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Alex Pier
Vault-13
1
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Posted - 2011.11.22 16:36:00 -
[31] - Quote
Heinrich Rosenmantel wrote:I am proud of this thread. Fear not, for your money has been put to good use!
The money is not the issue Heinrich... It wasn't that big of an amount, it took me less of a week to recover.. it's the scam tat matters. But there are other ways of repaying that!
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Zions Child
Odyssey Inc SpaceMonkey's Alliance
164
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Posted - 2011.11.22 17:05:00 -
[32] - Quote
Necro post, but whatever. To all the people saying that this can't happen in real life: it can and does. Its not quite the same thing (its more to do with Shorts than margin trading) but it does happen. The consequence is that you get sued and/or arrested (if you get caught and do it in such a way as to cause severe issues). In the states its called a naked short, were you short-sell some financial property without first owning it (generally to drive the price down, or because you're lazy). This happened with stocks quite a bit. Its been illegal in the US since 2008. And by "illegal" I mean its mildly prohibited, still happens, and there isn't a whole lot people can do about it.
That being said however, because of the nature of the stock market a naked short is considerably harder to scam with than EVE's equivalent (which I suppose could be called a naked long... KEEP YOUR MIND OUT OF THE GUTTER). |
Jagga Spikes
Spikes Chop Shop
47
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Posted - 2011.11.22 17:18:00 -
[33] - Quote
Tasko Pal wrote:I think this is a seriously broken aspect of the market. A basic principle should be, if the book order exists, then there should be no question that the trader backing it has the isk to carry through with the trade.
on other hand, i'd like to see possibility to put sell orders with only partial amount of assets available. |
flakeys
The Great cornholio's Paper Tiger Coalition
41
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Posted - 2011.11.22 17:23:00 -
[34] - Quote
Alex Pier wrote:[quote=Heinrich Rosenmantel] But there are other ways of repaying that!
Nope not in eve , alts or chars you don't undock are immune to vengeance my friend.
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Alex Pier
Vault-13
1
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Posted - 2011.11.22 17:27:00 -
[35] - Quote
flakeys wrote:Alex Pier wrote:[quote=Heinrich Rosenmantel] But there are other ways of repaying that! Nope not in eve , alts or chars you don't undock are immune to vengeance my friend.
Well yes, but the specific character does and he roam around Tama and Dandumi and other systems around that area usually evenings (EVE time)...
I have done my homework, but didn't have much time to play lately due to real life and work... when I get the time though... |
GavinCapacitor
CaeIum Incognitum
4
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Posted - 2011.11.22 19:40:00 -
[36] - Quote
This particular market scam has been known for quite some time. See also: you cannot into common sense, too good to be true, etc.
Still can't believe people fall for this **** all the time. And it literally takes no effort to watch over this stuff. |
Tom Hagen
Twilight Empire Blazing Angels Alliance
5
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Posted - 2011.11.22 22:28:00 -
[37] - Quote
Even if it has been known to people for a long time, Eve is a big place and for most people it is always something new to learn (if you want to fully understand a concept, it is easy to jump around and try stuff).
I don't think it is the market vets that falls for this scam, and if you do your homework I am sure you can avoid it. But lets face it most people don't think, lets try something different, I will start to go on the forum and read 1000+ post about the subject. If we set that as a entry standard on everything in EVE we would have very few players, I personally think EVE already suffer from the level of complexity and lack of instant gratification that most other mmorpg have.
Margin trading are one of those skills that I believe is easily overlooked when you enter the market and if you don't have a decent basic understanding of economics, it would be even easier to miss the potential in this skill. Margin trading adds a level of complexity that are advantageous for older player or more precis for players that prey upon others. It also hits them where it hurts from an angel a new player have a limited chance of knowing. This guy comes to mind. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=14194&find=unread We can argue about the value of his contribution to EVE, but I doubt it he is the only one getting burned out there.
I like the skill Margin trading very much, but I have started to doubt the positive effects it has on EVE as a whole. It serves people with many orders and a lot of ISK, in general older player. It raises the entry bar for new players to get in on the market, both skill wise and that players don't have to choose in what items they want to trade or produce. I find my self still trading in T1 goods because it don't cost me much to put up buy orders on huge amount of items and just let my orders sit there and simmer.
At GavinCapacitor: It is easy being elitist in areas we already have all the answers in, but we all started out as noobs. I find myself constantly humbled in EVE and no matter how small it is every now and then I discover something new.. |
GavinCapacitor
CaeIum Incognitum
5
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Posted - 2011.11.23 14:34:00 -
[38] - Quote
Tom Hagen wrote:Even if it has been known to people for a long time, Eve is a big place and for most people it is always something new to learn (if you want to fully understand a concept, it is easy to jump around and try stuff).
I don't think it is the market vets that falls for this scam, and if you do your homework I am sure you can avoid it.
Then it seems.... ...you need to catch up on your homework. yyyyyeeeeaaaahhhhhhhhhh
Tom Hagen wrote: But lets face it most people don't think, lets try something different, I will start to go on the forum and read 1000+ post about the subject.
That is ridiculous hyperbole. You do not need to read "+1000 posts" to understand this scam. You need to read one (1).
Tom Hagen wrote: At GavinCapacitor: It is easy being elitist in areas we already have all the answers in, but we all started out as noobs. I find myself constantly humbled in EVE and no matter how small it is every now and then I discover something new..
You're right, it *is* easy to be elitist about something we "have all the answers in" and we did all start out as noobs. But that is not what I am doing. You see, I am being elitist about being able to follow simple things like "if its too good to be true is usually is" and being able to keep in mind the general premise in eve that people are out to take your money and kick your dog. I'm sure even you (if you tried really hard) would find it odd there was someone selling X and someone buying X for *much* more so close together. Perhaps even read that one post (or +1000, whatever) on the topic before you went for it.
I wish someone would hand me 1.5billion isk for nothing. |
Srioghal moDhream
B and T Inc
0
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Posted - 2011.11.23 14:44:00 -
[39] - Quote
There is an exceptionally easy way to fix this and it would take very little coding.
Make it so the minimum order amount required cannot exceed the amount of ISK in escrow.
So if you place a buy order for a total of 1 billion isk and you only have to put up 500 million in escrow, then the minimum number of items required cannot exceed the 500 million.
Required amount x cost < escrow
Very easy fix to this scam. |
thekiller2002us
Order of Celestial Knights Galactic System Lords Alliance
32
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Posted - 2011.11.23 22:22:00 -
[40] - Quote
Alex Pier wrote:Heinrich Rosenmantel wrote:I am proud of this thread. Fear not, for your money has been put to good use! The money is not the issue Heinrich... It wasn't that big of an amount, it took me less of a week to recover.. it's the scam tat matters. But there are other ways of repaying that!
maybe you should hire people to go after the guy who scammed you- i wouldn't rely on your ' PVP SKILZZ ' as you would have us belive |
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Dane El
Daneco Inc.
8
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Posted - 2011.11.23 23:18:00 -
[41] - Quote
The most confounding part of this thread is "Who looks at the market for freed slaves and janitors?" |
Shizuken
Venerated Stars
0
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Posted - 2011.11.23 23:31:00 -
[42] - Quote
Dane El wrote:The most confounding part of this thread is "Who looks at the market for freed slaves and janitors?"
This is exactly what I was thinking. I am guessing that the OP was not aware that these items have little to no actual use in the game other than as mission items.
In a way though that may make this sort of scam more prone to be targeted to new players. They are the ones who lack context on the workings of the game and are bombarded by missions requiring them to obtain the items. They may therefore tend to overvalue these items and not question their being offered for sale at such a high unit price.
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Alex Pier
Vault-13
1
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Posted - 2011.11.24 12:08:00 -
[43] - Quote
thekiller2002us wrote:Alex Pier wrote:Heinrich Rosenmantel wrote:I am proud of this thread. Fear not, for your money has been put to good use! The money is not the issue Heinrich... It wasn't that big of an amount, it took me less of a week to recover.. it's the scam tat matters. But there are other ways of repaying that! maybe you should hire people to go after the guy who scammed you- i wouldn't rely on your ' PVP SKILZZ ' as you would have us belive
This is the care bear character, I have done little to no PvP with him. His main responsibility is to run missions to make money so we can fund the PvP... Secondly I didn't say that I am brilliant at PvP, but I think I can handle this: Heinrich Rosenmantel |
Tivookz
The Forgotten Navy Gentlemen's Agreement
19
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Posted - 2011.11.24 13:51:00 -
[44] - Quote
Callduron wrote:On the bright side you did free a lot of slaves. William Wilberforce would be proud!
Win. |
Kirian Kador
KANTAI HIKAGE White Noise.
4
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Posted - 2011.11.24 14:37:00 -
[45] - Quote
Who said he freed them? After all he BOUGHT already FREED slaves. Karma is a ***** |
Heinrich Rosenmantel
The Society of the Rosy Cross Stone Tower Industrial Group
1
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Posted - 2011.11.24 18:16:00 -
[46] - Quote
Alex Pier wrote:This is the care bear character, I have done little to no PvP with him. His main responsibility is to run missions to make money so we can fund the PvP... Secondly I didn't say that I am brilliant at PvP, but I think I can handle this: Heinrich Rosenmantel
I hope you enjoy waiting for a very long time while I remain stationary. Find me in Dantumi. And hell, if you actually became a problem I could always use some of your donation to hire some more guns! |
Patri Andari
Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer
6
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Posted - 2011.11.24 19:43:00 -
[47] - Quote
Heinrich Rosenmantel wrote:I am proud of this thread. Fear not, for your money has been put to good use!
"Well done Pig, well done."
This tactic requires no policing. Just do not be a fool with your isk.
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Kara Books
Hedion University Amarr Empire
10
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Posted - 2011.11.24 22:43:00 -
[48] - Quote
If a negative ISK balance where to be introduced for these situations... |
Moranti Patron
Income Savings Plan
0
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Posted - 2011.11.25 02:04:00 -
[49] - Quote
freed slaves are people...just people....
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Heinrich Rosenmantel
The Society of the Rosy Cross Stone Tower Industrial Group
2
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Posted - 2011.11.25 05:32:00 -
[50] - Quote
Kara Books wrote:If a negative ISK balance where to be introduced for these situations...
If they did that I'd run up immense debts on an alt to myself... |
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