With the venture out (no nerf on the horizon), and gas prices dropping, I don't think it should be easier to harvest gas. Another reason is it takes the risk out of using shiny ships to clear the sleepers....a potential PVP aspect that is getting harder to find.

With the venture out (no nerf on the horizon), and gas prices dropping, I don't think it should be easier to harvest gas. Another reason is it takes the risk out of using shiny ships to clear the sleepers....a potential PVP aspect that is getting harder to find.

Seriously? I expect the nullbear whiners with their Nerf AFK cloaking. Or the highsec bears crying nerf suicide ganking. Or even the high sec PVP'rs whining about NPC corps.

And who cares about gas prices? I can make more in 20min running a site than an hour mining gas. Let them have it.


I wouldn't have expected one of the alliances listed on the "notable wormhole alliances" to be ones to make a whiny ***** post like this. Grow a pair and go kill some ventures. Plenty of killmails of them on whkills.info so somebody has figured out how.

came in expecting a thread that was complaining about how you can use grid and sleeper ai to harvest the larger clouds in the high end sites with out any sleepers pwning your ship. was not expecting a nerf a venture thread.. also you may want to take a look at tech 3 hull prices and movement before you scream falling prices are the ventures fault :p

Apparently you didn't see the part about trying to gank the site runners in shiny T3 ships. And yea, ganking ventures is fun but how much do they cost again? How is bringing up a broken mechanic considered whining? Anyways, on the notable wormhole alliance poke...even if we are outnumbered we always bring the fight. When was the last time you went balls deep. Who are with you again? No, seriously, I've never heard of you.

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/34509567.jpg

I warned you all about the venture but would you listen?!!

I agree the Venture is too good as a gas miner in WH space and i think CCP made a mistake in its design.

And FYI you can mine in one of the high end gas clouds without the sleepers reacting to the venture.

Maybe, as it seems, the mention of ventures simply confused your post. Venture's aren't a broken mechanic. But if there is a way to harvest high end clouds such as Phaderift described, then yes I would agree with you. A broken mechanic such as that should be fixed.

If that is in fact the case, then you simply failed to explain your argument very well (considering all of the replies, including mine assumed you were just pissed about the venture).

If that is the case I humbly apologize for the over the top jabs at your manhood.

And no, I'm nobody. We are just a small but slowly growing WH corp, working towards the eventual goal of playing in the big leagues.

no worries, should have explained better...figured everyone knew about it. roll into us and we will give you an even fight

When was the last time you went balls deep. Who are you with again? No, seriously, I've never heard of you.

So what is this broken mechanic you guys talk about? Sleepers don't attack a venture that is already there? At first I assumed the OP was talking about just being unfair that it was posible to huff for 15 min before the sleepers appeared, but it looks like there's something else to it.

In core sites (the most valuable ladars) you can create a bookmark at the far end of the larger cloud, so far out that you wont get agroed by the sleepers at all. That's pretty much it, can safely huff that cloud dry and move on to do something else.

I just want an opportunity to gank ships that clear ladar sites. Please gift this to w-space CCP.

Ninjaing is too EZ.

I wanna see TENG00S, CARRIERS and other expensive things out in space.

finally...someone who isn't mentally ********

How exact is the venture worse than a cruiser with a few warp stabs? It mines a little faster to be sure, but by that logic we'd be all still be mining in cruisers.

Where is the problem? Gas is cheaper then T3 price is low and its mean i can do more pew pew in my Proteus... i feel good with that

And who cares about gas prices? I can make more in 20min running a site than an hour mining gas. Let them have it.

A year ago, gas prices were upwards of 150k per unit for 320 and about 70-90k per unit for the 540. I remember one night, using cruisers and old style can mining, with only 3 people online, we had a static that had 4 instrumentals in it, 3 vitals, and had a c2 static that had a high sec in sobaseki. (1 jump to jita) We gassed out all the instrumentals and the vitals ran the gas to jita. Using JUST the profits from the gas, I bought a replacement bhaalgorn and a redeemer fully fit. I still had about a bil left over from this.

Today, if I were to pull off the same feet, I would barely be able to buy the bhaalgorn.

The venture has a ton of advantages when compared to cruisers, starting from being harder to scan down due to smaller signature and the possibility of fitting ECCM to make it even harder, they are also much faster and as such you can orbit the clouds to make getting warpins directly to you much more difficult. On top of that the clouds themselves uncloak everything that tries to sneak up on you on grid and if that's not enough, you'll have a vastly improved alignment speed and as a frigate, getting a lock on you takes more time than it does to lock a cruiser.

And it's not just a little faster, it's the fastest gas harvester in the game when properly trained.

A year ago, gas prices were upwards of 150k per unit for 320 and about 70-90k per unit for the 540. I remember one night, using cruisers and old style can mining, with only 3 people online, we had a static that had 4 instrumentals in it, 3 vitals, and had a c2 static that had a high sec in sobaseki. (1 jump to jita) We gassed out all the instrumentals and the vitals ran the gas to jita. Using JUST the profits from the gas, I bought a replacement bhaalgorn and a redeemer fully fit. I still had about a bil left over from this.

Today, if I were to pull off the same feet, I would barely be able to buy the bhaalgorn.

A year ago, gas prices were upwards of 150k per unit for 320 and about 70-90k per unit for the 540. I remember one night, using cruisers and old style can mining, with only 3 people online, we had a static that had 4 instrumentals in it, 3 vitals, and had a c2 static that had a high sec in sobaseki. (1 jump to jita) We gassed out all the instrumentals and the vitals ran the gas to jita. Using JUST the profits from the gas, I bought a replacement bhaalgorn and a redeemer fully fit. I still had about a bil left over from this.

Today, if I were to pull off the same feet, I would barely be able to buy the bhaalgorn.

Add to all that the massive ore bay means that the venture doesn't need to make regular drop offs or call for collection. This reduces a hunters opportunity to catch a miner unawares.

You have 2 options now - while the pilot is in system scan the wormhole he came from or scan the ship and pray he is afk.

The venture has a ton of advantages when compared to cruisers, starting from being harder to scan down due to smaller signature and the possibility of fitting ECCM to make it even harder, they are also much faster and as such you can orbit the clouds to make getting warpins directly to you much more difficult. On top of that the clouds themselves uncloak everything that tries to sneak up on you on grid and if that's not enough, you'll have a vastly improved alignment speed and as a frigate, getting a lock on you takes more time than it does to lock a cruiser.

And it's not just a little faster, it's the fastest gas harvester in the game when properly trained.

- I can fit ECCM on my cruiser too. Not to mention you are an idiot if you use combat to scan down gas miners. Use dscan to narrow things down and scan down the bloody site with core probes in a single quick scan.
- If clouds are uncloaking you need to reconsider how you hunt gassers.
- A smart miner is either orbiting or aligned with an AB or MW

It sounds like you just miss idiots jet can mining at a dead stop.

- I can fit ECCM on my cruiser too. Not to mention you are an idiot if you use combat to scan down gas miners. Use dscan to narrow things down and scan down the bloody site with core probes in a single quick scan.
- If clouds are uncloaking you need to reconsider how you hunt gassers.
- A smart miner is either orbiting or aligned with an AB or MW

It sounds like you just miss idiots jet can mining at a dead stop.

You know it wasn't all that difficult to put warp stabs on a battlecruiser for ninja harvesting before the venture came out. Still isn't. People are just using the crap out of the ship because it is new. Give it a few months. The novelty of using the new ship will wear off, people will get bored with gas mining like always, and prices will go back up.

With the venture out (no nerf on the horizon), and gas prices dropping, I don't think it should be easier to harvest gas(ninja harvesting clouds without taking aggro from sleepers). Another reason is it takes the risk out of using shiny ships to clear the sleepers....a potential PVP aspect that is getting harder to find.

bahaha, so many ppl mad, for this **** [ ninja mining was created this ships] a lot of u miss da point, and i like ccp ideea to create a oportunity for new players to explore more and ninja stuff and hope prices will drop for everything not only for t3 to encourage more ppl for pvp not one pew a day and 10 ops for mining gas, and dont forget something, HUNTING PVE SHIPS DONT MAKE U A PVP-ear and 90% of u pretty much do that not really fighting so........think and reflect more on this.

The venture has a ton of advantages when compared to cruisers, starting from being harder to scan down due to smaller signature and the possibility of fitting ECCM to make it even harder, they are also much faster and as such you can orbit the clouds to make getting warpins directly to you much more difficult. On top of that the clouds themselves uncloak everything that tries to sneak up on you on grid and if that's not enough, you'll have a vastly improved alignment speed and as a frigate, getting a lock on you takes more time than it does to lock a cruiser.

And it's not just a little faster, it's the fastest gas harvester in the game when properly trained.

You forgot to mention with its large ore/gas hold it does not need to jetcan, so no can to warp too, and it has warp strength of +2 so even if you do manage to lock it, you need 3 points to tackle it.

But then again if you lock it you can most likely insta pop it, so no need for tackle.

The venture tank IS its GTFO ability. Take away its warp strength, or fast align time it will go from urber to useless.

All the calls to nerf the venture are more a case of " I have not adapted to this new ship fast enough. So you need to nerf it, so I do not need to learn new strategies to gank gas miners."

The issue that needs addressed is the ability to harvest ladar sites without clearing the sleepers, this really has nothing to do with the venture, it is just the new gas harvesting ship.

For the past several years there have been many many requests for a gas mining ship to be added to the game. Now that we have one there are complaints it is good at mining gas? That was an intended part of its design. It is only marginally better than a cruiser with 5 gas harvesters. it could have been 50% better.

Stop complaining it is so hard to catch. That is it's only defense. if you catch it, it is dead, it is a frigate you can insta pop. The Ventures ability to avoid geting locked is its only defense, once locked, it has very little chance. Sure it is hard to tackle, but easy to alfa, why tackle it when you can target it out of tackle range and insta pop it with an alfa strike. yes it is hard to target, but that IS it's main tank. If it was easy to target it would be useless as it would have no defense at all.

If the venture really is to much ship for the price, then remove the gas mining bonus and move it to a T2 version of the ship. Basically the same ship we have now, but costs more if you want to mine gas.

i don't necessarily think the venture should get nerfed...but I do think it should cost more...maybe even more skills to fly like bugsy suggested. I think it should be right around gas fit bc...so maybe 50-55m-ish. This thread was never really supposed to be about the venture, I added it as a side note. It was supposed to be about ninja harvesting.

Nothing new here. It was possible to ninja high end gas sites long before the Venture existed...

This would make it more expensive and skill intensive to fly for gas mining, without hurting the new player mining experience.

Confirming that we're low in ISK in wormhole space...



Oh Hi Vegas :)

Even outside of C5's, us lowsec scrublords are raising cash due to the parlous state of the FW LP store, via blitzing ladars. With 2-3 Ventures hitting the same cloud, you can alpha-suck the expensive gas from a Ladar site before the sleepers spawn; you can turn over 4 ladars in an hour for about 30-40M. Which isn't great, but it isn't bad for an alt if you have an egg timer and warp out when the sleepers spawn.

i see no problem with this. if the wormhole is empty, the ladar is available, and you have the time and spare toon to do it, a Venture alt is a reasonable investment.

if the wormhole is empty, the ladar is available

Confirming that we're low in ISK in wormhole space...



Oh Hi Vegas :)

What happened to d-scan, warp sabre to 0, kill venture? You guys are wormholers and scan for your supper anyway. Last I checked, warp strength didn't matter against bubbles. Granted, its a frigate with a fast align, but it will either not stick around when the probes go out or it will die.

Also, confirming w-space is SO broke nowadays. No one makes any money in w-space anymore. In fact, everyone is moving out of W-space and coming to live in null. W-holes are so broken now, SO BROKEN, I tell you, because of ninja-mining ventures!

What happened to d-scan, warp sabre to 0, kill venture?

So I love semi-afk gas harvesting vitals and instrumental cores, till now I wasn't caught yet. SO basically everything cruisersized can't tackle you because to slow, a bomber can't kill you with a bomb even when standing still, sabres dpn't bother you cause you're a god bit faster.

Just the combination of shuttle'esque align time, 3km/s mwd speed and +2 warpcore strength make it really hard to gank (unless stupid / really afk / dscan glitched / client times out)).
The only venture I lost yet, was cause a barren ladar bookmark turned out to be an ordinary.

The ship really is great, but given it's use inside a wormhole, has maybe to many advantages for exactly that region.

Big issue is also that this 500k frig has a highslot and the cpu to fit a tech I cloak...

Off topic a bit, but why haven't drug booster prices dropped if gas harvesting is so popular now? Perhaps there's more risk in low sec, but you're based there I'd think your guys would eat that stuff up at 20-40 million a site.

Don't lowsec clouds do Venture-destroying damage waves? Or am I completely off base?

though i have not mined low sec gas in ages. yes the low and null gass clouds do some damage when you mine from them

Ninja mining/gas harvesting frigate is good at ninja mining/gas harvesting so its BAD?

When I referred to warping sabre to 0, I was assuming you'd have a fleet following (sabre au/second warp is much higher than average ship).

FYI, sebo'd stealth bomber with scram would also work. Stealth bomber has no delay from targeting, so you should be able to point and scram a venture in time for the cloaky rapier/dps to get there.

Yes, I know, its a ridiculously cheap ship. Hence why I said warp in a sabre at 0, so you can be sure to get pods.

Sadly, I am currently in null sec for friendship's sake. I have come to a place where I play this game about people, not play styles. I like the current group of guy's I'm with, so I'm bro'ing it up in Null Sec for a bit with my current corp. I do have plans to return to the holes though soon(tm), and have a crew ready to launch at my word, but I have other commitments in game and they have real life to sort out first so.... No, I have not tried to kill this elusive venture. I just find all the crying about it... unbecoming of you all, as wormholers.

Wormholers are l33t and epic compared to the rest of EVE . We have skill sets the average player does not have, and we are shadowy ninja masters of gank that appear from nowhere, burn down a whole bunch of ****, and then leave. I know wormholers as intrepid enterprisers... I'm sure you can think of a way to efficiency murder ventures and be on your way.

With the venture out (no nerf on the horizon), and gas prices dropping, I don't think it should be easier to harvest gas(ninja harvesting clouds without taking aggro from sleepers). Another reason is it takes the risk out of using shiny ships to clear the sleepers....a potential PVP aspect that is getting harder to find.

CCP May have fixed ninja harvesting. Couple of corpmates (who know how to make ninja and bounce locations) had sleepers aggro when they were ninja harvesting an instrumental. Had this happen to us today as well. Had to warp out and grab the tengus.

So if CCP has fixed it, then thats awesome. If CCP hasnt fixed ninja harvesting and sleeper aggro in ladars is broken... dont fix it.

Please excuse my corpmate, he's terrible at eve. Apparently someone thinks being at 110k's is a ninja. I suspect the cloud they were at was partially gassed out across downtime so the cloud shrunk.

A couple of guys in our alliance have also confirmed sleeper aggro even 140/150 k's out. So it looks like they fixed the ninja gas harvesting. Stock up your gas lads, gas prices are going to go through the roof the next couple of days.

Curious. Which gas sites have you confirmed this at, because other corpmates have done it since patch day without problems, in both instrumentals and vitals.

Confirming that sleepers aggro 140km in an instrumental after being properly set up.

Confirming that sleepers aggro 140km in an instrumental after being properly set up.

Please excuse my corpmate, he's terrible at eve. Apparently someone thinks being at 110k's is a ninja. I suspect the cloud they were at was partially gassed out across downtime so the cloud shrunk.

I am glad that this got fixed, gives us more reward for our efforts.
Just wish they would put ninja fixes like this in patch notes.

people are actually filling your jita buy orders? or people in your hole.

Oh Haay Havok.

Still got that gas to sell me? :P

For your sexy australian self I would love to sell you my gas as long as you admit to drinking Fosters.

Also glad this got fixed. Was always pissed to watch Sleepers circling idly at 101 km below me whilst I greedily sucked up the gas they were "guarding."

Though not pissed enough to not do it, obviously.

There is still a very easy way to do these, needs further fixing i guess

For your sexy australian self I would love to sell you my gas as long as you admit to drinking Fosters.

For your sexy australian self I would love to sell you my gas as long as you admit to drinking Fosters.