...however you can only use clone upgrades, implants, plex and train/inject skills on a subscribed account?

(I suppose you could even 'police' where they could go with Concord and limit to certain ships)



Would this mean more potential customers for CCP?


Would this mean a massive influx of useless alts or bots?

What does the community think? I am interested

...Drivel

EVE is already F2P if you earn enough in-game to pay for it in PLEX.

Thank you for your well thought out and considered replies.

It is not free to play. Free to play implies that the game is 100% free to play. This game is not free. You spend your time grinding isk to pay for a gtc that someone else paid for with RL cash. Your times is worth something and you had to purchase an item that was purchased with RL cash. So EvE is not F2P.

...however you can only use clone upgrades, implants, plex and train/inject skills on a subscribed account?

(I suppose you could even 'police' where they could go with Concord and limit to certain ships)



Would this mean more potential customers for CCP?


Would this mean a massive influx of useless alts or bots?

What does the community think? I am interested

You can only train skills on a paid account?

So what's the point of an F2P one then?

Is this a stealth nerf highsec thread?

Cyno alt. Freighter alt. Suicide ganking alt.

See that broken monument in Jita? It's broken for a reason.

It is not free to play. Free to play implies that the game is 100% free to play. This game is not free. You spend your time grinding isk to pay for a gtc that someone else paid for with RL cash. Your times is worth something and you had to purchase an item that was purchased with RL cash. So EvE is not F2P.

The simply way to look at it is that individuals may play for free, but as a Plex can only exist through RL cash, it means Eve isn't free to play. It's a rather elegant solution.

...however you can only use clone upgrades, implants, plex and train/inject skills on a subscribed account?

But then you could say the same about F2P shops, those buying from the shop ensures that it can afford to be F2P.

How about no?

The point is that with Eve, the Plex's core purpose is to supply gametime. That''s the difference.

All MMO's which were Pay2Play first and were introduced to the F2P-Market failed in the long run. If you want to make a F2P-Game you have to be very careful to get no Pay2win-Imbalance, because then your game will fail.

Eve is not suited for such a model, and not suited for having things like golden ammo with extra damage for $!

Make some one else pay 2 play or as I call it. MSOEP2P

They've been pushing the whole pay to win f2p model for a while. Just look at the facts. Ever since Incarna, it's been painfully obvious that overhead on Eve development has decreased, with every new expansion just being more and more recycled content surrounded by shiny new things that ultimately don't add content to the game.

PLEX is not F2P? Hmm...

Based on the limitations proposed in the OP (specifically, unable to inject/train skills) none of these would be possible.

See that broken monument in Jita? It's broken for a reason.

Is this a stealth nerf highsec thread?

Players wanted microtransactions

Player wanted walking in stations

In addition to everything mentioned above (in particular the "no" bits), there's the consideration of just how much the servers can take. Imagine if everyone could suddenly get 10 more alt accounts, and fly them? GǪ

So, in my opinion, it's a very bad idea from a very technical point of view.

We asked CCP to fix the little things and that's what they've been doing. How you manage to twist that into CCP pushing free-to-play is beyond me.

Mr Epeen

CITATION NEEDED

CITATION NEEDED

Go through the mountains of tears in the post-Incarna forum rage and see just how many people complained about the Noble Exchange items being "too expensive" (as opposed to complaining about the existence of the items in the first place).




Continual requests for more items in the Noble Exchange store, continual discussion about space barbies.

Now you know the key words to search for, you can find the copious references yourself.

...however you can only use clone upgrades, implants, plex and train/inject skills on a subscribed account?

(I suppose you could even 'police' where they could go with Concord and limit to certain ships)



Would this mean more potential customers for CCP?


Would this mean a massive influx of useless alts or bots?

What does the community think? I am interested

See that broken monument in Jita? It's broken for a reason.

I think maybe some have put too much of their own opinion into my original post.

Many thanks btw to those of you who have replied intelligently (there are far too many knuckledragging trolls these days lol)

I wasn't really meaning a change to the way eve plays by making the whole game free and adding premium items - more making a cut down version of Eve to get those interested who do not want to pay on a monthly basis.

So you are not adding anything but subtracting things for non subscribers.

Personally I thought it may bring an influx of new players.
Those who get the hang of it and want more will subscribe for the abilities I mentioned.

CCP are already adding training for plex with the 2 on one account thingymaboby.

You still give someone the 15 days free (as now) but then the training stops, the implants stop.

This may allow players to taste more of the game before deciding to quit forever because of learning curve etc.

TBH its not much different from what you have now except the unsubbed accounts can still fly around and partake in the Eve universe - but with limits.

Like I said - Just interested in intelligent opinions

(but will read troll replies for laffs and pity)

Go through the mountains of tears in the post-Incarna forum rage and see just how many people complained about the Noble Exchange items being "too expensive" (as opposed to complaining about the existence of the items in the first place).

The point I was trying to make is PLEX can only exist through RL cash, but so does F2P accounts in F2P games due to people using the F2P shops.

So people buying PLEX from CCP fund the accounts via PLEX in exchange for isk of people that use the PLEX to extend their game time. People that use an F2P shops are funding those accounts that never use the F2P shops. So I don't really see that much difference.

Continual requests for more items in the Noble Exchange store, continual discussion about space barbies.

Now you know the key words to search for, you can find the copious references yourself.

EvE is one of the oldest-surviving computer games, even older than WoW (albeit by a few months). Why change a winning strategy with something that has been shown time and again to have a high rate of failure?

In addition to everything mentioned above (in particular the "no" bits), there's the consideration of just how much the servers can take. Imagine if everyone could suddenly get 10 more alt accounts, and fly them? Or for that matter that the amount of people online would multiply by 10 (arbitrary number to get the point across)? Ok, let's assume the servers can (just barely) take it - let's double the amount of people once again (keep in mind, this is without CCP getting more revenue). Servers crash and burn.

So, in my opinion, it's a very bad idea from a very technical point of view.

Not true, LOTRO went for the hybrid model a few years ago and they are still going strong. Personally I think hybrid is the best model but I like EVE's Make some one else pay 2 play or as I call it. MSOEP2P

No, you said players WANTED MT. Show me your source for that. I have yet to encounter anyone in game who actually wanted that except for you. Pricing is not at issue and was not referenced in my request.

I have however experienced players who want WIS, show me some statistics where this constitutes more than a dozen or so of the same players posting over and over in the same "GIEV WIS NAOW!!!" threads.

Ah, so people complaining about the price of items in the virtual item store doesn't mean they wanted things in the virtual item store at a cheaper price, at about, say, the level of a micro transaction?

You're applying the "no true Scotsman" argument here. Pricing was the issue, rather than the presence of the item store. Certainly there were people like me who didn't want the item store in the format that it was executed, but we were by far the minority: for most people the issue wasn't so much the presence of the boots magicked into the economy without player involvement, so much as the price of them. When people are haggling about price, they have already indicated that they want the item.

Just because you didn't want the Noble Exchange doesn't mean everyone else didn't want it. They were complaining about the price of its stock, not the presence of the store. They were complaining about the promises made in Fearless about saved fitting slots being purchasable for Aurum. They were complaining about the future of the game should CCP decide to follow the path of LOTRO, DDO and SW:TOR, not realising that those games went F2P because they were crap (i.e.: they didn't turn to crap because of F2P, though LOTRO didn't help the case by selling The One Ring and SW:TOR didn't help their case by selling hotbars).



Show me the statistics for people who rioted over WiS. Not the folks who don't care about WiS, not the folks who rioted because WiS took so much time away from flying in space, but the people who rioted because Incarna existed at all. People oohed and aaahed at the presentation back in 2009 (I think?) where Hilmar walked a capsuleer around the inside of the station. We speculated about what else would happen in stations besides trading boosters "off the grid" and playing/betting on Slay, and what would be involved in running an establishment, and would we be able to put our exotic dancers to work drumming up clientele?

The future MMO industry going to be a very different one from the one we know, this is pretty obvious.

...however you can only use clone upgrades, implants, plex and train/inject skills on a subscribed account?

(I suppose you could even 'police' where they could go with Concord and limit to certain ships)



Would this mean more potential customers for CCP?


Would this mean a massive influx of useless alts or bots?

What does the community think? I am interested

lots of accounts are free to play atm thanks to the introduction of PLEX

Is this a stealth nerf highsec thread?

Free to play means that CCP gets no money unless you choose to spend it. Someone already bought that plex. CCP got paid. You put in hard labor to have a month to play. It may not cost you the end user money but it was hardly free.

...however you can only use clone upgrades, implants, plex and train/inject skills on a subscribed account?

(I suppose you could even 'police' where they could go with Concord and limit to certain ships)



Would this mean more potential customers for CCP?


Would this mean a massive influx of useless alts or bots?

What does the community think? I am interested

Mara is right, the numbers of players that want WiS is so large that when they unsubscribe CCP will have to institute massive layoffs and switch to years of patches that reassure these players that CCP cares about their concerns. Oh wait... that was the exact opposite of what happened.

Have to go against ya on this. The fear was MTs leading to a pay-to-win situation, that people would pay to get items magiced into the game, thus hurting the entire sandbox.

Not too many people cared about the fact that vanity items were introduced, pure vanity who cares. But $1000 pants was icing on the cake, and that was after the Golden Scorp, and 18 months awesomeness etc. It simply added to the 'greed' narrative that was forming. Then the news letter and devs in flames at CQ doors, one of the most epic and funny threads of all time, even if "DIAF" did get someone in trouble.

I suspect we all have a slightly different perspective, from my recollection, pay to win was the biggest and most damaging, to the game, issue that players were expressing.

"you say tomato, I say tomato"

PLEX is not F2P? Hmm...

...however you can only use clone upgrades, implants, plex and train/inject skills on a subscribed account?

(I suppose you could even 'police' where they could go with Concord and limit to certain ships)



Would this mean more potential customers for CCP?


Would this mean a massive influx of useless alts or bots?

What does the community think? I am interested

lots of accounts are free to play atm thanks to the introduction of PLEX

lots of accounts are free to play atm thanks to the introduction of PLEX

EVE is already F2P if you earn enough in-game to pay for it in PLEX.