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Thgil Goldcore
Advenus Classem
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
524
   |
Posted - 2013.02.16 18:18:00 -
[1] - Quote
Greetings members of the Empire and State citizens.
Today I would like to announce Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris (PIE, the oldest Empire loyal capsuleer organization) has formerly created a branch with the express intention of improving Empire/State relations and to increase military cooperation. My corporation, Advenus Classem (AVCL, sub-branch of the PIE alliance), will operate as this branch and is authorized to work with Caldari pilots for both cultural and strategic exchanges. While there are many things we may not see eye to eye on, there are so many ways that the Empire and State are very compatible. For this reason it is my sincerest prayer that cooperation can be established, that good nature will triumph over mistrust, and that we can form a stronger alliance together against the darkness of the cluster.
AVCL will conduct three operations in order to establish this goal.
First, AVCL is seeking Caldari military leadership in order to host some combined operations within our warzones, both in the State/Federation front and the Empire/Republic front.
Second, AVCL is establishing a common area, of sorts, which is open to those loyal to the Empire or State to converse, talk about culture, and establish commercial and military partnerships. More information on this location is to follow shortly as the final details of the venue are still being fleshed out.
Third, AVCL is authorized to accept Caldari pilots in our new pilot exchange program. The purpose is to allow Caldari pilots to experience the Amarr Culture in a environment that is both comfortable and understanding. Caldari amenities will be provided during the length of the transfer program for pilots who want to ease themselves into it. PIE will also lift the typical hull restriction on transfer pilots as such they may pilot their native Caldari hulls.
I look forward to working with loyal members of the State in the near future. Any and all questions should be aimed at me directly though mail or convo. Any Amarr who wish to be involved in this program are welcome to contact me as well. |
Knoot Enderas
Advenus Classem
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
5
|
Posted - 2013.02.16 18:28:00 -
[2] - Quote
Citizens!
I have been among the first to join this commendable initiative. The security and stability of the cluster depend upon the close cooperation of Empire and State. That cooperation must not only be forged by our leaders, but by our peoples as well. The participation of capsuleers, who play such a prominent role in inter-empire relations these days, is essential.
Under the auspices of the Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris, State and Empire will be able to strike the fear of God into the hearts of the enemies of the State, whilst simultaneously strengthening the friendships between those men and women who choose to fight together for a common cause.
I highly recommend that capsuleers who are adversely affected by the recent unpleasantness join me in this exciting new opportunity. The exchange programme will allow you to experience Amarr culture first-hand, without losing access to the amenities that we've become used to enjoying. Such an experience will look good on any corporate CV.
For the State! Amarr Victor! |
Brother Ludwigus
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
14
|
Posted - 2013.02.16 18:44:00 -
[3] - Quote
This is a wonderful initiative. I'd like to extend a personal welcome to all interested pilots. I look forward also to seeing an equivalent program on the Caldari side.
Amarr and Caldari Victor!
Soli Deo gloria. |
Thgil Goldcore
Advenus Classem
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
526
|
Posted - 2013.02.16 18:58:00 -
[4] - Quote
Before its asked, AVCL's opinion about the current issue within the state, and what side we stand on...
"No official comment"
AVCL's goals is to make friends with the state, not dictate its internal affairs. |
Samira Kernher
Praetorian Auxiliary Force
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
34
|
Posted - 2013.02.16 20:10:00 -
[5] - Quote
A blessed initiative, Lady Goldcore. I look forward to flying with our Caldari allies. |
Aethion Mirra
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
30
|
Posted - 2013.02.16 22:09:00 -
[6] - Quote
Amicos in aeternum.
Aethion Mirra
Commander and Recruitment Officer,-áPIE Inc.
|
Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence Cadre XV-01A
Pyre Falcon Defence Combine
359
|
Posted - 2013.02.16 22:32:00 -
[7] - Quote
Thgil Goldcore wrote:Before its asked, AVCL's opinion about the current issue within the state, and what side we stand on...
"No official comment"
AVCL's goals is to make friends with the state, not dictate its internal affairs.
Now THAT is the sign of a true friend. I've spoken with Miss Goldcore at length about her proposed offer to Caldari pilots and I can honestly say that anyone who chooses to take her up on her offer can expect to be treated with respect and courtesy.
I look forward to great things from this initiative. |
Katrina Oniseki
Revenent Defence Corperation
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
1179
|
Posted - 2013.02.17 02:44:00 -
[8] - Quote
I for one commend this initiative. Well done. |
Sepherim
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
280
|
Posted - 2013.02.17 02:50:00 -
[9] - Quote
I must admit I never been much of a friend of the Caldari, probably because I can't really understand their culture. And I look forward to this chance of meeting the allies on the other side, and be able to overcome those deficits in understanding that exist in my perception of the caldari people and society.
May both sides come stronger out of this, and may an eternal bond be created between both nations!
Sepherim Catillah
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris Initiate
Ex-Imperial Navy Imperator Commander |
Thgil Goldcore
Advenus Classem
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
531
|
Posted - 2013.02.17 06:46:00 -
[10] - Quote
I wanted to publicly thank Deus Fides Empire for their extremely generous donation of ships and resources to provide to ships and learning material for new transfers. Now it is our job to live up to Mr. Cutters gift by making this initiative as effective as possible. |
Raphael Ordo
Praetorian Auxiliary Force
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
34
|
Posted - 2013.02.17 17:47:00 -
[11] - Quote
As a former Caldari citizen myself, this is a most blessed opportunity for all Caldari capsuleers who wish to earn deliverence.
Fly with God, brethren. |
Misha M'Liena
Rui Freelance Mining
2614
|
Posted - 2013.02.17 22:29:00 -
[12] - Quote
Interesting to say the least. Until Pie accepts Gallente and Minimatar pilots, Their will be those that will say this is nothing but a PR job...
It is a good first step.
M.
Not as innocent as she appears.Gäó
-á |
Samira Kernher
Praetorian Auxiliary Force
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
41
|
Posted - 2013.02.17 22:39:00 -
[13] - Quote
Misha M'Liena wrote:Interesting to say the least. Until Pie accepts Gallente and Minimatar pilots, Their will be those that will say this is nothing but a PR job...
It is a good first step.
M.
Hello.
The Praetorian Auxiliary Force accepts Gallente and Minmatar pilots who support the Empire. Advenus Classem is likewise open to Gallente and Minmatar pilots despite being focused on Amarr-Caldari relations.
|
Thgil Goldcore
Advenus Classem
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
534
|
Posted - 2013.02.17 22:39:00 -
[14] - Quote
PIE has a division for all races loyal to the empire in the PAUX corp.
AVCL doesn't have a race restriction as well, just we accept State loyal pilots. We also don't force the Amarr faith on transfer pilots. We make sure they can get exposure to it if they chose to, but faith in god is not a requirement for AVCL... Respect though is. |
Misha M'Liena
Rui Freelance Mining
2614
|
Posted - 2013.02.17 23:25:00 -
[15] - Quote
Consider me corrected then.
M.
Not as innocent as she appears.Gäó
-á |
Thgil Goldcore
Advenus Classem
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
536
|
Posted - 2013.02.18 18:25:00 -
[16] - Quote
The public common area is almost complete. We are just finishing installing the last Holo-Emitters to catch the latest mind clash games. Speak to me about details, public post coming soon.
|
Aethion Mirra
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
34
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 11:24:00 -
[17] - Quote
Amarrian loyalists that wants to contact PIE are also welcome in the channel PIE Public.
Aethion Mirra
Commander and Recruitment Officer,-áPIE Inc.
|
Stitcher
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
913
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 11:37:00 -
[18] - Quote
Thgil Goldcore wrote: Advenus Classem ... is authorized to work with Caldari pilots for both cultural and strategic exchanges.
Translation: "We want to convert you to our faith and command your fleets as is our divine right."
The Caldari don't need the Amarr: we should be forging diplomatic ties elsewhere, among the civilisations who don't regard us as children in need of an education.
An in-character blog and a video:
http://verinsjournal.blogspot.com
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu1mbsgo738
|
Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence Cadre XV-01A
Pyre Falcon Defence Combine
381
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 11:59:00 -
[19] - Quote
As much as I respect you, Hakatain-haan, I have to respectfully disagree. I never got that vibe from Commander Goldcore, who has been very interested in not offending Caldari social and cultural mores. |
Stitcher
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
914
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 12:04:00 -
[20] - Quote
Oh yes. She's extremely skilled at not giving offense.
The thing that needs to be remembered is that the Amarr do want to convert us. It's kind of the stated purpose of the Empire, and the last time I checked PIE were Imperial loyalists. The objective of Amarr is to become the monoreligion, the one faith system of all of humanity in New Eden. And they're not stupid about pursuing that objective - if they think they can do it through flattery, inoffensiveness, diplomacy and pleasantries, you can bet your beard they will try.
They're the most dangerous kind of enemy, Tuulinen-haan - the one who is convincingly masquerading as a friend.
An in-character blog and a video:
http://verinsjournal.blogspot.com
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu1mbsgo738
|
Aelisha
Achura-Waschi Exchange
74
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 12:39:00 -
[21] - Quote
I was under the assumption that this offering was only going to net the culturally curious and potentially converted anyway. There is a rising sub-culture of Amarr faithful in both the Federation (in various forms) and the State; but nothing major at present. Simply put, it was my belief that this 'exchange' was by design aimed at tapping the undercurrents of curiosity and latent belief present in fringe Caldari loyalist capsuleers.
As a long time trader across the Caldari-Amarr border, I feel that this form of cultural exchange; a willing and voluntary submission of self to a different society, while that society seeks to provide an approximation of the culture to which I am accustomed in return, is noble. It is one of the things the Federation does well internally, that the cluster at large could embrace externally to great profit.
As ideological exchange and cultural cross-over was a stated part of this programme, I can't really find it as either insidious, or negatively impacting. Any participants, such as Enderas-haan, will bear the stamp of their time with this corporation even should they leave, any entities seeking detachment from Amarrian theism always have the power to say no - as small minded as I believe that to be.
Times are changing, and we aren't going to dissuade any culture from thinking of us as children, by acting as such.
CEO of Nisaba Syndicate
Intaki born State Citizen and supporter of the Practicals Bloc. |
Stitcher
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
915
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 12:54:00 -
[22] - Quote
It's none of my business what individual persons choose to believe. It is my business, as it is the business of all Caldari, to worry about foreign interference in Caldari affairs.
If somebody's willing to be converted to Amarr, good luck to them. I think they're crazy, but it's their mind to waste as they see fit. But the Empire has not historically been satisfied with the table scraps. They'll take small liberties, then bigger ones. They'll push, and wheedle, and finagle, and insinuate, until you've gone from an outreach program picking at the desperate few who'd rather pray to another culture's god than try to fix their own problems themselves, to the point where the empire has its claws in enough to start demanding more.
I'm not advocating a ban, or censorship. I'm advocating putting the other argument out there, the powerful one that Amarr is a doctrine that is antithetical to the meritocratic ideals of the State. I can't and shouldn't make people's decisions for them - that's slavery. But I'll damn well fight tooth and nail to oppose whatever campaign the Amarr or anybody affiliated with them might set up. I'll be damned if I'll live to see the meritocratic ideals of the State supplanted by mindlessly kowtowing to the "chosen" of Dam-Torsad.
An in-character blog and a video:
http://verinsjournal.blogspot.com
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu1mbsgo738
|
Kithrus
Deus Fides Empire
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
237
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 12:54:00 -
[23] - Quote
Stitcher wrote:Oh yes. She's extremely skilled at not giving offense.
The thing that needs to be remembered is that the Amarr do want to convert us. It's kind of the stated purpose of the Empire, and the last time I checked PIE were Imperial loyalists. The objective of Amarr is to become the monoreligion, the one faith system of all of humanity in New Eden. And they're not stupid about pursuing that objective - if they think they can do it through flattery, inoffensiveness, diplomacy, pleasantries and outright lies, you can bet your beard they will try.
You watch, the oh-so-sincere declarations of wounded integrity will inevitably follow what I'm saying here. The words "We have nothing but respect for the Caldari people" in the mouth of an Amarr loyalist is a smooth deception. Make no mistake - to them, we're still heathens. It's just that we're heathens they feel safe enough using their subtler, slower tools on. They're the most dangerous kind of enemy, Tuulinen-haan - the one who is convincingly masquerading as a friend.
Am I accusing pilot Goldcore of knowingly spreading falsehoods? No, of course not. I'm sure she's perfectly sincere. The most convincing lies are the ones where the person disseminating them honestly believes they are the truth.
Last time I was on a battle field and someone came to my aid I didn't care if they had a leaflet to give out afterward of not. I was just grateful.
The Caldari have been close friends to the Khanid Kingdom for quite a while now. I find your remarks rather cutting Stitcher when if the Kingdom hasn't tried to convert you why would the Empire? Are we so different from each other aside from the Empire not sporting slick black ships? |
Stitcher
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
915
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 12:57:00 -
[24] - Quote
Indeed we have. I've made the exact same arguments against that "friendship" too. Don't try and paint me as being inconsistent and opportunistic, pilot.
An in-character blog and a video:
http://verinsjournal.blogspot.com
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu1mbsgo738
|
Samira Kernher
Praetorian Auxiliary Force
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
50
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 13:01:00 -
[25] - Quote
Wishing to convince others of the positives of one's culture and religion is not an evil, mister Stitcher. Nothing is being forced here. PIE would of course be very pleased if a transfer pilot did convert, but the choice to do so is his alone.
You are Caldari, mister Stitcher. Surely, as a Caldari, you would understand that there is nothing wrong with organizations and people each attempting to advertise their merits in comparison to their competitors? If someone is exposed to two drinks, each from competing companies, those companies have a right to promote their drink. It is up to the consumer to choose which drink he most prefers. If you wish the consumer to choose your drink, then you should promote your drink better, not attempt to completely deny your consumer the opportunity to ever test your opponent's drink out of your fear that he may purchase it instead.
Your fear that Caldari might be converted, is no reason for them to avoid seeking to experience our culture, or to share their own. It is no reason for them to avoid us, to avoid strengthening the bonds between our empires. It is their choice to participate in the program, and it is their choice if they wish to convert or hold to their original beliefs in the process. |
Aelisha
Achura-Waschi Exchange
74
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 13:05:00 -
[26] - Quote
Fair enough, I guess, Hakatain-haan.
I wish this initiative the best of luck, and hope that there might be a future culture of beneficial trade between our cultures. By lending force of arms today, we build the markets of tomorrow - AWEX will gladly consider any and all material needs in your staging area, should uptake of goods prove sufficient to justify shipping.
One question, will you be providing a cultural exchange channel or venue to sit alongside this venture - to allow those of us with commitments that restrict us from participating in this programme to visit, discuss and grow in tandem with your efforts? I would personally appreciate the chance to extend my understanding of the Amarr beyond an aesthetic appreciation for your cities and historical sites.
CEO of Nisaba Syndicate
Intaki born State Citizen and supporter of the Practicals Bloc. |
Samira Kernher
Praetorian Auxiliary Force
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
50
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 13:06:00 -
[27] - Quote
Aelisha wrote:One question, will you be providing a cultural exchange channel or venue to sit alongside this venture - to allow those of us with commitments that restrict us from participating in this programme to visit, discuss and grow in tandem with your efforts? I would personally appreciate the chance to extend my understanding of the Amarr beyond an aesthetic appreciation for your cities and historical sites.
Such a venue will soon be opened. Mister Tuulinen has already had the opportunity to visit it and voice his thoughts. |
Aelisha
Achura-Waschi Exchange
75
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 13:09:00 -
[28] - Quote
Wonderful news.
I'd greatly appreciate if I could be notified of this venue's opening for public use. The Empire has been very kind to my investments in the past, and I feel that a deeper understanding of their capsuleer culture, as well as offering my own humble presentation of what I choose to represent, will only enhance such efforts.
Again, good luck and I appreciate the update.
CEO of Nisaba Syndicate
Intaki born State Citizen and supporter of the Practicals Bloc. |
Stitcher
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
915
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 13:14:00 -
[29] - Quote
Quote:If you wish the consumer to choose your drink, then you should promote your drink better.
That is in fact exactly what I am doing - stepping up the marketing campaign.
Review what I have said - I have not called for you to be forbidden from entering the State, or advocated that this program of yours should be illegal. All I have done is expressed my views on what it is you really want, and where I think it leads. As I said - I have no authority, nor the right, to attempt to control what another person chooses to think and believe. Doing so constitutes slavery, to which I am absolutely opposed. People are free to frak up in my philosophy - and I am free to make it known that, in my view, converting to Amarr constitutes a massive frak-up.
An in-character blog and a video:
http://verinsjournal.blogspot.com
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu1mbsgo738
|
Sepherim
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
294
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 13:16:00 -
[30] - Quote
Captain Stitcher, there are two things you don't include in your analysis and yet, are most important.
First, you picture the AVCL as a one way process: Caldari come to the Amarr, get brainwashed, get converted. As I've seen inside the AVCL and by talking to its members, this is not the case. The AVCL is intended to be a two sided process, you know us, we know you. We create trust, we create bonds, we come to eachother's help. Some Caldari may be converted, but it could also perfectly be possible that amarrians be convinced of the good things in the corporation "way of life". Afterall, this is not a monologue, but a dialogue.
And second, Amarr aims to convert everyone to the one religion, that is true. But we have all eternity to do it, there's no hurry in it. We convert by taking slaves and teaching them the propper ways, and we do this when Crusades are called under the banner of the Reclaiming. There is an on-going Crusade now, but it's not under the banner of Reclaiming, as it is a defensive war in the Bleak Lands. We are even forbidden to capture new slaves by order of the Empress herself. So, even if we wanted to Reclaim you, we wouldn't be able to; and, certainly, even if we could, we'd leave our friends for the last, there's still much work to do with the Minmatarr and the Gallente.
Sepherim Catillah
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris Initiate
Ex-Imperial Navy Imperator Commander |
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