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Arcticblue2
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Posted - 2005.07.03 12:42:00 -
[1]
Man reading this forum now I see complaining about this 750K bounty rat nerfing... and all kind of apocalyptic visions...
First of all... Dev's try to make people go into low sec by opening up more routes, put in more agent contents for low sec than in high sec and zyd trace in some ore from 0.4 and down... this will drawn people to low sec I am sure of.
Then we get these pirates who complain (don't take me wrong I see pirates who cheers about this change too), these now see that wardec miningcorps as only way now... why ??? if a miningcorp get wardec'ed they will stay in 0.5 and above a pirate with -5 in sec rate will not be able to get to them without hiring others then in that case.
Instead of seeing the oppertuneties like belt piracy, ransoming (This will not affect your sec status) and who knows maybe it will encourage beltpiracy and ransoming because it will not affect your sec status.. but hey if they want to kill people then take responsibility... Risk vs Rewards is always thrown in here, you did get lvl 4 missions nerfed... you did whine about how much lvl 4 was destroying the game so maybe you guys can sit here on the forums and complain aobut this for the next 4 months and maybe.... just maybe you get devs to change that too ???
To use some pirates own word.... Adapt or leave...
---------------------------------------------- "When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things." 1 cor. 13:11 |
Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.07.03 12:53:00 -
[2]
Your logic is flawed.
There is a .5% penalty for initating aggression. That's 13 750k rats under the new patch.
If they refuse to pay the ransom you are obliged to destroy the ship, thats a 2% sec hit. 52 750k rats under the new patch. Afterall, are the ransomers meant to say "Gee, I tried but I cant kill your ship - sec hit and all"??
Pirates have already seen the alternative and will adapt. Its a CCP approved and Concord condoned war on a soft target.
Please dont complain when this happens.
So, in conclusion your facts are blatently incorrect
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theRaptor
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Posted - 2005.07.03 12:59:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Deja Thoris Your logic is flawed.
There is a .5% penalty for initating aggression. That's 13 750k rats under the new patch.
If they refuse to pay the ransom you are obliged to destroy the ship, thats a 2% sec hit. 52 750k rats under the new patch. Afterall, are the ransomers meant to say "Gee, I tried but I cant kill your ship - sec hit and all"??
Pirates have already seen the alternative and will adapt. Its a CCP approved and Concord condoned war on a soft target.
Please dont complain when this happens.
So, in conclusion your facts are blatently incorrect
Hey at least pirates will be rich from all the NPCing
That is not dead which can eternal lie, And with strange aeons even death may die. -- Ancient "Dirt" Religious figure. |
Arcticblue2
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Posted - 2005.07.03 13:06:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Deja Thoris Pirates have already seen the alternative and will adapt. Its a CCP approved and Concord condoned war on a soft target.
So don't complain!!! stop the barrage of whining on both forums how bad this new patch is... because now every other thread is a whining on this new patch and the 750K rat nerf.
But hey maybe I should be happy... they have stopped whining about the nerfing with agents and lvl 4 (you don't really see many agentrunners complaining about the nerf do you ??? seems they are adapting too).
---------------------------------------------- "When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things." 1 cor. 13:11 |
Josiah Bartlet
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Posted - 2005.07.03 13:09:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Arcticblue2
Originally by: Deja Thoris Pirates have already seen the alternative and will adapt. Its a CCP approved and Concord condoned war on a soft target.
So don't complain!!! stop the barrage of whining on both forums how bad this new patch is... because now every other thread is a whining on this new patch and the 750K rat nerf.
But hey maybe I should be happy... they have stopped whining about the nerfing with agents and lvl 4 (you don't really see many agentrunners complaining about the nerf do you ??? seems they are adapting too).
They are far too busy running level 4 missions before the patch comes to post on the forums.
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theRaptor
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Posted - 2005.07.03 13:14:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Arcticblue2
Originally by: Deja Thoris Pirates have already seen the alternative and will adapt. Its a CCP approved and Concord condoned war on a soft target.
So don't complain!!! stop the barrage of whining on both forums how bad this new patch is... because now every other thread is a whining on this new patch and the 750K rat nerf.
You started this thread.
Why don't you spam some messages to stop people spamming messages. Brilliant plan.
That is not dead which can eternal lie, And with strange aeons even death may die. -- Ancient "Dirt" Religious figure. |
Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.07.03 13:16:00 -
[7]
Level 4 agent missions will still be a great cash cow.
The main problem with the change in the way sec status works is people deserve the chance to change their play styles.
It's a one way trip now.
You will also note that people against this "nerf" have generally present well reasoned and thought provoking arguements to back up their point.
People for this "nerf" have responded with "lolol die ******* griefer" or suchlike.
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dantes inferno
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Posted - 2005.07.03 13:53:00 -
[8]
"People for this "nerf" have responded with "lolol die ******* griefer" or suchlike.
"
prehaps such people are getting their own back for all the similar posts made by pirates, so called griefers, and thiefs. every time "caerbears" and other victims of these people complain they get the exact juvinile(sp) posts in return, so now they see the same pirates,etc. complaining their getting their own back _____
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MadGaz
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Posted - 2005.07.03 14:19:00 -
[9]
Might aswell start a vote against Arcticblue2's corp then. ------------------------------------------
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Arcticblue2
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Posted - 2005.07.03 14:26:00 -
[10]
Originally by: MadGaz Might aswell start a vote against Arcticblue2's corp then.
If that turns you on... Good thing my corp don't have any assets so ditching the corp is not that difficult, and well ... also good to have several accounts so still would be playing well with what I do
---------------------------------------------- "When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things." 1 cor. 13:11 |
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MadGaz
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Posted - 2005.07.03 14:32:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Arcticblue2
Originally by: MadGaz Might aswell start a vote against Arcticblue2's corp then.
If that turns you on... Good thing my corp don't have any assets so ditching the corp is not that difficult, and well ... also good to have several accounts so still would be playing well with what I do
omg wardodging 'sploit. ------------------------------------------
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Arcticblue2
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Posted - 2005.07.03 14:35:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Arcticblue2 on 03/07/2005 14:38:50
Originally by: MadGaz
Originally by: Arcticblue2
Originally by: MadGaz Might aswell start a vote against Arcticblue2's corp then.
If that turns you on... Good thing my corp don't have any assets so ditching the corp is not that difficult, and well ... also good to have several accounts so still would be playing well with what I do
omg wardodging 'sploit.
Only exploit if we join old corp can leave an alt there and you guys have fun camping that station hehe but you are more than welcome to take a shot at me when I am mining in low sec because that happens from time to time.
EDIT: and btw ... yes after the patch you will most likly find me even more in low sec doing missions or mining
---------------------------------------------- "When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things." 1 cor. 13:11 |
Liu Kaskakka
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Posted - 2005.07.03 14:58:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Arcticblue2 they will stay in 0.5 and above a pirate with -5 in sec rate will not be able to get to them without hiring others then in that case.
My sec is ok thx.
Quote: you did get lvl 4 missions nerfed... you did whine about how much lvl 4 was destroying the game so maybe you guys can sit here on the forums and complain aobut this for the next 4 months and maybe.... just maybe you get devs to change that too ???
I've made a couple billion doing the missions myself and I still want them nerfed hard. You, Sir, must be stupid if you don't understand what's wrong with them
Quote: To use some pirates own word.... Adapt or leave...
I will, don't worry about that.
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Arcticblue2
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Posted - 2005.07.03 15:23:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Liu Kaskakka I've made a couple billion doing the missions myself and I still want them nerfed hard. You, Sir, must be stupid if you don't understand what's wrong with them
Well I have been doing my share of lvl 4 missions as well and yeah I do agree they need nerfing, to be honest I become tired of them because they where abit to easy when doing them alone.... I made lots of isk doing them, and went back to mining because I like building things and it is even more fun when people actually buy's the stuff.
---------------------------------------------- "When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things." 1 cor. 13:11 |
MadGaz
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Posted - 2005.07.03 15:24:00 -
[15]
Well if I go under -2.0 I'm gonna turn into a lame ass sniper, popping nubs all day. ------------------------------------------
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Zell
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Posted - 2005.07.03 15:29:00 -
[16]
I think this is an excellent fix for the 750k sploit.
What the whiners here are saying, is not that they can't do the missions any more, but that they can't be bothered to take the additional time required to fix there aggressions.
re:lazy..
CCP is just putting more of a time sink into this fascet of the game to equal the time spent mineing/buying/building the ships you rats hope to destroy without (much)repercussion..
High time everyone was on an even playing field..
Good job CCP!
"A coward dies a thousand times, the brave die just once.." |
Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.07.03 15:57:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Zell Edited by: Zell on 03/07/2005 15:33:24
I think this is an excellent fix for the 750k sploit.
What the whiners here are saying, is not that they can't do the missions any more, but that they don't want to take the additional time required to fix there aggressions.
re:lazy..
CCP is just putting more of a time sink into this fascet of the game to equal the time spent mineing/buying/building the ships you rats hope to destroy without (much)repercussion..
High time everyone was on an even playing field..
Good job CCP!
I think you need to get a clue.
If a player brags he can make 100 mill a day doing level 4's then ergo it takes him less than a day to recoup his losses if he gets killed by pirates.
It takes roughly 35 hours to regain lost sec at the mo if you are -10. A lot of single player games brag if their campaigns are this long.
Now it will take 350 hours to regain said sec losses. Thats nothing to do with laziness, thats simply not reasonable, practical or feasible.
I'm sorry if my facts blow your assumptions and conjecture out of the water.
Come back with hard facts and we can continue the debate.
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Arcticblue2
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Posted - 2005.07.03 16:02:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Deja Thoris
I think you need to get a clue.
If a player brags he can make 100 mill a day doing level 4's then ergo it takes him less than a day to recoup his losses if he gets killed by pirates.
It takes roughly 35 hours to regain lost sec at the mo if you are -10. A lot of single player games brag if their campaigns are this long.
Now it will take 350 hours to regain said sec losses. Thats nothing to do with laziness, thats simply not reasonable, practical or feasible.
I'm sorry if my facts blow your assumptions and conjecture out of the water.
Come back with hard facts and we can continue the debate.
But this is a way to make you choose a path, if you are a die hard pirate then -10 sec status means nothing, and I think I have seen plenty of them camping gates from time to time.
if you are a wannabe pirate then yes ... loss of secstatus will suck...
I got to agree that I don't know all about sec loss and such because I have not been doing that kind of stuff myself.. but if I where having a bad sec loss or being a pirate I would not care... because piracy still will be a way of life in low sec and 0.0...
---------------------------------------------- "When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things." 1 cor. 13:11 |
Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.07.03 16:05:00 -
[19]
So alternative play styles are forever lost to a person with low sec...
This is the problem I have.
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Elucidate
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Posted - 2005.07.03 16:08:00 -
[20]
I've got a fact:
You shot someone in secure space and took a sec hit.
Concord does not like that. You made the choice to shoot, now you either stick with your path, or fix it - and fixing it is going to take a long time, as it should. Crimes are not quickly forgotten. ------------ Elucidate - Extraordinarily Lazy Miner |
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Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.07.03 16:15:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Elucidate I've got a fact:
You shot someone in secure space and took a sec hit.
Concord does not like that. You made the choice to shoot, now you either stick with your path, or fix it - and fixing it is going to take a long time, as it should. Crimes are not quickly forgotten.
Give me some numbers.
How long should it take in your opinion? Lets imagine said player has 2 hours per day to pay for his sins?
This way we can move away from the weak generalizations and get something concrete to work with.
Give me a number.
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Galk
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Posted - 2005.07.03 16:24:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Galk on 03/07/2005 16:28:48 Edited by: Galk on 03/07/2005 16:26:41 Ummm..
Tell that to the people who specialise their characters in other areas..
Y'all don't seem to have a problem with them when your blowing them up.
Once they have there mid 20's intel and memory atributes and dedicate to learn the abbundance of science/trade/building skills... it leaves them at a massive disadvantage to move it other areas.
I would be also intrested as to what 'other' areas (lets just generalize) and say your average smack talking low sec pirate/pvp'er... whatever.. would be intrested in doing (in high sec space)
Obviously a big generaliztion there on the type of player, but i make that on my dealings with low sec pirates.. placid in perticular.
But intresting i think for all to hear why so 'pirates' would want to change there defining lifestyle into wanting to be part of the greater community in high sec empire space... --------
"I have always depended on the kindness of strangers."
'A Streetcar Named Desire' |
Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.07.03 16:28:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Galk Ummm..
Tell that to the people who specialise their characters in other areas..
Y'all don't seem to have a problem with them when your blowing them up.
Once they have there mid 20's intel and perception atributes and dedicate to learn the abbundance of science/trade/building skills... it leaves them at a massive disadvantage to move it other areas.
I would be also intrested as to what 'other' areas (lets just generalise) and say your average smack talking low sec pirate/pvp'er... whatever.. would be intrested in doing (in high sec space)
Obviously a big generalistion there on the type of player, but i make that on my dealings with low sec pirates.. placid in perticular.
But intresting i think for all to hear why so 'pirates' would want to change there defining lifestyle into wanting to be part of the greater community in high sec empire space...
Dunno,
Perhaps a person takes a disliking to another.
Maybe said person plots an attack on...hmmm... some mining barges in a .7 system with some smartbombs.
Said person does this and is forever condemned to lowsec for one action?
Sound familiar or did you manage to repair a bit of that sec hit?
If you did, why deny others the opportunity?
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Galk
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Posted - 2005.07.03 16:31:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Galk on 03/07/2005 16:35:33 I would be denied my 5.0 sec status.
I was very proud of that, was one of the first to achive it.
A sacrifice on my part, look between the lines, i made a choice. edit* As for repairing it.. ive done nothing but missions...
--------
"I have always depended on the kindness of strangers."
'A Streetcar Named Desire' |
Rafein
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Posted - 2005.07.03 16:32:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Deja Thoris Level 4 agent missions will still be a great cash cow.
The main problem with the change in the way sec status works is people deserve the chance to change their play styles.
It's a one way trip now.
Perhaps there should be a kind to amnesty available when the patch comes out, to give those players a chance to change their play styles.
But getting rid of the Carebears that think they are Pirates, the one's that do their dance, and jumping from Empire to Unsecure space, is better in the long run.
All pirates risk is losing some Sec status when podkilling another player. It's about time that penalty had the same teeth as a Podkill.
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Queen Agave
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Posted - 2005.07.03 16:33:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Queen Agave on 03/07/2005 16:37:49 Maybe you shouldn't be able to pay for your sins at all. Maybe you should have to die with them. There's really no purpose to having high sec in the current game, and certainly no downside to having neutral status.
The sec system we have inherited today seems to be an anachronism from a different conception of the game in pre-beta times.
If enough people are banned from empire, part of empire will follow them. You will be responsible for securing ties to those who will help support you.
If anything, the more politically realistic EVE becomes, the more it will attract people of above average intelligence.
People that are opposed to this just want PvP to become another anonymous grind like PvE. These people don't understand the real thrill of truly opposing another person who they can recognize for their goals and objectives. It's all about quality of kills rather than quantity in a political sim.
You have to become willing to let the small fry slip by and go after the big fish. Then people will respect you as part of the competitive community.
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Zell
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Posted - 2005.07.03 16:35:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Deja Thoris
Originally by: Zell Edited by: Zell on 03/07/2005 15:33:24
I think this is an excellent fix for the 750k sploit.
What the whiners here are saying, is not that they can't do the missions any more, but that they don't want to take the additional time required to fix there aggressions.
re:lazy..
CCP is just putting more of a time sink into this fascet of the game to equal the time spent mineing/buying/building the ships you rats hope to destroy without (much)repercussion..
High time everyone was on an even playing field..
Good job CCP!
I think you need to get a clue.
If a player brags he can make 100 mill a day doing level 4's then ergo it takes him less than a day to recoup his losses if he gets killed by pirates.
It takes roughly 35 hours to regain lost sec at the mo if you are -10. A lot of single player games brag if their campaigns are this long.
Now it will take 350 hours to regain said sec losses. Thats nothing to do with laziness, thats simply not reasonable, practical or feasible.
I'm sorry if my facts blow your assumptions and conjecture out of the water.
Come back with hard facts and we can continue the debate.
Im sorry, but its you that needs a clue..
First, a player bragging that he makes 100mil on lvl 4 missions, isn't the same as one that actually, can (and does?). Added to that the very real possibility that the percentage of those capeable, willing and able to do this on a regular basis, is in the single digits, if that. So quoteing a "player bragging" as the gospel for the "norm" of the player base, is, flawed.
Also, making 100mil " a day" (24?12? hours of play),that can be midigated by 11 secs of volley fire doesn't exactly equal out there either does it? , if you are comparing wallet bottom lines at the end of the session.
So to recap your logic...
A player making 100mil a day on missions is bad, A player killing players making 100mil a day on missions in 11 secs, good. Having to pay for this pleasure in a time sink way, bad.
uh-huh
So try another one, Im sure everyone sees right through your "facts"..
"A coward dies a thousand times, the brave die just once.." |
Zell
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Posted - 2005.07.03 16:39:00 -
[28]
Whats being lost in translation, is not the fact that you "can't" repair faction/standing, but choose not to do so...At the rate now prescribed by CCP.
Ok you've been nerfed.
Many other game mechanics have been changed, and will continue to do so, some even not to your likeing....
Deal, or quit.
"A coward dies a thousand times, the brave die just once.." |
Ruffio Sepico
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Posted - 2005.07.03 17:15:00 -
[29]
Originally by: MadGaz
omg wardodging 'sploit.
Actually, its not a sploit. You can freely leave a corp, and nothing keep you from rejoin it again later. What is a sploit is to leave a corp to avoid a camp/blockade, etc then rejoin again right after, rinse and repeat.
Thats how players like us, avoid players like you
Home: http://www.hidden-agenda.co.uk HiD Kills: http://eve.hidden-agenda.co.uk/kill_list.php
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Arcticblue2
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Posted - 2005.07.03 19:51:00 -
[30]
Well maybe there can be a isk sink into this... a pirate can pay himself to get better standing... for example ... 1 billion isk to get back into empire ???
Just a tought ofcourse, that it is a way to get away from the time sink and maybe make it a isk sink instead ???
---------------------------------------------- "When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things." 1 cor. 13:11 |
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