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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 4 post(s)
the animator	Posted - 2005.08.22 11:17:00 - [121] Edited by: the animator on 22/08/2005 11:20:49 I had my little play today b4 DT i also noticed we had 8-10 ships macro-ing, so i of course petitioned against them, and then started to haul myself a litle bit of their/my ORE :P i only managed to get 100k M3 worth of ORE about 8 trips, b4 DT got to me and B4 they automatically docked intime for DT, and surely if they wasnt macros, and someone came in a hauler and stole your ORE then you'd have said something in local, well its free ORE for me :P
Matthew	Posted - 2005.08.22 11:45:00 - [122] Originally by: Confession Time There is your problem, just say hi or SOMETHING to prove to others your not a macro arse. Too good to talk to others in the game? DONT play an MMO then. Why should somebody have to respond? Just because it's a MMO doesn't mean people have the right to demand a response from people. If that was the case then there wouldn't be the option to block people. It's important to remember that the right to free speech does not include the right to have people actually listen to you I know a lot of people that pay very little attention to local at all. It's not that they're being rude or stuck-up, it's just that they have other channels to be chatting in, other things to do, and the majority of the time the garbage that goes through local isn't worth reading. Originally by: the animator and surely if they wasnt macros, and someone came in a hauler and stole your ORE then you'd have said something in local Not necessarily. They may not say anything in local because they know there is nothing they can do anyway. They may also not want to alert competing miners, in the hope they'll suffer losses too. Quite a few ore thieves steal ore more to provoke a reaction and get a new "annoyed miner" quote than the actual value of the ore. Staying silent denies them that. Beware those beyond here, for they cannot see evil.
Sarunn	Posted - 2005.08.22 12:29:00 - [123] Edited by: Sarunn on 22/08/2005 12:32:07 Originally by: Driven Two ways to bring macromining to a screeching halt: 1) Put rats in .9's and 1.0's including ice belts 2) After two months of game time all players must be in a player corp from then on. Actually, I saw a group of macro'ers in a .8 and they even had a macro protector frigate killing rats (or someone who refused to talk and didn't seem to care that we bumped them around and took their ore). A few of us spent hours over a period of two days bumping around and trying to talk to them, 31 macro'ers in 3 systems. I reported all info in petitions and got the same "we'll check on it" response. After several hours one person started to respond when so many of us were convo'ing him. At first we thought it was even macro chat because his responses were so wierd and didn't always fit the question asked. Then it changed and seemed that a "real" person came on. Here is one conversation we had. He claimed to have no idea what a macro was, although he later said he saw it for sale on eBay. He also claimed that he and all of his dorm mates had been mining with no sleep for 2 days straight, although he admittedly had no idea people were bumping them, disrupting their mining, some of their ships were killed by rats (and the pods remained in the belts for hours ), or that people were stealing their ore. They're still mining.
Marcus Aurelius	Posted - 2005.08.22 12:59:00 - [124] Well, it's indeed true that not every massive and continuous op is a macro op. There's of course also the sweatshp type things. Look more like you hit one of thise instead. But, macro or not, if the goal is to ebay then they need handling. It just gets harder, but one person at keyboard for one dollar an hour can ensure that a LOT of accounts get away with this crap.
theRaptor	Posted - 2005.08.22 13:09:00 - [125] Simple solution to this. Ban BS, large and medium barges from 0.8 and higher. This would stuff up a lot of the macroers who don't bother training the skills needed to fend off even lowly rats. Frankly I don't think even proper players should be strip mining starter systems. That is not dead which can eternal lie, And with strange aeons even death may die. -- Ancient "Dirt" Religious figure.
Marcus Aurelius	Posted - 2005.08.22 13:18:00 - [126] Oh, Macro miners are already spread beyond 0.8. They've been reported as low as 0.4 already. It's not like it's hard to leave an armor repairer running is it ?
Matthew	Posted - 2005.08.22 13:58:00 - [127] Originally by: theRaptor Simple solution to this. Ban BS, large and medium barges from 0.8 and higher. This would stuff up a lot of the macroers who don't bother training the skills needed to fend off even lowly rats. Frankly I don't think even proper players should be strip mining starter systems. Ahh, the old "0.9+ systems are for noobs only" argument. Which falls down on the simple fact that they certainly aren't for noobs only at the moment. Unless of course you think it's the noobs putting up buy orders there for 50mill units of trit at a time? The legit miners are there because the big, high-priced buy orders are there. The buy orders are there because the veteran megacorp producers are there. The producers are there because those systems are in a central position. If you really want to keep the very-high-sec systems for the noobs, then they need wholesale changes so that the veterans simply don't want to be there anymore. The single biggest thing that would do this would be to move them off the main travel routes. Beware those beyond here, for they cannot see evil.
Vulkan0	Posted - 2005.08.22 14:12:00 - [128] Hey is it an bannable offense to 'steal' ore from those Macro Miners, me thinks so.Although the person has nothing to do with the Macro Miners?
Matthew	Posted - 2005.08.22 14:19:00 - [129] Originally by: Vulkan0 Hey is it an bannable offense to 'steal' ore from those Macro Miners, me thinks so.Although the person has nothing to do with the Macro Miners? It is a bannable offense to benefit from macro mining. If you steal off macro miners, you are benefiting from macro mining. In practical terms, this seems to translate into you having to petition the macro miner before you steal their ore, though I'm not sure if this is the official position, or just the current discrectionary interpretation of the rules. Beware those beyond here, for they cannot see evil.
Aloris Crow	Posted - 2005.08.22 15:48:00 - [130] I've only ever seen one person I thought was a macro miner, I petitioned it and i've never seen him again (Locked in the vaults of a station in the Polaris sytem, I guess) I would definitely like to see a stop to macro mining, but it's one of those evils that all MMORPGs have to deal with at some point. I trust CCP and am sure they will come up with the right solution to macro miners and macro users in general. As for the people who suggest kicking Players out of newbie corps, I couldn't disagree more. I'm still in a newbie corp after over a year of play and feel no need to join the big bad world of player run corporations. There is a group of several veterans in my newbie corp that have been helping out new players for months. Much the same thing was in place when I was a newbie (I still remember the help I received from Conman back in the day) and I'm proud to carry it on. I know some people hide from retribution in the newbie corps, but I'm certainly not one of them. In my opinion a better idea would be to add a security lvl hit to ore thieves, then set any player who gets a certain negative security level to be booted from newbie corps. I know it's slightly off the point, but I see no reason to boot legit players from newbie corps, as many of us do provide a valuable service to them.
Avon	Posted - 2005.08.22 15:54:00 - [131] Originally by: Matthew Originally by: Vulkan0 Hey is it an bannable offense to 'steal' ore from those Macro Miners, me thinks so.Although the person has nothing to do with the Macro Miners? It is a bannable offense to benefit from macro mining. If you steal off macro miners, you are benefiting from macro mining. In practical terms, this seems to translate into you having to petition the macro miner before you steal their ore, though I'm not sure if this is the official position, or just the current discrectionary interpretation of the rules. It is, as far as I know, still the official stance. ______________________________________________ Pay or pray..er..prey..yeah, pray you aren't prey. Er, just pay.

Eris Discordia	Posted - 2005.08.22 15:57:00 - [132] Originally by: Vulkan0 Hey is it an bannable offense to 'steal' ore from those Macro Miners, me thinks so.Although the person has nothing to do with the Macro Miners? If you petition them before stealing, it is not. Actually some dev's have commented that they are party grateful to orethieves because they make maco miners miserable and they petition them so often. While it's hard to gather evidence even if you petition the GM's will keep an eye on them. If you steal their ore and not petition you can be warned or banned as well. I ♥ my pink dreadnought of pwnage Mail [email protected] if you have any questions.

Tar om	Posted - 2005.08.22 16:08:00 - [133] Edited by: Tar om on 22/08/2005 16:08:40 Its not just orethieves that take from macro miners. I've done it myself once because they were cheating. On the other hand I petitioned the group and they they are in Oursulaert 3 days later. Shamengirl and that crowd are at it again. Sickening. -- We are the Octavian Vanguard www.octavianvanguard.net http://www.serenitymovie.com
Waldo Barnstormer	Posted - 2005.08.22 18:36:00 - [134] A bunch were in Jotenen all week.. now the belts are empty and they're gone. I petitioned them and was told 'we'll check on it' However, I made it my mission to steal as much ore from them, and bump them as much as possible. CCP need to get rid of these leeches of the game now
Driven	Posted - 2005.08.22 18:50:00 - [135] Originally by: Maya Rkell That's called a "level playing field". Welcome to it. IMO? Stop skill gain at 2 mil in a NPC corp. This is a fantastic idea. A great way to get people out from behind the zero risk - 100% reward flawed game mechanic of hiding out in NPC corps. For those who say they'll be forced into a corp they don't want, or forced into PvP 1) Form your own one-man corp and do what you like on your own 2) If you get war-deced, what's the big deal? Shoot em.
glasl	Posted - 2005.08.22 19:35:00 - [136] or destroy them like me ^^ 2005.08.21 04:04:00 Victim: Sensient Alliance: Unknown Corporation: Full Metal Industrys Destroyed Type: Thorax Solar System: Leran System Security Level: 0.4 Involved parties: Name: glasl (laid the final blow) Security Status: -0.6 Alliance: Unknown Corporation: The Galactic Empire Ship Type: Enyo Weapon Type: Light Electron Blaster II 2005.08.21 04:06:00 Victim: Despra Alliance: Unknown Corporation: Full Metal Industrys Destroyed Type: Megathron Solar System: Leran System Security Level: 0.4 Involved parties: Name: glasl (laid the final blow) Security Status: -0.9 Alliance: Unknown Corporation: The Galactic Empire Ship Type: Enyo Weapon Type: Light Neutron Blaster II 2005.08.21 04:06:00 Victim: Nixstin Alliance: Unknown Corporation: Full Metal Industrys Destroyed Type: Retriever Solar System: Leran System Security Level: 0.4 Involved parties: Name: glasl (laid the final blow) Security Status: -0.9 Alliance: Unknown Corporation: The Galactic Empire Ship Type: Enyo Weapon Type: Light Electron Blaster II 2005.08.21 04:06:00 Victim: Donnga Alliance: Unknown Corporation: Full Metal Industrys Destroyed Type: Vexor Solar System: Leran System Security Level: 0.4 Involved parties: Name: glasl (laid the final blow) Security Status: -1.1 Alliance: Unknown Corporation: The Galactic Empire Ship Type: Enyo Weapon Type: Light Neutron Blaster II They even didnt notice that I attacked them. The didnt move or tried to move his ships out of scrambling range. I was alone with my enyo and 2 warp scramblers :) The Scorpion that destracted the npcs ran away from me :P
Cosmic Dragon	Posted - 2005.08.22 20:09:00 - [137] For the first time ever i gave macro hunting a go and found a 6 omen 1 hauler op in Oursulaert not only were they ALL 3 days old they also had similar names. First i checked them all to seeif there were any old charecters to convo. There were not i talked to the haukler first got some good replies so werent sure so i convied 2 of the othjeres it was then that the answers got a bit thin. So i petitione dthem and started bumping them for fun then got a hule rand emptyed their can no complaints from them at all within 30 mins a GM came over thanke dme and then they dissapered I hate ore thieves but i support it when macro miners are involved, just make sure first and petition before you mine there jet cans. Beauty Is In The Eye Of The Beer Holder!!!
Emarald Sween	Posted - 2005.08.22 20:40:00 - [138] here's the best way to stop macro miners: ore thieves. finaly, let's put them to good use.
Jonkai	Posted - 2005.08.22 21:10:00 - [139] I found a group of six last week, all had the same name and were all in Ferox's, each character was 1 month and 3 days old. I tried convo'ing all of them, to no avail... also tried getting a reply from local, and still nothing. I then sent in a petition, grabbed an Indy and emptied every can. Made a nice little bonus from the ores. Couple of days later I was passing through the system again. There they were again... Don't hate me for speaking the truth! You know it makes sense. The truth hurts... grow some balls.
callisthenes excelsior	Posted - 2005.08.22 21:40:00 - [140] OK is there a channel we can monitor to loot these macro miners from? Also I have SIMPLE solution that I hope they code. We need space mines like ole naval mines. You can set them in any system and then set the timer for like 1 3 5 and 10 RL minutes. They then go BOOM in the time allowed. If you are a real person, you will see the mine being placed, and then you can defuse it with another skill or just leave. Also, I fully agree with the rats in .9 and 1.0 If the game coders don't want to do that, then do this. Code some NPC miners who will then go and mine the very roids that the macrominers are doing. Thus, if macro miners are reported, the GM can just click a key and send like 10 caldari naval miners out to mine that belt. That will shut down the macro miners. I hope this idea gets coded as it will save work in the long run. The NPC miners can then sell the ore at a resonable price just like any trade good--so the market too stays balanced. Next, can't a dreadnaught easily kill macro miners in concord space? I mean can't a dreadnaught fight off concord long enough to blow up a retriever and then warp out?
Derron Bel	Posted - 2005.08.22 21:53:00 - [141] There's mines in-game, or at least there were a year ago. I think maybe they got taken out. -==- Holy-Jim> as you know, surprise is the key to victory.....surprise! LooseCannoN> ahh! LooseCannoN> my plans have been foiled!
Bror Jace	Posted - 2005.08.22 22:42:00 - [142] Originally by: callisthenes excelsior OK is there a channel we can monitor to loot these macro miners from? Also I have SIMPLE solution that I hope they code. We need space mines like ole naval mines. You can set them in any system and then set the timer for like 1 3 5 and 10 RL minutes. They then go BOOM in the time allowed. If you are a real person, you will see the mine being placed, and then you can defuse it with another skill or just leave. Also, I fully agree with the rats in .9 and 1.0 If the game coders don't want to do that, then do this. Code some NPC miners who will then go and mine the very roids that the macrominers are doing. Thus, if macro miners are reported, the GM can just click a key and send like 10 caldari naval miners out to mine that belt. That will shut down the macro miners. I hope this idea gets coded as it will save work in the long run. The NPC miners can then sell the ore at a resonable price just like any trade good--so the market too stays balanced. Next, can't a dreadnaught easily kill macro miners in concord space? I mean can't a dreadnaught fight off concord long enough to blow up a retriever and then warp out? Dreads = <0.4 only I like the NPC mining op idea though, would add some more depth to the universe...
Par'Gellen	Posted - 2005.08.22 23:22:00 - [143] I've been accused of macro-mining a couple of times but it is completely untrue. I use multiple accounts running on the same computer (all of which I gladly pay 15 bucks a month for) to mine ice for my corp's POS's or for isk. I put them all in a gang and warp them back and forth to the station when thier cargo is full. Anyone that wants to watch me mine in this manner is more than welcome. Heck I'd be glad for the conversation actually as it can get supremely boring
Emarald Sween	Posted - 2005.08.22 23:52:00 - [144] the channel that moniters macro miners is [MM Killers] MM= Macro Miners
Marcus Aurelius	Posted - 2005.08.23 09:37:00 - [145] Edited by: Marcus Aurelius on 23/08/2005 09:39:28 Well, if that channel is run by Ollobrains, dont expect me in it. I'll get my info elsewhere, thanks. As for the abundance of m,acro miners, its getting utterly out of hand. You can go to ANY 1.0 or 0.9 system in Caldari or Gallente space that has moe then 5 pilots in it and have a 50% chance of running into an obvious macro setup. CCP replies to the petitions yes, but it does not seem like it's going much good. I see lots of newbie macro mining groups around now using 3 day (!) old chars macromining in omen cruisers. Those are either new accounts from banned macroers, which CCP should have a lid on anyway, or new macro mining groups. Typically they'll have some asian or eastern european guy (no racism, just talk to some of em and they'll tell you themselves where they are from), sitting behind 10 pc's or so and supposedly 'playing with this dorm room friends' or something. Yet the reaction takes an hour of bumping, stealing, blowing up cans and whatever not to come in the first place and for some reason ends up with the miner sounding apolegetic instead of angry. Anyway. CCP can obviously not handle it at this point. If they can, then they're letting it go on in some instances, which they should just be frank about if they do. I guess CCP does not want to make the simple changes that would make macro mining so innatractive in eve that it could simply become nearly extinct because that would 'hurt' part of the playerbase as well. But in all honesty, as a player spending most of his time outside empire I was absolutely shocked to see the amounts of obvious macro ops going down in Empire when I went looking these past two days. It's looking like Eve is gonna go down to macro abuse fast now, because once you reach a critical point there's nothing more left to do then turn a blind eye and let everyone do it. It is not going to take much longer before that point is here.
sonofollo	Posted - 2005.08.23 09:54:00 - [146] well there are some things empire miners can do a) strip mine and lower the price of trit b) soak up the supply so more empire production can take place c) various tactics for countering macro miners.
Discorporation	Posted - 2005.08.23 10:01:00 - [147] lol a) Do what they're doing b) Reward them by buying their ore c) Do something else lol [23]
Marcus Aurelius	Posted - 2005.08.23 10:06:00 - [148] You might not have noticed who sonofollo is Discorp ?
Rustafa	Posted - 2005.08.23 16:18:00 - [149] Originally by: phillip duncan Two related idea's have just pop in to my head that CCP my already be doing. idea 1: CCP create or reuse event characters (so they have bene arround for a bit) to try and buy ISK, followed by hitting the sellers account with the ban bat. Idea 2: CCP to set some honey traps for the buyers followed by the ban bat. I am sure some of the CEO's would invite the CCP characters into there corps to help deal with this problem if they wanted to make them look more realistic. I am sure so players (especially Carebare miners) will be willing to hunting of the sales and maintaining the honey pots, after all it will give us something to do while we mine plus give use more roids to strip! I dunno if you ever seen ebay site with isk sellers/account sellers but there safe from EULA they cant ban them cause there not selling the property of CCP there selling the time spent aquiring it. :(
Avon	Posted - 2005.08.23 16:21:00 - [150] Originally by: Rustafa Originally by: phillip duncan Two related idea's have just pop in to my head that CCP my already be doing. idea 1: CCP create or reuse event characters (so they have bene arround for a bit) to try and buy ISK, followed by hitting the sellers account with the ban bat. Idea 2: CCP to set some honey traps for the buyers followed by the ban bat. I am sure some of the CEO's would invite the CCP characters into there corps to help deal with this problem if they wanted to make them look more realistic. I am sure so players (especially Carebare miners) will be willing to hunting of the sales and maintaining the honey pots, after all it will give us something to do while we mine plus give use more roids to strip! I dunno if you ever seen ebay site with isk sellers/account sellers but there safe from EULA they cant ban them cause there not selling the property of CCP there selling the time spent aquiring it. :( lol. CCP can ban anyone they want, at any time, for any reason. ______________________________________________ Pay or pray..er..prey..yeah, pray you aren't prey. Er, just pay.

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