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How to counter Strategic Cruisers?

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Ivy Romanova All Your Machariel Belong to Ham Industrial Technonauts 751	Posted - 2013.01.12 04:30:00 - [1] - Quote Legions , Tengus , Loki... All names that would instantly send a chill down the spine of those listening on the intel channel. Fast , agile , and very lethal. They are among the MOST dangerous ships to fight and perhaps one of the most resilient on the battlefield . With the damage potential of a Battleship and agility of a cruiser , just how do you counter them??? In this game of Rock Paper Scissors Spock. Just what can we use to defeat Spock?? A sex symbol becomes a thing. I just hate to be a thing. -Marilyn Monroe
Xuixien Rifterlings Damu'Khonde 230	Posted - 2013.01.12 04:30:00 - [2] - Quote Blob them. That's how you win in EVE. Everyone vs Everyone Xuixien - Space Cat, Queen of Rens
Ivy Romanova All Your Machariel Belong to Ham Industrial Technonauts 751	Posted - 2013.01.12 04:36:00 - [3] - Quote Xuixien wrote: Blob them. That's how you win in EVE. Well ofc , thats how we ALWAYS took them down (if we can catch them). But THERE HAS to be a counter. Destroyers counter Frigates Cruisers counter destroyers and frigates Battlecruisers counter cruisers ,destroyers, but have trouble against Frigates. Battleships are battlestations that can be countered by frigate and cruisers. Where is the strategic cruiser in that equation? A sex symbol becomes a thing. I just hate to be a thing. -Marilyn Monroe
Commander Ted Sudden Buggery Swift Angels Alliance 401	Posted - 2013.01.12 05:19:00 - [4] - Quote Arbitrators! Killed a blaster prot in my arby not to long ago. Anyway no specific hull counters t3. It depends on the type of t3 and how he is setup. I mean not all frigates are easily taken down by destroyers. some cruisers are great at smashing some frigates but not all, while some cruisers can't touch frigs at all. Don't measure counters by ship class measure them by hull and setup. A shield brutix is a very different ship than an armor one. A fleet maelstrom isn't the same thing as a dual xasb one. Some battleships can make mincemeat of frigates with the proper modules and weapon types. I mean if a t3 is a fast type counter it with something fast, if its a mediocre speed brawler kite it or use a better brawler. Their are to many variants to name the counters for, but you don't list counters for a ship class you do it for a hull and setup type. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
SAJUK NIGARRA Shadows Of The Federation Drunk 'n' Disorderly 100	Posted - 2013.01.12 05:43:00 - [5] - Quote Ivy Romanova wrote: Legions , Tengus , Loki... All names that would instantly send a chill down the spine of those listening on the intel channel. Fast , agile , and very lethal. They are among the MOST dangerous ships to fight and perhaps one of the most resilient on the battlefield . With the damage potential of a Battleship and agility of a cruiser , just how do you counter them??? In this game of Rock Paper Scissors Spock. Just what can we use to defeat Spock?? Webs, painters and neuts.
Zarnak Wulf In Exile. 906	Posted - 2013.01.12 05:49:00 - [6] - Quote T3 nerf is coming. Just wait a while.
ShahFluffers Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance 1808	Posted - 2013.01.12 06:09:00 - [7] - Quote Ewar. Lots of Ewar. Energy neutralizers will ruin Proteuses and Legions. Sensor dampeners will infuriate Tengus. Tracking Disruptors will wreak havoc on Proteuses, Lokis, and some Legion builds. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective.
Ivy Romanova All Your Machariel Belong to Ham Industrial Technonauts 751	Posted - 2013.01.12 08:13:00 - [8] - Quote Well after reading the above posts. There really isn't any counter to it is there? E-War you say? If you're 1v1 ing a t3 , that means your med slots are out and chances are they'll out run you , If you want to be practical with E-war that means you'll need backup, falling back again to the BLOB tactics . Pick arbitrators you say? Are you sure you're not just fighting a poorly skilled pilot in a poorly fi A sex symbol becomes a thing. I just hate to be a thing. -Marilyn Monroe
Danny John-Peter New Eden Renegades Ninja Unicorns with Huge Horns 185	Posted - 2013.01.12 10:53:00 - [9] - Quote Neuts are pretty effective, so maybe something like this for anything that isnt a Tengu; [Curse, Curse Passive TD + Point] Damage Control II Nanofiber Internal Structure II Drone Damage Amplifier II Drone Damage Amplifier II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I, Optimal Range Disruption Script Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I, Optimal Range Disruption Script Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I Republic Fleet Warp Disruptor Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I True Sansha Medium Nosferatu Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Heavy Missile Medium Core Defense Field Extender I Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Valkyrie II x5 Warrior II x5 Hornet EC-300 x5 Hammerhead II x5
Ivy Romanova All Your Machariel Belong to Ham Industrial Technonauts 751	Posted - 2013.01.12 10:58:00 - [10] - Quote Danny John-Peter wrote: Neuts are pretty effective, so maybe something like this for anything that isnt a Tengu; [Curse, Curse Passive TD + Point] Damage Control II Nanofiber Internal Structure II Drone Damage Amplifier II Drone Damage Amplifier II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I, Optimal Range Disruption Script Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I, Optimal Range Disruption Script Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I Republic Fleet Warp Disruptor Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I True Sansha Medium Nosferatu Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Heavy Missile Medium Core Defense Field Extender I Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Valkyrie II x5 Warrior II x5 Hornet EC-300 x5 Hammerhead II x5 considering tengus are about as common as T3 comes , and people are saying how other T3s are crap compared to it . How do you kill a cruiser than can speed tank 2000+dps while dishing 600-700 omni dps ? A sex symbol becomes a thing. I just hate to be a thing. -Marilyn Monroe
Danny John-Peter New Eden Renegades Ninja Unicorns with Huge Horns 185	Posted - 2013.01.12 11:31:00 - [11] - Quote Well, they don't deal that kind of DPS, unless HAM fit in which case they are a lot easier to kill, they deal around 450 these days, and no other T3s arent crap compared, they just have different purposes.
Garviel Tarrant Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel 411	Posted - 2013.01.12 12:09:00 - [12] - Quote What t3 spottings really sound like on intel channels is "OMG! EXPENZIV KILLMAILZ MUSTWHORE!"
Ivy Romanova All Your Machariel Belong to Ham Industrial Technonauts 751	Posted - 2013.01.12 13:41:00 - [13] - Quote Garviel Tarrant wrote: What t3 spottings really sound like on intel channels is "OMG! EXPENZIV KILLMAILZ MUSTWHORE!" Well, BricKs are pretty professional on intel lol. " xxx Spotted in XXX system Nullified cloaky Tengu warped off towards xx cluster . In pursuit . Orders? " but does it matter? When a T3 comes into hostile space , it probably is already prepared for roadblocks . Catching it with skills won't be sufficient , it'll also require a GREAT proportion of luck. If a T3 is camping , the enemy FC probably already has done a complete KB background check and with alts as eyes, the entire fleet compo is already exposed , and killing the T3 is guaranteed to be a blood bath . Even on 1 v 1 , a well skilled tengu will kill ANYTHING less than a BS in a jiffy . Its the ultimate , one man army and don't even get me started on t3 fleets . That reckons the question , even Goliath has a weakness, what are their's? A sex symbol becomes a thing. I just hate to be a thing. -Marilyn Monroe
Machiavelli's Nemesis Angry Mustellid Iron Oxide. 55	Posted - 2013.01.12 14:09:00 - [14] - Quote Ivy Romanova wrote: That reckons the question , even Goliath has a weakness, what are their's? Another t3. LINK or failing that, any gang with the right type of ewar and a rapier/huginn/ashimmu.
Ivy Romanova All Your Machariel Belong to Ham Industrial Technonauts 751	Posted - 2013.01.12 15:57:00 - [15] - Quote in other words ... there are no effective counters A sex symbol becomes a thing. I just hate to be a thing. -Marilyn Monroe
Derath Ellecon Washburne Holdings Situation: Normal 1043	Posted - 2013.01.12 17:11:00 - [16] - Quote Ivy Romanova wrote: in other words ... there are no effective counters There are plenty of ways to kill t3's And to be fair, most T3's don't do BS level damage, although some can fit BS sized tanks. Proteus can do huge damage, has a big tank, but is very susceptible to kiting and neuts. Tengu does so so damage at range, but can be hard to catch. Oh, and show me a fit that does 700dps omni damage (given the tengu only has a bonus to kinetic missiles). Legion is very prone to neuts with lasers. It is a brick armor tanked. Loki has dem long range webs. But generally seems the squishiest of the T3's Given their pretty much guaranteed SP loss these days, they should be tougher than your average ship to counter.
JAF Anders Quantum Cats Syndicate Samurai Pizza Cats 9	Posted - 2013.01.12 18:08:00 - [17] - Quote It is less of a question of how to beat Spock as it is a question to beat Rock or Paper on a given occasion. The question of how to counter any generic strategic cruiser likely indicates the need to become more familiarized with Tech 3 ships and their subsystems. Account for the makeup of each individual ship you encounter and bring a ship or ships that exploit that ship's weaknesses and avoid or inhibit its strengths.
Garviel Tarrant Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel 415	Posted - 2013.01.12 20:10:00 - [18] - Quote Ivy Romanova wrote: Garviel Tarrant wrote: What t3 spottings really sound like on intel channels is "OMG! EXPENZIV KILLMAILZ MUSTWHORE!" Well, BricKs are pretty professional on intel lol. " xxx Spotted in XXX system Nullified cloaky Tengu warped off towards xx cluster . In pursuit . Orders? " lol, how quaint xD
Eli Green The Arrow Project 419	Posted - 2013.01.12 20:21:00 - [19] - Quote This thread needs more Ashimmus wumbo
Benjamin Hamburg Kernel of War Goonswarm Federation 7	Posted - 2013.01.12 21:13:00 - [20] - Quote It depends on the fit. Most Tech 3 that you will encounter in your space, if you live in null, are likely to be nullified and cloaky, wich leave little room to catch them. A skilled interceptor could be able to decloak and point them, maybe 1 time out of 5 , and since these set-up usually are a compromise between tank and dps, it shouldnt be an issue even for a single BC to kill them. If you encounter a Tech 3 wich is not nullified, then you will be able to catch it easilly but killing it will be harder, and you will likely need a gang/logi to support you. The easiest way is to use a tech 3 yourself so you can properly counter fit depending on what you want to fight. Soloing a tech 3 in anything else excepted in a tech 3 yourself is impossible if you want my opinion, unless you gank it with a faction battleship like a vindicator, but he would be stupid to engage that alone, wich if he do, mean he is a scout and you'r screwed. If you want a clue of what fit your target is using, check his lost on evekill, and at least his kills to see if he is close or long range. Beside that, there is not a lot of thing you can do, cause it's the purpose of Tech 3: versatility.
Flyingleanpocket Amarrian Vengeance 24eme Legion Etrangere 16	Posted - 2013.01.12 22:02:00 - [21] - Quote Xuixien wrote: Blob them. That's how you win in EVE. This ShahFluffers wrote: Ewar. Lots of Ewar. Energy neutralizers will ruin Proteuses and Legions. Sensor dampeners will infuriate Tengus. Tracking Disruptors will wreak havoc on Proteuses, Lokis, and some Legion builds. Or this, they're good but few ships are impervious to ewar Zarnak Wulf wrote: T3 nerf is coming. Just wait a while They dont need a nerf just because people are unimaginative and baddies play right into the hands of "solo pwnmobile t3 pilots" They're worse than the highly specialized racial ewar cruisers, and theyre many times more expensive than hacs. Cost is a balancing factor, and Eve is pay to win despite what is vehemently asserted by CCP
terzslave RedStar Enterprises RA Citizens 130	Posted - 2013.01.13 01:51:00 - [22] - Quote NAPOCS!!!!
Machiavelli's Nemesis Angry Mustellid Iron Oxide. 55	Posted - 2013.01.13 02:20:00 - [23] - Quote I really don't see the problem as risk vs reward goes. Look on this forum, you will find people complaining that it's hard to find 1v1s without the other party bringing overwhelming support THEN you also find people complaining that a solo ship has no effective solo counter. In short, HTFU. I've flown cloaky T3s in lowsec tons of times, they give me the option of evading a blob, limited engagement (in the case of a loki with boosted web range) or just going balls deep and wiping out whole gangs (Protus lol [link]. I take on the risk of fighting outnumbered, I take on the risk of losing SP if I die. Is it too much to ask that your response gang includes a Guardian or Curse to shut me down before you come demanding CCP do something to stop me?
Ivy Romanova All Your Machariel Belong to Ham Industrial Technonauts 751	Posted - 2013.01.13 04:19:00 - [24] - Quote Machiavelli's Nemesis wrote: I really don't see the problem as risk vs reward goes. Look on this forum, you will find people complaining that it's hard to find 1v1s without the other party bringing overwhelming support THEN you also find people complaining that a solo ship has no effective solo counter. In short, HTFU. I've flown cloaky T3s in lowsec tons of times, they give me the option of evading a blob, limited engagement (in the case of a loki with boosted web range) or just going balls deep and wiping out whole gangs (Protus lol http://minmatar.eve-kill.net/?a=kill_related&kll_id=10491341). I take on the risk of fighting outnumbered, I take on the risk of losing SP if I die. Is it too much to ask that your response gang includes a Guardian or Curse to shut me down before you come demanding CCP do something to stop me? EDIT: the forum is breaking KB links for some reason, copy/paste it and it works. pretty typical if I'm honest. T3 are known for winning solo against gangs if fitted properly . A sex symbol becomes a thing. I just hate to be a thing. -Marilyn Monroe
Cynthia Nezmor Nezmor's Golden Griffins 111	Posted - 2013.01.13 06:40:00 - [25] - Quote Ivy Romanova wrote: Legions , Tengus , Loki... All names that would instantly send a chill down the spine of those listening on the intel channel. Fast , agile , and very lethal. They are among the MOST dangerous ships to fight and perhaps one of the most resilient on the battlefield . With the damage potential of a Battleship and agility of a cruiser , just how do you counter them??? In this game of Rock Paper Scissors Spock. Just what can we use to defeat Spock?? Your own T3s. Battleship to kill close range T3. Rapiers to kill funny Tengus. Generally: thinking for yourself and not just bringing in ten times more pilots and hoping for the best.
Rammes lol USMG ExFor Legem Terrae. 15	Posted - 2013.01.13 07:48:00 - [26] - Quote Well in my experience I never had a problem with T3s because once you see that in Intel everyone anyone and there brother fleets up to get a kill mail. End result its blob attack for the win.
Cynthia Nezmor Nezmor's Golden Griffins 111	Posted - 2013.01.13 07:57:00 - [27] - Quote Rammes lol wrote: Well in my experience I never had a problem with T3s because once you see that in Intel everyone anyone and there brother fleets up to get a kill mail. End result its blob attack for the win. And people wonder why there is no real pvp in noobsec...
Ivy Romanova All Your Machariel Belong to Ham Industrial Technonauts 753	Posted - 2013.01.13 08:49:00 - [28] - Quote Cynthia Nezmor wrote: Ivy Romanova wrote: Legions , Tengus , Loki... All names that would instantly send a chill down the spine of those listening on the intel channel. Fast , agile , and very lethal. They are among the MOST dangerous ships to fight and perhaps one of the most resilient on the battlefield . With the damage potential of a Battleship and agility of a cruiser , just how do you counter them??? In this game of Rock Paper Scissors Spock. Just what can we use to defeat Spock?? Your own T3s. Battleship to kill close range T3. Rapiers to kill funny Tengus. Generally: thinking for yourself and not just bringing in ten times more pilots and hoping for the best. T3 speed tanking BS damage Long range scrammers and disruptors kites the raiper. If I think only for myself and not follow FC ,I will get popped faster than you can say Nostradamus A sex symbol becomes a thing. I just hate to be a thing. -Marilyn Monroe
Cynthia Nezmor Nezmor's Golden Griffins 119	Posted - 2013.01.13 11:09:00 - [29] - Quote Ivy Romanova wrote: Cynthia Nezmor wrote: Ivy Romanova wrote: Legions , Tengus , Loki... All names that would instantly send a chill down the spine of those listening on the intel channel. Fast , agile , and very lethal. They are among the MOST dangerous ships to fight and perhaps one of the most resilient on the battlefield . With the damage potential of a Battleship and agility of a cruiser , just how do you counter them??? In this game of Rock Paper Scissors Spock. Just what can we use to defeat Spock?? Your own T3s. Battleship to kill close range T3. Rapiers to kill funny Tengus. Generally: thinking for yourself and not just bringing in ten times more pilots and hoping for the best. T3 speed tanking BS damage Long range scrammers and disruptors kites the raiper. If I think only for myself and not follow FC ,I will get popped faster than you can say Nostradamus I killed proteus solo with my t1 Mega while having 90% navy webs on me. Rapier webs at 106 km, good look kiting that. My point is you should play this game with the intention of being a tiny little bit better than what you were yesterday while having fun. Bringing the same clueless horde of noobs is just one solution. Trying to counter those "op" ships is the better. Thinking about a setup that can beat them, and beating them using the same number of people and not just 200 Rifters/Nagas is much more rewarding, you should try it sometimes!
Princess Saskia Hyperfleet Industries 27	Posted - 2013.01.14 11:05:00 - [30] - Quote The counters. Cloaky nullified t3 - A blob sitting on the other side of the gate its jumping through sitting around 15km off the gate so the ship cant cloak Combat 100mn t3 - Webs, once you pin down one of these ships they arent going to last long atall. Brawling fit t3 - Neuts (these tend to be either legions or proteus's) shut off their guns so you can kill them in due course /Princess

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