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Owain GIyndwr
Trotters Independant Inc.
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 14:37:00 -
[1] - Quote
A few years ago to combat the macro mining and RMT epidemic in Eve CCP reduced the amount that asteroids re-spawned after down time resulting in macro miners completely draining the high sec belts until finally there was nothing but specks of asteroids re-spawning after each down time which then got quickly sucked up by the macros shortly. Then Ganking came into the game in a big way and reduced the numbers of miners and macros until finally Hulkaggendon arrived which then made mining almost a none event except a few brave soles like my self mining in very out of the way places, about this time or not long after, CCP made a stand against RMT and got rid of many macro mining accounts.
There was a period of about a year or may be a bit longer when the belts grew fat with very few brave enough to go mining in high sec because of the eve present threat ganking. The markets shot up as the cost of loot reached new all time highs as players used refined loot to make ships instead of mined minerals. What was CCPGÇÖs answer to this they cut the amount of loot being gathered from missions and rats in general. CCP actively tried to force players to go mining again. But it did not workGǪGǪ..
Fast forward to recent times. CCP have given the whole mining ship situation a buff. We all know of the many changes made which has very much improved the mining situation in high sec, making it harder to gank many mining ships. BUT! Where are we today, well I will tell youGǪGǪ.
Hordes of macro miners roaming about the belts freely sucking away at the newly re-spawned tiny specks of asteroids currently in the belts of high sec. Yes folks we have come FULL CIRCLE.
CCP I have got to ask how could you be so short sighted as to not see this coming, I mean seriously this has to be the worst form of game management I have ever seen.
I have roamed the high sec systems until I have gone almost blind and there are no belts worth mining left any whereGǪGǪ..DonGÇÖt take my word for it go look your self.
I fully expect the flamers to bark that there are many fat belts around the place or that I should go mining in low sec or null but thatGÇÖs not how I wish to play. I really have been far and wile and there is nothing worthy out there to mine in high security space.
Is this game over for the many players who simply wish to log on and spend a few quiet hours making isk. CCP are you going to scrifice these players for the sake of macro miners AGAIN?!
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Whitehound
1007
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Posted - 2013.02.26 14:45:00 -
[2] - Quote
Owain GIyndwr wrote:I fully expect the flamers to bark that there are many fat belts around ... Bla bla bla.
You need to realize that there is not enough room for everyone in every system and that you need to search away from the market hubs. This means you need to move your ship more than 10 jumps.
Making a stand on the forum and throwing a little rant is cute and also accusing all miners of being botters - just you are not one - is cute, too.
My serious advice to you: HTFU.
The forums are not a place to cry yourself out over your lack of success. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
Azami Nevinyrall
Carbon Circle Tactical Narcotics Team
701
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 14:46:00 -
[3] - Quote
You can still gank in Highsec with great ease, the 15 Barges I exploded yesterday is proof. It's just a TAD bit harder, 1 Catalyst per Barge, 3 per Exhumer. With crimewatch in place, if their drones engage you, you can POD them without any further sec hit! Apperently I'm on twitter now... @AzamiNevinyrall |
silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
874
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 14:50:00 -
[4] - Quote
Huh. When I want to mine (about once a year, admittedly), I never have any problems finding enough rocks to violence that my hold may overflow with the mangled corpses of innocent and blameless space-boulders.
All it requires is the willingness to move around a bit. Lazy miners get to suck up the scraps. Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing.
Malcanis for CSM8 |
Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
937
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 14:50:00 -
[5] - Quote
So, following your claim of empty belts, I undocked from the station two jumps from Amarr in a busy system.
Warping to a random belt, I found it full of rocks. Warping to another belt, it was full of rocks. Warping to a third belt, it was full of rocks.
"Can't be" I said to myself and jumped to Amarr. Warping to the top belt there I found it.... ... full of rocks.
Either I am on a different server, or your scope is very limited. Mining Overhaul Nothing changed since 2008. |
Sentamon
688
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Posted - 2013.02.26 14:52:00 -
[6] - Quote
I too cannot find full belts within 2 jumps of a market hub.
True story m8. ~ Professional Forum Alt -á~ |
Quit Whining
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
26
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Posted - 2013.02.26 15:00:00 -
[7] - Quote
So essentially, you're saying that the hisec mining areas are overpopulated...but you don't want to mine in the bountiful belts located in losec/0.0...
What would you like CCP to do then good sir? Provide never-ending belts in Hisec so you wouldn't be required to engage in any form of potentially risky but profitable behavior?
You don't hear traders/industrialists whining when the market for a particular product drops out, forcing them to search for more profitable endeavors... |
Whitehound
1007
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:02:00 -
[8] - Quote
I like your name! You need to post more often. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
enterprisePSI
180
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:03:00 -
[9] - Quote
Remember not to mine without a mining permit. The tears of the many, outweight the tears of the few. Or the one. enterprise-psi-¬
I made tweet, Y U NO FOLLOW!!! |
Owain GIyndwr
Trotters Independant Inc.
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:03:00 -
[10] - Quote
well at least the flamers are predictable |
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S'Way
Bitter Vets
447
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Posted - 2013.02.26 15:06:00 -
[11] - Quote
How to find rocks in high sec ? Systems without stations far away from market hubs.
Take a look around the bleak lands (there's at least one system there with 50 belts it's rare to see a miner in due to no station), khanid, devoid, solitude, derelik etc.
Or you could just remove the opposition miners ships with some friends in catalysts and mine where you want. |
Selene Nask
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
2
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:06:00 -
[12] - Quote
I regularly mine in high sec. Mostly near a market hub (not Jita). Even if I decide to mine a few hours before reset I've never had a problem finding belts. At that time the belts nearer the hub tend to be picked over of some of the best stuff but that is to be expected. A couple of hops away and there are belts that have never been touched that day.
I can see how some areas experience what you're seeing but to say it's all of high sec is laughable. It's not. Far from it from my experience.
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Skeln Thargensen
The Scope Gallente Federation
38
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:08:00 -
[13] - Quote
the answer is always you need to move further and you shall find the rocks. you shall also lose the griefers. I take back my previous statements and judgements of others. -áyou can mine in iteron if you want. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3639
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:15:00 -
[14] - Quote
Your entire post is spot on, except for all of it. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Captain Tardbar
NEWB ALERT
166
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:16:00 -
[15] - Quote
I don't mine regularly, but I know people who do. There are plenty of belts in hi sec avaiable if you know where to look.
Like Mili for example.
Secondly, I would argue if you look at mineral prices (which are quite higher than they were a year ago), one could argue that there is not enough minerals to go around to build all the ships that need to be built to satisfy the demand of all the mission runners and incursioners.
In that regard, people who want cheaper ships should want more mining to go on.
I mean its hard to pew pew in PVP all day when your losses are too much to replace. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Manny Moons
New Order Logistics CODE.
7
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:21:00 -
[16] - Quote
Owain GIyndwr wrote:...Hordes of macro miners roaming about the belts freely sucking away...
Solution: Kill the macro miners. Join the New Order. Or if you prefer, do it independently. If you aren't part of the solution, well, you could be.
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Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
3538
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:25:00 -
[17] - Quote
Owain GIyndwr wrote:A few years ago to combat the macro mining and RMT epidemic in Eve CCP reduced the amount that asteroids re-spawned after down time resulting in macro miners completely draining the high sec belts until finally there was nothing but specks of asteroids re-spawning after each down time which then got quickly sucked up by the macros shortly. Then Ganking came into the game in a big way and reduced the numbers of miners and macros until finally Hulkaggendon arrived which then made mining almost a none event except a few brave soles like my self mining in very out of the way places, about this time or not long after, CCP made a stand against RMT and got rid of many macro mining accounts.
There is so much wrong with paragraph I'm not even going to start, so.....
I have no problem finding tons of ore to mine any day of the week.
Perhaps one should move away from the Gallente/Jita Route ? Be yourself; everyone else is already taken.-á-á-á-á-á-á - Oscar Wilde - 1870's |
Felicity Love
STARKRAFT
295
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:27:00 -
[18] - Quote
And here I thought this would be another "conspiracy" thread about how all miners are just alts of Null characters, or that James 315 was "being mean" to someone.
Sigh.
I ask you where is the drama and scandal these days, to sooth my aching bones, before the booze kicks in ? We need more drama and scandal... and meatballs of questionable origin.
Proud Beta Tester for "Bumping Uglies for Dummies" |
Lady von Baroness
Mizara's Dollhouse
15
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:35:00 -
[19] - Quote
Get out of Caldari space. In Amarr, Ammatar, Khanid and the southern portion of the Gallente space, there are plenty of rocks to chew on. Entire blets full of even the most popular rocks like Scordite, including the +5 and +10 variants, that are 50k units or larger, and 100k+ units of all forms of Veldspar.
Even in Caldari space I've seen full belts, simply by going to out-of-the way systems. I know of a few dead-end systems, with no stations and only a single warp gate, that rarely see all of their belts drained, let alone depleted.
Try looking around for once. If Dotlan is too difficult for you, spend a few hours in a shuttle and scout some area other than Jita or the trade hubs. Mizara's Dollhouse - Do you play with Dolls?
Donations of any doll-related item are graciously accepted anywhere in EvE! |
silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
875
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:36:00 -
[20] - Quote
Felicity Love wrote:And here I thought this would be another "conspiracy" thread about how all miners are just alts of Null characters, or that James 315 was "being mean" to someone. Sigh. I ask you where is the drama and scandal these days, to sooth my aching bones, before the booze kicks in ? We need more drama and scandal... and meatballs of questionable origin. Been shopping Swedish, have you?
Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing.
Malcanis for CSM8 |
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Owain GIyndwr
Trotters Independant Inc.
1
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:39:00 -
[21] - Quote
if you are going to suggest a high sec system that has lots of fat belts in it may I suggest you offer one that dose not have 5 jumps through low sec to get to it.
Thaks for all the other suggestions btw I'll sifft out the realistic ones and act upon them. The rest I'll ignor.
Thanks for your replys. even the flammers need love
BTW sarcasam is not very effective in a typed sentance it just comes off am lame. |
Piugattuk
Lima beans Corp
356
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:40:00 -
[22] - Quote
Huh, you must be trolling cause there is plenty, I lived in a 1 roid field system and it got drained from time to time but next door I could always find everything I wanted. |
Dave Stark
1866
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:41:00 -
[23] - Quote
Owain GIyndwr wrote:I fully expect the flamers to bark that there are many fat belts around the place
no, you should expect to be told that because it's true. stop being lazy. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
Sentamon
691
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:42:00 -
[24] - Quote
Confirming that every single LowSec belt is overloaded with juicy ore for you there Mr. Wants-Big-Risk ~ Professional Forum Alt -á~ |
Captain Tardbar
NEWB ALERT
166
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:51:00 -
[25] - Quote
Owain GIyndwr wrote:if you are going to suggest a high sec system that has lots of fat belts in it may I suggest you offer one that dose not have 5 jumps through low sec to get to it.
I see that you saw what I did there.
But if you made it through lowsec, the belts are all yours! Risk vs Reward mind you. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Bane Veradun
Black Sun Dawning
7
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:56:00 -
[26] - Quote
Your face......you look like a replicant. I will congratulate you on the courage of the bottom of your feet though. Always encouraging to see them rise up. While you only co-opt the darkness for your petty purposes, I was borne of the darkness.
Malcanis for CSM 8 |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1860
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 15:59:00 -
[27] - Quote
Whitehound wrote: Bla bla bla.
You need to realize that there is not enough room for everyone in every system and that you need to search away from the market hubs. This means you need to move your ship more than 10 jumps.
Making a stand on the forum and throwing a little rant is cute and also accusing all miners of being botters - just you are not one - is cute, too.
My serious advice to you: HTFU.
The forums are not a place to cry yourself out over your lack of success.
I disagree.
CCP told us that there are more people mining then ever in high sec, and it's becuase mining is safer in high sec now. I can see it for myself as I fly around high sec, the OP is indeed correct about belts being stripped clean faster then ever. It's more widespread then just "not mining 10 jumps out"
And in my experience "more then 10 jumps out" tends to put you into low sec. I mine the lower sec status belts in high sec, they're being stripped clean just like the .9 and .8 systems.
This isn't 6 years ago when it was just a simple matter of finding a place that doesn't have a lot of activity.
It's not that they're stripping clean belts, they're stripping entire systems clean in no time.
The fix isn't to make it mroe dangerous to mine in high sec. They need to give miners a reason to either form corporations or join them for the purpose of mining.
I would go so far as to require miners to be in a player run corporation in order to fly an exhumer or use T2 strips, and MLU's. They can say that CONCORD is requiring all capsuleer miners to register with a corporation, that is not NPC corps; for the purpose of lsensing, and economic reasons. |
baltec1
Bat Country
5441
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 16:02:00 -
[28] - Quote
OP makes it sound like there has only been one hulkageddon... |
Generals4
Liandri Covenant
1731
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 16:06:00 -
[29] - Quote
I don't get why people complain about the lack of roids. Whenever i need mins to produce more merlins and mine with my alt the belts have no miners and are full of juicy roids. The fact it's in low sec may be why though. -Death is nothing, but to live defeated and inglorious is to die daily. |
Skeln Thargensen
The Scope Gallente Federation
38
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 16:07:00 -
[30] - Quote
lol good one, we need high sec nerfed for our own benefit.
smashing.
i lost count of how many 0.5 systems i rejected as not being quite juicy enough last week. just stick a survery scanner on a cruiser and get out there. I take back my previous statements and judgements of others. -áyou can mine in iteron if you want. |
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Karrl Tian
Under the Wings of Fury Atrocitas
196
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 16:09:00 -
[31] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:Whitehound wrote: Bla bla bla.
You need to realize that there is not enough room for everyone in every system and that you need to search away from the market hubs. This means you need to move your ship more than 10 jumps.
Making a stand on the forum and throwing a little rant is cute and also accusing all miners of being botters - just you are not one - is cute, too.
My serious advice to you: HTFU.
The forums are not a place to cry yourself out over your lack of success.
I disagree. CCP told us that there are more people mining then ever in high sec, and it's becuase mining is safer in high sec now. I can see it for myself as I fly around high sec, the OP is indeed correct about belts being stripped clean faster then ever. It's more widespread then just "not mining 10 jumps out" And in my experience "more then 10 jumps out" tends to put you into low sec. I mine the lower sec status belts in high sec, they're being stripped clean just like the .9 and .8 systems. This isn't 6 years ago when it was just a simple matter of finding a place that doesn't have a lot of activity. It's not that they're stripping clean belts, they're stripping entire systems clean in no time. The fix isn't to make it mroe dangerous to mine in high sec. They need to give miners a reason to either form corporations or join them for the purpose of mining. I would go so far as to require miners to be in a player run corporation in order to fly an exhumer or use T2 strips, and MLU's. They can say that CONCORD is requiring all capsuleer miners to register with a corporation, that is not NPC corps; for the purpose of lsensing, and economic reasons.
Or just lower the respawn rate of asteroid belts to once a week and make the economics game about actual scarcity. Europe never would have colonized The Americas if everything they needed magically reappeared right outside the capital every day. Also we would have missed out on some kickass wars. |
Lucy Zatekai
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 16:19:00 -
[32] - Quote
Systems without stations and lots of belts is the way to find good high sec mining spots (hauling to a station in the next system over is only a little more effort and gives you a lot less competition). Given the prices of ore currently amarr space is the way to go, so ideally you'd want to check out places like Jarkkolen or Ahteer etc.
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Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1860
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 16:20:00 -
[33] - Quote
Skeln Thargensen wrote:lol good one, we need high sec nerfed for our own benefit.
smashing.
i lost count of how many 0.5 systems i rejected as not being quite juicy enough last week. just stick a survery scanner on a cruiser and get out there. No, not for your benefit Mr. NPC corp dude, for the benefit of those people who actually play in player run corporation, otherwise known as the way CCP wants us to play.
The OP has a legitimate point.
CCP is the one that gave us the information. There's more people mining in high sec then ever in the history of EVE, and it's because mining is safer.
More mining means more large scale operation by people who multibox, as well as botters. That means more systems getting stripped clean.
There are far more people playing EVE today then there was 5 years ago, and CCP verified that there were mroe miners then just by telling us that there's more mining in high sec then ever before.
It's common sense to come to the conclusion that there will be more systems with nothing, or very little to mine. I personally do not mine in populated systems, am constantly moving to find "better" systems, and see exactly what the OP is talking about every where I go. When I find a good system, it may be good for few days to a week and then the locusts, otherwise known as NPC corp mining fleets, enter the system and start eating everything.
Sinse the guys in player run corporatioins can be war decced, they don't matter.
However, LOL@high sec player run corp miners. Like that ever ******* happens! CCP needs to create valid reasons to either form or join a player run corp.
If you want to be the best, you should be in playe run corporations. The only way to really make being a miner in a player run corporation is to restrict acccess to the things that make you the best while in the NPC corporations. Miners are the best based on what they fly and where they refine.
It would fix the issue of having worthwhile incentive to be in a player run corp, and doesn't prevent anyone from being able to make a living mining.
In order to build the most advanced ships in EVE, I am not only required to play in a player run corporation, but also be in the most dangerous areas of EVE. There is no reason that they can't have restrictions on mining that require you to be in a player run corporation. Even the high sec mission runner is penalized for playing in the NPC corps by having to pay a higher tax then everyone.
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Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1860
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 16:25:00 -
[34] - Quote
Lucy Zatekai wrote:Systems without stations and lots of belts is the way to find good high sec mining spots (hauling to a station in the next system over is only a little more effort and gives you a lot less competition). Given the prices of ore currently amarr space is the way to go, so ideally you'd want to check out places like Jarkkolen or Ahteer etc.
You still make less, and the NPC corp miner running 5 accounts is stripping belts clean that don't require him to move ore from one system to another; therefore spending less time mining.
Even having someone else do the hauling isn't the answer, because that generally just means one less miner.
The answer isn't reduced minerals output, because it's fine. Minig is FINE in high sec.
The best miners being NPC corp miners is NOT FINE. This is the biggest problem that exists with high sec mining.
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Captain Tardbar
NEWB ALERT
166
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 16:36:00 -
[35] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:Lucy Zatekai wrote:Systems without stations and lots of belts is the way to find good high sec mining spots (hauling to a station in the next system over is only a little more effort and gives you a lot less competition). Given the prices of ore currently amarr space is the way to go, so ideally you'd want to check out places like Jarkkolen or Ahteer etc.
You still make less, and the NPC corp miner running 5 accounts is stripping belts clean that don't require him to move ore from one system to another; therefore spending less time mining. Even having someone else do the hauling isn't the answer, because that generally just means one less miner. The answer isn't reduced minerals output, because it's fine. Minig is FINE in high sec. The best miners being NPC corp miners is NOT FINE. This is the biggest problem that exists with high sec mining.
What is the difference between being in an NPC corp and a throw away corporation that you drop every time you get war dec'd?
None (short of having less people to talk to in 1000 man NPC corp).
I know people who everytime their industrial or miner character gets wardec'd they switch to another corp they just made up on the fly and continue on their business (and their station trader remains the original CEO as they have no risk of ever dying in the station) until the wardec is over.
Besides, if you want to kill a miner the best way is to gank them outright with little or no warning. Not wardec them and wait 24 hours to see if they are dumb enough to undock (though some are). "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Dave Stark
1867
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 16:42:00 -
[36] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote: CCP needs to create valid reasons to either form or join a player run corp.
this is the only thing that you've said in this thread, that i agree with. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
Skeln Thargensen
The Scope Gallente Federation
38
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 16:58:00 -
[37] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:No, not for your benefit Mr. NPC corp dude, for the benefit of those people who actually play in player run corporation, otherwise known as the way CCP wants us to play.
The OP has a legitimate point.
I disagree because as a high sec miner I can tell you i mine all the time and you just need to move your space buns to find good systems. the work you put into mining is finding the damn belts not actually mining them which is trivial. and you can be as far away from your trade hub as you like if you contract your minerals in bulk as people will shift them for less than 1% of their market value.
I would have thought if CCP wanted us to play in player corps then they would make the incentives better. certainly there's no incentive for me to join one as a solo miner. other things, however... I take back my previous statements and judgements of others. -áyou can mine in iteron if you want. |
Benny Ohu
Chaotic Tranquility Casoff
862
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:00:00 -
[38] - Quote
Owain GIyndwr wrote:miners completely draining the high sec belts until finally there was nothing but specks of asteroids re-spawning after each down time sigh |
Dave Stark
1867
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:02:00 -
[39] - Quote
Skeln Thargensen wrote:certainly there's no incentive for me to join one as a solo miner. other things, however...
actually, as a solo miner, there is. most corps offer orca bonuses.
the problem is, once you have about 3 accounts or more, inevitably one will be your own orca and at that point, nobody can offer you anything that is worth giving up war dec immunity for. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
No More Heroes
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2207
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:07:00 -
[40] - Quote
If only there were vast swaths of untouched space with virgin fields full of giant untouched asteroids
if only . |
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Skeln Thargensen
The Scope Gallente Federation
38
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:10:00 -
[41] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:actually, as a solo miner, there is. most corps offer orca bonuses.
the problem is, once you have about 3 accounts or more, inevitably one will be your own orca and at that point, nobody can offer you anything that is worth giving up war dec immunity for.
there is that I suppose. I refuse to multibox mining though. I take back my previous statements and judgements of others. -áyou can mine in iteron if you want. |
Dave Stark
1867
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:14:00 -
[42] - Quote
Skeln Thargensen wrote:Dave Stark wrote:actually, as a solo miner, there is. most corps offer orca bonuses.
the problem is, once you have about 3 accounts or more, inevitably one will be your own orca and at that point, nobody can offer you anything that is worth giving up war dec immunity for. there is that I suppose. I refuse to multibox mining though.
then you have plenty of reason to join a player corp, however conversely i'll wager you're one of few miners that doesn't multibox. i was like you once, "one account is enough". well, that didn't last long, now i have 3 accounts. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
Joey Bags
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
2
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:16:00 -
[43] - Quote
I mine every now and again. Usually when I want to skill up in my +5 implants. I usually am far enough removed from a hub and have very few problems. No, I don't have a "permit" and I've been ganked once and only occasionally bumped. I even go ice mining in a cheap fit procurer hoping mabey sometime someone will just so I can get kill rights. Another thing you can always do is scan down a grav site and mine that. I usually don't even run across another ship other than rats when I do. I half pay attention to what's going on usually and read a book. I've come across ripped belts with nothing in them but there are SO MANY belts, who cares. If you need to unload in a system with no staions and don't want to jump systems, find a .5 or .4 put up a POS and unload in that. At the end of a few days, take the POS down and move so nobody gets the idea to WARDEC just so they can kill your POS. It's really very easy. |
Skeln Thargensen
The Scope Gallente Federation
38
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:24:00 -
[44] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:then you have plenty of reason to join a player corp, however conversely i'll wager you're one of few miners that doesn't multibox. i was like you once, "one account is enough". well, that didn't last long, now i have 3 accounts.
yes, it seems like it's quite easy to get a collection going but i am going to resist.
I suppose what I like about being a solo miner is that I can set up and skim the fat off a belt very quickly. no hanging around for people to fleet up etc. not that i mind waiting around to fleet up for a roam because that's fun, but mining??? hell no, background activity. I take back my previous statements and judgements of others. -áyou can mine in iteron if you want. |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1860
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:31:00 -
[45] - Quote
Skeln Thargensen wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:No, not for your benefit Mr. NPC corp dude, for the benefit of those people who actually play in player run corporation, otherwise known as the way CCP wants us to play.
The OP has a legitimate point.
I disagree because as a high sec miner I can tell you i mine all the time and you just need to move your space buns to find good systems. the work you put into mining is finding the damn belts not actually mining them which is trivial. and you can be as far away from your trade hub as you like if you contract your minerals in bulk as people will shift them for less than 1% of their market value. I would have thought if CCP wanted us to play in player corps then they would make the incentives better. certainly there's no incentive for me to join one as a solo miner. other things, however... I mine as well in high sec, often.
You don't see belts stripped clean by gangs of miners in player run corps, they're all NPC miners.
The OP would have never even mentioned ganking if he was flying around and seeing miners in player run corps.
In order to access the highest level of industry you have to join a player run corporation, even in high sec; except where high sec mining is concerned.
There is no rule that says that people who choose to make a permenant home in a corporation that CCP doesn't intend for you to make a permenant home, must have access to the best mining potential.
I was only giving an example of stuff that they could do that wouldn't actually be "bad" for people.
If you need to be in a player run corp in order to fly an exhumer, oras, use T2 strips and MLU's, as well as be able to fly things in high sec like freighters and jump freighters, then dropping corp because someone war decced you would actually have an impact.
CCP did not put the NPC corps in the game so that industrialists can exploit them by leaving their corporations when there's a wardec, and suffer any consiquence. |
Whitehound
1011
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:36:00 -
[46] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:I disagree.
CCP told us that there are more people mining then ever in high sec, and it's becuase mining is safer in high sec now. I can see it for myself as I fly around high sec, the OP is indeed correct about belts being stripped clean faster then ever. It's more widespread then just "not mining 10 jumps out"
And in my experience "more then 10 jumps out" tends to put you into low sec. I mine the lower sec status belts in high sec, they're being stripped clean just like the .9 and .8 systems.
This isn't 6 years ago when it was just a simple matter of finding a place that doesn't have a lot of activity.
It's not that they're stripping clean belts, they're stripping entire systems clean in no time.
The fix isn't to make it mroe dangerous to mine in high sec. They need to give miners a reason to either form corporations or join them for the purpose of mining.
I would go so far as to require miners to be in a player run corporation in order to fly an exhumer or use T2 strips, and MLU's. They can say that CONCORD is requiring all capsuleer miners to register with a corporation, that is not NPC corps; for the purpose of lsensing, and economic reasons. You may disagree, but I go mining myself, I have friends who do and I buy minerals from miners all around. Even if there was a shortage can one always go mining in a mission. There is no shortage here.
Besides, what would you want to do? Spawn more asteroids in high-sec so all of EVE can go mining?? This makes no sense to me. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
Altrue
Exploration Frontier inc
327
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:42:00 -
[47] - Quote
Even if ganking can be the key to stabilize things here, remember that ganking is essentially NOT profitable in any way for the ganker, and even if you gankers are making our mining in wormhole space more profitable (GÖÑ for that you desserve a hug GÖÑ), it appears that your activity can't, by nature, stay indefinitely, as it's unrewarding and repetitive.
Also, one day, macro-miners will learn how to buy procurers, and they will discover the 70k EHP thing... This day, ganking will cease to be an efficient counter to macro-mining, and the problem will appear again.
So even if I wouldn't scream and shake in all directions like OP did, even if it's not the worst game managment CCP ever did, we must admit that, at some point, there will be a problem.
Oh and, Themitanni dot com remembers us often enough that, regarding to the EULA : GÇ£You may not use your own or any third-party software, macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play..GÇ¥
Common sense would suggest that being able, with one click, to give orders to twenty accounts, is a bit an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play and ordinary physical limitations...
But...
As this is all about money, CCP won't move a finger.
So we will all have to wait until the situation is critical. When the accounts leaving the game due to multiboxing will be more numerous than the multiboxers'. And it will take a lot of time... G££ <= Me |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1860
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:44:00 -
[48] - Quote
No More Heroes wrote:If only there were vast swaths of untouched space with virgin fields full of giant untouched asteroids
if only Bingo.
If miners in high sec were required to play in a player run corp to access the best ships for the best mining in high sec, they'd be better prepared and more willing to enter other areas of the game to mine.
The NPC corps are only teaching people that by staying in the NPC corp you suffer no loss, and can do as well as everyone else that's not in a corp. NPC corps are too confortable, too profitable, and don't help to adjust people to the realities that EVE is a game about loss.
When it was more wortwhile to mine in null sec, miners came to null to mine.
Miners overall aren't as risk averse as people make them out to be, it's just you pussies on the forums that are. When miners gain something from mining with more risk they do it.
Just like carebears will PvP when they feel that PvP has a real purpose. Fighting for your corp so that you don't suffer a loss of profit by only being able to fly T1 industrials in high sec would be a big encouragement for a lot of high sec industrial corps that feel they have no reason to endure a wardec because they can just go back to the NPC corp.
I don't care about you guys on the forums that **** yourself everytime something other then another mining ship aligns towards your belt. Because you are the guys that only give a **** about maintaining your ability to be able to use the NPC corps to avoid PvP and still be as good an industrialist as everyone else.
|
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1860
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:49:00 -
[49] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:I disagree.
CCP told us that there are more people mining then ever in high sec, and it's becuase mining is safer in high sec now. I can see it for myself as I fly around high sec, the OP is indeed correct about belts being stripped clean faster then ever. It's more widespread then just "not mining 10 jumps out"
And in my experience "more then 10 jumps out" tends to put you into low sec. I mine the lower sec status belts in high sec, they're being stripped clean just like the .9 and .8 systems.
This isn't 6 years ago when it was just a simple matter of finding a place that doesn't have a lot of activity.
It's not that they're stripping clean belts, they're stripping entire systems clean in no time.
The fix isn't to make it mroe dangerous to mine in high sec. They need to give miners a reason to either form corporations or join them for the purpose of mining.
I would go so far as to require miners to be in a player run corporation in order to fly an exhumer or use T2 strips, and MLU's. They can say that CONCORD is requiring all capsuleer miners to register with a corporation, that is not NPC corps; for the purpose of lsensing, and economic reasons. You may disagree, but I go mining myself, I have friends who do and I buy minerals from miners all around. Even if there was a shortage can one always go mining in a mission. There is no shortage here. Besides, what would you want to do? Spawn more asteroids in high-sec so all of EVE can go mining?? This makes no sense to me. You either didn't read a single thing I wrote, or you mixed up who you quoted.
Never once did I say a thing about spawning more asteroids, or that there was any kind of a shortage. Your response has nothing to do with anything I wrote.
350K+ people play on TQ today. Every single person can start mining in high sec for all I care, as long as the majority of them are doing it in a player run corp.
You do not see belts full of miners from player run corps in high sec. Anyone that says you do is a liar. |
Dave Stark
1867
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:50:00 -
[50] - Quote
Altrue wrote:Even if ganking can be the key to stabilize things here, remember that ganking is essentially NOT profitable in any way for the ganker, and even if you gankers are making our mining in wormhole space more profitable (GÖÑ for that you desserve a hug GÖÑ), it appears that your activity can't, by nature, stay indefinitely, as it's unrewarding and repetitive.
Also, one day, macro-miners will learn how to buy procurers, and they will discover the 70k EHP thing... This day, ganking will cease to be an efficient counter to macro-mining, and the problem will appear again.
So even if I wouldn't scream and shake in all directions like OP did, even if it's not the worst game managment CCP ever did, we must admit that, at some point, there will be a problem.
Oh and, Themitanni dot com remembers us often enough that, regarding to the EULA : GÇ£You may not use your own or any third-party software, macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play..GÇ¥
Common sense would suggest that being able, with one click, to give orders to twenty accounts, is a bit an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play and ordinary physical limitations...
But...
As this is all about money, CCP won't move a finger.
So we will all have to wait until the situation is critical. When the accounts leaving the game due to multiboxing will be more numerous than the multiboxers'. And it will take a lot of time...
highlight the caveat, totally ignore the caveat.
even multiboxing, you don't gain anything at an accelerated rate in comparison to normal gameplay. honestly, the eula seems like the bible some times. people picking what they do and don't want, and interpreting it how they want it to be interpreted instead of what is actually written. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
|
Skeln Thargensen
The Scope Gallente Federation
38
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:50:00 -
[51] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:You don't see belts stripped clean by gangs of miners in player run corps, they're all NPC miners.
The OP would have never even mentioned ganking if he was flying around and seeing miners in player run corps.
In order to access the highest level of industry you have to join a player run corporation, even in high sec; except where high sec mining is concerned.
There is no rule that says that people who choose to make a permenant home in a corporation that CCP doesn't intend for you to make a permenant home, must have access to the best mining potential.
I was only giving an example of stuff that they could do that wouldn't actually be "bad" for people.
If you need to be in a player run corp in order to fly an exhumer, oras, use T2 strips and MLU's, as well as be able to fly things in high sec like freighters and jump freighters, then dropping corp because someone war decced you would actually have an impact.
CCP did not put the NPC corps in the game so that industrialists can exploit them by leaving their corporations when there's a wardec, and suffer any consiquence.
CCP presumably put NPC corps in the game so casual and solo play is tenable, which it has the effect of doing. that's how I play at the moment as I don't have a lot of time IRL, at least not for the game. I see a lot of player corp operations in the belts I've been mining in. no idea what it's like closer to the hubs but i stay away from them for good reason.
It's a noob profession, best left to noobs. player corps should be using their POS to their advantage, copying, invention, research etc. I take back my previous statements and judgements of others. -áyou can mine in iteron if you want. |
Dave Stark
1867
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:52:00 -
[52] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:You do not see belts full of miners from player run corps in high sec. Anyone that says you do is a liar.
i know of one, but it's just one guy in his own corp running like 10 accounts. he only does it because he has a pos. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
baltec1
Bat Country
5442
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:56:00 -
[53] - Quote
Oh before I forget, rebalance barges. |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1860
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:58:00 -
[54] - Quote
Skeln Thargensen wrote:
CCP presumably put NPC corps in the game so casual and solo play is tenable, which it has the effect of doing. that's how I play at the moment as I don't have a lot of time IRL, at least not for the game. I see a lot of player corp operations in the belts I've been mining in. no idea what it's like closer to the hubs but i stay away from them for good reason.
It's a noob profession, best left to noobs. player corps should be using their POS to their advantage, copying, invention, research etc.
CCP has NEVER said that NPC corps are there for solo and casual play.
They have said that they don't indend FOR ANYONE to stay in the NPC corp perminently and that they WANT EVERYONE to join a player run corporation at some point.
It takes only one person to have a player run corporation.
Flying exhuamers, Orcas, Freighters, and jump freighters is not something "noobs" do.
PoS's do not just do copy, invention, and research. The only reason that you put them up specifically for those things is because the NPC stations are just as good for everything else, and you don't have the wait times to deal with.
I"m sorry, but you didn't give a single valid or accurate excuse to allow miners in NPC corps to be just as good at mining as everyone else without having to assume the same risk. |
Dave Stark
1867
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 17:59:00 -
[55] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Oh before I forget, rebalance barges. not empty quoting. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
Skeln Thargensen
The Scope Gallente Federation
38
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 18:08:00 -
[56] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:CCP has NEVER said that NPC corps are there for solo and casual play.
They have said that they don't indend FOR ANYONE to stay in the NPC corp perminently and that they WANT EVERYONE to join a player run corporation at some point.
It takes only one person to have a player run corporation.
Flying exhuamers, Orcas, Freighters, and jump freighters is not something "noobs" do.
PoS's do not just do not just do copy, invention, and research. The only reason that you put them up specifically for those things is because the NPC stations are just as good for everything else, and you don't have the wait times to deal with.
I"m sorry, but you didn't give a single valid or accurate excuse to allow miners in NPC corps to be just as good at mining as everyone else without having to assume the same risk.
lol wut? that's the game we're playing. you are thinking of some imaginary game which is differently balanced. what CCP does and CCP says do not seem to be in agreement.
And I don't see how us all being in one man corps betters the game other than feeding the usual high sec blap fantasies. I take back my previous statements and judgements of others. -áyou can mine in iteron if you want. |
Altrue
Exploration Frontier inc
328
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 18:11:00 -
[57] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Altrue wrote:Even if ganking can be the key to stabilize things here, remember that ganking is essentially NOT profitable in any way for the ganker, and even if you gankers are making our mining in wormhole space more profitable (GÖÑ for that you desserve a hug GÖÑ), it appears that your activity can't, by nature, stay indefinitely, as it's unrewarding and repetitive.
Also, one day, macro-miners will learn how to buy procurers, and they will discover the 70k EHP thing... This day, ganking will cease to be an efficient counter to macro-mining, and the problem will appear again.
So even if I wouldn't scream and shake in all directions like OP did, even if it's not the worst game managment CCP ever did, we must admit that, at some point, there will be a problem.
Oh and, Themitanni dot com remembers us often enough that, regarding to the EULA : GÇ£You may not use your own or any third-party software, macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play..GÇ¥
Common sense would suggest that being able, with one click, to give orders to twenty accounts, is a bit an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play and ordinary physical limitations...
But...
As this is all about money, CCP won't move a finger.
So we will all have to wait until the situation is critical. When the accounts leaving the game due to multiboxing will be more numerous than the multiboxers'. And it will take a lot of time... highlight the caveat, totally ignore the caveat. even multiboxing, you don't gain anything at an accelerated rate in comparison to normal gameplay. honestly, the eula seems like the bible some times. people picking what they do and don't want, and interpreting it how they want it to be interpreted instead of what is actually written.
Ok then I'm waiting for a video of a guy managing let's say, 10 accounts without a multiboxing tool, as effectively as someone who would have such software. It could be quite fun to watch ! ^^
So, indeed yes you are gaining items at an accelerated rate compared to ordinary Game play. Not because 10 players couldn't do that, but because ONE player can. G££ <= Me |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1860
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 18:13:00 -
[58] - Quote
Skeln Thargensen wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:CCP has NEVER said that NPC corps are there for solo and casual play.
They have said that they don't indend FOR ANYONE to stay in the NPC corp perminently and that they WANT EVERYONE to join a player run corporation at some point.
It takes only one person to have a player run corporation.
Flying exhuamers, Orcas, Freighters, and jump freighters is not something "noobs" do.
PoS's do not just do not just do copy, invention, and research. The only reason that you put them up specifically for those things is because the NPC stations are just as good for everything else, and you don't have the wait times to deal with.
I"m sorry, but you didn't give a single valid or accurate excuse to allow miners in NPC corps to be just as good at mining as everyone else without having to assume the same risk. lol wut? that's the game we're playing. you are thinking of some imaginary game which is differently balanced. what CCP does and CCP says do not seem to be in agreement. And I don't see how us all being in one man corps betters the game other than feeding the usual high sec blap fantasies. You not keeping up with what the things CCP talks about is wholey your problem and no one elses.
CCP has never said that NPC corps are for solo and casual players. Exhumers, Orcas, freighters, and jump freighters are all advanced ships that are not for "noobs", as you said. PoS's are not just for invention, research, and copying, as you said.
You were wrong about all three of those points, and insisting othwise only means you're not being honest. |
flakeys
Arkham Innovations Paper Tiger Coalition
865
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 18:18:00 -
[59] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:I mine as well in high sec, often.
and now i've seen it all .......
We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
|
Dave Stark
1867
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 18:19:00 -
[60] - Quote
Altrue wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Altrue wrote:Even if ganking can be the key to stabilize things here, remember that ganking is essentially NOT profitable in any way for the ganker, and even if you gankers are making our mining in wormhole space more profitable (GÖÑ for that you desserve a hug GÖÑ), it appears that your activity can't, by nature, stay indefinitely, as it's unrewarding and repetitive.
Also, one day, macro-miners will learn how to buy procurers, and they will discover the 70k EHP thing... This day, ganking will cease to be an efficient counter to macro-mining, and the problem will appear again.
So even if I wouldn't scream and shake in all directions like OP did, even if it's not the worst game managment CCP ever did, we must admit that, at some point, there will be a problem.
Oh and, Themitanni dot com remembers us often enough that, regarding to the EULA : GÇ£You may not use your own or any third-party software, macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play..GÇ¥
Common sense would suggest that being able, with one click, to give orders to twenty accounts, is a bit an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play and ordinary physical limitations...
But...
As this is all about money, CCP won't move a finger.
So we will all have to wait until the situation is critical. When the accounts leaving the game due to multiboxing will be more numerous than the multiboxers'. And it will take a lot of time... highlight the caveat, totally ignore the caveat. even multiboxing, you don't gain anything at an accelerated rate in comparison to normal gameplay. honestly, the eula seems like the bible some times. people picking what they do and don't want, and interpreting it how they want it to be interpreted instead of what is actually written. Ok then I'm waiting for a video of a guy managing let's say, 10 accounts without a multiboxing tool, as effectively as someone who would have such software. It could be quite fun to watch ! ^^ So, indeed yes you are gaining items at an accelerated rate compared to ordinary Game play. Not compared to 10 players working together, but compared to what the multiboxer could have done without an external tool.
totally ignoring the fact that 1 person playing 10 accounts isn't ordinary gameplay, so comparing anything to that is dumb. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
|
Whitehound
1013
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 18:23:00 -
[61] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:Whitehound wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:I disagree.
CCP told us that there are more people mining then ever in high sec, and it's becuase mining is safer in high sec now. I can see it for myself as I fly around high sec, the OP is indeed correct about belts being stripped clean faster then ever. It's more widespread then just "not mining 10 jumps out"
And in my experience "more then 10 jumps out" tends to put you into low sec. I mine the lower sec status belts in high sec, they're being stripped clean just like the .9 and .8 systems.
This isn't 6 years ago when it was just a simple matter of finding a place that doesn't have a lot of activity.
It's not that they're stripping clean belts, they're stripping entire systems clean in no time.
The fix isn't to make it mroe dangerous to mine in high sec. They need to give miners a reason to either form corporations or join them for the purpose of mining.
I would go so far as to require miners to be in a player run corporation in order to fly an exhumer or use T2 strips, and MLU's. They can say that CONCORD is requiring all capsuleer miners to register with a corporation, that is not NPC corps; for the purpose of lsensing, and economic reasons. You may disagree, but I go mining myself, I have friends who do and I buy minerals from miners all around. Even if there was a shortage can one always go mining in a mission. There is no shortage here. Besides, what would you want to do? Spawn more asteroids in high-sec so all of EVE can go mining?? This makes no sense to me. You either didn't read a single thing I wrote, or you mixed up who you quoted. Never once did I say a thing about spawning more asteroids, or that there was any kind of a shortage. Your response has nothing to do with anything I wrote. 350K+ people play on TQ today. Every single person can start mining in high sec for all I care, as long as the majority of them are doing it in a player run corp. You do not see belts full of miners from player run corps in high sec. Anyone that says you do is a liar. Sure I read your comment. You replied to me, remember? And I only replied to the OP. I was telling you that there is no shortage. You can make up theories in your head all day, but right now are the belts in the system I am in all full. Stop making stuff up. One only needs to go around and search. Just stop mining in The Forge and Lonetrek, that is good start. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1860
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 18:24:00 -
[62] - Quote
flakeys wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:I mine as well in high sec, often.
and now i've seen it all ....... And I do it from an NPC corp.
Let you in on a little secret. I"m not the only one.
You can't just undock in null sec and start mining, and sinse I don't sell the minerals there's no real reason for me to mine in null.
I exploit the NPC corps like everyone else. That's why I know they're being exploited.
I didn't play in null for 7 years. Where do you think I have? |
Dave Stark
1868
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 18:24:00 -
[63] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Just stop mining in The Forge
confirming i have no issues mining in the forge, at almost any time of day. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
baltec1
Bat Country
5443
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 18:30:00 -
[64] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Whitehound wrote:Just stop mining in The Forge confirming i have no issues mining in the forge, at almost any time of day.
Such a wretched place. |
Whitehound
1013
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 18:40:00 -
[65] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Whitehound wrote:Just stop mining in The Forge confirming i have no issues mining in the forge, at almost any time of day. Not saying you cannot go mining in The Forge. I just find it more difficult there than in other regions to find belts with big asteroids in them. The system "Reisen" is one of the few good systems in The Forge that I know of, because it has got only a single station of a non-Caldari corporation there (CreoDron, Gallente) and does not get visited too often. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
Skeln Thargensen
The Scope Gallente Federation
38
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 18:41:00 -
[66] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:You not keeping up with what the things CCP talks about is wholey your problem and no one elses.
CCP has never said that NPC corps are for solo and casual players. Exhumers, Orcas, freighters, and jump freighters are all advanced ships that are not for "noobs", as you said. PoS's are not just for invention, research, and copying, as you said.
You were wrong about all three of those points, and insisting othwise only means you're not being honest.
and yet you can fly a freighter in under 30 days and an mackinaw after 50. and trying to argue that these should be corporate assets doesn't change the fact that they are not. the only restrictions are on trial accounts, not on NPC corp members.
and you certainly can do other things with a POS but you're pretty much wasting your time if in high sec if you're not leveraging your research advantage for the risk you're taking. what with all the free slots at NPC corp stations etc.
and whatever CCP say you can obviously play this way for as long as you like as a casual and solo player. all that happens is you get screeched at on forums by people. I take back my previous statements and judgements of others. -áyou can mine in iteron if you want. |
Skeln Thargensen
The Scope Gallente Federation
38
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 18:51:00 -
[67] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:I exploit the NPC corps like everyone else. That's why I know they're being exploited.
people with lesser moral flexibility than your good self might call this 'hypocrisy' I take back my previous statements and judgements of others. -áyou can mine in iteron if you want. |
Dave Stark
1869
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 18:55:00 -
[68] - Quote
Skeln Thargensen wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:I exploit the NPC corps like everyone else. That's why I know they're being exploited.
people with lesser moral flexibility than your good self might call this 'hypocrisy'
the rest of us call it sensible. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
Skeln Thargensen
The Scope Gallente Federation
38
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 19:00:00 -
[69] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:the rest of us call it sensible.
I'd imagine quite a lot of nullsec dwellers have highsec alts. it indeed makes sense.
just not sure why you'd rant at other people on teh interwebs for doing the same thing I take back my previous statements and judgements of others. -áyou can mine in iteron if you want. |
Dave Stark
1869
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 19:06:00 -
[70] - Quote
Skeln Thargensen wrote:Dave Stark wrote:the rest of us call it sensible. I'd imagine quite a lot of nullsec dwellers have highsec NPC corp alts. it indeed makes sense. just not sure why you'd rant at other people on teh interwebs for doing the same thing
i haven't been? although i still agree that player corps need to be able to offer miners something to compete with wardec immunity. currently, they can't. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
|
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1861
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 19:07:00 -
[71] - Quote
Skeln Thargensen wrote:Dave Stark wrote:the rest of us call it sensible. I'd imagine quite a lot of nullsec dwellers have highsec NPC corp alts. it indeed makes sense. just not sure why you'd rant at other people on teh interwebs for doing the same thing I'm not complaining about anyone doing anything.
I'm pointing out a problem and asking that it be corrected so that no one can take advantage of it. It's an imbalance that is long over due to be addressed.
I didn't even suggest anything that only effected high sec miners. What do you think would happen if you had to be in a player run corp to operate a freighter or jump freighter in high sec?
I'm not saying "stop" doing it, I"m saying CCP needs stop "letting us" do it. |
silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
881
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 19:10:00 -
[72] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:
If you need to be in a player run corp in order to fly an exhumer, oras, use T2 strips and MLU's, as well as be able to fly things in high sec like freighters and jump freighters, then dropping corp because someone war decced you would actually have an impact.
This is intersting, and I'd like to see it expanded upon, outside the context "Mining is Broken." Because it seems to me that this would be a useful change to the game in terms of gameplay,as opposed to hating on people who make money in ways that you disapprove.
Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing.
Malcanis for CSM8 |
Whitehound
1016
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 19:19:00 -
[73] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:I'm not saying "stop" doing it, I"m saying CCP needs stop "letting us" do it. Oh, how wonderful. Can we interrupt this topic and shortly switch to freighter ganking? Please?? Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1862
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 19:26:00 -
[74] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:I'm not saying "stop" doing it, I"m saying CCP needs stop "letting us" do it. Oh, how wonderful. Can we interrupt this topic and shortly switch to freighter ganking? Please?? NPC corps have everything to do with what the OP is experiencing.
The OP would have never made this thread if he had seen a bunch of miners in player run corps, because the only people you have to gank are NPC corp members.
Freighter ganking is not exempt from the same situation. If you had to be in a player run corp to fly a freighter there would be no such thing as freighter ganking.
If they made it a reequiment to be in a player run corp in order to fly a freighter, I would be perfectly fine with them putting in a mechanic that would make you instantly blow up if you bumped or fired a single shot at a freighter without declaring war. Because the only people that would be effect are NPC corp gankers.
Why should NPC corp gankers be able to exploit the NPC corps as well. If you want to gank the best stuff in the game you should be in a player run corp.
I say that jokingly, but I"m also pretty serious at the same time. |
Skeln Thargensen
The Scope Gallente Federation
39
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 19:29:00 -
[75] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:Skeln Thargensen wrote:Dave Stark wrote:the rest of us call it sensible. I'd imagine quite a lot of nullsec dwellers have highsec NPC corp alts. it indeed makes sense. just not sure why you'd rant at other people on teh interwebs for doing the same thing I'm not complaining about anyone doing anything. I'm pointing out a problem and asking that it be corrected so that no one can take advantage of it. It's an imbalance that is long over due to be addressed. I didn't even suggest anything that only effected high sec miners. What do you think would happen if you had to be in a player run corp to operate a freighter or jump freighter in high sec? I'm not saying "stop" doing it, I"m saying CCP needs stop "letting us" do it.
maybe they're worried about their subs. maybe pandering to the lowest common denominator is the slow death of a game (call of duty i'm looking at you!) or maybe since everyone can have this advantage it's just another permabroken bit of the game that people just shrug off. I take back my previous statements and judgements of others. -áyou can mine in iteron if you want. |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1862
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 19:33:00 -
[76] - Quote
Skeln Thargensen wrote: maybe they're worried about their subs. maybe pandering to the lowest common denominator is the slow death of a game (call of duty i'm looking at you!) or maybe since everyone can have this advantage it's just another permabroken bit of the game that people just shrug off.
You're the lowest common denominator.
Stop trying to perpetrate the idea that people in high sec are afraid of PvP, they are not. There's only a means to avoid it that is to easy, and doesn't penalize you for taking advantage of it.
Everyone using it so it's fine is a **** poor excuse, and only shows the kind of gamer you are. |
Theron Dashto
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
8
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 19:40:00 -
[77] - Quote
Came in expecting another dumb hisec miner thread. Left satisfied. |
Skeln Thargensen
The Scope Gallente Federation
39
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 19:43:00 -
[78] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:Skeln Thargensen wrote: maybe they're worried about their subs. maybe pandering to the lowest common denominator is the slow death of a game (call of duty i'm looking at you!) or maybe since everyone can have this advantage it's just another permabroken bit of the game that people just shrug off.
You're the lowest common denominator. Stop trying to perpetrate the idea that people in high sec are afraid of PvP, they are not. There's only a means to avoid it that is to easy, and doesn't penalize you for taking advantage of it. Everyone using it so it's fine is a **** poor excuse, and only shows the kind of gamer you are.
the same kind of gamer as you?
I mean it's one thing to be the kind of fool who holds others to his own standards but to actually hold others to standards you don't even apply to yourself is quite amazing. I take back my previous statements and judgements of others. -áyou can mine in iteron if you want. |
Whitehound
1017
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 19:59:00 -
[79] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:NPC corps have everything to do with what the OP is experiencing.
The OP would have never made this thread if he had seen a bunch of miners in player run corps, because the only people you have to gank are NPC corp members... How can you possibly know why and why not the OP created his thread? Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
Mallak Azaria
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2531
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 21:00:00 -
[80] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:NPC corps have everything to do with what the OP is experiencing.
The OP would have never made this thread if he had seen a bunch of miners in player run corps, because the only people you have to gank are NPC corp members... How can you possibly know why and why not the OP created his thread?
Actually reading the OP is a good indication. Apparently booking your flight & accomodation to Iceland BEFORE you buy the tickets for the convention which is pretty much the only reason you wanted to go there in the first place is popular. |
|
Whitehound
1017
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 21:08:00 -
[81] - Quote
Mallak Azaria wrote:Whitehound wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:NPC corps have everything to do with what the OP is experiencing.
The OP would have never made this thread if he had seen a bunch of miners in player run corps, because the only people you have to gank are NPC corp members... How can you possibly know why and why not the OP created his thread? Actually reading the OP is a good indication. Please, go on. I would not mind reading another rant. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
Tom Gerard
Glorious Nation of Kazakhstan
939
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 21:13:00 -
[82] - Quote
Owain GIyndwr wrote: this has to be the worst form of game management I have ever seen.
Monaclegate, so HTFU.
CCP has come a long way in a short time, stop trying to make every damn issue sound like the end of the world. Hey, I just met you... and this is crazy but you popped my Rifter, so don't pod me maybe? |
Captain Tardbar
NEWB ALERT
168
|
Posted - 2013.02.26 21:16:00 -
[83] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:If miners in high sec were required to play in a player run corp to access the best ships for the best mining in high sec, they'd be better prepared and more willing to enter other areas of the game to mine.
So what? I'll start a one man corp.
If I get wardec'd, I get a nice warning and I stay docked until I can leave the corp and create a new one.
I'll keep doing this until the wardecer realizes he could have spent the war fees on just buying a gank ship and just take me out that way.
Seriously NPC corps are just as safe as one man corps. Both can avoid wardecs.
Both are equally nice targets for ganking.
And ganking gives little or no warning on when a good time to be docked is.
[edit]
When I said "I" I mean in theory as I do not mine, but if I did mine it would be in an NPC corp or a one man corp. I don't trust people not to awox me. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Ris Dnalor
L'Avant Garde Happy Endings
460
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 03:48:00 -
[84] - Quote
Owain GIyndwr wrote:A few years ago to combat the macro mining and RMT epidemic in Eve CCP reduced the amount that asteroids re-spawned after down time resulting in macro miners completely draining the high sec belts until finally there was nothing but specks of asteroids re-spawning after each down time which then got quickly sucked up by the macros shortly. Then Ganking came into the game in a big way and reduced the numbers of miners and macros until finally Hulkaggendon arrived which then made mining almost a none event except a few brave soles like my self mining in very out of the way places, about this time or not long after, CCP made a stand against RMT and got rid of many macro mining accounts.
There was a period of about a year or may be a bit longer when the belts grew fat with very few brave enough to go mining in high sec because of the eve present threat ganking. The markets shot up as the cost of loot reached new all time highs as players used refined loot to make ships instead of mined minerals. What was CCPGÇÖs answer to this they cut the amount of loot being gathered from missions and rats in general. CCP actively tried to force players to go mining again. But it did not workGǪGǪ..
Fast forward to recent times. CCP have given the whole mining ship situation a buff. We all know of the many changes made which has very much improved the mining situation in high sec, making it harder to gank many mining ships. BUT! Where are we today, well I will tell youGǪGǪ.
Hordes of macro miners roaming about the belts freely sucking away at the newly re-spawned tiny specks of asteroids currently in the belts of high sec. Yes folks we have come FULL CIRCLE.
CCP I have got to ask how could you be so short sighted as to not see this coming, I mean seriously this has to be the worst form of game management I have ever seen.
I have roamed the high sec systems until I have gone almost blind and there are no belts worth mining left any whereGǪGǪ..DonGÇÖt take my word for it go look your self.
I fully expect the flamers to bark that there are many fat belts around the place or that I should go mining in low sec or null but thatGÇÖs not how I wish to play. I really have been far and wile and there is nothing worthy out there to mine in high security space.
Is this game over for the many players who simply wish to log on and spend a few quiet hours making isk. CCP are you going to scrifice these players for the sake of macro miners AGAIN?!
IF this is not a troll, that sucks. I have not been to h i sec for a very long time, but if new folks can't find something to mine, there's a problem that needs addressed. But have heart, CCP will not let their new players suffer long, and by proxy you will benefit too.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961
EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody
- Qolde |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
3136
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 06:56:00 -
[85] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:If miners in high sec were required to play in a player run corp to access the best ships for the best mining in high sec, they'd be better prepared and more willing to enter other areas of the game to mine.
LOL.
If membership of a player-run corp was required in order to undock in an exhumer, we'd just have many more single player corporations with alts set up to assist with war-dodging. Then you'd be here on the forums complaining that war dodging is too easy, insisting that players be forced to fight when wardecced. Then you'd be complaining that these folks you wardecced only ever undock when they outnumber you 3:1.
You are the risk faced by miners. You impose your will by suicide ganking their ships. No sensible miner will mine during a wardec: they will turtle up and play a different game, or they will log on one of their other characters in a different corp and continue mining.
When it comes to suicide ganking, the miner gets no warning and it doesn't matter whether they're in an NPC corp or player corp.
Of course it's likely that you want to wardec the miners because you're frightened of losing your ship to CONCORD and suffering the sec status loss which means you'll have to rat for a day or two to get your sec status back. I feel for you and your lack of consequence free aggression. Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
3136
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 07:09:00 -
[86] - Quote
Owain GIyndwr wrote:I have roamed the high sec systems until I have gone almost blind and there are no belts worth mining left any whereGǪGǪ..DonGÇÖt take my word for it go look your self.
GǪ
Is this game over for the many players who simply wish to log on and spend a few quiet hours making isk. CCP are you going to scrifice these players for the sake of macro miners AGAIN?!
As a miner myself, let me assure you that the three major reasons for the emptiness of most belts are the introduction of the Orca back in Quantum Rise, the recent buffs to mining barges and the number of new players choosing mining as a profession. The introduction of the Orca immediately boosted the harvesting efficiency of all mining fleets larger than one ship. The foolish design decisions represented by the Mackinaw mean that even single ship mining fleets can be very efficient at stripping belts. The introduction of new players (or at least, new accounts) increased the number of mining fleets. As a result, there is far more ore being sucked out of belts and thus the belts disappear faster.
Another option for the lazy miner is to run missions. Look for missions that have large collections of rocks, and go mine those rocks.
Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Merovee
Gorthaur Legion Of Mordor
105
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 07:27:00 -
[87] - Quote
Funny, I have two belts I mine in a high sec system just outside the door of my station, just me. Sure the small money rocks are picked over but when go out with my two hulks its just me in the belt for two hours. Secret? I'm in the boonies where the roids are large and plentiful. Why do I mine? Too cheap to buy the minerals to build my Capital Parts. Sure Its dangerous to be near a low sec systems but less so near the herds. |
dark heartt
I Own Four Sheep Silent Requiem
49
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 07:40:00 -
[88] - Quote
I mine in a highsec island surrounded by lowsec systems. I am the only miner here... company is welcome! |
Dave Stark
1870
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 07:42:00 -
[89] - Quote
dark heartt wrote:I mine in a highsec island surrounded by lowsec systems. I am the only miner here... company is welcome!
i shall join you, in my catalyst. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
Dave Stark
1870
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 07:46:00 -
[90] - Quote
it's also what, over 20 hours past downtime now? my favourite mining belt in the forge region, completely untouched. even by me. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
|
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3644
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 12:18:00 -
[91] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:If miners in high sec were required to play in a player run corp to access the best ships for the best mining in high sec, they'd be better prepared and more willing to enter other areas of the game to mine. So what? I'll start a one man corp. If I get wardec'd, I get a nice warning and I stay docked until I can leave the corp and create a new one. I'll keep doing this until the wardecer realizes he could have spent the war fees on just buying a gank ship and just take me out that way. Seriously NPC corps are just as safe as one man corps. Both can avoid wardecs. Both are equally nice targets for ganking. And ganking gives little or no warning on when a good time to be docked is. [edit] When I said "I" I mean in theory as I do not mine, but if I did mine it would be in an NPC corp or a one man corp. I don't trust people not to awox me.
A wise precaution, considering the source. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Kha'Vorn
Fruidian Logic The Volition Cult
95
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 12:28:00 -
[92] - Quote
There are some fecking huge rocks in systems that are out of the way. Travel a bit, look around. Its good for the soul. |
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
1015
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 13:14:00 -
[93] - Quote
i lol'd heartily when OP claimed hulkageddon made mining virtually a none existing event
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
13037
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 13:30:00 -
[94] - Quote
I really like how pretty much every GÇ£factGÇ¥ presented in the OP is almost exactly the opposite of what actually happened.
silens vesica wrote:Felicity Love wrote:I ask you where is the drama and scandal these days, to sooth my aching bones, before the booze kicks in ? We need more drama and scandal... and meatballs of questionable origin. Been shopping Swedish, have you? Fun fact: in Sweden, salted and smoked horse is sold as Hamburger meat (capital H, as in the city).
Vote Malcanis for CSM8. |
Felicity Love
STARKRAFT
301
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 13:35:00 -
[95] - Quote
silens vesica wrote:Been shopping Swedish, have you?
Naw man.. the beef on my table and BBQ comes from the farm across the road... which is to say big corporations, with dubious ethics and shoddy production standards, are not required.
To all my friends in the Eurozone... Bon Appetite, and may the spirit of "Old Dobbie" be with you.
Proud Beta Tester for "Bumping Uglies for Dummies" |
Jake Warbird
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
2272
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 14:03:00 -
[96] - Quote
But... Didn't you guys whine, ***** and moan to CCP to get barges 'fixed'? Wow, I'm so confused now... |
Dave Stark
1871
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 19:08:00 -
[97] - Quote
Jake Warbird wrote:But... Didn't you guys whine, ***** and moan to CCP to get barges 'fixed'? Wow, I'm so confused now...
does it matter if they did? barges weren't fixed. they were changed, but not fixed. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
Fredfredbug4
The Scope Gallente Federation
469
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 20:05:00 -
[98] - Quote
I haven't noticed any macros and the belts are rather well supplied.
You should probably try looking at least 5 systems away from a major trade hub and at least 10 systems away from Jita, maybe more now that it's getting backed up. I accidentally my assets, is this bad?-á |
dark heartt
I Own Four Sheep Silent Requiem
51
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 07:05:00 -
[99] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:dark heartt wrote:I mine in a highsec island surrounded by lowsec systems. I am the only miner here... company is welcome! i shall join you, in my catalyst.
You'll have to deal with the rest of the corp living here haha. That and I do tank my ships. Otherwise I shall welcome you with open arms! |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1865
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 07:45:00 -
[100] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:If miners in high sec were required to play in a player run corp to access the best ships for the best mining in high sec, they'd be better prepared and more willing to enter other areas of the game to mine. So what? I'll start a one man corp. If I get wardec'd, I get a nice warning and I stay docked until I can leave the corp and create a new one. I'll keep doing this until the wardecer realizes he could have spent the war fees on just buying a gank ship and just take me out that way. Seriously NPC corps are just as safe as one man corps. Both can avoid wardecs. Both are equally nice targets for ganking. And ganking gives little or no warning on when a good time to be docked is. [edit] When I said "I" I mean in theory as I do not mine, but if I did mine it would be in an NPC corp or a one man corp. I don't trust people not to awox me. A one man corp is better then an NPC one.
You don't have to GANK a guy in a one man corp. one man corps can be wardecced like a 1000 man one.
There is safety in numbers. If people aren't smart enough to figure this out then then that's on them.
Edit: wtf is with all the "one man corp" responses I got? You guys act like I don't play the ******* game. Player run corps, regardless of size, are better then not having people in player run corps.
It is CCP's INTENT that you either join or form a corp, not live in the NPC ones. They've only said this numerous times in the 7 years I've been here.
But many of you just keep ignoring this fact. |
|
Dave Stark
1871
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 07:48:00 -
[101] - Quote
dark heartt wrote:Dave Stark wrote:dark heartt wrote:I mine in a highsec island surrounded by lowsec systems. I am the only miner here... company is welcome! i shall join you, in my catalyst. You'll have to deal with the rest of the corp living here haha. That and I do tank my ships. Otherwise I shall welcome you with open arms!
what does tanking your ships have anything to do with it? i put a survey scanner on my catalyst... "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
Irya Boone
TIPIAKS
212
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 09:08:00 -
[102] - Quote
I'm confused ....
Improve C2 class WH More anos more signs ...RENAME null sec system With the name Of REAL Universe Stellar Name like KOI-730 etc etc It xill be awesome-á |
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University Minmatar Republic
5487
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 10:13:00 -
[103] - Quote
I'm depressed ....
|
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
1038
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 10:33:00 -
[104] - Quote
Owain GIyndwr wrote:I have roamed the high sec systems until I have gone almost blind and there are no belts worth mining left any whereGǪGǪ..DonGÇÖt take my word for it go look your self.
*looks around at the countless giant field of asteroids that she could never hope to clear out in a day*
Hint: Get away from Jita. Far, far away from Jita.
EvE Forum Bingo |
Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
968
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 10:35:00 -
[105] - Quote
Katran Luftschreck wrote:Owain GIyndwr wrote:I have roamed the high sec systems until I have gone almost blind and there are no belts worth mining left any whereGǪGǪ..DonGÇÖt take my word for it go look your self. *looks around at the countless giant field of asteroids that she could never hope to clear out in a day* Hint: Get away from Jita. Far, far away from Jita. Just yesterday, I was around Jita about 10 hours after downtime. And for curiosity's sake I checked the belts in New Caldari and there were rocks floating everywhere. One jump away from Jita. Rocks. Belts full of them. Sure, it's just Veldspar, but still, it's not empty. Mining Overhaul Nothing changed since 2008. |
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
1038
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 10:41:00 -
[106] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:CCP did not put the NPC corps in the game so that industrialists can exploit them by leaving their corporations when there's a wardec, and suffer any consiquence.
Or maybe they did and you just don't want to accept that?
EvE Forum Bingo |
Boobiq
Imperial Express
5
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 10:41:00 -
[107] - Quote
Death to multiboxing, see the other thread and give your votes. |
Abditus Cularius
Clancularius Industries
132
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 11:20:00 -
[108] - Quote
OP suggesting that there were periods of time where almost no one mined or every belt was always completely stripped explains a lot.
OP has never been more than 4 jumps away from Jita. |
Remiel Pollard
Intergalactic Trade and Harm
1368
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 11:46:00 -
[109] - Quote
You have not been "far and wide" enough, my friend. You don't scare me. I've been to Jita. |
Miningfor Tears
University of Caille Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 15:37:00 -
[110] - Quote
I've just checked hi-sec around amarr for you, all empty no reason to consider moving shop to these barren lands. |
|
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1870
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 17:07:00 -
[111] - Quote
Katran Luftschreck wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:CCP did not put the NPC corps in the game so that industrialists can exploit them by leaving their corporations when there's a wardec, and suffer any consiquence. Or maybe they did and you just don't want to accept that? There's a differnece between being able to fall back on the NPC corps, and exploiting them to avoid wardecs.
When the default way of dealing with a war dec is to drop or leave corp, it's being exploited.
Please understand, I do not fualt you, I do not harbor any annimosity to you, I do not blame you in the least. This is ENTIRELY CCP's fault.
There has to be a REASON to stay in your corp. No one in null sec ever disbanded there corp because someone wardecced them, you lose something when you do.
I lose something if I leave the corp. Things I do not want to lose, and as a dedicated industrialist who does not PvP I would most definately undock in a hauler, with guns equipped, to shoot people trying to kick me from my home.
I truely believe that you guys in high sec need your own little sov system, built around industry.
EVE is about us, in particular the player run corporations, and the way we shape the world. High sec is the least player driven area of the game. Not having anything to call your own (the PoS's as they currently exist are not a thing that people fight for in high sec, are not accessible to a wider group, and do not provide significant advantage over the NPC stations) while being able to be "just as good" in the NPC corp has a negative impact on player run corporations in high sec.
Even in low sec, the player run corporation has a reason to stay together if there is a wardec. Safety in numbers is not something you can just dismiss as a non factor, it is indeed a huge reason to fill a corp with active, and participating members.
How would you make joining a player run corp as a miner wortwhile? Keep in mind that it has to be significant enough that the majority of people would WANT to join one for reasons other then other people, as well as provide a benefit that made going back to the NPC corp undesireable.
Or do you tink that ganking is a satisfactory means of industrial warfare in high sec? I personally do not.
The OP didn't come to the forumand point out he sees miners in deccable corporations all over high sec. He pointed out that it's a bunch of guys you have to GANK. You don't gank miners in player run corporations, and miners don't join player run corporations (let alone stay in them) because they can be decced.
We all know this as a fact. |
Ginger Barbarella
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
1195
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 17:15:00 -
[112] - Quote
Owain GIyndwr wrote:There was a period of about a year or may be a bit longer when the belts grew fat with very few brave enough to go mining in high sec because of the eve present threat ganking.
Stopped reading here at this bit of melodrama, not to mention obvious misinformation. "Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." -á --- Sorlac |
Dave Stark
1876
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 17:17:00 -
[113] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote: How would you make joining a player run corp as a miner wortwhile? Keep in mind that it has to be significant enough that the majority of people would WANT to join one for reasons other then other people, as well as provide a benefit that made going back to the NPC corp undesireable.
this is something that really needs looking at. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
Ginger Barbarella
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
1195
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 17:45:00 -
[114] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote: How would you make joining a player run corp as a miner wortwhile? Keep in mind that it has to be significant enough that the majority of people would WANT to join one for reasons other then other people, as well as provide a benefit that made going back to the NPC corp undesireable.
this is something that really needs looking at.
Guaranteed isk on level with L4's or Incursions, freedom from wardecs, and ability to game as you see fit?
Yeah, that'll happen... "Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." -á --- Sorlac |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1873
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 18:58:00 -
[115] - Quote
Ginger Barbarella wrote:Guaranteed isk on level with L4's or Incursions, freedom from wardecs, and ability to game as you see fit? Yeah, that'll happen... That isn't required.
The OP made a valid point that people keep dismissing.
Prior to retribution there were more people mining in null, CCP made the comment that a lot of the guys that started to mine in high sec came from null, and they speculated (which is kind of a joke) that it might have something to do with the added safety gained from the ship buffs.
CCP said that the ship buffs made high sec safer, and more people are mining there then ever before.
Miners WILL assume risk when they're adiquately rewarded.
I suggest making it the ability to fly the best stuff for the proffesion. This should go for freighters as well as JF. You're not running around low sec in a capital ship without being in a corp, you don't run around null in a super without a corp, and mission runners have been making 1 man corps for a while now just to avoid a little tax.
The highest reward for the indy pilot is the ability to move the most amount of goods as well as achieve the best yield when mining. Tie those rewards to play run corporations and people will join or form player run corporations. |
Dave Stark
1876
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 19:40:00 -
[116] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:Miners WILL assume risk when they're adiquately rewarded.
quite correct.
look at the price change, over the last 12 months, of megacyte in comparison to tritanium.
trit, up about 50% from 4 isk/unit to 6 isk/unit. megacyte from 2.6k isk/unit to 2.2k isk/unit.
there simply isn't much reward left in null sec mining, let alone enough to encourage players to move to null sec to mine. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
Blacko Bellamy
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
5
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 19:57:00 -
[117] - Quote
Owain GIyndwr wrote: CCP I have got to ask how could you be so short sighted as to not see this coming, I mean seriously this has to be the worst form of game management I have ever seen.
what makes you think, this accidentially happened? in this forum section is a post, in which CCP Devs brag about 500k subscriptions. When was the last statement from CCP Sreegs about results of his work? ... On fanfest we will get one of these great presentations - he is really good at that - and then a few months later, when we find lots of new bots, we ask ourselves again, how this is possible, if Mr. Sreegs does all this great work? |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1875
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 20:07:00 -
[118] - Quote
Blacko Bellamy wrote:
what makes you think, this accidentially happened? in this forum section is a post, in which CCP Devs brag about 500k subscriptions. When was the last statement from CCP Sreegs about results of his work? ... On fanfest we will get one of these great presentations - he is really good at that - and then a few months later, when we find lots of new bots, we ask ourselves again, how this is possible, if Mr. Sreegs does all this great work?
This is why CCP needs to give the number for both servers and not just lump them together.
CCP changed Chinese partners. When they hit 450k they said that they had exceeded the previous high set in China, under the old partner.
A part of the reason they have a new partner is to provide more publicity and awareness for the game. It was mentioned that Tiancity is one of the largest MMO providers in China, and reaches one of the largest markets.
The sensible conclusion here, seeing as we're taling about an almost 150k increase in subscribers sinse december, is that more people in China are getting into EVE, not that there has been a large influx on TQ.
That is not saying more people aren't playing on TQ, just that the largest influx probably isn't us, but Serenity and you're arguement is a bunch of ****. |
Amber Solaire
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
16
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 20:59:00 -
[119] - Quote
To the OP: You do not say at what time of day you are looking to mine (or day of the week)
At weekends, all the weekend warriors (or miners), descend in hordes right after downtime on the HiSec ore fields first-come, first to mine, usually Pyroxeres/Kernite, then down the list
A lot of these are new players in their shiny new Ventures, mining surprisingly quickly... So, get to the ore right after downtime (preferably on a weekday) and you may find some ore to mine |
Bashier Brutalius
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 21:27:00 -
[120] - Quote
Well I spent a bit of time and read most of this post trying to figure out the issues.
Now I have played EVE before and was in a few player corps. and part of the reason I left was at that time was the constant war decking. I left two corps. trying to find a more stable corp. Maybe the problem is not so much the mining formula is flawed, but the player corp. formula is wrong. I know that I left the game after being forced to change corps due to being unable to play cause i was a noob and then changing corps to have the same thing happen. Spending several weeks docked up due to some war I can't even get into just told me it was time to drop the game.
Right now I am in an NPC corp getting a bank roll and skills ready for low/null space mining and PVP, but until I am less of a noob the NPC corp seems to provide a way to play the game without the pain of sitting out a grudge match that you have no real understanding of and all you want to do is play.
If I am totally off the mark take it for what it is a noob on a steep learning curve opinion. |
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Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1877
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 21:38:00 -
[121] - Quote
Bashier Brutalius wrote:Well I spent a bit of time and read most of this post trying to figure out the issues.
Now I have played EVE before and was in a few player corps. and part of the reason I left was at that time was the constant war decking. I left two corps. trying to find a more stable corp. Maybe the problem is not so much the mining formula is flawed, but the player corp. formula is wrong. I know that I left the game after being forced to change corps due to being unable to play cause i was a noob and then changing corps to have the same thing happen. Spending several weeks docked up due to some war I can't even get into just told me it was time to drop the game.
Right now I am in an NPC corp getting a bank roll and skills ready for low/null space mining and PVP, but until I am less of a noob the NPC corp seems to provide a way to play the game without the pain of sitting out a grudge match that you have no real understanding of and all you want to do is play.
If I am totally off the mark take it for what it is a noob on a steep learning curve opinion. As it should be.
The NPC corp is where you should learn to play, and get prepared to join a player run corp. As a new player a wardec is going to have a larger impact.
At the same time, the corp you join matters. Being in a corp that can deal with a wardec because the people in charge understand that this a part of the game, and takes appropriate measures to be able to function during a war without resorting to staying docked or dropping corp, will make a world of difference.
You can see how many people are in the corps you're at war with, as well as find out when they operate, to figure out whether or not they'll actually be an issue for you. A lot of guys will see the wardec and just assume that if they undock they'll get blown up, even though the corp that decced them has 12 members and plays during EU times, while they themselves play in US peak times.
If the corp tells you to stay docked, you should say attempt to rob them blind at some point an then join a real corp.
There are things you can do to minimize your loss when there's a war, without having to resort to leaving a corp.
I get the impression sometimes that high sec guys think logistics is something you only have to deal with in null. WAR TIME logistics is required everywhere.
Then you've got an entire group of players who want to be mercenaries that you can hire, but there's little reason to if you don't lose any profits dropping back to the NPC corp. |
Bashier Brutalius
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
1
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 22:17:00 -
[122] - Quote
Got to admit that I am spending alot more time looking at Corps this time around. Also spending a bunch more time trying to understand the whole dynamics. Got to love this games learning curve , looks like a missile launch. |
Kathern Aurilen
41
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 23:01:00 -
[123] - Quote
Owain GIyndwr wrote:Hordes of macro miners roaming about the belts freely sucking away at the newly re-spawned tiny specks of asteroids currently in the belts of high sec. Yes folks we have come FULL CIRCLE. .... Ok you've made a broad statement... Let me make a few to make things fair. I've mined in 50 high sec systems and never once seen what I would call a bot, AFK yes... but not a bot. If you see a "BOT" fleet, see if you can get a commission from new order to scout for them or Report it or blast it on the forums that way we can all get in on the fun.
The only times I seen multiple empty field was after the large mining fleets swoop through, orca, battleships with mining lasers, hulks, and a freighter(new with the change in the last big update). Me, my corp 1 corp mate and 2 guys(that happened to be working in the field) have managed to clear a mid sized field in 2-3 hours... untouched 6-10 hours after downtime.
Quote:I have roamed the high sec systems until I have gone almost blind and there are no belts worth mining left any whereGǪGǪ..DonGÇÖt take my word for it go look your self. ...No you haven't, I have my pick of 3 systems right next door that I can mine in if the "HOOVER" fleets are working in my system. I often hit those systems just just for a change of pace cause the rocks are so untouched that I can fill my mack on one big roid, 190,000 units... lately its closer to 90,000 thats when I start checking my adjoining systems.
Quote:I fully expect the flamers to bark that there are many fat belts around the place or that I should go mining in low sec or null but thatGÇÖs not how I wish to play. I really have been far and wile and there is nothing worthy out there to mine in high security space. HELL let us know... or new order or something. I would love to get in on a bot squishing squad
Quote:Is this game over for the many players who simply wish to log on and spend a few quiet hours making isk. CCP are you going to scrifice these players for the sake of macro miners AGAIN?! I love a lil quiet time to mine after a long day. I'm not having near as much fun mining as I used to dew to the rise of the extortion group "NO!"(new order) No cuts, no butts, no cocanuts!
Forum alt, unskilled in the was of pewpew! |
Kathern Aurilen
41
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 23:13:00 -
[124] - Quote
S'Way wrote:How to find rocks in high sec ? Systems without stations far away from market hubs. I'm sitting 4 jumps out from a trade hub, in a system with 4 stations, and 40 people on local, with 3 connecting systems in line from a neighboring region along a trade route... ALL MY SYSTEMS HAVE FULL BELTS No cuts, no butts, no cocanuts!
Forum alt, unskilled in the was of pewpew! |
Dave Stark
1876
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 23:15:00 -
[125] - Quote
Kathern Aurilen wrote:S'Way wrote:How to find rocks in high sec ? Systems without stations far away from market hubs. I'm sitting 4 jumps out from a trade hub, in a system with 4 stations, and 40 people on local, with 3 connecting systems in line from a neighboring region along a trade route... ALL MY SYSTEMS HAVE FULL BELTS
that's quite common. people just like to make nonsense threads these days. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks Petition Blizzard
2915
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 23:24:00 -
[126] - Quote
Even if all of the ore in highsec got mined every day, I wouldn't want more to be spawned just because more people want to mine in highsec. Eve is a game with a living economy, and you can't have that when everything everyone wants just gets spawned into existence. It requires limited resource and competition. Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement. |
Kathern Aurilen
41
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 23:27:00 -
[127] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Skeln Thargensen wrote:Dave Stark wrote:actually, as a solo miner, there is. most corps offer orca bonuses.
the problem is, once you have about 3 accounts or more, inevitably one will be your own orca and at that point, nobody can offer you anything that is worth giving up war dec immunity for. there is that I suppose. I refuse to multibox mining though. then you have plenty of reason to join a player corp, however conversely i'll wager you're one of few miners that doesn't multibox. i was like you once, "one account is enough". well, that didn't last long, now i have 3 accounts. I don't muti-box and never planed to No cuts, no butts, no cocanuts!
Forum alt, unskilled in the was of pewpew! |
Dave Stark
1876
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 23:40:00 -
[128] - Quote
Kathern Aurilen wrote:I don't muti-box and never planed to
that's nice, dear. "100k for notifications of stupidity, i love this bounty system." |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1880
|
Posted - 2013.02.28 23:50:00 -
[129] - Quote
Wouldn't never planed to imply that you will be but never planned to?
Or is the thread now about wood working? |
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