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The 750k security status change is ridiculous.

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Aryth	Posted - 2005.07.04 00:53:00 - [61] Edited by: Aryth on 04/07/2005 00:53:49 Originally by: Blind Fear As bsspewer's graph clearly notes, it takes 319 hours of pure NPC grind to change away from the pirate profession. That is 2 weeks of 23/7 grinding. Umm...That seems like a reasonable amount of time to change from a pirate proffession. I was under the impression that it was SUPPOSED to be hard to gain back security status after you go pirate. did i miss something? A few weeks of npcing/complexing to replace months of piracy. I think thats a fair deal. whats the problem again?
Allen Deckard	Posted - 2005.07.04 00:58:00 - [62] Originally by: Ivana Killya Edited by: Ivana Killya on 04/07/2005 00:42:43 Well u see not many peeps hunt solo in emp.most emp rats gank (multi ships) so your dead in a few secs! sent guns hurt solo. ive looked at my post again and cant see where i claim to be uber and better then YOU ! BUT IF THE SHOE FITS All you said was that by the time I would see someone with a -10 sec I would be dead. If you meant that By the time I would see the 8 -10 pirates ganking the gate I would be dead. Then thats a little different statement. Under that situation what exactly will have changed? Pirates sit at .4 ganking everything that comes threw now. And don't say that most pirates pick and choose targets to get those that will make a profit as i have been killed and podded in a shuttle before in .4 using a 3 day old alt. All I am saying is instead of some "pirate" that has a higher sec status then alot of non pirates ganking people at a gate it is gonna be a lot of "pirates" that "LOOK" like pirates sitting at gates ganking.
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2005.07.04 01:00:00 - [63] Originally by: Olivin Edited by: Olivin on 04/07/2005 00:34:22 Originally by: Maya Rkell You realise by posting in these threads, you're making yourself prime targets for "pirate" wardecs im Empire, right? LOL. Could it be more pathetic? Olivin No, the change couldn't be. (btw, I suggest you do some checking before you make accusations. I'm NOT a Pirate and never have been...) "Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted."
Ixianus	Posted - 2005.07.04 01:15:00 - [64] Edited by: Ixianus on 04/07/2005 01:15:03 People always assume that if you arnt for harder sec increase/decrease penalties that you are a pirate. And about the several weeks straight of npcing not being that bad, yeah.... Im not willing to do anything straight for 2 or so weeks, on a realistic time frame that is about 3 months of nothing but npcing, on a more casual time frame thats closer to 6months-never. Last time I looked grinding NPCs wasnt the most entertaining thing to do.
Claude Leon	Posted - 2005.07.04 01:19:00 - [65] Edited by: Claude Leon on 04/07/2005 01:19:51 Originally by: Ixianus Edited by: Ixianus on 04/07/2005 01:15:03 People always assume that if you arnt for harder sec increase/decrease penalties that you are a pirate. And about the several weeks straight of npcing not being that bad, yeah.... Im not willing to do anything straight for 2 or so weeks, on a realistic time frame that is about 3 months of nothing but npcing, on a more casual time frame thats closer to 6months-never. Last time I looked grinding NPCs wasnt the most entertaining thing to do. So, grinding is acceptable for that person trying to increase their sec rating? Did it only become a problem when it affected you? I am really trying to understand the opposing views arguement. All I see is people that are upset over their actions and are to lazy to fix them. ===================================================
Ixianus	Posted - 2005.07.04 01:55:00 - [66] Shifts into a more traditional Amarrian mode Claude, I am 6 times your age. I see in your limited existance you have managed to increase your security status by .2. It is beyond the point of practicality to repair security status. I would love to see you and your no doubt armada of alts all decreased to a rather negligable, by your standerds at least, -7.8sec status. And then you could recant to me the pleasures of endless grind. The system is broken, by forcing persons with a low security status to remain that way there will only be an increase in piracy and podkilling. Also its rather disparaging for anyone who wants to do anything that doesnt involve ganking everything that moves, to look forward and see a year long trek throuch zombie npc land.
Claude Leon	Posted - 2005.07.04 02:03:00 - [67] Originally by: Ixianus Shifts into a more traditional Amarrian mode Claude, I am 6 times your age. I see in your limited existance you have managed to increase your security status by .2. It is beyond the point of practicality to repair security status. I would love to see you and your no doubt armada of alts all decreased to a rather negligable, by your standerds at least, -7.8sec status. And then you could recant to me the pleasures of endless grind. The system is broken, by forcing persons with a low security status to remain that way there will only be an increase in piracy and podkilling. Also its rather disparaging for anyone who wants to do anything that doesnt involve ganking everything that moves, to look forward and see a year long trek throuch zombie npc land. The system is not broken, only a certain group of players are. Do we really need to go over the issue again? Just like I have to "grind" to increase my sec status, pirates should have to grind too. If, they want to increase their sec status, of course. ===================================================
Ixianus	Posted - 2005.07.04 02:07:00 - [68] Once you go there we will see. My sec status, as said earlier has been like this for a year or more. Ive killed quite the millions of npc rats. You would think, over a year, that casual rat killing would get a sizable sec increase. But you know.... you will counter with the same thing... again.
Blind Fear	Posted - 2005.07.04 02:10:00 - [69] Originally by: Aryth Edited by: Aryth on 04/07/2005 00:53:49 Originally by: Blind Fear As bsspewer's graph clearly notes, it takes 319 hours of pure NPC grind to change away from the pirate profession. That is 2 weeks of 23/7 grinding. Umm...That seems like a reasonable amount of time to change from a pirate proffession. I was under the impression that it was SUPPOSED to be hard to gain back security status after you go pirate. did i miss something? A few weeks of npcing/complexing to replace months of piracy. I think thats a fair deal. whats the problem again? If you think that working a full-time job for 8 weeks is an acceptable amount of time to change professions, there's really nothing more that needs to be said. You're an idiot.
Ander	Posted - 2005.07.04 02:16:00 - [70] Originally by: Blind Fear Originally by: Aryth Edited by: Aryth on 04/07/2005 00:53:49 Originally by: Blind Fear As bsspewer's graph clearly notes, it takes 319 hours of pure NPC grind to change away from the pirate profession. That is 2 weeks of 23/7 grinding. Umm...That seems like a reasonable amount of time to change from a pirate proffession. I was under the impression that it was SUPPOSED to be hard to gain back security status after you go pirate. did i miss something? A few weeks of npcing/complexing to replace months of piracy. I think thats a fair deal. whats the problem again? If you think that working a full-time job for 8 weeks is an acceptable amount of time to change professions, there's really nothing more that needs to be said. You're an idiot. I have to agree on this one. At times when I cannot be a pirate (as in during wars) I want to be able to go to empire without getting shot. 319h grinding... the war would already be lost while the majority of our miner members in high sec gets ganked daily. http://www.eve-pirate.com Headlines: EVE-PIRATE.COM - DOES NOT CONDONE THE NEXT PATCH!
Reiisha	Posted - 2005.07.04 02:24:00 - [71] How odd..... I went from -0.7 to -0.2 with just 'some' hours of npc'ing and agents. I think this is rather ok.... -10 to +5 in a week of casual play? **** off. That's like killing someone intentionally, and expecting to get a week of prison. Huh? Another problem with this though: I had a nice sec rating of +0.7. A corpmate got attacked in a 0.4. So, i get my Thorax and head there. A BB with a bounty and -4 sec rating is shooting newbies at an agent location. I kill him, what happens? CONCORD rewards me with 250k (his bounty) and also lowers my sec rating by 1.5. Huh? Reiisha's Skills
Deja Thoris	Posted - 2005.07.04 02:32:00 - [72] Originally by: Claude Leon Originally by: Ixianus Shifts into a more traditional Amarrian mode Claude, I am 6 times your age. I see in your limited existance you have managed to increase your security status by .2. It is beyond the point of practicality to repair security status. I would love to see you and your no doubt armada of alts all decreased to a rather negligable, by your standerds at least, -7.8sec status. And then you could recant to me the pleasures of endless grind. The system is broken, by forcing persons with a low security status to remain that way there will only be an increase in piracy and podkilling. Also its rather disparaging for anyone who wants to do anything that doesnt involve ganking everything that moves, to look forward and see a year long trek throuch zombie npc land. The system is not broken, only a certain group of players are. Do we really need to go over the issue again? Just like I have to "grind" to increase my sec status, pirates should have to grind too. If, they want to increase their sec status, of course. See, there you go calling other peoples play styles broken. You have addressed the person behind the post in all of your responses and not the opinion they had. "You makr me sick" and "I used to have respect for you" as just some of the gems I've seen. I'm a disagreeable ass on the forums but you sir, have raised it to an art form. Attack the issue, not the person.
Logan Xerxes	Posted - 2005.07.04 02:40:00 - [73] I am a pirate. Now, I am a "true" pirate, I don't sig at a gate and 'wtfpwn' anything that come through. I Hunt through belts looking for a target to ransom. I Prefer by choice not to blow up ships or pod people. Now, this still means that over time I would have to work up my sec status every so often. Not a prob that. But If someone tells me have to do an odd week of grinding so i can raise my sec status by some impossible fraction so I can get from point A to B in a reasonable time frame, I get rather ****ed. It's a GAME people... Also, this kinda buggers anti-pirates who shoot first and kill a pirate and they get smacked with the sec status hit.
MindBender	Posted - 2005.07.04 02:43:00 - [74] These gankers need to stop the whining. I have LOTS of pod and ship kills and my sec status has NEVER dropped below 5.0. Then again all my pod kills were in 0.0 space where CCP intended them to be. You want to gank noobs then pay the price. Once you can't enter high sec space then we can gank you.
Deja Thoris	Posted - 2005.07.04 02:49:00 - [75] Originally by: MindBender These gankers need to stop the whining. I have LOTS of pod and ship kills and my sec status has NEVER dropped below 5.0. Then again all my pod kills were in 0.0 space where CCP intended them to be. You want to gank noobs then pay the price. Once you can't enter high sec space then we can gank you. Err, haha - look noob in a frig looking to see 0.0 - GANK HIM Hypocrite
Allen Deckard	Posted - 2005.07.04 02:52:00 - [76] Originally by: Logan Xerxes I am a pirate. Now, I am a "true" pirate, I don't sig at a gate and 'wtfpwn' anything that come through. I Hunt through belts looking for a target to ransom. I Prefer by choice not to blow up ships or pod people. Now, this still means that over time I would have to work up my sec status every so often. Not a prob that. But If someone tells me have to do an odd week of grinding so i can raise my sec status by some impossible fraction so I can get from point A to B in a reasonable time frame, I get rather **ed. It's a GAME people... Also, this kinda buggers anti-pirates who shoot first and kill a pirate and they get smacked with the sec status hit.[/**quote] Not if the pirates they were hunting actually had pirate sec status relative to their deeds in game.
Alita Tiphares	Posted - 2005.07.04 03:29:00 - [77] this thread is infested with carebear hobby-pirates. you either are a pirate or you arent, there is no in-between.
Claude Leon	Posted - 2005.07.04 03:33:00 - [78] Edited by: Claude Leon on 04/07/2005 03:34:54 Edited by: Claude Leon on 04/07/2005 03:33:53 Originally by: Deja Thoris Originally by: Claude Leon Originally by: Ixianus Shifts into a more traditional Amarrian mode Claude, I am 6 times your age. I see in your limited existance you have managed to increase your security status by .2. It is beyond the point of practicality to repair security status. I would love to see you and your no doubt armada of alts all decreased to a rather negligable, by your standerds at least, -7.8sec status. And then you could recant to me the pleasures of endless grind. The system is broken, by forcing persons with a low security status to remain that way there will only be an increase in piracy and podkilling. Also its rather disparaging for anyone who wants to do anything that doesnt involve ganking everything that moves, to look forward and see a year long trek throuch zombie npc land. The system is not broken, only a certain group of players are. Do we really need to go over the issue again? Just like I have to "grind" to increase my sec status, pirates should have to grind too. If, they want to increase their sec status, of course. See, there you go calling other peoples play styles broken. You have addressed the person behind the post in all of your responses and not the opinion they had. "You makr me sick" and "I used to have respect for you" as just some of the gems I've seen. I'm a disagreeable ass on the forums but you sir, have raised it to an art form. Attack the issue, not the person. Deja, the problem is that these so-called pirates have lost their "carebear" card and now they are crying. If you choose to be a pirate then DEAL WITH THE CONSEQUENCES of that role. How many times must this be said to get it through youe skull? Your flipping of sec status has been taken away. You were using a bug to your advantage, I consider that an expliot. Do we really need to go on with this? There are three options here: 1. Adapt 2. Whine 3. Leave It is as simple as that, boys. "this thread is infested with carebear hobby-pirates. you either are a pirate or you arent, there is no in-between." Best damn quote of the thread. ===================================================
Solarfury	Posted - 2005.07.04 03:45:00 - [79] I don't get the problem here. CCP didn't take away the ability to hunt npc to fix sec standing. Pirates just need to spend more time on it than in past that is all. Consider the people who got killed will have to spend days and even weeks to replace their lost. What is the problem for pirates to spend more time to fix their standing? Crime and punishment comes in hand to hand. As for more podding, honestly people are pod killing anyway. It makes no difference what so ever with or without this bug fix. Again, if pirates don't want to suffer from low sec, then just don't go around killing people. Or move to 0.0 systems then you don't have to worry about sec standing. Adapt or die it is that simple.
HUGO DRAX	Posted - 2005.07.04 03:49:00 - [80] Think about it the way it is pre-patch. Ganker kills noob running mission in his 9million dollar Cruiser + assorted fittings, New player is forced to Mining hell at the belts for weeks in a velator with a basic mining laser to earn enough to get back on the saddle. The ganker gets his jollies in local and does a little NPC hunting to go back to empire as Mr. Niceguy. Postpatch, Noob grinds and now ganker has to grind also. Looks like things have reached a state of equilibrium don't you think? This leaves the weekend gankers a few choices, #1 fight real fights with skilled pilots in 0.0 like a man, or all the weekend gankers can form a corporation and wardec all the small corps and have your joillies that way.
Deja Thoris	Posted - 2005.07.04 03:58:00 - [81] Originally by: HUGO DRAX Think about it the way it is pre-patch. Ganker kills noob running mission in his 9million dollar Cruiser + assorted fittings, New player is forced to Mining hell at the belts for weeks in a velator with a basic mining laser to earn enough to get back on the saddle. The ganker gets his jollies in local and does a little NPC hunting to go back to empire as Mr. Niceguy. Postpatch, Noob grinds and now ganker has to grind also. Looks like things have reached a state of equilibrium don't you think? This leaves the weekend gankers a few choices, #1 fight real fights with skilled pilots in 0.0 like a man, or all the weekend gankers can form a corporation and wardec all the small corps and have your joillies that way. First rule, dont fly what you cant afford to lose. There are bigeer issues here. Not our fault you fail to see them.
HUGO DRAX	Posted - 2005.07.04 04:24:00 - [82] I self insure so I can afford the loss (Blueprints, mineral stores etc, mining and building skills in addition to my main focus which is fighting) I die, I crank out another ship 3 hours later. Anyhow the ones I feel bad for are the new players that have a mission and it goes to Egg for example. What the heck are they supposed to do? not play EvE since they cannot afford losing a ship/pod to a ganker who targets the weak for jollies instead of fighting like a man against other skilled pilots. Now things are equal, the newguy has to spend 3 weeks mining and the jolly go happy weekend ganker has to spend time grinding NPC so he can go back to Yulai. The only folk not whining are the true pirates who actually could care less about sec status, actually act like real pirates (Pay or die) and has the resources to survive in lowsec space due to being a successful pirate. You dont see them in Egg for example in a drunken stooper blowing up everything in sight just for laughs. Looks like things are now balanced, you die you grind, you kill you grind. So now is it worth killing a noob and be stuck with nothing but low sec?, or weigh the options and kill when there is real money to be made making the secstatus a moot point. This fix will probably weed-out the dimwit criminals and only the pros will be left. Just the way it is in real life where all the dimwits who rob gas-stations for 10 dollars end up in the brig while the pros are raking in the cash living in the underbelly of society. Thank god for the updated logoff timers, this means if you pick the wrong target and realize you are now outmatched you cannot pull the plug and call it a day. Its all good.
DukDodgerz	Posted - 2005.07.04 04:39:00 - [83] Originally by: Dark Shikari Originally by: Claude Leon Shut up! I am getting quite tired of this whining. Just as in life. If you make a choice you deal with the consequences. How come the only ones whining are gate gankers and wanna be pirates? You people make me sick. How come you're the only one who gets to decide who is a "wanna be pirate"? i say so too, now go back to your corner and put that pointy hat bak on...
Drunk Driver	Posted - 2005.07.04 04:43:00 - [84] I want to be a pirate! I don't want to be a pirate! I want to be a pirate! I don't want to be a pirate! I want to be a pirate! I don't want to be a pirate! I want to be a pirate! I don't want to be a pirate! Etc....... Goodbye 750K bug. We'll miss you.
DukDodgerz	Posted - 2005.07.04 04:52:00 - [85] Originally by: Deja Thoris Originally by: HUGO DRAX Think about it the way it is pre-patch. Ganker kills noob running mission in his 9million dollar Cruiser + assorted fittings, New player is forced to Mining hell at the belts for weeks in a velator with a basic mining laser to earn enough to get back on the saddle. The ganker gets his jollies in local and does a little NPC hunting to go back to empire as Mr. Niceguy. Postpatch, Noob grinds and now ganker has to grind also. Looks like things have reached a state of equilibrium don't you think? This leaves the weekend gankers a few choices, #1 fight real fights with skilled pilots in 0.0 like a man, or all the weekend gankers can form a corporation and wardec all the small corps and have your joillies that way. First rule, dont fly what you cant afford to lose. There are bigeer issues here. Not our fault you fail to see them. classical excuse of the criminal, "it isn't my fault..." ... yayaya, blame your clone tech, blame your chldhood as a slave to a pirate that abused you, blame it on anyone and anything other then yourself.
Deja Thoris	Posted - 2005.07.04 04:56:00 - [86] I could point out once again I am not a criminal. I do think the changes are dumb. Thanks for seeing the person and not the issue.
Bubba Fett	Posted - 2005.07.04 05:37:00 - [87] Pirates want a way to improve their sec rating? Well, since we need a solution that doesn't let people yo-yo their sec rating, they should let people buy higher sec status with the most valuable currency in the game. Skill points. You want a big sec rating increase, it should cost a BIG number of skill points. (eg, a million skill points per 1.0 sec rating gained) That would give people a chance to recover from a mistake or a bad career choice, but would be so expensive that you wouldn't use it often.
Bubba Fett	Posted - 2005.07.04 05:41:00 - [88] Originally by: Deja Thoris First rule, dont fly what you cant afford to lose. There are bigeer issues here. Not our fault you fail to see them.[/quote Second rule, don't waste security rating you can't afford to lose. There are bigger issues here. Not our fault you fail to see them.
Deja Thoris	Posted - 2005.07.04 05:49:00 - [89] Originally by: Bubba Fett Pirates want a way to improve their sec rating? Well, since we need a solution that doesn't let people yo-yo their sec rating, they should let people buy higher sec status with the most valuable currency in the game. Skill points. You want a big sec rating increase, it should cost a BIG number of skill points. (eg, a million skill points per 1.0 sec rating gained) That would give people a chance to recover from a mistake or a bad career choice, but would be so expensive that you wouldn't use it often. Err, it isnt April 1. One MILLION SP per 1.0
Rafein	Posted - 2005.07.04 07:48:00 - [90] Originally by: Deja Thoris Originally by: HUGO DRAX Think about it the way it is pre-patch. Ganker kills noob running mission in his 9million dollar Cruiser + assorted fittings, New player is forced to Mining hell at the belts for weeks in a velator with a basic mining laser to earn enough to get back on the saddle. The ganker gets his jollies in local and does a little NPC hunting to go back to empire as Mr. Niceguy. Postpatch, Noob grinds and now ganker has to grind also. Looks like things have reached a state of equilibrium don't you think? This leaves the weekend gankers a few choices, #1 fight real fights with skilled pilots in 0.0 like a man, or all the weekend gankers can form a corporation and wardec all the small corps and have your joillies that way. First rule, dont fly what you cant afford to lose. There are bigeer issues here. Not our fault you fail to see them. Second Rule, don't attack a friendly if you can't afford the Sec hit. And Yes, there are bigger issues here. Like making Sec status mean something. Like making the "punishment" of low Sec status hard to wash away. Like populating unsecure space with more players who enjoy being a pirate, all of which, this change helps, so the current pirates already have something to do. I'm sure I missed one or 2, but I just got home from work. Personally, I'd like to see the return of the .1 a day Sec gain, but that's just me.

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