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Andouus La
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Posted - 2005.09.15 02:14:00 -
[1]
Seems that amarrs ships have a ridiculous advantage of not have to pay for ammo and thus having mods for their turrets.
One way of having some level in this game is to have charges for lasers like those you have for cap boosters. So, they would have to carry "energy" charges to shoot their lasers. Small cap for small lasers, med caps for med lasers and so on to the dreadnaugt. This would seem fair since all other races have to buy carry and resuply their ships and dont have mods for their turrets.
This would level up the game to all races and give a fair chance to everyone to get the same start in pve and pvp.
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RabbidFerret
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Posted - 2005.09.15 02:17:00 -
[2]
dont mess with something that works. Its been like that for over a year and a half (two years?). No reason to change it now.
All your ferrets are belong to us. |
MrCjEvans
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Posted - 2005.09.15 02:18:00 -
[3]
close this topic plz, ps i dnt even use amarr. perfect how it is
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Andouus La
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Posted - 2005.09.15 02:35:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Andouus La on 15/09/2005 02:42:31
Lol close the topic... shut up dont talk about it...
The raven was fine and still was badly nerfed so has the missiles. Why should one race have more advantage over the other? The main argument for the missile nerf was that the raven was it too much advantage over the other races battleships. So has the amargeddon.
Close this topic i will post it elsewhere m8.
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JoeSomebody
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Posted - 2005.09.15 02:37:00 -
[5]
if something needs a nerf, that would be geddon's drone bay 
____
When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..." |
Jack Cade
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Posted - 2005.09.15 02:41:00 -
[6]
They already nerfed the geddon plenty of times.
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MrCjEvans
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Posted - 2005.09.15 02:43:00 -
[7]
hmm wtf your saying the Raven got nerfed vs other races battleships? what planet you on, their torps do more damage than ever.
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Andouus La
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Posted - 2005.09.15 02:46:00 -
[8]
And they nerfed the raven a couple of times... lol Still the amarrs have a total advantage over the calderis that have to carry ridiculous amounts of torpedoes to also ridiculous prices. So, to really get some level in this game is to carry ammo, pay for it and need to be resupplyed like everybody else in this game. Fair is fair.
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Torquemanda Corteaz
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Posted - 2005.09.15 02:56:00 -
[9]
why does everybody still think the raven got nerfed... they just made it more logical ( a torp hitting a ship the same size it was for 1k damage was daft ) since the missile change 1 of my corp mates has become even more dangerous in a raven
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FishPoo
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Posted - 2005.09.15 03:00:00 -
[10]
torpedos cost nothing, step out of your raven if you think it does bad damage, or that torps are expensive. its like noobs gone wild week on the forums all the time now, -.-;
2005.08.25 21:00:07 combat Your Mjolnir Torpedo I hits One Percent [FZN], doing 900.7 damage.
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Torquemanda Corteaz
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Posted - 2005.09.15 03:04:00 -
[11]
 Originally by: Andouus La
And they nerfed the raven a couple of times... lol Still the amarrs have a total advantage over the calderis that have to carry ridiculous amounts of torpedoes to also ridiculous prices. So, to really get some level in this game is to carry ammo, pay for it and need to be resupplyed like everybody else in this game. Fair is fair.
let me guess a geddon just hammered your raven didnt it.
everyone has advantages/disadvantages, learn to live with it
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Andouus La
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Posted - 2005.09.15 03:23:00 -
[12]
Dont have a raven, dont plan to have one for a while. Just saying amarr ships have unlimited ammo suplies and others races dont. Calderis have one mod for the missiles and need two if you use rails with missiles. The amarr lasers have their mods on the turret itself and this is a real advantage others races dont have. And was not a raven nerf it was a missile nerf my bad. Talk about the post lol not my ships... or those that I dont have in this instance.
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Blind Fear
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Posted - 2005.09.15 03:24:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Andouus La
And they nerfed the raven a couple of times... lol Still the amarrs have a total advantage over the calderis that have to carry ridiculous amounts of torpedoes to also ridiculous prices. So, to really get some level in this game is to carry ammo, pay for it and need to be resupplyed like everybody else in this game. Fair is fair.
The Raven is better than it ever was. You are just a moron, and you have no room to whine about not enough ******* missiles in your cargo. Lets go take a trip on the gallente bs train, lets carry some cap booster 800s then lets cram in 400 rounds of extra ammo to use incase the guns use all of its ammo. Like all ships there is a trade off, the geddon doesnt tank at all while still out damaging frigates. Serioulsy put some thought into your argument so you dont sound so stupid(thread creator as well).
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Derailing threads with logic since 1992 |
Remedial
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Posted - 2005.09.15 03:46:00 -
[14]
The Armageddon has multiple drawbacks to its high dps + non-use of ammo, including a susceptibility to EW and a dearth of midslots.
There is no good reason to change it.
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Andouus La
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Posted - 2005.09.15 03:53:00 -
[15]
"The Raven is better than it ever was. You are just a moron, and you have no room to whine about not enough ******* missiles in your cargo."
One thing is clear, personnal insults will never lead you anywhere. Stay polite, dont get into that stuff. If you cant discuss of something without falling into that junk well stay away from public forums because you might hear stuff you dont like.
IT'S CALLED FREEDOM OF SPEECH.
Even if you think i am gizmo and I am totally wrong, dosent give you ANY licence to attack me personnaly. Stick to the thread and what is said here. My idea is not totally dum. And even my idea was dum bottom line that does not that I am.
DO YOU UNDERSTAND?
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Nimrae
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Posted - 2005.09.15 04:03:00 -
[16]
If one Amarr ship might need a slight check is the Zealot
Dont mess with Geddon, it is perfect as is
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Hllaxiu
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Posted - 2005.09.15 04:40:00 -
[17]
The proper arguments would be:
1. The stacking of 5-8 damage mods is far more effective than it should be.
2. Large pulse lasers offer 95% the dps of large blasters at twice the range.
Fix to 1 affects every ship in the game, and number 2 involves changing blasters and not pulses. Geddons are fine, they just demonstrate every current problem with gank ships.
Proud member of Elite Academy. |
Shamis Orzoz
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Posted - 2005.09.15 05:22:00 -
[18]
Geddons clearly Do NOT need nerfing. They deal massive damage, but they are very vulnerable, and not very versatile at all.
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Aitrus
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Posted - 2005.09.15 05:26:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Andouus La
The amarr lasers have their mods on the turret itself and this is a real advantage others races dont have.
This makes absolutely no sense. Seriously, I don't know what this means. Laser turrets operate exactly the same as all other turrets in combat with the exception of needing to reload.
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Zayle
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Posted - 2005.09.15 05:32:00 -
[20]
i dont see what there is to whine about seriously.. so they only use 1 crystal which doesnt take up any room, do you really think that it matters? your talkin about gankin a ship and you dont even understand it, so what if it can stack dmg mods, that means no tank, the raven can do the same thing, can do all 4 types of dmg and can manage a tank with a high dmg output
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Val Amon
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Posted - 2005.09.15 06:06:00 -
[21]
The only thing I think is *** about lasers is the crusader can switch ammo in 1 sec and everything else takes 10 thats like 1/2 the fight in frigs.
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2005.09.15 06:26:00 -
[22]
Its not the armageddon that needs nerfed its module stacking in general, the penalty should be quite a bit more harsh for damage mods.
The Armageddon will always be one of the top damage dealing ship in the game, if not the top damage dealer, but to be honest, with so many heatsinks on it, it's fairly ricidulous how much DPS it puts out, even compared to other battleships in 'gank' mode.
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FERRET DEMOCRACY |
Aurora Tagan
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Posted - 2005.09.15 07:11:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Aurora Tagan on 15/09/2005 07:11:53
The Gedeon is fine how it is, it is one of the easiest ships to tank against or should i say amarr, as we do em and therm, so advantage/disadvantage.
My only guess is that you got owned by a gedeon pilot last night, that knows how to use it 
*edited* for early morning typos 
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2005.09.15 07:26:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Aurora Tagan
Edited by: Aurora Tagan on 15/09/2005 07:11:53
The Gedeon is fine how it is, it is one of the easiest ships to tank against or should i say amarr, as we do em and therm, so advantage/disadvantage.
My only guess is that you got owned by a gedeon pilot last night, that knows how to use it
*edited* for early morning typos
Oh we're back to the oldschool em and thermal damage sucks argument again.. 0% EM resist and 20% thermal resist on shields.. ya... poor Amarr, how will their 1,100 DPS ship ever get through that? Some of us do still fly Caldari ships yanno.
Seriously though, no one really fits EM Armor Hardeners either, and 60% resist isn't that bad when you are doing that much DPS, tbh.
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FERRET DEMOCRACY |
Urfin
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Posted - 2005.09.15 08:00:00 -
[25]
I have a better proposition for the thread starter - why don't you go kill yourself at run against a good solid wall? That would be a supremely intelligent thing to do, compared to your post. Really, calling for a nerf should be a bannable offence.
_____________________
Heatsink - Ship efficiency calculation proggie |
Tzellurio
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Posted - 2005.09.15 08:31:00 -
[26]
The Amarr weapons as a whole do not need nerfing; although they do not eat up ammo, they still need crystal charges, taking up room in cargo. This means, that like any other ship, they need to carry numerous charges to compensate for different distances. The base size for each weapon class crystal is far larger than that of conventional ammo (e.g Hybrid & Projectile ammo), and this compensates the cargo space issue. When talking price, although conventional charges cost more over time then energy weapons', the initial investment for frequency crystals is far higher.
Another reason why Amarr weapons are balanced, is the cap issues inherent with each weapon:
Instead of the cargo space and limited ammo issue; the player must be well aware of his cap recharge and capacity, due to the large amounts of cap taken when firing these weapons, becoming more prominent as you move up the ship scale. I believe this balances out the weapons nicely, as to get any ship class firing all their weapons, you must have a larger number of cap mods, or skills, than other races ships.
The topic of the Armageddon, or when fitted for damage; the "Gankageddon", has been discussed to death; The fact that the Armageddon does not need nerfing, and the very reason the Devs have not done so in recent times, is that they can produce such extreme dps due to complete lack of defence - opting for a purely offensive setup, which has to allow for damage mods, and cap mods, to keep the weapons running, whilst sacrificing their defence.
It is irritating when people call for a nerf, with "This ship can beat my ship no fair1!!" as a reason, instead of looking deeper into the game mechanics, as well as PVP and PVE tactics.
Every weapon has advantages over another; Live with it; or better, Shoot with it.
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2005.09.15 08:38:00 -
[27]
Tzellurio I think the issue is that ships in EVE can deal a lot of damage very quickly, the Armageddon is just the post child for this. Tanking just isn't as good as ganking, it probably never will be, but I do think the stacking penalty on damage modules could be a bit more harsh.
Mega Pulse are still kind of screwy to me, they're the highest DPS lasers, yet the easiest to fit. Trying to get neutrons on a gallante ship is hard, getting mega pulse on an armageddon is teh easy, never understand why that is.
I think the lasers cap cost is very much made up for with amarr ships bonuses and large capacitors.. and crystals uh.. try using missiles sometime, you can only carry 1,000 torpedoes in a Raven. Why does the Apocalypse get a larger cargo hold than the Raven, honestly? Imagine only being able to carry 1,000 laser shots, it sucks.. hard. So yeah I envy the space you save with crystals, and the fact you don't have to be looking for ammo constantly..
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FERRET DEMOCRACY |
MrMorph
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Posted - 2005.09.15 09:20:00 -
[28]
ok by me if we can fire the guns using 1 cap/shot
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Rod Blaine
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Posted - 2005.09.15 09:44:00 -
[29]
In Eve, balance is maintainedtogether with variety.
Balance dictates that no one ship can be far better or worse then another. That alone is hard enough to define, since an apoc is a faaaar better miner then a Raven, yet the Raven is the superior 1v1 pvp ship of the two. You need to attribute values to the different uses these ships have.
On top of that, there is also the balance of thei weaponry. And there as well different traits are balanced against eachother to maintain variety. In this case, that means that the no-ammo thing of laser based weaponry is balanced for example by their lower d.o.t, or their lower then average dronebay, or their reliance on thermal and em damage only.
Fact is that ANY balance discussion liek the one you tried initiatinhg here is useless unless you take ALL character traits of the weaponry into account.
That is also why the armageddon wasn't nerfed but pulse lasers for example. Or why blasters and rails didnt get more range but less grid use. CCP wants to maintain the variety.
_______________________________________________
Yes yes, blogging is passÚ I know.
Rod's Ramblingz on Eve-Online
Solutions to your issues. |
Kaeten
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Posted - 2005.09.15 10:19:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Kaeten on 15/09/2005 10:19:23
nerf the geddon, or can I say, balance it...
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Kinsy
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Posted - 2005.09.15 10:23:00 -
[31]
Geddon is fine.
Nothing to see here.
Please move along.
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ExChange
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Posted - 2005.09.15 10:41:00 -
[32]
think the dronebay on the gedden needs a nerf... i still dont understand why its so big ???
and the hybrids use lots of cap AND ammo... and the lasers use lots of cap and NO ammo...
why dosnt the hybrids do tons more damage ?
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Fred0
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Posted - 2005.09.15 11:01:00 -
[33]
Just do the math guys. The dot comparisons are ok for all other ships if you look at pro's and cons, well not really but almost anyway. But one tier1 bs stands out considerably.
The Gankageddon has 50% more dot than a gankapest and 35% more than a railthron. And in my book that's just wrong. The short range version is also very overpowered. :)
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N1fty
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Posted - 2005.09.15 11:02:00 -
[34]
MAYBE the geddon is a little easy to set up, just fit tons of damage mods. But that leaves it very weak defensively, its essentially a glass-jaw battleship when set up to gank; as soon as you hit it, it shatters.
And amazingly, when a geddon is target jammed, it does 0 DPS, wierd. When a HAC gets in close range and orbits at 600m/s it misses constantly, also wierd...
.................
N1fty -"CKN Recruiting Sergeant" |
Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2005.09.15 11:03:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Fred0
Just do the math guys. The dot comparisons are ok for all other ships if you look at pro's and cons, well not really but almost anyway. But one tier1 bs stands out considerably.
The Gankageddon has 50% more dot than a gankapest and 35% more than a railthron. And in my book that's just wrong. The short range version is also very overpowered. :)
Remember when a Scorpion could actually kill another battleship? 
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FERRET DEMOCRACY |
Arleonenis
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Posted - 2005.09.15 11:36:00 -
[36]
Edited by: Arleonenis on 15/09/2005 11:38:44
another piece of crap from someone that dont used amarr ships i guess.
Few facts: fitting raven with full rack of cruise launchers is easy, with full racks of sieges isnt much of a problem too. Fitting apoc with full rack of nice and dandy tech2 mega beams is impossible without at least 1 pdu2 and 1 rcu2, and possibly 2 rcu2 if someones skills at fitting arent best possible, mounting full rack of tachyons is near to impossible and now try to mount in on geddon.
More facts: amarr lasers do only em and thermal, longest range crystals do only em, raven could do all types of damage
Even more facts: raven dont use cap to fire its guns, all his cap go for tanking, amarr bss use loads of cap to tank AND fire its weapons, and this goes from someone with amarr bs at 5 and all cap skills at 5
If you want change crystals to ammo like sure: just put cap usage on lasers to 0 (on hybrids too) and made laser crystals be able to do all kind of damages (hybrids too) and furthermore increase grid on apoc, geddon by 20%, on gallente ships too
btw i know you cry about pulses, as they have much better fittings and same damage as beams, but they range isnt really good for npcing and geddons with max amount of pulses and all damage mods cant tank at all, when raven with full rack of ballistics still have nice tank and torps do insane damage to battleships now, they just cant do much agains frigates, but for this everyone use drones, so now caldari need to learn drones too, oh what a nerf they are in line now no more "i win" button for npcing with 1 month of skill training
(and i can use effectively all bss, minmatar bs lvl5 amarr bs lvl5 gallente bs lvl4 caldari bs lvl4 so i know how each one of those handles and they all can be quite good, only megathron and tempest have troubles with decent tank and still having nice firepower, they should get some boost but rest is good enough as they are)
edit hell i dont know why i posted it, no ones care about balance and this all they want is "i win" button for ship they fly, "nerf them nerf all of them except mine so my ship is best oh oh" thats all i see in this threeds between lines
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Forsch
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Posted - 2005.09.15 11:42:00 -
[37]
To add to that... in order to use large tech 2 weapons you have to train small and medium specs. Last I heard, missile users don't. 
The Auctoritan Syndicate
Defenders of the Empire - Curatores Veritatis Alliance |
Arleonenis
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Posted - 2005.09.15 11:46:00 -
[38]
exactly forsch, but i dont think strict raven users look at this part
(look at my edit)
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Hephaesteus
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Posted - 2005.09.15 12:20:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Arleonenis
Edited by: Arleonenis on 15/09/2005 11:38:44
another piece of crap from someone that dont used amarr ships i guess.
Few facts: fitting raven with full rack of cruise launchers is easy, with full racks of sieges isnt much of a problem too. Fitting apoc with full rack of nice and dandy tech2 mega beams is impossible without at least 1 pdu2 and 1 rcu2, and possibly 2 rcu2 if someones skills at fitting arent best possible, mounting full rack of tachyons is near to impossible and now try to mount in on geddon.
More facts: amarr lasers do only em and thermal, longest range crystals do only em, raven could do all types of damage
Even more facts: raven dont use cap to fire its guns, all his cap go for tanking, amarr bss use loads of cap to tank AND fire its weapons, and this goes from someone with amarr bs at 5 and all cap skills at 5
If you want change crystals to ammo like sure: just put cap usage on lasers to 0 (on hybrids too) and made laser crystals be able to do all kind of damages (hybrids too) and furthermore increase grid on apoc, geddon by 20%, on gallente ships too
btw i know you cry about pulses, as they have much better fittings and same damage as beams, but they range isnt really good for npcing and geddons with max amount of pulses and all damage mods cant tank at all, when raven with full rack of ballistics still have nice tank and torps do insane damage to battleships now, they just cant do much agains frigates, but for this everyone use drones, so now caldari need to learn drones too, oh what a nerf they are in line now no more "i win" button for npcing with 1 month of skill training
(and i can use effectively all bss, minmatar bs lvl5 amarr bs lvl5 gallente bs lvl4 caldari bs lvl4 so i know how each one of those handles and they all can be quite good, only megathron and tempest have troubles with decent tank and still having nice firepower, they should get some boost but rest is good enough as they are)
edit hell i dont know why i posted it, no ones care about balance and this all they want is "i win" button for ship they fly, "nerf them nerf all of them except mine so my ship is best oh oh" thats all i see in this threeds between lines
Good posting, raises some topics I have wondered about for a while. Like why do Ravens NOT use cap when firing their weapons? surely they would use a little, unless they are like WW2 U boats and are hand loaded which seems a little odd in the setting of Eve. |
HUGO DRAX
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Posted - 2005.09.15 12:30:00 -
[40]
Wow the nerfdorks are not done trying to get the rax nerfed and now they want to nerf the geddon.
Go back to Guildwars or something.
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Sakura Nihil
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Posted - 2005.09.15 12:31:00 -
[41]
Missile carry warheads, why not propellant as well?
As for the idea of nerfing the Geddon, I'm against it - as for your idea of making "laser charges", I also respectfully disagree. It doesn't make sense, why have an uber capacitor and not have lasers hardwired in the ship to tap that energy? Keep it the way it is guys, they aren't that tough (my Ferox nearly chewed one up when I was younger  , imagine a Raven v Geddon fight), if you make these laser charges it'll just give them more energy to tank with, and that would suck.
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HippoKing
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Posted - 2005.09.15 14:16:00 -
[42]
the geddon is fine really - its damage mod stacking thats in need of a nerf
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Moominer
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Posted - 2005.09.15 14:20:00 -
[43]
Won't somebody please think of the children!?!?
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Hephaesteus
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Posted - 2005.09.15 15:18:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Sakura Nihil
Missile carry warheads, why not propellant as well?
What, so missle launchers are just old bits of pipe stuck to the side of the ship. What about a loading and firing mechanism eh, wouldn't it use just a smidgen of cap i'm not saying its going to be alot but surely a bit? |
Meeko Gloom
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Posted - 2005.09.15 15:53:00 -
[45]
I think they Geddon is fine Thats like tell a Scorp he can use Jammers or telling a domix he can use drone its just the advanage for the race thats all. if its scorp vs geddon jam the hell out of him that whats a scop is for and a geddon is just a gaint laser platform.
Meeko Gloom: Bounty Hunter he is looking for you!!!!
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Xardrix
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Posted - 2005.09.15 17:56:00 -
[46]
I feel sorry that you feel that you must whine about something rather than adapting to overcome it. Evolve.
I feel wounded that scum like you have forced Thorax pilots to cry, not that their drone bays have been sliced in half.
By the way, you have been uninformed. Crystals degrade over time and cost millions times more than the cost of hybrid ammo and deal the worst two types of damage that can be dealt to the preferred meathod of tanking. Lasers vs. Armor SUCK!
How about you go whine in favor of your preferred ship and let the good things be.
General rule, complain that YOUR ship isn't good enough instead of saying HIS ship is too good.
http://www.huzzah-federation.com/ |
Avon
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Posted - 2005.09.15 18:04:00 -
[47]
The geddon is powerful but weak.
The dom lacks power but is strong.
In a 1vs1 I'd be in the dom.
Does that mean we need to nerf the dom?
______________________________________________
Pay or pray..er..prey..yeah, pray you aren't prey. Er, just pay. |
God forbid
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Posted - 2005.09.15 18:09:00 -
[48]
Hmmm.. Please dont messup the armageddon.. Argh..
*DEAD*
Life is all about Losing.. |
Agricola Augusta
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Posted - 2005.09.15 18:12:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Hephaesteus
Originally by: Sakura Nihil
Missile carry warheads, why not propellant as well?
What, so missle launchers are just old bits of pipe stuck to the side of the ship. What about a loading and firing mechanism eh, wouldn't it use just a smidgen of cap i'm not saying its going to be alot but surely a bit?
I'm Training up my drone skills before using my Raven (1st BS ever) and I have a crew of Amarr eunuchs that maually load my torpedoes so no need for capacitor use.
On the subject of nerfs, Raven/missiles weren't nerfed in my opinion. Missiles were brought into line and all the Raven gate campers with minimal skills (BS 2 and torps 1) were given a spanking by CCP and sent back to school to learn some skills.
Does the Armaggedon need to be balanced? Can't say I've ever used a BS but have fought them in my Claw. From an interceptors point of view drones are the problem but the Armaggedon is not the most superior there in my opinion. Also with the total damage setup it would preform well unless let's say a Raven returned fire on it (does that really happen in a BS 1v1 confrontation?) rather than sit there die then calculate the DPS.
Crystals can be changed quick for best range, no need with missiles. "But the raven only has room for 1000 torps in its cargo hold!" you say? Well if you can't destroy an Armaggedon with 999 torps but are still there to fire the last one I'd say you're not in any danger but have been firing at the wrong target.
Raven has the smallest drone bay and an Armaggedon has the biggest. 1. you want to use drones you're in the wrong ship. 2. you want to use drones you have to get within range then he'll do the same to you anyhow and then you'll start *****ing about how your SB destroys your torps.
Maybe stacking the damage mods should be looked at but until then Athene's advice is "Stop wasting your time complaining and shoot back you moron!"
Yours sincerely,
Agricola Augusta (High Priestess)
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piercer
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Posted - 2005.09.15 18:19:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Andouus La
Still the amarrs have a total advantage over the calderis that have to carry ridiculous amounts of torpedoes to also ridiculous prices.
Torps cost **** all compared to what they used to actually.
And as for amarrs having an advantage.... how?
The caldari can load every dmg type which means they can damage both shield AND armor at maximum efficiency, now take the Amarr weaponary, EM and thermal dmg types.... u try breaking a nice fat armor tank like that.
Yeah the geddon can, but only when it goes all out gank, so can a blasterthron when it goes all out gank and so can a tempest/phoon.... you wanna nerf all of them too?!
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EvilDoomer
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Posted - 2005.09.15 19:00:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Andouus La
Seems that amarrs ships have a ridiculous advantage of not have to pay for ammo and thus having mods for their turrets.
One way of having some level in this game is to have charges for lasers like those you have for cap boosters. So, they would have to carry "energy" charges to shoot their lasers. Small cap for small lasers, med caps for med lasers and so on to the dreadnaugt. This would seem fair since all other races have to buy carry and resuply their ships and dont have mods for their turrets.
This would level up the game to all races and give a fair chance to everyone to get the same start in pve and pvp.
Now here is a stupid thought!!!!!!!!
Jesus
Lasers come from Electricity!!!!
Let all put gas tanks on ships now.
STUPID
Thanks
EvilDoomer
Chicago Mobsters
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2005.09.15 19:22:00 -
[52]
Originally by: piercer
Originally by: Andouus La
Still the amarrs have a total advantage over the calderis that have to carry ridiculous amounts of torpedoes to also ridiculous prices.
Torps cost **** all compared to what they used to actually.
And as for amarrs having an advantage.... how?
The caldari can load every dmg type which means they can damage both shield AND armor at maximum efficiency, now take the Amarr weaponary, EM and thermal dmg types.... u try breaking a nice fat armor tank like that.
Yeah the geddon can, but only when it goes all out gank, so can a blasterthron when it goes all out gank and so can a tempest/phoon.... you wanna nerf all of them too?!
lol, you can only fit 1,000 torpedoes in a raven, good luck on carrying enough for every damage type, trust me 1k torps goes fast. every raven pilot basically needs an indy loaded with ammo strapped to its aft..
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FERRET DEMOCRACY |
RabbidFerret
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Posted - 2005.09.15 19:23:00 -
[53]
Originally by: EvilDoomer
Originally by: Andouus La
Seems that amarrs ships have a ridiculous advantage of not have to pay for ammo and thus having mods for their turrets.
One way of having some level in this game is to have charges for lasers like those you have for cap boosters. So, they would have to carry "energy" charges to shoot their lasers. Small cap for small lasers, med caps for med lasers and so on to the dreadnaugt. This would seem fair since all other races have to buy carry and resuply their ships and dont have mods for their turrets.
This would level up the game to all races and give a fair chance to everyone to get the same start in pve and pvp.
Now here is a stupid thought!!!!!!!!
Jesus
Lasers come from Electricity!!!!
Let all put gas tanks on ships now.
STUPID
Ummm....modern day laser weapons use xenon and other gases to get electrons... i dont think electricity provides enough power.
Anyway...Lasers have been like this for 2 years, and its not going to get changed because of your annoying whining.
Oh NOEZ!! i cant fit my ore in my cargo hold becuase of my missiles!!! cept my ship cant mine.... I cant think of any better reason than that....
Did you loose your raven to an apoc because you ran out of missiles???? Becuase the only other reason for you post has to be just a cry for attention..
All your ferrets are belong to us. |
Raging Alcoholic
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Posted - 2005.09.15 20:34:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Jim Raynor
lol, you can only fit 1,000 torpedoes in a raven, good luck on carrying enough for every damage type, trust me 1k torps goes fast. every raven pilot basically needs an indy loaded with ammo strapped to its aft..
You can hold 1000 torps and change and i can only hold 400 rounds of antimatter large in gallente ships. Reloding, ha maybe 3 guns and if that. If your not so retarded as to waste your torpedos on frigates and instead use the power of the drones you will have plenty of ammo. I want a mega and domi with 3000m/3 cargo space so i can fit ammo to take fighting. Get a clue
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2005.09.15 20:41:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Raging Alcoholic
Originally by: Jim Raynor
lol, you can only fit 1,000 torpedoes in a raven, good luck on carrying enough for every damage type, trust me 1k torps goes fast. every raven pilot basically needs an indy loaded with ammo strapped to its aft..
You can hold 1000 torps and change and i can only hold 400 rounds of antimatter large in gallente ships. Reloding, ha maybe 3 guns and if that. If your not so retarded as to waste your torpedos on frigates and instead use the power of the drones you will have plenty of ammo. I want a mega and domi with 3000m/3 cargo space so i can fit ammo to take fighting. Get a clue
Torpedoes have six times the volume of large hybrid ammo.. and the Megathron has a larger cargo bay than the Raven to boot.
Put down the bottle, Raging Alcoholic. I think it's you that needs to buy a clue.
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FERRET DEMOCRACY |
Andouus La
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Posted - 2005.09.15 20:56:00 -
[56]
Edited by: Andouus La on 15/09/2005 21:00:34
Edited by: Andouus La on 15/09/2005 20:58:11
Well I was looking for a title that would draw attention lol. I did rofl.
On a more serious note and this is not whining but strict comparasons between races.
Facts and numbers and I go with battleships but this applys to all ships actually.
Calderi Raven
Cargo space: 665m3
Size of torpedoe: 0.6m3
Price of a torpedoe (citadel region): 414.99 isk each (Bane torpedoe)
Total stack: 1108
Total cost: 459 808.92
Gallente Megathron
Cargo space: 675m3
Size of a large hybrid charge: 0.1m3
Price of a large hybrid charge (citadel region): 99.99 isk each (antimatter charges)
Total stack: 6750
Total cost: 674 932.5
Minmatar Tempest
Cargo space: 600m3
Size of large projectile charge: 0.8m3
Price of a large projectile charge (citadel region): 28.00 isk each (carbonized lead charges)
Total stack: 750
Total price: 21 000.0
Amarr Armageddon
Cargo space: 675m3
Size of laser charge: n/a
Price of a laser charge (citadel region): n/a
Total stack: n/a
Total price: 0
Do you get my point?
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Vollaryn
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Posted - 2005.09.15 21:56:00 -
[57]
Edited by: Vollaryn on 15/09/2005 21:59:26
How about this?
Price of 1 Microwave L crystal in Aridia: 360,000.00 ISK
Multiply by 8. Then multiply that total by at least 3-5, for proper ranges.
Oops, there goes 14,400,000.00 ISK just for one proper set of crystals, without even having all the different types.
Do YOU get MY point?
What's your next argument going to be? |
Oberon Oblique
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Posted - 2005.09.15 22:02:00 -
[58]
Nerf Geddon? NO
Now that we have covered that, please let the other whiners have there turn now.
-The mind is strong and the flesh is weak, but oh the flesh... |
Andouus La
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Posted - 2005.09.15 22:22:00 -
[59]
For the Raven I'll give out not what I think or say but what the developpers said about it. This was taken in in the french MMORG portal of eve online in an interview with Nathan Richardsson from CCP.
"EN: We know that one of the most important priority is to keep a balance in the game, with bloodlines, ships and objects. With the last news we got, we heard that you plan to reduce the power of missiles power, when we fight against larger ships. Some players, specialy Caldari people , think that it will affect a lot the soloing part of the game, against NPCs for exemple. Do you think it will be so ?
Nathan:
EN:We are changing missiles so that large missiles such as Torpedoes and Cruise Missiles are less effective against small ships such as Frigates and Cruisers. They are still effective against big ships, even more effective in many cases. Smaller missiles will still hit all ships quite well.
I should also point out that it works both ways if you are NPC hunting. If you are in a cruiser for example, NPCs shooting Torpedo's and Cruise missiles will damage you less. The Raven has been a very good solo NPC ship - far more powerful than most of the other battleships. After this change, it will still be a powerful solo ship, just not as powerful as before.
In addition to that, we are releasing Tech 2 missile skills and missile launchers in the same patch, so there are some good additions coming at the same time for Caldari players."
Here is the link to the full interview:
http://eve.mmorpgs.info/index.html?rub=devchat&tid=5143
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Aitrus
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Posted - 2005.09.16 01:30:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Aitrus
Originally by: Andouus La
The amarr lasers have their mods on the turret itself and this is a real advantage others races dont have.
This makes absolutely no sense. Seriously, I don't know what this means. Laser turrets operate exactly the same as all other turrets in combat with the exception of needing to reload.
Asking again because I really want to know what the heck you were trying to say here...
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Dr Tetrahydrocannabinol
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Posted - 2005.09.16 01:34:00 -
[61]
troll
---------------------------------------------
"Where the air is crisp."
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2005.09.16 02:20:00 -
[62]
Minmatar Tempest
Cargo space: 600m3
Size of large projectile charge: 0.8m3
Price of a large projectile charge (citadel region): 28.00 isk each (carbonized lead charges)
Total stack: 750
Total price: 21 000.0
Carbonized Lead is .08 not .8. Your figures are very wrong, the largest is EMP which is .1 the same as a large hybrid charge.
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FERRET DEMOCRACY |
Andouus La
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Posted - 2005.09.16 03:16:00 -
[63]
Lol figured that one was coming, but you totally missed the ppint. I am comparing stuff to buy with an absence whatever figures show up it's O amarr and a price tag whaterver else race you are.
Get it now?
Equality between races right...
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Andouus La
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Posted - 2005.09.16 03:23:00 -
[64]
Ahhhhhhhhh
That's what appens when you write stuff between jumps lol.
You right it's not 0.8, but 0.08 for the large projectile. Thaught on the moment that thingie was huge for a projectile.
Still, my point is not that is to end up with a price tag on whatever your shooting and ends up in your cargo.
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Einheriar Ulrich
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Posted - 2005.09.16 04:01:00 -
[65]
Dont nerf the ship.....
Nerf the crystals, make them degradable, so you have to buy new ones, once i awhile.....
That is only fair
So Say I. Einheriar Ulrich of the Bloodline of Einheriar.
****Minion Of VOTF****
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Xardrix
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Posted - 2005.09.16 11:40:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Andouus La
On a more serious note and this is not whining but strict comparasons between races.
Xardrix says: Bull****, You are whining, and its effecting people.
Facts and numbers and I go with battleships but this applys to all ships actually.
Calderi Raven
Cargo space: 665m3
Size of torpedoe: 0.6m3
Price of a torpedoe (citadel region): 414.99 isk each (Bane torpedoe)
Total stack: 1108
Total cost: 459 808.92
Gallente Megathron
Cargo space: 675m3
Size of a large hybrid charge: 0.1m3
Price of a large hybrid charge (citadel region): 99.99 isk each (antimatter charges)
Total stack: 6750
Total cost: 674 932.5
Minmatar Tempest
Cargo space: 600m3
Size of large projectile charge: 0.8m3
Price of a large projectile charge (citadel region): 28.00 isk each (carbonized lead charges)
Total stack: 750
Total price: 21 000.0
Amarr Armageddon
Cargo space: 675m3
Size of laser charge: n/a
Price of a laser charge (citadel region): n/a
Total stack: n/a
Total price: 0
Do you get my point?
Originally by: Vollaryn
How about this?
Price of 1 Microwave L crystal in Aridia: 360,000.00 ISK
Multiply by 8. Then multiply that total by at least 3-5, for proper ranges.
Oops, there goes 14,400,000.00 ISK just for one proper set of crystals, without even having all the different types.
Do YOU get MY point?
What's your next argument going to be?
Ok, lets look at this then. Each racial weapon, with a single type of ammunition.
Missiles - 459 808.92 isk / 1108 shots
Projectiles - 21 000.0 / 750 shots
Hybrids - 674 932.5 isk / 6750 shots
Lasers - 2 880 000.0 isk / ??? shots
I think it is balanced that the Amarr have to spend 10-20 times the isk for a single ship to be effective. Do our lasers degrade? Yes.
Would it not be more effective to ask not for a Laser Nerf, but a Ammo Size Reduction? Perhaps a reload duration more in line with Lasers?
Why ask for something that hurts people, when you an ask for something that helps people.
Say NO to NERF! Say YES to BOOST!
http://www.huzzah-federation.com/ |
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