fellows in Eve but at least you can't (safely) not be around while ice mining when we (and the Knights of the New Order) are present. Its not boring in Kamio and Halaima these days.

This is how afk mining could be affected. The need to be present combined with someone giving you something to do. Eve at its finest.

www.minerbumping.com

Highsec is worth fighting for.

Bing Bangboom
Agent of the New Order of Highsec
Belligerent Undesirable

i usually watch neil degrasse tyson videos on youtube while i mine

and you should too

you can't go afk totally. If you do, you'll first lose your drones followed by losing your ship. The NPC's now target your drones first and they vanish quickly

If it wasn't for the ability to go afk in empire, i would probably be mining in nullsec, if at all.

Highsec is ~the~ place to mine.

quite sad that this is true, tbh.

Your sitting there, watching lasers turn as you mine a roid. Oh the occasional rat will come, but you get to see your drones circle & kill it within 10 seconds. Some action right? Super exiting isn't it? It's god dam torture, and unless it was more interactive/ required player input (for the mining itself), people will continue to go afk while mining.

Not if I can help it

Afk mine all you want.

Know this though, if I or one my ilk catch you unawares, we will blow up your barge and squish your pod.

Action/consequence, risk/reward and all that stuff.

Regards,

Garrison Woods
Knight of the New Order of Hi-Sec.

so you're flooding the market with low end minerals to force the prices down? good to know.

Actually I'm doing it for lulz and tears.. and also the salvage. But if you want to say "flooding the market with low end minerals to force the prices down" then that works too!

In New Order systems, afk miners get interactive game play. In fact, all miners get interactive game play. I know we Agents are not the most popular fellows in Eve but at least you can't (safely) not be around while ice mining when we (and the Knights of the New Order) are present. Its not boring in Kamio and Halaima these days.

This is how afk mining could be affected. The need to be present combined with someone giving you something to do. Eve at its finest.

www.minerbumping.com

Highsec is worth fighting for.

Bing Bangboom
Agent of the New Order of Highsec
Belligerent Undesirable

considering mining requires 0 interaction,

I wonder how long it will be until "online semi-anonymous sociology" becomes a field of study, if it hasn't already.

Its amazing how many emergent deviant behaviors have surfaced in Eve Online alone, in addtion to previous MMOs.

i think minerbumping could be a great name for a gay bar

Utterly false statement that. Don't post about activities you have never actually done.

considering it's all i do, i suggest you try another reply.

Post proof.

No reasoning with............... Oh...nevermind.

Tired of your junk postings and just blocking ya.

it's a fact that mining requires 0 interaction. hence why people afk mine ice because they can literally leave the house and go to the shop, walk the dog etc, because there's no need to interact with the game in anyway in order to be able to mine.

Isn't it odd how the only people saying such things are people who are against mining in general?

If they tried mining while 100% afk out walking the dog, I've no doubt they'd quickly be complaining about how they lost their mining ship.

You know i don't get people... i mean how many of you whiners are actual miners? I mean this is a case of a child whining that somebody else got a different toy that doesn't match yours exactly and you want that kids toy taken away.

This game really is full of people who just don't understand that not everybody plays the game the same. You pay your $15 a month and i pay my $15 a month. You like killing/popping ships every chance you get i like making ships and mining. During my "afk" mining i'm actually at my computer in game chatting with friends and corp mates, i'm also doing PI, checking market orders, checking market fluctuations and planning what my next manufacturing run is going to be.

But wait you want to screw the miner? I mean you like your shinny little ship that allows you to pop other ships? Possibly even miners? Well somebody had to mine that ore (or salvage it) also somebody had to make that ship right?

This whole "hate the miners" thing this game has is so childish... i mean really guys.

i was more suggesting that 1 bored player in high sec is totally irrelevant to high sec being the place to mine.

Fix gatecamps too! Maybe have the billboards play a few episodes of Bones or something

Most are too narrow minded to realize that if everything that they ask were done, Hi Sec would become the same ghost town that Low and Null are often today.

And what else do you think those really want?

-> finish "their" level, thinking there's another one to farm for
->slap CCP with intelligent words like "incompetent" and "lack of imagination", because it's obvious they're smarter
->ragequit because they don't have targets any more, rage a little bit more over high sec and CCP

Bah, just leave them do whatever, play when you have fun and stop playing when you have none. Don't worry about anything like those, it's a waste of your time for no changes.

i was more suggesting that 1 bored player in high sec is totally irrelevant to high sec being the place to mine.

not really. if i didn't have to tab back every time an asteroid popped i'd be walking the dog too. the simple fact is nobody really tries to gank miners "for lulz" or "because they hate afkers". hulkageddon excluded. unless some one is handing you a stack of isk to suicide people, it simply doesn't happen often enough for it to be a "thing".

****, i've lost 2 mining ships in my entire life, one of them was a t1 barge during hulkageddon, that's why it was t1. the second, was a corp mate ******* around.

i've yet to see a mining barge, of mine or belonging to another player get shot at in high sec outside of hulkageddon.

The way I see it, every pilot like Starfox is a little bit more ISK in my bank. They keep the mineral prices inflated, and demand for ships/mod/ammo high. It's a true miners dream

...
They will just succeed in making Eve a ghost town.

considering mining requires 0 interaction, and therefore you have no way to tell if some one is afk or not i wish you good luck with carrying that out without shooting people who aren't afk.

It is actually remarkably easy to tell if someone is afk or not. Think about it for a minute, don't worry I'll wait.

That is generally what I do.

Though, I suspect that many think by making Hi Sec a ghost town, the population will migrate to Low and Null since that is where all the rewards would then be located and that by default will make Null and Low suit their desires.
I don't think this would be the end result.

They will just succeed in making Eve a ghost town.

not really. if i didn't have to tab back every time an asteroid popped i'd be walking the dog too. the simple fact is nobody really tries to gank miners "for lulz" or "because they hate afkers". hulkageddon excluded. unless some one is handing you a stack of isk to suicide people, it simply doesn't happen often enough for it to be a "thing".

****, i've lost 2 mining ships in my entire life, one of them was a t1 barge during hulkageddon, that's why it was t1. the second, was a corp mate ******* around.

i've yet to see a mining barge, of mine or belonging to another player get shot at in high sec outside of hulkageddon.

Your sitting there, watching lasers turn as you mine a roid. Oh the occasional rat will come, but you get to see your drones circle & kill it within 10 seconds. Some action right? Super exiting isn't it? It's god dam torture, and unless it was more interactive/ required player input (for the mining itself), people will continue to go afk while mining.

Funny that. The New Order has recently topped 60 Billion isk in destroyed mining barges and pods, and we're just warming up. I assure you it isn't hard or terribly expensive to murder barges, especially when you work as a team. Most of my gank fits are less than 2 million isk.

Oh and, at least for me, profit has nothing to do with it. I gank because I love Eve, and because I strongly disapprove of bot/bot-aspirant gameplay and entitled whiny carebears.

hth

Regards,

Garrison Woods
Knight of the New Order of Hi-Sec.

Things to do while mining

Scan asteroids so you can stop lasers and don't wast a full cycle.
Scan asteroids so you can stop lasers when asteroid is almost depleted leaving a belt full of hollow asteroids.
Take an armor repping drone and repair other drones.
Update your skill queue.
Take a salvage drone and salvage other wreaks in the belt.
fit a scan prob launcher and scan out the system.
check the market and update orders.
Try and figure out if manufacturing ____ is profitable.
Read bio's of other players in local.
Read the internet.
Try and figure out a Battle fit for the orca.
go afk and get RL stuff done.


I though the entire idea of half the stuff in eve was that it is a game you can still play when you don't have enough time to play games. That is why there is Skill training in real time, mining, manufacturing, research, inventing, PI, playing the market, aft hauling, etc...

Your sitting there, watching lasers turn as you mine a roid. Oh the occasional rat will come, but you get to see your drones circle & kill it within 10 seconds. Some action right? Super exiting isn't it? It's god dam torture, and unless it was more interactive/ required player input (for the mining itself), people will continue to go afk while mining.

Of course there should be some kind of dangerous, more interesting, and more lucrative mining activity...

i refer back to when i pointed out a few bored players don't really have much of an impact. if you guys enjoy that kind of thing; power to you.

those new order people (they really needed to pick a better name) are, as far as i've been able to tell, just sitting in one system bumping players in ice belts.

you say you disapprove of bot-aspirant gameplay but when you really get down to it, the only difference between a miner popping an asteroid, and a combat pilot popping a ship is how long it takes. miner hits f1, and waits until the asteroid pops, combat pilot hits f1 and waits until the enemy ship pops. neither style of gameplay is particularly "engaging". all the combat pilot does is swap target more frequently, let's face it if every mission was "warp to location and kill the big ship with an OTT amount of ehp" people would instantly switch to amarr ships, hit f1, and come back when the big ship was destroyed. pretty much the same as ice mining, except you wait for a full cargohold instead of a loot can to pop up.

the entire game revolves around "hit f1 and wait" whether you like it or not.

I don't believe he was comparing PvE to Mining, but rather PvP to Mining. In which case there is a huge difference. I agree with you ..a bit on the PvE and Mining. Because, essentially you are running the same course of action/s. However, no matter how you look at it, PvE -as boring as it can get- is still more fun than Mining... Though if you are in a nice fleet with a group of friends/corpmates you know and are having a good time with conversation, then I could see Mining being fun and engaging. But, nevertheless level 4's are still more fun than Mining. And PvP is way more engaging than Mining will ever be. I think most of us can agree on at least that and I reread your post and looks like you were comparing it to PvE combat missions, so no need to continue.

I don't believe he was comparing PvE to Mining, but rather PvP to Mining. In which case there is a huge difference. I agree with you ..a bit on the PvE and Mining. Because, essentially you are running the same course of action/s. However, no matter how you look at it, PvE -as boring as it can get- is still more fun than Mining... Though if you are in a nice fleet with a group of friends/corpmates you know and are having a good time with conversation, then I could see Mining being fun and engaging. But, nevertheless level 4's are still more fun than Mining. And PvP is way more engaging than Mining will ever be. I think most of us can agree on at least that and I reread your post and looks like you were comparing it to PvE combat missions, so no need to continue.

My alt is AFK mining while I do most things...so...free materials, why not?

i find pve less interesting than mining because while mining i can do other things, in pve i can't. i don't have time to watch that funny youtube video or reply to a message etc because ships pop far faster than asteroids.

i did a level 4 and all i could think was "i wish these ships had more ehp so i could go and do something less boring, like mining"

i also tried pvp once, the FC called a name, i pressed f1 and... i see a pattern here.

I go on the forums and post the truth about the superiority of Hi Sec.

Where do you mine? Just curious.

Funny that. The New Order has recently topped 60 Billion isk in destroyed mining barges and pods, and we're just warming up. I assure you it isn't hard or terribly expensive to murder barges, especially when you work as a team. Most of my gank fits are less than 2 million isk.

Oh and, at least for me, profit has nothing to do with it. I gank because I love Eve, and because I strongly disapprove of bot/bot-aspirant gameplay and entitled whiny carebears.

hth

Regards,

Garrison Woods
Knight of the New Order of Hi-Sec.

Its gonna be pretty hard to keep buying and fitting ships for les than 2 million if no one did "bot/bot-aspriant gameplay" like mining, bro.

Its gonna be pretty hard to keep buying and fitting ships for les than 2 million if no one did "bot/bot-aspriant gameplay" like mining, bro.

Wow. Are you defending bot gameplay? For real. I don't even.... People like you make me fear for the future of this awesome game.

A thousand ganks upon your household sir, for having such an ignorant opinion.

And btw, noone who supports bot gameplay will ever be my "bro". Just sayin'

Wow, that's a fantastic argument. Let's me see how many ganks that's prevented so far...

Oh right, none.

Edit: bro.

I don't consider mining bot gameplay, so no I am not defending it, I mean, I could consider ganking bot gameplay, it takes about as much effort as mining.

You could consider it the same. You'd be wrong, but hey. And trust me, we arent buying any ships from your sell orders.

Nice contradiction btw. All that afk botting has clearly fried your brain. Before you insult my playstyle, maybe you should make up your mind about yours. (Protip: you were right the first time.)

I am actually kind of confused because you seem to want mining removed from the game

No-one (at least not among the New Order that I know of) wants mining removed from the game. We want highsec miners to mine with a Permit - like a human - instead of pretending to be bots all day.

No-one (at least not among the New Order that I know of) wants mining removed from the game. We want highsec miners to mine with a Permit - like a human - instead of pretending to be bots all day.

No-one (at least not among the New Order that I know of) wants mining removed from the game. We want highsec miners to mine with a Permit - like a human - instead of pretending to be bots all day.

Oh, I get it...I don't get a snappy comeback because I use my alt to AFK mine in NULLSEC, and you guys are too afraid to go there? AmIrite?

Lol, if thinking that makes you happy. Afraid, in a videogame... You're silly :p

define "like a human", please.

Perhaps I have taken Garrison's first post the wrong way.

The way I read it is he was saying that Mining is a style of game play that you can be as dumb as a bot to do and as such should be removed from the game.

If you were refering to removing only bots as such and keeping mining then I apologise Garrison. I would be all for that, because at the end of the day I would love bots to be removed entierly, because they are taking precious ore that I spent my own time trying to mine and I have to compete with them...

There still seem to be a lot of bots out there as well, with the amount of ganks I see and yet the player who got ganked does not respond in anyway when the ganker taunts them in local after.

I would fully support some form of permit system if it meant the end of actual bots in EVE, as long as it isn't game breaking

No need to apologize. Maybe I wasn't clear enough. As Lin stated, code-compliant human miners are fine with me, and they are set blue with the New Order upon purchase of a mining permit. What I dislike are straight up bots and folks who think this game is a mining simulator and who feel they should be immune to non consensual interaction. I find these types of players detestable and an affront to everything that makes Eve great.

I don't in any way want mining removed from the game. What I actually would like to see is more code compliant good citizens mining attentively and judiciously, and less whiny entitled muppets who spout off about the EULA every time you so much as look at them. Also dead bots, lots and lots of dead bots.

Regards,

Garrison Woods
Knight of the New Order of Hi-Sec

Oh, I get it...I don't get a snappy comeback because I use my alt to AFK mine in NULLSEC, and you guys are too afraid to go there? AmIrite?

No need to apologize. Maybe I wasn't clear enough. As Lin stated, code-compliant human miners are fine with me, and they are set blue with the New Order upon purchase of a mining permit. What I dislike are straight up bots and folks who think this game is a mining simulator and who feel they should be immune to non consensual interaction. I find these types of players detestable and an affront to everything that makes Eve great.

I don't in any way want mining removed from the game. What I actually would like to see is more code compliant good citizens mining attentively and judiciously, and less whiny entitled muppets who spout off about the EULA every time you so much as look at them. Also dead bots, lots and lots of dead bots.

Regards,

Garrison Woods
Knight of the New Order of Hi-Sec

If you look at who some of the guys doing the ganking are, you'll find a lot of them are no strangers to nullsec, so nope, you're quite wrong.

Turn of auto-repeat?! Do you guys sell bots for EVE or just hate life?

Your sitting there, watching lasers turn as you mine a roid. Oh the occasional rat will come, but you get to see your drones circle & kill it within 10 seconds. Some action right? Super exiting isn't it? It's god dam torture, and unless it was more interactive/ required player input (for the mining itself), people will continue to go afk while mining.

Oh boy.

I really don't understand the hate towards afk miners. Is it because they aren't in low sec so you can shoot them? Is it because you hate to admit that the game needs them?

personally i sit in my hulk with orca support, mining away i have 22k range. I only use t1 strip miners so i don't need to change crystals. So i can jump in to the middle of the belt and clean the whole thing out sometimes i have to move a few ks to get the last few. I just target the next roid and hit it doesn't bother me what it is.

while thats going on, on my secondary monitor I play star wars the old republic on my primary monitor

use t2 strips with crystals.
you've got to tab back to the game to change asteroids, only takes 2 extra clicks to load a different crystal.

Your sitting there, watching lasers turn as you mine a roid. Oh the occasional rat will come, but you get to see your drones circle & kill it within 10 seconds. Some action right? Super exiting isn't it? It's god dam torture, and unless it was more interactive/ required player input (for the mining itself), people will continue to go afk while mining.

Afk mine all you want.

Know this though, if I or one my ilk catch you unawares, we will blow up your barge and squish your pod.

Action/consequence, risk/reward and all that stuff.

Regards,

Garrison Woods
Knight of the New Order of Hi-Sec.

I saw someone in the Help channel today asking if anyone knew of a good "mining timer" a timer he could set to alert him to come back to his computer and move product.

Now thats some engaging PVE right there

I saw someone in the Help channel today asking if anyone knew of a good "mining timer" a timer he could set to alert him to come back to his computer and move product.

Now thats some engaging PVE right there

In essence, they are causing harassment.

So I've been around the Knights of the New Order area for a few days now and I'd like to say the following:

First, I am also opposed to AFK mining. In fact, any AFK activities. Back when Ultima Online came on, I was with a ganking squad that took out AFK skill builders. So I know where the idea is coming from. And if they did nothing but AFK miner harassment, I'd pay them 100m ISK for their work.

However, they do not target AFK miners but require all miners to pay 10m to be left alone. That's extortion and I don't abide by it. They have destroyed many non AFK miners through their exploits.

And there is no fighting them. For the most part, they are on throw away characters. I have only seen two that are over 30 days old. They don't care about their ships and the bounties they produce when killed are pitiful. In essence, they are causing harassment. The fact that most aren't using their main characters to do this lets you know that they also know it is wrong. The game punishes people for such harassment so they're avoiding it with the new characters.

Now many people say 'so what?' Fair enough, the game does have things that can be used to defend against them. Because of their low value ships and tactics, a bit of armoring can protect you from them until Concord arrives. I've seen it happen a few times. But the game doesn't really allow for proper defense against their tactics.

That's why I suggest if you really feel that they're harassing you, send a petition about it - even if you think it won't do anything. One, or even a hundred won't cause them to move but thousands may have them perk up and take notice.

In the end, I like the idea that they started with, but now it's just become a bully group that there is no real way to stop them.

The only problem I see here is the fact that they are recycling characters and not that they are extorting miners.

This part is incorrect. We have permanent dedicated ganking alts. No alt has been biomassed to avoid the consequences of ganking miners. We live with the consequences, adapt to the restrictions of low sec status, and using the game mechanics, we try to achieve our goals the best we can.

Over time we have learned to manipulate (not avoid or escape) but manipulate Concord so that we can gank before they kill us. The discipline required to FC a gank fleet is incredible. Coordinated undocks, cloaky warp ins, rotating belts we hit to manage concord; we actually strive to improve our game through an understanding of how it works and leveraging it in our favor.

EDIT: Just today, we got our first quadruple Retriever kill. A single squad split DPS four ways and we took down 4 Retrievers closely clumped together. It was truly a glorious feat of planning and execution.

This is in stark contrast to the afk miner, whose toolbox only contains one tactic: whine and complain.

The only problem I see here is the fact that they are recycling characters and not that they are extorting miners.

Do not create further threads regarding bumping, they will be treated as spam, and locked.